So Russia has finally admitted they are going to scrap, sell or give it away. There is only one nation crazy enough to take it. Leaving aside the question of would they want it at all and the ridiculous amount of reworking it need, i think they could do it. What would it look like?Cons:>Going to be slower>Engines need replacement>Power system/generators need total overhaul, it's an over complicated mess>Possible Nuclear conversion>Almost every weapon besides the AK-360s needs replacement>Rader/sensors need to be made Norky>Aircraft compliment needs almost total replacement besides Mig-29sPros:>Speed not too much of an issue, it will die in a real war no matter what>Norks probably willing to jam a civilian PWR or two into it>Willing to use unusual options>Significantly reduced power needs; every Nork weapon they would use has a mobile version that can be independently powered if needed>Much less aircraft upkeep; the Mig-29s would be the most complex aircraft and most of the rotor craft would be goneSo start with making it move, how? Big civilian engines? PWRs and electric drives? I could even imagine them doing something weird like electric drives and a coal plant if it would be cost effective.
>>64518277China should buy it
>>64518277trip on norktard
>>64518291They already bought one that was in far better condition, they don't want another one. >>64518296As you wish, i was following the unspoken tripfag rules. Recognized i am honor bound to use it. Funny thing i just researched, the joke propulsion isn't much of a joke: Anthracite only has slightly less energy density than Mazut. You could stick a coal powered steam turbine plant in there, in theory if you were simplifying alot of the power systems and shortened the range to account for the coals bulk it would work just fine. Somehow less polluting as well.
>>64518291>>64518303Correction: China has two. One rebuilt Soviet/Ukrainian Carrier and a local variant. Both use normal steam turbines.
>>64518291They already have 2 kutzes that aren't in need of a total overall. Really the only buyers I can think for it are Best Korea, India, and maybe Indonesia seeing as they're already buying a carrier off the Italians. The Kutz is trash but at least it can support migs and isn't restricted to harriers and helicopters. Maybe Iran, maybe, if Russia really wants to get on everyone's bad side and also have their boat blown up within 5 minutes of it leaving port by mossad
>>64518277they'll need to tow it to China to fix it first
>>64518277But why would NK need an aircraft carrier? Their primary focus is entirely on SK and American bases in the vicinity, and secondarily focus is on Japan and maybe China, the Nork’s do not have any interest in power projection besides giving advisors to the ME/Africa.>>64518291Why would you inflict such a curse upon the Chinese?>>64518312>maybe Indonesia seeing as they're already buying a carrier off the ItaliansI think that outright ruled out the Indo’s, why get the waterborne equivalent of a space hulk when they can just get an old but well looked after Italian carrier. That and they’ve just made a lot of noise about having a mutual defence pact or whatever with Australia, who would probably not be too keen on having a ecological warcrime travel that close to their waters.
>>64518303>Somehow less polluting as well.Not that surprising, given that anthracite coal is a high-quality mineral fuel and mazut is literally what's left over after extracting the fuel out of crude oil.
>>64518277Do they even have drydock facilities large enough for it though? If not they'd just be using it until it's dead, which seems to be not too far off. I guess they could send it to China but their relationship is sort of rocky, particularly with the norks getting closer to Russia than they'd been previously. Russian facilities are also an option but I think they'd fear they'd just take it back if they felt they needed it. Not sure they have any large enough in the pacific anyway. They haven't had an issue with redirecting export equipment before, although this would be on a completely different scale.
>>64518312The DPRK are really the only ones who would take it, especially as it would basically be given to them for free. Every weapon system has a direct Nork equivalent/copy so adopting them to it isn't a big deal. They would dump the Kortiks and replace them with Pantsus which we already know they have access to. The only real addition would be the obligatory 14.5mm Gatling guns and MANPADS. They already use Mig-29's which would probably be the only aircraft left from the original design that would go on the KPAN Juche besides a few utility helicopters, probably a couple of Mi-8s and a few MD 500s. For alot of the things that the rotary aircraft do on it they very well might to the funny thing and use AN-2s.>>64518348Nampo could do it. It would be a pain in the ass and a really big project but they could pull it off. It would take half a decade but they could do it.>>64518358>Their primary focus is entirely on SK and American bases in the vicinityTheir primary focus is being a major regional power, countering the PRC and setting themselves up to take advantage of Russias decline. The USA, RoK and Japan are not nations they are worried about trying to overthrow the Kims or starting a war.>>64518373Pretty much. Interesting comment as they just announced that they are building a large scale coal gasification synthetic fuel plant to which all i have to say is they should have done that 50 years ago.>>64518376Yes. Or at least they can make a very basic dry dock that would work. They are past masters at land reclamation and how to use concrete. The big issue which i haven't though of is can it fit past the locks on the Nampo tidal barrier which i will immediately research. That might be the single biggest problem.
