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>>431576329
Yes. Why do you ask?
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>>431576329
Makes sense to me.
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>>431576329
Isabelle's specials are similar to the Villager though not exactly the same. It's like Wolf was with Fox
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Isabelle is definitely the "kid mode" character that only children and women will pick. They needed to dumb down her moves because villager is too complicated.
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>Character clearly more popular than the other gets new move set priority

Yeah that makes sense.
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>>431576329
Stay mad
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They wanted her fully separate to increase Animal Crossing's visibility as advertising for the new game.
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Isabelle = Popular
Dark Samus = Obscure even in the Metroid series, which never a best-seller anyway.

>>431576838
This is a kid game already.
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>>431576329
Dark Samus at least still isn't an Echo to the same degree as Pittoo or Lucina, it has a lot of different animations because of that, feels a lot more like it's own character.

>>431576990
Animal Crossing is already one of Nintendo's highest selling IP's ever, I don't think that was the reason. This was could have done because Isabelle in Smash would undoubtedly push more copies, and potentially more Switches.
or maybe they put her in because shes a fan favorite and not everything is tied to money
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Dark Samus = from a game that sold 1.5 million copies
Isabelle = from a game that sold 12 million copies
Make sense
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the only reason i dont get this is because dark samus has animations from her AT form in sm4sh they could just use in this playable version

so why not put them in too, if you're gonna give chrom a mix of different moves as well
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>>431576743
Only returning move she has is pocket.
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>>431576329
That makes sense, though; Dark Samus the result of a Metroid trying to copy Samus.
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>>431576329
Seriously though...
WTF Nintendo?
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>>431576329
If I had it my way literally half the cast would be labeled as echoes. Ganandorf, Luigi, Dr Mario, Falco, Pichu, Young Link, Toon Link SHOULD ALL BE ECHOES. It's literally just an inconsistent mechanic at this point. I will ignore it on my character select screen
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>>431576329
Isabelle is basically a clone character like Luigi, Ganondorf and Wolf
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>>431578327
I really don't know why Dr.Mario isn't a fucking echo at least.
Same weight, and literally all clone moves.
Weight difference shouldnt matter anyway if the character is still the fucking same.
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>>431578697
I didn't know normal mario had a ganon dair and Mario Tornado as a down b
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>>431578327
>Falco
The only moves Falco shares with Fox are 3 of his specials, which all have extremely different properties.
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she's a semi echo tho
down smash is same as villagers but using water
up special is basically the same
the tree planting is replaced with gyroids
and more
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>>431577358
>Dark Samus = Obscure even in the Metroid series
Definitely one of the dumbest things I've ever read on these boards.
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>>431576838
nah, she's gonna have nutty followups off fishing pole
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>>431576329
>samoose but edgy >:(
>actual different character with a personality
whoa really subverting my expectations nintendo
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>>431582029
But he is right.
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>>431582268
>phone posting

OH NO NO NO NO

Metroid fags are never happy.
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We've talked about this before. Animal Crossing is popular. Metroid is not. Do the math.

t.metroidfag
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>>431576329
But OP, Dark Samus is the Metroid Prime Echo
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>>431582268
Fellow Dark Samus fag here. I'm not bothered about her being a clone because we got Ridley, which I never thought would happen.
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>>431576329
We literally got Ridley

Dark Samus was fashioned to be as similar to Samus as possible (but still had plenty of unique powers like invisibilty and tri clones)

I'll taek the samus echo, I love playing as Samus and I adore being able to get another one in.
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>>431576329
>Forced to play as this shitty furfag waifu in order to 100% the game
Guess I'll kill myself
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>>431582029
Do you think any casual player even knows who Dark Samus is outside of "oh it's evil Samus"?
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>>431577358
>This is a kid game already.
No it isn't.
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>>431581881
So not the same
This is like saying Falcon is a Mario clone but they just replaced coins with fire in up b
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>>431582498
At least Krystal didn't get in, that would actually be a suicide scenario
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>>431582463
is that sticky bear?
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>>431582664
having a different animation doesn't mean shit when the move works exactly the same
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And what unique moves would you give a literal clone of Samus?

Think of Isabelle as a villager alt. Basically they had a bunch of moves he could have used, but there was enough there for a new character. So they chose the most popular animal. I bet you anything Isabelle will have skins for other animals like Nook, Sable and one of the other residents like Bob or Lucy or something.

