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http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S002216941730478X#%21

https://www.thegwpf.com/new-study-global-warming-standstill-confirmed-climate-models-wrong/

http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2017/10/10/delingpole-man-made-climate-catastrophe-is-a-myth-more-studies-confirm/

Don't forget to attack the source.
>>
>>186429
it'd be easier not to attack your sources if you'd use reliable and objective sources
>>
>>186429

I came for the science, I left on the short bus.
>>
There's no point debating this anymore

Man made climate change has become a religious cult to liberals. They can't even fathom that they might not be right

It's not their fault though. Man made climate change is one of the key pillars of implementing of communism

The government has to be given full control of all industry, all in the name of doing what is best for the planet. Meanwhile, China and India are freely allowed to pollute as much as they want, while you pay 99% taxes and only government subsidized corporations can operate under the regulations
>>
>>186479
my question always is, what's the end goal? So if man-made climate is super real, and we are all going to die, what's the proposed solution?

I can theorize two options: One, is lay down and die because next year we are going to be skeletons from the burning sun. Or, second option is that we tax anything and everything that could possibly contribute to global warming in an effort to curb behavior, which leads to the main issues: Who collects the money and what do we do with it, and when do we stop? What is acceptable levels of global numbers and who gets to make that decision? Do we collect all the money from other countries and then use the US military to enforce these rules?

Nobody talks about the magical end goals, or even brings up the stopping point. I'd love to see (((scientists))) agree on a number, any number for this.
>>
>>186479

You are right, the polarisation is damning, but I came for so some solid peer reviewed research. The sources given are dog shit. Every time my attention is drawn to a story where climate change is not influenced by mankind it always turns out to be an opinion puff piece with nothing in the way of measured observation. However, I keep my mind open.
>>
>>186492

As for China and India? They are living in the shit of their own making with a mandarin class (literally in China's case) hoping to ride the wave through to wealth and prosperity the other side, much as the endless hells of mills in industrial Britain burgeoned into the comfortable life standards and human rights of the nineteenth and twentieth century. Will it work? Fuck knows, but congenital diseases, syndromes and respiratory disorders are skyrocketing, human life is a casual care. The actual infrastructure they are implementing is grossly under spec in all areas as they battle each other to become the controlling super nation in the region. All corners must be cut. They think speed shall be their safety. Their policies of turning an industrial bind eye may lead all their efforts to naught. Maybe man made climate change is not viable, I don't know, but I want to live on a green planet, not stuck in my pod because we cunted the world up to get good share holder value for the relatively brief time it matters. It's like saying Iv'e got a job stabbing myself in the leg, incredibly well paid, people think it may kill me, but fuck em, I dunno. Eventually my leg falls off, I don't die but I must expend more resources than I made stabbing my leg to try and live normally without it. Even if everyone else is making more money than you by stabbing themselves in the leg, it's probably not going to gain them anything in the long run but a butt load of pain and a big bill.

We have to look at the value of our actions, what will eventually pay off best for us and do our best to advise more fool hardy nations. But if they want enough rope, let em hang.
>>
>>186479
the problem is that climate change is real. it's MAN MADE climate change, and that somehow, we are the reason that the icecaps are melting, that is false.

we have been, for the past few thousand years, coming out of the last ice age. And we know for almost certain, that between ice ages, there is a big melting period, until ALL the ice on the earth is gone.

we cant stop that. and any effect we may have is minimal at best, compared to shit like volcanoes, or storms, like the tornadoes we've been having this season, that have completely altered the normal weather patterns for most of the country, prolonging summer.

but liberals grab onto the fact that its real, to push their agenda, despite all the times their predictions of doom and gloom fail, and have absolutely no concern for the well being of the country, and are perfectly ok with other countries surpassing us
>>
>>186494
>>186492
>>186491
nice samefaggery snowflake. Lemme sum up for the rest of /news/.

