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Skerples Edition?
Welcome to the Old School Revival General

>Trove:
http://pastebin.com/raw/QWyBuJxd

>Online Tools:
http://pastebin.com/raw/KKeE3etp

>Blogosphere:
http://pastebin.com/raw/ZwUBVq8L

>Previous thread:
>>56264331

What is the best alternate reverse-acronym for OSR?
>>
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>OSR to RSO

Really Smelly Ogres?
>>
>>56316288
Reverse Space Opera.
>>
Rapidly Spinning Orangutan
Really Simple Occult
Rapid Spelunking Operation
>>
Do you think it's bad to add additional classes for the purpose of player variety?
>>
>>56316789
>Do you think it's bad to add additional classes for the purpose of player variety?
I don't see a problem with it. The actual execution is obviously important, and the presentation might be as well. Regarding the latter point, you don't want people drowning in a sea of classes with a thousand different slight variations, but organizing them into base classes and then bonus/special classes (possibly group according to their specialties, or by what class they're variants/subclasses of) might help that. That way it's not like: which of these 27 classes do you want to be? Instead it's like: which of these 3-8 main classes do you want to be, or would like to look at the variants of one of them?

For what it's worth, my game is shaping up to have 13 classes.

Human Classes:
warrior
barbarian
knave
ranger
wizard
cleric
druid

Demihuman Classes (tweaked multiclasses, in effect):
elf
half-elf
gnome
halfling
dwarf
half-orc
>>
Settle a bet. No character ever has died of old age rules, right?
>>
>>56315585
This just inspired me, a 1 on 1 campaign would be a great place to do spell research.
>>
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would your interpretation of Locate Object be able to locate water?
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>>56317749
Sure.
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>>56317749
>>
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>>56317839
>tfw you have a superior water content to women
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>>56317899
I'm gonna chalk that up to muscle mass.
>>
>>56317943
Ah, never mind then
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>>56317839
>gender-based stat limits
I thought we'd moved past this shit, guys.
>>
>>56317994
>he doesn't play OAD&D anymore
Gary would be rolling in his grave if he had died before releasing Lejendary Adventure™
>>
>>56316789
If it doesn't have a good enough mechanical difference, then it's a bit of a waste. I'm all for OSR simplicity but I still like class options beyond the traditional 7.

My homebrew LotFP-based campaign has race/class separation:
>Dwarf, Elf, Gnome, Half-Elf, Halfling, Human, Kenku and Orc.
Each offers an Ability modifier bonus plus a skill bonus, and maybe one other thing.

Classes are
>Barbarian, Cleric, Druid, Fighter, Magic-User (schools: Wizard, Witch, Necromancer, Illusionist), Ranger, Rogue and Trickster.
Each of these applies the HD used and gives some kinda class ability.

It still keeps the ease of OSR character creation and adds a bunch of options to make a character they are interested in playing.
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>>56317965
Don't pretend to be me.

>>56317943
Won't stop me from enjoying my water-content privilege.
>>
>>56317899
Is this from Mario Odyssey?
>>
>>56318074

What's your Witch class do?

I'm a big fan of Witches.
>>
>>56318190
Honestly, it just gives them a different set of spells to choose from. No mechanical difference otherwise. It's from this B/X supplement.

https://archive.4plebs.org/dl/tg/image/1401/88/1401882258184.pdf
>>
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>reading the Ghastly Affair books after some Anon mentioned them
>"this is a game for adults"
>"this is a game of horror"
>"if nothing terrible happens then you're playing wrong"
>and then
>"the group should agree to a Safe Word. If the Presenter’s description of a situation ever becomes too disturbing for a Player, the subject matter becomes distasteful, or the role-playing becomes too intense, a Player can say the Safe Word to immediately stop the game. The Player should then explain to the Presenter what they found excessively disturbing. Play should then continue, with the Presenter glossing over the disturbing situation and proceeding to the next situation."
wew

>>56316288
Overpowered Stone Rock
>>
>>56318416
$5 says if you ever get into some real kinky shit you'll die because of poor communication.
>>
>>56316789
>Do you think it's bad to add additional classes for the purpose of player variety?
I don't have a problem with it, at least as long as each class has a niche of some sort

>>56318074
>I'm all for OSR simplicity but I still like class options beyond the traditional 7.
agreed
>>
>>56318455
You gotta get a girl that is into it anon.
>>
>>56317749
They really don't give you much guidance, but judging by the nomenclature alone, I'd say no, as I wouldn't consider water an object. Objects have a fixed shape. They're items or structures. Water is a formless blob. (On the other hand, the fact that they felt it was necessary to clarify that creatures couldn't be detected might indicate a broad usage of "object".)

For what it's worth, 5e doesn't define what qualifies as an object either, but it gives examples of particular kinds of objects--apparel, jewelry, furniture, tools, and weapons--and all of them are man-made.
>>
>>56318416
>Overpowered Stone Rock
Don't make me demonstrate my finger-Zen.

>>56318190
>>56318223
Have you seen Zak S' post about witches?
/2014/08/d100-witch-traits.html
>>
>>56318562
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cjCu-pZxp4k
>>
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Anyone got any feedback or suggestions for improvement for this little game?
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>>56318846
>Roll 3d6 and grant bonuses per number rolled, stacking.
"Roll three d6s", or "Roll three 6-sided dice." By common convention, 3d6 indicates you're totaling the results of the dice.

>[1] +1 to hit, load, and starting equipment.
I'm assuming "load" means encumbrance, meaning that when paired with the +1 to-hit, we seem to be looking at a strength score, basically, but the bit about starting equipment seems like it's completely unrelated.
>>
>>56318968
>By common convention, 3d6 indicates you're totaling the results of the dice.
Naaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah.
It makes sense as written and I've seen plenty of similar uses of the notation.
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>>56313563
>You're not a class of entity - you are your own unique and horrible thing.
That's the idea. Every Spook is it's own thing. Undead spooks have some stuff in common just because 'not having biology' produces similar strengths. But there's no such thing as a 'Vampire' as a meaningful thing. Just lots of individual monsters.

>>56314279
It's not innately a vampire. It's just some corpse that's still walking about. When it realises it can drink blood and benefit from doing so, it's behavior means people start calling it a vampire. But if a normal person started drinking blood (just because they were weird), they'd get called a vampire. Vampire is something you do, not something you always were.

>>56314335
Drinking blood heals you. Which is useful since undead don't heal at all easilly (thanks, thread!)

>>56314349
>there's no "vampire" to base this on. You're not a vampire, you're a Count Dracula. You are your own unique non-classifiable folklore thing.
got it in one
>>
>>56316789
Work out what archetypes you want in the game, and have a class per archetype. No more than that. Honestly, in 5e say, the difference between a bard, a warlock, a sorcerer and a wizard is so fucking arbitrary that players just pick for mechanics. Fuck that.
Lots of classes covering the same thematic ground just results in decision paralysis and diluted themes.
PCs can distinguish themselves with gear selection, attributes and perhaps spells known. That is fine.
>>
>>56317469
they do if you fight enemies that magically age you. I've seen it.
Attack every part of the sheet etc etc
>>
>>56318416
isn't that just 'comunicating well and not being a dick'?
I wouldn't run SPIDERS IN YOUR CLOTHES for an arachnaphobic player. Same idea.
>>
>>56318846
question: is the 'each roll of a 1' in sage magic
>each time one of the d6s shows a 1
or
>each time the roll's total is 1 or less?
Those will produce veeery different results in play, and it's a little ambiguous.
>>
>>56318968
Also, you might consider naming the bonuses. Even if it doesn't even get written down on your character sheet and contributes nothing to the game, itself, it can relay the concept of what it is so it's not just a bunch of bonuses that people might not instantly connect together.

>>56318846
>Add level to Combat saves Whenever you make an attack roll, add your level to that roll.
Unnecessarily verbose. Just say "Add level to combat saves and attack rolls."

>Add level to Hazard saves If you have an appropriate tool, you can add your level to any skill checks you perform. Add your level to sneak rolls.
How about: "Add level to sneak rolls, hazard saves, and skill rolls (when using an appropriate tool)." It's shorter and makes them items in a list of things that behave the same way, as opposed to three separate sentences that you only notice afterwards adhere to the same mechanic.

>All rolls of 6 or better have advantage on their attack
As in 5e advantage? You probably want to note this at least parenthetically: "All rolls of 6 or better have advantage (better of 2 rolls) on their attack...."

>Creatures usually take their number of HD in order to kill of weakening or wounding blows
You mean that creatures can take a number of hits equal to their hit dice?

>If the attack stated is intended to be lethal and the attack roll > enemy remaining health it's lethal.
Okay, now I'm confused. Do you have to hit something a number of times equal to its hit dice to kill it, or just roll over its health (hp?)?

>>56319006
>It makes sense as written and I've seen plenty of similar uses of the notation.
I mean, I pretty quickly figured out what it meant, but I had a brief "huh?" moment as I tried to fit together things that, using conventional terminology, don't. Why not be as clear and easily understood as possible?
>>
>>56318846
>Difficulty HD = number of points of damage of a wound, HD of creature's special move or poison, number of steps to cure this curse normally, amount of damage dice this trap does to sense it, or the size of the die of this bless. (Bless difficulty HD: +1d4 = 1, +1d6 = 2, etc.)
Uh... what?
>>
Anyone else absolutely love the gm sided stuff to 7 Voyages of Zylarthen, the Hex Crawl resources, the great random encounter tables. The fact that you can just randomly encounter a Longship filled with Vikings is pretty awesome.

Probably going to use alot of it's stuff on a project in the near future. It just seems more traditonal and folkloric compared to most other products of it's nature.
>>
What's the ideal size for a hexcrawl hex?
>>
>>56319187

It showing how to calculate the HD / difficulty of Sage magic rolls.
>>
>>56314918
>Embarrassing question; what's the name of those roaming medieval bard/troubadour/student guys?
Since you said "student", I think you mean the goliards. Ordo vagorum! They weren't really bards and definitely not troubadours, but there were notable poets among them, like the Archpoet and Hugo the Primate. Mostly they were reprobate monks, wandering, drinking, and making a living as occasional secular scribes with their rare and valuable skill "writing". The Carmina Burana are actually goliard drinking songs, just set to really weird incongruous music by a weird Victorian-era German.