Basically it was a gameplay design choice. They wanted to add more unique animal crossing moves but they already used male and female mayors
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>>431582591
wait, there's more to dark samus than 'it's evil samus'? i thought it was like dark link and the shadow mario that sometimes chases you in mario lol
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>>431582680
What is so bad about that? It isn't like you'll turn into a furry if she's there and furries won't invade the smash fandom.
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>>431582950
Oh, so you've had lab time with her?
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>>431583096
>furries won't invade the smash fandom
I see you're unfamiliar with the way furfags operate, my sweet summer child
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>>431578327
>ganandorf
zoomer detected
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>>431576329
>dark samus is a samus echo
>dark samus first game was echoes
Poetic.
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>>431582029
She was only in two games and her appearance is kind of understated in both even if she is the main antagonist of 3
Also bear in mind Corruption was 11 years ago
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>>431576329
Smashroidfags are the most whiny fanbase. Regular Metroidfags I can see actually suffering since they barely get shit for years and their complaints are well deserved.
Smashroidfags on the otherhand get 2 brand new fighters in Smash in a series lacking good potential fighters, with one who should of been a stage hazard because they are TOO BIG w/out being scaled down, and yet they bitch.
You faggots are lucky Ridley or any other Metroid character actually got in, let alone 2.
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>>431576329
>side villain from 10+ years old game vs face of one of Nintendo's biggest IPs, yes even bigger than Metroid

Hmmm
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>>431576329
Sakurai is an out of touch boomer, what else is new
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>>431583253
She appeared in all three prime games and had anything but an "understated" appearance in metroid prime 2, you had challenging, cinematic fights against her at least three times throughout the game
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>>431583358
"Smashroidfag" is le new epic bogeyman you will post about 500 times a day because one guy annoyed you
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>>431583169
so anyone saying daisy is a clone is wrong because they haven't played her
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>>431582463

This is how I feel as well. DS could easily have been a unique character but even getting the character as an echo is good enough when Ridley is playable. Also because of the name the general perception of the character is probably >>431583065 and I don't really blame them.
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>>431578057
Dash attack too.
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Dark Samus is direct clone with new animations. Isabelle is based off Villager but is Luigified.
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>>431576329
Reminder that DS is objectively better than Samus because she has a regular roll instead of the slowass morph ball
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>>431580575
do you not see how arbitrary these rules are. Dr. Mario only has one special different from Mario and he's not an echo??? There's 6 different Marths but only Lucina is an echo???
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>Character Uniqueness in Smash Ultimate
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/10qEYZx3Bcl8CBAYr0AIdg1GUohKRTPPfcYiQnLLVYpg/edit#gid=0
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>>431576838
>pick Isabelle
>kick the shit of of edge lords
>they ree "kid mode" over the game
Just in another days work.
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>>431583781
Based chaika poster
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>>431582620
>YAHOO
>BOING
>BOING
>BINGO SMASH
sure m8
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>>431583502
Eh. A hand in Prime 1 doesn't really count, I know Metroid Prime is the same thing but casuals don't

Dark Samus is kind of pushed aside by the Ing in 2, the fight in Sanctuary is basically just a reminder she exists and most of her appearance in the story is just read in pirate logs

She shows up even less in 3 ironically
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>>431583781
>he watched that faggot ESAMs video and thinks he knows anything

They sped up Samus's roll so its essentially the same thing with a different animation. At least it looks cooler though
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>>431576329
this might be the only time i've ever agreed with these bait images. Like what the fuck
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>>431576743
>Wolf is like Fox!
Are you fucking retarded? Wolf isn't even remotely like Fox. Want to know why Wolf was called a clone? Because Wolf (and Sonic) had nearly all their animations ripped from various fighters. Wolf goes so bad as to having terrible animations for the shit he ripped, like his down smash looked especially shit. Wolf isn't a Fox clone, he is a Frankenstein monster of a character
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>>431583914
This. Again most people don't even know what Dark Samus is aside from "evil Samus". She also has basically no impact on the plot until Corruption, and you only fight her ONCE in that game. She isn't even an individual, she's part of the Phazon hivemind.
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>>431578327
It isn't inconsistent, you just need an IQ higher than 20 to see the patterns and realize what does and doesn't make an echo.
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You bet it did, echofaggot

Get fucked Isaacfags
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>>431578697
Echoes are practically identical to their base character, having only a tiny amount of non-cosmetic differences. Other clones are significantly more distinct to the point that they are required to be balanced separately. It's simply a degree of how much is reused. It is more than moves just having similar functionality or animations, it goes right down to the characters having identical parameters, hitboxes and frame data.
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people only wanted Dark Samus in the game because they thought Ridley would never get in, and she probably only got in so Sakurai could take the heat off Dark Pit
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I'm a huge metroidfag but I can recognize that Dark Samus is an old character from a niche series while Isabelle is one of Nintendo's most popular characters.