>>64518277Why wouldn't they sell it to China? The fuck is NK going to do with a carrier?
>>64518424LARP, which is as valid a purpose as any for them. It's nukes or nothing anyway
>>64518405>Nampo tidal barrier>Can it fit>50k cargo ship capacityYes it can but to paraphrase the guy from Das Boot when they were going through Gibraltar: 'stick a finger up your ass with no Vaseline'>>64518424China doesn't want it, no one else does and Russia owes the DPRK alot of money. Also Worst Korea doesn't have a Carrier so the DPRK wants one. The Norks are trying to fast track themselves to a Blue water navy right now.>>64518434Basically this. 'Fuck you, we have a carrier and we will nuke you but otherwise will remain harmless as long as we are left alone'It's why they build atomic armed frigates, destroyers, subs and supposedly a heavy cruiser. Their military isn't really meant to win a war, it is meant to deter it by making any victory so painful that no one will bother fighting them. Somehow they have been doing it so long they got a competent military, at least one that can stand up to the PRC or gets Russia begging them for help. They are transitioning from LARP 'fake it until you make it' to actual making it status. Being Norks they aren't satisfied with being the local bully (regional power) they want more. Pic: Nampo tidal barrier, the carrier can fit through it. With alot of tug boats, water pumps to ensure buoyancy and possibly people using ropes to pull it. It has winches to lift cargo ships during low water events so it should work. Their best shipyard is behind the sea wall;
>>64518312>Maybe Iran, maybe, if Russia really wants to get on everyone's bad side and also have their boat blown up within 5 minutes of it leaving port by mossadwhy would mossad do that? iran being gifted the naval equivalent of a white elephant is in their interest. it would be even less of a threat and more costly than their converted oil tanker "aircraft carrier".
>>64518474>Nampo tidal BarrierThey can probably get it through, the Nampo tidal barrier great engineering accomplishment but was made for large cargo ships. The scale of it is hard to describe, the main part is 8km wide pic related the red parts.A major issue is not having the Carrier clip the central control/flak tower, i understand why it is there but i assume the Norks never imagined having to move a Carrier though there. Random fun fact: If you look closely there are access points, bunkers and small boat docks next to the huge steel shutters. They are almost identical to ones for the storm surge barrier for Providence RI.
>>64518495Because the jews go ballistic when the Iranians get their hands on anything sharper than a crayon. Though seeing as their "drone carrier" hasn't been sunk yet maybe they'd let the kutz join Iran's navy. Perhaps you're right and they'd let then have a white elephant
>>64518495No one has a use for it besides the DPRK. It would be a burden on any other buyer and the DPRK would demand it as a gift and make Russia pay to transport it. Which is exactly what will happen if the Norks take it. I am seriously thinking that Kim would take it and make it functional in some capacity just so he could say that the DPRK can make a Carrier work and Russia cannot. It would be a great flex as the one one one the DPRK already has conventional Naval Supremacy over Russia in the Far East. >>64518521Iran isn't getting it and they would have no idea or capability on how to use it. Calm down Iran, the DPRK and Iran are bros but you aren't getting a real carrier. Iran can't even maintain it while the Norks can. You should smoke some weed, chill out and buy more midget subs.
>>64518521right. my point is that the kutz is less sharp than a crayon. that piece of shit won't ever sail again and is more of a treat to it's crew than the enemy.
>>64518536do the norks even have the support auxiliaries and drydocks and port facilities to handle it? at least the iranians have some of that stuff because of shipping oil.regardless, it's powerplant is done. it needs gutted and the norks aren't exactly known for building large naval powerplants. like, are they building heavy cruiser steam gear in the 2020s? did they ever?they could probably take it make it a casino or something for their failed resort beach project tho.
