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Cis (real) females: Do MTFs severely creep you out, or do you just not care as long you don't have to see one of us in person?
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>>8992322
As I said before tttt, I find you mtfs quite endearing.
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>>8992329

>I find you mtfs quite endearing.

Why is that? I kind of wonder what my aunt thinks now. She's the closest thing to a fag hag I have in my family, and she seems supportive of trannies to some degree, but I wonder under what motivation.
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>>8992353
yaoi
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>>8992364
but that's the opposite of how we want to be endearing...
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>>8992353
I never had any problems with mtfs. The few I met were nice and never seemed to creep me out in any way. I think mtfs can be cute as well.
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>>8992353
I've been thinking about this a lot lately. Seems to me that girls are way more forgiving on girl-on-girl (i.e. more willing to say "whatever, might be gay but probably not" than guys who believe that if you kissed a man on the cheek you're forever gay). Culture in general is more lenient with feminine sexual fluidity. I think it has something to do with the fact that women are XX and men are XY-- so men have more "in common" with women than women have with men, if that makes any sense.

So women are I think a little more accepting of MtFs because they are just dropping the Y factor out and looking cute and being girly, whereas FtMs are adding a factor that isn't there chromosomally, and men are more easily threatened/alarmed in that sense.

I don't know if I'm making any sense at all, it sounds better in my head
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>>8992322
>Do MTFs severely creep you out, or do you just not care as long you don't have to see one of us in person?
Nice fucking loaded question moron lmao
>>
Don't listen to lies above, cis females HATE us and want us gone.
They can often fake their acceptance because they'll want to be good in the eyes of others, but they HATE us.
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>>8992468
They only hate you if you're beautiful
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Yes. I don't gotta justify shit. They just do.
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I like mtfs and I’ll use the proper pronouns and everything. But deep down I don’t really think that they are really women. It’s not a big deal and it doesn’t change how I treat them but sometimes you just have to play along for everything to run smoothly.
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>>8992467

lol so triggered
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>>8992498
>lol triggered
no see you pretended to offer 2 different points of view, but it was actually just the same thing rephrased
get it?
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>>8992491
do you see them as men? or something in between?
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>>8992491
>But deep down I don’t really think that they are really women.
Well that's because we aren't. I don't see what you're really getting at, just treat people like people and it's k.
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>>8992527
Probably depends on the shoulder width and if they have a cleft chin/jawline
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>>8992466
Men are shamed for not fulfilling their duties as men and also for homosexuality. This shaming leads to a deep-seated fear that mtfs hit both parts of.
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>>8992541
if they aren't a hon
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>>8992475
No, they hate us regardless. Look at THIS:
>>8992478
>>8992491
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>>8992527

Well, men of course.
>>
Straight MTFs - they're fine, I don't have any particular problem with them
Bi MTFs - They're okay, again no real opinion
Lesbian MTFs - kill it with fire. Just kidding, but I find them to be eerily similar to straight men and they often use the same arguments as straight men for why I (bi leaning lesbian) should date them and how its bigoted to not want their giant clit. They don't really seem like women desu. A few of them do, but most I have encountered seemed like they watched way too much anime and tranny porn.
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>>8992527
Not that anon but I see trannies as a sort of "other" or third gender. Neither men or women.
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>>8992583

Can’t help but agree with this, the transbians always made me the most uncomfortable of the bunch.
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>>8992601

The funny thing is that a lot of trans in the west hate being slapped with the third gender label but you go to a place like Thailand and they’re actually fine with being called ladyboys

Something about transgenderism in the west is more neurotic and touchy than in the east, I’ve found
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>>8992605
I'd feel the same way if a FtM was trying to convince me to bang them

Although shit I might still do it, actually that could be strangely hot

Sex is weird
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Mtf are my favorite female because they usually put more effort into it. Penis isn't important.
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Now just watch how all this mtf hate will just pile up.
They don't view us as women, they never will and at best they'll tolerate our presence somewhere away, but often they'd openly say that we need to die or disappear.
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>>8992491
That's fine, I don't really consider myself a valid female, just a poor attempt at imitation. Do you play along out of fear or pity? I think a lot of women just go along with MTFs forcing themselves into female spaces out of fear of reprisal or just learned submissiveness towards men.

>>8992601
It's only fair, I think most of us feel like a third gender anyway.

>>8992631
Everyone is entitled to their feelings and opinions. As long as it doesn't come to violence on any sides, then there's no harm really.
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>>8992627

You don't sound like a cis woman, so your opinion wasn't asked for.
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>>8992475
Nah they only hate you when you look like a creepy hon.
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>>8992626
Assuming you're a gay guy, a FtM might be a creep, but you could always fend him off if he gets really annoying.
Transbians are often built like linebackers and scare the fuck out of cis lesbians (cis women in general). They're also really pushing, whiny, and annoying, except they still behave like men and often get aggressive like them too.
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>>8992644
>you don't sound like a cis women
Explain
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>>8992642
I never said that no one can have an opinion. It doesn't mean, however, that I don't hate a right to react to it.
>>8992646
They'll hate you REGARDLESS.
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>>8992653
That shitty behaviour is to be expected sadly, but what is worse is when liberal feminists defend their behaviour.

>>8992659
You don't want to come off as threatening or mangry.
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>>8992583
I'm glad we bi MtFs aren't creepy

I kind of have the attitude that it's w/e, if I like someone I do and if I don't I don't and you can't really force attraction. I wonder if other bi MtFs or bis in general have a similar attitude
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1. No, why should I get the creeps if they did nothing to me?

2. Its kind of sad that you think most cis females overall want you to hide yourself in real life. Even if they feel that way, people like that aren't worth paying attention to. I hope you find yourself in an environment where you don't feel that way in the near future ,anon.
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>>8992622
>Something about transgenderism in the west is more neurotic and touchy than in the east, I’ve found
The entirety of the USA is neurotic lmao
It's not just gender issues
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>>8992583
>tfw part agree and hate them and part identify with them and resent you for saying that
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>>8992583
Straight and bi MTFs often seem like they want to play out some ddlg or 1950s housewife fantasy. They often look like caricatures of women.
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>>8992665
>You don't want to come off as threatening or mangry.
I never threatened anyone. I'm just stating my opinion.
I never even called anyone "transphobic" in my life, even though cis females claim we do it all the time. I can understand and accept preferences, but it doesn't mean I can't feel bad about it, alright?
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>>8992655
people on this board do it all the time
they try to invalidate based on arbitrary/nonexistent gender/sex/orientation things, this board is basically 95% trolling tbhon
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>>8992659
Dude I'm married to one.
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>>8992622
Yeah my ancestry is eastern (India) and we've had hijras for thousands of years. So that's generally how I see most trannies. I grew up in the west all my life so I'm familiar with western trans identity but I prefer the eastern view far more.
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>>8992684
>They often look like caricatures of women.
Is that such a horrible thing? As a man I aspire to be a charicature of a man in a lot of ways
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>>8992695
Oh, let me guess.
She was your gf before you transitioned.
>Dude
Fuck you.
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>>8992684
I don't think I'm a caricature
I do want to be a housewife tho
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>>8992701
Hijras are at the lowest tier of the social hierarchy. It isn't very different in the West.
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>>8992655

Why would a cis woman post that picture and say
>Mtf are my favorite female because they usually put more effort into it.

>>8992681

The "them" would be the transbians?
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>>8992701

I honestly think that if transgenderism is to survive in the west, it’ll have to be based on eastern models which generally have a less binary view of the situation. Hijra and kathoey and two-spirits are fascinating, while Caitlyn Jenner is disquieting.
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>>8992711
They're mocked and laughed at, sometimes, and they're mostly prostitutes (unsurprisingly like most western mtfs), but there's not a whole lot of anger or violence towards them like in the west. When I was in India I saw at least two of them, walking openly in the streets carrying some supplies and nobody cared. They're also very strong, which is why most Indian men don't try to bother them.

