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China General

This general is for the discussion of:

>Travelling in China
>Working in China
>Living in China

And all other Chinkshit.

Old thread is long gone.
>>
ExpressVPN went to shit today

Proton VPN doesn't work 99% of the time.

Is it best to just roll your own fucking VPN at this point? What's the best way to do that for individual devices and for a router?
>>
>>1487930
Or just use Tor Browser fren
>>
>>1487935

Normie shit is blocked on TOR.

Any good guides for Shadowsocks? Also looking to install it on some routers. Hoping to get on something that isn't blocked all the fucing time.
>>
Get lantern, I've never had a problem with it once.
>>
White pig go home
>>
>>1487930
I used nord vpn with almost no issue, just it can be tedious trying a dozen servers until you find one which connects. I would recommend setting up your own if u can, and maybe have nordvpn as a back up.
>>
>>>/gif/thread/13818530
>>
>>>/gif/thread/13801078
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China is the superior country lol
america is full of niggers lol
>>
>>1487930
>Is it best to just roll your own fucking VPN at this point? What's the best way to do that for individual devices and for a router?
Pretty much.
I use the highly technical solution of pic related.
You just need a server outside and you're good. It does tend to get throttled a bit from time to time and it competes with everyone's digital TV for bandwidth but it works more or less and they'll never waste an IP ban on it when there are commercial versions to worry about.

That works fine for a PC but not so well for phones, there's probably an app to make it work though.
There's also Shadow.socks which you can google, that is apparently pretty bullet proof.
>>
>>1487984
got it, bought pro, got cucked since.
it works occassionally, but only when I log out for free mode. when I contact support they gave me some free months of use..... except it doesnt even work
>>
>>1487930
Express tends to go down a couple times a year in China. From my experience they usually have it back up within a day or two with instructions on how best to connect. I'd still stick with them for the time being, but up to you
>>
>>1487930
Nord VPN working well since I have been in China
>>
Any standout bars in Beijing to check out? Anything to avoid?
>>
>>1487929
I’m white and know mandarin what would job opportunities be like for me?
>>
>>1488189
>I’m white
Cocksucker no one gives a shit what pigment your dick is. Like for fucks sake
>>
>>1488189
You've got better job opportunities in the West. Just highlight your mandarin knowledge on your resume and apply to international companies.
>>
>>1488211
Mmm in China they do
>>
>>1488222
I don’t want to live in the west. I hate every western country
>>
>>1488222
I don’t have other skills either
>>
>>1488230
Figures if you hate the west and want to move to China to teach English for hot dogs
>>
>>1488014
lmao
>>
>>1488189
You need a degree for any good job, there are illegal jobs without degrees but they're obviously not going to pay that well and you can get fucked over a lot.
I knew a guy who worked in China for four months at three companies before he finally got a paycheck from one of them, the others just kept pulling these scams about the bank fucking things up and stuff and telling him to wait till they did the next payroll cycle in a month etc.
Illegal teachers (no degree) are just chewed up by the dodgy schools and even by the "good" ones sometimes.

It can happen if you have a degree and visa too but it's less common and you can change jobs more easily sand safely if you have that since you're in the country legally and there isn't that much a dodgy school can do to you if you tell them to fuck off.

>>1488290
>move to China to teach English for hot dogs
If anon is qualified and gets a job at a decent school, their accommodation is usually paid for, living expenses are so cheap it's nearly free and everything they earn is disposable income/savings. I know 2nd year teachers in a tier 2 city on 25k RMB/month plus an apartment. They're saving most of that.

I realise that's not too competitive with a good career in the west but it compares well with most office jobs where you're not that likely to save more than about $2k/month at most.
>>
>>1488290
I hate western culture and cities and lifestyle I’m a genius
>>
Just spent a month visiting random small cities and towns in Anhui and Jiangsu. Small Chinese cities tend to have a reputation for being generic concrete hells, which I suppose is true to some extent, but there's always something interesting to see or do. I love visiting tier-99 and seeing the gaudy lighting on the plastic pagodas in the parks. I love taking buses to bumfuck nowhere and just wandering around rural areas. I love trying the overly contrived "local specialities" literally every place, no matter how small, seems to offer. And almost invariably, people are surprised that I've come to their crappy town and show me a bunch of cool stuff.