>>64518541Agreed but two of them, one conversion and one copy have been turned into functional warships by the PRC. Do you really doubt that the DPRK could not strip the hull of the Kuznetsov down to bare bones and make it into something vaguely functional? They turned the rusted out scrap hulls of Krivaks into nuclear armed frigates and the scrap hulls of Romeos into something that can kill Tokyo. >>64518562The dry docks, ship yards and ports? Yes they can do it although it would be a major effort. They have at least three docks that could resupply or work on it. Sinpo in theory could handle it as could Nampo, see above posts about Nampo issues. >it's powerplant is done. it needs gutted and the norks aren't exactly known for building large naval powerplants. like, are they building heavy cruiser steam gear in the 2020s? did they ever?Smart detail noticer. I commend you. The DPRK can build large scale electric engines, they make generators for their hydroplants locally. They make electric train engines and generators for their hydroelectric plants. It would be a significant pain in the ass but they could make electric motors that would move the Carrier. Powering them would be the issue. It is worth noting that a triple expansion steam boiler like on the Konesberg as a primary power sourse would work out better than Mamzut. Given the issues, anthracite is better. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_cruiser_K%C3%B6nigsberg>You are now all aware that the only Aircraft Carriers made by the USSR would have been more efficient if they were coal powered. >I'm not joking, it would have been better if the USSRs Carriers were coal powered.
>>64518277Iran should buy it, modify it to CATOBAR so we can have this
>>64518627Iran would waste it, the Iran/DPRK relationship has been one of the DPRK trying to help Iran and Iran ignoring sensible advice.
>>64518615the solution to the Kuz problem is a coal-powered triple expansion electric drive cobbled together by north korea.you have interesting ideas.
oh shit a norktard thread>>64518615OK. so norktard. I'm seeing just one flaw in your plan (well more so than the other ones anyways). Can they really spin this as a propaganda win if their first super carrier (using this term loosely here) is bought from another power? This seems not consistent with the spirit of Juche.>CAPTCHA: ASHM
>>64518675>Can they really spin this as a propaganda win if their first super carrier (using this term loosely here) is bought from another power?Chang seems to have been able to.
>>64518675Juche is so successful, other nations are gifting us aircraft carriers as tribute.
>>64518277the REAL question is: how does it get from the Baltic sea to the Korean peninsula?
>>64518646On a technical/engineering level it would be the most cost effective way for the DPRK to power a carrier. They would probably put a PWR on it just to have the word 'nuclear' on it and to make anyone afraid to hit it. The PWR would be for ships Radar/weapons powers systems, not the drive. But yeah, use coal, the Norks have alot of it and it would be expensive to operate otherwise. > carried 14 × Su-3314 × MiG-29K2 × MiG-29KUBR2 × Su-25UTG15 × Ka-27PS2 × Ka-31Nork version: >24 Mig-29>3-4 MD 500>2 Mi-8>18-24 An-2s>Probably try to land and carry a Il-28, not sure but it might work>>64518675They took an idea and a weapon from the USSR that the USSR lacked the will and intellect to develop into a modern weapon system due to the USSR/Russia's weakness. *Spoiler alert*, it's the Graf Zeppelin with a bunch of semi modern missiles and point defense systems. It isn't meant to win any battles, it is meant to inflict so much pain on anyone trying to take it down that is isn't worth the effort to fight them in the first place.The DPRK are bullies, arms suppliers and gangsters with atomic weapons and that is why they want a fleet carrier. Not to win a war but to prevent one by scaring people into thinking it isn't worth your time or lives to fight them. And to force you to pay them money.So far it seems to be working.>>64518699That is the second most intelligent question in this thread besides 'do they want it' that has been asked.
>>64518277Disappointing, I hoped they would keep pouring effort into this at least until the war ended.>>64518405What fucking purpose does the DPRKhave for a carrier? They don't project power navally, and in fact cannot. It's just stupid. Maybe they'd scrap it, thats all.They do not have the capability, will, or doctrine for this.
>>64518277>>Aircraft compliment needs almost total replacement besides Mig-29sThe MiG-29s too, unless juche is an effective substitute for a tailhook.
>>64518695Juche is so successful that the DPRK is considering rejecting Fleet Aircraft Carriers even as gifts.
>>64518277Maybe the Russians can find another Indian admiral to blackmail like they did with the Admiral Gorshkov sale.