The Confession of Golias is worth looking up, it's still good poetry.
>>
What's your favorite OSR game and why?
I'm asking because I'm kinda new to all of this (I played OD&D and Donjon de Poche but only a couple times and I don't remember playing anything else of the sort) and I'd like to know where to start.

>>56320377
Not that anon, but thanks. I periodically forget and re-learn the word.
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>>56320377
>scrolling down, Anon discovers he's a day late
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>>56320417
>I'm asking because I'm kinda new to all of this (I played OD&D and Donjon de Poche but only a couple times and I don't remember playing anything else of the sort) and I'd like to know where to start.
Most people here will advise you to start with Moldvay Basic. For my part, I'm going to advise you to start with Moldvay Basic.

If you're totally new, don't even bother with the attached Cook Expert set yet; get the hang of Basic first.

OD&D without the supplements is extremely fucking neat but it's also virtually impossible to get into starting from zero, so don't go there until later.
>>
>>56320459
Oh. I have a book I thought was a french translation and simplification of OD&D but it is actually a translation of Moldvay Basic. Which means I never played OD&D, but played Moldvay Basic.
I should probably clarify: I'm not new to RPGs, I'm new to OSR.
>>
>>56319099
I feel like 90% of the hypothetical rpg problems people like to complain about on the likes of rpg.net are caused by being unable to communicate like a regular human being.

The OSR one of the few communities that seems to assume a baseline level of good-faith negotiation between the players.
>>
>>56321273
Yeah.
I think for Ghastly Affair it's worth stating 'respect your players' boundries' in the text, since that sort of subject matter is more likely to have bodice-ripping ravishings and other sexy stuff, and sexy stuff at the table is disproportionately likely to squick people out.

FWIW, even Raggi, he of the canibal corpse art in the core book, explicitely says 'and obviously don't do shit that makes your players uncomfortable' in the ref book.
>>
Which of this design choices is most against OSR style:

1. a mechanic that allows for a partial success range on a check
2. the addition of a Resources stat that allows you to roll for having any certain piece of equipment on yourself
>>
>>56322046
2.
>>
>>56322046
2.
>>
>>56319679
6 miles across
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>>56322046
2.
>>
>>56322046
2
>>
>>56322358
>>56322370
>>56322388
>>56322426
that seems unambiguous
>>
>>56316288
Registered Sex Offenders.
>>
>>56322358
>>56322370
>>56322388
>>56322426
>>56322046

Think that if the "Resources" stat depletes by using it, its also resource management. But is sort of quantum resources (you get just what you wanted for a specific situation)

Is very useful, for example, for a ninja class. You don't have to carry a desert camouflage blanket, a jungle camouflage blanket and a palace wall-patterned camouflage blanket. You just have some camouflage clothes that are magically appropiate for the place you want to use them.
>>
>>56322936
Limited resource-altering special powers are not inherently bad as class abilities. Saying, "this particular class gets a unique way to bypass a certain part of the usual resource economy," is not an unreasonable way to distinguish one class from another. I've seen a few examples floating around of Specialist-type characters getting a limited "quantum item" like you describe in other people's houserules, and in some sense even Magic Users and Clerics have something like this with the ability to trade undefined spell slots each day to produce certain resources or circumvent certain obstacles.

However, as a general rule? The more you abstract resource management AS A WHOLE, the further you are moving from one of the core ideas of OSR play. Those classes above are noteworthy specifically because they give you a new vector to interact with the resource economy: they, if anything, reinforce the importance of resource management by giving certain players the limited option to trade one resource (spells, quantum items) for another.
>>
>>56323088
Yeah. I agree. I should have specified in >>56322046
"a piece of equipment that somebody of your [background] would have on its bag"
>>
>>56323120
that said, I forgot to shill the blog entry for today. My question was totally related to it.


http://daylands.blogspot.com.es/2017/11/1d6-osr-ultra-lite-small-dungeon.html
>>
>>56316789
Fighters can be differentiated by what weapon they are wielding.
Magic users can be differentiated by what spells they choose to use.
Priests can be differentiated by spell choice as well. Or you could let each priest pick one (1) domain and be able to do spontaneous conversion of spells into domain-related spells like in 3.5 for healing.
There. There's all the differentiation you need.
>>
>>56323871
how you differentiate thieves?
>>
>>56323989
inb4 "thieves were a mistake"
>>
>>56324034
how do you differentiate elves, dwarves and halflings?
>>
>>56323989
LotFP-style selection of which thieve's skills you focus on.
DCC does this by giving lawful/neutral/chaotic thieves different thief-skill progressions.
I can also see it working with thief progressions in all the potential skills mapped out, and then you pick which of them you're actually going to get that bonus in.
So like, maybe there's: Hide In Shadows, Hear Noise, Climb Sheer Surfaces, Open Locks, Backstabbing, Follow Tracks, Move Silently, Read Scroll, Mimic Sounds, See In Darkness, Recognise Dungeon Features and Speak With Animals. And you get to pick seven of those that you get the skill progression in, and the rest you're just as untrained as a fighter or whatever.

Just spitballing ideas here.
>>
>>56324093
>elves
Spells known
>dwarves and halflings
weapons used, and perhaps secondary skills like hiding and spotting dungeon construction.
>>
>>56318416
If you are playing a horror game, but get butt-blasted because it got too "disturbing" for you, then you are either playing with actual children, or mental children (women and nu males). In the latter case, suck it up. No one gives a fuck if you are offended. No one cares if someone is getting fed slowly into a meat grinder, or forced to masturbate to their daughter's rape or else she'll be executed, or being ripped apart by a spell that makes their bones swell in size until their skin stretches and tears off. If you didn't want that shit, you shouldn't have joined a horror RPG game. Fuck your safe space faggotry.
>>
>>56318846
It's okay. I like your saving throw categories.
>>
>>56324034
>>56323989
>>56324093
Well, here are my opinions:
1) race as class is boring
2) thieves are a typecast enough class that they don't really need much differentiation. Should only have 1 thief per party, too, imo.
3) thieves weren't a mistake. Skills were a mistake, as in when I play 5e and my ranger is useless because anyone can take a background to get Survival.
>>
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Is there any games like Dungeon Crawl Classics where I don't need to buy funky dice?
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>>56324437
DCC with the TheCrawler app.
>>
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>>56318846
Went over it and made some notes. Hope it helps. Presumably there's a page missing or yet to be written, because some things made no sense (what is talent 4, for instance). Things highlighted but not noted are changes I made.
>>
>>56324509
Thank you anon!
>>
>>56319679
"half day's travel by a reasonably experienced adventurer"

I read somewhere that the entire skyrim map fits inside of a 6 mile hex, though, so IDK if this is actually true
>>
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Here's a question - my previous experience with other editions of D&D made me assume that the 6 attributes always improve as a character levels up. I put together a few character sheet templates for a BX game I ended up not running, and I rerolled a few numbers because I thought they were too high. My assumption here was that the characters would start off kind of shitty, which would be fun and appropriate for level 1 adventurers, and then would become more powerful and capable as they leveled up.

However, after reading through my manuals again, I haven't been able to find any kind of improvement to the 6 attributes as characters level up in OSR. Am I missing something, or is this correct. Do any of you include something like this in your games? Or is Thor Grunknar the fighter never going to get any smarter no matter what level he reaches?
>>
>>56325050
The in-game map probably does, but Skyrim's map doesn't accurately represent the province itself, which I figure would be a handful of hexes.

What really blew my mind about hexcrawling once was some post about porting ACKS domain management to 3.5, which showed that real-life nations are large enough that it would be practically impossible to make a domain as large as Italy with 6-mile hexes
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>>56324196
My thoughts exactly, although apparently we're in the minority. I blame the nu-OSR hipsters.
>>56325190
>Do any of you include something like this in your games?
No. It's also pretty pointless since OSR systems have less meaningful modifiers (9-12 = +0 as opposed to WOTC's 9 = -1, 10-11 = +0, 12 = +1).
>>
>>56325190
You are correct.

Increasing ability scores in some way seems like a relatively common houserule, though. A method I've seen in a few different places is allowing players to roll against one or more of their ability scores on a level up: if you roll over your score on 3d6 or 1d20 or whatever, it goes up by a point. Of course, there's no reason you couldn't just implement the modern D&D method of letting the players chose one or more scores to increase every so many levels.

But like many things in oldschool D&D, I think it was assumed that ability score increases, if they did happen at all, were the kind of thing the DM would choose to give out as a special reward: a faerie boon increases your DEX or CHA, say. They weren't meant to be "built in" to the system.

As >>56325328 points out, ability scores aren't even supposed to be that important in OSR games anyway, so your game will run just fine even if you never let your players increase those scores.
>>
>>56322046
1. Happens all the time, usually as 2d6.
2. Has no precedent, but fits the style.

I'll say 2 is less OSR from the no precedence bit.
>>
>>56319851
>It showing how to calculate the HD / difficulty of Sage magic rolls.
I recognize most of the terms used there; it's just that they're strung together in a manner that's mostly incomprehensible to me. I think it's probably just too shorthand-y for somebody who doesn't already know the basics of what's going on.
>>
Does anybody have a link to the hex kit torrent? There was an anon asking about it in the last thread.
>>
>>56325500
>if you roll over your score on 3d6 or 1d20 or whatever, it goes up by a point
I like the opposite, which I swiped from Bruce Heard: Roll 3d6 and if you get a roll lower than your ability it increases by 1 point. Makes it easy for subpar scores to improve but hard for good scores and caps nicely at 18.
>>
>>56324563
>what is talent 4
I think that's referring to the section where you roll "stats":

>[4] Roll +1 health die & take highest
>>
>>56325683
>Makes it easy for subpar scores to improve but hard for good scores and caps nicely at 18.
Uh... it's easier to roll under a high score. You will always roll equal to or less than 18 on 3d6, while you will only do it one out of 216 times if it's a 3.
>>
>>56325683
You're mistaken, buddy. Other way around. The system I outlined does what you want.
>>
>>56325695
Oh, yeah, that makes sense. Needs keywording then to make that clear, I think.
>>
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>>56325190
The system really isn't designed for increasing scores. It could invalidate direct ability checks (roll score or under on 1d20), it could be rather powerful with some stats (a +3 strength can more than double your damage output), and the stats aren't stratified the right way (it gets increasingly easy to advance past each successive modifier level because 13-15 = +1, 16-17 = +2, 18 = +3). If you want to make stat increases a significant part of your game, you'll probably want to regularize your stats' relationship to modifiers, like modern D&D (every 2 stat points increases modifiers by 1, or every 3 points if you prefer--the latter might be better if you want to keep things from getting out of hand*). You'll also probably want to come up with an alternative system for attribute checks. Personally, I like the idea of doing d12 checks modified by your attribute modifier (see pic for a roll-under system that does this).

