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First flight with modern engine

https://youtu.be/371VTv_jQE0
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>>36084186
S - D U C T S
-
D
U
C
T
S
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>>36084186
>modern engine
>smoking like a 1800's train
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>>36084228
Left engine is new design, right engine is old.
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>>36084268
So is that why some people were roasting the T-50 for having different length engines?
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>>36084679
Got to love your vatniks, first they screamed all day long how you are retarded for saying that one engine is shorter then the other and now they call you retarded for not noticing that those are two different engines.
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>>36084679
yeah, but its pretty obvious it was sheer retardation on the attempted trolling.
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>>36084268
Is Russia so broke they can't afford 2 engines?
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>>36084679
>So is that why some people were roasting the T-50 for having different length engines?
Because they hate everything Russian.
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>>36085168
standard testing procedure for new engines
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>>36085495
Most countries don't test the intended production engine 8 years after first flight.
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>>36085509
Name another country that can actually afford to develop engines for their 5th gen fighters?
Hard mode: No burgerlandia
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>>36085509
Yeah, most USA's just put them straight into developmental testing planes and then have the whole fleet sit idle few months because something will always go wrong with new engine designs delaying the whole program.
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>>36085573
>Implying the Su57 is 5th Gen
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>>36085578
What kind of data will you get from using engines that don't meet performance specs?
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>>36085581
Daily Reminder it has the RCS of a B-1B.
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>>36084679
>No, you got it all wrong, stupid western! Those two engines are same length! You are sooo stupid for not seeing this.
>Ugh, those stupid westerners. Why didnt get that those are different engines, it is so obvious they arent even the same length.
>...
Tune in tomorrow, to hear the latest mantra that gets repeated endlessly by russboos, extra points when it is obviously contradicting to what they claimed before.
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>>36085573
Not Russia I guess.

The 30 is based on the decades old AL-31.
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>>36085613
Really, all you need to understand Russia is this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QrU1hZxSEXQ
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>>36085600
Engine development takes time, even more so for clean sheet designs. If they had waited for those Izdeliye 30's before they did anything else the first flight of PAK FA prototype woudn't have been 8 years ago, it would have been right about now. Instead of having 95%+ of developmental flights and testing done with only envelope expansion with the new engines remaining they would be starting from zero with the expected delivery dates closer to 2030
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>>36085700
Yeah, but even US engine design isn't "clean sheet."

The F119 is an evolutionary development from the F100-PW-220/220E (With the -229 integrating technologies from the F119 and F135), and the F135 is derived from the F119.
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>>36085700
>>36085773
So you're telling me current US engines are literally a better F100? Also how hard is it to design and develop engines?
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>>36084186

From behind, when the plane is lifting off, you can see the clean burning engine on the left and the old engine on the right.

Good stuff, vlad.
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>>36085890
There are major redesigns, but everything builds off of prior, successful models.

>Also how hard is it to design and develop engines?
Well, at this point it's not so much about raw design, as the F119/135 actually have 4 less compressor stages than the F100, it's about the manufacturing technologies needed to produce perfect monocrystalline parts with nanometer-scale precision that can withstand far greater heat and pressures than older engines. The F119 can output 11,000lbf more thrust than the F-100-PW-220, and the F135 can push 8,000 more than the F119.
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>>36085581
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>>36086016
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>>36086036
>>
/k/ on suicide watch.
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>>36086034
>Not stealth
>Basically still using Su-35 sensors
>Implying it's anything but a Gen 4.5++++
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>>36086054
>stealth
This isnt something a 0lane simply is or isnt you know, its not like planes either do or dont come u on radar, they have a thing called radar cross section that can be big or small, planes desogned to be stealthY (notice the y, capitalized for effect) have drastically reduced radar cross sections and are thus MORE DIFFICULT (notice how the word impossible is absent) to detect, the t-50 isnt f-22 level low observable, but its a hell of a step up from the mig-29/su-27
>>
nice 4.5 gen plane. Sad that it will never get orders.
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>>36086185
Even by Russian admittance at best it's on par with Eurocanards and late-model F-16s. Nobody considers those "stealth" in any way, shape, or form.
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>>36086255

10 to be delivered in 2019.
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>>36086271
Do you have evidence of this?
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>>36086054
> Not STEALTH
You really do have to hand it to the Amerifats.
Compete by comparing simple systems,
Speed, turn, climb, SC, hard points, fuel consum/carry, Guns.
Simple top card type things.
Then step it up to hard mode.
Radar, RCS, FnF.

The Americans are doing pretty well in a lot of fields, certainly beating the Russians in most. Russia starts up its decaying RnD, and starts catching up to Ameribros, in some cases, even surpassing them.
What do the Amerifats do? Start working harder, smarter, learning from their mistakes and observing the Russian improvments? capitalize on their own genius of the past?

NOPE. Set a new goal. A goal that can't be proven, or measured. Or tested in anyway. Come up with a BS term that they spoon feed the morons about "NEW Tenth gen STEALTH fighter, can shoot down enemy without ever leaving the hanger"
Bank roll Lockheed martin, NOT Boeing, not EUC, not any of the well established super companies that do this shit on the daily. lock-fucking-bribe-your-government-produce-shit-martin.
Spend more money than God building a plane that is fucking shit tier. That is a coffin in the sky. That will cost Trillions more in "refitting" it to try to make it work, before finally admitting its a pile of shit, like the F22(also lockheed) never seeing combat, and then replace it with something shit tier, because no one wants to spend crap tons more money on jets because the last one was a fucking national disaster that if it does ever see combat buts pilots lives at risk.

> Stealth.
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>>36086375
See
>>36085611
The 0.1m RCS hasn't changed from their previous claims. No link because I'm tired of repeating myself on the subject and CBA to grab one. Find it yourself.
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>>36086395
>implying that vatniks arent doing this
>implying that vatniks arent constantly doing this
>implying that vatniks arent constantly doing this way worse
Anon, i...
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>>36086395
>And here we see the butthurt Vatnik try to redefine "advances" and "comparable performance capabilities" because he hates that all his country's planes are good for is air shows
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>>36086395
> Stealth.
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>>36086318
57 this year alone.
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>>36086409
0.1 is a fuckload less than the 1.2 of the f 16c and wayyy less than the 10 square meters the b1b gets

Basically what the fuck are you talking about

Oh look, its a source!
https://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/stealth-aircraft-rcs.htm
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>>36086318
10? Basically a tech demonstrator then.

Maybe Russia will develop another plane in the future from what they learn from this jet. Possibly even a 5th gen fighter.
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>>36086514

Whateva Man
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>>36086533
0.1 is fucking huge.
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>>36085654
I'm scared anon, what the hell did I just watch?
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>>36086602
Pure, distilled Russia.
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>>36086409
There is no standard definition of RCS (point value or avg, and averaged over what angles, at what frequency or frequency range, etc.) and it was blantantly obvious from the Russian source that when they talked about F-22 being around 0.1-0.05 and compared that to their planes 0.1 (or whatever the actual numbers where, I can't remember) that they are not using the same way to calculate/measure RCS than the few burgers who have slipped few words about what the RCS of US planes might be did. It's just dishonest cherry picking to take 0.1 from the Russian source disconnecting it from the context it was said and compare that to word of some fighter jockey who was just boasting about the size of his 0.000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000001m2 marbles trying to impress some congressman
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>>36086634
>Trying to redefine the conversation by claiming RCS values are meaningless
Just because the Russians SAY the F-22 is that high doesn't mean it is. Admissions (Su-57) and baseless speculation (F-22) don't belong in the same room.
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>>36084186
RCS as tiny as the image. Glorious comrade.
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>>36086602
a talented man's great artistic project showing how rotten russia is
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MKcmtFP19YM
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>>36084186
What's different with the new engine?
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>>36086668
If one number for example is the average over the whole front sector at C to Ku band and the other is just the lowest point value at mid X-band at the best case angle then comparing those two numbers for any other reason than shit flinging is completelly meaningless.
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>>36086838
Everything.
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>>36086869
I'd like actual info lad, i can't seem to find much on it online
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>>36086838

+ Power
+working hours
>simpler
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>>36086859
>Implying the US has any reason to do anything but understate performance
>Implying that isn't historically the constant

>Implying Russia has ever been honest about their equipment in anyway and hasn't constantly bragged, overstated, and blatantly lied about how overpowering it is

Stop trying to muddy the waters.
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>>36086922
>Implying Russia has ever been honest about their equipment in anyway and hasn't constantly bragged, overstated, and blatantly lied about how overpowering it is
they never did tho
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>>36086958
>they never did tho
THEY ALWAYS DO. Every single piece of equipment is a West-smashing piece of super equipment that will wreck US gear according to state media and Vatniks, that on deeper examination is either shoddily built, doesn't do what is claimed, is a deathtrap, they can't afford to build more than a handful, or is all of the above.

