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Is attending lectures worth it in math and science? Isn't learning on your own much more effective?
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>>10055328
>being paid to be taught something
>don't show up
>hurr durr college is a waste of money
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Don't show up and blame the professor when you have a C-
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>>10055334
>being paid to be taught something

'Murrica...
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>>10055334
I don't get paid lol?
>>10055340
What does a lecture offer that textbooks don't?
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>>10055364
in theory yes, but soon u will probably find yourself 6 chapter behind with no idea whats going on; currently in that situation with organic chem
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>>10055328
In theory, sure. In practice, lecture holds us accountable so that we actually get things done.
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>>10055334
sometimes the lecture really is fucking useless as the professor just reads off slides and doesn't even work through examples. a lot of those times the opportunity cost of commuting to school and making it to class just isn't worth it when you could have read the chapter in your textbook and done examples in the same amount of time. this should never be the case if you have a competent lecturer, but that is anything but a given
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>>10055383
my prof is what u just described; even though its against school policy he makes attendance mandatory on top of having a chapter due every class. literally flies though a chapter of slides without showing examples or anything
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>>10055328

>Isn't learning on your own much more effective?

Yes, that's how you make A's. Acquire knowledge of the material BEFORE the professor talks about it in class.
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>>10055328
>Is attending lectures worth it in math and science?
Why don't you try it and find out?
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>>10055328
Lecture is just a guide. Learning by yourself is more thorough, but it isn't what is examined.

I went to a school on the quarter system, which gave us 8 effective weeks to cover half a book, or an entire book. University is a time crunch to learn as much material as quickly as possible. That was my experience on the quarter system.
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The only time I have ever found lecture useful is when it is less lecture and more high level seminar. Whenever a lecture ever gets into the real meat of any subject, I personally find it too hard to properly follow the flow the logic and reason at the pace the lecture is given. If you cannot grasp a key point midway through a lecture in the short time it's presented, you'll just be lost the rest of the time.
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>>10055356
>not realizing you’re paying for it with taxes, even if you don’t use it
Hur Europe. Also fuck off back to lereadit with your spacing.
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Most of the time it isn't. Grab a book and go to office hours if you can't do an exercise. Most professors don't give a shit about attendance and are actually pleased that you've taken enough interest in a subject to grab a book about it. This also has the added benefit that they will remember you when a paid research position opens up.
If you have one of those insecure professors who get all flustered because you're not going to class, then don't even bother and withdraw from the group.

>>10055334
>paying to lose two hours of your time
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>>10055497
Pretty much this. The solution though is reading through the slides before hand and acquainting yourself with the material. Trying to comprehend it and then come to the lecture.
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>>10055328
Depends on the lecture, it's about unique insight and problem solving technique, not textbook knowledge. Problem classes are very important.
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>>10055328
Depends on whether the lecturer says important shit or not. One of my current classes has assessment for: lecture content, random fucking anecdotes during the lecture, the practical manual, random anecdotes from only some of the practical tutors and a bunch of random shit not covered in class that we were meant to 'infer'.
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>>10055328

No.
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>>10055328
Yes you dummy
How are you going to get a recommendation out of your professor if he's never seen you a day in their life
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>>10055328
Lectures take less time to learn the same thing and you need the connections to advance your career. But you learn the material much better through self study imo. So do both. That 4 hours of study per hour of lecture rule isn't a meme.
Be a good student anon or your IQ will be called into question.
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attending lectures gets your brain in the groove and thinking about it self consciously.
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>>10055328
Nope, it's good to show up to have discussions with your peers and later on in your studies lectures get more personal as classes get smaller, and you will actually be able to have meaningful conversations with your professors about the theory.
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>>10056753
>How are you going to get a recommendation out of your professor if he's never seen you a day in their life
This as well
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>>10056792
This "meaningful discussion" thing makes no sense to me. Either you're asking about the material which means you weren't paying attention in class or if you do know the material you're asking about things you're going to learn later anyway or are outside the scope of the course. Its really just intellectual masturbation. NPCs that do nothing in class but learn are actually pure genius. I wish I was like that, I'm always the loudest person.
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>>10056832
This is because you're only taking undergrad classes
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>>10055380
>In theory, sure. In practice, lecture holds us accountable so that we actually get things done.

underrated truth
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I once went to class and be the only one there. Everyone else was too lazy to go because it was raining pretty heavily that day. The prof was a sweet old lady and she taught me alone for 2 hours in a huge lecture hall lol. When the final exam came up I only managed to answer half the questions but the prof still gave me an A-. My other classmates got Cs and some even failed. Thank god I went to class that day.
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>>10058681
Based grandma.
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>>10055328
>worth it
What do you mean by "it", Peasant?
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>>10060866
>Peasant
Why the classism?
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>>10055383
its more often than not the case and i immediately drop classes where attendance is strictly enforced by narcissistic midwit insects
>>10060866
noble
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>>10055334
Did you mean "paying to be taught"?
Because I'm certain no one is paying you.
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>>10055328
It is when your grade is slashed 3-5% per absence
Its extra worth it when you get bonus credit for perfect attendence.
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>>10055328
A joke.