There's a distinct charm in the crappiness of China. Anyone else know this feel?
>>
Would you guys suggest 5 days in Qingdao,beijing, or shanghai in early january? I prefer eating and partying historical sights and hiking is nice and all but not a huge priority
>>
>>1488189
ESL
>>
>>1489987
Shanghai if you want western standards but less culture, Beijing if you want a bit less western standards but more culture, Qingdao if you want no western standards but more culture with some German influence.
>>
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I'm going to have six hours of layover in Chengdu on the way to Tibet, can any of you guys recommend a tour company that could take me to the earthquake museum like 70ish miles north of the city?

Or anything else to do close to the airport? I'm particularly interested in politics and communist history.
>>
>>1489981
>Anyone else know this feel?
Sure.
I kind of enjoyed Longyan, Fuzhou which is out in the middle of nowhere but is the jumping off point for the roundhouses.

>>1490103
>can any of you guys recommend a tour company that could take me to the earthquake museum like 70ish miles north of the city?
Maybe email a hostel and ask them. They might be able to sort something out though they don't have much incentive to do so.
>>
>>1488211
Found the guy who's never been to China.
I was travelling and got offered 200usd to attend a random board meeting and pretend I understood what I was listening to while people stared at me and some Chinese guy told everyone god knows what

>>1489981
I know the "enjoying Chinese crapiness" feel.
Also in the post soviet union, it's soul less and neat
>>
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>>1487929
How tough is teaching English in tier 2 China if i come from a first world country, i was thinking one of the more northern cities to avoid the heat (and massive rent of shanghai) but i get the impression that Northern china gets the worse of the China problems like pollution and lack of development. But, living in a tropical climate just seems terrible. Don't mind teaching kindergarten and am hoping to only do it for a year or two. Shanghai is probably the safest bet but the cost of rent is terrifying
>>
>>1490633
>Northern china gets the worse of the China problems like pollution and lack of development
Some places are worse than others. Some northern places are fine, others are shitholes. Though they can be fun shitholes regardless like Lanzhou, awful pollution, dirty and crowded but fun and with character.
Dalian is a northern city that expats really like, it's coastal so the pollution isn't bad at all, international so you can get anything you want there, it has normal Chinese infrastructure, so it's not Shanghai or Beijing but it's ok.

>Don't mind teaching kindergarten
That's unironically where the most money is, unless you take a tonne of private students and basically work as a freelance tutor full-time.

It's common to have accommodation included in your salary package so often you don't pay rent at all. Still, Shanghai can be unpleasant in summer. Dalian seems to be the one that everyone likes but can't really say why. I've been there and thought it was cool but nothing special, I wasn't living there though.
>>
>>1490633

I don't know why any sensible person would want to go to a Tier 2 city.
>>
>>1490645
It's more "Chinese" than a tier 1 city and it's more fun being a big fish in a small pond than just another fucking foreigner in Beijing where everyone is over foreigners.
Tier 2 cities are kind of the sweet spot between being able to save money, still have fun and get western food when you want a night out and socialise with other expats when you want to speak English.
>>
>Farting
>Spitting
>Burping
>All the fucking time
>Everywhere, even in the Mao line
>Even women

Seriously, it was funny at first but after a week in Beijing is driving me insane. I have been in a lot of SEA shitholes and I have seen everything, but this crap is getting out of hand.
>>
>>1490670
Racist.
>>
>>1490721
Most of the spits/phlegms are brown/red
Years of smoking + deadly polution + uneducated mainlanders perhaps?
>>
>>1490645
high rent is spooky, plus i heard that some of the tier 2 cities aren't that bad, a friend said he'd try to teach me basic mandarin if i wanted so ill hopefully be able to read menus and Bus timetables well enough before i leave.
>>1490637
I was thinking xi'an (although i don't know if that is tier 2 or not) since it seems nice and people are apparently friendly enough with it being a big tourist city, i'm hoping to avoid training centers and get an ESL job that is hopefully 9-5 so i can attempt a social life. Xi'an's climate also doesn't seem too bad if i'm coming from western Europe either
>>
>>1491019
It's not an official list. It started as a USA magazine's classification of Chinese real-estate prices, it's been tweaked over the years by various Chinese newspapers who made their own versions but it's still not official.

Originally, there are only four tier 1 cities: Beijing, Tianjin, Shanghai, Chongqing
Unofficially, Shenzhen and Guangzhou are generally added to the list and Chongqing is sometimes taken out.
After that, nearly anything with at least two starbucks is considered tier 2.