Vatniks are almost worst than /pol/.
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>>36086922
>lack of reading comprehension
Also do remeber in what context those marble numbers were tossed: Pentagon was trying to sweet talk more money for F22, that is the only time someone who might have some clue about the true RCS of that plane has opened their mouth about it. It wasn't bragging to impress others, it was them trying to convince your own gov not to cancel the program
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>>36086995
Implying that this couldn't be said about the US. I've never even seen anyone praising Russian hardware, it's always been "oh rusty old garbage that doesn't work even if it demonstrably does". Are you guys projecting?
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>>36087002
Yeah, no. Those "marble" numbers are based on calibration solids that generate that size image on radar. If anything they're giving numbers a couple orders of magnitude larger than what it actually is to throw off your opinions. It's nothing to do with "reading comprehension" and everything to do with how you're trying to use malevolently constructed arguments to try to make actual Stealth aircraft seem like a fakeout because your country's equipment doesn't match up.

I love though how you Vatniks keep trying to twist this into "your government lies to you about the equipment you have the same way ours does!"
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>>36087047
It's always great getting the Web Brigades riled up about how their shit isn't as good as what their bosses in the Kremlin tell them to say it is.
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>>36084679
The T50 is South Korean. We’re duscussing the SU57.
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>>36087066
Wasn't the marble^2 RCS of the F-22 frontal only? And the 0,1 m^2 of the Su-57 was an average RCS
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>>36087081
I've heard of these Kremlin trolls but I've never seen them. Are they the ones that hacked the 2016 presidential election?
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>>36087047
>I've never even seen anyone praising Russian hardware
So since how many minutes are on /k/? I got my fair share in hating americans and their big mouth on this board, but you and your likes with your baseless claims and constant switching and twisting of reality always manages it to bring it into perspective. I bet you dont even get how fucked up you are, if you surpass the amerifats with their special kind of retardness.
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>>36087096
Nobody will ever have the exact details publicly for at least 50 years after they retire, but there's no reason not to believe the F-22/35 have an RCS similar to that of the B-2. We invented it (inb4 that Russian paper on the base principles they did nothing with), we've been building operational planes with it for 34 years now, and we test it against both our own anti-air systems and the Russian ones we buy from people who buy IADS from Russia.
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>>36087134
>ridiculing response and mentioning of the term hacking, while hardly ever anyone even mentions it here, so it looks like you have a point
everytime
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>>36086054
>Basically still using Su-35 sensors
only the early prototype, those one doesn't have RADAR btw
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>>36086709
>comedian
>a talented man's great artistic project

yeah, late night show is a good news source too
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>>36087134
>>36087186
Exactly. There was a massive propaganda and kompromat campaign, there was hacking of the parties to get Kompromat to leak to influence the election, and there was illicit contact between members of Trump's campaign in Russian, but nobody claims they hacked the election itself except, like that twat, to simplify all of it into the one thing that didn't happen.
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>>36087191
Serious question: Would Russians and their friends allow anything like this to be used by americans or would they make endless threads about it? Let me guess, it doesnt matter, right? Well, actually it matters a lot, since we can see your type only popping up when it is in defense of Russia. Any other nation? *Poof* Total silence.
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>>36087180
again, missing the point
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>>36087233
what are you whimpering on about you underage retard?
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>>36087215
>Art isn't an important reflection of reality
>OUR COUNTRY ISN'T SHIT YO
>NO FUTURE, NO RICH
It's a fantastic juxtaposition of the despair and alcoholic fugue the Russian people are constantly in with the jingoistic nationalism they project outwards.
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>>36087265
Evading answer counter :+1
Yes or no?
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>>36087249
It's a shitty, poorly developed point. More of a smear, really.
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>>36087281
>Evading answer counter :+1
early PAK FA prototype don't have RADAR and new avionic

do you even read my post, retard
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>>36087291
Evading answer counter :+2
The question was:
>Serious question: Would Russians and their friends allow anything like this to be used by americans or would they make endless threads about it?
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>>36087278
>Art isn't an important reflection of reality
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DHLRj1LaPiQ

yeah, like the prediction that Trump can't win 2016 right
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>>36087318
how is that related to aircraft engine and avionic?

why are you derailing this thread?
>>
And here we see the typical vatnik, trying to dodge a simple question, by pretending not to understand it and trying to derail.
>>36087265
>>36087291
>>
>>36087319
>Deerrrrrrrpppppppp
Still trying that angle? Can't actually counter that your country has a shit economy, is overdependent on selling natural resources externally, it's military is a greater burden to itself than the US's with only a tenth of the budget, that you're still trying to maintain Soviet era posture without the slave states to draw from, that you have serious alcohol, drug, and HIV problems, and/or that you're run by a Kleptocracy with a dictator who pretends at democracy?
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>>36087346
Your question doesn't really make any sense. Not that guy. He just told you that your claim is wrong, and that Su-35 avionics were used by prototypes.
No need to act like a schizophrenic over it. Prove that he's wrong, calling people names doesn't really help your cause.
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>>36087337
Evading answer counter :+3
The question was:
>Serious question: Would Russians and their friends allow anything like this to be used by americans or would they make endless threads about it?

>how is that related to aircraft engine and avionic?
It is a question about your honesty and the side you try to defend. Truth is you would shit over this all day if americans had done this. And the endless threads about random minor american thing happening are pretty good proof for your hypocrisy.
>why are you derailing this thread?
Why cant you answer a simple question? Because it immidetalty would show you are a biased hypocrite, that would not even stood up to his own standards.
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>>36087387
But even if he is a biased hypocrite, you (or someone else) made a claim, he disputed that claim, and you proceeded to sperg out about irrelevant shit (irrelevant to this thread).
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>>36087373
>He just told you that your claim is wrong
Never made that claim, am another guy.
>and that Su-35 avionics were used by prototypes.
And? You think vatniks like him would not make 10 threads about it?
>No need to act like a schizophrenic over it.
Calling out shitheads for that they are is far from that, but actually you should get the irony from that, specially with the next part of yours:
>Prove that he's wrong, calling people names doesn't really help your cause.
It is not about him being wrong, it is about him, doing way worse the second the tables have turned.

Impressive how you even felt the need to hop to the defense of that idiot. Seriously, what would anyones motivation be to that?
>Would you look at that, one of the vatniks is getting attacked for the shit they constantly pull.
>My oh my, better attack the other one.
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>>36087372
>>36087429
Like a clockwork:
>vatnik sperglord gets pushed into a corner
>random "neutral" logic poster appears to defend the vatnik for whatever reason
This is far from happening to be a conicident by now.
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>>36087446
>>36087464
I don't even want to read your posts. Go see a fucking shrink.
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>>36087387
>It is a question about your honesty and the side you try to defend.
i am defending no one

i try to tell you that the early PAK FA don't have RADAR and new avionic

you can read about that on the Air&Cosmos article written by Antony Angrand «Du PAK FA au Su-57»,

>Truth is you would shit over this all day if americans had done this. And the endless threads about random minor american thing happening are pretty good proof for your hypocrisy
you are just projecting

>>36087446
>Never made that claim, am another guy.
so you admitted that you are trolling
>>
>to be coincident
Ah, a non-native English speaker.
Given his obsession with Russians, some butthurt belter.
I wish we had flags here, so I could filter you fucks (and leafs too).
But yeah, as I said, see a shrink.
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>>36087162
Not just on /k/, I've never seen anyone praise russian kit on the internet
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>>36087373
>No need to act like a schizophrenic over it.
>>36087486
>I don't even want to read your posts. Go see a fucking shrink.
It is the random "neutral" logic poster at it in defense of the vatniks again. Or is that the script you guys get in Olgino?