Also, they crash weddings all the time and dance at them. You're supposed to let them do that and give them gifts or they'll curse you, or so the Hindu lore goes. They're considered good luck for the bride and groom.
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>>8992706
I'm just a cis female.Girls still call each other dude all the time. Believe it or not, it wasn't a put down. When I said it i didn't even think about it that way.
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>>8992735
Whatever, I hope you feel good showing your false acceptance.
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>>8992718
>The "them" would be the transbians?
yes, even though i'm bi
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>>8992718
It was just a random picture with basic girls. I was saying trans girls are a little more interesting to me because they TRY more. They usually put effort into fashion, makeup and hair while most cis women these days half ass it with leggings and some shitty messing bun, if that makes any sense. I don't know, I find that admirable and it makes me want to dress nicer too.
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>>8992622
It's a consequence of the west having no third gender so any misgendering is automatically implying natal sex and trans people in the west being a new thing without an established place socially.
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>>8992701
why do they all look really manly in the pictures that come up when I google them
don't they casterate themselves?
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I'm mtf

Honestly I don't blame people if they hate me, I hate me. I think it comes down to female tact during conversation being able to maneuver in social atmospheres. Testosterone does not help with this, and more-so wanting to keep use their penis is another thing that really changes how you communicate with others.
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>>8992744
Oh, I accept them. I could never hate, I do dislike women who are catty for no reason, so you're obviously passing.
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>>8992767
Well, none of them are on HRT. They just dress in womens clothing and behave like women.
Some of them castrate themselves, some of them are kidnapped and castrated by force as children.
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>>8992774
lol passing as a huge cunt
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>>8992704
>Is that such a horrible thing? As a man I aspire to be a charicature of a man in a lot of ways
Fragile femininity.

You can imagine other men being scared if your caricature gets you more women than they get, right?
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>>8992774
>>8992780
Oh, very funny you two.
I'm just trying to warn fellow mtfs about your real nature, so they wouldn't suffer as I did.
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>>8992601
>I see trannies as a sort of "other" or third gender. Neither men or women.
Me too and I am one, but I see trannies as kind of closer to female, which leads me to accidentally misgender ftms like by calling gay ftms straight if I'm not thinking about it.
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>>8992787
>your real nature
>trying to be a woman, but think you have a different nature as women
The only person who hates trannies and will never see them as women is yourself, clearly.
By the way, none of us cis women give a shit about trannies. Most of us don't care, and treat you a lot better than cis men who are prone to beating, raping and killing you. But neither are we going to go out of our way to appear accepting to you. The more hostile you behave the more likely we are to treat you like trash and make fun of your manly shoulders.

The sad truth is you will never be a cis woman. You will never be an actual woman, you're just an attempt. We'll still be cordial with you in public though. We don't have a rabid hatred of you or anything.
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>>8992804
>The only person who hates trannies and will never see them as women is yourself, clearly.
Nope. I see them as women, who are extremely fragile and suffered enough.
>and treat you a lot better than cis men who are prone to beating, raping and killing you
Of course you don't do that yourself.
>But neither are we going to go out of our way to appear accepting to you
I never demanded anything of the sort. I'm not negotiating with the devil.
>The more hostile you behave the more likely we are to treat you like trash and make fun of your manly shoulders.
As I said, you'll merely play false acceptance at best. I don't see any reason acting friendly towards someone who hates me. Oh, wait...
>You will never be an actual woman, you're just an attempt. We'll still be cordial with you in public though
Just like I said. Thanks for confirming my words.
So you'll either pretend to accept us or just outright hate us, just like I said before. Why do you even argue with me if I was right from the beginning?
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>>8992829
Because you're so butthurt about it and claiming that we hate all of you. Not accepting you as real women is not hating you, get that through your thick fucking skull. You were born a male, you're a "woman" technically but not an actual natal female. There's a difference.
>Of course you don't do that yourself.
This is the most retarded thing I've ever seen. Women don't beat rape and kill trannies at any rate close to men. I have never even said anything rude to a transwoman in my life, but keep pretending that we do the same thing. Whatever helps you sleep at night.

>I'm not negotiating with the devil.
Do you consider yourself one of us or not?
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>>8992322
as someone who's trans, I really haven't met any girls that give a shit so long as I'm acting like a fucking girl and not some loserfaggot failed male

>>8992627
>they usually put more effort into it
isn't that weird in and of itself?
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>>8992776
>Well, none of them are on HRT.
off to a good start
>They just dress in womens clothing and behave like women.
uh huh
>Some of them castrate themselves, some of them are kidnapped and castrated by force as children.
home run, ya nailed it. I'm gonna quote you in my next research paper.

fucking retard
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>>8992829
Oh and by the way, we're definitely going to hate you when you refer to us as the devil and trying to differentiate yourself from us. Stop acting like such a beta male and act like a woman you stupid tranny.
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>>8992583
I'm a transbian and I don't even watch anime or porn. I don't expect women to date me if they are attracted to penises, but I just wish that they wouldn't invalidate us. Why should I have to be attracted to men to be a "real" woman?
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>>8992847
>Not accepting you as real women is not hating you, get that through your thick fucking skull.
Translation: Yea, I just don't want to do to have anything with you, and I'll merely disguise my disgust in order to appear empathetic, but that's not hate at all!
>This is the most retarded thing I've ever seen. Women don't beat rape and kill trannies at any rate close to men.
I never said they do?
>Do you consider yourself one of us or not?
I consider myself a girl, but I'm obviously not a CIS girl. And I know how cis girls like you treat us.
>>8992861
>we're definitely going to hate you when you refer to us as the devil and trying to differentiate yourself from us
Oh, don't worry, if there's something I learned from you, it was the mastery of pretending. I never said anything of the sort to cis females (except for my ex) and I usually play along with their false acceptance. I get treated nicely, especially if they don't know that I'm trans, and I'd rather keep that way than have an open conflict.
And, as I said, you'll hate us regardless, the only difference is whether you'll bother to mask it or not.
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>>8992847
>Women don't beat rape and kill trannies at any rate close to men.
No, women simply enable it from behind the scenes while keeping their hands clean, you vile TERF.
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>>8992653
>Transbians are often built like linebackers and scare the fuck out of cis lesbians (cis women in general). They're also really pushing, whiny, and annoying, except they still behave like men and often get aggressive like them too.

I've never gotten in a physical fight in my entire life, and I almost never even raise my voice. I'm way more passive than most cis girls that I know. And I was always small and scrawny as a guy.
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>>8992876
>I consider myself a girl, but I'm obviously not a CIS girl. And I know how cis girls like you treat us.
Treating you as in.. we don't consider you a cis girl? Which is exactly what I said? Yet you're conflating that with wanting nothing to do with you, which is bullshit since none of us have a problem interacting with you in real life. We just don't consider you a cis woman.

>and I'll merely disguise my disgust in order to appear empathetic, but that's not hate at all!
I hate to tell you this but the majority of people, male and female, consider trannies disgusting. We disguise our disgust because we don't want to openly express it to you, as that would be disrespectful. That's not hate, thats actually us trying to not hurt your feelings. If you don't understand this basic type of female behavior you are clearly a male.
>>8992491 is how we see you. If you think that's hate and disgust then you're just a butthurt tranny.
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>>8992896
>it was actually womens fault all along!
Shut the fuck up idiot. The only thing that enables men to beat the fuck out of you is finding out you have a cock.
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>>8992653
>Transbians are often built like linebackers and scare the fuck out of cis lesbians (cis women in general)
I was bullied in school for being the weakest around, people regularly threatened to beat me, I would often burst into tears because I couldn't do anything about it, I never initiated a single fight (I would rather get ridiculed more than try to fight back), and now I probably won't be able to hjt anything larger than an insect, but yeah, I'm a huge danger.
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>>8992906
>We disguise our disgust
>If you think that's hate and disgust then you're just a butthurt tranny.
TERF quality argument. Literally contradicting herself. Subarashi.
What's funny, you've actually confirmed everything I said, yet you consider yourself right.
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>>8992923
Victim blaming. You'd never treat an AFAB rape or murder victim the same way.
>>
victim compleeeeeex
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>>8992930
Yes we do consider you disgusting, most people do actually. Stop trying to make that as some unique female trait. We don't hate you though.
It doesn't really matter though. You can keep pretending I'm a TERF when in actuality I'm the majority of the human population.
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>>8992322
>mtf: "OMG LADIES ARENT MEN SUCH SCUMBAGS RIGGHT OMG GIRL POWERRRR WE SHOULD START A FEMINIST PUNK BAND ABOUT CUTTING OFF DICKS"

ugh take it easy
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>>8992686
>I can understand and accept preferences, but it doesn't mean I can't feel bad about it, alright?

>it doesn't mean I can't feel bad about it, alright?
See, here's something you need to understand about women in general. Women believe that only women are allowed to have complex emotions, and that men (including trannies) are just supposed to listen to cold unfeeling logic. It's "logical" that they aren't attracted to you, and they WILL shame you for daring to feel bad about it, because feeling bad about things is supposed to be a female privilege.
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>>8992944
>Stop trying to make that as some unique female trait.
You mean like you did with transphobic violence as some unique male trait?
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>>8992938
Who said I blamed them for being raped/murdered? It's not justified and it's still a heinous crime, but that is the reason men do it, because the find out you have a dick. Not because women are secretly orchestrating an army of men to kill trannies while rubbing their hands like some /pol/ jew caricature.
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>>8992956
It is though. Prove that women commit rape, murder and assault on trans women at the same rate men do. You can't because you're just bullshitting.
I can certainly prove that men find trannies just as, if not more disgusting than females do.
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>>8992966
Prove that men are as transphobic as women are.

