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File: 1484348845011.png (94 KB, 1336x1336)
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>Assemble a part list
https://pcpartpicker.com/
>Example gaming builds and _monitor_ suggestions; click on the blue title to see notes
https://pcpartpicker.com/user/pcbg/saved/
>Learn how to build a PC (You can find a lot more detailed videos on channels like Bitwit)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=69WFt6_dF8g
>How to install Win7 on Ryzen
https://pastebin.com/TUZvnmy1

If you want help:
>State the budget & CURRENCY for your build
>List your uses, e.g. Gaming, Video Editing, VM Work
>For monitors, include purpose (e.g., photoediting, gaming) and graphics card pairing (if applicable)

CPUs:
>NO i5 7500/7600K or i7 7700/K. THEY ARE DEFUNCT AND SUPERSEDED BY COFFEE LAKE
>NO R3 1200/1300X or R5 1400/1500X. THEY ARE DEFUNCT AND SUPERSEDED BY THE R3 2200G AND R5 2400G
>G4560 - non-gaming (light tasks) or bare minimum gaming builds with a dedicated graphics card
>R3 2200G - Gaming WITHOUT a graphics card
>i3 8100 - Budget gaming builds
>R5 1600 / i5 8400 - Great gaming (especially the i5 8400) or multithreaded use CPUs (especially the R5 1600)
>R7 / Used Xeon / Threadripper / i7 - Heavy Multi-Tasking / VM Work / Mixed use

RAM:
>Current CPUs benefit from high speed RAM; 3000-3200 MHz is ideal
>Before buying RAM for Ryzen, check your Mobo's QVL or look for user reports

Graphics cards:
>Crypto-Currency miners have driven GPU prices up (particularly Radeon)
1080p
>MSRP of standard 1080p cards: 1050Ti, 140USD; 1060 3GB, $200; 1060 6GB, $230; RX 570 4GB, $170; RX 580 4GB, $200
>GTX 1070 if you're looking for very high (100+) framerates and you have a CPU and monitor to match
1440p
>GTX 1070/Ti and 1080 are standard choices; currently overpriced
>GTX 1080Ti if you're looking for very high (100+) framerates and you have a CPU and monitor to match
2160p (4K)
>GTX 1080Ti

General:
>PLAN YOUR BUILD AROUND YOUR MONITOR IF GAMING
>A 240GB or larger SSD is almost mandatory; consider m.2 form factor

Previous: >>65538351
>>
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>>
>State the budget & CURRENCY for your build
$1300 USD, max is $1400

>List your uses
Gayming primarily, but I would like to stream and do video editing. VR is the most secondary purpose down the road.

>For monitors, include purpose
I have a 1080p, but a 1440p monitor is in the cards

is this build solid or what should I swap out?
https://pcpartpicker.com/list/kyFx6s
>>
>>65555996
>I would like to stream and do video editing.
consider an 8 core Ryzen then.
that i5 is 6c/6t, in your case you could very benefit from the extra cores. Since budget looks like a concern get a 1700 8c/16t, on sale, or even a 1600 6c/12t. Pair it with a decent b350. Also, you could do a similar with ryzen 2, get some new stuff but likely losing on some old Ryzen 1xxx, x370 and b350, clearance deals that are sure to come in this next week.
>>
>>65555996
also,
https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817151094

That psu is a meme for a reason. I have one myself, it's bronze but it's still going strong for more than 6 years without a single issue.
>>
as for case 12mm fans, do you go with any random chinkshit or do you think it's worth investing in fans from good brands?
>>
>>65556315
>12mm fans
the fuck
>>
>>65556331
they are for VRMs
>>
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>>65556331
120mm* you know what I meant
>>
>>65555996
I still don't get why people are willing to spend $150 on a SSD instead of investing in a better GPU

Is the time worth the loss of performance ?
>>
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>>65556368
>not calling out the fucking BD drive for $50
That's the real fucking crime here, I don't know what you're expecting people to do for an SSD.
I got a 120GB SSD and while I'm fine I basically use it for NOTHING because anything would fill it up.
500GB might be a bit overkill at that price, but there is no winning right now.
>>
>>65556400
I don't speak french, but just in case that PSU is non-modular, switch it out for at least a semi-modular PSU. You don't want any more wires than is necessary for a mITX build
>>
>>65556368
$150 aint gonna do shit when I'm already buying a 1080
>>
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>>65556400
Get a 2x4GB kit, dual channel is optimal
>>
>>65556315
nah get a budget/eol'ed brand name, at least you'll get a bit of reassurance they won't break down after 6 months of use. Unless you're building one of those 9x9 double sided moira radiators, then shit gets expensive enough to justify going with chinkshit.
>>
>>65556400
And get a S12II 520 for €60 or a VS450 for €45
>>
>>65556368
I use other programs more than I play games.
>>
>>65556555
holy get what is this even
>>
>>65556490
I purposely bought 1 stick so I can upgrade to 16GB later when the RAM will decrease in price (if it happens one day).

>>65556472
>>65556536
nice idea actually. Thought about
EVGA B3 450W ?
VS450 isn't modular
>>
>>65556472
>>65556536
>>65556624
I shilled the s12ii first. I forgot that they weren't modular, the one I have has been sitting in the same system for a long ass time time. Modular psu's are much better, make a priority to go for at least a semi-modular variant. Seasonic still should be your first pick, though.
>>
I'm searching for a new 1TB hd, any recommendations? Should I go with Toshiba, WD or Seagate?
>>
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>bought an Intel K CPU without knowing how to overclock
Is there any reference material for dummies for this sort of thing?
>>
>>65539168
Ryzen 6 or 8 core will last you probably 6+ years like a 2600k did.
4790k is still good for now, but you might feel the need to upgrade in a few years.

>>65539622
No, that's overkill. Just get like a C1, H7, or whatever in the 125-150 TDP cooling range.

>>65540399
grounding issue on the monitor cable connection?

>>65540684
No. 3GB of VRAM in 2017 is retarded, and it's 2018 now.
The performance of that card tanks like over 35% in some games compared to the 6GB model. It's basically the difference of going from a 6GB 1060 to a 1070 in those cases.
It's similar performance of a 6 year old 7970 in some games, that's how bad it is.
Absolute shit scam of a GPU. Better off just getting a 1050Ti 4GB which at least performs more consistently even if it's a bit lower on average. Or RX560 for that matter if you get the full die one.

>>65540907
From what I can see, there's tons of 1060 and RX580 in stock and no justification for these high prices.

>>65541862
2TB is good.
Shame how many games have unjustifiably large file sizes.

>>65542066
Get a 2TB SATA SSD instead of 1TB NVMe, imo. You can't store much anime on 1TB.
Also the 850W PSU is excessive for even Threadripper. You should get a 650W titanium instead.

>>65543382
1900X has what, double the PCIe lanes? Simple. It is slightly faster than the 1800X in some cases but you mostly get it for the lanes.
Or as something to use for now before upgrading to TR+.

>>65552930
Max has been improved for Ryzen. Twice the heat pipes and better contact.

>>65556710
Newer Barracuda seem to be pretty good. Really good value.

>>65556400
CL17 is fucking awful timings for 2400.
You can get 2600 CL15 @ 1.2v dual rank with crucial ballistix, iirc.

>>65556726
Intel says not to overclock.
>>
>>65556710
Whichever's cheapest
>>
what would be a nice machine to stream in 4k retro games run in a linux machine?
>>
don't know if they changed the site layout for something hilariously bad or if this wasn't exactly the one I was looking for.

http://www.orionpsudb.com/platforms
brand name / manufacturer psu database
>>
>>65556829
scratch that.
found the one I wanted
http://www.realhardtechx.com/index_archivos/Page678.htm

or for instance, evga rebrands for each manufacturer
http://www.realhardtechx.com/index_archivos/Page2293.htm

corsair
http://www.realhardtechx.com/index_archivos/Page447.htm
>>
>>65555888
Work on that cable management, otherwise enjoy

>>65555996
For streaming or video editing, I'd get a 6c/12t CPU or above

>>65556368
>investing
You're retarded. A high graphics card isn't an investment especially considering it'll be significantly devalued by the next gen (980Ti = 1070). An SSD would be a better "investment" because at least you'll use it for a long, long time and it'll save you time (equals money) and annoyance over that period. Most of the time anything better than a 1060 tier graphics card for 1080p is unseen "performance" anyway

>>65556738
>3GB of VRAM in 2017 is retarded
>The performance of that card tanks like over 35% in some games compared to the 6GB model
False https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VRtCCMsbcnM

>From what I can see, there's tons of 1060 and RX580 in stock and no justification for these high prices.
You can't see their actual stock. If they priced the cards lower they'd probably be out of stock again. They want sales, and higher prices mean lower sales
>>
>>65556624
In that case this might be better
https://fr.pcpartpicker.com/product/XJYWGX/gskill-aegis-8gb-1-x-8gb-ddr4-3000-memory-f4-3000c16s-8gisb
>>65556683
You're right, maybe a M12II 520 or a 620 EVO
>>
I ordered a Pentium G5600 yesterday, did I fuck up? Should I have spent the extra £20 in getting a coffee lake i3? Bear in mind this is meant to be just for work (nothing intensive) and web browsing/watching videos and films at 1080p as well as light gaming with a 1050ti.
>>
>>65556772
AMD, both CPU and GPU, are the way to go for less headache with Linux, aren't they?