>>36087493
No one is trolling, faggot. And you are obviously doing the standard vatnik dance here, so get lost.
Not him before you get all riled up again, about people trolling.
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>>36087529
Just look at YT comments my dude.
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>>36087541
>No one is trolling
but there is one. you are
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>>36087509
>attacking grammar
>butthurt belter
>shrink
Is it projection, Vlad? Or you doing it, because you always get similar responses, when you defend the motherland on the internet.
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>>36087227
Would the Russians really do such a rude thing? I'm beginning to get the feeling that these Russians are good for nothing, always hacking and never telling the truth
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>>36087561
>NO! YOU!
Pretty rich coming from an obvious russian poster to dump to even answer a single question.
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>>36087549
If anything that's where people like to piss all over Russian kit, and if they don't they get immediately shut down
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>>36087566
Yeah. Just tell me which irrelevant pseudo-Russian shithole you're from so I can laugh at you?
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>>36087561
Evading answer counter :+7
Vatniks are always so predictable.
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>>36087083
You fucking tard the T- designation in Russia means it’s a prototype.
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>>36087595
>vatnik spergs out
>gets shit for it
>noble neutral poster throws himself in front of the vatnik
>starts attacking the other person and try to derail thread on the nation of the poster
We should have a bullshit bingo for stuff like this by now.
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>>36086838
They bring Russia up to late cold war american standards.
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>>36087585
>>36087606
>Never made that claim, am another guy.
>but you have to answer this unrelated question or you a Russian poster
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>>36087625
Evading answers, are we?
>>
>>36087595
>>36087429
>>36087373
Impressive, you bash into a discussion, attack the far lesser evil for questionable motives, whine about derailing and insults, then go and do it yourself.

kys
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>>36087578
>Would the Russians really do such a rude thing?
Manipulate elections just like they've been doing in Europe to get someone friendly (and likely in their pocket) in power? What exactly is in place that they wouldn't want to?
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>>36087674
>kys
don't cut yourself on that edge
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>>36087655
You are not allowed to say something, i am still 6 evaded answers behind the other guy and you dont mind him doing it.
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>>36087674
You are aware there's poster counter here?
And it didn't change. What medications are you on? I suggest cyanide.
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>>36087654
>unrelated question
You mean like people like you always saying one thing in one thread and then do the exact opposite in another? Totaly unrelated of course, how dare you get shown the door for your obvious bad pattern behaviour.

>>36087655
You are quite deliberate with the shitposting yourself, while complaining about much less far more.
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>>36087705
>implying anyone would enter this shitshow at this point
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>>36087699
Damn, I didn't know it was that bad. When do we get to nuke Russia? I just want to genocide their people now.
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>>36087699
>propaganda is ''manipulating elections''
No it's not. Manipulating elections would be rigging the process, assassinating candidates, stuff like that.
And they aren't doing anything Americans and others haven't been doing for decades.
Or Soviets for that matter. It's just that Russian propaganda is more effective, they kinda nailed it.
Russians are acting like every great power ever. Western neolib/neocon drones are crying because they're getting a taste of their own medicine. Russians are exploiting their total detachment from their own population, and their catastrophic mistakes. It's hard to counter this, so instead of changing their policies that are giving ammo to Russians, they double-down on crying about Russia, creating an opposite effect.
>in their pocket
To be honest, given where West is heading, in general, I'm not sure if Russian puppets would do a worse job.
>>
>>36087744
>No it's not. Manipulating elections would be rigging the process, assassinating candidates, stuff like that.
That's just semantics.
>>
>>36087744
>Hacking email servers and infiltrating social media to intentionally spread disinfo in order to get the result you want
That's exactly what manipulating it is. You're trying to pretend that the only way is by changing the votes.
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>>36087760
>spreading disinfo on social media
IT WAS HERRRRR TURRRRRNNNNN
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>>36087783
And the connections between those two is exactly what?
>>
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>>36087783
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>>36087722
>>You mean like people like you always saying one thing in one thread and then do the exact opposite in another? Totaly unrelated of course, how dare you get shown the door for your obvious bad pattern behaviour.
no, you are projecting
>>
>>36087825
see>>36087585
>>
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>>36084186
N O I C E
>>36084228
Bitch, please.
>>
>>36085509
Remind me, how many years after X-35's first flight did F-35 receive F135 engine?
>>
>>36087759
>>36087760
I disagree, except perhaps the e-mail part.
And why are you presenting that as something extraordinary?
Hillary got TENS of millions in donations from foreign powers and agents. She had the massive backing of the media.
Why aren't you crying about that? I didn't see media point out to that much during the election.
As I said, Russians are doing what everyone is doing, it's just that they're effective at it, and that makes neocons and neolibs ultra-butthurt. Only they can manipulate elections, goddammit!

And I don't believe Trump is a ''Russian agent'', at least not directly. It would be too much.
But here's the beauty of it, he's doing their bidding whatever he does (unless he launches nukes).
There's several angles here:
1. He's clearly incompetent, does and says stupid shit, and not an answer to problems. Perhaps future change won't be sought by political means, which just means further destabilization.
2. Being so incompetent, he's little threat to Russia. Even if he's forced into acting against them, Putin will outplay him like a child.
3. He divided America into two radical camps. This division will only grow. Trump is clearly an ass, but removing him will cause shitstorm of epic proportions.
4. Russians are playing hard on these divisions. I wouldn't be surprised if they're funding both sides, pushing extremists. More destabilization.

It's fucking beautiful. They perfected their art of ''active measures''. HE. FUCKING. WON.
Too bad his economic policies are kinda meh. But this man is God of geopolitics. Even Kissinger is paying his respects.
>>
>>36087783
>Lost popular vote by 3 million
>Won Electoral by ~78,000
>Thinks Russian manipulation didn't squeeze that turd into the White House

Even though Hillary wasn't the best candidate, she is both far more capable and far less destruction than Trump, who can't even get around to the basic duty of fully staffing the Executive. And of those he does, are all cronies and destructionists.
>>
>>36087902
>3. He divided America into two radical camps. This division will only grow. Trump is clearly an ass, but removing him will cause shitstorm of epic proportions.
Part of the issue is Pence: His politics are about as horrific as Trump's, but he's an experienced and competent statesman. He'd actually get shit done.
>>
>>36087902
Oh, and I forgot, he literally made a huge part of American population HATE their own Congress, hate CIA, FBI and all that. Which just makes America and West more and more vulnerable.
Even when they try (with half-assed measures) to stop Russian propaganda rape train, they inevitably cause more and more disgruntled people.
>>36087916
If it makes you feel any better, Hillary wouldn't have done shit against Putin. She's also incompetent.
You can't fight Putin. Only way to fight his influence is to deal with topics which cause resentment with the establishment.
Only way communist subversion was fought was by providing alternative, clearly superior path.
Hillary would just preserve status quo. And status quo is slow death.
So yeah, it's same shit, Hillary or Trump. Trump is just a more preferred option to Putin because he's an orange buffoon and used to say nice things about Russia and Putin.
>>
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>>36087916
KEK
How does it feel to support gungrabbing on /k/?
>>
>>36087970
>Implying it could happen with Congress as it is
>Implying you didn't bitch and moan and panic buy the entire 8 years Obama was in office without a single federal law coming close to passing
>>
>>36087902
>Why aren't you crying about that?
What the hell does that have to do with the topic? It is about Russia meddling with the US election. What you mentioned doesnt make that go away.
>>
>>36087949
No, no, no.
As I told you in following post, you don't understand what caused Trump.
What caused Trump, and opened up West to Putin's shenanigans, is the march of neoliberal and neoconservative (same shit, different color) policies. That world is clearly experiencing cracks. And Putin exploits those cracks. Doesn't mean they don't exist. They weren't created by Putin.
So only way to fight Putin is to clean up the mess. By mess I mean cultural, social, demographic and partially economic mess.