*Maybe:
3-5 = -2
6-8 = -1
9-11 = 0
12-14 = +1
15-17 = +2
18-20 = +3
21 up = +4
>>
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>>56325746
>>56325751
h-haha y-you fell for my trick I w-was merely pretending!
>>
>>56325637
Not a torrent, but... >>56315945
>>
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What are yor feelings about World of Dungeons?
Is just me, or if it wasn't for the fact that Dungeon World exists and is tied to it intimately, would work perfectly as an OSR game?
>>
>>56326823
I gave it a cursory glance once, and wasn't impressed.
>>
Help me /osrg/, you are my only hope. How do I deal with a party that is super careful and therefore terribly slow to advance through my dungeons? They are terrified of springing any traps, as they should be in some way, but this way play becomes boring and sluggish...
>>
>>56327296
Random encounters and strict records of time.
>>
>>56327296
Give them a time limit of some sort. Also, random encounters if they linger too long.
>>
>>56327296
WRITE DOWN THEIR STANDARD SEARCH ROUTINE
(a) you don't need as much back and forth (b) you know their blind spots

You still gives cues for things they might miss and still give dummy cues to cut down on metagaming
But try not to give too many dummy cues or they'll get caught up int them
>>
>>56327340
You mean there should be a penalty to spending too much time searching for traps? But how would they know they are about to enter a part of the dungeon that is worth it to spend some time searching?
>>
>>56327296
Add more traps.
>>
>>56325198
>The in-game map probably does, but Skyrim's map doesn't accurately represent the province itself, which I figure would be a handful of hexes.
It depends on what measuring rod you use. Vvardenfell in Morrowind (game and province) is several times larger than the Skyrim gameworld IIRC but smaller on the Tamriel map; the Iliac Bay region (part of High Rock, part of Hammerfell) in Daggerfall is massively larger, like, several times the size of Great Britain. So it's really a question of which size you consider "canonical". It seems like a lot of fans think the Daggerfall scale is the "true" one and the others are Disneyfied in-game representations for playability purposes, but I don't know for sure since I'm not a huge TES guy.
>>
>>56327296
1) This is probably your fault.
2) Wandering monster checks.
3) Have an honest discussion with them asking them to cut back on the paranoia while agreeing to cut back on the lethality of traps.
>>
>>56327296
Like the others said, this is happening because you're not rolling for random monsters properly. Run correctly, you can let the players take all the time in the world to search, but if they do, they'll get wandering monsters right up the dickhole and get hurt probably worse than a trap's worth. Just knowing that that timer's on their asses should organically make the players search more selectively and only when they feel risk is heightened.
>>
>>56327617
1) Of course: I run the game so if it runs badly I'm obviously doing something wrong, that;s why I'm asking for help
2) That's a nice way to add some time pressure indeed
3) You see, that's kind of the point. At some locations their paranoia is totally justified while at different locations it isn't at all. How do I go about setting the scene such that they more or less automatically pick up on this?
>>
>>56327473
They don't. You can put traps in logical places, have clues to what's in an area, etc. Mapping is the best way to find hidden rooms and secret doors since if a big area of the map is just "empty" there's likely a secret room.
The penalty to searching for traps is that it takes a turn to search an area for them, a random encounter chance is rolled every 2 turns in ad&d/basic.
>>
>>56327473
>But how would they know they are about to enter a part of the dungeon that is worth it to spend some time searching?
>>56327706
>How do I go about setting the scene such that they more or less automatically pick up on this?
There are two schools of thought on this:
I.) Fuck that, and fuck them. They have to figure it out by trial and error.

II.) Describe epiphenomena of the traps. "There are several small holes in the wall here." "There's some kind of scorched pit down the other end of the hallway" and then if they're careful about searching, "when you turn around you see a coppery pipe embedded in the wall, flush with its surface."

The electrum plate in Skerples' Tomb of the Serpent Kings is an example of this technique, at least as I understood it. Maybe he disagrees.
>>
>>56327340
>>56327359
>>56327435
>>56327503
>>56327617
>>56327645
>>56327752
Thanks all, I think I know what to do ^^
>>
>>56327340
Have you seen the 'normal' move speed?
>>
So, what happened to that anon who came here months back asking why his group didn't "get" OSR and it turned out he lived in China where the only people who played old school D&D were OD&D turbogrogs and led him to think the choice was between OD&D and a bunch of random ass systems? Did he ever report back to the thread?
>>
Is it possible to run older adventures (whiteplum mountain, ravenloft, etc) in s&w complete without having to do a bunch of conversion ?

if not, is ad&d 1 or 2 better?
>>
>>56328045
Post a link to the original discussion.
>>
>>56328045
I don't remember this at all and I feel like I've at least lurked every thread since the beginning of 2016. Was it further back than that?
>>
>>56324196
>"nu-males"
>anyone who has feelings that aren't mine are wrong!!


neckbeard detected
>>
>>56328186
This will work for sure with S&W Complete
>>
>>56328211
>>56328286
No, it was this year. I may be misremembering it a bit. I'll look for the original posts.
>>
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>>56328186
>whiteplum
Sounds tasty af
The biggest differences between most TSR modules (which are a flavor of AD&D) and S&W is more classes, race-and-class, slightly different AC, spells, and movement in 2e.

>>56328289
>the game is about horror
>horror entails by its very nature the disgusting, profane, macabre, scary, and traumatic
>"but you never said it would THAT disgusting, profane, macabre, scary, and traumatic!"
What happened to the idea that adults should make sober judgements instead of needing constant coddling and awards for victimhood?
>>
>>56328329
Alright, it was in this thread
http://archive.4plebs.org/tg/thread/55386753/
>>
>>56328329
>>56328437
Oh I see, I missed it then. My bad, I was too busy getting triggered by b8ers
>>
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After perusing this thread I see a lot of people referencing "OSR ideals" but it's not clear what these are. Is there somewhere I can read through a summary of what all this shit's about, or what the core principles are at least?

There are a shitton of fucking links and blog stuff in that OP, every link I open is just a link to 500 more links.
>>
>>56328727
Read the Quick Primer for Old School Gaming by Matt Finch.

It's wrong (apparently old school games don't have search checks?) but it's a start.
>>
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>Only Humans may be Druids
>The example picture of a Druid is an Elf
What did they mean by this?
>>
>>56328772
Dungeons and Dragons was written and understood by most of its audience as a deconstruction of earlier tabletop game tropes. It's full of visual jokes like that, and in the rules themselves and all through the material. It's kind of lost on a modern audience, since if anything, now Dungeons and Dragons itself is the old standard. The things it was meant to critique have faded and been totally forgotten.
>>
>>56327296
I like the idea of a detect traps roll being a sort of sixth-sense, "something feels wrong", "from the construction of the dungeon, it seems like they'd put a trap here" sort of thing. You don't actually detect the trap (and have to search the room/corridor descriptively, telling what you examine, poke and prod), but it clues you in to the fact that there is something probably suspect about the area. Key to this, however, is making sure that this danger sense has a high enough level of success (even when there's no thief present), that it's not worth it to search places where you don't "get a bad feeling". To me, that means having at least a 50% chance (rolling for the party as a whole) for a party without a thief to subconsciously notice that something's "off" -- maybe 4 out of 6 in most cases. If you wanted to get fancy, you could have different levels of success where you give increasingly bigger hints the lower you roll for them. With a 1, you might say something like "you notice that one of the floor tiles is discolored", where there's a pressure plate. With a 4, you might just mention in passing that there doesn't seem to be much dust on the floor here, in contrast to the corridor before. Thief trap detection could then be used as a saving throw for when the party check fails.

Of course, even at a 2/3 chance to detect traps, it still might be worth it for people to poke and prod everything if there aren't really any penalties attached to it. That's when the time-consuming nature of searching starts to deplete party supplies (food, water, torches, etc.), and give time for monsters to discover the looting and carnage in the PCs wake (raising alarms, calling in reinforcements, tracking down the PCs, set up ambushes, etc.). And then there's just the chance that a wandering monster happens along, and at a time when the party members are all down on their knees, examining the floor tiles.
>>
>>56328831

>Dungeons & Dragons was a postmodern critique of games and artwork that appeared long after D&D.

You're blowing my mind-hole here, man.
>>
>>56325198
It makes sense. I can't say for sure about ACKS, but I had the impression that most osr domain management was done more at the County level, rather than something as large as a modern nation.

And that makes sense when you consider how the feudal system worked. A king shouldn't be able to manage every single 6 mile hex at least, not without pissing off the local nobility that manages it
>>
>>56328429
saying places need to be forced into EXTREME fear discomoft etc based on the theme is like saying anytime someone wants a massage for sore muscles they need to get a thai deep tissue massage

>uses this topic to insert political ideals

you do know there are other people than you, right??
>>
>>56328772
>What did they mean by this?
"The guy in charge of putting together whatever clone this is forgot to give a proper art brief to the artist doing the piece and so the latter just drew what he was already familiar with from new-school games". You can see it in the bone ridges over the bear's eyes as well, that's a 3E-era dire animal tell that AFAIK didn't exist before 3.0.

This is why proper art direction matters, kids!
>>
>>56328769
Don't read that.

>>56328727
The players trust the DM, the DM does not abuse this trust.
Rules exist for things that cannot be fairly and consistently arbitrated.
All other situations are handled by DM fiat (hence the need for trust).
Acting has more to do with situations than with characters. Not dialogue heavy.
Players earn their keep or die trying.
Low iteration times and low investment: death isn't a setback early on.
>>
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>>56329079
>>56329079
>EXTREME fear discomoft
If you're having a panic attack because of text or narration you're literally mentally ill and should seek help.