>>645186991905 Baltic Fleet Expedition Remastered
>>64518705>They don't project power navally, and in fact cannot. It's just stupid.Wrong. They have several nuclear armed frigates and destroyers and are working on a heavy missile Cruiser with the intent of having a Blue Water Navy. They already have the world's largest submarine fleet if none in quality but numbers. They are making a nuclear powered heavy sub. They are making a serous effort to have a real navy, they already have all the pieces to make it work.Google the Yellow Sea where the PRC ships around 20% of it cargo through and look how confined it is, in a DPRK/PRC war the first thing that will happen is the PRC will lose every ship in the Yellow Sea to the DPRK. Within 48-72 hours of a conflict between the PRC/DPRK anything flying a PRC flag in the yellow sea that floats will be destroyed by the DPRK.
>>64518749Not entirely related but what do you put the odds of a PRC-DPRK war in the next 20 years at? It seems pretty unlikely to me. I know their relationship isn't as solid as it looks on the surface, but it just seems like a bad idea.
>>64518699They tow it. Varyag didn't even have engines installed when the Chinese bought it.
>>64518768Varyag was Ukrainian, can the Russians pull something like off over an even larger distance?
>>64518761I've been thinking about that, maybe 50/50? They did have a diplomatic issue where they tried to kill Kim Un in favor of their puppet and the DPRK did a internal sting operation against the PRC puppets, pic highly related. As long as Xi isn't a complete idiot i don't think it likely, the DPRK has enough atomic weapons to wipe Beijing off the face of the earth and even if the DPRK would lose that nuclear exchange Xi's Generals will not allow it. Conventionally the DPRK could fight the PRC into a Ukraine style quagmire and China doesn't want that, especially because the US would support the DPRK. It is worth mentioning that the DPRK has the worlds largest amount of chemical weapons and the instant they knew that they could use them with impunity due to their atomic weapons they would gas the shit out of any opposition including civilian populations. >>64518768>>64518778They would find a way to get it to Nampo, even if they had to literally carry it with ropes and manpower. >>64518784I know i'm grossly simplifying things with 'just use coal' but it was intended as a intellectual starting point. Norks use field phones for their basic ship communications systems, there is this new 'analog' technology called a 'telephone', you should investigate it. I heard it was cutting edge in WW1.
>>64518806The only scenario I could see it happening in is one where Xi or whatever future Chinese leader is in power is convinced their new ballistic missile interceptors are enough to neutralize the threat, which seems unlikely but plausible. The technology probably won't be there for another 5 years at least, probably another 5 years for sufficient production and deployment. Chemical weapons use seems like something that's just not going to ever happen again in a peer war, NK might have a lot but everyone else has enough to make it not worth it. There's even debate about whether or not chemical weapons use in a peer war would warrant a nuclear response, so you're rolling the dice regardless if you intended for nuclear escalation or not.
Now that we have propulsion and power systems out of the way, what's the flight compliment? >The Mig-29's stay and would probably be increased 50-100%>Most rotary craft would be reduced>Su-33s are probably not going to happen>15 Kamov Ka-27's aren't happeningSo what would the Norks put on it besides a bunch of Mig-29s?My thoughts:>Double the Mig-29 numbers>A few Mi-8s and MD-500s>Shitloads of long range drones>18-24 An-2s for resupply and patrol duties>Try to land a Il-28.H-5 variant on it, besides the Mig-29s this is the only thing you need a arrestor hook for>>64518827The North Korean nuclear weapons stockpile is capable of hitting and eliminating Washington DC, NYC, LA, SF, Tokyo, Seoul and a dozen other cities despite all the efforts those nations have put into not having the DPRK nuke them. The USA, South Korea and Japan live in terror that the DPRK will nuke them on a bad day.If the DPRK can make those nations cower in fear, what do you think would happen if the DPRK unleashed all it's atomic weapons on Beijing with the intention of killing as many Chinese citizens as possible? Half of China would be dead and radioactive and somehow there would still be some asshole named Kim threatening you from the rubble pile called Pyongyang.
>>64518860I didn't say it would work, just that they might think it would.
>>64518277Should just buy the new Type 076 LHA from the Chinese instead.