>MUH JEEEWWWWS
>MUH COMMUNISM
>IT'S ALL LE LIE
>>
you are objectively stupid
>>
>>186491
They could shut down international shipping unless using sails, as 50 cargo ships pollute more than all the cars combined. They could launch a zillion flat satellites to block out the sun. There could be kWh caps for each and every building per month. But no, all the solutions seem to be more different power generation and electric cars.
>>
>>186494

I think the point is that American liberals are

The Paris agreement is a good example of this. Other countries just have to pinky swear that they will attempt to reduce their emissions and pollution, with no actual effort, but the US basically has to subsidize the entire thing.

The net result is that the global pollution barely changes and everyone just pays higher taxes.

There needs to be a better solution to this instead of just virtue signaling and higher taxes
>>
>>186497
Yes, i am the first two posts you list, and I have no idea what you're talking about, you amy have a condition.
>>
>>186504
*may
>>
>>186504
Stay mad stormfag.

>muh jeewwws
>muh communism!
>it's all le lie!
>>
>>186496

Perhaps, I have seen models which seem to suggest we are still exiting the recent ice age, but I'm far more concerned with ambient pollution, rad levels, delocalised mercury depositing, sea acidification, specific and unrecoverable environ decimation etc, than I am with the melting of the icecaps. We can move, we have before, but we need stable environments to move into.

And yes, the liberal jump to back up their positions with unaccredited research is proving to be a massive problem, making themselves look foolish, but more importantly generally discrediting top tier scientific research in public opinion to that of "that bloke down the pub says" level of veracity. One way or another, we're in a big ol' mess.
>>
>>186510

I seriously am not sure if your saying I'm lefty or righty, you appear to be stuck in a meme hole.
>>
>>186513
*you're
>>
>>186502

The US and Europe, but that does appear to be the state of things currently.
>>
>>186512
It's almost like there are groups working to subvert cohesion between Western environmentalist causes.

Now, I wonder. Who stands to gain the most from anthropogenic global warming...? Who stands to gain the most by suppressing renewable energies? Who stands to gain the most by flaunting world regulations on arctic exploration?

Let me tell you this one, it ain't the leafs.

>The results indicate that, in the future, there will be a global net increase in land suitable for crops of 4.7 million km2, from 54.2 million km2 to 58.9 million km2. These figures include land that is both rain-fed and irrigated, and exclude protected areas and dense forest. Large areas of forest were also considered suitable for cropland, but the researchers excluded these from this estimate because of the importance of conserving these to protect ecosystem services, such as carbon storage. Most new land will become available in Canada, China and Russia.

>Total cropland is predicted to shrink across all regions of the EU (including protected areas and dense forest), with the exception of Scandinavian Member States where 0.21 million km2 of land could become available. Across the EU as a whole (excluding Croatia), there may be a total loss of 1.7 million km2. The Mediterranean region of the EU shows a steep decline, with an expected loss of 0.7 million km2.
>>
>>186517

They are certainly factors to consider.
>>
>>186494
Your analogy doesn't work when you consider we all share the same "leg" in this circumstance. Countries that cut back to help the environment will lose out on all the benefits that countries like China will be able to get, but get fucked over by the consequences just the same. Basically, either get paid to stab yourself in the leg or have someone else get paid while they stab you.
>>
>>186429
Thanks fossil shill.

You sure show these climate alarmists who's the boss of humanity.
>>
>>186517
Yet the climate alarmists wanted the death of resource extraction and fossil fuels, along with capitalism.
>>
>>186528
How are you able to post on this board when your head is stuck so deep in the sand?
>>
This post brought to you by Gazprom
>>
>>186529
It's those fucking enviromentalists that wanted to destroy human progress with their doomsday lies.

Oil, gas, and coal will lead us to utopia.
>>
>>186429
You willfully delude yourself with corporatist propaganda packaged as science. You and many more like you do this at the expense of a planet's worth of life. The only life we know of, mind you.