Until you do by your own logic it's a uniquely female trait.
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>>8992322
im dating one so no.
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>>8992961
>but that is the reason men do it, because the find out you have a dick.
And women who get hit by their husbands or wives are hit because they're cunts.
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>>8992973
>men kill, beat, rape, and assault trans women more than women
>prove men are as transphobic as women
The proof is self evident. Jesus you're stupid as fuck.
Now prove that it's a unique female trait.
>>
i never meet one irl but from what i see here,they are pretty mean spirited
imagine the most stereotypical female out there extract all her bad qualities and put it in to a blank body and you have a tranny
do they creep me out?
no,but i don't want to interact with irl
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>>8992992
Neither situation was justified, like I said. You just have 0 proof that women enable it. Nice argument kek.
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>>8993001
>Now prove that it's a unique female trait.
TERFs.
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>>8992944
Why do you consider us disgusting though?

I'm not trying to start an argument with you btw I'm a different anon. I don't expect humans to be rational beings but I'm never really given a good reason when this comes up.
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>>8992804
>>8992847
You're alright. I appreciate your honesty, and I hope this thread doesn't give you a sour impression of trans gals. I'd like to think that -most- of us aren't like that...

I feel like a lot of the girls in /mtfg/ need to spend less time studying makeup and fashion, and put more effort into learning basic etiquette, because the male socialization of picking fights with everyone who disagrees with you is obviously pretty hard to break.
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>>8993062
Think sweeping us under the rug will score you some points in her eyes? Pathetic.
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>>8992973
Actually cis women are more likely to be happy with things like trannies in the women's bathrooms than men are, despite that terfs would like to think.

>>8992992
Most DV is reciprocal.
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>>8993002
This
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>>8993086
Women are just submissive and accustomed to accommodating men.
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>>8993086
>Most DV is reciprocal.
I'd say that qualifies as being a cunt.
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>>8993086
stop putting things out of your ass,dicks and turn inside out dicks go in the men's bathroom ,and vagianas in to woman's bathroom
14 million years of evolution and you cant even use a bathroom
shame
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>>8993002
>imagine the most stereotypical female out there extract all her bad qualities and put it in to a blank body and you have a tranny
^^^
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>>8993094
That's because women were conditioned to do that.

We need to break the conditioning.
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>>8993070
I'm not sweeping you under the rug, I'm saying you should show some humility, and consider that maybe it's a bad idea to alienate the ~50% of the population who shows you some empathy.

You know, empathy for the outgroup? That thing you seem to be horrendously lacking in?
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>>8993086
>Actually cis women are more likely to be happy with things like trannies in the women's bathrooms than men are,
of course we are ,everybody likes Jesters when you go peeing
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>>8993002
>i never meet one irl but from what i see here,they are pretty mean spirited

>imagine the most stereotypical female out there extract all her bad qualities and put it in to a blank body and you have a tranny

Holy fuck this is true. I have only met a handful of trans women that were sweet and nice.
>>
>>8993094
>>8993109
>women need to be told what to think by TERF propaganda if they don't agree with us
TERFs are the stereotypical abusive lesbian girlfriend.
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>>8993115
>empathy for the outgroup
Cis women have little to none.
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>>8993130
>TERF
>agp
>aap
>htr
jesus crust i need to get a TRANSlator if i ever have a tranny gf ,you guys are like from another layer of existen
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>>8992990
"Reeeee u dOnt sEE hEr As a rEel wUMAn"
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>>8993147
I paid for all her clothing and taught her make up plus supporting her through transiotion. ngl i worry that people think of me like that or as a chaser.
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>>8993146
Why do you keep typing a space before the comma instead of after? Are you mobileposting?
>>
Mtf be like
>wE WAs WOmAnS aND ShIT
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>>8993146
t. low-h GAMP ISHF
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Okay so listen, God just spoke to me. He says if you're a good ally to cis women, then He'll make you a cis woman when you go to Heaven. If you're a bad ally, you'll have to stay trans :(
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>>8993165
I'd done that too with my wife, but people probably see me as a chaser too. I've helped her with fashion, hair, makeup,skin care and nails . What would be a chaser anyway? I like women regardless of what's down there.
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>>8992764
>It's a consequence of the west having no third gender
Third gender is cancer. It's dalit tier, hardly an acceptable social position. I am so glad we don't have that garbage in the west.
The third gender idea isn't as much of a thing as some people think anyway. Thai mtfs are legally male, for example, and cannot legally change sex. ftms seem to be invisible there and can't change sex either. From what I've been able to read mtfs in Thailand aren't any different from anywhere else and want to be seen as legally and socially female. The status quo is not acceptable to them.
Just drop the third gender nonsense. No one wants it,
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>>8993184
>t. i don't have a argument but im still gonna give you a (you)
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>>8993201
*I've
Fucking hell
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>>8993189
>ally
>to cis women
wtf?
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>>8992731
Yes! I'm Q here and I resisted having any thoughts because of Caitlin Jenner and all those weird trans in the media. But most of the mtf on this board seem level headed.
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>>8993146
I only know the first two
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>>8993201
pretty much. I loved her before i knew she was trans and I love her afterwards. Im bi/pan so it just honestly doesnt bother me. i love her for who she is not whats in her pants or what shelooks like.
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>>8993146

It would be the same if you dated someone in the military.

>>8993215

>But most of the mtf on this board seem level headed.

Huh, really?
>>
>>8993219
Same here. I've been dating her and married her before she said she was trans. She was just really androgynous at first. I've been with her through the best and worst, eight years of marriage. She's such a joy to be around. Someone said a lot of trans women are so hostile and mean, but she's always been so sweet and chill.
>>
>>8992322
Don't care they're just people and idgf about ppl so my Fucks are yknow not given
>>
>>8993237
>and married her before she said she was trans.
How did she come out about it?
>>
>>8993236
>compering serving your country with a mental illness
you disgust me
>>
>>8993237
Do the two of you have kids?
>>
>>8993237

Are you bi? How were you not bothered?

>>8993253

Your low IQ disgusts me. We're talking about esoteric terminology. Have you heard the fucking acronyms, words, and phrases that people in the military use? Trannies probably don't even compare.

Leave before you disgrace your miserable intelligence further.
>>
>>8993246
She started to talk about girly things more often and would ask if she would make a cute girl. Sometimes she seemed a little jealous when I would dress up or receive girly gifts from my family. I could see it on her face. One day she just broke down crying and said, if she could pass and cute and said I should just get a real man. That I deserved a real man and not a "freak". I hugged her a lot and said I'd always love her no matter what and that I did she her as female and imo, she's a real cutie.
>>
The behavior of MOST MTFs is completely creepy and bonkers. A combination of depression, low self esteem, and a hyper desperate need to be IN on whatever girls thing you're doing is a recepie for some Watamoe like fucked up shit.

But to be perfectly fair, there's a hell of a lot of fucked up insane natal women as well who do the exact same sort of shit. I'm not sure if this should be counted as good thing or not.

>>8992566
>>8992475
The female social hierarchy isn't nearly so clean cut and simple anon. If you can't handle the cattiness, you had better just stay out of the alley.

And don't feel so bad. Lonely spinsterhood is as stereotypically female as it gets.

>>8992583
I think the worst is the quantum mechanical lesbian MTF hons who simultaneously won't accept a no because you're exclusively straight, with a no because you're exclusively gay.

>>8992642
>Do you play along out of fear or pity?
Even if someone is some sort of hideous mutated freak, regardless of the Trans issue, I think being a good person means a certain level of respect. I think that would be true even if I believed that they were all nothing but mental cases.