>>65556882
holy fuck you linked to a video that literally shows at least one example where the 1060 3GB is 35% slower in a game than the 6GB LMAO while saying
>false
what a retard holy shit

>You can't see their actual stock. If they priced the cards lower they'd probably be out of stock again. They want sales, and higher prices mean lower sales
There's 115 different RX580 models on sale at Newegg. Even if they only have a handful of each, that's still significant stock.

>>65556899
Na it's fine.
>>
>>65556944
Yeah because AMD is trash.
>>
>>65556899
You'll be fine though a 2200g would have been better, the dual core will bottleneck the GPU in a few games
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=55bmAN5VyQk
>>
>>65557016
>2400MHz RAM for the Ryzen comparison
Fucking Intel shills will stop at nothing
>>
>>65556944
>AMD, both CPU and GPU, are the way to go for less headache with Linux, aren't they?
its actually a very sad meme
supposedly the drives are better because they belive in supporting linux but they also known to be pure trash and break. SO yea maybe going full AMD will work
>>
>>65555859
>Retard OP ads his redundant 3 low end cpus
what a dumbass
>>
>>65556944
>1060 3GB is 35% slower in a game than the 6GB LMAO
If you're referring to the Mirror's Edge: Catalyst benchmark using Hyper (yes, HYPER) settings, the review specifically states that, while the 3GB is about significantly slower, the 6GB CANNOT PLAY AT THIS SETTING DESPITE BEING "FASTER"
So, in conclusion, lmao fuck off retard.
>>
>>65557031
>expensive ram
>budget build
Fuck off most people won't go beyond 2666, if you're buying above 3200 just save up for a 1600.
>>
>>65556981
(you)
>>
Any ideas for a cheap graphics card for this?
>>
>>65557062
2933 should be the bare minimum to get the juice out of a 2200/2400. And even then depending on the region, speeds don't affect price wildly.
If you're going to pinch that hard might as well keep on saving.
>>
>>65557077
>leak
>still slower
Discarded.
>>
>>65557081
https://pcpartpicker.com/user/pcbg/saved/#view=9CfZ8d
>>
>>65557091
>being retarded
>>
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>>65557106
>R-Ryzen is the multithread k-king!
>>
>>65557062
The price difference from 2400 to 3000mhz is typically very small. Hardly worth being upset over considering the performance increase.

But in any case, getting 2400mhz for an APU is a bad idea unless it's only going to be used for very low impact gaming
>>
>>65557123
Impressive lead for it costing 3 times as much
>>
>>65557135
>price
Every fucking time. It's slower, we're only talking about performance
>>65557142
I fail to see your point.
>>
>>65557135
Hey fuck you I paid for that lead and Intel was generous enough to give me a CPU when they didn't even have to!
>>
>>65557148
>price not being an issue

Guess I'll just bust out my ole IBM supercomputer that will get 1 million in CPUZ and say that it's the best PC going and if you don't own one you are literally retarded
>>
>>65557081
>>65557093
If you're looking for something used, check https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SMFs29g_a90
The max performance tier of graphics card I'd pair with a 2200G at 1080p would be 1060/580
>>
>>65557160
It's okay I informed a friend of mine who works at Intel to raise the price and just barely eek out gains on Ryzen so we can be back on top to gloat, bro.
>>
>>65557091
>>65557091
8700k st 555, mt 4234
7700k st 496, mt 2648
7900x st 480, mt 5416

2700x st 495, mt 5313

it's only slower if you're getting paid to say it's slower. It's almost an exact midground between mt and st comparing with intel mainstream and hedt.
>>
>>65556899
It's fine but the i3 is a pretty good deal. If you can cancel the order and get the i3, why not?
>>
>>65557161
But I thought multithreaded apps were the future? You fuckers flip based on whatever fits your retarded agenda.
>>65557166
Not an argument.
>>65557175
All of this over a non confirmed picture of someone's monitor. Remember when Vega 64 was faster than a 1080 Ti?
>>
>>65557175
~7700k ST IPC.
intel fanboys gonna cry hard this week.
>>
>>65557197
>~
That's literally margin of error.
>>
>>65557190
crap. that's actually a very fair point.
4 more days to go.
We'll also have a round of bad leaks too before the nda lifts on the reviews.
>>
>>65557190
If i want multithreading then ill buy threadripper, retard
>>
>>65557197
>7700k ST IPC
no, it has the same score but its at a lower clock so it means the IPC is actually better
>>
>>65557211
So now moar corez don't matter after the 8700k kicked the 1800x's ass. Cool.
>>
What's the best AM3+ CPU cooler that's less than 90mm tall? I've got a retarded slim mATX case that won't fit a Hyper 212 or a big Noctua.
>>
>>65557200
well there's a lot more to ipc than one single benchmark.
>>
hey guys what about ARM
>>
>>65557256
There are no good ARM desktop or laptop systems yet. Get a Raspberry Pi and fuck around with it if you want to.
>>
>>65557269
Isn't ARM inferior to x86 when it comes to performance?
>>
>>65557292
arm processors are designed with power usage in mind more than performance, yes
>>
>>65556738
>Intel says not to overclock.
Why?
>>
>>65557292
It's at performance parity and half the watts for some server workloads, but those are all for super duper multithreaded things. If you need single threaded perf it's still crap right now, although the gap is closing. If you want something RISC but x86 performant, get a Raptor Engineering Talos II And rice it the fuck out.
>roughly Haswell performance per core
>can have two sockets of 22 cores each
>>
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>>65557221
the fuck are you on about retard
>>
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ri3g2dFOPtg
>>
I'm getting a 1080ti and probably that new AMD chipset for my high end build. I'm trying to decide between 4k 60fps or 1440p with high fps. Which is better?
>>
>>65557320
>what's the 8400 guy on?
quite literally suicide watch
>>
>>65557393
depends
nice scenic and cinematic games like total war,or skylines and gta v is good for 4k
if you like fps,moba or multiplayer rts higher fps will be good
>>
>>65557409
>the 8400 guy
That would be me, but I'm not involved in the discussion
So you're still literally a retard
>>
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>>65557614
nice try.
>>
How will intel ever recover after Ryzen+ and then Ryzen2 erode their marketshare dominance more and more
>>
>>65557646
if they started to be not fucking disingeneous pricks who uses shady business practice,multiple infractions on consumer trust and all around cum slurpers no one would be making fun of their indian and jewish asses
>>
>>65557540
I play an even mix of both with a tendency toward single player. Would it be worth it to get a high refresh rate 4k monitor that I can downscale to 1440p when needed?
>>
>>65557743
just go for 2k 144hz,i think 4k still has room to grow and become really something worth your while
>>
>case have 4 fans setup
>1x200mm front intake
>1x120mm rear as exhaust
>2x120mm side fan

How should I setup the side fans? Unfortunately no top fan slot.
>>
>>65557883
intake
>>
>>65557897
Ok, I’ll try that and see.
>>
>>65557637
>projecting this hard

>>65557646
Intel is clearly running scared with their 8 core consumer i7s and 6c/12t i5s planned for the next lineup. Zen will be in the next consoles, so that will be the death knell for Intel gaming dominance, which isn't to say that Intel CPUs will be bad for gaming, but AMD will have gaming parity within the next 5 years. Intel does still have the lead in foundry tech, but x86 is at the end of its rope. Whichever companies can come up with the next big computing chip will be the big winners. Nvidia has machine learning / GPUs, IBM probably has quantum computing, AMD is dabbling in GPUs and CPUs, but Intel only has CPUs that are losing relevance compared to ARM etc.
>>
Fell into the RGB meme and bought 6 Deepcool RF120 fans to replace my old Rosewill ones. I expected to regret it quite a bit.
>CPU and GPU temps are down by 10 degrees
>Computer is actually quieter.
Thanks chinkshit.
>>
>>65557224
>please respond
>>
>>65558143
nice delusion friend
>>
bump
>>
Well, I was adamant to post this but I guess you know your shit, /g/.
Current build:
>fx 6300
>750ti oc 2gb
>78lmt usb3 or some shit (got it real cheap)
>8gb ram 1600mhz
>120gb ssd
>scavenged HDD from a dead external one, 1tb @5400 rpm
>cool master PSU 800w