Metroid, Donkey Kong and Animal Crossing are all series' that had less than ideal representation in SSB4 and got newcomers in Ultimate. There's nothing weird about it.
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>>431582962
Also Villager's moves are very obviously catered to being a mischievous little fuck who wants to hurt you with slingshots, axes, flying a gyro right into your face, etc. Isabelle's is more the Phoenix Wright "whoops, I'm just doing something normal and you got in the way and got hurt" thing. Aside from I'd say her grab.
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>>431584715
>she probably only got in so Sakurai could take the heat off Dark Pit
Holy shit, you're right. This is definitely why she got in. Sakurai is a crafty faggot
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>>431578697
Different air and walk speed, different playstyles. Dr Mario can't chase in the air for followups like Mario can, Mario doesn't have a 3 frame kill move like Dr Mario does.
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>>431576329
Dark Samus is actually a clone, how is this a problem?
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>>431576329
thats a good thing fuck dark clones isabelle deserves it
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>>431583065
Yeah, after you defeat the Phazon roided up Metroid Prime in Prime 1 it steals an imprint of the Varia Suit and maybe a bit of Samus herself and turns itself into Dark Samus, who you fight in the next 2 games. There is literally a jellyfish inside that suit.
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>>431576329
I'm sorry it had to be this way because the moveset potential is definately there, but this is a simple matter of dev time vs number of people who would actually appreciate it.
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>>431583065
It's a Metroid that stuffed itself into one of Samus' armors and mutated it into an exoskeleton after it got its shit kicked in during the events of Prime 1.

Using its newfound intelligence and power to hijack a planet and spread its power source throughout the galaxy via meteors. This triggers an intergalactic war in the third Prime game, where it's the main antagonist.
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>>431584569
>literal autistic arbitrary chart to define what is and isn't an echo
>the links break all these rules
kys
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>>431582950
This. A heavy block falling on you and an item bringing you to the sky are the same exact thing.
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>>431578327
I wouldn't say Luigi should count as an echo, he's different enough from Mario for it to count.

Ganondorf is questionable, since he's basically "Captain Falcon, but slow", yet from a completely different franchise. I think he's slow enough that it doesn't count. Plus, if I could, I would have him focus more on sword moves. I know they've started changing some of his moveset to use his sword, but there needs to be more.

I'm not sure if it's possible in their menu to have more than 1 echo fighter per character, so maybe Toon Link can be standalone. Young Link is basically the same as Link, but Toon Link has some quirks that make him stand out a little more.

Falco should be an echo, but Wolf is different enough to count separately.
the fox trio needs different goddamn final smashes, though
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>>431582962
>And what unique moves would you give a literal clone of Samus?
The ones it had in the last game, retard.
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>more popular and relevant character gets the unique moveset

woah......
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>>431584229
Wolf was called a clone because Smashfags are fucking retarded and only see Special moves as the whole move set.
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>>431587871
>Fox is unchanged
>Falco gets a flashy autocombo like DK and Shiek
>Wolf is stuck with the Landmaster
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>>431582962
>What unique moves would you give
What I wanted was a semi-clone ala what Isabelle appears to be. Dark Samus isnt a clone of Samus in the Prime games she just happens to be using one of her suits, it's meant to contrast with the abilities she can actually do which are vastly different from Samus's.

That having been said I'm just glad to have Dark Samus playable in any capacity, she was my third most wanted after Ridley and K. Rool. I dont begrudge the Isabelle fans either, I'm glad both series are starting to get love since as I understand it, Animal Crossing has been in almost as long of a rut as Metroid has
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>>431583980
I thought the problem with Samus's roll is that since she goes into morph ball it's much more telegraphed/easy to read, not that it was too slow or something

Could just be a retard though
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>>431584569
>>431584707
>his cape move lasts 2 frames longer and his fireball move is in the shape of PILLS, which bounce slightly higher! so he CAN'T be a clone!
>not to mention his up smash lasts a full frame longer! Take THAT, retards!
>and furthermore
>FURTHERMORE
>HE'S SLIGHTLY SHORTER
>AND YET IS NOT AS GOOD AT LIMBO
>BIM BAM BLOWN THE FRICK OUT
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Sakurai can sakku my borosu
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>>431587871
Ganondorf and C. Falcon barely even have any shared animations anymore, they just have moves which do similar things.

You people still don't understand that echoes are based on level of direct asset/data reuse and not on whether the moves have the same basic concept. Two characters having a "big slow punch" attack doesn't mean that it's the same attack. Even if all the Links have the same concepts for their attacks, if those attacks have different animations, properties, hitboxes, frame data, etc then they are not cloned attacks.
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>>431588628
No one is arguing that Dr. Mario is not a clone, dipshit. But he's a lot less of a clone than Dark Pit is to Pit, or Lucina is to Marth.
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>>431588628
>>431585015





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