>>8992704
Think of it how actual japanese people react to weeaboos.
>>
>>8993266
I guess I'm bi. Men are ok I guess, but I really like women. I was afraid that our marriage wouldn't work at first, but things went really good.
>>
>>8993236
I know that must be funny, saying mtf here are more "normal" or something. But try looking at it from the outside...I'm Q and was resisting questioning for a long time. A lot of that was seeing crazy looking trans like Caitlin Jenner or Laverne Cox and being really put off. That and the whole tumblr culture. An mtf on this board told me she thinks trans is a mental illness, which made me much more accepting of it. There's more self awareness and less delusion. It's the delusion and the anger and the stereotypes that prevent more acceptance of trans. Even those who might question themselves otherwise...
>>
>>8993272
Does she pass? How is her voice?
>>
>>8993258
We don't have any, but I wouldn't mind. We've had lots of unprotected sex, but nothing. Then we found out that she might also be intersex because she has all the traights. Then again about the sex thing, I haven't really thought about it since we hardly use her penis.
>>
>>8993295
She likes penetrating you with her penis? How very feminine.
>>
>>8993288
I think she passes. Random strangers have called her she and her, even when she wasn't dressed up or before when she was in boymode. Umm, she's not too tall. She's 5'9 while I'm 6ft. She has a soft round face, big breasts natural, wide hips and a big round butt. That was her body before she came out. Her voice is pretty neutral souding.
>>
>>8993304
When she presented as male she tried to, but was way too small. It shouldn't even be called a penis. Now I do the penetrating. I'm always on top of her desu.
>>
>>8993286
I can understand being put off by Caitlyn, but Laverne Cox? What's wrong with her?

>An mtf on this board told me she thinks trans is a mental illness, which made me much more accepting of it. There's more self awareness and less delusion. It's the delusion and the anger and the stereotypes that prevent more acceptance of trans.
This, I can totally understand. What really bugs me are those trannies who put their trans identity front and center, but at the same time demand to be treated exactly as a cis woman in all respects. Like, do these people not realize the huge conflict of interests they're creating?
>>
>>8993314
Also, she's thought about srs but she might be too small and it's a little scary
>>
>>8992733
Eastern MTFs use curses on normies if they don't let them dance eh? It seems like we still have alot to learn.
>>
>>8993253
>servin' muh country

Joining the military takes a lot of resolve, commitment, and what I suppose can loosely be described as "courage" as well, but can we stop pretending like it's this really selfless and noble thing? It's actually a pretty selfish and narcissistic move. When you brag about "serving your country", what you're really telling people is, after high school you decided to become a contract arab-killer because you thought you were too good to get a real job.
>>
>>8993365
This is why I'm a Wiccan. I want to be the magic tranny.
>>
>>8993399
>T.treehugger
>>
>>8992322
At that same point, what do y'all cis (male and female included) see in FTMs?
>>
>>8993460
Met only a few.

Either super butch lesbians, or proto chads. Some completely nerdy sperglords aspiring to be chads.

Either way, generally more laid back than than the MTFs, with less desperation to get into whatever I was doing, or into me.

In general, they take a firm no, I don't want to have sex with you a lot better than many natal males.

When I'm trying to get them to compete with each other or fight over me or something like that, they don't quite do it the same way natal dudes do, which seems odd, but not a really big deal.
>>
>>8992622
>and they're actually fine with being called ladyboys

yeah dumbass because they want your money, they dont actually call themselves that
>>
>>8993286
I don't think it's a mental illness per se, although I think there could be numerous causes, but I do think Caitlin Jenner is ridiculous person and the 37 genders types from Tumblr calling themselves "gender terrorists" aren't really helping us.

Those people made it hard for me to accept myself. What's wrong with Laverne Cox?
>>
>>8993560
Cox advocated on behalf of an incarcerated serial killer of women who decided he was now himself a woman and so should be moved to a women's prison.
>>
>>8993560
>i hate my actual self
>until i get drugs and surgery galore
>not a mental illness

ok bud
>>
>>8993583
Or perhaps not a serial killer, but the man raped and murdered an 11 year old girl.
>>
>>8993583
>>8993589
Being convicted of a crime means you deserve to be a woman in a man's prison and get misgendered?
>>
>>8993611
He's just a man in a man's prison. The safety of women in prison is more important than the whims of a child killer.
>>
>>8993611
TERF justice.
>>
>>8993583
>>8993589
gotcha

>>8993584
I don't hate myself as a person though. I just have gender dysphoria. I don't hate my personality or anything.
>>
>>8993640
>The safety of women in prison is
irrelevant since they're criminals.
>>
If you want any more proof that MTTs will always be male, look at all the autistic black-and-white thinking and lack of empathy in this thread.
>>
all the mtf i know are batshit crazy and invite drama and try to queen bee, while most of the ftm i know are generally some of the most chill and kind folk

i don't get why my experience has been this way, I wish it wasnt so one sided.
>>
>>8993640
>The safety of women is prison is
irrelevant because all genders are equal am I right
>>
>>8993746
>you are male because you lack empathy
>you fucking autists
Hmmmm....
>>
>>8993852
I meant this terf >>8993838
>>
>>8993521

>When I'm trying to get them to compete with each other or fight over me or something like that

Teach me.

t. MtF
>>
>>8992944
Lol how the fuck is disgust "better" than hatred? They are symbiotic emotions you dumb bitch. This has to be bait.
>>
>>8993280
>But to be perfectly fair, there's a hell of a lot of fucked up insane natal women as well who do the exact same sort of shit
Are there really? Why do people shit on trannies for doing this so much then? Why not point this out more?

Like me as an insane low self esteem tranny, if I hear that doing this makes me a "bad woman" my immediate thought is "oh, I'm not really a woman" which only drives me deeper down into depression. But if it's just a human thing then it's something to be overcome..
>>
>>8992583
i mostly agree with this poster. i feel the straight MtFs are definitely the most similar to actual females, the transbians are extremely creepy and perverted most of the time

i have 2 transbian friends, and while i do enjoy them as people, they definitely are as perverted as typical males, one is worse than the other, but they're by far more perverted than most females i have met

they're also the most loud and annoying bunch of the entire lgbt spectrum, anything that disagrees with their opinion is wrong and TERFy

see below for an example:
>>8992829

their whole mentality of "if you don't accept me as 100% cis female and sleep with me you're transphobic" is why i'm getting tired of them in our spaces
>>
>>8994482
Bisex tranny here. I have a cis lesbian boss, and she is extremely pervy in how she cracks jokes. I have a bi coworker who is more femme who also cracks pervy jokes and literally belches to try to fuck with you. If a SJW worked here it would be a sexual harassment lawsuit waiting to happen.
>>
>>8992666
Same tbqhon Satan

T. Bi mtf
>>
>>8994482
I'm not even surprised that yet another cis terf misrepresents my point. I NEVER said "if you don't accept me as 100% cis female and sleep with me you're transphobic". In fact, I specified that I never used the word "transphobic" at all.
>>
>>8994492
oh yeah, there's no denying some women can be creeps as well, but it's A LOT less common for cis girls to be creepy than trans

>>8994515
i love how the TERF argument is thrown around endlessly because someone doesn't agree with your opinion, so male
>>
>>8992322
I hang around a discord that had a lot on mtfs in it and Jesus Christ they're all walking memes. I'm hoping its just an age thing because they're all very young 20's and not a representative of trans in general. Id like to talk with more older tranners and see if theres a difference.
>>
>>8994531
Oh yeah, it's less common for cis women. However, you are still a piece of shit for singling out and misgendering trannies for this behavior.
>>
>>8994533
Sure, I'm nearly 25. Post some contact?
>>
>>8994543
I mean in a group casual setting not like one on one sorry.

Would be nice If there was a 25+ lgbt discord
>>
>>8994540
>males being creepy and perverted

but you're the bad one here!
>>
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penis envy vs venus envy, nuff said

May I suggest not chilling with cis females, you're like a wigger trying to get into the Crips, it just doesn't work.
>>
>>8994550
Sure. If it's helpful my experience with irl trannies is that they are all pretty chill with diverse backgrounds, interests, and careers. 4chan and discord is just a honeypot for people in trouble
>>
You’re all just ladyboys to me :3
>>
>>8994482
>their whole mentality of "if you don't accept me as 100% cis female and sleep with me you're transphobic" is why i'm getting tired of them in our spaces

Straight tranny here, I think trans lesbians are gross and give us all a bad name, too.

Cis lesbians and trans straight women need to think of a solution to our "transbian" problem that mutually benefits both parties. What if we lobbied lesbian advocacy groups to change the definition of "lesbian" to "cis women attracted to other cis women"?
>>
>>8993611
He's a sociopath who only came out as "trans" because he wants easy access to women, this is exactly the sort of thing TERF's love, and what actual trans women should be fighting against.

You think you're an advocate, but really you're just proof that gatekeeping wasn't such an awful idea.
>>
>>8994589
What if you hate makeup and dont wanna wear it?
>>
>>8994403
90% of female socialization is learning how to get along with people you don't like. Women are cooperative and conflict-avoidant on average.