>uses this topic to insert political ideals
Wanting coddling isn't political but not wanting coddling is political? How does that work?

>you do know there are other people than you, right?
Yes, and they shouldn't be playing a horror game if they get triggered by horror.

>>56328772
>>56329110
It's probably stock art.
>>
>>56324437
No. It's literally like 20 bones for the full 14 piece DCC set from Impact. Or buy the "Who Knew?" Dice from Koplow that sell for like 8 bucks and find a random d14.
>>
>>56329492
Never said panic attacks, people just have different preferences just how some people prefer crunch or flavor - its really not that hard of an idea to grasp.

You might as say something worth while, like people shouldn't play D&D unless they roll magic-user

Also
>some players being uncomfortable with whats being said
>"coddling"
>implying its that difficult to work around it

thats your gm's problem

and why are you so caught up on the idea of people wanting to escape discomfort? you must see yourself in these people ofcourse.
>>
>>56328727
In addition to what >>56329412 said, there are some principles of OSR play that've grown out of the default focus of oldschool D&D on dungeon crawling. Thus, the OSR tends to emphasize that:

>Resource management is a central challenge of the game.
>Players should engage with their environment. (And DMs should make this engagement rewarding.)
>Not every encounter is meant to be fought.
>Player skill and creativity in overcoming challenges should trump character skill.
>Characters are not "built"; character creation options are minimal, and characters grow organically with the things they accomplish, the treasure they acquire, etc.

If you want to get deep into the OSR, I would honestly recommend you check out some of those links though. There's tons of good writing out there in the blogosphere. Off the top of my head, Hack & Slash and the Alexandrian do a pretty thorough job elaborating on what OSR play means.
>>
>>56329853
>>56329853
>Resource management is a central challenge of the game.
I hear this a lot, but I don't see it.

The other points are redundant with >>56329412
>>
>>56329812
>>56329812
>people just have different preferences
Do they need a "Safe Word" to signal them?

>people prefer crunch or flavor
Then they should play systems and settings that conform to those tastes instead of bastardizing a system that isn't meant to be used in that way.

>people shouldn't play D&D unless they roll magic-user
That is such a retarded analogy I can't even begin to fathom how you think it is any way relevant. Playing a adult-oriented horror game with kid gloves on is like playing D&D with no dungeons, no dragons, and no exp.

>implying its that difficult to work around it
>"a Player can say the Safe Word to immediately stop the game. The Player should then explain to the Presenter what they found excessively disturbing. Play should then continue, with the Presenter glossing over the disturbing situation and proceeding to the next situation."
That's not "working around" that's a vidya-tier "press to skip" button.
>GM: "Suddenly you turn the corner to face a gang of snarling orcs armed to th---"
>Player: "SAFE WORD! Orcs represent numerous stereotypes of non-White peoples and that kind of racism makes me uncomfortable."
>GM: "Nevermind, you don't see anything around the corner."
That's a cancerous attitude to have.

>thats your gm's problem
I /am/ the GM. Retardedation and people who defend it are my problem

>why are you so caught up on the idea of people wanting to escape discomfort?
It's a HORROR game. If you don't feel discomfort then you're either playing campy as fuck or you're a sociopath.

>you must see yourself in these people ofcourse.
High school-tier logic with grade school-tier typing, shaking my damn head to be honest
>>
>>56329812
>discomfort
I'm discomforted every time my character gets low on HP.
That discomfort also makes it exciting.

Take your safe spaces somewhere else, fag.
>>
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>>56320377
>>56320427
It's all good, anon. The more references the better!

>>56321273
>I feel like 90% of the hypothetical rpg problems people like to complain about on the likes of rpg.net are caused by being unable to communicate like a regular human being.
Oh, easily.

>>56322910
*Reclusive Sex Offenders
>>
>Fade Into Bolivian
What level is thus spell?
>>
>>56327783
>The electrum plate in Skerples' Tomb of the Serpent Kings is an example of this technique, at least as I understood it. Maybe he disagrees.

Nah, that's pretty much it. When you open the door to that room, there's this big weird shiny plate right ahead of you down the hall. If you walk in, you trip the pressure plate and get hit by lighting.

So it's obvious that there's /something/ fucky about the room, but not what, until the players search or ask.
>>
>>56331053
>What level is thus spell?

Fairly high level. At least Level Brazilian.
>>
>>56331053
What does it do?
>>
>>56331091
Feign death by losing relevance/xp. There's a travel component to it, but that's more of an inconvience than anything else.
>>
>>56331091
You are teleported to an alternate world, specifically the country of Bolivia. You reside there for 1 hour before returning.
>>
>>56325190
Used to have a "percentile" score for each attribute. Rolled at start then add a die each level based upon primary, secondary and tertiary stats. Fighter for example +1d8% str, +1d6% con& dex, and 1d4% for the others.
>>
Has anyone made us of Oriental Adventures Honor stuff?

I feel like it might add a bit more verisimilitude to the world, but it might also be more fun to read about than play with.
>>
>>56326823
Apocalypse World is the only good PbtA game.
>>
>>56331720
I've been considering using it somehow, it's a pretty funny system but I don't think it should be very important or strict for the game.
>>
Going to present this spell to my DM for Spell Research. Any thoughts?

Finger Bolts (First level Magic User+Elf Spell)
Range: 30ft
Duration: Instant
Three small bright bolts erupt from the caster's finger tip, they flutter and sparkle as they fly towards their target. The caster may choose to aim each dart at separate creatures in range. Make a "to hit" roll for each bolt. On a hit a bolt deals 1d4 damage.

Commentary: With this spell you give up the auto-hit of Magic Missile to split the damage among different targets. While this spell has potentially more damage output the unmodified "to hit" roll means on average you'll be dealing less.
>>
>>56324196
because when i put a paranormal activity DVD in i expect so see someone forced to masturbate to their daughter's rape, and also the TV won't let me turn it off it when it gets to that scene

different people
have different expectations
of what horror means
and that's fine
>>
>>56329492
what if...... the one that should seek help....... is actually you
>>
>>56331806
Froideval seems like a cool dude.
>>
I have a minor problem with my game and group.

I ran an OSR game for them and it was fun, they enjoyed the TPK (twice) and liked not having to roll skills every 3 seconds.

However there was a bit of argument or confusion over time management. How do you keep track of time being spent not based on movement and combat? Things like interacting with objects in the environment?

Things like, look over the statue, put your face to the floor and see if the tiles were raised, turn the doorknob the other direction, etc.

Those were all things that came up in the game, but there was no good rule to determine how long all that stuff takes. Should it just be like every 4-6 interactions counts as a 10 minute turn?
>>
>>56331917
>and that's fine
The only thing that's fine is you sticking a fork in an electrical socket, tumblrtard.
>different expectations
I don't care. If you can't handle the game I am running, you're welcome to leave. That's it. I am under no obligation to make you comfortable.
>>
>>56328289
>anyone who has feelings that aren't mine are wrong!!
Except those feelings are wrong. If you find gore and torture in a GAME disturbing past the age of 13, you are a mental child.
>>
>>56331720
>>56331806
>>56332041
OA has a lot of good shit but it needs some adaption to other (i.e non-Asian) settings.

>>56332307
>Those were all things that came up in the game, but there was no good rule to determine how long all that stuff takes. Should it just be like every 4-6 interactions counts as a 10 minute turn?
2 minutes per cubic foot of the thingamajig being thingamadoodled
>>
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>>56332307
I keep track of turns using something like pic related.
As far as how many interactions, I say it varies on what they're doing. Say they're exploring a dungeon. If they tell me specifically they are dicking with the torch sconces on the walls, examining statues, etc then I'd say they could do a couple things in one turn. But if they want to make Search checks for an entire room, then it takes a full turn to completely check everything out. (I usually rule that an entire party can Search a room, but 2/3 players have to succeed).
I'm also up front with my players so they understand how I do things.
>>
>>56324196
>mental children (women and nu males)

How about you go fuck off back to >>>/pol/ or >>>/r9k/ instead?
>>
>>56332494
How about you stop shitposting and explain why I have a right to pander to your whiny ass when you get offended over a fucking horror game getting too scary for you?
>>
>>56332494
Hi Zak S

Has someone kicked your ass, yet?
>>
>>56332464
>lanterns last twelve rounds
They were so close.
>>
Can't we just have /v/-tier shitposting about water content instead of this /pol/-tier garbage clogging up our threads?
>>
>>56332632
>or two hours
It's your choice.
>>
>>56332661
>discussion about a game rule and player responsibility
>"/pol/-tier"
Has the cabal that tried to ax Greg Gorgonmilk suddenly taken up residence here?
>>
>>56332789
Twelve rounds is two hours.
>>
>>56332866
And by rounds I mean turns.
I accidentally perpetuated the typo.
>>
>>56332866
Twelve TURNS. Looks like a little typo.