>>64518749Their sub fleet is almost all AIP shitboxes which are decent for modern Monitor Doctrine or French "Young School" shit but aren't for projection because they have effectively no endurance while submerged. If they wanted blue water projection they'd need SSNs of which they have three that are not total shit, namely the last three Shang class. And even they are questionable. Their opposition can bring 50 SSNs all superior to best the Chinks can deploy. At most they want to deny the East Coast of Taiwan to anyone trying to resupply or assist the ROC.
there's no way the kuz is in any way salvagable in any reasonable way at this pointi seriously doubt it has any ability to float for more than a few hours before taking on waterthe cost to repair, move, refit, train/man and arm to any degree would most certainly be more than even NK building their own smaller carrier from scratchthe question of how it would traverse from murmansk to pyongyang is also obviously impossiblethe varyag took a year and hundreds of thousands of dollarstoday russia isn't going to find many friendly ports and nk isn't likely to find a very cooperative tug boat company willing to accept either rubles or wonnot to mention there would be several interested parties that would love to interrupt such a transactionmy money is on the ship being chopped up for scrap, or maybe melted down to restart t62 hull production
>>64518827>NK might have a lot but everyone else has enough to make it not worth it.No. No one has any significant chemical weapons stockpiles besides the DPRK. There are a few outliers, but even Russia and the USA have at most have 200-300 tons in questionable use status, decades old or just tiny amounts. The DPRK has thickened Mustard, Sarin/GB, VX equivalents, vast stockpiles of shit like Lewisite and BZ thermal pots (actual candles BTW) in the 10-15K ton range. Knowing Nork Chemical weapons were my IRL job for 8 years, i know what they have and what they can make.>>64518869Hah, i'm sure they will do whatever they think rational for them. It might be crazy to us but i doubt it will work out badly for them. >>64518871You missed the part where the Norks hate China.>>64518874As a reminder:>The DPRK is the only nation on earth to get a torpedo kill against a warship since WW2 or the Falkland's War>The DPRK has more submarines (includes coastal subs) than anyone else on earth>The Yellow Sea is the worst Naval Death Trap on earth >The Norks naval base in Nampo is physically impossible to penetrate
>>64518312>Maybe Iran, maybe>out of water>buying a boat
>>64518699It isn't in the Baltic though. It's in Murmansk, which opens up a lot more options for transport.
>>64518312India or Indonesia sound like much better possibilities in this fever-dream.Indonesia's Poland-esque menagerie would welcome this freakshow of a Kuznetzov.
>>64518897They took apart Krivaks and Romeo class subs from sunken 30-40 year old scrap metal hulks bit by bit, piece by piece and put them back together. They made them work again.Why can't they do it with a Carrier?
>>64518749that's pretty optimistic, all of best korea is within range of Chinese land based missiles, aircraft, ship based missiles, etc
>>64518277>>Almost every weapon besides the AK-360s needs replacementQuoting myself above BTW Besides the CIWS (a separate topic) how would it be armed? It can carry a shitload of missiles and one of the Norks trademarks is making a shitload of missiles. They might not be all that great but they do make alot of them. And sometimes they work just fine.>>64518929Make no mistake, China can obliterate the DPRK in a atomic war. The PRC would wipe out 90% of their population in 24 hours in a nuclear exchange. The problem is that the DPRK's response would be to kill 25-50% of China's population before they went down. The rest of the world would not allow the PRC to exchange 25 million North Koreans for 750 million Chinese as well as the population of any city within range of a North Korean atomic weapon during a North Korean second strike revenge attack.There is also the nightmare possibility that somewhere in the rubble of Pyongyang the Kim's might survive a PRC second strike and still have a few more nukes plus willing soldiers.
>>64518948How willing are the soldiers really going to be after everything is rubble, though?