Xi'an is definitely tier 2, squarely in the middle of that group. It has bad pollution, mostly because of all the charcoal BBQs I think. So bad that you can see haze on the other side of the road sometimes. Aside from that, it's nice enough but it's definitely a tourist city and you probably wouldn't be living inside the walls so the pretty parts of Xi'an wouldn't be something you'd see every day. It's a big city though and has anything that you'd want there.
>>
Question about Taiwan, but figured this thread gets more eyes.
Is there a site or app to buy and sell concert tickets in Taipei? For a small indie rock show, not mandopop status.
>>
>>1491138
>Unofficially, Shenzhen
how is this possible? i thought Shenzhen is a tier 1 without a doubt
>>
>>1491313
Did you read the post?
It's explained why Shenzhen is unofficial.
>>
As a white chinese speaking engineer, are there opportunities in China?

I'm getting tired of the West.
>>
In Japan I was fucking invisible but here people want to take pictures with me all the fucking time, even selfies, especially chinese grannies lol. It was funny at first but now I feel like some kind of circus monkey when I go to a tourist spot.
Do they find western guys that 'funny'?
>>
>>1491529
>As a white chinese speaking engineer, are there opportunities in China?
Yes but you need to get the job with the western company and then get a transfer to Shenzhen or wherever to supervise a Chinese factory or something.
It's a very sweet gig if you can get it, the best of both worlds. Living in China on western salary because you're assumed to be going to come home eventually and want to buy a house etc so they have to pay you on similar rates to your coworkers back in the west. China has low living costs though so you can save money easily.
It's sort of a hard gig to get into though but start by talking to HR departments of engineering companies who have factories in China.

>>1491609
>but now I feel like some kind of circus monkey when I go to a tourist spot
Yeah, it gets annoying after a while. It makes it easy to pick up chicks but unless they're a 20yo qt, you eventually want people to fuck off. I think of it as a bit like being a hot girl in the west.
>Do they find western guys that 'funny'?
A bit yeah, novel at least.
>>
>>1487929
Yes
>>
>>1491609
That really surprised me too.
I have lived in HK and worked a lot in Shenzhen and never stuck out. Of course I would get some stares when I traveled in remote towns to audit factories, but that was to be expected when I was the only westerner in the whole city (feels weird to nod at another westerner in the breakfast room because it’s the first white face you saw in 3 days).
Only when I traveled to Shanghai, Beijing and Xi’An of all places (where I expected westerners to be a common sight), people would always look at us, sneak pics or even come to me and asked for selfies. A bunch of cuties even asked my wife to photograph them with me, boy was she pissed lol. I still wonder why so many people saw a family of white people as novel in such touristic places.
>>
I've got a six hour layover in Chengdu. I figure Mt Qingcheng is a bit too far away, but is there anything right outside the airport? My main interest is politics and culture, I'm not too into going to bars.

Also ending the trip in Tibet. Do any Americans have experience in Lhasa? I've heard it's illegal to just walk around the capital unsupervised but my first couple of days are spent there acclimatizing and I'd be a bit bummed out if we had to spend it all in the hotel, when the city looks so fun to walk through.
>>
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>>1490670
This is fucking hilarious
>>
Any thoughts on Wuhan? Probably gonna spend a semestr there. Tips would be welcome, thanks.
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>>1490670

I was in Chinarr for couple weeks past weeks. All I saw/heard was spitting, even on the train and plane, lol.

Never noticed any farting goin' on. The fuck?
>>
>>1491915

Past summer I meant.
>>
>>1491908
>Any thoughts on Wuhan?
It's big, a little polluted but there are worse places.
It's sort of the LA of China, it's a big transport hub, quite spread out. It's actually three cities merged into one big one so it has three main stations, three CBDs etc.
Just the one airport though, I think.

It's an international city with an expat scene, so if you feel like you're suffering from culture shock and burnt out with Chinese bullshit, it's easy enough to go get a steak meal and head out to an expat bar and chill for an evening. Actually, there are so many expats that the scene is quite fragmented, in smaller cities everyone hangs out at the same places and knows everyone, in Wuhan, it depends on which expat groups you associated with.