Why?
>>
>>186549
You willfully delude yourself to the Communist narratives of Environmentalism; all of which were lies to kill human progress.
>>
>>186558
>[citation required]
>>
ITT /news/'s favorite anti-communism crusader Cletus trolls some newfags.
>>
>>186528
>>186536
>>186564
>31 posts, 16 posters

sure smells like Russia in here
>>
>>186496
>>186479
>This is your brain on /pol/
Have any of you ever read any science book in your entire life? Or do you just spend all day shitposting on /pol/ while listening to Alex Jones?
>>
>>186558
Da, is good American grammar Ivan.
>>
>>186580

>Anyone that disagrees with me is /pol/ and antiscience
>There are hundreds of genders and all races are genetically identical
>>
>>186496
So after the planet decides an ice age is over, it decides to get hot. That's what you think the science is. I hope you're not American, because everybody already rags on us enough for our education.
>>
>>186585
>racebait asspull
I already knew you weren't smart, but you've now proven to me that you're dumb.
>>
The boards of 4chan are a wondrous microcosm.
>>
>>186589

>communist that denied science calling others stupid
>>
>>186602
You are the one who denies science. You reject the reasonable conclusions reached by the majority of scientists regarding climate change.
>>
>>186588
>muh facts
>>
>>186589
He's right, though.
>>
>>186608
>denying science
As if science is some monolithic Truth. If you think that, you know nothing of science.
>>
>>186429
Man, reliying on those sources are like saying islam is the real true religion becauae an muslim page show studies confirming it.
>>
>>186615
Right regarding what? Equating scientific consensus with SJW bullshit? That's a false equivalency.

>>186616
Science is a rigorous process of proving a point using data and logic. Scientific papers are then peer reviewed. Anthropogenic global warming denial is a minority view among scientists, and for good reason. Under scrutiny, those theories do not hold water.
>>
>>186429
But the study just says that they didn't really find a link between flooding and climate change.

How does that disprove climate change?
>>
>>186429
>Fake news, anything that doesn't agree with me is fake news
Get real, every article denying climate change either misquotes or makes up an interpretation of the data. Have fun calling me a Jew or whatever, hope its not just copypasta from what ever authoritarian told you not to believe in global warming
>>
>>186632

Ask liberals, they're the ones claiming all the hurricanes are the direct result of man made global warming
>>
>>186642

Not an argument
>>
>>186648
Not Anon, isnt that the argument though?
>>
>>186536
Appalachia is looking pretty goddamn grim for a 'Utopia', then.
>>
>>186648

That is the argument, you dumb commie
>>
>>186642
>implying they're wrong

https://insideclimatenews.org/news/06092017/hurricane-irma-harvey-climate-change-warm-atlantic-ocean-questions

Man-made climate change isn't the only cause for tropical storms, but it's a major factor in their development for the simple reason that higher sea surface temperatures make them more likely to occur. Trump can splutter about Katrina all he likes, but it's going to get worse and worse.
>>
>>186501
I wonder if we could put some sort of turbine system into cargo ships so as they sail water would turn the turbines and charge a battery which powers an electric motor. Essentially they would become a mobile hydroelectric dam. Even a small amount of supplemental power would allow for lower fuel usage and less emissions overall.
>>
>>186429
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2007/02/070228-mars-warming.html

Here's a National Geographic article from 2007 (pre Obama) showing NASA's data that Mars is heating up too because the sun is polluting with too many rays, not humans polluting with too many cars.

>>186660
Also, "insideclimatenews.org"? Give me a fucking break with that jokester website.
>>
>>186650
>>186656

You completely ignored all evidence presented in the thread and went straight to HURR DURR LIBRULS

It's not an argument, you're retarded.
>>
>>186588
>So after the planet decides an ice age is over, it decides to get hot. That's what you think the science is.

I think you are the only retard here.

scientists have been studying this shit for decades, and we KNOW FOR A FACT that we have had a few ice ages, and that between each one, there was a melting period. we know of at last 5 major ice ages. And we know that during interglacial periods, ice melts and the earth warms up.

No, it doesn't happen because "HURR THE EARTH JUST DECIDES IT"

The Earth is basically a living organism. and it is affected by both it's own changes, such as weather and natural events, such as volcanic eruptions, and from outside causes such as solar activity, radiation, etc.

and this shit comes and goes. In fact, we have even had "mini" ice ages. Periods of time where we didn't go full "day after tomorrow", but there was a significantly marked cooling of general temperatures, which allowed for glacial ice to grow. We had a mini-ice age between the 17th and 19th centuries.

