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Previous Thread(s): >>4318554 >>4282550

>Try to keep it /vr/-related: Nothing past 5th gen(+ Dreamcast). Slight OT might be okay if related to CRTs (E.G. 16:9 compatible models, flatscreens, etc.) Systems with backwards compatibility are also pretty safe territory, assuming you're focusing on the older games. PC CRTs are also a-ok.
>Produce OC! Get out your real cameras and take beautiful pictures of your CRTs displaying recognizable characters with the kind of beautiful accuracy that brings tears to the eyes of young and old alike! If you take 100 photos, at least one of them will turn out alright! (maybe)
>Try to be as detailed as possible when asking info on a specific model. As always, google is your friend, and we are your friends with benefits. Older archived threads aren't a bad place to look either.
>Share appreciation for others choice of technology and personal philosophy of gaming. As always show courtesy in your discussion and moderate yourselves first.

Discussion of video processing and scaling devices is okay, but try to keep the focus on CRTs and CRT accessories

CRT Pastebin (WIP) : http://pastebin.com/1Ri5TS3x
Guide to CRT Hunting : http://pastebin.com/H9H9L2LQ
Guide to Video Monitors : http://pastebin.com/pQX4N6gZ
General Purpose CRT Adjustment Guide : http://www.arcaderepairtips.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/01/guide_setup_adjust_arcade_monitors_v1.2.0.pdf
S-Video Pasta : http://pastebin.com/rH2h6C7W
BKM-10R Protocol Info : http://pastebin.com/aTUWf33J
JVC RGB card cloning guide : https://pastebin.com/EXqMBfcY

/crt/ Discord Server : https://discord.gg/EFWPCYE

Thread Survey : https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSd1HF1jPaNTZDupCn_GGtFuB3DxW5WFFd3yT4znmLA_cuU5oA/viewform
Collaborative Consumer CRT Project Survey : https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSd3_OraDPRRN_OzQ4r_-CqoNPR9J0r2KtFrpV6iuXdxM3DDJg/viewform

OP Revision and Update Soon : All suggestions welcome
>>
We need a better guide on trinitron hunting for the normies.
>>
>>4353556
>helping normalfags ever
>>
We talked about it in the Discord, but would people be interested in a CRT database of sorts?
>>
Hello, is JVC TM-A170G any good?
>>4353592
I think - yes. It is good to see all pros and cons about different models.
>>
So I got a trinitron over the summer and I really like it but I'm planning on getting pic related because I owned it before and it was amazing. I want to take both but the trinitron is really heavy and I can carry the Toshiba with ease. Anyone think I'm making a mistake ditching the trinitron?
>>
>>4353592
Yes, absolutely. I would be able to give pros/cons to specific models.

If it's moderated, but always anonymous submissions, people will probably give a decent amount of info on which models and brands are tolerable.

A CRT wiki, maybe?
>>
>>4353609
>Anyone think I'm making a mistake ditching the trinitron?

Depends on model # and condition
>>
>>4353639
That was another part of the idea being floated.

One of the questions that came up is whether to go with a standalone site of sorts, or perhaps contacting item-3 who I believe is in charge of the gametechwiki, and maybe getting a subdomain like the emulation general on /vg/,
>>
>>4353607
>TM-A170G
Looks pretty decent to me, it's got the 750 line tube like the higher end models, S-video input by default, doesn't have the standard JVC card slot, but does look like it's based around the same main signal board, so modding for RGB is probably possible. Only service manual I found for it didn't have schematics, so can't be totally sure.
>>
Anyone in Cardiff want a 32" CRT for free?

None of the charity shops take the damn things.
>>
>>4353556
>>4353564
Well guess what boyos, that's exactly what OP's pastebins are designed for. Concentrated normie-level spoonfeeding.

How often do we get rec-only posts in these threads? As in anon doesn't care to learn how or why we do things, he just wants a "scene-approved" display at the snap of the fingers. Comprehensive lists and guides enable this.
>>
What's needed to connect a Neo Geo MVS to a Sony PVM's RGB inputs?
>>
>>4353956
Connect BNC cables for RGB and sync to the MVS RGBS pins with a 220 ohm resistor in series, if you're using a JAMMA adapter board you may have the resistors already.
>>
Can anyone recommend JP21 cables for SNES/PS1 that also has RCA connectors for audio?
>>
I just picked up this 27” beaut for 20 bucks today. Has component and s video, made in 2005 and is in awesome shape. Good times ahead
>>
>>4355302
>>
>>4355302
Niiiice, Toshiba AF line are really underrated sets. Tons of adjustments in the service menu too, so you can dial it in real nice.
>>
>>4354962
You could probably hit up either RGC or RetroAccess to make you a custom one if you'd like. You're very unlikely to find specialty JP21 cables like that in the wild.

https://retro-access.com/
http://www.retrogamingcables.co.uk/
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De number nein
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Got some problem with a PC Engine. Seller said is has RGB with a sync stripper. But it looks like it only outputs composite.
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>>4355837
I checked the cable but it doesn't seem to have fast blanking. Might that be the problem? I have another cable (which I know for sure it's RGB) that fits on the port but it won't show anything and just makes a loud buzzing noise.
>>
>>4355837
>>4355841
>Flat screen

That might be the problem. If you have a CRT TV try it on that if you can hook it up to RGB.
>>
>>4355841
Probe the port on the console, did the modder hook up the +5V
>>
Is this type of bowing at the top unfixable through the service menu?
>>
>>4355849
It's black and white on my CRT for some reason. I am yuro so it's PAL

>>4355890
Not that I know, seller is Japanese. But he said he did more of this mods and never heard complains before
>>
>>4356036
How are you connecting the PCE to the TV? All I see in your picture is a composite cable.
>>
>>4355347
I just wish they had an H.size adjustment. V.size works no problem, but H.size is locked out.
>>
>>4356042
The first pic is the scart output (9 Din)
>>
>>4353324
when are niche crt manufacturers gonna pop out? isn't retro kewl these days?
>>
>>4356294
Maybe cost is too high. Or the whole "it's radioactive waste" thing stops people from producing it
>>
Amiga 1080 /w Wii via s video
>>
Nothing beats a CRT pc monitor though. All the benefits of an lcd and crt.
>>
>>4356312
>Maybe cost is too high.
no maybe about it
>>
How much TVL does your typical CRT TV of good brand have?