If you want to be accepted as a woman in a cisnormative society, here's a handy tip: Maybe don't call every woman who disagrees with you a "dumb bitch."
>>
>>8994620
>Women are cooperative and conflict-avoidant on average.
Don't you see the double standards though?

>cis woman is combative and conflict-seeking
>"She's empowered!"
>trans woman is combative and conflict-seeking
>"Haha she's a man! Why so mangry?"
>>
>>8994531
>i love how the TERF argument is thrown around endlessly because someone doesn't agree with your opinion, so male
This, desu. Muh everyone is a radical feminist if they don't like us trannies.
>>
>>8994647
And the lack of ability to nuance seems like the -tism.
>>
Pointing out any flaws in transideology makes you a TERF
>>
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Pre everything transbian here. Don't hate ladies pls.
>>
>>8994653
>le autism meme :^)
You stop that.
>>
>>8994557
>VenusEnvy

I think I just found my new Twitch handle.
>>
>>8993038
>REEE TERF TERF TERF
Protip, most men are "terfs" too. Except they don't really care about feminism, they just hate trannies.
>>8993044
Honestly I only find transbians disgusting because they make the least effort at being women. The rest are okay, but in general trannies give some sort of uncanny valley feeling. Like they're girls.. but something's a little off.
>>8993062
Yeah I know most of you aren't like that. That one girl is just stupid as fuck though, acting like women being polite is evil.
>>8993365
They're auspicious.
>>8994403
They are not symbiotic emotions you fucking autist. I am disgusted by certain foods, that doesn't mean I hate them and get angry when I see one.
>>
lol yall got taken for a ride
>>
>>8994690
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Womb_and_vagina_envy

Womb envy: The cause of misogyny and even male achievement?
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0277539511000252
>>
I'm cool with trans girls, I'd consider fugging one if she was cute and had a neovag. Dilation sounds like typical mushy lesbian cuddle-sex to me.
>>
>>8994698
>Protip, most men are "terfs" too.
[citation needed]
>>
>>8994742
>Womb envy: The cause of misogyny and even male achievement?
Is penis envy the cause of feminism then?
>>
>>8994603
If I'm a trans lesbian who's just starting to get involved in LGBT circles, is it a good idea for me to pretend that I'm bisexual? Will cis lesbians and other trans people hate me less if they think that I'm also attracted to men?
>>
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>>8994915
>is it a good idea for me to pretend
>>
>>8994698
Pretending like "ohh I'm just disgusted by you!" is somehow better than "I hate you!" is laughably dumb, and hatred and disgust are definitely strongly linked emotions, read some psychology sometime.
>>
>>8994959
If people punish you for what you are, pretending to be something else is the right idea.

Are you opposed on principle to stealth too?
>>
>>8994808
the only reason lesbians get targetted for this trans inclusion meme is because as women we are socialised to be accepting, the transwomen pushing for it have male socialisation and give off the "just accept it or we'll get mad". why do you think cis gay dudes literally laugh in the faces of FtMs when they attempt the same, because men don't listen to women
>>
>>8994959
Isn't that sad? That this is supposedly a community where you don't have to pretend to be "the right" sexuality and if you don't you'll be ostracized and/or punished. This is why LGBT as a whole is a cruel joke.
>>
>>8994632
i'm a cis female and agree to an extent, it's more due to how many trannies are conflict-seeking

i joined a trans discord once and it was literally like a bunch of men discussing politics, while there are always exceptions, females really do not communicate in the way transwomen do
>>
>>8994993
>female victimhood TERF meme
>>
>>8993044
not op but i don't find trans people disgusting per se, it's more their attitudes and entitlement. a 35 year old transbian who has been on hrt for 3 months will become irrationally upset when they aren't viewed as women and welcomed into lesbian spaces
>>
>>8994993
This isn't really how the world works.

Generally, cis gay men do listen to the concerns of FtMs in terms of inclusion; they allow them in gay spaces with no fuss, and do not harbor resentment or distrust for them. They do not post routine abusive language or gather in online strongholds to talk about how pathetic and unmanly FtM's are.

Neither FtM's nor MtFs suggest that they must be forced to date them outside of a few insecure ego fueled jerks, and both of those ideas are laughed at.
>>
>>8995002
>women are interested in politics
"it's literally like a bunch of men, females really do not communicate that way"

Feminists would be the first to condemn such sentiment if ti was expressed by a man about cis women, but here you are as a cis woman saying exactly the same about other women in an attempt to shame them into conformity and patriarchal standards of femininity.
>>
>>8995039
join a few female spaces and you'll realise how true that statement is
>>
>>8995020
well you see the difference is

FtM: can i please be included in your spaces?

MtF: include me in your spaces or i'll kick off about it
>>
>>8995009
I mean, not that you or the queer community are intrinsically at fault, but what you're talking about is a somewhat larger problem with the concept of "safe spaces" overall. The fact of the matter is, trans women who are passable and mentally well adjusted aren't going to be looking for emotional support or a sense of community in lgbt spaces, only older trans women and unpassable trans women as a whole will.
>>
>>8995058
FtM's don't really have anything to kick off about from gay men. Lesbians have a history of hostility to MtF's, it's just a different situation.

I do agree with you though that transwomen really need a mass fucking xanax dose + therapy session
>>
>>8995049
I've just seen it in action right here, thanks to your hypocrisy.
>>
A question from a transbian to all cis females who hate us: how do I improve my standing in your eyes?
Before you ask, no, I'm not perverted (openly at least), and I'm not making any advances on cis girls, because I have panic attacks when I talk to them.
>>
>>8995095
Just a reminder that 4chan is not an accurate reflection of real life. RL lesbians might not have sex with you, but they probably won't hate you. After all, you're not bi, so it's ok. Don't worry so much about RL lesbians, they're not as violent as 4chan users.
>>
>>8994992
>Are you opposed on principle to stealth too?
That's not really the same thing. The purpose of "stealth" for trans people, is to avoid discrimination, prejudice, assault, etc. from straight cisgender people in everyday society.

If you're hiding who you are and staying closeted in an LGBT space, doesn't that kind of defeat the purpose? And isn't it going to be a bit awkward when someone inevitably finds out that you're only pretending to be attracted to men?
>>
>>8995063
while you're right, it isn't our responsibility to provide that, especially at our own discomfort
>>
>>8995091
there is no hypocrisy you annoying tranner, be gone
>>
>>8995095
there really aren't many cis lesbians who "hate" transbians, not willing to date, have sex, or even the willingness to include in ALL female spaces doesn't equate to hate
>>
>>8995133
>>8995164
Can't you just answer the question?
This thread is full of posts talking about how "creepy" we are. I merely want to know what's wrong.
>>
>>8995095
if you want to be accepted by women as close friends you have to bring some utility to the table. you have to assist in their social standing, entertain, be attractive, so on

I have only ever met one woman who kinda took me under her wing and showed me around the woman world, out of the kindness of her heart, early in transition. I've met tons of guys who gladly wing you but for whatever reason, women are almost never the same way. so you're really on your own if you want to increase your social standing. youtube tutorials help tho
>>
Ok as pre everything transbian I seriously ask: Will I always be hated by cis les and bi women? I am not mangry, I don't want to use my dick or anything, I am just shy and can be socialy akward as fuck - I literally can only function in debates far removed from personal staff.
>>
>>8995183
This thread is for narratives and nothing else.
>>
>>8995039
It's a fact though, that girls are generally taught to listen and be considerate of others' feelings, while boys are taught to assert themselves and talk over people to get respect. Women are taught to be cooperative, men are taught to be competitive. You can't deny that socialization plays a huge huge HUGE role in how you're perceived as "manly" or "womanly", especially as a trans person.

I'm a trans girl and I received a mostly-female socialization, having been raised by a single mom, and I've seen first-hand that there are fundamental differences in how men and women solve problems and relate to others.

If you often find yourself getting into arguments with people, then you should probably look in the mirror and ask yourself if maybe you're the one creating the conflict. Having a boy's socialization makes it hard to be introspective, after all.
>>
>>8995211
admiration as a trans individual who is at least mildly self aware.

she's right in what she says.
>>8995039
if you want to be a woman you really need to learn others have different perspectives and it's absolutely their right to have, and you can't challenge everybody on it. to be honest even males know this, you just seem like an argumentative type of person
>>
>>8995183
if you don't understand what being "creepy" entitles then this is a prime example of why we don't want you in our spaces.
>>
>>8995211
the point the poster was making is that a cis woman who is competitive and asserts their interests furtively (and I have met many of these), would generally not be attacked and othered by adult cis women. trans women are held to a double standard in that regard.

is encouraging trans women to unlearn male socialization a good thing? no idea really, that's a really complicated topic. definitely for passing, it's a good thing. the double standard is still there though!

it's a symptom of transphobic hostility.
>>
>>8994603
Every time we lesbians try to do anything they call us TERFs.
>>
>>8995264
>person posts about severe social anxiety and wanting to fit in
>you attack this person for having social anxiety and wanting to know what you're talking about
Yeah I don't think you're even a female.