t.phd
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>>10061175
Well not OP but I'm being paid for it.
ENS masterace <;^)
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>>10061944
>grade is slashed 3-5% per absence
what the actual fuck, i feel sorry if this is real
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>>10055328
attend lectures and just listen to music and study while you're there. then if you need to talk to your professor about something he can't smugly dab on you and blame your problems on not showing up to class
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Imo, sure, most lectures are ineffective and you might be better off learning on your own. However, there are some extraordinary teachers that make you enjoy learning the content much more. Best example for me is Robert Sapolski's human bio course on Youtube. Learning from him is much better than just reading a book alone.
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>>10062231
I wish i was making this up
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>>10062686
that's absolutely terrible
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>>10062692
If you don’t sign by the minute class starts you are counted absent.
Theres this dude who doesn’t even know about the sign in sheet because hes always there 20 seconds late.
His grade is so fucked by now.
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>>10055364
>What does a lecture offer that textbooks don't?

An idea on what's going to be on the exam.
>be me
>taking biochem
>"Pfff this shit is all review from orgo and bio"
>Professor is this old condescending hag who gets kicks out of kackelling at students that incorrectly try to answer her questions
>Says on first day of class that as long you read the assigned chapters, you should do fine in the course
>Don't really show up to her lectures and just focus on the book and the few presentations she posted online
>a week before exam 1 she posted a study guide (consisting of just the four textbook chapters it will cover, taking up all of one line on the page)
>go to her office hours to ask what the test will be on specifically, as the 4 chapters in total are ~160 pages, and covering a wide range of concepts (with some sections going into detail rants on specific case examples)
>"Anon, how many times do I need to repeat myself? EVERYTHING YOU NEED TO KNOW IS ON THE STUDY GUIDE, you should be grateful because I didn't even have give you that!"
>Exam 1
>no multiple choice, all opened ended questions penned in the bitch's messy handwriting
>questions look like they were worded by a dyslexic, to where you have to read it three times over to understand how the question should be worded to make actual sense.
>see exam grade posted online
>48%
>flip the fuck out, as studied all the material in the book thoroughly
>Confront her about it
>Won't even let me see the graded exam unless a book an appointment to review
>finally looks at exam
>bitch took points of every single answer for, "not answering the question completely", because I answered just the question and nothing more.
>"Anon, one sentence isn't sufficient for an answer"
>Shows me answer
>point out to her that my answer is saying the same thing as hers, but her's goes on to give an example (which the question doesn't specifically)
>"Anon all grades are final, being rude to me isn't going to change this
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>>10056838
I always assume people like OP are talking about introductory classes, since those are the only ones that make sense to skip
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>>10062208
tell us more
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>>10055508
Lmao, so defensive. I'm not the guy you're replying to, but I find it funny that Americans use taxes as an argument all the time when they have some of the highest taxes themselves. It's really icing on the cake to know that around 50% of all of those tax dollars will be blown on some redundant military spending or a drone strike to the middle East.
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>>10062686
"Inner city" school, perhaps?
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Almost anything you could write down in your notes in an undergraduate math lecture is already better written in the book. But exam hints, an idea of what kind of problems the professor likes to assign, and being able to ask for a recommendation make showing up worth it... not to mention you're paying to be there
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>>10063444
Lmfaoo... And just think, black "people" want YOUR tax dollars and to go to school with YOUR children, white man.
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>>10055328
>Show up as needed to keep up with the subject matter.
>When you DO attend, sit down front.
>Make sure anytime the instructor never glances at you and you are daydreaming and looking away, by NEVER taking your eyes off of him.
>Ask at least one question, and make sure it is a question he knows how to answer. When asking your question, stand and state your name.

If you do this, the instructor thinks you are the best student in the class. Enjoy your A++.
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>>10065129
>When asking your question, stand and state your name.
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>>10055383
>the opportunity cost of commuting to school and making it to class
>opportunity cost
somebody's a freshman taking econ 101. You can just say "cost" like the rest of the world.
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lecturers will take you not showing up to lectures personally , especially if you are at a small uni
so if you are a student that generally doesn't do well and needs that 1-2 points to pass, go to lecture

however if you know how to study and are disciplined lectures are a complete waste of time if slides are provided
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going to lectures helps asociative memory
>symbols get stuck in your brain unconciously
>your brain put ideas into social context


the problem is the time you lose if it's a bad professor
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>>10055392
Couldn't agree more. Learnt many math classes this way in undergrad.
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>>10062648
Thanks for bringing that to my attention I've been looking for something like it. It's amazing how much difference an enthusiastic professor makes.
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> biology
> lectures

LMAoa
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>>10062208
>ENS
>not l'X
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>>10055508
>>not realizing you’re paying for it with taxes, even if you don’t use it
I don't pay for it with taxes if I move out of Europe right after though.
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>>10055508
>Uses 200 missiles to bomb empty buildings in Syria
>Each missile coated 1 million dollars
Nice use of your taxes buddy. At least my taxes do something
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>>10066835
>missile-coated money
What has science done?
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>Go to lectures
>People playing games or watching Twitch on their Laptops