There is a professional monitor on my craigslist but it says it only has 400+ TVL.
>>
>>4355374
Hm anything like this for JP21?
>>
>>4356728
Potentially, but unlikely. You could probably rewire one to work with JP21, but at that point you'd just be better off adding RCA cables to the original cable yourself.
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>>4356449
Most consumer crts have a tvl count of 250-500. Trinitrons will be on the higher end.

Older pvms like my 1344q have 600. Sony called it "TRINITRON Super Fine Pitch" and i think that was later changed to HR Trinitron. Either way (sony) pvms tend to have 600 tv lines on the low and go up to 1000 for bvms.
>>
>>4356449
Also do you no the model number of the one you're looking at??
>>
>>4357028
JVC TM-131SU
>>
>>4356728
The one I got for that is manually wired, it can be rewired if opened up. Might be different for yours, but you can give it a try.
>>
>>4356763
As a last resort I probably will try wiring my own.
>>4357097
Where did you get yours?
>>
>>4357081
Uhhg google-fu couldn't help me on rhat one. But from the looks of it seems to only have composite input and at best maybe y/c. Super meh. How much is the seller asking
>>
>>4356449
>>4357081
Might as well be a glorified TV. If it's rather cheap and in good condition, I'd grab it, but if they're asking anything even mildly up there for it, look elsewhere.
>>
>Custom Resolution Utility
>Windows Vista or later (Windows XP does not support EDID overrides)
Wait, did Windows XP really not support custom EDID values? How did people overclock their monitors before Windows Vista? I was going to build a retro Windows XP gaming machine, my CRT monitor supports 320x240 at 120/140Hz which will let me play console and DOS games (through DOSBox) at their native framerate, just doubled. But if CRU doesn't work, I'm worried that my GPU drivers won't work either. (I have an old GTX 960, surprisingly it actually has XP drivers)
>>
>>4357361
>How did people overclock their monitors before Windows Vista?
Powerstrip. It was a million times better than edid hackery.
>>
>>4356413
CRT monitors can't do true 200/240p, they upscale it to 400/480p hence the huge pixels in your pic.
>>
>>4357414
>CRT monitors can't do true 200/240p,
Some old ones can.
>>
>>4357414
Many PC CRTs can do 240p 120Hz.
>>
>>4357425
Wrong. You'd need a really old one like from the mid-90s or so.
>>
>>4357486
Nope, my CRT from the 2000's can do 320x240@120Hz using the Nvidia Control Panel. Make sure you change the EDID values, the automatic ones are always trash. I've just been using CVT and it seems to work fine.
>>
>>4357486
The 120Hz is the important bit, running 240p 120Hz is the same ~31kHz horizontally as 480p 60Hz. Here's a pretty normal 1999 model doing it.

It's getting 240p 60Hz that needs an 80s-early 90s computer monitor or video monitor.
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>>4357542
always forgetting the pic baka
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>>4357553
What's the model? How big is it, can it do 1600x1200?
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>>4357563
Apple Studio Display 17" Blueberry, it's a rebadged Mitsubishi Diamondtron something. Can indeed do 1600x1200@60Hz, I've also used it as 1920x1600 for HD video, looks pretty nice even though that's getting quite a bit beyond what the tube can actually resolve.
>>
>>4357595
Nice.

To be frank, I haven't used a CRT in like 10 years but I remember 60Hz really hurting my eyes. My old Sony Trinitron 17" was usually set to 1024x768@100Hz. Some games were running in 60Hz by default and it was really pissing me off. I remember fucking with the drivers to delete all @60Hz resolutions from the system selection. I think back then you could unpack an Nvidia drivers package, hand edit one of the .ini files to remove the resolutions you don't want and then install it.
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Found this Bang & Olufsen Beovision MX 4000 at a dump today. It powers on fine, but it didn't come with a remote.

Is there any universal remote I could buy for it? Or any other way to access the av channels? The button on the tv only cycles through BB1 to Channel 5
>>
>>4358268
http://www.remotes4u.co.uk/Bang-and-Olufsen-BEOVISION-MX-4000-Remote-Control-Alternative.html

Hardly the last word in style but should do the job.
>>
>>4358539
That's the best option I've found. It beats paying £40+ for an original remote.
>>
I'm having a real hard time accessing the service menu on my JVC AV32D500. I'm trying a few of the input combos it says to access it(using a universal remote), but none of them are working. Does each TV need one of the combinations or are all these combinations supposed to be viable for more than one type of TV?
Been trying some of these:

http://www.riddledtv.com/forums/jvc-service-menu-codes-plasma-lcd-crt-rptv-t285.html
>>
Do ALL RGB Scart cables need fast blanking? Or does a sync stripper also do the job?
>>
>>4359178
If it's going into an actual SCART equipped TV or a switch which does automatic switching, then yes, wire up blanking. If you're going into a breakout cable/Extron/manual switch (into breakout) then it's not needed. That blanking pin is what tells a SCART based TV to switch from composite to RGB. Sync stripping has nothing to do with it.
>>
I found something interesting on Ebay.
Apple miniVGA to composite and S-video adaptor.
This will allow older Mac laptops to connect to CRT TVs.