Daily reminder that this board is infested with a few male turds who like to abuse trans women, and are so pathetic and creepy in their duration of stay that they know impersonating cis women is a great way to do that.
>>
>>8995271
it's a double standard but if you want to join the club you've got to play by the rules
>>
>>8995283
no, not really. I haven't worn makeup a single time in my life, dress lazy as fuck and girls hang out with me and period talk and all that garbage all the time.

most young women also aren't gonna call you a man or creepy if you display male socialization, they'll just think you're an odd square
>>
>>8995271
Because
1. Cis women who have male characteristics do not need to prove that they are women. They are born women so any behavior that comes from them is not a reflection of their gender.
2. Transwomen were born men and socialized as men. If you behave in a masculine way you will be looked at with suspicion by us because there's absolutely no way to discern if that's just a one-off trait of yours or its because you are a biological male.

I think you know the answer to this you just don't want to admit it.
>>
>>8995312
>If you behave in a masculine way you will be looked at with suspicion by us because there's absolutely no way to discern if that's just a one-off trait of yours or its because you are a biological male.
aka transphobia
>>
>>8995316
aka reality
>>
>>8995320
so because some shitty behavior is the norm (in your mind) it shouldn't be called out or ridiculed for what it is?
>>
Transphobia = common sense now I guess
>>
>>8995316
it's not transphobia lol, the poster gave a completely rational explanation and all you do is just throw the phobia card around, surprised you didn't add the TERF insult as well

you aren't going to get your own way by throwing your toys out the pram, perhaps try to listen to what we are saying because the way you're acting just makes it worse for yourself
>>
>>8995316
But what is masculine behaviour for real? I'm not like Butler fan? But beside women generally being more carring/nurturing and men more providing/protecting are there any significant differences? I mean is middle class american family only way to understand gender relationships and behaviours?

I grew up in rural and bit conservative enviroment but my mom is still stem professor, and my grandad never watched sports and no one ever blinked an eye.
>>
>>8995271
>a cis woman who is competitive and asserts their interests furtively (and I have met many of these), would generally not be attacked and othered by adult cis women
Well yes, that's certainly true. There's a double standard, and I'm not saying that's a -good- thing. But the double standard isn't going away in our lifetime. When you're %0.3 of the population, you have to pick your battles very carefully.

>is encouraging trans women to unlearn male socialization a good thing?
I see that as a matter of personal choice. Transition is a time for reinvention; you have to decide for yourself who you want to be.
>>
>>8995338
feeling suspicious towards a transgender person because they are transgender isn't transphobia now?

any bigotry has some basis in rational reality. african americans have a high rate of crime, does that mean I shouldn't be dismissive of some racist fuck?
>>
>>8995329
It's not shitty behavior. Expecting us to bend over backwards for you despite making little to no effort at presenting as a woman is shitty behavior. Fuck off with your victim complex.
>>
>>8995359
asking you to maybe consider why teasing trans women for being interested in politics is asshole behavior, is not asking you to bend over backwards, you twat
>>
>>8995353
Let's rephrase that to what it really is:
Feeling suspicious towards a biological male because they display masculine characteristics and behave in a male way but wants to be considered a woman is PERFECTLY NORMAL because they are not actually biological females and so there's no way to tell if they are really the woman they claim to be.
>>
>>8995345
it's not so much to do with your hobbies and professions as the way you come across.

I feel the MtF vs FtM is a good example to use, the MtFs are far more aggressive in their quest for inclusion, throwing around insults and slurs when they aren't agreed upon, demanding access to every female space with little regard to how females may actually feel, because men only care about themselves.

obviously this isn't true in all cases, i've met MtFs who came across as very female-socialsed, but the majority aren't.
>>
>>8995364
I wasn't the one who said that thing about politics. And no one is teasing you, jesus christ. She just said that the way they talked wasn't the way females talk. Which is true and it's not meant to be mocking.
>>
Hey, this is totally off-topic, but I've been wondering.

Is "cis" pronounced like siss or sizz? I've never heard anyone say it out loud :s
>>
>>8995375
Ok that make actual sense, thanks :)
I am really not like that, much to shy and scarred of everything.
>>
>>8995375
+

i've seen FtMs display similar behaviours, but in my limited anecdotal experience the painfully obvious male socialisation is very rampant in MtFs, and the female socialisation is pretty clear in FtMs
>>
>>8995379
yes you are right, i wasn't mocking anyone, just pointing out the topics of discussion were typically different from casual female ones. this isn't including transition related topics
>>
>>8995382
I always thought it was 'kiss' until I saw the 'CISsie' epithet, then I figured it was 'sis'.

Knowing my luck, it's pronounced fluffenschlagen or something.
>>
>>8992322
I have a MtF friend. She's probably more feminine than me and takes care of herself more.
I literally can't into makeup and if I ever needed any help I would probably bother her about it.
Her only two issues are that she's kinda dumb when it comes to mathematics and she has the self esteem of a screwdriver.
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>>8995371
almost any sort of bigotry used to be PERFECTLY NORMAL. people used to think fags are dirt, that used to be normal.

this idea of feeling suspicion towards trans women is literally just transphobia. I am not saying it is not normal, or does not come from some rational fear response. it's still shitty because ultimately these fears and suspicions are not grounded against any legitimate danger. it's just bigotry, I'm sorry it's so difficult to acknowledge that?
>>8995379
>>8995399
the entire thread is talking about whether you find trans women creepy. singling out some weirdo trannies talking about politics in this threadleads to my assumption that they're being viewed as creepy, or other, for it, rather than just being some benign weirdo women.
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>>8992322
Who gives a shit what cis women think? They're just a big of degenerate as we are. Most just lowkey take advantage of people that like them, men and women. I do agree that MtF's need to tone it down a bit though. You don't need makeup and crazy body concealing outfits everyday. Buns and sweats, or skinny jeans and tops is what most cis woman wear unles their going somewhere "special" to them. Also the ridiculous hairstyles need to stop. Cis women don't wear hair styles that they are constantly fixing every 2 secs when there is no wind. Shits just me unrealistic to keep up with all the time.
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>>8995183
Interpretation, sweetheart: if RL cislesbians don't hate you, because you behave like a civilized human being instead of an entitled and impatient asshole, then how can you improve your standing? Well, just go on being a civilized human being. Might not improve much, because your general "standing" wouldn't be different from anybody, but since that's pretty much what you ask for, that shouldn't be a problem.
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>>8995423
>or does not come from some rational fear response. it's still shitty because ultimately these fears and suspicions are not grounded against any legitimate danger
Except there is legitimate danger. Translesbians (not all) are actually creepy and aggressive. If they acted like straight MtF's none of us would have a problem. But they don't.
And the girl talking about politics never said it was creepy, just that they don't speak like women. Those transgirls who talk about politics are actually weirdo benign women. We don't think they're otherwise.
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>>8995538
if someone is acting creepy and aggressive then they are a problem, yes.

you were talking about being suspicious of them if they are masculine though

sounds like "if they dont wear makeup or talk/use the same body language as most females im gonna be suspicious" to me. and your whole tone towards trans women just reeks of a phobic undercurrent, the same one that leads to explosive anger towards trans women, or an overall ridiculing climate

and like talking about trans women being aggressive or trying to barge into womens spaces, to me, literally sounds like some racist fuck complaining about niggers and how they can't stop buying steak with food stamps. can you understand why that is?
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>>8995538
>Except there is legitimate danger. Translesbians (not all) are actually creepy and aggressive.
Funny how TERFs never have evidence of this.
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>>8995582
you can throw your insults around all you want but it's not just one or a couple individuals who think this, the majority of lesbians have had an experience with creepy and aggressive transbians. If you're not one of those then great, doesn't change the fact they exist and exist in numbers
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>>8995749
>the majority of lesbians have had an experience with creepy and aggressive transbians.
It's not an insult to say stop making up lies. If you were right, you'd have already posted the evidence and you TERFs wouldn't be as irrelevant as you are.
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>>8995821
people having a problem with transbians are pretty relevant, why do you think you idiots are raging so bad lmao
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>>8995935
probably all the bitter middle aged jealous bitches saying slanderous things because their sons turned out hotter than they were
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>>8995935
>If you were right, you'd have already posted the evidence
/thread
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>>8995998
>evidence

nigga shut up, everybody knows how creepy and aggressive transbians are, you're not worth the effort of even going on Reddit to find creepy posts

>>8995949
really no one is jealous of you hons
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>>8996049
>"everybody knows" meaning "everyone in my terf circle knows, even though we've yet to meet any tranny irl and all our knowledge about them is based on tumblr"
>still no evidence
Stay mad
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>>8995935
Trans lesbians aren't the only trans people who can be aggressive when they're rejected. Straight men can also have trouble taking no for an answer: https://www.reddit.com/r/actuallesbians/comments/2f8jrp/getting_hit_on_by_trans_men_who_know_im_a_lesbian/
>>
>>8996049
>>evidence
>nigga shut up
Perfect example of TERF thinking.
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>>8995821
>"I had a bad experience with a trans lesbian once"
>"Oh yeah?! PROVE IT!"