Now, I did want to get this ultrawide lg monitor 25um58 but I keep reading that such GPU won't even handle it at 30fps. I mainly use it for school/work but I also watch movies, some Netflix and have a DAC for music; play lightweight games such as lol, borderlands2, the witcher 3, pubg, and maybe one day borderlands 3, StarCraft 2 and eve. I thought "maybe I can upgrade just the GPU and that'll do" but it seems 1050ti won't cut it, and RX 470 will only pull medium at ~55fps. So now I got options. I could technically get a ryzen 5 1600 and change the whole thing with this prices
>ryzen 1600 $189
>GPU 1050ti 4gb($226) or RX 470 ($216) or RX 570 ($236~$260), whatever that gives me +60fps on ultrawide 2560x1080
>some 350b mb $110
>8gb ddr4 3200 corsair vengeance $131
>evga 500b psu $63
>2tb firecuda sshd $70
Those are in usd the prices of said parts in my country. I can keep the ssd.
So, even if its an upgrade, I don't think I'd be playing extremely demanding games. Maybe I could drop the screen and get a normal 24" 1080p led with freesync and change my GPU? That would be A Lot cheaper, although I could sell my actual rig for $342. So, any thoughts, /g/ents?
>>
>>65560101
>GPU 1050ti 4gb($226) or RX 470 ($216) or RX 570 ($236~$260)
With those prices, go for an RX470 for sure, it's way better than the 1050Ti. Pair it with a freesync monitor and you won't regret it, adaptive sync just makes everything look way smoother. Don't go for an SSHD though, it's not worth the premium you're paying, go for a plain old 7200rpm HDD.
>>
>>65560192
>sshd
I could get a barracuda 3tb for $75, the store said they're clearing and that's why they put the firecuda for half the price (the stock price here is $147 for them, they sell it for $70)
>rx470
People say they're superseded by 570, won't I regret it? What I think I could do was get the 470/570 and the freesync monitor as you suggest, and wait for the prices to drop on ram and ryzen then change the rest of the rig. What do you think?
>>
is gsync a meme on 144hz?
what's a solid 24'' fhd 144hz?
Is x370 worth the money over b350?
How does Zen and memory get along at this moment in time? e.g. Can I expect to run a 3200 memory on the qvl of a mobo (Asus 350-f strix) at actual 3200mhz on a Zen1700 with stock cooler?
>>
>>65560246
>SSHD
Well, if it's really a great deal, then go ahead and get it, though be warned, recent Seagate hard drives have had some reliability issues.
>RX 470
There's not a whole lot of difference between the RX 470 and RX 570, the RX570 is just slightly higher clocked. You'll easily handle high to ultra settings at 1080p, and Freesync will make up the difference when you can't max out your monitor's refresh rate. That said though, your FX-6300 will be the main bottleneck in your system. If you wait for RAM prices to go down, you'll be left waiting for months. That said though, even with the CPU bottleneck, you'll already have a massively improved experience.
>>
AMD Ryzen 7 2700X
Corsair 32 GB DDR4-3200 @ CL16 19-19-3
Other option is @ CL16 18-18-36
GIGABYTE AORUS GA-AX370-Gaming 5

I am not going to OC. Probably have to set ram speed back to a stable setting since the description mentions 2933mhz.

Had a previous build set around the 1700x but might as well wait for the 2700x
>>
>>65560372
>sshd reliability
Roger that, going for a 2tb Toshiba p300 same price, I read they were pretty stable.
>470 vs 570
If I can get a deal on the 570 I'll get it. Otherwise, stick to the 470, wait a couple of months, sell other parts and get the major upgrade, I'm really looking forward the 1600.

Thanks for the freesync advice, and all in general. That was my first build and this my first upgrade, still learning. You're based, anon.
>>
>>65560546
Some SSHDs have firmware issues where they won't wake from sleep so the OS marks them as failed.
>>
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I'm in the market for a new monitor, managed to get a 1070 at my local Best Buy while it was closing for a steal. Is G-Sync important, or should I just grab a regular 144hz monitor? Have an old meme for your troubles.
>>
>>65555859
>>G4560
>>i3 8100

Kill yourself.
>>
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What's the best heatsink for the AM4 socket, bother overall and for the price? Upgrading my 1st gen i5.
>>
>>65560546
No problem, enjoy anon.
>>
>>65560646
> 1070
> Is G-Sync important
It is, for you. Also you'll pay a G-Sync tax, $100 or so.
>>
>>65560681
Oof. Got any recommendations? Cheapest decent one I'm seeing is the Acer Predator 24" for like 350 USD. Tell me it gets better.
>>
>>65555859
I've got $500, a case, a 650w nonmodular PSU, and peripherals. I want to play Overwatch, what to do?
>>
>>65560733
Is that the only thing you're playing? Get an i3 8100, a B360 motherboard, 8GB of RAM and a GTX 1050Ti and you should be good to go with some money to spare.
>>
>>65560733
>>65560752
Oh yeah, and a cheap SSD and hard drive, that should fit into the budget.
>>
>>65560752
>>65560756
Thank you, and yeah for the most part. Its the only new game anyway. Otherwise I'm sticking to older ones, maybe Path of Exile too.

The parts are from a machine I'm running now, the HDD has W7 on it. Is the W7 license tied to the HDD or the motherboard?
>>
>>65560733
>>65560756
You could get a MX330 to fit the budget
https://pcpartpicker.com/list/n6zjpG
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y16UYZN9zCU at 7:34
>>
>>65560900
Excellent, thanks anon
>>
>>65560777
If I'm not mistaken, it's tied to your motherboard, and you can't transfer it if it's just an OEM key.
>>
https://pcpartpicker.com/list/fBnK4q

good/decent build for gaming? the I3 is on sale at Fry's for $89 so i'd like to buy pretty soon
>>
>>65561091
You should be fine, though get a bigger SSD if you can. That and B360 motherboards only support up to 2666Mhz RAM.
>>
Getting an Asrock (?) Z370 extreme 4 tomorrow. Should I get another 2x8gb 3200 DDR4 to make it 32gb or just stick with 16? I don't max out 16gb; but 32gb is recommend by some third party add ons (flight simulator scenery).

Also will I be able to take my cpu to 5.3ghz on this mobo? I had a Z370-I rog strix (it shit itself) get me to 5.3ghz at 1.45v I think. Have a delid 8700k so temp wasn't high at all for the volts.

What should I use my new PCI slots for? I need one for a wifi card. I bought a 2.5" adapter to RAID some spare SATA M.2. SSD I had laying around so not interested in an M.2 raid PCI adapter (I have a 960 Pro anyway).

Apparently the Asrock z370 Extreme 4 is a good board - especially for the price ($170)
>>
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This is good as I can OC this thing without it BSoDing after a few hours.

How'd I do?
>>
>>65555859
Hi /pcbg/, searching for a 4u case where I can stick a liquid cooling setup. Do you know any?
>>
>>65557032
>its actually a very sad meme
>supposedly the drives are better because they belive in supporting linux but they also known to be pure trash and break. SO yea maybe going full AMD will work
No not just the driver, but not having basic features locked to enterprise hardware (Xeon and Qaudro) which make passthrough and other things easier.
>>
What type of specs do I need for a simple home webserver, something that would be better or equal to $8 a month at a web hosting service?
>>
>>65560657
Best...? I mean a Noctua, or one of those giant Cryorig, Thermaltake or Be Quiet ones. They're all pretty similar and vary here and there from reviewer to reviewer.

But I'd just get like an H7 or C1 because Ryzen is voltage limited and not thermally limited. Any 140w TDP cooler or better will handle a 1.4v Ryzen perfectly well. No reason to get a 180w+ TDP one... but if yo want to, just go ahead pick whatever you like the most man.

>>65560733
Uhh even a 2400G is perfectly good for playing Overwatch at 60fps.
Do you have a monitor already?
I'd get that and just upgrade later. Dunno why people are suggesting an overpriced 1050Ti. Doesn't Overwatch prefer AMD, and the RX560 is real close to the 1050Ti for a lot less money, too?
Yeah an RX560 is good for 80fps minimum, 100 average, in Overwatch at 1080p so wtf.

>>65561334
16GB is all you need if you aren't a developer, artist, etc. Don't waste the money on 32gb of fast RAM when you could get a larger SSD, better monitor, etc.
Also don't get NVMe if you're just gaming. Those things are mostly only useful as scratch disks and for better VM performance etc. Higher end SATA SSD speeds are super good.
>>
>>65561462
I think an Amazon ec2 mini is like similar to half to a quarter a core of a 1700, not counting the "burst" credits.
So a 1700 is 16-32 ec2 minis.
>>
>>65561501
So your saying I can build a pretty powerful web server for pretty cheap? I'm specifically trying to avoid being attached to an external hosting service. Like if I made a ryzen 1600 machine with a 1030 just for graphics and 8 gigs of ram would that be a good web server?
>>
>>65561610
isn't the thing about web servers a proper infrastructure rather than just a potent server.
What are you going to do if the external connection crashes? you just can swap the whole server in matter of seconds to another computer and what about DDOS, web services have dynamic systems where they can disable basic attacks and you wont even notice them.
I guess you just want it for a local network and im assuming to much
>>
>>65561652
I want a website that looks like this.
http://tldp.org/HOWTO/NCURSES-Programming-HOWTO/
And simply has articles and links to download torrent files for Let's Play videos I want to make. I don't want to deal with youtube, I don't want to stream the videos, I just want to host torrent files for individual episodes and batches like a podcast website or a website like horriblesubs does. No illegal content I just trust filesharing more for archival and availability than jewtube.

I have no idea if I can do what I want with a simple hosting service or not but you can probably gather by the fact that I don't want to deal with youtube I also don't want to deal with a webhosting service that is going to do shady business practices or interfere with what I want to do. I'm being paranoid I guess because I really don't have anything outlandish to say, I have no reason to get flagged or anything, I just really value free speech and I hate google and youtube for the types of things that do to content creators and the attitude they take towards free speech on the whole.
>>
>>65561610
Er kind of?
Also figure that a 1700+chipset is going to be like $5-$10 per month in electricity, not counting any graphics card usage.

For small servers, AWS and Azure tend to be quite a bit cheaper and more flexible.
But even on the high end.. AWS has $million+ clients using its services for a reason. They don't cost much more than co-lo or owning your own servers while they give a lot of benefits.

You're paying for way more than just the CPU cycles.
>>
> Pic related.
Good deal for $410? Used around 6 months and not mining card.