I know that the TV-out on PC videocards whether composite or S-video is considered poor quality even before considering they can't do 240p.
But what about the Mac? They were used by professionals for their excellent video editing software. Do they have better quality TV-out than the PC? Can they do 240p?
>>
>>4359279
Where do I need to put the blanking?
>>
>>4359315
No, even video editors didn't use 240p.

Only video games and some much older computers,
>>
>>4359315
Professional video editors wouldn't use that adaptor, they'd have a proper input/output card often with component or SDI video, and they wouldn't use 240p
>>
>>4359392
1 volt or higher on pin 16.
>>
>>4359315
Same old TV encoder chips, same old limitations.
>>
How do you get 240p @ 120Hz with CRT monitors on a Mac?
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>tfw mommy's boyfriend gives me a Panasonic consumer tv and some Sony KV monitor because he heard I like using them for video games
>>
Here's my current CRT setup. Got a Sony Wega KV-20FS120 (which is dying a slow death), and my recently acquired Panasonic BT-1390YN. I run my console either through component, or SCART through Retrotek's custom SCART to Component transcoder. It allows me to have my SCART consoles output to both my professional monitor and my consumer TV at the same time.

I know I need to get some better speakers and I've only got a few consoles so far, but it's shaping up quite nicely.

I would love suggestions on what console to buy next. I'm currently looking at N64 or Saturn. I also would like to upgrade to some nicer bookshelf speakers eventually.
>>
Geometry is pretty good, but I can't seem to fix the tilt. I tried adjusting the service menu setting called "TILT", but it doesn't seem to do anything at all.

At the end of the day it's not something I notice during gameplay, but it'd be cool if I could fix it somehow.

Panasonic BT-1390YN, if anyone has any suggestions.
>>
>>4359801
Looks pretty good anon, you just gotta lose those posters. Not because "hurrhurr can't put video game pictures on wall" but because posters inherently look kind of tacky.
>>
>>4359845
>/crt/ - interior design general
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>>4359845
Having 15 year old CRTs on wire racks is probably way tackier than some old posters, really. It's in a corner of my bedroom that doesn't get seen by general company anyway.
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>>4359315
240p isn’t an official standard used for anything aside from old console games. It’s a work around to get games to display on TVs of the day. It’s an irrelevant resolution outside of that.
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>>4359605
SwitchResX.
>>
Does anybody know what pic related means when it says “re-initialise geometry settings only when in prog 59”

But if you look further down prog 59 says no function. Or does it mean channel 59?
>>
>>4360342
Looks like it does mean channel 59, protecting against accidentally clearing those settings which you probably won't want to do.
>>
>>4359315
Those adapters were used with Late PPC-Era Macs and they were a last-resort kind of solution if your place of work or school didn't have VGA projectors yet; you'll be disappointed with it's awful 480i output.
>>
Can I connect a Japanese saturn to a pvm with a scart cable and bnc converter or do I need to use a jp21 cable?
>>
How's running VC games on Wii with component cables vs using my SNES with scart to component? I'd rather playing whatever I can on my SNES itself, but some games like Earthbound are a bit pricey. Will the difference be noticeable? Both would be on the same JVC CRT.
>>
>>4360834
Other than the bit of extra "input lag" you shouldn't notice a difference.

Early VC releases may not support proper 240p out but can usually be modified for it. Or just use Retroarch.
>>
>>4360657
Saturn -> SCART -> BNC should do exactly the same thing as Saturn -> JP21 -> BNC, use whichever you have the BNC cable for already.
>>
>broke my back hauling a 32" Trinitron up a flight of stairs to my room
>it takes up too much room
>the geometry is fucked and it looks like shit no matter what I do with the service menu
I wanna kill myself
>>
>>4361951
Ouch bro. Lesson to everyone else, always plan on testing and configuring extensively before you herc something upstairs. Then reconfigure after it's been moved.
>>
>>4361951
Its this reason why i stuck with tiny crts. 20in is plenty for yourself and any bigger is not big enough for your firends who are used to playing split screen mario kart 64 on their 50in+ lcd/led tv.
>>
>>4362118
nah, fuck that. figure out the layout of your retro gaming room, pay a couple of dudes off of craigslist or home depot to lift it in place, never ever touch it again
>>
>>4356294

I'm an electronic technician in argentina and people still repairs their crts, I assure you that I'd try to set up a crt factory if I had some millions to spare but I'm sure costs will be higher than before and it would not make sense
>>
Just got this for free lol
Needs some calibration though, it seems to accept RGB trough SCART, so that’s pretty cool... I just hope those weird geometry issues can be solved with the service menu. 240p looks really good.
>>
>>4362964
Very cute, what is going on in the middle though.
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why did non-sony AGs look so much better than sony AGs?
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>>4362967
That's 240p suite's full 288p PAL grid.
>>
>>4363018
Ahh, gotcha; guess I've never had a reason to give that mode a shot.
>>
I just got a 20" ikegami, how do I pull out the control drawer? it seems to be pushed back and I cant find anyway to pull it out.
>>
>>4363468
gorilla bang with US steel hammer fix it good
>>
>>4363468
Which model is it? Maybe it doesn't have a drawer.
>>
>>4363584
HTM 2070R, it does, it's just seems stuck
>>
>>4363602
the tray on my htm-2050RA1 has its spring lock mechanism toward the rear end of the rail, I suspect yours is similar. I think the way to fix it would start with you turning the monitor upside down and taking a peek.
>>
>>4363620
Alright, if I can't find anything else I guess that's what I'm going to have to do.