I like reading Schindler's blog, he's a fanatic anti-Putinist, but he's mostly right about many things. Problem is, he is either afraid to say it openly, or is unaware of why is Putin so powerful.
Putin is powerful for the same reason America and West were powerful in the Cold War. Many Western citizens see him as an alternative, better path. Reality of the situation here doesn't really matter.
>>
>>36088030
>So only way to fight Putin is to clean up the mess.
I am begining to see a pattern developing here: It is about everything but Putin and russian involvement, we must talk about everything else instead.
That shilly smell.
>>
>>36088022
But why are you upset about just Russian influence, and not Saudi, Israeli, and so on?
I wasn't joking when I said it, given the actions of Western politicians, I doubt even Russian puppets would do worse.
America is fucking 62% white now, and that number is declining. This wouldn't be a huge problem, if there wasn't so much racial tension. That tension will only grow, as white percentage goes down.
On top of racial tension, changing demographics, you also have massive cultural and social issues across all lines.
You can't make your society Putin-proof until you deal with that. Russian propaganda with populist edge and the scale of it will always triumph in such conditions.
I mean, short of nuking Russia.
''Containment'' and sanctions and that shit won't work.
This struggle literally looks like late-stage USSR fighting West, except ideologies and power-balance is kinda different, and roles are switched.
>>
>>36088090
Are you retarded? I mean, if it isn't clear from my posts, I'm quite literally describing Putin's involvement, and acknowledging it.
>>
>>36088099
Who says i am not? Again that doesnt make what Russia does go away or was the topic. Also this >>36088090
>>
>>36088099
>But why are you upset about just Russian influence, and not Saudi, Israeli, and so on?
Because Russian influence was uniquely insidious.
>>
>>36088122
And I told you there's no way to make Russia go away. They are winning this war, mostly because their opponents are cannibalizing themselves.
>>
>>36088129
Not really. It was actually quite brash.
>>
>>36085168
You forget the Jewish commissars bled that country dry for 70 years THEN sold it off to themselves for pennies.
>>
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>>36085581
>Implying it isn't
>>36085611
Daily reminder that in reality it has RCS comparable to F-22A.
>>36085653
No, it is not, imbecile.
>>36086054
>Implying it's anything but a Gen 4.5++++
It is, since everything you just said is bullshit.
>>36086409
>The 0.1m RCS hasn't changed from their previous claims
Too bad neither have any actual data on any other 5th gen aircraft's RCS appeared.
>>36086505
>It's a picture, therefore it's true
>>36086514
Of which how many are actually combat capable?
>>36086533
>globalsecurity.org
>a source
It's about as much of a source as wikipedia.
>>36086668
>claiming RCS values are meaningless
They are meaningless if there's none availible.
>>36086922
>Implying the US has any reason to do anything but overstate performance
>Implying that isn't historically the constant
>Implying you're not spewing out rancis McCarthyist propaganda
>>36087180
>Nobody will ever have the exact details
Then stop shitposting.
>>36087233
>Serious question: Would Russians and their friends allow anything like this
Like what? What are you referring to here exactly? The imbecilic and completely false claim made by lying piece of shit Jane's that T-50 shares radar and engines with Su-35?
>>
>>36088107
>>36088099
Your posts are only stating one thing: Putin did it, but dont take direct actions against what he is doing, instead you have to take care and talk about those 100 things instead.
If this aint a typical shill apologetic answer, i dont know what. Dont say you are a shill, maybe just picked it up since it made sense for you, but the whole drive behind what you do is rather only going in that direction and the true intentions of those giving you this predigested route are leading the way.
>>
>USAF has over 230 various F-35 models built so far.
>China has at least 20+ J-20s in service
>Russia is putting in orders for Su-57s that may be delivered in 2019?

Can anyone deny that Russia is 3rd world tier?
>>
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>>36088169
>Vatnik shows up late to reply with script text to everyone
Don't you want to do one to one so you'd get 360 Rubles instead of just 30?
>>
>>36088183
>don't take direct actions
I did not say that. I said you can't take any direct actions, unless you wanna nuke Russia.
As I said, he's winning, and you're losing.
Yeah, you, because you're clearly neocon/neolib, or a butthurt belter. Sorry m8.
>>
>>36088198
>Fatnik is so broken he doesn't even try anymore
>>
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>>36088169
>pls take my country seriously
>>
>>36088214
More like everybody knows you by now and doesn't bother wasting their time.
>>
>>36088169
>Daily reminder that in reality it has RCS comparable to F-22A.
>Too bad neither have any actual data on any other 5th gen aircraft's RCS appeared.

So we the data we don't have tells us it has the RCS of an F-22A?
>>
>>36088203
>I said you can't take any direct actions, unless you wanna nuke Russia.
And you got this from where? This is exactly what i am talking about. Seriously, where did you get this idea from? I have read this so many times already in this case, but it makes no sense whatever. Why shouldnt there be something in the middle? Raising awareness to such threats, keeping presentable tracks to exposed stuff, working with social media companies, banning firms involved in it, making it harder for nameless new firms to do it again, infiltrating russian propaganda apperatus to expose more of their doing,...
It goes on and on. Really ask yourself where you got this
>it either doing nothing or nukes
response. Because i really doubt someone would come to such a conclusion so easily unless it has been infused.
>>
>>36088214
>Vatnik is an actual descriptive term used inside Russian for nationalists
>Fatnik is a cheap reactionary term in response to being identified and called out completely bereft of creativity or relevance to the target needed to make it sting
Using "fatnik" just proves you're a Russian professional troll.
>>
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>>36088216
>>36088231
>Fatniks can't handle it anymore
>>36088233
When I say comparable I refer to the estimates in actual numbers made by actual scientists and aircraft engineers. When fatniks say 0.0000000001m2 bullshit, they refer to a rancid press release that was using designated golf ball units to drain more money for the program or whatever.
>>
>>36088300
>When I say comparable I refer to the estimates in actual numbers made by actual scientists and aircraft engineers. When fatniks say 0.0000000001m2 bullshit, they refer to a rancid press release that was using designated golf ball units to drain more money for the program or whatever.
Nice script read.
>>
>>36088233
There are claims of Suchoi officials. American's too denial to listen them, you know "muh RT propaganda". They prefer meme about "golf ball size RCS" that is based on globalsecurity article, which is based on some guy's interview, which transcription can not be found and origins are lost. So, basically, based on nothing.

>>36088297
>Russian professional troll.
lol.
>>
>>36088300
Hey armatard I see you sperging out about balls a ton so here's a quick quiz:
What kind of metal shape used for calibrating radars and now for testing imaging radars was launched into space back in the early 60s?
>>
>>36088231
This

>>36088233
Ignore him, he is a retard, he will nitpick on everything he misinterpret about what you say, while only answering vaguely so he later can say, he didnt mean it that way and you are retarded for not understanding it correctly. If you want more info on him, look up a 4chan archive of /k/ and search for armatard.
>>
>>36088291
I already explained that in my posts.
Underlying problems aren't solved, people just see elites trying to strangle alternative, and Putin's influence grows.
Some "truth squads" won't work, nor did they work that great even against communist active measures. Russia isn't communist USSR. And Russian intelligence services improved their trade.
Furthermore, like every good propaganda, their propaganda is at least partly based on truth. There are massive problems with current state of West.
Focusing on Russia is just focusing on whistleblower, in a way. It won't solve anything. They are winning either way.
>>
>>36088300
>motorola
Heard they banned them from elevators in east ukraine, because they blew up.
>>
>>36088314
It's impressive that they claim to know the actual RCS of the F-22 by looking at pictures of it while actual field experience against superior planes to Sukhoi's (F-15Cs) is that an F-22 is functionally invisible.
>>
>>36088341
This is such a non answer. We cant take care of this problem because we have to do that other thing first. You could say this about everything. My god, i am saying such stuff when i dont want to do anoying stuff around the house. It is an exuse and it is showing.
>>
Not to mention your solutions (let's just ban shit) are against free speech and what not.
As I said, base problems remain that are killing the West. Social, cultural, demographic and economic. Putin is just exploiting them, he didn't cause them. I mean sure, you can fight him, but it will only accelerate his victory.
If you still don't get my point: people who cry about Russia, are usually people who want to open borders, make kids learn that homosexuality is normal and awesome, that Islam is religion of peace, and that Germany got 1 million nuclear physicists last few years.
Average Joe, tired of all this shit, but still silent, sees this, and starts thinking, "wow, that Putin sure is awesome".
>>
>>36088314
>Sukhoi knows the F-22s RCS and it's totally the same as the PAK-FA and anyone who disagrees is a shill.
>>
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I swear these threads are practically scripted at this point. For both sides.
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>>36088390
No, I'm outlining you the reality of the situation.
"House is on fire" I say, but you want to kill cockroaches under the sink. Russia is the least of your problems.
And only way to fight them is to solve the problems I mentioned. But your elites want to have their cake and eat it too. Too bad.
>>
>>36088420
>"House is on fire" I say, as my country burns around me