This is why feminists hate us.
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>>8996049
i wonder how many terfs had an ex-husband go hon, or a son they raised to be the perfect little feminist hero cut his dick off at 18 and be all 'i'm a girl mommy, will you love me now?'
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>>8996088
all feminists, you mean
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>>8996088
A woman claims to be raped.
You demand evidence and accuse her of lying.
Even if she posts evidence, you just say "reeee not all trans lesbians are like that!"

This is exactly what we mean when we say "male socialization." You hate talking about rape culture and abusive trans women, the same way straight guys hate talking about rape culture and abusive men. You use the same exact silencing tactics that a man would use. I can still respect your pronouns and gender identity, I'm not saying you ARE a straight man, but if it walks like a duck...
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>>8996109
They said the majority of lesbians have creepy experiences with trans people. That's a massive claim.
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>>8996115
I think more often it's either they or their daughter have FTM dysphoria and their method of repressing themselves/gatekeeping their trans son is by blaming nasty men.
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>>8996133
I'm straight MTF and the reason I stopped going to trans support groups is because of creepy older transbians aggressively hitting on me.
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>>8996125
I'm starting to think so. There seems precious little difference between TERFs and actual feminists besides the latter selectively turning off their man-hate out of respect for us that appears only after we reveal we're not cis.

>>8996126
I don't see how you wanting men locked up without trial has anything to do with you having no evidence for your transphobia.
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>>8996126
no-one is denying 95% of trans'lesbians' are in fact just creepy failed men who don't even see themselves as real girls as they wouldn't date another trans woman, but feel entitled to a cis woman's vagina. so many are creepy and entitled, so many of the older ones are/were abusive and used transition as a clean slate from their abusive past. a great deal are just mangry perverts. it doesn't make that transbian couple who love and support each other and are accepted by their local feminist bookclub suddenly straight men. terfs are far from being angels. terfs aren't 100% wrong about everything either. things are nuanced, my dude. chill out
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>>8996057
really no one is mad but you trannies
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>>8996082
comparing trans lesbians to straight men, kek
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>>8996126
>if it walks like a duck
You talk like a TERF and a racialist. Are you going to blurt out, "Do you have a horse in this race, boy?" next.

It is funny how TERFs pretend their way of acting isn't a pseudo-male socialization due to their denial of gender normativity. Your claims are a direct attempt to gain power using masculine means and seizing systems of patriarchy to push down transgender women to favor natal females in a social Darwinist power struggle devoid of morality and meaning. That is male socialized behavior to abuse power, forgo empathy, deny collective unity, and attempt to create divisions.

It isn't that anyone is denying there are creepy transbians; it's that the majority of them are not threats, and the claim being made that they are is a fundamentally transphobic claim that needs to be proven with facts to be accepted. Then again, you don't have facts, because you're arguing as a woman. The one thing male socialized that you are not doing yourself is using facts and evidence to argue your claim. Mostly you're appealing to emotions (female) and abusing fragile people for your own gain (male).

In any case, this is /pol/ shitposting isn't it?
>I can still respect your pronouns and gender identity, I'm not saying you ARE a straight man,
Don't use a false leading statement when you're basically treating all transwomen and transbians and thus abusers/rapists in order to deny their identities. You are barely a woman yourself with how little empathy you can muster, and yes, two can play at that game, TERF.
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>>8996148
>and are accepted by their local feminist bookclub
Kek, because being feminists is what makes you TruTrans.
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>>8996144
>I don't see how you wanting men locked up without trial has anything to do with
LOL, because that's totally how it works.

Keep going though! Keep going through all the straight guy anti-feminist talking points while trying to convince us you aren't a straight guy.
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>>8996148
i wouldnt go to a fucking feminist commie knitting circle because those people are fucking predators, half the lesbian femmes in there end up in domestic abuse shelters

you people are fundamentally untrustworthy manipulators trying to pass the buck and hide your own abusive behaviors by loading the burden on trannies
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>>8996180
>>8996195
>what is a joke
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>>8996210
i responded with a joke wtf...
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>>8996216
sorry hun i guess your subtle humor slipped past my silly girlbrains ;D
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>>8996179
>You are barely a woman yourself with how little empathy you can muster,

Because women are supposed to be empathic and passive, amiright?

You aren't changing anyone's minds and you're reading way too much into what they said. Using TERF as an insult is dumb. The person you're arguing with never said anything that indicated they are any kind of rad fem.

If you're going to critically examine anything take the time to figure out why trans lesbians are regarded as problematic in ways that straight trans women aren't. Hint: it's because learned how to sexualize women through a socially constructed male lens, something that is only shared by straight men. It would be bonkers if *any* population wasn't impacted by that.
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>>8992322
I'm completely fine with MtFs and to be honest I would have no problem with dating one. You guys don't creep me out at all.
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>>8996339
tranner detected
>>
I'm so sorry you all had to see this.
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>>8996252
>Because women are supposed to be empathic and passive, amiright?
I never said passive. I'm being mean to you, and it's not passive. I empathize with your situation, you voluntarily masculinized your behavior to deal with a male-dominated society thinking that men would respect you as more powerful, but it hasn't had a net good result, so you blame trannies for stealing men from you or stealing lesbian partners and allies.

>Using TERF as an insult is dumb.
It is a literal label for feminists who harp on about transgender people, about how they are different. Yet they harp on about this difference while seemingly having convenient answers about transgender peoples' motives and the reality of their day to day lives. If we are so different, why do you think you understand us? The reality is not shocking: you don't know anything about men, transgender people, or yourselves.

>never said anything that indicated they are any kind of rad fem.
Except the catty remark pretending they respect transgender identity while affirming their belief sarcastically that transwomen are just men.
>I'm not saying you ARE a straight man,
Are you so dumb you can't get that this is passive aggressive shit flinging? I guess being shitty is only ok if they agree with you.

>Hint: it's because learned how to sexualize women through a socially constructed male lens,
You are playing the same game as that anon, so I'm going to assume you're samefagging.

>something that is only shared by straight men.
Are there not cis women who share these traits? Are they special because they are natal women, and you're uncomfortable to label as also being abusers? You are essentially saying transgender women are all socialized entirely as men, yes? So why is that cis lesbians have high instances of partner abuse? Isn't that a male socialized and testosterone based behavior?

What little research we have on this topic shows that cis lebsians have much higher domestic abuse rates than most pairings.
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>>8992322
they're a 10 on the creep factor. the very idea of them repulses me.
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>>8996424
hating on trannies doesn't necessarily mean you are a feminist lol
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>>8996424
>is that cis lesbians have high instances of partner abuse?

GONNA NEED THAT EVIDENCE SENPAI
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>>8996468
hating women doesnt necessarily make you a man
>>
>>8996424
it's funny, when i first started reading this post after checking back at this thread i thought...hmm...this reply has such a male aura too it, low and behold, it was written by a male

kekerooni
>>
>>8996476
well no, it doesn't, what's your point?
>>
>>8996471
Violence by an
Intimate Partner
• The lifetime prevalence of rape,
physical violence, and/or stalking
by an intimate partner was:
For women:

- Lesbian – 43.8%

- Bisexual – 61.1%

- Heterosexual – 35.0%

For men:

- Gay – 26.0%

- Bisexual – 37.3%

- Heterosexual – 29.0%

https://www.cdc.gov/violenceprevention/pdf/nisvs_sofindings.pdf

>43.8%
>higher than women in hetero relationships
>>
>>8996479
im a FTM with autism so yeah im male but not by your definitions

nice try tho
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>>8996491
>im a FTM with autism
why are so many FtTs autistic?
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>>8996486
>What little research we have on this topic shows that cis lebsians have much higher domestic abuse rates than most pairings.

incorrect fampai

>bisexuals have the highest domestic abuse percentage
>most bisexuals end up in opposite sex relationships
>>
anyway this thread has gotten boring now so ima peace out. enjoy never being viewed as the gender you're trying to immitate
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>>8996498
lesbians are in second? in a race second is enough to get silver

"most of" the other pairings is literally true, they outperformed all but bisexual women.

nevertheless bisexuals arent straight and thats your fundamental claim here, "bi is just straight"

i get the canned lines now "transgender women are men" "bi isnt real"

care to explain why lesbians have higher abuse rates than gay men by a huge margin then? im guessing you wont respond
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>>8996507
lern 2 spel, u fagot
>>
>>8996424
>I empathize with your situation, you voluntarily masculinized your behavior to deal with a male-dominated society thinking that men would respect you as more powerful, but it hasn't had a net good result, so you blame trannies for stealing men from you or stealing lesbian partners and allies.