Thanks
>>
Just got this, no power cord.

https://www.recycledgoods.com/nec-pm-1271a-monitor-bnc-and-vtr-inputs-with-rca-audio-jacks/

Will I be able to get much use out of it for gaymin or is it too old? Doesn't seem to be too many ports in the back, hard to find much info on it either.
>>
I want a 16:10 CRT
>>
>>4363639
>Composite and mono audio
Please tell me you didn't pay the listed price for that. You could have got a big boy professional monitor with RGB and/or Component for that price. :(

It might look better than a consumer CRT with composite. But I'd take a consumer CRT with even just S-Video over a CRT with composite only.
>>
>>4364613
That's a composite-only monitor.

>>4364615
Sony FW900 was 16:10.
>>
>>4364668
>That's a composite-only monitor.
Might still be worth it for NES then, maybe? I don't know how much of a pain in the ass finding a power cable for it will be, not sure if I can just try and finding something generic.
>>
>>4364671
Depends on the comb filter. Not sure about pro monitors but TVs that old had primitive ones, which are great for display speed but not for image quality.

Power cable looks bog standard and should be cheap. Just use a spare from a desktop PC to test it before spending anything else on this monitor.

You should know that others might tell you not to waste your time on this thing, but I subscribe to the idea that you should test everything you care to get your hands on. You never know what surprises you might find, and you might learn something/uncover something to show everyone else.
>>
>>4364685
Cool, thanks! I appreciate the help, this is the first PVM/PM whatever I'd managed to get my hands on, so I'm excited to play around with it if nothing else.
>>
>>4364695
Really hope it ends up producing a nice picture for you, anon. But even if it doesn't, maybe even just testing it will give you first-hand knowledge of what to look for next time. Nothing beats first-hand experience.
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Hey guys,

How can I fix a purple spot that I have on the top left corner? Do I need a strong magnet and try fooling around in that area?
>>
>>4361951
what settings are you adjusting, if you could list them, for your geometry?
>>
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https://seattle.craigslist.org/skc/zip/d/free-tvs/6368697065.html

That's a nice CRT. Wish I had the space or a basement game room; that XBR has to be top tier for a bigger set.

Awesome gunmetal finish and the matching stand and glass shelves.

Appears to be a 4:3 SD set and not 1080i HD? Anyone know the model number?
>>
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I need some detective work done. I'm picking up some N64 stuff at this dude that's selling his N64 and some games. And it looks like he's selling off his collection.

And I noticed that he seems to have some sort of BVM, but I can't make out which model/brand it is. Anyone that can figure it out just by the shape of it?

I might make him an offer if it's a decent BVM
>>
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>>4365883
BVM are the premium line , I have a 14G5U and the picture quality is just superb.
>>
>>4365952
Oh crap, you're right. I must have meant to say PVM.

And holy crap, that is a nice picture!

You wouldn't know what brand that monitor might be? Or if it might have RGB. Because I feel like getting a BVM/PVM and just have composite would suck
>>
>>4365839
LVLN, UVLN, PAMP, HSIZ, VSIZ, TROT, LPIN, UPIN, HOSC, probably most other settings

I tried everything several times over a period of months
>>
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I have a busted Sony fw900, well the neck board is messed up, weird blank color bars n shit, other is fine

where the hell can I get a neck board for a fw900, cause taking it to a repair shop is just asking to getting it smashed or dropped and scratched due to its wait and size
>>
>>4365872
Sony did make 4:3 HD sets, but that looks to be an XBR250 or so which is an SD model. Would be rather nice.

>>4365883
Honestly just looks like a boxy TV to me, and the pair of rabbit ears attached to an f-connector to twin-lead adapter would suggest as much.
>>
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Friendly reminder not to fall for the SCART meme.
SCART is not even intended for use as RGB input. Use RGB BNC instead.
>>
>>4365832
Yes, I had a similar issue with my Amiga monitor. It doesn't need to be the strongest magnet in the world, just bigger than your average fridge magnet. I used a horseshoe magnet I had lying around to degauss. Pretty sure I just started from the corner and circled around the monitor slowly pulling towards myself as I went. It faded away for a little but would come back on occasion, so there's a chance it's a permanent magnet issue.
>>
>>4366274
>>4366274
What's the problem braaah? Just plug it in the back of your tv
>>
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>4366274
>SCART is not even intended for use as RGB input.
>>
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>>4366095
Neck boards aren't that large or complicated. Even with zero electronics skill, you could just replace every single component on the board and hope the problem goes away.
>>
>>4365987
Thanks, it's hard to think that the CRT in your picture is actually a professional monitor of any sort.
* The N64 is hooked via coaxial RF the worst possible quality
*The main brand I know are Sony, JVC and Ikegami
*Your N64 must be modded in order to output RGB, and in most cases you will need a SCART to BNC cable to use in these monitors
>>
>>4366274
>Friendly reminder that I cant into SCART and I don't want any other people to do so.
>>
>>4366106

Oh, I never noticed that about the TV. It makes sense now. Yeah, it's probably just a regular consumer CRT.

Some day I'll find one I suppose. It's just so fucking hard to find one in Europe!
>>
>>4366561
You make some good points that I never thought of. And you're probably right, sadly...