Irritates me everytime.
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>>10066883
What is your major?
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>>10055328
Lectures are social events to meet other people and connect with them, go there whenever you can.
Or be like stupid old me and befriend postdocs and doctorate students, while still in undergrad.
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I try to attend even if I feel I don't need to. The structure they add to my day is essential. Same reason I study in proximity to others (Not quite the same thing as a study group), it provides a social environment in which to do work, while providing structure to everyday life.
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>>10062776
This is where you make an official complaint, my man. Have it reviewed by the department, or perhaps by the equivalent of the department of education in your country.
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>>10061175
It applies to me as well since i'm russian
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>>10066883
This.
If your brain isn't going to show up then nor should you.
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>>10055328
Depends on the subject matter, the professor, and how the course is taught.
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>>10055328
I've always made an effort to show up to most of the lectures in all of my classes. I feel like getting that extra reinforcement is worth it. It's also worth it to make sure that your professor knows that you show up and do work for the class. They'll remember you and write you good recommendations later on if you ask them.
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>>10067144
CS
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>>10055328
>Isn't learning on your own much more effective?
Only when the professor believes that to be true as a blatant excuse for why they refuse to do their job.
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>>10070252
Well, no shit.
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>>10070252
I'm so sorry
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>>10067501
This
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I do it to feel less alone
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>>10055328
You're paying a lot of money for each lecture, you may as well show up.

>>10062776
What shithole country are you studying in?
Hand-written exams is some jungle-tier fuckery.
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>>10063375
Hey man, those sandpeople aren't gonna bomb themselves
o wait
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>>10055328
For low level stuff maybe if you're very smart. But for me at least I need both. Lectures with no context or coverage beforehand do jack shit for me. I often find it a waste of time as indomt really know what he's taking about it where he's going . Only reading the book is mediocre at best as you won't know exactly what's going in class or the way the prof is presenting it.

Doing both ensures you have a solid foundation that the lectures can solidify and augment. It also helps mitigate shit profs or books as you have other sources.

As somome whose learned the hard way (blew 2 semesters), go the fuck to class. Even if you're tired as shit some of it will stick and be useful. Otherwise you're wasting your time and money.

...fuck i need to stop skipping
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>>10062231
Some of us have it worse
>miss 1 babby intro chem discussion
>minus 8%
>subsequent absences double that each time
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>>10065136
Can someone optimize this please
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>>10065129
>Ask at least one question, and make sure it is a question he knows how to answer. When asking your question, stand and state your name.
jesus
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>>10055364
You can ask questions
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>>10066883
>>10070252
Sit in the front third of the room
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>>10062272
I wish I could see a professor dab on students
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>>10063444
Niggers man
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>>10055328
Depends in each one way to lean, for me i like to study alone i hate teachers i hate homeworks i hate evaluations and stuff like that. Normally they use to fuck up my grades because they dint like the way i express my self, now that i learned to stayed quit i havent had this problem again.
And above that i am nocturnal i like to wake up at 4 pm and go to bed a 8 -9 am
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>>10062776
>questions look like they were worded by a dyslexic, to where you have to read it three times over to understand how the question should be worded to make actual sense.

This shit triggers me so hard. Why do professors have to be so lazy.
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>>10055328
studying in a group is the best way to go about it. 5 people max
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>>10063375
What are you talking about? Maybe compared to Germany where you income tax rate is five percent plus church tax it's low, or one of the central countries where it's capped at 15% income tax, but France, Switzerland, Denmark, Spain, Austria, etc (western countries) its the same for the first two tax brackets, up to around 35k USD at 15%. Then for each tax bracket beyond that tax rates are 5-15% higher per bracket.

Income caps:
>America - 39% at 500k USD
>France - 45% at 150k Euro
>Spain - 45% at 60k Euro
>Austria - 48% @ 60k, 50% @ 90k, 55% @ 1mil
>Britain - 40% @ 46k pounds, 45% @ 150k pounds
>Sweden - 32% @ 18k(2100USD), 52% @ 468k(52000USD)

And these are just the ones I felt like googling while I was here sitting on the shitter.
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>>10055328
Idk but I'm really bad at absorbing material from lectures and am much better with texts

For example, I rarely go to my grad real or topology class and can always crunch out a pset in a couple of hours just by going over the topics on the homework from the assigned text before starting
On the other hand, there's this QFT class I'm taking which literally doesn't have an assigned text and the prof doesn't really follow any standard sequence of topics so I'm forced to go to lectures
Despite that I'm getting fucked so bad in that class it's not even funny, dumping over 15 hours is sometimes insufficient to finish the hw

I guess it also really depends on how good of a lecturer you have, but I think that's a very personalized question too.
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>>10055328
>Isn't learning on your own much more effective?
Not for me, I'm a neurotic midwit with internet addiction. I go to three to four lectures every week to remind myself that I'm studying in a college.
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>>10063371
I guess you're right
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>>10055328
Some people are better at explaining shit than internet resources. If it's explained poorly, it'll be harder to understand.





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