And since the 20th century, we seem to have started warming again.
>>
>>186690
what I always find confusing is that there were holes in the ozone layer, right? Even back in the 80's, maybe the 90's and such. Big major holes due to too much CO2 or CFCs, and yet here we are, and they are magically shrinking.
>>
>>186690
Few will disagree about the cycles or the fact that the planet is heating, the biggest argument is how much of that heating is man-made (and also, whether or not the man-made contributions are reversible). While that argument is far from settled, it would not be wise to underestimate the damage humans can do. In the span of a few centuries, we've fucked up other parts of the environment far beyond what can be considered natural (plastics/mercury in the ocean, cities like Beijing where the air is so bad people having to wear masks, etc.)
>>
you guys should fear ice ages more than anything

it takes just ONE major volcanic eruption and we'll be back having half of Europe under 100 meters of ice

https://www.iceagenow.info/yellowstone-supervolcano-trigger-ice-age-far-faster-anyone-thought/
>>
>>186429
all these arguments on climate, here's my pov, i think that we are just in-for-a-run from earth's natural cycles. Although, our impact have spped'ed up the warming none the least, to how much extent we not sure, as earth is warming itself too, earth will not go away, it will undoubtly continue its cool-warm cycle until an external threat comes into play. maybe and asteroid. maybe aliens. or maybe... its really us humans.
>>
>>186690
>The Earth is basically a living organism

You are full fucking retard and I wish you idiots would stop worshiping the heals of that hack lovelock.
>>
>34 posters, 62 posts

How much shilling can one man do?
>>
I guess the carribean just imagined the increase in storms
>>
This isn't complicated.

If I burn a bunch of deadly chemicals and fill the atmosphere with them you're going to get sick if you breath them in. You might even die and so will other plants and animals.

Never mind if it heats up the atmosphere or not.

And why keep paying the oil companies and electric companies when I could eventually go solar and pay nothing?
>>
>>186719

they are decreasing globally, that's what matters:

http://wx.graphics/tropical/
>>
>>186429
The first source you posted doesn't refute man-made climate change at all. It says that the change in flood frequency in North America and Europe over the past ~100 years doesn't exceed that expected by chance.

The second source also doesn't confirm anything. It claims that a slow in warming between 2000-2016 is still ongoing (they still acknowledge that global temperatures are increasing) because El Nino skewed the temperature results. They show that temperatures haven't increased as much as was previously predicted, not that anthropogenic climate change is a myth.

>OPs reading comprehension
>OPs honesty
>>
>>186722
>go solar and pay nothing?

solar panels don't grow on trees
they require A LOT OF ENERGY to be produced and installed
as of now, we are barely on par with all the energy wasted in the solar industry:

https://news.stanford.edu/news/2013/april/pv-net-energy-040213.html

it's the same with electric cars: the reduction in emissions is NEGLIGIBLE when compared with normal cars:

http://notrickszone.com/2017/07/27/new-study-electric-vehicle-use-does-not-appreciably-reduce-co2-emissions/

you can't escape the principles of thermodynamics: if you don't want the side effects of using energy, you have to renounce using energy.
>>
>>186491
>>>186479
>my question always is, what's the end goal? So if man-made climate is super real, and we are all going to die, what's the proposed solution?
>
>I can theorize two options: One, is lay down and die because next year we are going to be skeletons from the burning sun. Or, second option is that we tax anything and everything that could possibly contribute to global warming in an effort to curb behavior, which leads to the main issues: Who collects the money and what do we do with it, and when do we stop? What is acceptable levels of global numbers and who gets to make that decision? Do we collect all the money from other countries and then use the US military to enforce these rules?
>
>Nobody talks about the magical end goals, or even brings up the stopping point. I'd love to see (((scientists))) agree on a number, any number for this.
> At last some logical question...
>>
>>186616
so how exactly do you distinguish yourself from flat earthers then?
or maybe you are one?
>>
>>186616
Fucking this. Science is a method, not a secret club
>>
>>186727
>use energy to produce something that uses the sun's energy to produce electricity
>use the sun's energy that you collected to make more things that use the sun's energy to produce electricity
What is a positive feedback loop?