But thanks for the detective work!
>>
Would it be stupid to spend nearly $1000 AUD on a professional JVC crt?
>>
>>4366569
its just a bundle of wires why do people get so retarded about this?
>>
>>4366484

yea and replacing those IC chips on it isnt just soldering, you have to reflow it which isnt cheap also finding new specific IC chips for a Sony might be hard

I think I would have more luck if I find a neckbord from another broken unit except these fags jack the price up
>>
>>4366669
It's the one thing Europeans can hold over everyone else with retro gaming, because everything else about European retro gaming is inferior. I sure do wish I could into SCART though.
>>
>>4365883
If it has a tuner, it's not a PVM or BVM. That has a tuner and is just a regular, although rather nice looking consumer CRT.
>>
>>4366476
The rgb of scart was intended for overlays. Pin 16 is for a blanking signal.
>>
>>4365883
That's not BVM or PVM of any kind, just a boxy looking consumer set. It might still be nice but I wouldn't offer much for it.

>>4366274
Oh hey it's this retard again. Just because a technology wasn't "intended" for a specific application, doesn't mean that the technology is a poor fit for that application.

The fact is that you can order RGB SCART cables for most retro consoles for very cheap. RGB BNC, while it is a better connector, is going to be way more expensive and will result in the exact same image quality.
>>
>>4366860
>better
>exact same
gotta pick one, hombre.
>>
>>4366868
The physical design of the CONNECTOR is superior, but the video quality is exactly the same.

Learn to comprehend you fucking troglodyte.
>>
>>4366873
Learn to write comprehensibly, eurotrash.
>>
>>4366875
I'm American.

I wrote:
"RGB BNC, while it is a better connector, is going to be way more expensive and will result in the exact same image quality."
>while it is a better connector
>better connector
>connector

I don't understand why that was so difficult for you to comprehend.
>>
Ugh.

>gamers
>>
>>4366814
Alright, thanks for the input!

Yeah, the shape really caught my eye. If he wants rid of it, I might make him an offer
>>
>>4367094
Of course, happy to help. I'm a big proponent of consumer sets.
>>
>>4366659
>Some day I'll find one I suppose. It's just so fucking hard to find one in Europe!
I've acquired 20 in the past year or so, all cheap as chips. It's really not hard in the slightest.

>>4366846
SCART was introduced in 1977. I have a set from 1980 whose documentation mentions no such "intended" usage. Either this early period was of such short duration as to be unworthy of consideration or...you're full of shit.
>>
>>4367163
>I have a set from 1980 whose documentation mentions no such "intended" usage.
Maybe you should look at the specification:

http://fr.meric.free.fr/Articles/articlesba/stsurtvplat/Scart/BS_EN_50049-1%20Peritelevision%20connector.pdf

>or...you're full of shit.
Or maybe I just know more than you.
>>
Hey wanna see something retarded

http://trinifieds.com/classifieds/sony-wega-27-inch-tv/
>>
>>4367274
lolwut
>>
Excuse my retardation, has anyone tried this?

http://geedorah.com/eiusdemmodi/forum/viewtopic.php?id=326
>>
What's it matter anyway it isn't meant for RGB? Scart's handyness is that ANY kind of connection could be used, intended or not
>>
>>4367230
Seeing as the set in question ONLY accepts RGB on its SCART (Peri-TV if I wanted to be really pedantic) connector and has no facility to overlay or otherwise mix signal types I'd say it's intended use is and was to facilitate the display of pure RGB.

Maybe you've read too many obsolete spec sheets and need to leave your mum's basement for a while?
>>
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>>4367519
>Seeing as the set in question ONLY accepts RGB on its SCART (Peri-TV if I wanted to be really pedantic) connector and has no facility to overlay or otherwise mix signal types
In that case I'm afraid you are not talking about a scart input. The spec is clear about pin 16 being a fast blanking signal. Maybe it is a hacked up port using the same physical connector but it isn't scart.

> need to leave your mum's basement for a while?
See pic.
>>
>>4367543
I am talking about a SCART input. The original 1977 spec (which my example adheres to) is quite different to the 1998 revision which you proffered.

tl;dr: there is not, nor has there ever been, a provision for *selective* blanking in the CENELEC standard. That function was almost always provided by TTL-level rgb signals over entirely different connector types such as a 9 pin D-Sub.
>>
>tfw my 14M2U has component support via BNC but no 480p support
For what purpose
>>
>>4367594
>The original 1977 spec
I assume you can produce the 1977 spec?
>>
>>4366665
Is it a particularly nice model in exceptional condition? If not, you're stupid.
>>
>>4367658
Component was a broadcast video standard, it's the native format of Betacam.
>>
>>4367763
Sorry, I guess I should say YPbPr
>>
>>4367776
YPbPr is component.
>>
I’m so fucking tired of this shit, was born in the 96 so it’s not like I have any nostalgia but getting a decent CRT plus it has to be in good shape image wise, plus cables, then more and more...
The information on the internet is outdated, I can’t get in the service menu with an universal remote, I can’t play NTSC games till I get SCART cuz I moved to shitroupe, FUCK THIS SHIT, I tried, I wanted to enjoy retro games the best way posible, but the hardware is rare, old and fucking imposible to deal with, I’m done with this shit.
And I won’t play shit on emulators, fuck everything.
>>
>>4368018
nice blog
>>
>>4367163
>I've acquired 20 in the past year or so, all cheap as chips. It's really not hard in the slightest.

Where do you go looking to find these monitors then? Because I don't see them pop up much here in Sweden
>>
>>4366752
>reflow
Does it have BGA chips?