>>56332797
Seriously, man. Don't be such a faggot.
>>
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>>56332917
>Don't be such a faggot.
You didn't say the Safe Word so I must refuse.
>>
>>56319679
I actually like 1 mile hexes. The reason being is that there's a LOT going on in a 6 mile hex, hell, there's a LOT going on in a 3 mile hex, but I don't want to have to rely on abstraction to keep on top of it all, nor do I want to simply say "the location is half a day away" and hand wave it. I want my players to have to explore by geographical landmarks & directions and I find it's easier for me to run a hexcrawl with a greater degree of player choice when I use 1 mile hexes.
>>
>>56333136
Larger hexes have less back-and-forth and pixel bitching.
>>
>>56333220
I don't have that problem, if anything there's a greater variety of immediately visible landmarks to explore and it allows for things like tributaries and hamlets to get mapped out in a satisfying way. 1 mile is still a big enough space that if the hex isn't completely flat, there's a good chance that if I forget to mention a mountain range my players won't get too flustered.
>>
How do you do dungeon design? Especially for large dungeons.
>>
>>56333136
>>56333332
I like 3-mile hexes since each is just about the right size to hold a village + a significant feature, and each represents about an hour of travel if the party is just passing through. I find that fairly convenient for my purposes.
>>
>>56333507
You do you, brother. I'm always asked about "hex bloat" when I use the 1 mile scale, but I have found that my encounter tables/rumor tables keep my players engaged in a small handful of regions and my dungeons get recycled for later sessions.
>>
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>>56333413
It depends on what you're trying to make.
MacGuffin dungeon?
Theme dungeon?
Puzzle dungeon?
Meatgrinder?
Meagdungeon?
For example, I haven't written anything up for it but I wanted a dungeon that had a dormant flesh colossus inside. I made a Mayan-style step pyramid/hangar that was a couple of hundred feet tall but didn't have a lot of rooms because of the colossus' sealed sarcophagus standing uptight in more or less the center of the dungeon.
>>
>>56333021
Eilistraee 4 lyfe. Take your evil gods and shove 'em.
>>
>>56333413
Per Dungeon
---
3 Speaking Elements: 1 Mocking Enemy, 1 Ineffective Friendly, 1 Neutral

9 Dungeon Rumors: 3 Falsehoods, 1 about specific Treasure inside, 1 about specific Monster inside, 1 about Thematic dungeon elements, 1 about Aeshetic dungeon elements, 1 about dungeon's original function, 1 about dungeon's current function
Specific Key to Specific Door
Generic Dungeon Key found on Monster
Generic Dungeon Key found near Treasure
Generic Dungeon Key found outside

Minimum Per 10 Rooms
-
0.5 Peepholes
0.5 1 Specific Locked Door with 1 Specific Key
0.5 Oneway Door
1 Lever Locked Door
1.5 Generic Locked Door
1 Dynamic Dungeon Element: (Change Another Dungeon Room, Alter Character, Destory/Alter/Unleash Monster)
1 Trap: (Visual Effects of Trap Activation, Nearby Corpse, Hidden)
1 Monster
1 Monster with Treasure
1 Treasure
3 Aesthetic Elements which inform about the dungeon

Minimum Per Floor
-
2 Entrances
1 Secret Entrance
(These can either Staircases into a floor or doorway into a dungeon)
>>
>>56332797
you mean the cabal that succeeded?
we're winning bruv
get with the programme
>>
>>56333782
Who's cooler, Zak S or the RPG pundit?
>>
>>56333919
neither, theyre both cunts
>>
>>56333782
>programme
Perfidious Albion get ye gone
>>
What's a good city based adventure to run? I'm using DCC, but it really doesn't matter what system the module is for. I'm thinking about using one of the already released DCC Lankhmar modules.
>>
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>>56333919
Gennady Golovkin, because they both need their noses fucking broken
>>
>>56333671
I'm after a megadungeon with sub-areas at the moment. Darkest Dungeon inspired me as well as my play group. The only megadungeon I'm more than passingly familiar with is Maze of the Blue Medusa, and while it's beautiful and I love it, it's way beyond me and I have two first-timers who will be hella confused. Plus, always nice to create something new.

I don't necessarily want a meatgrinder; referring back, Maze does it exactly how I love, it's just too esoteric in a lot of places. Puzzles, social aspects (yes please), and yes, combat. I've just never done a dungeon before, coming from games that are totally the opposite of this.
>>
>>56334022
Grab any mega-dungeon and contort the layout so the rooms are inside many buildings. Pad it out with non-hostile entrances (which turn hostile if you've stirred shit up) and break-rooms (which don't).
>>
>>56333919
They're both obnoxious, but the RPG Pundit makes good content like Dark Albion and Arrows of Indra. Zak is just an insufferable tool.
>>
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>>56334058
>their noses fucking broken
PUT ME THE FUCK IN COACH
>>
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>>56334122
You're cool.
>>
>>56334122
>tattoos
Was he an MU all along??
>>
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>>56334058
>>56334122

I bet ya can box a little, can't ya sir? Aye, you look like a boxer.
>>
>>56334186
This is how monks were meant to be played.

Now, I've got to make and roleplay one as Floyd Mayweather Jr, The Best Ever (tm)
>>
>>56334223
Supplement III FM w/ Body Weaponry, BECMI 16HD Mystic, or trashy obligatory option?
>>
>>56334264
If allowed.

>Hard work
>Dedication
>>
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>>56334223
>This is how monks were meant to be played.
Nah man. https://coinsandscrolls.blogspot.ca/2017/10/osr-class-surly-gnome.html
>>
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>>56334471
Rules for your jewish oranges when?
>>
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>>56334629
When I get around to it. I've got to work on my fish class first: yom kippers.
>>
>>56325190
Magic fountains that increase stats or wishing for +1 strength was not uncommon. No need to have baked-in rules, make it a reward to be found in the dungeon.
>>
Is Maido OSR?

Does it follow the philosophy?
>>
>>56335377
No, but I counter-recommend it whenever I see someone recommend GURPS for anything.
>>
Hey, I'm having a bit of trouble configuring some certain classes in my setting. Originally I had a set of druidic tribes that individually contained the powers of the clasaical elements: fire, earth, water, air. However I'm thinking that some aspects of each tribe fit better with others. For instance, the air based tribe usually had a motif focused on storms abilities focused on gales and lighting. The fire based tribe had a motif of sun and stars and abilities based on fire and smoke. But since lightning is plasma, much like the sun, and plasma is just a supercharged version of fire, I'm thinking of giving the lightning abilities to the fire druids. Is that fair? I wouldn't know what to supplement the air druids with though, since I'd be taking away part of their aspects as storm people.
>>
>>56335475
>not using Aether, Water, Earth, Fire, Sulphur, Mercury, and Salt
>>
How do you guys actually play out hex crawls at the table? I read B/X and am still confused on how the procedure works -- what do I actually say? What do the players do?
>>
>>56335810
Use a good module like World of the Lost to get a fleshed out grip on how to run them.
>>
>>56335810
You see the hex map, they see whatever they draw. You just describe what's nearby.
It's like "10 feet, 20 feet, 30 feet" but miles instead of feet and mountains instead of support props.
>>
>>56331894
seems about balanced to me.
>>
>>56331894
Hmm. Let's see. Starting THAC0 is 19. Let's figure our target has a relatively modest AC of 7. That means you hit on a 12 or better, which is 45% of the time. 3d4 damage = 7.5 points on average. 45% * 7.5 = 3.375 compared to a magic missile's 4.5 average.

Of course, you have the opportunity to split your damage between multiple targets with Finger Bolts, which is handy, but your range is only 1/5 that of Magic Missile. In terms of progression, Finger Bolts will improve as your to-hit does (though you can't count on your targets having the modest AC of 7 I used for the calculations above), but Magic Missiles gives you two extra missiles every 5 levels (which can be shot at different targets), so it's clearly coming out on top here.

Overall, I'd say that Finger Bolts is weaker than Magic Missile, but is better in certain situations, (at least for a caster of less than 6th level, which is when 1st level spells are important) and thus has its uses. It's a legit spell, but one that plays it safe in terms of power, so I don't see any reason your DM would reject it over concerns of it being abusive.
>>
>>56335810
I'm learning to run B/X by doing, so I don't know if this is standard or anything, but here's my procedure.

Upon starting out, I map out the path they are planning on travelling, assuming that they actually know where they are going. For example, if they are following the road up to the nearby city.

Each day of movement, I figure out how far along they'll be able to get that day, taking into account terrain, weather, etc. Weather is generated using tables I made. I also generate the day's worth of random encounters. If they have no encounters, I tell them if they see any changes in terrain in their day's worth of travel. If they have encounters, I tell them when those are and they get resolved. Sometimes it will be something nonthreatening, like when they encountered a clutch of hatched giant tortoise (or maybe turtle) eggs. The mapper then draws in whatever they feel is necessary.

Each hex, I roll to see if they get lost. If they're following a road, river, or coastline, they're not going to get lost. If they're travelling on a cloudy new-moon night in heavy forest, they're probably going to. If they get lost I figure out what direction they are actually going in, and note that to myself. The players don't know, although they can reorient themselves or try to backtrack if they want. I just tell them what they see.

Generally I have to remind about rations.

If they're just exploring rather than following a specific route, or if they think following a different direction will help, then sometimes they'll change direction midway through. No problem. If they're trying to go west, for example, and the northwest hex is swamp and the southwest is forested hills, I might say something like "There are some forested hills to (the southwest/your left). Do you want to continue travelling through the swamp, or try to go through the forested hills?"

I also have some procedures for hazardous terrain if the party is bushwhacking. They haven't run into those yet.
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>>56317749
Depends on where that water is. Water in a canteen or wineskin is an object in my book. Water in an ocean or cave is more of a location that an object to me. But the term object can be applied to anything physical in nature, with this case only having a specific exception for creatures.
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>>56337501
If you wanted to make Finger Bolts more powerful, you could have each bolt do flat damage equal to your level. This makes it a pretty shitty spell for a first level character to have, and a tad worse than your version at 2nd level, but thereafter it flies ahead, and actually does a good job of keeping up with Magic Missile, overall. The picture here shows the average damage of Finger Bolt vs. Magic Missile, assuming a 50% chance to hit with Finger Bolts. Keep in mind that starting at 6th level, a magic-user will be shoot 3 Magic Missiles, and at 11th level, that will increase to 5.

I'm not sure your DM would approve it because A) flat damage is a bit uncommon in D&D, and B) it sounds really fucking powerful. But if you look at the actual math, I think it's still a bit less powerful than Magic Missile overall.
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>>56337770
Sorry, had my columns too narrow, so it was rounding decimals to the nearest whole number for Magic Missile. Where it says 14 damage, that's actually 13.5, and where it says 23, that's actually 22.5. The picture here is the corrected version.
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>>56337501
>>56337770
Thanks for your input. Posted elsewhere, someone suggested requiring a Save vs Spell instead. What do you think of that?
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>>56337535
>Generally I have to remind about rations.
A good suggestion I've seen is to pass around a bowl of chits.
The mechanical act of depositing a chit is hard to forget.
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>>56337828
Makes it better at low levels and worse at high, like any other save-based activity.
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What's the best way to design a dungeon key? I've started designing my own dungeons, but putting all the crosslinks in is absolutely killing the readability of my prep notes.
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>>56331053
This made me think of the ending in Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid.
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>>56337801
Here's a bit more of a sophisticated version that takes into account the caster's increasing THAC0, as well as assuming a slowly-increasing AC for their target (since higher-level creatures are likely to have at least somewhat better ACs).
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>>56332307
>there was no good rule to determine how long all that stuff takes
You've always been expected to determine that for yourself as referee. From OD&D Vol. III: Underworld and Wilderness Adventures:

>Time spent searching for anything (secret passages, hidden treasure, etc.), loading treasure, listening, ESP'ing, hiding, will be adjudged by the referee as to what portion of a turn will be used by the activity. Typically, ESP'ing will take but a quarter turn, while searching a ten foot section of wall for secret passages will require a full turn.
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>>56337828
What >>56337874 said.