Or should I go for GTX 1060 6Bfor $310?
>>
>>65561718
Alright I guess it makes a lot of sense to use a web hosting service then. I have a feeling that comcast would get pissy if I tried hosting a server without business internet anyways.
>>
>>65561731
$410 for a 1070 is okay, except when you consider it's only about 35% more powerful than an RX470 that you could have gotten for $100-$130 a year and a half ago, or about 30% more powerful than an RX580 that you could have gotten for $230 a little over a year ago.
But if you're using a 1440p monitor already, go for it.
>>
>>65561693
the thing your describing sound like a 2$/month server.
i don't know how much traffic your torrents will drive but for the actual cpu power it wont eat up that much you just sharing files.

With a 2$ server HD drive i ran a little server that hold up relative big edits on the maps, an that supposed to be a very intensive task even do its just a cube game.
For the traffic i don't think your internet provider will give you those 10Gbit connections
>>
>>65561731
Eh, Ampere's dropping in 3 months. I'd wait. 2 year old midtier card shouldn't be more than $300. Bad time to buy right now.
>>
>>65561731

Lol I bought the same card for $80
>>
>>65561814
I was saying that 1070s shouldn't be more than like $325 over a year ago.

Navi is supposed to have GTX 1080 performance for around $250 MSRP next year, too.
>>
>>65561771
Currently using 1440p with RX560. Guess I'll go GTX1060 6GB and wait for next 2060. Just need double fps upgrade from RX560.

>>65561814
>>65561899
Agree. But Ampere probably release with higher MSRP compared to Pascal and midrange card with $300 just a dream from now.
>>
>>65561981
1060 6gb isn't quite double over a full 16CU 4GB RX560.
It's about +80%.
Really less when you factor in how much better AMD GPUs increase in performance from overclocking.
You get like +4% performance overclocking most Nvidia GPUs. You can gain like straight up +30% overclocking most AMD GPUs (except some of the already highly clocked 580s and vega64 liquid).

If you want 2x FPS over an overclocked 560, you'll have to look at a 1070, not 1060.

>>65561981
Dunno I mean the Ampere *60 is likely going to be 1070 performance for $250-$280 msrp. You could preorder a founder edition but Nvidia founder editions usually are shitty PCBs and coolers.
Or just overclock the 560 and wait for Navi to give you 1080 perf for $250.
>>
>>65555859
>How to install Win7 on Ryzen
>https://pastebin.com/TUZvnmy1
>Written October 3, 2017
Is this still valid? Specifically the second part - "Enable Windows Update for Ryzen hardware"
>>
>>65562054
this is the guide i followed at the end of february
the driver injection into iso might throw an error about only adding 2 of 3 drivers or something but it turns out you can ignore it
>>
Can someone recommend a CPU+MOBO combo for a office/home PC?

It just need to handle MS Office, Youtube vids (at least 720p) and general internet browsing.
>>
>>65562111
Thanks.
Is the Windows 7 installation guide on the /g/ wiki still relevant?
I haven't installed any OS in a very, very long time.
>>
>>65562142
2200g+B350 PC Mate or any B350 board that's not the Pro4 or the Gaming Pro
>>
>>65562054
afaik the only thing really preventing you from installing Win7 on Ryzen is that Win7 installer doesn't have the usb 3.0 drivers.
Putting those drivers on the installer usb fixes that and should make it work.
>>
>>65562148
not a clue, i just went on autopilot after following the guide you linked
>>
>>65562142
>>65562282
You'll need DDR4 too, a 2x4GB 2666MHz or faster kit if possible
>>
>>65562300
thanks dude, but i aint buyng 8GB of ram for a office pc
>>
>>65562282
Not that anon. So is the MSI B350 Tomahawk gud?
Going with a Ryzen 5 1600.
>>
>>65562407
You could get this one, the cheapest 2x4GB kit is $30 more
https://pcpartpicker.com/product/xwYLrH/crucial-ballistix-sport-lt-4gb-1-x-4gb-ddr4-2666-memory-bls4g4d26bfsb
>>
>>65562435
It's good but I'd get the Strix B350-F for $13 more (better quality and more power phases)
>>
>>65562435
All b350 are shit but i like msi
>>
Best mouse/keyboard combo for $60?
>>
>>65562435
I have one. No complaints.
>>
>>65562054
its still good
>>
>>65561771
RX470 never went for $100. Cheapest was $170, quick was a steal

>>65561731
1070 is a decent deal

>>65561091
RAM is too fast. You can't is anything past 2400 with an i3 and a B360. Get a bigger SSD
Also a 6GB 1060 is so overpriced, and new midrange cards are coming out in 6mo... I wouldn't buy it

>>65560733
>overwatch
Check benchmarks. Look into a 2200G, 2400G, or a 1050

>>65560649
Why are you mad though?

>>65560101
470 or 570 are great deals relative to the Nvidia cards. I have an FX 6350 and a 470, and it's a pretty good combo, but I'm looking to upgrade my CPU because it sucks for PUBG. I'd upgrade the graphics card first, then decide if you want to upgrade the CPU.
>>
>>65563910
>RX470 never went for $100. Cheapest was $170, quick was a steal
Objectively wrong, mister history revisionist.
There were ones for $125 after mail in rebates, which could get as low as $85-$95 with hoops like Newegg Groupons and ebates.
Many people on /pcbg/ were getting RX470s for $85-$95 in May of 2017, and a quick look at camelcamelcamel will show RX470s for $125 or less before further discounts.
>>
>>>65561731
>1070 is a decent deal

I still remember the price is in the price range last year.
>>
>>65563987
'no'
Anyway I'm talking about sticker price, not sucking dick to get 10 bucks off. $85 is less than the price of a GTX 1050, so no, they were never, ever, ever close to $85
>>
please advice
I haven't built a PC in a long time and due to some life issues I'm starting from scratch.
I found a prebuilt with
i5-7400
8 GB DDR4-2400
NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1060
For $750
$800 is about what my budget is right now
should I pull the trigger
I don't feel like its gonna get much cheaper if I build it myself
I just inherently don't trust prebuilts
>>
>>65564341
its shit
>>
good deals this week
http://www.microcenter.com/product/485472/ryzen_7_1700_summit_ridge_30_ghz_8_core_am4_boxed_processor_with_wraith_spire_cooler

many more below 300 bucks here
https://pcpartpicker.com/product/3kPzK8/amd-ryzen-7-1700-30ghz-8-core-processor-yd1700bbaebox

intel competition, the i5-8400 @180 +10 /-2 bucks, i5-8600 @224 /+10 bucks, 6c/6t, both locked.
https://pcpartpicker.com/product/LHYWGX/intel-core-i5-8400-28ghz-6-core-processor-bx80684i58400

https://pcpartpicker.com/product/XMTPxr/intel-core-i5-8600-31ghz-6-core-processor-bx80684i58600
>>
>>65564304
>a quick look at camelcamelcamel will show RX470s for $125 or less before further discounts.

>>65564341
Eh.. I'm guessing memory is single channel, so that leaves about 25% of performance on the table there.
The 1060 is the 3GB and not 6GB I'm guessing too, which is shit.
i5-7400 is pretty shit. Granted you could upgrade it, but I'm guessing it's a motherboard that isn't unlocked. You could put an i7-7700 in there, but that's an extra $250 and just not worth it.

It won't be much cheaper if you make one yourself, but you can make something better with a better upgrade path.

>>65564505
The $240 on Amazon isn't bad but like.. the 2700X is significantly better for not a whole lot more.
If you're getting Ryzen 1, I'd just get a 1600 which you can find for like $160 sometimes. I wouldn't get a 1700 at this point unless it's just for like a home server or you can get the CPU+motherboard for under $300.
>>
>>65564535
yeah there is a newer model with a i7-7700 for $1050 too
https://www.amazon.com/HP-Pavilion-Desktop-Computer-580-068/dp/B076BXQDJZ/ref=dp_ob_title_ce?dpID=31xk2PxuHOL&preST=_SY300_QL70_&dpSrc=detail

I'm just gonna keep saving and live off my laptop for another month or so
>>
>>65564535
well, I have mine.
But they are good deals, I'd advise to wait for the Ryzen 2 launch as well though, because maybe we'll get some fire clearances after the 19th. More cores is always better.
>>
>>65564505
>>65564535
also, it comes with the cooler, for those even more budget oriented. So that's another 30 bucks shaved off in possible costs.
>>
>>65564656
which would make it 189 dollaridoos... following that logic. That's a nice value if you think about it.
>>
>>65564656
The 2700X comes with a cooler, dude.
>>
>>65564731
I know. the spire's bigger brother at that.
But that's at 329 bucks. I was just commenting on good deals I found while looking for something completely unrelated.
My post: guise look, I came upon a good sale.
It's a sale.
That's it. don't over analyse it.
>>
https://pcpartpicker.com/list/NnJ27W
Can I do anything better with a 1000yurobucks budget?
Gaming focused
>>
https://pcpartpicker.com/list/HNffHh

This is my ideal build, but as I still don't have enough money I'm thinking about just buying an A8 9600 and using that until I get enough. Would the integrated graphics be adequate for playing older (~10+ years) games?
>>
>>65565517
oh wait the A8 would replace both the CPU and GPU
>>
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Friend asked for a €1000 budget desktop that can handle "music/photo/film recording/editing" (no gaming). I've quickly come up with this:
>>
Do you ever wonder if your just trying to make up for a lack of discipline or your trying to fill a gap in your life by upgrading your PC and your just hoping the upgrade will be the catalyst for radical change to alter the direction that you're taking your life?
>>
>>65565568
>no gpu
>15cm noctua on non K chip
>no storage
>platinum psu

bait?
>>
>>65565576
yes, that's why I've made parts lists about 5 times a year but held on my current 280X/i3-2100 build (didn't have much money at the time). It still plays the things I want, only thing I'd upgrade for is VR but that's still too expensive for what you get and the choice of games
>>
>>65565568
250gb SSD will fill up in less than a day of recording. lmfao.
Also, most editing programs have GPU acceleration?
>>
>>65565606
>no gpu
No gaming.
>15cm noctua on non K chip
For silence desu.
>no storage
The SSD for OS. Other hard drives I'll leave that to him.
>platinum psu
Honestly have no idea for the PSU for a 1k build, I've worked with tighter budgets myself in the past.