>new specific IC chips for a Sony
Have you googled the part numbers yet? Most likely they're just off-the-shelf parts.
>>
>>4368180
eBay and gumtree, local pick ups
>>
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>>4366274
>>
>>4368595
You are so full of shit, m8
>>
>>4369025
When I get home I'll list some prices. A few might even still be on eBay sold items listing by way of proof.
>>
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Found this on the way home from work, finally have a nice CRT that doesn't have washed out colors or warping and doesn't only accept RF. Running 240p on it is a dream

Is there a general purpose service manual for TVs that don't have one available? Cause I can't find it. It's a ct-20sl14j

Also should I change to the Vivid color setting or does that fuck with color ranges and all that
>>
>>4369115
Forgot to mention, using Component for the Wii. The composite you see there is the dreamcast because I don't have any VGA displays atm
>>
>>4369115
Nice find, hombre. Picture looks great. From what I've gathered, every TV is totally different as far as service menus go, if they have one available to begin with. Fortunately, more modern sets like yours generally allow you to get pretty deep from the regular consumer menu as far as geometry and color configuration go. Get the 240p test suite on your Wii, and use that to get colors and geometry set to your liking. This whole hobby is very subjective, so it's really up to you.
>>
>>4368018
it's a known fact that you can only access service menu on sonys with a sony remote.
>>
>>4369206
That's odd because my Logitech Harmony does the job just fine.

I was also able to set it up as a custom macro for maximum convenience.
>>
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>>4369025
>>4369074
Okay I'm as good as my word so...
>>
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>>4369752
>>
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>>4369753
>>
>>4369752
What is this type of tv called
>>
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>>4369757
>>
>>4369752
This specific type of CRT what is it called
>>
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>>4369763
Paid this price for two units, got another two thrown in for free, then negotiated a further ten for less than £100 when I went to pick them up.

>>4369760
It's not a TV, model is in filename and google is your friend. Prepare to be jelly.
>>
>>4367365
Aight, no one seems to, I got some VGA to RGB SCART cable that just arrived.

I tried that and it actually works, pretty happy with it. Problem is, I don't know how to set up other resolutions.

Is there any manual out there on how to figure out the right settings for custom resolutions to set on CRU? Let's say I want to play at 224p (2560x224).
>>
>>4369772
I'm referring to this
>>4365883
Specific shape and type of crt, what is this called and how do I look for it? I've really wanted one for a while now and I'm not sure how to look for it
>>
>>4369776
Mine is a broadcast monitor.

Other anon's is simply a mid to late 80s portable television. nothing special really.
>>
>>4369784
NES and N64 work on them right? Those are my favorite aesthetic crts
>>
>>4369793
With an appropriate input card it'll take composite, yes.

Shame not to feed it RGB though.
>>
>>4369776
You're gonna find the cube look a lot with video monitors, with TVs not so much.
>>
>>4369817
How do I do that?
>>
>>4369967
Do what?
>>
Are there HDMI to VGA converters that can go above 1080p ?
>>
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So I'm trying to run through the 240p suite on a new CRT but it doesn't have individual color sliders to do this test with. Should I just skip it or what?
>>
>>4370274
Adjust the contrast and brightness until you can clearly see the difference between each shade on the grid, with the far left "0" column being just barely distinguishable from the black background.
>>
What's the best way to connect a Atari 2600 to a CRT that doesn't have an coaxial input for RF? A cheap RF modulator? An old VCR?

I know there's composite video mods, but let's be honest, the quality on 2600 games isn't going to matter much at all.
>>
>>4370447
VCR is the easiest
>>
>>4353556
I've got one.
>find a thrift/donation store that accepts/sells TVs
>wait till a trinitron shows up and buy it for 15 bucks tops

Done.
>>
>>4369967
>>4369971
Use RGB, I believe he means. Unfortunately NES and N64 are part of the minority of consoles without RGB built in. You would have to mod or get pre modded consoles for the best picture.

Personally I would just stick with the NES' composite video, as I am in the mindset it was meant to be how it looks. N64 looks fine with S-Video to me, as it's a blurry mess nmw. That is if it has S-Video available.
>>
>>4370447
Can second the VCR thing. A standalone old-school cable tuner would do the trick as well, but I would just pick up a broken VCR for peanuts and call it a day.
>>
I have 36" Panasonic that is a bit dim (worn phosphors, yes?). I could jack up the brightness, but have left it alone under the assumption that it would last longer. Is this silly? It was free a year or three back, but it's humongous and I don't want to move it any time soon.
>>
>>4372261
worn gun is more likely. You could try upping G2 a bit, but might eat some life time (probably not much if it's actually worn anyway)
>>
>>4372271
This is something I would do if the Brightness setting was unable to make things bright enough, or instead of that setting?
>>
>>4372349
Best to put the brightness and contrast on half then adjust G2 for a good picture.

That way you have some headroom left for the future.
>>
>>4372271
How do you adjust G2?
>>
>>4372369
I assumed it was a trimpot.
That right anon? >>4372271
>>
>>4372369
Usually a control on the neckboard, often named "Screen" if not G2.

Some newer sets may allow adjustment through the service menu.
>>
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>>4372369
There's usually a knob on the flyback transformer labelled Screen. Some later model Trinitrons control it through software via the service menu or via serial port.
>>
>>4372349
well, kinda both. Upping G2 will bump up the whole min/max range of brightness. So you can end up needing equal or even less brightness value
>>
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Anyone know why my screen is sort I tapered on the bottom left corner?
>>
>>4372674
its tryna get dem cheezits lol like and subscribe
>>
>>4372674
get to the service menu and change the geometry there, you have to look for the chasis of your tv and then get to that options via a remote control combo.
>>
>>4372698
Unfortunately I don't have a remote for it, is there any other way? Thanks for the help
>>
>>4372724
I fixed my old apex tv this way. (the bottom part of the screen was simple not there) changing the geometry in the factory menu.
the first thing I did (Didn't have a remote for it, but i remember how it looks)
Look for the tv brand and model, for the service manual, it cost me $2 dollars.
Now I have the combo, but didnt have the remote controller.
I looked for the tv chassis and service manual, all the tv's that used the same chassis as my apex have the same remote, so I purchased a clone one online with all the functions (replacement remotes, send those guys your chassis number if you dont remember how your tv controller looks)
(BTW universal controller dont work)
the combo was like this press F on the remote on the tv all the sound down to zero, push mute and press + and chanel + on the remote.
>>
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>everytime a pvm 20l5 shows up its $1200+
>>
>>4372674
Good luck, using the service menu to adjust problems localized to one side of the screen is either difficult, or flat out impossible.