>>1491915
I have literally never seen spitting on a plane. People don't even do it on trains except into the trash pan.
>>
>>1487929
has anyone reapplied for a visa after an overstay?

i overstayed a few days, went to PSB in shenzen they said no problem for first time, fixed it and left.

i cam back home to re-apply but it was rejected, consulate said wait 3 months before applying.

what are my chances of getting back in?
>>
>>1491953
>has anyone reapplied for a visa after an overstay?
I have and got it ok but I didn't apply myself, it was through an agent.
>>
>>1491943
And what about the chinese ppl there? The young especially.
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>>1492088
Dating is kind of forbidden until university, if an ESL teacher fucks a student, expect to get v& and deported.
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>>1492118
Nonono, sorry. I ment I'm gonna spend a semester there studying chinese on a uni.
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>>1492128
And already speak it on an intermediate level.
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>>1492088
Some of the most chill people I've met are from Hubei. Not as nice as Hunan or Sichuan people, but almost there.
>>
>>1492128
>I'm gonna spend a semester there studying chinese on a uni
Oh, right. Then you're almost guaranteed to meet some student there who you go out with for a semester and then turn your life upside down to stay with. You'll be there for about two days before you've found some kid studying English who you swap language practice with and then end up dating.

>>1492135
Do you really think there are those kinds of regional differences?
>>
>>1491754
Why go to Tibet? It just seems like such a shitty and expensive thing to do. Who the fuck wants to be followed around by Chinese guides?
>>
Anyone have any advice on what to do in Shanghai? I’ll be going there for a week to visit an old buddy, but I’m at a loss on what to do while he’s working for a few days. I only speak English and I have no idea how to make the most of it other than wander with my pockets stuffed with pictures of crudely drawn dicks.
>>
>>1492139
Oh definitely. It does help that none of those provinces are as overpopulated as the coastal places, less competition.
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>>1492369
I'm pretty sure your old buddy will have some suggestions.
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How feasible would it be to rent a helicopter in order to avoid descending mt.Everest?
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>>1493691
You can visit the base camps pretty easily, there are sometimes helicopters to/from the summit. You'll need to do your own research.

The place is sometimes closed though, depending on how dangerous it is at the time and the weather and stuff. You'd want to check before you go and you can never be guaranteed that you can do what you want up there.
>>
I want to work in China. Do you think that's feasible with a degree in Computer Systems Engineering? I'm still at the start of my major and quite undecided, so I'll take anecdotes for C.S. or engineering if you have any as well.
>>
>>1493956
No, that's not feasible.
There's no reason why a Chinese company would employ you over a Chinese programmer and in fact they're not even really allowed to since you're not bringing a skill that local Chinese can't provide. The visa rules outline exactly which jobs are available to foreigners.

In theory, I suppose that companies like Ubisoft might hire you to oversee/run their Shanghai office but they wouldn't hire graduates for that, they'd use their own management/senior developers from another office and the Shanghai office has been around so long that I'm sure it's run by their own Shanghai staff now.
That's the only way that expats do management, financial or technical work in China though, on transfer from western offices of companies with offices in China. Everything else is either airline pilot or ESL teacher.

If you're very serious about this though, do some googling and find companies with branches in China and contact the HR of those companies and ask them how you'd end up on that career path. See what they say.
>>
>>1493981
I see, thanks anon. That sounds very similar to Japan.
>>
>>1494039
>similar to Japan
FWIW and it could well be 20 year old memes, people do say that foreign programmers are in demand in Japan. I don't get it personally.
>>
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Going to Yunnan and Sichuan next year in June,
anyone have any tips on what to see and do? would love some advice!
>>
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>>1493956
>>1493981
Seconding the advice about getting a transfer from a western company.

Are you American? For what it's worth, you should know that the US is one of (if not THE) best places for a computer/software engineer to work in terms of compensation. In China, programmers can expect less than $40,000 as an annual salary. Further, programmers/engineers are not seen with the same elevated social distinction in China as in America. In America engineers are seen as a rung or two below doctors & lawyers, programmers in China are seen more in line with technicians and skilled blue collar labor.

The ideal situation is to get into a company with offices in China and get a transfer over while still keeping that fat American salary. I'm working on a similar trajectory myself, I'm currently based in the US, and I'm looking to get into a position that will put me in China/Taiwan in 2019. Good luck brother!
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>>1494401
i wish i was interested in tech stuff, but God only gave me the interest of History and Archeology.
is there any hope for me? I've heard history professors are highly regarded in China
>>
>>1494410
Teachers in general are highly regarded in China.
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>>1494411
hmm nice, i better aim for that then!
>>
>>1494410
It's very hard for foreigners to get university jobs in China other than ESL monkey and even then, they're just a 'teacher' and not a professor or anything, maybe more like a teaching assistant. These jobs don't pay that great and after benefits, pensions etc, the local staff sometimes end up better off though they do have a lot more bullshit to deal with.