I'm Irish but PC shopping is done in the UK.
>>
>>65565697
Problem is that I've only built a budget gaming PC back in 2012. I have no idea what's needed in an editing machine.
>>
>>65565722
You want a GPU for video editing, get a cheaper power supply (bronze 550-650W will be more than enough), wait for the new ryzen chips or get older ones if you can't wait so you can save some money there too,and with that money get a 1050ti or something like that.
>>
Tfw only the x470 taichi has 8 sata ports.
>>
>>65565722
https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/list/nvzskd
Here you go, that's around 1000€ and it's even got some storage
>>
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>>65565785
>>65565697
>>65565606
I-is this build more sensible, senpais...?
>>65565915
Thank you for going through the trouble senpai, why a Ryzen 5 instead of 7 though?

Also, I asked the fella; he is editing 1080p video,
>>
>>65565996
No particular reason, a 1600 would be more than enough for 1080p editing but sure the 1700 will do better. Make sure to check if the ram is compatible with the motherboard. Also really cheap cases can be a pain to work with, I don't know about that one in particular you should check some reviews.
>>
how well does a gtx 1070 hold up for 1440p if i were to upgrade my 1080p tv to a 1440p 144hz monitor? i won't be utilising adaptive sync but as long as i can get 60+ fps on average i am fine with it
>>
>>65566083
Hmm good points senpai, thank you.
>>
Best ~$200 video card?

currently looking at one of these:
https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814126170&ignorebbr=1&nm_mc=AFC-C8Junction&cm_mmc=AFC-C8Junction-PCPartPicker,%20LLC-_-na-_-na-_-na&cm_sp=&AID=10446076&PID=3938566&SID=
>>
>>65565996
Is 1000£ a hard limit? Is budget more the goal or performance. How comfortable are you with the bios/PC building (I assume you're building this for them). Is this a good friend who you visit often, or a mate from college. You don't want someone coming to you for tech support so if it's the latter I'd go for something simpler and more proven to work. Otherwise I'd tweak the build towards better value.
>>
>>65565823
you're probably complaining because of the bios issues the x370 had on release. Most of them have been fixed and it's not as bad anymore. Memory compatibility is also on par with gigabyte and asus -- don't know about msi (because I don't care about msi).
So if that's the deal breaker for the others, then I don't see why wouldn't you go for Asrock. That bios was probably the single very well known flaw it had. Excepting that, most would rate that board a solid 10/10.

Also, take into account that the one complaining is a professiobal overclocker, and the bios wans't featureless or defective. It was just annoying to work with, especially when you're trying many different things, to prove concepts or just hardcore oc'ing it to ridiculous levels; on ln2.
>>
>>65565996
>https://pcpartpicker.com/list/NnJ27W
Seems reasonable, but why not just get a 1 TB regular SSD? You just want one WITHOUT TLC and MLC NAND like the Samsung 850 iirc.
What is the NVME actually for? They can be useful as a scratch disk for video editing, but that's not useful if your friend doesn't know how to utilize it.
You can also get 2TB HDDs for hardly anymore than 1TB.
>>
>upgrade from a 980 Ti to an almost brand new, hardly used 1080 Ti that I got for a great deal (it's a Dell one that came in an Alienware Aurora, pic related - it also has a red pcb)
>performance in some games gets worse
Great, now I have to upgrade my CPU.
>>
>>65564535
>RX470s for $125 or less
>backpeddling from $85
Yeah sure, just link me when you find a cherrypicked example even close to 125 + discounts

>>65564535
>I'm guessing memory is single channel
Probably not. It's likely 2x 8GB
>that leaves about 25% of performance on the table there
Even if it were single channel memory doesn't drop an i5's perf by anything near 25%. More like 10% at max in CPU limited situations. I'm not arguing against dual channel, just against your dumb numbers

>>65565291
Better monitor, get a VA panel

>>65566673
Personally I'd get a 1050, then sell and upgrade when new cards come out

>>65567194
Update your drivers
>>
>>65567374
>Update your drivers
I did a complete clean install (used DDU)
Still get absolute shit performance in games like Hitman, Far Cry 3 Blood Dragon, and GTA:O
>>
>>65567487
Post your speccy, just so that we can laugh
>>
My parts are arriving on Saturday, 6 in total: R5 2400g, ASUS TUF, RAM, SSD, Case, PSU. Is there something I’m missing or will I be able to build everything?

>pic related?
>some cables?
>some other screws or bits and bobs?
>>
Lads all I'm missing is a mobo+cpu, I have everything else (390x GPU, 4000MHz ram, everything else is superficial) am I retarded if I go for 2700x + decent x470 mobo and leave it stock with the stock cooler. People are finding it hard enough to OC past 4.3 GHz it seems so having XFR 2.0 boost 2 cores to 4.35 GHz should be enough for gaming. I know intel is better for gaming but I doubt I'll go 144Hz over 4KHD in the future and am running 1080 60 for now regardless. I don't feel like screwing with delidding as well because muh warranty.

Want this to last 4-5 years ideally and I don't see things advancing much past intel gluing on more cores and "moving" to 10nm along with amd moving to 7nm which should be a decent. The only future upgrade would be to get a better monitor and shove in a new GPU 2 years or so down the line.

https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/list/Vcy9GG link is what I have bought/have on hand.
>>
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>>65569049
honestly i'll be happy to trade off 10-15 fps lower gaymen performance with ryzen
>>
>>65568752
check the motherboard box for a sticker that says "ryzen 2000 ready". If it has it then you're good to go, if not:
You will either need to ask AMD for a boot kit, RMA the mobo and ask for an updated one, or go to a local PC shop and ask them to update which may cost more money than you're willing to spend
>>
>>65569564
It's what I'll most likely go for, I'm not gonna go full retard and pre order shit willy nilly though, best to wait for benchmarks incase it decides to implode at certain temps.
>>
I've got every part except the PSU for my PC now and that wristband shit for static electricity.

How can I make sure that no component will be zapped from static electricity? Can I just put the wristband clamp on my computer case? Or should it be to some other metal?

t. brainlet
>>
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best 4gb vram nvidia card?

w/o OC
>>
I have a question about power draw. I have a 380W power supply that came with the case, realistically would that be enough for the ryzen 2700x+rx460+1HDD?
>>
>State the budget & CURRENCY for your build
~$800 US, could be convinced to go higher. Have a Philips 257E7QDSB monitor already.

>List your uses

Moderate gaming, multitasking for working from home. Fusion 360, AutoCAD, many spreadsheets, other shit going at once. Nothing too crazy (We use damn MacMinis at work) but is a consideration.

I don't know anything about modern computing, looking for some guidance. Ask anything I'm not covering.
>>
guys today I won a MoBo in a local hardware reseller, im thinking in a Ryzen 2600 build, is this MoBo ok or do I have to get a new one.

I'm a thirdwolder so it wolud be amazing if this one works for what i want
>>
>>65570186
YOU LUCKY SON OF A GUN, stick with the mobo and buy the best AMD cpu you can get. Also take into consideration the cost of ram.
>>
>>65566731
I own a asrock x370 board. Never had issues with it. My complaint is that there's no other board with 8 sata ports. The new crosshair ditched its previous 8 sata ports to get only 6 on its refresh.
>>
>>65570213

thanks m8, ryzen 2600 will be here in like 10 days, probably ill need to upgrade BIOS but a friend has a spare CPU that I can borrow to upgrade
>>
>>65570186
2600 would be fine, but you might have to have the shop update the BIOS

>>65570213
Nah, he needs room to upgrade

>>65570143
Check benchmarks for AutoCAD. Not sure if it's more single or multithreaded performance dependent. You'll probably want 16GB of RAM

>>65570029
GTX 980 4GB, pretty sure your question is retarded though.
>>
>>65570311

yeah it is retarded... I'm just ranking them by vram amount, so it is surprising to me how 4gb vram cards are more expensive than 6gb
>>
>>65563910
>470vs570
I managed to get an offer. Rx 570 used for 2 months gaming and mining $210, dude says its dual bios so he wanted to try. Cheapest new one here is $320.
I think I might buy this, keep the CPU and get the LG 24mp59 with freesync. CPU will bottleneck but I can wait until ram cards are cheaper and get the ryzen 5 1600, 16gb 3200mhz and a decent mobo. Can't afford to spend $230 on 8gb ram, I'm buying my first car so until I finish paying it (prob September) I can deal with bottleneck.
>>
>>65570186
It's 2000 ready, I assume it would post with whatever 2000 ryzen you put in. Probably want to update bios regardless
>>
>>65570618

What's the worst thing that can happen if I try to update with a 2600?