I got a Sony that has almost the same issue you've got, I tried for many hours to fix it, but never got it perfect. The IC's are also dying on that TV, so I think it's going to take a trip to the dumpster this weekend.
>>
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Is it normal for games to look better under warm temps than normal or cool?
Trinitron KV-20FV300 over Wii+component here.
I mean, it looks gorgeous either way, but everything seems to shape up better on a warm tone.
Can't tell whether I like the "VM" on off or high. Whatever VM is.
>>
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God damn. Where's a hundred dollars and a van, and some extra manpower, and some space at home when you need it
>>
>>4373303
>not carrying it home with your own two hands
The weak deserve nothing.
>>
>>4373303
Isn't that rear projection though?
>>
>>4373303
>>4373562
>Rear Projection
>DVI
>HD
Why would anyone in their right mind want this monstrocity?
>>
>>4373225
On consumer TVs the default white balance is somewhere around 9300K, far bluer than the 6500K studio standard which is usually what the warm setting is.

VM is scan velocity modulation, it detects when there's a high contrast edge in the video, and speeds up the beam when on the darker side and slows it down on the brighter side to boost contrast. I'd usually want it off.
>>
>>4373303
No way that's worth 100 bucks.
>>
>>4373641
Thanks for the info.
The thing I like about the VM being on is, it seems to thicken up black lines/outlines on 2D/pixelated games on the set, making them more "comic-like" if you will.
Brightness is set slightly above mid and contrast(picture) is set at about 3/4. So the image is pretty bright there, leaving the VM to bring out outlines.

2D games look a hell of a lot better to me when bright and sharp. When I switch to PS1, etc 3D stuff I tend to swap to a dimmer and softer setting.
Didn't know consumer sets ran so cool though. 9300K is batshit.
>>
>>4372724
If that's a 2030 or 2530, you're looking at manual adjustments, no service menu.
>>
People were talking about a CRT db or a CRT wiki earlier in the thread.
Turns out I thought of something similar some time ago, and tried my hand on something on Wikia. Right now it's only populated with my own stuff, but if some other people contributed, it could be expanded pretty quickly.
The point is to have a standardized spec sheet across all entries, some words about the manufacturer line-up and differences between models, links to user and service manuals, and answers to common questions/problems.
I also tried to centralize manuals, in order to avoid broken links and such, and hosted everything on mega.
Wiki is http://aperturegrille.wikia.com
and Mega is
https://mega.nz/#F!SoIX2KZa!O-WQj2ZS4o6U97ihjlXJDA
Feel free to tell me if you guys are interested, or if I should just kill myself.
>>
>>4374279
Amstrad CTM-644 does accept composite video as sync.
>>
>ywn fall asleep while watching porn on dad's aging crt and wake up to see that a naked lady is permanently burned into the screen
>>
>>4374398
what did you pause the tape or something?
>>
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what is happening to /vr/ lately?
>>
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Hey, if you're still here, Volvo Bro, I wanted to pop in to show off my new car.
Nothing new on the CRT front. I still prefer my Panasonic monitor for old vidya and the Sony one (20L5) for 480i/480p/720p/1080i content.
And I'll probably be gone again now. Have a good thread!
>>
>>4374789
they're clearly all retarded underage kids, that's what.
There are plenty of SDTV's with YPbPr.
>>
>>4375124
Yeah, the current battlestations thread is a fucking shitshow.
>>4375120
Nice volvo hombre
>>
>>4375126
Are you the Volvo bro of years past?

Don't wanna re-ignite old arguments or stay too long.
And yeah my Toshiba 27A42 is a SDTV with YPbPr for one.
Battlestation threads on ANY board have always been shitshows of OCD autistic retards.
>/g/ ricers
>/o/ ricers
>/vr/ animu weebs with walls of manga
>also rice cable management on all of them
>>
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>>4375139
one more pic
>>
>>4375139
I am not, unfortunately. But one of the guys in my band just got a sick-ass 80s volvo wagon, so I can appreciate a nice volvo. Oh, and don't worry we're all aware of what component video can and cannot do here, but jesus fuck there's some of the dumbest shit I've ever seen on 4chan happening in the battlestations thread, so I felt compelled to share it.
>>
>>4375120
Hi James May
>>
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>>4375157
If I could find a good non-rustbucket 80s volvo wagon I'd be on it in a heartbeat. In the midwest where they never sold that many in the first place and they salt the roads that's a tall order, though.
Also I used to be on this board daily a year or two ago. a lot of people were confused about this shit.
This pic might jog someone's memory.
>>4375163
Not gonna lie, I had to look up who that was.
>>
>>4375157
Is it a 240 wagon? or a 740 wagon?
They look very similar, but the 740 has slightly shorter frontend (shorter headlights/grille/fenders) and is slightly wider.
The 240 is probably a little more common today, but it's also the classic 80s/late 70s volvo.
>>
>>4375202
If the interior has a fabric headliner, it's a 740.
If it's a plastic/vinyl headliner it's a 240.