>>64518922>Why can't they do it with a Carrier?it's an order of magnitude larger, more complex and who is going to do it? the ruskis are a little tied up and bringing in the north korean 'engineering' squad to cut up a full sized carrier to then truck/train it across russia would be some serious entertainmentat that point you might as well start over from scratchkeep in mind the kuznetsov has not just been rotting in dry dock for the last few years, it's also been seriously fucked up by a series of fires rendering it irreparable by the country who potentially has the plans to build itthe chinese reportedly got 40 tons of plans/blueprints from ukraine when they bought theirs
>>64518963There are roughly 750-1000 people in the DPRK Government, Korean Workers Party or Military who are either direct blood relatives of the Kim blood line or married to one. The bodyguards are all part of that system as are 3-5 generations of their families. All the military.The soldiers are not only willing, they are really pissed off, vengeful, and in a rage state that will be only satiated with the use of atomic weapons.>>64518964They would make Russia drag it intact to at least Vladivostok then Fukino before they took custody of it. >Vladivostok so they could inspect it and make sure it would not sink>Fukino so they could inspect the weapons and launch systems>Spend 4 months at Fukino screaming and yelling at Russia that they left something important out>Don't actually tell Russia what that part was missing but blackmail them with ammo supplies if they don't give it to you now>Finally get the part, move it to Sinpo>Inform the Russians that you are satisfed, take all the tugboats**Mao once sent Kim Il Sung a huge trainload of supplies after they opened the first rail line between the PRC and DPRK. 120 Trains and cars worth of supplies, he saved the DPRK.Mao meant it as a gift to get Sung to be more reasonable and get Sung to negotiate a peace treaty.Sung told him to fuck off, took the supplies, took the trains and conscripted their crews because he though Mao and Stalin were pussies who troops just didn't fight hard enough. Sung was a asshole.
>>64519002>>Spend 4 months at Fukino screaming and yelling at Russia that they left something important out>>Don't actually tell Russia what that part was missing but blackmail them with ammo supplies if they don't give it to you now>>Finally get the part, move it to SinpoThat 'part' was probably detailed plans for a WW2 era coal gasification plant that made synthetic gasoline for the Nazis. That last bit isn't a fantasy or a hypothetical, they are actually trying to do it IRL:http://kcna.kp/en/article/q/33f5e9f9c3154e67e21f874112d7b9db.kcmsf
>>64518948Do we have any credible demonstrations of the AK-630 functioning roughly as-advertised, when it is properly maintained and crewed?I have seen documents on this forum showing that Phalanx does work decently. And there have been various combat incidents in the middle east too, evidencing that it's decent.
>>64518675>>64518694>>64518695>OK. so norktard. I'm seeing just one flaw in your plan (well more so than the other ones anyways). Can they really spin this as a propaganda win if their first super carrier (using this term loosely here) is bought from another power? This seems not consistent with the spirit of Juche.I have no idea what you are talking about, the United Spirt of the Choson Race under the guidance of KIM JONG IL spontaneously created this Aircraft Carrier as a response to the aggression of the Imperialist powers.
>>64519080>nork bodyguards
>>64519076>Do we have any credible demonstrations of the AK-630 functioning roughly as-advertised, when it is properly maintained and crewed?No, not really. I've been wondering why the Norks SPAAGs that use AK230s and miniature tilt drum radar derivatives* haven't upgraded to 630s since the gun fits in the mount. The AK-630 doesn't seem to work that well. *Norks use a half sized tilt drum derived radar for almost all their radar guided AA gun needs. It seems to be short ranged but it works.
>>64519096>half sized tilt drum derived radarOne of them and a automated Nork ZPU-4 battery.
>>64518860Po-2. A shitload of Po-2.
>>64518860>and somehow there would still be some asshole named Kim threatening you from the rubble pile called Pyongyang.Only because like 1/4 of Koreans, North or otherwise, are named Kim.
>>64519002The funniest part is that was not the last time the DPRK straight up stole Chinese trains, Jong did it too.
>>64519302It is becoming a hobby of theirs, during their Covid restrictions they made the families of the PRC ambassador and their support staff walk across the bridge only taking what they could carry by hand. This was of course after the Nork sting operation that resulted in Kim Jung Nam's death.>>64519296You are only saying that because it's true.
>>64519302>The height of the cold war in the 1960-early 1980's period'>Kim: 'You said you would support us with 300 train cars of cargo and your best dozen train engines'>Mao: 'Yes, i meant the cargo i gave you not the trains and cargo cars themselves'>Kim: Thanks for the Trains.>Mao: WTF?>Zhou Enlai: Chairman, Kim is being a asshole again, i told you to ignore his calls
>>64519302Now that i think about it i can think of almost a dozen historical incidents where Norths Koreans have stolen train cars and engines. They don't normally steal individual trains, they steal entire City train fleets.
>>64519596You'd think the Chinese would have learned at some point to stop sending them trains but hey, if free trains keep showing up they'd be insane to say no. If anything the Chinese should have just pushed the cars across the border, uncoupled the engine, and thrown it in reverse as fast as possible.