At low level (save as fighter levels 1-3 in B/X), this would increase the average damage output vs an AC 7 target from 3.375 to 6. That's a huge jump, and actually significantly surpasses Magic Missile's 4.5 damage. There's still the limited range to consider, but I'm still thinking Finger Bolts is looking sweet. But as we look at higher levels, instead of increasing damage output to keep up with higher hit dice monsters, damage output will actually decrease as their saves increase.

So with the spell as-is, I don't like the math of saving throws over to-hit. It boosts the spell at low levels, where it doesn't need it, and comparatively hobbles the spell at higher levels, where it does need it.
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>>56328831
What pre-D&D elfgame was being referenced, pray tell?
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I'm trying to find something that was posted here recently: a sheet of like +20 common backgrounds for a funnel, each with a listed weapon and some item.

Can anyone repost it or guide me to it?
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>>56333332
Let's see what faggot stole your get >>56333333
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>>56332464
That chart is pretty cool! Do you happen to have the full pdf for the Forbidden Caverns of Archaia?
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>>56319127
>>56319140
>>56324563

Thanks for advice.
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Hello, /osr/. I have been looking into weird fantasy settings and was recommended Veins of the Earth. Now, I'm a little confused.

Veins of the Earth seems to be a spin-off of Lamentations of the Flame Princess. Then there's another setting called Ruin/Rust Princess? Plus there's another setting called Flame on the Velvet Horizon. Could someone please tell what these settings are about and what differentiates them?

Also, is there a database with a list of OSR settings? In fact, what is OSR? Is it another system similar to DND, PF, etc?
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>>56339419
>Veins of the Earth seems to be a spin-off of Lamentations of the Flame Princess. Then there's another setting called Ruin/Rust Princess? Plus there's another setting called Flame on the Velvet Horizon. Could someone please tell what these settings are about and what differentiates them?
All of this is Understandable But Wrong territory.

Veins of the Earth is really a supplement about Underdark shit, not so much a setting necessarily.

Ruinations (of the Dust Princess) is a local thread guy's unfinished post-apoc homebrew so I don't even know how you heard of that, but it's just a non-affiliated guy spinning off the rules of LotFP (which are mostly the rules of B/X D&D anyway) to make his own game.

Fire on the Velevet Horizon is yet another Not A Setting At All, it's just a monster book with no stats. Personally I consider it terribad and the art is worse, but there are people here who will defend it for some reason.

>Also, is there a database with a list of OSR settings?
No.

>In fact, what is OSR? Is it another system similar to DND, PF, etc?
It's really old-school D&D; playing D&D as it was meant to run originally, before people started thinking of RPG adventures as fantasy novels with some dice rolling in them. There are a lot of dungeons and wargamey shit, and very little patience for people being upset over character death.
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>>56339788
I see, anyone this does clarify things a lot for me. Are you saying that Veins of the Earth is a supplement of the DnD Underdark with the Drows and stuff?

Second, could you tell me about Lamentations of the Flame Princess as well?

> There are a lot of dungeons and wargamey shit, and very little patience for people being upset over character death
So it prioritizes gameplay over roleplay? How popular is it?
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>>56340176
>Are you saying that Veins of the Earth is a supplement of the DnD Underdark with the Drows and stuff?
VotE is a re-imagining of an Underdark setting. There is a lot of cannibalism.

>Second, could you tell me about Lamentations of the Flame Princess as well?
LotFP is a clone of b/x dnd. Not really a setting, although the implied setting is real-world 1600s with occult shit happening.
>So it prioritizes gameplay over roleplay? How popular is it?
This is sort of true, although by "gameplay" it's less of skill-rolls and damage numbers, and more of complex problem solving.
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>>56340331
>more of complex problem solving.
Could you give an example please?
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>>56337954
>crosslinks

What are you writing it in? If it's anything other than plain text you should be able to make a URL that displays a single word instead of the address.
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>>56340346
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>>56333136
I tend to do 1km hexes for roughly the same reason. Also, when dotting down the landscape with villages and towns, 1km hex = area used for the fields, orchards and pasture land to feed 50 people given late-medieval technology. So now I can easily convert between population and cultivated land area.
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>>56340458
Why.
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>>56340346
One basic example most people give is trap-finding/disarming.
Normally you roll perception and need to hit a certain number to find them, and thieves tools to disarm them.
But in an OSR style game the default way of finding traps is by telling the DM what you are doing.
If you are tapping the ground with a 10' pole you will find the pit trap. Alternatively you could pour water down the hall and watch for cracks it flows into etc. Then you have to come up with a plan to circumvent the trap.

Combat is also very deadly. You usually don't want to fight anything unless the odds are stacked in your favor. The problem then becomes "How do we defeats these monsters with a minimum amount of risk". This could involve ambushing them, leading them into a trap you discovered, or even allying with other monsters and getting them to fight each other.
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Is there anything similar to a Monster class?

As in: when you're getting into the mythic underworld, wouldn't be cool to make it as a former denizen?
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>>56340518
What is significance of roleplay?
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>>56340721
People can still roleplay their characters.
It's just more focused on the exploration of an imagined space, rather then the creation of an exciting theatrical production.
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>>56335475
>lightning is plasma, much like the sun, and plasma is just a supercharged version of fire
Depends on the setting, nerd.

>>56340544
Orcs of Thar
Creature Crucible
pic related
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>>56341261
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Where is the Man-beast article from?
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>>56341261
>Schizos
>Two personalities
An ideal class for schizos would be one that turns and manipulates illusions the same way a necromancer turns and manipulates the undead.
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>>56341430
It was a different time.
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I tried something late last night...

>SUMMONER Draft 0.1
A class for B/X and other OSR Games
HD: As Magic-User
EXP: As Magic-User
Saves: As Magic-User
Requirement: Charisma 12+, Constitution 8-.
Prime Requisite: Charisma

Summoners are folk who caught the allure of dancing with devils and dedicated their life to it. They are all oddities and outcasts in their own way and no one likes them. The arcane tissue that binds them deeply to this specialized magic has withered their body, and they often appear sickly.

Special Abilities: At first level they know the Summon spell as found in Lamentations of the Flame Princess. At third level and every odd numbered level after you roll on the Witch Traits table (https://basicredrpg.blogspot.com/2016/11/witch-traits.html).

At fifth level you know the spells Find Familiar, Contact Higher Plane, and Conjure Elemental. You can cast one spell per day. Find Familiar works as per your system, however it’s not quite right. Roll twice on the Witch Trait table and the pick one quality for the familiar.

Restrictions: You may only use wicked ceremonial daggers (d6 damage, 25gp). When dealing with anything other than a summoned creature or another summoner treat your Charisma score as 3. Should you ever reach 14th level the foreign creatures you’ve sought to control your whole life set out against you and steal you away to some untold place the next time you sleep.
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>>56339788
>but there are people here who will defend it for some reason.
http://udan-adan.blogspot.ca/2016/11/conceptual-density-or-what-are-rpg.html
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>>56340458
>posting my shitty underlined version
May you live in interesting times.
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>>56340721
Do we escort these captives and leave them be?
How might one go about bribing a Troll?
Are sheep hides enough to sneak past a Cyclops?
What do we do with all the money? Etc.

Plus trap searching (>>56340518) is a form of roleplay.
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>>56341261
>magic ring
>not meth
Poor form.
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>people ITT not understanding mutual respect and caring for your fellow man

I guess I shouldn't be surprised. No one is gonna call out a safeword every two seconds because they want to """win.""" There is not a concentrated push to invade /tg/ spaces and shame and insult other people. I'm genuinely sorry if this is your experience. Let people play the way that they want. If you don't like it, you can stay in your "safe space" and ignore it
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How do i start with wilderness of high fantasy and mystara? there are a lot of books from both :(
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>>56343623
The regions are largely self-conrained. Read until one catches your eye, then skim everything near it.
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>>56338430
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>>56343718
City-state of the invincible overlord
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>>56316288
Any good OSR video/podcast sessions?

I understand the concepts of OSR in principle but have no idea what they look like in practice having very much come from a 3.5/4E background when I started.
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Anyone taken the time to OSR'ify 5th edition? There's a lot I like about and would prefer to run it over some of the retro-clones I have, but the power level in it is obviously a step above what most OSR dungeons and adventures expect.
Does anyone have any simple rules they have used for this?
I was think either removing cantrips or making them just first level spells.
Modifying the long rest/short rest into some sort of amalgam and stick to being a long rest. I don't like the idea of fully healing with sleep, but the spending hit die seems aight. Not 100% sure what to do with this yet.
I would like to adapt lamentations encumbrance rules into the game as well, I fond that so much nicer to use than calculating weights that are always changing as I end up usually ignoring it for rations, torches, money ect ect but I don't WANT to do that.

Anyone have advice or thoughts other than just stop being a faggot and run Lamentations or the like?
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>>56344370
Stop being a faggot and run Moldvay.
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>>56344370
I’ve tried this in the past and it’s really not worth doing. Just play moldvay and start at level 3.
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>>56344370

What >>56344381 said.

Now i can enjoy 5th ed, but to even try to do what you are suggesting is gonna wreck the game trying to bend it into a role it is not designed for. What you'll get is a broken machine that might get you a game if you fight it some more while you try to play, but ultimately to get it functioning would be as big a task as making a game from scratch.