Im aware that It has an update to do
>>
>>65570703
The worst thing would be that it wouldn't post. I'm 99% sure this wouldn't happen though since it does say that it's 2000 series ready and has probably had its bios updated to at least post with a 2600 thrown in. I would just update to the latest bios to get better (probable) memory compatibility.
>>
new drivers for Raven Ridge are out, but from the few tests ive seen don't show much difference, maybe its a bit smoother.
I would guess it's a stability patch rather than performance :/
>>
>>65570719

Thanks m8, Im going for a 2600 then.
>>
>>65570349
They aren't though
>>
Is buying a pc worth it right now, will prices eventually drop?
The prices of video cards and fucking memory sticks is still ridiculously high compared to what it was not so long ago before the crypto craze
>>
>>65571255

GPU prices are dropping, CPU and MoBos have prices for all budgets

but yes, memory sticks are overvaluated as fuck
>>
>>65565996
Ah I got that motherboard. Super solid. If you look in the archive about it you'll probably find me asking tons of questions about it, glad I took a chance on it because I got for really cheap.
>>
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>tfw leaning 560 4gb over 1050 2gb for that extra 2gb vram

am i falling for the vram meme? its $15 more for the 560 but I prefer AMD and was probably going that way anyway...
>>
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>Trying to install the Vega FE I brought a week ago into my system
>Decide to also repaste Ryzen 1700x for the heck of it
>Repaste the CPU, but don't really notice mounting CPU didn't go right, as system doesn't POST after doing everything.
>Think the Vega must be faulty, swap GPU, still not POSTing, notice CPU fans and PSU is not spinning at all when power button is pressed
>Looked to see if power button got screwed up, redid the header pin on the motherboard, no POST still.
>Unmount cooler and see what is going on with the CPU
>Notice 1 bent pin and some other pings somehow got thermal paste on it.
>Spend a good 45 minutes cleaning the pins and rebending the pin.
>Remount and try it again, still no POST
>Pretty much feel like I exhausted all options and gave up
>Call Frys to see when I can drop the system in as I don't have enough equipment to do diagnostics
>Delayed for 2 hours since I had to do some other things
>Get back early and decide to try one more time and see what is happening
>I noticed that there was a piece of lint in the socket so the CPU would not mount correctly and it was probably shorting something
>Clear it and remount, computer POSTs
>Put in Vega FE and everything is working

Lessons learned:

1.) PGA sockets are a huge hassle, that was a good waste of 3-4 hours for a simple job, just because I wasn't careful or noticed mounting the CPU was wrong,
2.) I am probably a brainlet or something to let all this happen and my troubleshooting skills need work, along with needing to not give up so easily
3.) Vega is pretty but gets hot quick.

Anyways, sorry for the blog. I was seriously considering a 2nd generation Ryzen when all this seemed hopeless.
>>
What's the sweet spot amount of memory for threadripper builds? I'll probably be multitasking a lot of stuff at once, probably games while watching HD video and/or other stuff like browsers or rarely a VM.
>>
>>65571555
32 gb ram access memory
1 tb ssd
>>
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>>65571627
>1 tb ssd

i want it
>>
>>65571542
>PGA sockets are a huge hassle
>I am probably a brainlet or something
I'm noting a trend here
>>
Currently have a

Ryzen 1300x
AMD 380 2G
8GB RAM
SSD

What should I upgrade to get more framerats?
>>
If I'm stuck at a 970 for the foreseeable future due to the GPU market being killed, should i bother going all in on the absurdly priced maximum meme monitor like a 279Q, which will require 15 returns?
Or should I go some other ~$300 27 1440p IPS and pray that by some miracle better monitors that don't require a lottery come out in a few years
>>
>>65571805
Graphics card
or simply turn down settings

>>65571811
Get a VA panel with HDR10
>>
>>65555859
The g4560 wasnt surpassed by the pentium g5500 and g5600?
>>
>>65571909
DO those really come in 27 2k at all? Seeing far too much 4k which is too much to handle right now
>>
yooOOOOOO
just scored a brand new asus 1080 ti strix (not OC edition) for $750 and my build is FINISHED
>>
>>65571542
PGA sockets are fine
>>
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A warning to everyone who is building a new Ryzen system:

Stay away from this board. I unfortunately bought it, it was working great until i updated to the new BIOS(which it now ships with) and now i get random freezes and crashes, and worst of all i can't get into the UEFI so i can't update it, which means i'm stuck with this buggy version.
>>
>>65572135
Even the G5400, but platform cost is significantly higher than the G4560 for a super budget build

>>65572142
MSI Optix or Samsung
>>
>>65572338
>i updated to the new BIOS

the beta one ? or the 4.70? more details about what CPU u have?
>>
>>65572965
1600x at stock speeds.

And the bios is 4.70.
>>
Is r9 fury/nano good alternative for rx 580?
580 cost 450 usd while used r9 fury/nano cost 320 usd

I just want to experience 144hz goodness for cheap
>>
>>65573001

what BIOS u had before update?

also

>We don't recommend users to update the BIOS if their system is already running normally.

but I guess u did bc M.2 improving...
>>
>>65573138
4.60, and i updated to fix the DRAM voltage setting issue because 4.70 apparently fixes it.
>>
>>65573171
>DRAM voltage setting issue

I wonder if you have Corsair memories...
>>
>>65573237
G.skill, and this was a widely reported issue.
>>
>>65555888
Okay for stock speeds, get a better VRM board if you want to overclock.

>>65556368
>2010+8
>actually considering avoiding an SSD
The SSD is probably one of the most critical components of the build. Just buy one.

>>65557091
>slower
Only slightly. Realistically, they're equal.

>>65557224
AIO liquid cooler? The pump blocks are usually significantly shorter than most low profile air coolers.

>>65557256
Too low power and absolutely crap for single threaded applications. Also wrecks 20+ yeas of backwards compatibility by introducing new instruction sets.

>>65560257
>is gsync a meme on 144hz?
Gsync is a meme period.

>>65560394
>GIGABYTE AORUS GA-AX370-Gaming 5
The gaming 5 has known BIOS issues. Either get the gaming 7 or the ASUS crosshair.
>not going to OC
If you're absolutely sure about that, then you could probably use one of the <$100 b350 boards. However, those should never be used for overclocking due to their shit VRMs.

>>65561334
>>65561489
>16GB is all you need if you aren't a developer, artist, etc.
Dev here. 16GB is fine even for me. The only reason to buy more would be to run VMs, Fortnite, and Premier at the same time.
>>
https://pcpartpicker.com/list/sypn7W
I wake up and go to work every day knowing I'll be ordering this or something similar in just 5 short months of budgetting. What was purchasing your first custom PC like anons? I'm 25 and I've been using a prebuilt Dell for 10 years.
>>
>>65571495
It's not powerful enough to utilize that 4GB of VRAM, but that extra VRAM might (ever so slightly) become useful if you get a decent 20-30% overclock on your card.
>>
>>65569990
Put the clamp in a grounded outlet. Though honestly, I haven't heard of anyone actually frying their components by just touching them without that anti-static stuff. I've seen people build on a carpet and a metal desk and nothing bad happened. If you really want to be safe, just do what I do, plug in the PSU to the power supply without turning it on, and touch the housing, maybe touch the case too, 99% of the time you should be good to go.
>>
>>65574282
*PSU to the outlet
>>
>>65573727
imo you'd be better off with 2 3tb drives in raid1, if you hoard that much on a single point of failure you'd regret it a lot. If it's just for your steam library then it's fine.
>>
>>65574299
Hmm I guess you're right, is doubling up on that 6tb drive also an acceptable solution? It just seems like a good drive/deal.
>>
>>65570125
>380W
Probably not.
>>
>>65573387
>Dev here. 16GB is fine even for me.
I mean I had 16GB 6 years ago. More recently my IDEs, browsers, and profilers have been using a lot more memory.
I also do my own art sometimes, placeholder art, which is pretty common for many programmers, so add art programs to that list.
I was using 17-20GB at times, eating into page file.

It'll depend on what you're doing. You can still get by with 16, but I'm glad I have 32 now.
>>
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>shilltell releases cheap H310 mITX mobo for $60
>meanwile cheapest B350 mITX still $110
No chance to do G2200 build like that
>>
How do you plug 2 screens in one of this mini gpus? You plug the second one in the mobo hdmi port? You use an adaptor?
>>
>>65575619
your image literally has card with 3 outputs whats your problem?
>>
>>65575642
I want to plug 2 hdmi screens and the gpu has only 1
>>
>>65575619
>You use an adaptor?
Or a different cable. Both should go into the GPU.
>>
>>65575675
Then use another interface on your monitor, retard.
>>
>>65575677
>>65575717
The thing is that I would use 2 cheap tvs that I have arround. They both have only hdmi ports. In the past I had troubles using adaptors so I want to know what alternatives are there. Is not that I am THAT retarded...

>Pic related, is me
>>
>>65575823
Use a displayport - hdmi cable for one of them, then?
>>
>>65575838
>displayport - hdmi
I wasnt aware that that is a thing. Thanks. Can you tellme more about this port? I came from a vga build from like 2001 or something...
>>
Buy GTX 1070 now for $400 or wait for whatever Nvidia will release?
Any rumour next gen GPU?

I'm using iGPU now.
>>
>>65575899
As far as I know, it's just a better HDMI.
>>
I am going to build a new pc, now the question is of an OS? which windows OS should I use (I will install linux on my current laptop)

should I use windows 10 ltsc or maybe I should use windows server 2016 ? I hear that its basically windows 10 but with all the shit removed or disabled (even better than LTSC)
so what do you think /g/ ?
>>
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>>65555859
Does the voltage and temperature look okay here?
>>
>>65575914
IGPU is fine and should consume less power.