High schools can and do hire English-speaking teachers of various subjects, if it's a Chinese high school with an international program where they teach their whole curriculum in English or something. Those exist. These pay pretty well from what I've heard but you need a dip Ed or similar on top of your subject's degree. A CELTA/DELTA generally doesn't cut it.
>>
Use cryptostorm.is
>>
>>1493956
These guys basically are right with some exceptions
>>1493981
>>1494401
The memes that its impossible to get a visa or a job as a foreigner is not quite true. We have several in most disciples from business to design and also some programmers. We also have all from interns up to leads like me and even a few director roles. None are on loan from western companies.

I would guess salaries are not same as us though but compared to European standard they are fine. Wage differeces are much higher though, lower salaries are worse but higher positions are better.

Also for chinese programmers $40k is far from todays standard. Our seniors make 30-40k rmb monthly, then another 40-80% in bonus every year.

However. As a fresh graduate with nothing but white skin and and some basic programming i would not recommend applying here. For same reasons as the above anons are listing.
>>
>>1494615
>30-40k rmb monthly
That's a tier 1 city, right?
Nobody makes that in my tier 2 city, I know senior doctors who only make half that.
>>
>>1494665
tier cities? can you explain a bit more about different tier cities?
>>
Is HK just one giant tourist trap? I am planning on heading there in February with a couple friends and don't want to get sucked into the plastic bs.
Recommendations?
>>
>>1494394
There is so much even in just those two provinces...
Yunnan with everything from the the Pu'er tea fields to the Tibet-like parts.
Sichuan with the amazing food culture and the crazy cities.
>>
>>1494711
have you been there? mind telling me a little about your experiences? would be interesting to read
>>
>>1494685
>can you explain a bit more about different tier cities?
Did you read the thread? I literally explained the tier system here: >>1491138

>>1494707
>Is HK just one giant tourist trap?
No, it's really not. It's a giant CBD on an island, plus a giant slum-ish shopping district on the mainland, lots of giant malls and a bunch of other stuff that no one remembers about.
It's really not a touristy place at all outside of a few small areas, obviously Disney Land is one of those areas.
The place deserves its own thread though and there's already one up so go over and ask in there. Better yet, check the archive where there should be three or so threads from just last week.

HK isn't plastic bs, it's shiny, expensive bs for people that are, or aspire to be, ostentatiously rich. It's not as bad as Macau in that sense but it's up there.
There's a less visible side of HK which is much poorer, dirtier and arguably, more fun. You need to get away from TST and Central for that.
Also, it's quite a different place near the border and out on some of the more distant bays. If you're there a week, take the MTR to the end of the lines and explore.

>>1494711
Yunnan also has jungle buddhists down south and Sichuan has pandas obviously. A hydrofoil down to Wuhan is cool too.
>>
>>1494752
saw some Pandas in Beijiing, i think it was Beijiing, but can't remember. They're okay. Animals are not really my thing, but the Buddhist place in Seda looks interesting.
>>
How long does getting a visa take approximately? Western European, no risk factors or any other shit like that
>>
>>1494826
Depends on your country, the Chinese visa website of your country will advise you properly.
You cannot apply more than 3 months in advance, 1 month in advance is the most ideal in every country, but then it varies whether you get your passport back in 2 work days or 5.
They also all do same-day service for double the price in lots of places if you are in a rush.

It also depends on you, they will ask you when you can go back to pick up your visa.
>>
>>1490670
In China everyone has the manners of your old uncle
>>
>>1490103
youre not doing that in 6 hours buddy

just get the subway to chengdu center and get some food and shit
>>
>>1494845
Ok, thanks. But in general, it shouldn't take more than 2 weeks or so?
>>
>>1494665
Yeah we are in a tier 1, but we have offices in tier 2 cities too.

> I know senior doctors who only make half that.
You mean medical?

I think being a gp in a public clinic here isn't not a high regarded job, at least compared to the western standard. I heard similar about lawyers too. I only heard this from other people though.
>>
>>1494998
I mean senior medical doctor in major hospitals.
I'm sure it's different in tier 1 cities but here, they end up making about 20k/month after all the 'gifts' and things are included, it's complicated because salary is only part of it and there are a lot of red packets and things like surgeries are kind of billed to the hospital and paid separately. They often donate their surgery work either out of charity for very poor families or guanxi.

I have a few doctors in my in-laws.
>>
>>1494995
no, at most 1 week





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