Incidentally, it is probably much easier to up the power levels of an OSR system either by just starting at higher level or porting in some stuff you'd like to tack on for that fantasy superheroes feel.
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>>56344528
>Incidentally, it is probably much easier to up the power levels of an OSR system either by just starting at higher level or porting in some stuff you'd like to tack on for that fantasy superheroes feel.
Why is upping the power level of an OSR game easier than downing the power level of 5e?

>but ultimately to get it functioning would be as big a task as making a game from scratch.
I feel like that is some crazy hyperbole. I mean dropping cantrips, modifying resting rules (which seems to already be common for 5e GMs) is hardly any work at all, like essentially no work. The only thing thats remotely work is adapting the LotFP encumbrance which is really just thinking of what penalties you get for going over 11/16/21 items.
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>>56344381
>>56344490


Thats essentially what I am currently doing (BFRPG), but I got free time and like 95% of 5th edition so I don't mind taking on a small challenge.
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>>56344704
It's not a small challenge.
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>>56344661
5e has a LOT of non-osr mechanics. Skills, cantrips, encumbrance, the magnitude of the effect of ability scores, the terrible dying rules, the healing rate, assumed XP for monster-killing, the assumed “adventuring day”. Couple that with how so many of the classes are designed with these things in mind and you start asking what are you really getting from 5e? What parts of it do you want over your run-of-the-mill B/X clone?
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>>56344704
There was a screencap for this, but I don't have it saved

I would start by using gold=xp, disallowing taking averages in HP rolls, and ignoring the skill system even exists. Ignore CR-based encounter building. Old-school style movement rules are up next. No multiclassing or feats, remove armor/weapon proficiencies from races.
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>New OSR bundle of holding.
>It includes a 5e adventure and a Pathfinder setting
I mean they both look interesting I guess, but why are they in an OSR bundle?
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>>56344370
My homebrew is based off LotFP meeting 5e.

https://www.docdroid.net/5JkxE6q/rc.pdf
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>>56344795
>>56344819
Oh, that reminds me
>Remove death saving throws
>Probably remove cantrips
>Remove a bunch of races and remove darkvision from most of the ones that are left
As for ability scores, 5e puts a LOT of weight in them and changing it would require revising the whole system, so don't mess with them too much. It's the price to pay in order to not just play a OSR system
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>>56344661

Well to do a further metaphor, OSR games are tool kits that tell you how to build a house. 5th ed already is a house so if you wanna knock down some walls you better hope they aren't load bearing.

5th ed is built on the design principles of codifying as much as it can. It assigns cool moves and concepts as class specific abilities rather than give you the tools to arbitrate things in general and letting the players come up with the cool moves and concepts they want to pursue in play by bouncing of the world.

The other thing is that 5th ed is a complex and interesting network of rules that play off each other so shifting these things may have a lot of far reaching mechanical consequences.
An example of the top of my head is this:
Cantrips need to be 'at will' because they are the caster's attack actions and skill use checks. Just look at how the offensive ones for example mirror the scaling of a martial class' attack action. Without them being at will then some of the casters become utterly crippled in a way that the system isn't designed to handle and now you need to rethink all subsequent encounter difficulties.

Another:
Long and short resting are intimately tied to the balance and differentiating of the classes. Merging them makes for example warlocks a lot worse because their 'weaker' spellcasting is tied to a quicker 'cooldown' both thematically and mechanically.

tl:dr
5th ed is the culmination of a lot of interconnected rules that all in unison create the 5th ed experience. Fucking with some of them without fucking with all of them wont change the experience so much as destabilize everything that is still trying to push the original goal.

But hell, im running a fever so maybe none of this makes my point in the way i hope it does...
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>>56344758
I disagree

>>56344795
Yeah, honestly I want to keep most of that stuff except I don't like the healing rate and I don't care about what wizards considers and "adventuring day" and their CR system. I guess I want to keep enough stuff that this would have been a better topic for 5eg then osrg.
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>>56344935

I totally get what your saying, though it seems the only specific rule change I mentioned that would have detrimental reprocussions would be the combining long and short rests, which I could just as easily NOT do, but perhaps modify the way they would to get rid of "you get all your health back during a full rest"

I don't think changing the encumbrance rules or modifying the cantrips will have any detrimental affects. As for the other things mentioned like removing death saving throws, turning gold into XP, no multiclassing ect ect is not stuff I had any intention of doing in the first place, I was just curious IF other people had attempted to do it and if they had then what did they do.

I know Zak S has a blog post where he posts his rules for it, but those seemed like more rule changes than I needed or wanted.
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>>56344935
Long rest/short rest is actually mostly fixed by making the sensible choice of taking the assumed 3 rests per day and just converting all short rest features into long rest ones, but giving 3 times as many uses. The warlock maybe just doubling them since spells are considerably more powerful than superiority dice and such. The short rest concept shouldn't have made it past playtesting.
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>>56344370
you can probably splice in LotFP encumbrance (or, go one better, and use VotE encumbrance, which makes carrying stuff both simpler and more interesting) since in reality fucking nobody pays attention to encumbrance.

The problem is that, as others have said, 5e is a finely balanced thing and fucking with part of it will have all sorts of knock-on effects. It's probably easier to take an OSR system and hack it to incorporate 5e stuff that you like than visa versa.

This >>56344830 anon's rules are good, you should use them as a base.
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>>56344370
Run Swords & Wizardry, or if you can't do without ascending AC, BFRPG or Castles & Crusades
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>>56345108
>I don't think changing the encumbrance rules or modifying the cantrips will have any detrimental affects

Encumberance? Probably not. Cantrips? Definitley unless you put them on a level of availability that is in most cases functionally at will (like 20 per rest or whatever) because wizards, sorcerers, warlocks, hell especially EK and AT all NEED those cantrips to function as intended.

An analogy for taking away cantrips might be saying that a battlemaster may only use their weapon when using maneuvers because as designed thats what they are: the baseline 'i hit it with my sword' combat. The Eldritch knight is an especially good example of this because its a garbage fighter, but it can buff itself for the big showdown using spellslots and become a passable fighter using cantrips. So if the cantrips run out of juice, its just a garbage fighter.

This works in OSR because Magic Users are individuals with great but limited power trying to navigate a dangerous world. It doesnt in 5th because without ample access to cantrips, casters are players of a tactical battle game that suddenly dont get to play so you'll really need to clear that with your players or they will feel left out.
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>>56345334

I would be doing this most likely with the free basic rules, so I am not worried about the Eldritch Knight. I disagree that the spellcasters need cantrips to function, I also seen them removed in 5e houserules before without any real consequences.

I slapped together the test encumbrance rules, using a mix of lotfp and the variant encumbrance rules from 5e. Will have to test it out and modify as needed when I am not at work.
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>>56345542
Warlock is still a cantrip machine though. I mean they could basically be renamed Eldritch Blaster because much of the class is centered around making your EB cantrip better and their proper casting isn't really on par with the 'real' casters.

Im also curious to what extent you played with limited cantrips and how limited they were because they ARE designed as a token way for them to matter in fights where they have already spent their cool shit or while saving said cool shit for later.

But still, im not saying this to discourage you if you really want to do this, im just trying to highlight some of the things that stand out from what you've mentioned so best of luck to you.
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>>56345334
>the baseline 'i hit it with my sword' combat
I don't see what's wrong with letting them carry a crossbow or some acid.
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>>56345686

I've never played with a Warlock so I have no opinion on how they are affected, but I played with literally just no cantrips. 1st level spells and up only. It honestly just felt like playing a 3.5 or lower caster, just buy a light crossbow, survive a few levels and become a god.
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Hey it's my first time running a hex crawl and I'm wondering how big the hexes should ideally be. Ultimately I want a global hex map that's entirely explorable, but I don't know if that's a pie in the sky goal.
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>>56317994
>shit
Truth is hard to accept, but it doesn't make it any less true. Then again, the average soyboy of today is basically a woman, so I can see how you'd feel this way, kid
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>>56345840

>>56319679
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>>56344918
Why should you remove darkvision?
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>>56345859
Well. I guess I should have read the thread.
But, uhh, what about in a game where the players would have a car?
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>>56345876
Because literally just halflings, humans and dragonborn DON'T have darkvision in 5e. There's no real need to arbitrarily trivialize a handy enviromental danger, while also arbitrarily fucking over humans, which are already super shitty compared to everyone else unless you go vhuman, which is a bad fix
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>>56345848
I appreciate how much this bait sounds like a legitimate /r9k/ faggot.
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>>56345886
Pointcrawl.
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>>56345756

Basically, because they aint good enough at aciding or crossbowing. Early on it kinda works, but in essence the game requires your weapons to progress with you and play of your stats. A wizard for example needs int to be a wizard and con to maintain concentration and should only really pick up dex or strength as a third priority at best, or maybe second if you're daring about dropping your concentration spells.

But the difficulty then comes from the fact that a wizard never gets the cool addon damage like extra attacks or cant benefit from feats like crossbow expert (if you use feats) because they dont have the bonuses to back up the power attack to-hit penalty. Furthermore they dont have the proficiency for heavy crossbows so they'll only deal shitty crossbow damage, and carrying enough acid flasks to use those as a basic attack seems unlikely both financially and encumbrance wise.

Functionally this applies to sorcerers too, warlocks and bards can technically be weapon focused but with varying degrees of functionality. Clerics aren't really part of this they dont have a built in reliance on cantrips.

>>56345814
To further my note on warlocks above. If you remove cantrips in general, take a long hard look at the warlock class and its reliance on eldritch blast. They can technically do a melee focused "Bladelock" but they are... kinda bad.

So basically what it boils down to is this: One (or more) of the players is relegated to a backseat role and/or token contributions to combat in a combat centric game. On top of that you now have to consider your encounter design around the idea that one of your characters isn't really contributing unless he suddenly blows everything the fuck up.

More to come.
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>>56346320
cont

This works fine in games built like OSR games where a relativley dumb magic user becomes a challenge for the player and party to make the most out of, but in a game that is so focused on the combat and number crunching to the exclusion of much else like 5th it can become boring to even play a 'suboptimal' character because you dont feel like you contribute tactically and character wise mostly end up undermining your own vision unless you are going for the 'inept sidekick' character. This is because 5th EXPECTS you to strive towards maxing out your class' primary stat, to use the things that gel with that stat and so on. And that's where a wizards firebolt comes in for example. It i literally a heavy crossbow that uses the casting stat to hit and happens to scale up in damage around the time say a fighter would get more attacks.