>implying that because solar panels aren't fully optimized that we should give up
>>
>>186733
the big hurdle right now is storage
>>
The fight between Climate Alarmists and Fossil Shills are still strong on 4chan.
>>
>>186763
And it seems as though every time this debate comes up, fossil shills get completely BTFO and either move the goal posts or don't realize they lost.
>>
>>186731
Then why are climate change denialists still moaning about super-sekrit environmentalist conspiracies? You said it yourself; science is a method of learning, not an organisation, so why are we not listening to the ample proof that this methodology has shown for manmade climate change?
>>
>>186497
Sounds like you are the triggered snowflake. It seems like daily man made global warming is being debunked.
>>
>>186580
If you understood science you wouldn't be so quick the believe the global warming hoax.
>>
>>186608
There is no consensus.
>>
>>186772
You once again ignore the data you just parrot the same debunked talking points. You are always proven wrong, from the like that Miami would be under water by 2010 to ice less Summers in the Arctic.
>>
>>186776
>If you understood science
Like the minority of scientists in the pay of the fossil fuel lobby?

https://climate.nasa.gov/vital-signs/carbon-dioxide/
>>
>>186685
Right, I should stop relying on primary and secondary scientific literature and get all my info from Breitbart. Gotcha.

Furthermore, shifting the buck to natural climate change isn't doing you any favors, because no one's denying that climate change isn't happening on its own. The problem is that all evidence is suggesting that human intervention is rapidly speeding up this natural phenomenon, in the same way that smoking rapidly or using tanning beds increases your chances of developing cancer, which can also happen naturally. Human pollution doesn't have a neutral effect on our planet, and that's all you have to accept to understand the truth.

Finally, it's interesting that you brought up climate change on Mars, because oscillations in orbit creates different climate patterns to Earth's own. Also, the fact that Trump's appointee to NASA is more eager to acknowledge climate change on Mars than on Earth shows implicit denial, not ignorance.
>>
>>186807
>The problem is that all evidence is suggesting that human intervention is rapidly speeding up this natural
There is ero that shows this. It's all unsubstantiated their and this theories are almost always debunked when the prediction du jour is proven wrong.
>>
>>186681
Drag would kill any power gains while in motion but tidal/wave based power generation was a thing in testing but no idea where it stands now
>>
>>186727
Fuck solar really upped its game from 20 years ago. Maybe another decade to be net positive/profitable
>>
>>186734
Molten Nickle iron battery the size of a house looked promising
>>
>>186496
got a source for that?
>>
>>186429
>Breitbart
Okay sure pal
>>
>>186686
I wouldn't use that word, it's considered a no-no word
>>
>>186502
China and India didn't even commit to reducing gross emissions, just emissions as a fraction of their GDP. Many other nations like Pakistan actually made no commitment at all.

https://www.carbonbrief.org/paris-2015-tracking-country-climate-pledges

>Pakistan – 12/11/15

>Commits to peak and then reduce its emissions. Specific commitments will be made once “reliable data on our peak emissions levels is available”. Includes paragraph on adaptation. Pakistan’s INDC.

A commitment "to peak and then reduce" is literally just the definition of... peak.
>>
>>186429
>>186479
>>186496
>Conservatives Are Complete Morons Who Lack Even A Basic Understanding of Science, More Anons Confirm
>>
>>187206

>t. Person who believes it is perfectly fine to sexual identify as a gender fluid refridgerator
>>
>>187213
>defending climate change denial with racebait
You're only proving him right, but I suppose you aren't even aware of it.
>>
>>186686
What evidence?
>>
instead of repeating vague nonsense about some commie plot, you on the right might start to query just what you're in for due to climate change; likely food shortages on the home front, global instability, increased radicalization, and a massive influx of refugees otherwise.
>>
>>187264
do you really think the western world would let it get that bad? If anything, we'd just glass the absolute shit out of any country that attempts to go into the industrial age so we can just continue. Not that complicated.
>>
>>186726
>>186726
>>186726
/thread




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