I'm trans mtf ya goober. Just sick to death of trans women telling cis women they can't criticize trans lesbians.
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>>8996495
why are all mtfs autistic?
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>>8996508
Because men are far less likely to report abuse. Fucking duh.
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>>8996531
I was just fucking around because it was funny. You seriously are insecure if you think transbian hons have any meaningful effects in thew world. If you worry about hons embarrassing and making transwomen look bad, then you're probably a hon and preoccupied with guilt by association.

Otherwise, who fucking cares? Honestly, this predatory shit does happen, but it's not confined just to transbians, it's endemic to every sexuality and gender identity across the board.
>>
>>8996539
But feminists can't admit that because it throws their alternative statistics into questionable status.
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>>8996554
I am starting mtf attracted to women and this thread made me cry. Like trowing all my insecurites back at me. And I am not predatory, I am shy, tender and emotional. But everything that fill my dysphoria is thrown back at me..fml
>>
>>8996624
If you are not predatory and you aren't a creep then you have *nothing* to worry about. It's ok to be part of a community, even if that community has issues.

You can be a beautiful soul regardless of what you are and who you are attracted to. Big hugs.
>>
>>8993838
i dunno, the total hysterics, drama, and bitching in this thread makes me think they pass pretty well!
>>
This thread is a dumpster fire jesus chirst.
>>
>>8996650
Don't you get it? She's lived as a boy all her life, is just starting transition, and faces all this male hate, "transbians are men", "creepy man", etc, literally the nasty insults she knew she might be subjected to as a boy, and likely was as a dysphoric transbian egg, and she comes here to a trans board and finds the exact same attacks chasing trans people despite transition. How is that going to make her feel? That she might be a girl now but she's still subject to all the stigma given to a man.
>>
>>8996508
nice putting words into my mouth lmao

nobody said bisexuality isn't real, just that the majority of bisexuals end up in hetero relationships

but you're right transgender women are biologically men, bisexuality is definitely real though
>>
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>>8996624
Yeah, this thread really went downhill once the actual TERFs started showing up. :/

Don't let the stereotypes get to you. All of the trans lesbians I've met have been wonderful people, and our community wouldn't be the same without you.
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>>8996695
saying you're a girl doesn't make you one

and this isn't a trans board, its LGBT, but like everything you trannies want to be the centre of attention
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>>8996695
>She
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>>8996712
>complains about exclusionary
>uses a "down with cis" image

do you realise how retarded you all sound ?
>>
>>8996713
what fucking discussion can you have about being lgb? at least when you're trans you can discuss transitioning, if you're gay you can talk about... slutting it up on grindr?
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>>8996718
Hm? I didn't even notice the "down with cis" shirt, lol, it's just a cute picture I found. Don't take it so seriously!!
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>>8996733
i genuinely can't tell if you're serious or just trolling
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/lgbt/ and their damn acronyms what does tttt and TERF mean
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>>8996738
there's a reason its /tttt/ honey
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>>8996747
it's LGBT, get over it honey

shit like this just makes people hate trannies more

>but muma why does everyone hate muh i do nuffin rong, fukin TERFS
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>>8996762
sure thing hon :)
>>
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>>8996708
>the majority of bisexual WOMEN end up in hetero relationships
FTFY
bisexual men are pretty much all just closeted gays
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>>8996762
>shit like this just makes people hate trannies more
you cant possibly escape your own confirmation bias, anything transgender people do will reinforce your hatred. truth is you chose to hate people and cant control yourself since making the choice to begin

why the fuck would anyone care about your opinion if its just set in stone autism that cant be shaken up
>>
>>8996762
Nigga it's motherfucking /tttt/!

Moot originally created this board as a containment board for all the trans/trap content that was all over all the other boards. He simply made it an all inclusive board at the last minute for fuck knows what reason. Fact of the matter is, this is our board, not yours. Back of the bus with you cis bitch.
>>
Considering how many bait threads get made every single hour and how much /pol/ etc shit on here daily I find it hard to believe there's more than one or two cis women in this thread.
>>
>>8996695
Thanks for kind words. Thread seems death but I will try to respond anywhere. I think peeps have no idea how it could be growing up transbian in eastern europe, while being born in early 90ies. You didn't have information avaible and basically things you heard about trans people were: old Jerry Springer show, some cheap jokes ''it's a dude in the movies'', comedians in drag (mostly straight guys making fun of women) and so on. Then you hit puberty and have no idea at all what is going on, wishing to be girl, attracted to girls. Then come early 2000 and you heard something about it, which is story about trans girls claiming since 4 she is a girl to everyone, attracted to boys, allways very feminine. While I think I got pretty emotional and feminine personality, my hobbies aren't like that, I'm a nerd and music fan, and you are confused more. You don't fit there either, living in macho culture you make many feeble attempts to fit (looking at old pics is cringy af) and go into hardcore repression mode, get a gf, you are attracted to them so it make sense. You don't care about your body and come with rationalisations like all straight man don't like their bodies and looking at their dicks, I want to be female cause I love them so much etc. List of excuses is endless, you put on a show for everyone, and to protect yourself, be affraid to look for info etc. Dysphoria get worse and worse till you broke down, spending nights reading about this stuff while crying and chainsmoking. You hurt your girlfriend, become affraid of ''friends'' or better drinking buddies and so depressed that you lie in bed.

http://www.avitale.com/developmentalreview.htm If I only would have have this to read in high school or at least when I was 18, but stars weren't in my favour. That's why this thread hurt me so much.
>>
>>8996355
No. It's for the best. Anon wanted to see the forces at work. Well, here's living proof right in the thread.

>>8994411
>Are there really? Why do people shit on trannies for doing this so much then? Why not point this out more?
>Like me as an insane low self esteem tranny, if I hear that doing this makes me a "bad woman" my immediate thought is "oh, I'm not really a woman" which only drives me deeper down into depression. But if it's just a human thing then it's something to be overcome..

Natal women who are super clingy and try to wedge themselves everywhere, and throw emotionally unstable tantrums get ostracized, and mostly ignored as well.

Psycho turbo bitch in this thread doesn't get to with us on appletini night, but my psycho turbo bitch cousin or my aunt doesn't get to go either. Or maybe she DOES go out with us once, but that doesn't mean that she ever gets to go again. And that has NO relation to whether she's a real woman or not.

It's also a question of numbers and degrees. There's a hell of a lot of lonely, depressed natal uggo spinsters, but even they aren't suiciding at the rate transwomen are.

>>8994338
This is a terrible thread to try to learn this, but essentially you've got to catch up on all the social rules you missed in Junior High.

Two pointers. You need a solid peer group, preferably the hell away from the P flag meeting, and absolutely the hell away from 4chan. Even ugly, unattractive, sexually undesirable women can still have valued social positions with their peers with a good attitude. But that position isn't trying to outbitch the queen bee of the group. It's being a good friend over everything else.

Second is you can still get a guy who has ZERO sexual interest in you to compete for position, or to try to impress a girl he's actually interested in or all sorts of things.
>>
>>8996148
So your saying 95% of transbians aren't even GAMP? Thats absurd! Non AGP non GAMP failed straight men transbians probably exist but they're a minority.
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>>8996849
nah mate, this is an LGBT board hence the name, accept the facts you tranny scum
>>
>>8996846
>why would anyone care about my opinion

maybe because it's shared by most of society? nobody likes trannies except your own kind and over-inclusive sjw

lesbians don't like you
straight men don't like you
gay men don't like you

you're seen as a lesser partner, why would anyone choose to have a trans partner over cis unless they're socially retarded and/or unattractive.
>>
New Thread! >>8998796
>>8998796
>>8998796




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