Lel, the irony.
>>
>>36088395
Good luck finishing fixing the house when you keep ignoring the guy who actually breaks everything. You are so deep in the prorussian narritive you cant see it anymore. Would we see you go around and say wait we have to fix this and that instead before we can go after Hillary? Hell, no you wont and you know it.
>>
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>>36088297
>Fatnik is upset.
>>36088306
Nice damage control.
>>36088319
Hey amerishit, I see you like evading lockmart's bullshit claims about 0.0000000000000001m2 RCS being exposed.
>>
>>36088446
>Vatnik's still going
Gotta afford your lunch vodka, I see.
>>
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>>36088462
>Fatnik's still mad
Stay mad.
>>
>>36088446
>Hey amerishit, I see you like evading lockmart's bullshit claims about 0.0000000000000001m2 RCS being exposed.
A: Nice hyperbole, you're really convincing me.
B: I'm quizzing you on a fun fact, which considering your fixation on balls should be easy for you. I'm not saying anything about any aircraft.
>>
>>36088420
The reality is, that it can be done and it actually would help with other problems as well, Russias agenda is to get everyone fighting and not hearing to each other in the West, how you want to fix anyhting with that untouched? It is the basis for change.
>>
>>36088439
Not Russian, but Russia isn't burning. Wake up from your bubble anon. Problems they face and problems West faces are quite different.
>>36088445
Did Putin start the shit I'm talking about?
Maybe. But I doubt it.
Mass immigration, demographic change that follows, cultural and social decline, the stride of globalism, that's not Putin. Putin is just exploiting the aftermath.
>we can go after Hillary
I already told you it's irrelevant who won. Both would do a shit job.
>>
>>36088446
>being exposed.
By sukhoi, a unbiased and respectable source.
>>
>>36088480
>Nice hyperbole
It's no different from ordinary fatnik claims.
>I'm not saying anything about any aircraft.
Which means "evading".
>>
>>36088445
Did Putin make the west full of faggots, islamist refugees and marxists? If not, then you are looking at the wrong place for problems when they are right in front of your face
>>
>>36088515
>but Russia isn't burning
Lel
>wake up from your bubble
>>looks at HDI rates

Maybe your right, it's not burning. It's a pile of smoldering ashes.
>>
>>36088357
You do understand that for that purposes both countries keep entire research institutes, don't you? Gathering and analysis of data, industrial espionage, e.t.c. And yet, officials from Suchoi use words "estimate" and "approximately". In their materials you hardly find words like "superior", "absolute" and "innovative" that are trademarks of US propaganda. Also, you need to remember, that Su-57 is a commercial product for sale, so most things that those guys claim can be checked by potential clients. F-22 is not for sale, no one can check anything about it.
>>
>>36088492
No it wouldn't. These two issues are only connected in the sense Putin is exploiting them.
These issues would even be worse, if there was no competitors to the neoliberal (I'm not using "neoliberal" in economic, rather political sense) establishment.
>>
>>36088537
>did Russia make the west full of Marxists

Unequivocally yes. And for all your belly aching, they are a massive minority.
>>
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Fucking Quantum disabled my mass media downloader.
>>
>>36088525
By Russian Academy of Sciences, a source infinitely more unbiased than a lockmart press release using gold balls as units advertising the program to congress.
>>
>>36088539
F-35 IS for sale, and nobody is questioning its stealth. Yet, India did just that for the 57.

>>T...THEY DON'T COUNT

Sukhoi used such language because they know that's the most they could get away with.
>>
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>>36088530
>It's no different from ordinary fatnik claims.

>1991 + 26
>Basing your arguments on supposition
What a shame.

>I'm not saying anything about any aircraft.
Which means "evading".
You never asked me anything about aircraft. I'm here to laugh at your ignorance.
>>
>>36088554
But did Russia bring the hordes of brown people to the West, or was that the west's own doing? How about the disgusting decadence that the West is inflicting upon itself?
>>
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>>36088538
Yes have lower HDI, what about it? They are poorer. They are more corrupt. What does that have to do with this? Are you even following me?
They don't face the same problems.
>>
>>36088515
>Did Putin start the shit I'm talking about?
Actually Russia did a lot in creating the problems, they subverted and supported the bad kind of left in the west in the last century, whose aftermath we can still feel today and now they are doing the same thing with the right in the west. And exactly like leftist in the past, the alt right cheers them for doing so. Russia is big problem for the West.
>>
>>36088588
According to these two intellectuals, assasinating Putin would solve all the issues, and West "would work better".
I'm not sure if I'm just talking to naive people/butthurt belters, or some neolib shills who think diversity is power.
>>
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>>36088169
>yoba
>replies to half the thread
>fatnik
>unsourced claims and outright falsehoods
Yep, that's the armatard alright.
Bring out your bingo card boys, there are bingos to be had in this thread!
>>
>>36088571
Poo in loos only whine because Russia won't share technology with them seeing how poos can't even handle local Su-30 production properly.
>>36088587
>Basing your argument on designated golf ball unit figures used in a rancid lockmart press release
What a fatnik.
>I'm here to laugh at your ignorance.
Then how come you are only showing yours so far?
>>
>>36088570
>By Russian Academy of Sciences
>>36088539
>And yet, officials from Suchoi use words "estimate" and "approximately"

Hmmmm. Let's see them sources.
>>
>>36088630
>unsourced claims
Name them, fatnik.
>>
>>36088635
Good job ignoreing the main point.
>>
>>36088548
Why are you discussing with me? Should you not be busy to change society or something, so my opinion isnt there to begin with? Getting how illogical this is. Fixing a hole wont do shit, if you got someone who is constantly making new ones with the ones he created before.
>>
can't beat any of avro's creations, i dont give a fuck about engine type or avionics, all of avro's works are gods gift to mankind
>>
>>36088635
I'm not the one who's denigrating the use of spherical measurements of RCS when that's how it's done IRL.
>>
>>36088640
http://vivovoco.astronet.ru/VV/JOURNAL/VRAN/03_10/STELLS.HTM
>>
>>36088630
That should count as PROOFS, shouldnt it?
>>36088657
>>
>>36088666
Ok, satan
>>
>>36088588
>disgusting decadence
Oh buddy, this shit is great.

>YOU HAVE A GOOD QUALITY OF LIFE AND ARE RICH
>how DISGUSTING
Hahahahahahahahahahah, you russians are just quaint. I might order another whore from your shithole who is desperately trying to leave.
>>
>>36088169
>Of which how many are actually combat capable?
All of them?
>>
>>36088570
>Russian Academy of Sciences
A kreml propaganda outlet knowing more than the guys who made the plane? Good one.

>muh golf balls
Guess what shape radar calibration units have faggot.
>>
>>36088662
Sad job trying to evade lockmart's bullshit being exposed.
>>
>>36088600
You're totally oblivious to political history of New Left.
They had nothing to do with Soviets. They were anti-Soviet. Soviet communism and Marxists in West are two different worlds, at least after the WW2.
USSR wasn't Russia. Nor is Putin a communist.
See, that's the problem here. You're stuck in Cold War thinking.
America and it's Western sphere is the new USSR, they aim to export and enforce their ideology. Putin doesn't want that. Putin wants a return to great power politics of the past. Russia is not powerful enough to be a leader, so he aims to make it ''first among equals''.
Cold War was different. West was clearly superior, that's why fighting Soviets was possible.
But as I said, you can't fight Putin successfully now. Putin and Russian propaganda are providing a (Russian-biased, no doubt) outlet to frustrations that come from REAL PROBLEMS.
Removing Russians from the equation doesn't solve those problems, in fact as I said, it will probably make them even worse.
So your focus on Putin is fucking autistic.
Yes, they are meddling, and doing shit for their gain, but that's nothing compared to real issues that most of Western states face.
So only way to fight Russian influence you hate so much is to solve those issues.
I don't know how can I write this to make it more understandable. You're fighting a symptom, not the cause.
>>
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>>36088682
>GOOD QUALITY OF LIFE AND ARE RICH
is it the same as pic related?
>>
>>36088677
>Claims the opponend has made unsourced claims
>Refuses to name them
>PROOFS
Are you a schizo?
>>
>>36088657
>Name them
>Suck-57 has RCS comparable to the F-22
In reality it is not even on the same level as the euro triangles due to shitty air ducts.
>inb4 muh average
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>>36088571
>F-35 IS for sale, and nobody is questioning its stealth. Yet, India did just that for the 57.
No one is questioning its stealth because no one ever provide a number. IIRC, no official claims with numerals instead of adjectives were ever made about that question. Boeing, in other hands, gave something to think about that. Main argument against Su-57 is lack of meme-ducts, but Boeing claimed that their F-15SE has same stealth level as F-35. Without Meme-ducts. X-32 without meme-ducts was on same level as F-35 too. So, either meme-ducts are not the one and only way to hide engines from radar efficiently (and that means that Su-57 CAN be stealthy like F-22), or Boeing (trustful American company) lies