There are ways to fix this and make everyone feel relevant and so on sure, but then you need to find a new point of balance with encounter difficulty/number per day etc. and we're back to doing things that have far reaching consequences for many different classes. Its like dominoes, you take out one and suddenly the whole cascade stops anticlimactically and you gotta go in and nudge things again.


There, that's my experience on the subject. Hope it helps more than it shits on your plans.
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>>56345968
Thanks man. I try :)
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>>56346272
Interesting I'll look into it. Thanks.
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Why do 5heads always come here asking how to turn their game into OSR-lite? LITERALLY what do they mean by this?
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>>56347126
They become disillusioned with their game and how it is dominated by 3.shitfinder babbies but are too passive and abused to actually get their group to switch to a game they actually would like to play.
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>>56347126
They heard that it's this cool underground thing but they're too scared to fully commit to it so they come here to mop up whatever they can use.
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>>56347126
5e's marketing drew a bit of attention to OSR and people adventurous enough to switch to 5e are adventurous enough to switch away,
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>>56347126
I would assume they want different things because there's a lot going on in 5e that people might want altered. It's also not just 5e players wanting to turn 5e old school, when 5e was released several OSR blogs at the time had interest in it and tried taking a crack at making it more old school too.

That being said? I can take a few guesses on their true intention. They probably want some combinations of fast character creation, lethal combat, less reliance on a skill list and skill DCs, generally speaking less powerful characters, Ease of use/readability/hackability, and dungeon crawling.
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>>56347126
They know there's something that isn't working with their current style, but they aren't sure what. Since doing a full system switch is a big step, like leaping off an imaginary cliff, they start by adapting.

I don't think it's a bad strategy, but it's a band-aid solution. Examine your problems carefully.
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>>56348688
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>>56349480
>how would you hunt vampires?
By means of high level cleric.
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>>56347126
>LITERALLY what do they mean by this?
That is indeed the question.
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Updated DCC Trove.

https://mega.nz/#F!sMkXGLAA!SKFONS1gf6unPsgbQbHzhw
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>>56347126
In many ways, 5e is a lot neater than, say, B/X.
Instead of being a weird mix of d20 roll-over attacks vs descending AC, roll-over saves, roll-under characteristic checks, wonky d100 thief skills, miscellaneous d6 search/secret door/surprise/whatever else rolls and the like, everything is just d20+stat+proficiency vs DC.

If you want to play an OSR-style game but don't like the fairly haphazard mechanics of early D&D, 5e seems like a good base to work from.
Unfortunately, the devil is in the details, and there are numerous subtle things that make it unsuitable. Like the number of hit points, passive perception, rituals and the like.

A better plan, I think, would be to approach it from the other end and smooth over B/X's kinks with 5e's mechanics rather than trying to strip 5e down to an Old School game. I'm surprised it hasn't been done already, honestly.
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>>56350994
except for ascending vs descending AC, most of those things you mentioned are just better handled by the weird subsystems. A non-scaling 2d6 morale roll is just better than a d20-based equivalent. d% thief skills mean you actually get better and have an estimate of your chance of success (although someone completely reworking the thief or removing it I wouldn’t be opposed to). d6 rolls are objectively better for low probability rolls such as wandering monsters or secret door searches -- they’re simply easier to remember and are easier to roll frequently. Finally, not everything being a stat roll is a feature -- the 6 dnd stats are woefully insufficient for the true scope of play. Look at the hamfisted attempts to shove perception into wisdom -- that is just not wisdom is in normal english or even in a literature or story sense of the word.
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>>56351096
I agree to a certain extent. The odd subsystems are fine as part of GM procedures where the functions are mostly arbitrary. A random encounter roll isn't versus anything, it's just a 1-in-6. Morale rolls aren't strictly necessary, they just inject a useful amount of randomness.

On the player-facing side of things, though, I prefer it to be consistent. "Does constitution help with saves versus poison?" "Yes, but only at really high levels. I don't remember exactly what it is, let's find the chart. That's under character generation, right?" and so on.
I've got some criticisms of 5e's Proficiency system, but mostly I think it does a good job of differentiating characters where appropriate and doing so in a way that doesn't require you to look things up.
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>>56351469
Certainly, I think consistant -3 to +3 modifiers, rather than the weird-mish-mash that some versions use, is better.
But 'apply your con mod to saves vs poison' isn't too hard.
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>>56351469
Is your constitution changing in the middle of the dungeon? Don’t you just look-up any weird bonus at char-gen and adjust the number on your sheet instead of spelling it out at the table?

Personally, I’d rather have a game where the numbers and statistics were shaped through actual play and play testing than just because the tables or formulae look “neat”. Pragmatism vs Purity I suppose.
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>>56351469
If you can't remember a rule, don't use it.
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>>56351804
>if you can't remember a rule, change it so you remember it
FTFY
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>>56350734

Much obliged anon!
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>>56344821
The Mad Manticore thing seems easily workable in osr, if not a thing I'd run. The index card rpg is wack though. Its an actual hot garbage situation.
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>>56351804
The most elegant rule in Neoclassical Geek Revival.
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>>56351804
what if you have a bad memory
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>>56352420
Then you'll play a very simple game. Or make lots of inconsistent rulings.
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>>56352420
>what if you have a bad memory
Cheat sheets, cue cards, or switch to being a player - my players can't remember most of the rules anyway.
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>>56352921
I put the most autismally keen player in charge of remembering what's in the book, on the understanding that their role is only to advise.

It's one of those ooc party roles: Mapper, caller, inventory tracker, rules nerd, hireling tracker, etc.
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>he only has one mapper
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Has anyone read through Campbell's "On the Non-Player Character"? Is it any good?
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>>56351096
>d% thief skills mean you actually get better and have an estimate of your chance of success (although someone completely reworking the thief or removing it I wouldn’t be opposed to).
Given 7 different skills, it's quite easy to have advancement in at least something at every level without having to depend on percentile dice. LotFP gives you a couple of points to allocate at every level, and it uses fucking d6s. With a d20 system, you could group skills into far fewer units and still have them constantly advancing (see pic).

And yes, it's easy to understand your chance of success with percentile stats, but if that's important, why not use percentile stats elsewhere as well? I don't mind there being select subsystems that work differently when it's clearly advantageous for them to do so, but I do feel like old school D&D tends to be a hodge-podge to an unnecessary degree. You don't need d6 surprise, d10 initiative, d20 roll over saving throws and attack rolls, d20 roll under attribute checks, d% skills (except for hear noise which is d6), 2d6 morale, and so forth. I feel like it would be an improvement to have a standardized system, with maybe an exception or two. The rule and then the exception, rather than just a whole bunch of different rules.
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Planning on running Labyrinth Lord for some guys at work soon, doing sessions for about an hour over lunch breaks. Been looking at a few modules to run to cut down on some prep (barrowmaze and stonehell are what I've been reading). Any suggestions on what would be good for short sessions, possibly with some variance each week in terms of which players are available?
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Question: Many of the old-school games are as different from the source as some of the games published way back then, yet all of them seem to feel the need to waste paper on the open game license. Why for? I mean if it's a clone, then sure, but otherwise?
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>>56355554
It lets them use D&D property identity without getting sued.
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>>56355593
GORE is a clone of RQ yet has the OGL. There are others, it's like the OGL is a badge for OSR.
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>>56355611
¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Does GORE have any blatant D&D leanings (attribute names, etc)?
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>>56316288
Is there something like a solitaire OSR game?

Like a party based Barbarian Princes?
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>>56355650
It's got all the stuff that RQ copied from D&D, stats, hit points ect...
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Why is Mutant Crawl Classics so hated?
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>>56351469
>Morale rolls aren't strictly necessary
lel, good luck removing them and having shit work right.
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>>56353753
I don't get this. If you do a d20 mechanic roll, how do you roll above a 23 if you don't have any bonuses other than potential dexterity?
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>>56355554
>Why for?
Honestly, they're just twitches of fear. It's like crossing yourself or drawing the evil eye on your boat to avoid getting hexed. America is so litigious that the publisher guys are just superstitiously afraid of being sued for something that's actually legal, so they make these abjuring gestures of putting legal-looking agreements in their books to protect themselves.

You'll notice Raggi, who say what you will of him isn't a coward, and who also lives in Finland under Finnish law, doesn't do that shit.
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>>56356658
>I don't get this. If you do a d20 mechanic roll, how do you roll above a 23 if you don't have any bonuses other than potential dexterity?
Read the boldface: "For the d20 Mechanic (treating your skill values as bonuses to a d20 roll):" So you're adding the thief skill values from the table on the left (under "Thief Skill Values" to your roll and trying to overcome the target number. So let's say you're a 5th level thief and you're using a standard skill (not strong or weak). A 5th level thief's standard skill score is 12 (from the table on the left) and you're trying to perform a difficult task, which has a target number of 25 (from the table on the right). So you roll a d20, add your thief skill of 12 (and possibly your dexterity modifier) and try to meet or beat 25.

If, however you're doing the roll-under system, you do it like this... You're rolling directly against your thief score of 12, and trying to get equal to it or less. However, since it's a fairly difficult task, you get a -5 modifier to your target number for that roll. So the 12 becomes a 7, and you have to roll a 7 or less to succeed.
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>>56356796
I see, thank you. Turns out I was just blind.
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>>56356812
No problem. Honestly, having the mathematical variants on the same page is kind of confusing. I should probably just make different pages for the d20 system and the roll-under system.
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>>56350994

This was to a certain extent discussed upthread, and basically it'd be easier to take a simple D20 system similar to 5th and building an OSR game on it than scaling 5th itself back.

Secondly it sounds like most of what you're talking about has indeed been done. Like say in DCC, which admittedly is based on 3.5 but essentially only differs from a 5th-based version in that it has Will, Fort and Reflex saves instead of six.

Im sure someone who's read more games than me can point out something similar without DCCs eccentricities.
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>>56357130
>>56357130
>>56357130




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