>>64519824>pushed the cars across the border, uncoupled the engine, and thrown it in reverse as fast as possibleFrom what i have read that is exactly what happened, the Norks took it anyway. It's how Sung got two of Stalin's armored trains. He just took them. Sung stole two of Stalin's trains and one of Maos that was girted to Mao by Stalin. I'm on volume three to infinity (officially 68 volumes) of the Collected works of Sung and he is a hard guy that you don't want to fuck with. He is a asshole and a jerk in the best way i can say that.
>>64518277if i was north korea i wouldn't want a carrier, but if i did i might as well just commission a new one from china rather than buying a 50 year old pile of scrap metal.
>>64520006>might as well just commission a new one from china That is the one detail that filters casuals when we talk about the DPRK. The PRC is the #1 mortal enemy of the DPRK.
>>64520168>We ensured the survival of a sociopath's regime by direct military intervention>We repeatedly prevented that regime from collapsing with direct industrial and agricultural aid>We repeatedly gave direct (and plenty of covert) military tech and expertise to this regime>We know this regime is fanatically xenophobic, belligerent, and isolationist but they're sure to bow to our wisdom and wishes>Why are they not our puppets? Why are they so upset we tried to make them our puppets?Truly China continues to be one of the diplomatic masterminds of all time. I still don't see rapproachment between the US and the DPRK happening anytime soon, but I can certainly see in a US-Chinese war China having to keep significant reserves near the DPRK because Kim might just decide to take a bite while is distracted, simply out of pure pragmatism.
>>64520230I used to wonder how small (buffer) states could ever have been a thing. "Why doesn't country A, being bigger, simply eat the smaller ones?"But thanks through the DPRK and Belarus: at last I truly see. All that matters is that you do not have an absolute retard as leader.
>>64520168if it wasnt for china north korea would've ceased to exist 70 years ago, sit down mongoloid
>>64518277I'll take it off their hands.
>>64520287are you saying relations between the two are good right now?
>>64518277>There is only one nation crazy enough to take itAlgeria would if it wasn't for the current Ukraine war.
>>64518303>unspokenHi there! You seem to have made a bit of a mistake in your post. Luckily, the users of 4chan are always willing to help you clear this problem right up! You appear to have used a tripcode when posting, but your identity has nothing at all to do with the conversation! Whoops! You should always remember to stop using your tripcode when the thread it was used for is gone, unless another one is started! Posting with a tripcode when it isn't necessary is poor form. You should always try to post anonymously, unless your identity is absolutely vital to the post that you're making!Now, there's no need to thank me - I'm just doing my bit to help you get used to the anonymous image-board culture!
>>64520168>>64520230China/NK is in the same situation as US/Israel. The political situation that caused them to support NK's creation decades ago no longer exists, but China has to support NK's shenanigans because they know that if NK is conquered, they'll be the ones that get nuked for allowing it to happen.
>>64518277Too structurally damaged to repair
>>64518277Is it time to make the /k/arrier a reality?C'mon assholes, where are those six figure salaries I keep on hearing about?
>>64519080Norktard I know I say this every thread but look at her sexy powerful smirk. I bet she fucks like a bobcat
>>64520230>>64520287>>64520354Are you shocked that the DPRK isn't appreciative of 5000 years of China treating them like shit? Let me shock you further: Since the establishment of the current governments of North Korea and the Peoples Republic of China every single Head of State of the PRC has tried to kill the Leader of the DPRK. Multiple times. Recently the PRC finally got it through their thick idiot heads: THE KIMS WILL NOT DIE. China can't get rid of them without permeant Civilization altering consequences.>>64520250Obstinate assholes really don't get enough credit for how important they are in keeping humanity from doing dumb things.>>64520424They stole Krivaks and submarines that were literally cut in pieces and sold as scrap iron and put them back together, do not ever doubt the DPRKs ability to cobble something together from even the smallest scraps.>>64520504That ship is woefully unequipped in the area of 14.5mm guns. It needs at least 24 KPVs and a dozen rotary 14.5mm guns crewed by hot KPA girls with guitars. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9xUQTIax0Mg
>>64520583I know, but she is The Forbidden Cuddle.Also she is married and has kids, a daughter that we know of and probably s son. I can't help but think that her husband and kids are both the luckiest people in the DPRK and the most unfortunate.