>>36088640
>Hmmmm. Let's see them sources.
Try to watch movie about PAK-FA by "Wings of Russia" and then try to watch some American movie about F-22 or F-35. You will be surprised by differences in approach.
>>
>>36088685
Prove it.
>>36088686
No, fatnik, an actual scientific community's estimation is worth infinitely more than lockmart using golf balls instead of units while advertising their product.
>Guess what shape radar calibration units have
Guess what aircraft RCS diagram looks like, amerifag.
>>
>>36088727
I just posted a source to this claim, amerishit.
>>
>>36088727
It's alright man, let it flow. Just get it out of your system. That's better. Are you feeling good?
>>
>>36088672
That source says zero about the Su-57 and does not make anything specifically declarative about the F-22 or the F-35.
>>
>>36088682
But see how warped your mind is?
You can't see beyond money and wealth, which is transient. Many polities in past were wealthy, yet they collapsed.
Wealth is a remnant of previous age.
Future of West, if these problems aren't tackled, is one of strife and decline.
He isn't referring to that.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bdCXxUxI-WE
Watch this. This is one example. This is your culture. These are your cities.
Are you sure Putin is your main problem?
Are you sure Putin is ''making things worse''?
I mean, I can't help you if you insist on being deluded.
Even if you aren't from West, if you're butthurt belter, future for West doesn't bode well for you either. You tied yourself to a rotting corpse.
>>
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>>36088709
It's fun because despite all the faggots in the west, russia has rampant HIV epidemics due to drugs and cultural love for "non-homo" gay sex.
>>
>>36088709
>looks at HDI
Looks like it, ignoreing the extreme minority of that meme.
>>
>>36088780
>you ONLY care about money
Kek, way to miss the point completely.
>butthurt belt
Poor as fuck Russian absolutely confirmed.
>>
>>36088706
I was talking about the underminded peace movement in the US, the SJWs, leftist terrorists, universities in the west, etc. All those were targeted by Russia and they created a lot of problems you are complaining about TODAY. And then sou say in all seriousness we should ignore them, when they do the same attack from another angle? There will always be problems with your country, so dont act like you could solve them all while someone is busy creating more and more.
>You're fighting a symptom, not the cause.
A lot of problems in the West are a direct following of Russias involvement. They are the cause for it. They are causing them right NOW. They must be dealt with as well.
>>
>>36088744
>scientific community
>russia
loving every laugh

>RCS diagram
gives data that can be expressed as spherical RCS calibration units. Sorry fag.
>>
>>36088783
Based on the west's current neomarxist culture shouldn't they be striving towards a drug/HIV epidemic? I mean it is what they promote as brave and normal in the media.
>>
>>36088778
OMG, it is those "Mig-21 is stealthier that all 5th gen" source. Don't take it too serious.
>>
>>36088754
>y-you butthurt!!!

Yep, that's another box checked :^)
>>36088630
>>
>>36088783
Russia has HIV epidemic due to collapse of system in 90's, and drug abuse.
Besides, it's not like America isn't facing opoid epidemic m8. See for yourself.
But problem here is, you refuse to accept that those issues are issues of past in Russia, they moved forward, and they don't face the same (existential) issues West faces.
So pointing out HIV, HDI, GDP and other shit is irrelevant. You're missing the point.
All that wealth and success didn't originate from policies which are followed today.
>>
>>36088823
You know what, that's a good point.

For all it's ANTI-DEGENERACY, why does Russia have Africa tier HIV rates? Makes me fucking think.
>>
>>36088753
You posted a group of vatniks wildly erroneous guess at the RCS of the F-22.
In reality, russia barely catches up to current Euro fighters.
>>
>>36088706
>Removing Russians from the equation doesn't solve those problems, in fact as I said, it will probably make them even worse.
>So your focus on Putin is fucking autistic.
So is your blind spot for Russia. It is pretty obvious you are biased and dont see clearly in the matter. If you would have agreed they should be dealt with, this would have been over a long time. Russia is truely the didndu nuffin of countries.
>>
>>36088832
>Russia has HIV epidemic due to collapse of system in 90's

But they are not degenerate fucks like those filthy fucking westerners. Surely the average Joe's that make up Russia were not ass fucking each other?
>>
>>36088863
Average Joe - maybe no. Sadly, to 2050 there will be more average Jamals and Joses, than average Joes.
>>
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>>36088832
>those issues are issues of past in Russia
Not even slightly. The HIV rates in russia are still sky high and drug abuse makes the US pale in comparison.
>>
>>36088843
For all of the west's promotion of disease and perversion, they are the ones that have truly failed if it is their only goal to degenerate society when it is easier. Maybe there is a rebellious Russian element to your society that doesn't want to allow you to fall into eternal darkness? Maybe it's the part of your society that makes you frustrated at Russia. "Why can't we have more HIV like Russia does? I want to be progressiiiiveeeeeee!!!"
>>
>>36088880
Ahhh yes, deflect from the fact that Russia, based on HIV rates, is just about the most degenerate place around.
>>
>>36088897
>namefag
>wannabe vatnik
Off yourself.
>>
>>36088905
Maybe Russia is degenerate as fuck, as is logical with this data set
>>
>>36088807
I'm not sure what's your point then. Because all you do is provide statistics like that, which are totally unrelated to this subject.
>Poor as fuck Russian
Nope, ''butthurt belt'' is just a cool term, that describes you people perfectly (if you're one).
>>36088811
>peace movement
Sure, but they didn't create that. They nudged it for contemporary purpose (war in Vietnam).
>leftist terrorists
Totally irrelevant in 21st century.
>universities
Nope, Soviets had nothing to do with that. As I said, Marxists in West are not the same as Soviet communists. Different evolution, and overwhelming majority were against USSR.
>created a lot of problems
Only in your deluded mind. Neoliberals and their neocon brothers are just an evolution of Western (mainly American) politics. Nothing to do with Soviets, or Russians.
>always be problems
Not all problems are same. What this guy mentions, those are just problems. HDI, HIV, drug abuse, and so on.
But overall cultural, social, demographic and probably economic catastrophe? Those are EXISTENTIAL problems.
>direct following of Russias involvement
Now you're just lying.
Russians are enforcing mass immigration?
Russians are behind teaching kids homosexuality is awesome and normal?
Russians are enforcing same-sex marriages as something normal?
Russians are teaching people multiculturalism is totally awesome, and that you need to be sensitive about people who want to behead you and your family?
Russians are teaching people being European makes you evil by default?
And all the other shit, I'm too arsed to list.
No, that's not Russians. That's your own politicians, academia, media. Same ones who are opposed to Russia. How do you deal with that fact?
Are Russians paying them to do both things? How deep does the rabbit hole go?
>They must be dealt with
As I told you before, there is no means to deal with Russia, without first dealing with this.
>>
>>36088927
Maybe Russians are broke as fuck. I mean, they are going against the grain, literally everyone hates Russia and refuses to cooperate with them.
>>
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>>36088918
>>
>>36088898
Those are the numbers for people below 25yo in Russia, right? :^)
>>
>>36088950
>Nope, ''butthurt belt'' is just a cool term
Nope, you are Russian, as this is a term used by vatniks.

Prove me wrong. Timestamp your outlet.
>>
>>36088927
>Maybe Russia is degenerate as fuck, as is logical with this data set
>Maybe
There is no maybe about russia being a hellhole of vice, sin and debauchery.
>>
>>36088959
Being broke as fuck does not give you aids anon. Homo ass fucking gives you the highest chance of aids transmission.

Makes. You. Think.

I am starting to belive Russian hate against western "degeneracy" is just projection.
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>>36088960
>>
>>36088983
And so is the west, except they are more open about it in the west
>>
>>36088863
Except I literally said in the first posts I made that Russia is far from ideal country.
>>36088898
>not even slightly
Point is, they are FIGHTING that.
You probably have no idea how catastrophic were 90's (and even 80's) in Russia.
But now they're moving forward. They recovered in many areas. Pointing out they still have issues is kinda missing the point.
But I'm not surprised. It's like talking to a fucking wall.
Believe whatever the fuck you want, I personally am not your enemy. You're only digging your own grave.
>>
>>36089003
Shit, I'll take a minor amount of open degeneracy than a country absolutely infected by it, but hidden.
>>
>>36088995
Russians also have a shit ton of drug abusers living in run down concrete cubes in the middle of Siberia. No doubt if they were in a slightly better situation they would eliminate the societal elements that cause this
>>
>>36089012
>Point is, they are FIGHTING that.
Not really.
>>
>>36089012
>Except I literally said in the first posts I made that Russia is far from ideal country.