Stay with just that unless you want to play games or encode videos or something.
>>
>>65572338
i have the atx version and its perfectly fine, i guess they just fucked up the matx board
>>
>>65574318
I usually go with wd hard disk, cannot advice you on the toshiba. As for the 6tb raid solution sure, if you can afford and need double the space. Depending on how sensitive the data is you may wanna consiser a third disk to plug just for backup purposes, leaving it powered off the rest of its lifetime.
>>
Are there any cheap PSU that are very efficient at low system loads (Atom/Pentium J-series with only storage controller PCI cards and nothing else really) with 8+ SATA drives?

80plus PSU ratings seem useless here since only the premium "titanium" PSU are even rated at low load. And PicoPSU and clones usually supply only ~4 SATA drives.
>>
>>65573061
Fury is really bad (often it performs close to the 580 because of lack of support or something), but at those prices it might be an ok choice

>>65573727
>5 short months of budgetting
Get a better job, or manage your expenses. If you're investing+a tightwad, good job. Anyway you're overspending on the i7 almost assuredly, and same goes for the 1070Ti unless you have a 1440p or high refresh rate monitor

>>65575515
>G2200
It's a 2200G. GXXXX is Pentium nomenclature

>>65575914
>GTX 1070 now for $400
If used it's eh, if new it's fine.
>>
Is GPU sagging still a problem nowadays with memeinforced motherboard and backplate gpu's? or it will sag slowly overtime
>>
>>65577777
>>
What is a good and elegant case? Not interested in gaming. Mid tower/full tower.
>>
Can I ground myself by touching a turned off, charging laptop? If the battery is out?
>>
>>65575717
Is the joke that the graph doesn't look like that at all? It would be the limit as x approaches 0
>>
What's the best Bluetooth adapter?
>>
>>65575717
Why americunts are so dumb in math?
>>
>>65578210
Why are europoors so bad at humor?
>>
>>65575515
>mitx
why don't you just be a macfag if you wont want features and expansion retard
>>
>>65558362
the only delusion here is you thinking intel is anything but trash tier
>>
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It's been a couple months now. Has the miner craze died down and are GPUs finally a reasonable price?
>>
>>65573727
>https://pcpartpicker.com/list/sypn7W
>$2000
>6 cores
wow that is fucking awful
>>
>>65579985
still shit
>>
Should I go for a 1600X or a 2600 ?
1600X will be a tad cheaper, at around EUR 170-180, while the 2600 will be priced around EUR 200.
>>
>>65579994
2600x, it will come with a stock cooler this time, have better binning and cost only a little more
>>
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>>65579993
fuck. Im gonna be stuck on my 970 forever arent i?
>>
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>>65580019
Well you're not alone.
>>
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>>65555859
>i3 8100 - Budget gaming builds
>>
>>65580011
I don't have a need for a cooler, and it's way more expensive than the 1600x, is it really worth it ?
>>
GTX 1060 6GB OR RX580 8GB? Which one is more future proof? What about overclocking i didn't even know that you can overclock a GPU which is better to overclock, would i need to buy a fan or something to do it?
>>
>>65580154
>it's way more expensive than the 1600x
Nigger its 300$ more
https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819113497&ignorebbr=1&nm_mc=KNC-GoogleAdwords-PC&cm_mmc=KNC-GoogleAdwords-PC-_-pla-_-Processors+-+Desktops-_-N82E16819113497&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI3bDM0I3C2gIVl_5kCh3XNAaeEAkYASABEgI_HPD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds
>>
>>65580424
typo, meant to say $30 not $300
>>
>>65575515
go buy a locked chipset then retard
>>
>>65579989
Those 6 cores out perform a lot of shit while overclocked including the memerippers even at multithreaded shit.
>>
>>65580496
Good luck overclocking, shithead

>>65580301
Can't future proof a graphics card. Don't bother overclocking, but the 1060 has more OC headroom

>>65580115
>jewposting taken seriously

>>65580019
>>65579993
>>65579985
Getting better, but still shit

>>65579989
>>65579976
>>65579955
>all this stupidity spread over three posts
Just post it all at once next time, retard.
>>
>>65578185
just get literally any of the usb ones on amazon, they all work the same.
>>
>>65580424
No, the 1600X can be had for EUR 180 right now, the 2600X will be EUR 230. That's a 50 eurobucks difference, assuming the 1600X will not drop in price in the coming days. 30% more expensive is a significant step
.
>>
How much longer will 1080p be the standard? Looking out 6 years will it still be good?
>>
>>65580609
Yeah I have a cheap generic adapter but I was wondering if there was anything better. I realized this was possible because the Bluetooth on my Galaxy S9 seems to be amazing, I can plop the phone down on my desk and listen all over the house. But when I connect to my computer it cuts off right when I leave the room. You'd think with all the power of a plugged in PC it would be better
>>
>>65580115
great contribution

So what's better?
>>
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>>65580588
>>
anyone here own a high refresh monitor (1080p, 1440p etc)?
how bad will tearing and stuttering be if i use my nvidia gpu with a high refresh monitor with no adaptive sync? i don't want to spend an arm and a leg on gsync if i don't need to
>>
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>>65555859
I'm looking to upgrade my 6 year old PC an i7-3880 auto overclocked to 3.5GHz, 16 GB RAM, 256GB SSD. All that shit came out that year and it was the best in class shit I could find.

I'm thinking of getting a Ryzen 2800x paired with 32GB RAM and a 1080Ti. How do I keep the build within a low budget? Willing to sacrifice RGB because flashing lights don't mesmerize me no more.
>>
>>65580659
Till we move on to 4k. Remember how long it took for everyone to move on to flat screen HD TVs. Pretty much that time so don't worry. We can still barely get 4k running fine on a gtx 1080ti.
>>
>>65579985
By the time GPUs get back to normal I've got a funny feeling another boom will happen like the last time. Or maybe everyone has learnt their lesson and its too hard now
>>
>>65575066
This has been my experience as well. I mean I'm at 8 gigs but a lot of the stuff I do that uses ram would be happier if I just had more of it. I feel like software is being designed in such a way now that it makes better use of excess ram than previously was the case.
>>
I'm gonna be taking my desktop with me on a plane. You think I'll be able to take it in as hand luggage? Anyone got experience in this? Any tips?
>>
>>65580661
maybe it might be possible to modify those cheap adapters with an antenna
>>
>>65581285
I heard about taking out the HDD. But anything else to worry about? I'm gonna take out the GPU and put it in bubble wrap
>>
Is there any reason to buy an ATX board over a mATX board or vice versa if your case supports both?
>>
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Is it just me or are WD drives kind of shit priced right now? The X300 seems good so I'm really leaning towards Toshiba right now.
>>
>>65580987
I'm sure you can change the refresh rate if its a problem.
>>
>>65580659
It can be standard for you as long as you want it to be, but I'd imagine higher res and the graphics card to drive it will be cheap within six years

>>65580730
The opposite of Intel, of course

>>65581176
>i7-3880
?
>>
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>>65581176
>32gb ram
>1080ti
>2800x(not out nor has it been announced )
And your talking about a budget?
>>
Is 32GB of DDR4-3200 RAM overkill for Ryzen?
>>
>>65580154
Seems pretty worth it. Seems to have on average around 7% higher IPC. So 4GHz 2600 is like 4.28Ghz 1600. And it clocks slightly higher.

Wish I could have waited to upgrade but my 2500k was just becoming a stutterfest in like 2015, 2016, let alone 2017. :(
>>
>>65581509
Not about Ryzen, it's about your use case
>>
>>65581509
Since you have to ask without giving a use case scenario, yes. Yes it is.
>>
>>65581510
>stutterfest in like 2015
>things that never happened
>>
>>65581509
Blind guess? You don't even need 8GB RAM.
>>
>>65581384
look at the features of each board. do you need what the bigger board has? Would you like it at some point?

another consideration is air flow, albeit a relatively minor difference a larger board will probably be slightly cooler
>>
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>>65581461
> And your talking about a budget?
Yeah my budget is $3-4k

>Is 32GB of DDR4-3200 RAM overkill for Ryzen?
I was told 16GB was overkill when no one was using 8GB. Lasted me a while with no hiccups.
>>
>>65581410
Not especially. With the Gold and Red Pro of course you pay a premium for the longer warranty and vibration sensors and things.

You probably don't need these unless you're filling RAID arrays or cluster storage nodes.
>>
>>65581558
>tfw no Qt girl to walk during a rainy night
feel lonely man
>>
>>65581558
> I was told 16GB was overkill when no one was using 8GB. Lasted me a while with no hiccups.
So it was overkill. You can always do that, but it's not necessarily a good choice.
>>
>>65581515
>>65581522
>>65581540
>>65581558
Well i tend to run VMs and just multitask a lot, but desu i've never felt like i was totally running out of RAM during reasonable usage when i had 16GB, but i don't know if with new vidyas coming out that's going to change or not
>>
>>65581588
Grab one as you stalk the rainy nights. Time efficient, eh.

>>65581613
Unless you are on Windows running non-memory sharing VMs, you'll probably not even manage to find enough server daemons and interactive applications to occupy 12-16GB RAM. Granted, you can easily bloat RAM usage, but it's probably pointless.
>>
>>65581558
>16 overkill
Yeah but we slowly edged on to 16gb.
Though some games are now recommending 16gb
Anyways 3-4k is much of a 'budget'
With that you can basically pick an choose anything to your hearts desire. The best shit for what you need. Use pcpartpicker
>>
I would like an inexpensive file server, perhaps a FreeBSD-powered one because ZFS sounds comfy.