Except you did state Russia has different problems. They don't. They have western problems amplified by Russia retardation. Do they have crazy ass Muslims? Yep, they fought a near constant war with them for decades until they decided that paying them off was better. Are they degenerate? You bet their aids ridden ass they are!
>B... BUT MUH IMMIGRATION! THEY DON'T IMPORT IMMIGRANTS!!!
That's because you can't pay a fucker to set down roots in Russia.
>>
>>36088970
Timestamp my what?
And what the fuck does that have to do with anything?
What does my nationality have to do with the topics I'm discussing?
''Butthurt belt'' is used widely on this website you idiot. Just go on /pol/ or /int/.
I'm not attacking you because you're from Poland, Estonia, or something like that. I'm attacking you because you're blind faggot who wants everything to burn just so you get at Russians, or at least that's how you sound like.
>>
>>36089049
>Timestamp my what?
Your electrical outlet. Get on it. Timestamp.
>what does that have to do with anything.
Just do it, Russian. You won't, because it proves where you reside, and it's something you can't really fake quickly.
>>
>>36089046
>western problems
Correct, but they are moving away from Western solutions. Communism is a Western ideology anon.
>That's because you can't pay a fucker to set down roots in Russia.
Sure, but that's irrelevant.
Why do you keep turning this into /int/-tier nationalist wankery, when I'm not even Russian?
I'm not talking from a nationalist perspective.
See, this is why ''butthurt belt'' is a good term. You have the mentality of an average vatnik you hate so much.
I keep talking about some shit, and you keep turning it into childish nationalist LOL U HAV AIDS HAHA rambling.
Whatever dude. But keep in mind, even if you aren't Westerner, you're tied with West, and you will feel their downfall.
You have been warned. Just like how I warned people that Trump is fake. Or that Russia won't collapse in 2015.
People really misuse this place, instead of discussing shit openly and anonymously, they turn it into extension of their personality, or LARP as nationalists or whatever. Give it a fucking rest.
>>
>>36089012
>Point is, they are FIGHTING that
Beating up gay people and jailing drug addicts does not constitute fighting HIV, it is more of building a potemkin facade around the maggot infested wound that is russia.
>>
>>36088950
>No
>No
>No
>No
Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. They did. And no amount of historical negationism can save you from the fact. We still feel the shockwaves and changes of that in our society.
>Only in your deluded mind.
This is your own problem, right there. You claim that problems must be taken care of first, while this is in reality not always possible or easy and at the same time you want to give a free pass to those exploiting it in the mean time, just because they are "only" exploiting it. Talking about delusion, talking about only fighting the symptons.
>Russians are
All those things are coming directly from those or the successor or surpasser of those who the soviets had supported and underminded. Have you ever heard about the soviets and "the march through the instutions"? This is exactly what you say is so illogical and is happening.
>As I told you before, there is no means to deal with Russia, without first dealing with this.
If i have someone breaking into my house right now, i dont start fixing some windows and installing an alarm, i shoot or arrest the fucker, without empty talk about how there cant be anything done about it and we need to fix society instead.
You even get how apologetic illogical your arguement is? It is Unitonic leftist tier.
>>
>>36089021
>Russians also have a shit ton of drug abusers living in run down concrete cubes in the middle of Siberia. No doubt if they were in a slightly better situation they would eliminate the societal elements that cause this

To do that they need to nuke DC. first. I remind you, that communists were on a brink of winning 1996 elections. US gave tonnes of cash to Yeltsin and his pals and they began the most massive and expensive media campaign in history of a country and won elections. After victory, Yeltsin and his team with close cooperation with Western "partners" decimated what was left from Soviet economy. You, guys, totally forgot that Yeltsin and Putin were allowed to be in power with one and one goal only - to keep communists down. You remove Putin - you resurrect communists. And unlike current government of RF, they sleep and see you all on fire for what you've done with USSR.
>>
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>>36089067
Here you go, you paranoid fuck. I'm not sure if Russians use same outlets lol.
>>
>>36089099
>>36088950
>''butthurt belt''
Always like that one:
Definition: Belt of countries that creates a border between the butthurt of Europe (Russia) and the rest of Europe.
>>
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Too much /pol/
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>>36089150
Hahahahahahahahahahah, well well well, what do we have here.
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>>36089105
I'm not saying they're highly successful in that regard.
>>36089113
>historical negationism
Said a man who doesn't know history.
Claiming that New Left is Soviet thing is absolutely fucking retarded, and I bet you're partly relying on the video of that idiot Bezmenov, who was an INFORMER. Not a KGB officer privy to their plans or anything. A fucking informer.
Read what Mitrokhin smuggled out, instead of being a deluded naive fuck.
>not always possible
Then the outcome is (a sort of) collapse.
>free pass
So what are you proposing to do?
How the fuck can you fight Putin, while also not provoking huge reaction from your population?
Policing the social media?
Banning media?
You think that can't work in any negative way?
Ridiculous.
My whole point here is, Putin is not the main problem.
You aren't so upset about Saudis funding radical mosques, might I add.
>>
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>>36089099
>Correct, but they are moving away from Western solutions.

Wait, you just said that Russia had different problems, now they have the same? Try to stay consistent with your points anon.
>>
>>36089219
That's not the same outlet anon. Are you just trolling now?
>>
>>36089150
Make a photo of your refrigerator, lol.
>>
>>36089220
>yak-141
The only jet that could make the Harrier look safe.
https://youtube.com/watch?v=kPOo1jOqZTA
>>
>>36089246
I didn't mean that Russia is having ALL Western problems, just that some of their problems are similar.
But Russia is dealing with those problems in a different way.
>>
>>36089298
>But Russia is dealing with those problems in a different way.
By denying of their existence and building churches.
>>
>>36089287
It's pretty empty, I'm ashamed :(
>>
>>36089263
>t...thats not an ungrounded type C

Oh God this damage control is just devine. I live for this shit.

Tell me more, Russian. Do you not have national pride? If it's irrelevant, tell your host nation with pride.
>>
>>36089298
>But Russia is dealing with those problems in a different way.
It seems they are absolutely failing while the west is not. Maybe letting the freaks march for the populace is smarter than trying to hide them and make it taboo?
>>
>>36089319
Religion is important for social cohesion.
>>36089324
Nope. It's type F outlet. Again, are you just trolling now?
You can clearly see my outlet is F, and different from Russian outlets.
>>
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>>36089263
It was a standard russian outlet he posted though.
>>
>>36089354
>>36089354
>Nope. It's type F outlet. Again, are you just trolling now?
>You can clearly see my outlet is F, and different from Russian outlets.

No, you just fell for my trap :^)
>>
>>36089356
>Plug F is known as CEE 7/4 and commonly called “Schuko plug”, which is the acronym of “Schutzkontakt”, a German word meaning “protection contact” or “safety contact”. The plug was designed in Germany shortly after the First World War. It goes back to a patent (DE 370538) granted in 1926 to Albert Büttner, a Bavarian manufacturer of electrical accessories.

>Type F is similar to C except that it is round and has the addition of two grounding clips on the side of the plug. The plug has two 4.8 mm round pins, measuring 19 mm in length on centres spaced 19 mm apart. The distance between either of the two earthing clips and the middle of the imaginary line connecting the centres of the two power pins is 16 mm.

For fucks sake.
>>
>>36089356
It was indeed. He dun goofed.

Somebody cap this thread.
>>
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>>36089321
Top kek. Russian troll, obviously.

>>36089354
>Religion is important for social cohesion.
Religion is in direct conflict with measures that prevent child pregnancies and HIV.
>>
>>36089380
>Type F is used, for instance, in Germany, Austria, the Netherlands, Sweden, Finland, Norway, Portugal, Spain and Eastern Europe. (Click here for a complete list of all countries that use type F)

Well, your trap was a shitty one. I'm from Balkans you fucking retard.
>>
>>36089237
>those metallic sparks in the exhaust
Fuck!
The lack of build quality in russian engines are real.
>>
>>36089419
>I'm from Balkans you fucking retard.
Suuuuuurrreee you are my vatty friend.
>>
>>
>>
>/k/ - Power Outlets
>>
>>36089428
>post a pic of outlet in the hope of curing anon's paranoia
>turns out it's an outlet used in almost entire fucking Europe
>anon is just more paranoid
Well, road to Hell is paved with good intentions.
I'm a Serb. But I have no idea what does my nationality have to do with anything.
As I said, I didn't call you out on your opinions because of your origin, I just said that even if you aren't Westerner, you're affected, so your ''l-let's just kill Russia first'' mentality is idiotic.
Bye now, take care.
>>
>>36089466
>two piece canopy
Come on now russia, at least make an show of attempt.
>>
>>36089502
>Serb
Well, you guys are known vatnikboos.
>>
>>36089228
>Said a man who doesn't know history.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_long_march_through_the_institutions
>The long march through the institutions...describe his strategy for establishing the conditions for revolution: subverting society by infiltrating institutions such as the professions.
How does that work for you not getting what is wrong with the media today and how it is totaly illogical.
>Claiming that New Left is Soviet thing is absolutely fucking retarded
What i literally said:
>All those things are coming directly from those or the successor or surpasser of those who the soviets had supported and underminded.
>successor or surpasser
Never said it is a soviet thing, it is the successor or surpasser of the soviet involvement. Stop leaving out vital parts so you think you can make my words look unreasonable. It is rather pathetic and doesnt shine a good light on you.
>My whole point here is, Putin is not the main problem.
And? So, he should never be taken care of? It doesnt help stopping the guy exploiting the cracks in your society? You know what? The cracks can be there alone doing almost nothing, but it takes someone to exploit those. Show that this doesnt stand, will also help with others thinking to exploit some other cracks. It is so simple, nothing to lose, so much to gain. Still you are totaly blind for that option and get all fuzzy for even talking about it. And the only thing you can come up with are parroting phrases you read somewhere else.
>You aren't so upset about Saudis funding radical mosques, might I add.
Is it the main topic right now? How would you know what my opinion is? Why are you desperately trying to open side topics? Losing ground and want to bail to another discussion? Want me to do open additional side topics as well? So the discussion is completely fucked?
>>
>>36089502
>I'm a Serb. But I have no idea what does my nationality have to do with anything.
>i am the nation who are the worst russian cock suckers
>i dont know what this has to do with anything
How do we explain that to you the best way?
>>
>>36089589
>i am the nation who are the worst russian cock suckers
Like something bad. US and EU bombed them, only retard would expect gratitude after such things.
>>
>>36089632
Only some of them.
>>
>>
>>36089632
They did deserve those bombs though and they got off lightly. Other nations has gotten it worse.
>>
>>36088600
>they subverted and supported the bad kind of left in the west in the last century

>The New Deal and Great Society, which made the US powerful and it's people wealthy, and are being destroyed since Reagan
>Bad kind of left
>>
>>36089632
Or you could come to the conclusion you fucked up and no stokholme syndrome behaviour for those who have fucked up will make it better. Welp, ally of Russia it is then, sure will help the country.
>>
>>36089667
You think they supported the good left? What would they have gained from a stronger US with less problems? They supported the screamers, the deconstructive and dividers, which is unironically the same reason why they do the same thing with the alt right today.
>>
>>36088709
And we're still richer and doing way better in every measure than Russia, but stay mad that people get to live their lives without government interference.
>>
>>36089743
I wouldn't use phrase "every measure " with such confidence.
>>
>>36089726
They still support the SJW left as long as it hurts the US.
Russia is literally doing what they and /pol/ accuse Israel of doing.
http://amp.timeinc.net/fortune/2016/01/20/gawker-funding
>>
>>36089765
Why not? Russia is literally failing on every measure save Nationalistic Fervor.
>>
>>36089780
>Russia is literally doing what they and /pol/ accuse Israel of doing.
And /pol/ is cheering them for it, in the end /pol/ is simply the most cucked board.
>>
>>36089834
School education there is surely better. And you can't even dream of their labor rights. Small things like costs of litigation and digital government services, human rights in terms of what police can and can not do to you are too unbelievable for average burger.
>>
>>36090008
>School education there is surely better.
Pffffttt

>human rights in terms of what police can and can not do to you are too unbelievable for average burger.
Lolwhat?
>>
>>36090026
>Pffffttt
http://foxbaltimore.com/news/project-baltimore/officials-react-dont-react-to-13-high-schools-zero-math-proficiency-11-21-2017

>Lolwhat?
For example - Do police officers require to have two witnesses while performing a search of you, your car or other property?
>>
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>>36088778
>That source says zero about the Su-57
I can't be bothered to dig out that article where they say they aim for same figures. Besides, fatniks consistently bring it up anyway.
>does not make anything specifically declarative about the F-22 or the F-35
Yes it does.
>>36088813
>loving every laugh
That's what happens when amerishits bring up 0.000000000001m2 RCS.
>Doesn't know what a sphere is
Amerimbecile.
>>36088828
MiG-21 is already small as it is, and they are referring to modernising it and smearing it with shitton of RAM.
>>36088857
I posted an estimate by actual scientists, which is worth infinitely more than any vague lockmart press release.
>>36089202
This is /k/. It's but a sub-division of /pol/ for fatniks.
>>36089295
>A prototype crash
f-22 crash.jpg
b-2 crash.jpg
>>
>>36090878
>Doesn't know what a cross section is
>>
>>36090878
>Yes it does.

Nope.
>>
>>36086922
>Implying the US has any reason to do anything but understate performance
This is my favorite quote from the entire thread.

From the entire history of the Cold War till today, the US has done nothing but overestimate Russia.

Whatever claims they would make, we would believe wholesale.
>>
>>36090878
>yoba
>image name in subhuman
I'm getting close to a bingo, keep going armatard.
>>36088630
>>
>>36090878
>That's what happens when amerishits bring up 0.000000000001m2 RCS
Maybe you vatniks could too make true stealth if you weren't busy gay raping each other.
Now you'll have to make do with a plane with worse RCS than the Gripen.
>>
>>36090878
>actual scientists
>russia
Still lovin every laugh.
A group of vatniks guesstimate mixed with propaganda and fearful denial is not valid noe close to the truth in any way.
>>
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>>36086505
>SU-27 and F-35 is 26 km long
Jesus fucking christ.
>>
ITT butthurt libtard reeeing that patriots dumped "good" neobolshevik globalists
>>
>>36091284
>Doesn't know what RCS is
>>36092534
Yes it does. Buy yourself a pair of glasses if you're this blind from all the sugar.
>>36093133
>Being mad about a picture
Say, does a green frog makes you upset too?
>Any language except amerishit "language"
>subhuman
Amerishit, please.
>>36093164
>Amerifag projections
Amerifaggot, please.
>>36093208
The only invalid thing here is a rancid press release made by lockmart.
>>
>>36087083
>We’re duscussing the SU57
No such plane.
>>
>>36086514

>57 this year alone.
It should have been 66 but LM is lagging a bit in deliveries.

Next year the plan is for 100, it will probably be less than that though.
85-90 in 2018 is probably a good guess.

>>36088169
Of which how many are actually combat capable?
Every single one.
The times when LM was producing planes that would later need significant modifications are long gone.
>>
>>36094223
>Every single one.
Prove it. Then remind me, how many F-35 did the US have in 2007.
>>
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>>36094235

>Prove it.
If you define combat capable like the air force does then the 3i versions that are being produced right now already are combat capable.
The improved 3F version of the sofware will be standard off the production line starting with full rate production in 2018, i think.
F-35s that are being produced right now with 3i software will just need a software upgrade to 3F. That is being rolled out right now. (see below)

>"Aircraft in the baseline, or “3F” configuration, will be handed over to the Operational Test community in the next few months to verify that everything works as intended."

http://www.airforcemag.com/MagazineArchive/Pages/2018/January%202018/F-35-Exiting-the-Pattern.aspx

>Then remind me, how many F-35 did the US have in 2007.
What are you trying to say? That 2017 is to the SU-57 what 2007 was to the F-35?
That is just not true, both programs started at about the same time.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Vhpex6VU-Q
>>
>>36088832
>due to collapse of system in the 90's
Yet Russia is the only post-Soviet country suffering from these issues to anywhere near that extent. Ukraine has less than half the murder rates. Ukraine has much lower HIV rates. Ukraine has less alcohol related issues. Ukraine has better healthcare... And that's Ukraine, which is one of the countries that got the worst of the collapse of the Soviet Union and it still in the shit, and is poorer than Russia.
>>
>>36094339
So this is basically just a very obscure way of saying "it's still in testing".
>What are you trying to say?
Evading the question won't do. How many F-35 did the US have in 2007?
>>36094339
>both programs started at about the same time
F-35 program started in 1992 with first flight in 2000. Operational combat capable aircraft are yet to be seen. Yet shithead amerifags are trying to act though shittalking Russian for not starting full scale production just 7 years after the first flight.
>>
>>36094339
Also,
>Jane's
No trust for lying faggots spewing out amerishit propaganda about T-50 using the same radar and engines as Su-35.
>>
>>36094651
>So this is basically just a very obscure way of saying "it's still in testing".
Both the Marines and Air Force have a combat-ready squadron in Japan right now.
>>
>>36094235
>Still insisting that #6 economy on planet can (and should) build a 5th gen plane no same speed as #2 world economy with funds and orders from dozen of other countries.
Dude, just stop. Anyone who is trying to claim that Suchoi can do same thing as LM is a retard. Anyone who claims that Suchoi MUST do same thing as LM is even bigger retard. The existance of Su-57 program alone is a big fucking deal, because much richer and technological advanced countries can't do what Russians do (build a 5th gen plane on their own soil giving job places to their own citizens and keeping money inside their own economy).
>>
>>36094950
>#2 world economy
That's the EU. US is still #1. And Russia is 12th.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(nominal)




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