I live in potatoland, so only UK-based retailers for this spud.
>>
>>65581439
you mean change the refresh to 60hz if i'm getting fluctuating fps above that?
>>
>>65581686
>I would like an inexpensive file server
How many drives? Do you need it to have more extreme throughput than GBE will allow? [~100-120MB/s]

> perhaps a FreeBSD-powered one because ZFS sounds comfy
I prefer Linux mdadm RAID. Performs better on much lower-end hardware. Scales better with drive count.
>>
>>65581686
Do you mean like a cloud service provider? Or one that you have at home? How much power and storage do you need?
>>
https://pcpartpicker.com/list/MQZ3tg
Are there better mobos/ram for about the same price or lower?
I already have every part except the cpu, mobo, and ram.
>>
https://pcpartpicker.com/product/jvwqqs/evga-geforce-gtx-1070-ti-8gb-sc-gaming-acx-30-black-edition-video-card-08g-p4-5671-kr

Is this card good enough to upgrade to 1440p?
>>
>>65581730
Just enough to back up 2-4TBs worth of data. Since the backup is just going to documents, photos, etc. I don't think I need anything "extreme" in terms of speeds.
>Linux mdadm RAID
Can that "screenshot" like ZFS?
>>
>>65581744
One that I have at home, not a cloud provider.
>>
>>65581825
> Just enough to back up 2-4TBs worth of data.
So... one single drive? Or are you going to RAID5/6 is anyhow to get higher reliability?

> Can that "screenshot" like ZFS?
Snapshot? Yes. The most common way is to just run lvm2 on top of mdadm... fancier partition management on top of mdadm which handles RAID, essentially.
>>
>>65581825
Get yourself one of these Asrock mITX boards with an integrated Pentium, pico psu, 8gb ram and two 4gb HDDs plus a drive to run whatever OS you want to run on.
>>
>>65581880
>>65581910
I'll probably use two 4GB HDDs. I'll consider also Linux mdadm over something like FreeNAS.
>>
>>65581910
Good suggestion overall, but you need 1-2GB RAM tops to run a Linux storage box, even with a bunch of fileserver daemons, ssh and friends included.
>>
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>>65581952
If you use Linux mdadm RAID1, you'll easily manage with a J1800. These are ~$60 in various places since it's an older chipset, not sure if you can get it at the same price in the UK.

1-2GB RAM will also do the job no problem even if you want to run ssh, ftp, samba, syncthing plus nextcloud and the occasional local borgbackup verify [could also do that remote, though] or something.

Actually, FreeNAS with zfs drive mirroring won't be too bad either. It's only going to get more taxing if/once you do RAIDZ or online deduplication [would avoid the latter entirely IMO]. Once you do that, you'll want more RAM and maybe a slightly beefier Atom / Pentium at least.
>>
>>65564341
7400 is kinda shit now, 6c or more is recommended.

https://pcpartpicker.com/list/gB9MZR
This for example, is better.
>>
Is an R9 390 still considered decent for 1440p? My buddy is looking to ditch his Power color PCS+ 390 soon and I was wondering if it's worth bothering for $100
>>
>>65582042
BTW, pic related was another option, XU4 + Cloudshell.

But it has the disadvantage that you won't be able to really neatly add more drives to it. You'd be scaling vertically [more machines], presumably. Still, if you only need 4TB and you're buying 8, it might last you until a replacement is due.

Also, a few (not too many on Linux, actually) pieces of software don't run on ARM.
>>
>>65582071
> decent for 1440p
Depends on the game and settings. Most games should run fine; it's not like the consoles got anything better.
>>
>>65581709
You can if you're getting bad screen tearing or something, but you probably won't need to. Notice that most games can't hit 144FPS minimums but high refresh is still the way to go, i.e., if it were a problem everyone who bought one would complain. If you're looking at buying a new monitor definitely go HDR10 + high refresh because you'll have it for a long time

>>65581797
Yeah

>>65582071
Pretty much bare minimum for 1440p but for $100 it's a steal
>>
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>>65567689
Sorry I'm replying so late I was banned for a day
W-why are you going to laugh at me, that's mean
>>
>>65582121
Get an i7 4770/K on the used market and add in a 500GB SSD
>>
>>65582118
>If you're looking at buying a new monitor definitely go HDR10 + high refresh because you'll have it for a long time
problem is these hdr10 monitors, based on the reviews i've seen anyway, are extortionately expensive and also apparently provide a bad HDR experience as well. all i'm really looking for is a cheap-ish, 1440p, 144hz monitor to pair with this gtx 1070 i managed to grab on the cheap. i will most likely get a freesync monitor and use it without the variable sync solely because it's cheaper than buying the gsync equivalent.
there are some cheap 1440p 144hz freesync monitors from AOC and other brands which use the latest VA panels and all that

http://www.microcenter.com/product/483264/agon_ag322qcx_315_led_monitor
>>
>>65581957
Sure about that? I always go with "storage in TB should be memory in GB" for NAS boxes.
>>
>>65582419
Yes, I'm sure. The stuff you want -mdadm, lvm, samba...- all has configurable but constant caches that aren't large before going bigger has no more benefits.
>>
If I just want to set an overclock for running 2 applications (emulators) but run everything else at stock can I use intel xtu to do this?
>>
>>65582587
I guess maybe I should say *essentially constant per drive*. A little bit of read-ahead buffer and stuff per drive might help with performance.

But we're talking about like 16-128MB per drive or something, and it's certainly not mandatory to reach GBE speeds [saturated on ONE single HDD's speed]. Likewise for SAMBA and stuff, maybe a little buffer is useful.

Still, doesn't change anything overall. You won't have enough drives and presumably not enough network bandwidth that 1-2GB are becoming anywhere near a problem.
>>
I need g-sync for Nvidia cards right?
>>
>>65582761
You don't NEED it, like AMD's freesync it's pretty much worthless and should not influence buying decisions. If you feel like you need it then yes, only Nvidia offers it.
>>
>>65582780
Freesync makes a lot of sense. It's a not too huge improvement, but also cheap to produce / buy hardware for.
>>
I decided this is a terrible time to update. I'll wait for ram being way cheaper than currently and mid-tier gpus going for decent prices. Fortunately I still got decent toaster.
>>
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If I was planning on upgrading in September with $2400 budget do you think waiting for November instead and having a $3400 budget and buying during the black friday sales would be a better choice to get the best results? I've already waited so long adding 2-3 months isn't a big deal if it means I can get an amazing upgrade.
>>
>>65555859
GTX 770 or 960?
>>
>>65582780
>freesync is pretty much worthless
this is from Forbes just today
>Primarily G-Sync monitors, which cost considerably more than their FreeSync counterparts because of closed standards and proprietary modules that must be installed in the G-Sync monitors. There's no debate here: Nvidia did it first, but AMD has won the variable refresh rate game with open standards, HDR support, cheaper prices and even console adoption.
now, please go die in the corner over there you disgusting shill.
>>
>>65582761
If Jewvidiya didn't lock Freesync from their drivers while also barring Radeon gfx from using gsync, this wouldn't be an issue. Reminder that this a political decison, not a technical impossibility. Variable refresh rates could be agnostically implemented across AMD and Nvidia, either way, under whichever method, quite easily, if not for Ngreedya's own decision to lock it all out.
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>>65583378
Can't tell if you're purposely acting dense or not but he said
>like AMD's freesync it's pretty much worthless
He's saying both are worthless and shouldn't influence your purchasing decision. I agree to some extent as I have used monitors with gsync and monitors without and there's no discernable difference between the two. It's mostly just snake oil. The only 'real' advantage I've seen is when you drop from 120+ fps to 50 instantaneously, it irons out the stutter but it doesn't make the game feel any less sluggish.
One of, if not the most widely used esports monitors in the world is the benq xl2411 and it's newer variant in the benq xl2430. Neither of these have any form of adaptive sync.
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>>65583429
As a computer retard who is considering the gsync meme but is looking for any decent reason to save a million dollars by skipping it - what actually causes those 60+ instant fps drops that makes gsync worthwhile?
As someone who plays just single player shit is is it something to take into consideration, or is it more of a multiplayer fps-type problem?
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>>65583483
It can happen in any game depending on several factors. You be playing a game which runs nicely at 100+ fps but then you suddenly get to a scene where there's lots of explosions and alpha effects which drop the fps instantaneously. This could be jarring and you could get tearing and stuttering. In general you won't need any adaptive sync unless you're really prone to noticing stutter and/or tearing. Above 100/120fps it becomes practically unnoticeable to everyone. Another big advantage of this technology is if you're running at low fps for consistent periods of time between 30-59 it will stop the stuttering and tearing I mentioned before but realistically why would you play playing a game at such high settings to be hitting that shit performance in the first place.

If you want the best quality high refresh monitors then these normally have gsync anyway so go for them. If you want a nice price/perf/visuals monitor then these normally have freesync and you could go for them. Doesn't matter either way as adaptive sync is a meme.
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>>65583429
esports idiots don't even use vsync so why would they bother?
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>>65583559
I'm perfectly fine with spending the big bucks on one of those rog swift/predator gimmicks since it's a once a decade purchase anyway, but I've honestly never actually seen BLB in person before so I just don't know if even I get a great one if it will annoy the fuck out of me or not.
The Best Buys around me seem to only set up the touchpad shit (plus I'm not sure they'd even showcasea monitor with BLB), and all the actual good stores like Frys are too damn far




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