Also the interior will look like >>4375143
vaguely if it's a 240.
>>
>car talk
>on /vr/
>in a thread about crts
come on guys...I'm not even mad, just disappointed.
>>
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>>4375210
OK HAVE A CRT THEN
>>
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>>4375215
you missed a great opportunity to mix the topics up together. nice setup though, is that a model m?
>>
>20lcunt doesn't even know who james may is.
>James "gonna come in a Volvo" May
>>
>>4375221
Yeah, it's the Model M from my IBM 3161 terminal.
My parents had a TV like that for their old 140 wagon.

>>4375234
Ah I see I am remembered.
Oh, you meant the 850R from the Top Gear Africa special?
I honestly forgot May was in that.
>>
>>4375202
I'm actually not sure, he picked it up recently, so I've only been in a few times (he lives in another nearby city).
>>4375206
Based solely on that I would guess 240.
>>
>>4374789
Jesus, this is why I rarely trust what people say about CRTs and video quality in general on /vr/.

They're either retards, underage, or both.
>>
>>4375619
The extreme confidence while being completely, utterly wrong is what really blows my mind. This thread is the only safe haven; you might get some bias, but the information is accurate.
>>
Why does my TV display color when I feed luma to the composite video input?
>>
>>4375851
where are you getting the luma signal from?
>>
>>4376221
Playstation s-video cable.
And BTW, no, the composite and luma are not soldered together in the cable.
It gets the right colors but with a lot of noise.
>>
there is a profeel on CL anyone want it? I dont have the space currently.

https://sfbay.craigslist.org/sfc/for/d/sony-color-trinitron/6369550514.html
>>
>>4376229
Either there's terrible shielding in the cable allowing the subcarrier to bleed through, or it's one of the fake S-video cables that's really just composite.
>>
>>4376363
>there's terrible shielding in the cable allowing the subcarrier to bleed through
This appears to be the case. A component cable luma displays in B&W as expected.
>>
>>4376302
If I wasn't on the other side of the country I would nab that.
>>
Will there ever be some project to revive the CRT, or will CRTs all die with the generation that grew up with them?
>>
>>4377507
They will always be needed as props for movies and TV shows set in the 20th century, just like old cars. A subset of the existing stock will probably be maintained by enthusiasts forever. It has been like a hundred years since you could buy a Ford Model A or whatever, yet collectors still have them and keep them working.
>>
>>4377535
movies will just mold curved glass or plastic and digitaly add screen content
>>
Can someone explain the me the point of "expand 4:3 mode"? my 2004 philips has a button that you press that just stretches the screen vertically about 1/4" in each direction. I never found a use for it or why its even a thing

even my 4:3 LCD tv (2005) has the same expand option..
>>
>>4377545
Some will do that, just as a lot of movies use comp'd in cars and backgrounds for isolated old-timey scenes and such. But some directors will probably still insist on using authentic old monitors when a lot of focus is going to be put on them. I'm thinking about things like the scenes in Stranger Things involving security monitors.
>>
>>4377775
I don't understand what you mean, can you sketch a diagram or something? How can the screen be "stretched" vertically--does the image not already extend to the entire height of the visible display area by default?
>>
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>>4377793
>>4377775
Okay there are two pictures coming. Here's the first on regular mode.
>>
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>>4377803
Here's the second. Look at the how the button icons at the top get cut off and the bottom
>>
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>>4353324
Here we go
>>
>>4377805
Ok, my first thought from how you described it was that it was a zoom feature to make pillarboxed 4:3 content fullscreen, but it doesn't change the left or right edges of the image so it's definitely not a zoom. I guess it's some kind of aspect ratio fix, but I don't know why you'd ever want to change the aspect ratio in that particular way. Some A/V devices I've owned have had a 14:9 aspect ratio mode, which seems to have been implemented as a compromise mode between 4:3 (which is a ratio of 1.333...) and 16:9 (1.777...), since 14:9 is halfway between (ratio of 1.555...). This "expand 4:3 mode" is doing the opposite, but maybe the purpose is to use it as a compromise setting when mixing 4:3 fullscreen content and 16:9 letterboxed content. The vertical stretch distorts both images, but it makes the letterboxed content appear to fill more of the screen. I can't stand warped aspect ratios but the fact is that a lot of consumers seem to use them regularly. Frequently I see TVs in other people's homes set to stretch images wider.
>>
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Does cable build quality matter more for worse signals (RF, composite) or better signals (component, scart)?

Is there anyone who makes high quality custom cables that are not SCART/RGB?
>>
>>4378226
Coaxial cable is higher quality than the others.
>>
>>4378245
Because it is designed to carry many signals multiplexed at different carrier frequencies on the same wire. It's not really a fair comparison.
>>
>>4377775
It stretches the image vertically so that letterboxed movies fill the screen. you really shouldn't use it
>>
>>4378245
All of the normal analogue video standards use coaxial cable.
>>
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About 8 years ago I saw this portable tv (JCPenney brand) at a thrift store for $10. i wasnt into gaming yet then i was just amazing by the odd ports on the back. Could this have worked with game consoles? Should I have bought it anyways?
>>
>>4379063
It's a digital RGB + intensity input, meant for CGA PCs, MSX and other similar computer video outputs, not suitable for consoles without modification.
>>
>>4379115
Ah gotcha. thanks for the info
>>
>>4378226
The most noticeable cable flaws are poor shielding, which will result in picking up visible noise from other devices, and crosstalk, most visible in S-video as chroma leaking into luma creating a dot crawl effect like you'd see with composite. Cheapo s-video cables that aren't even coaxial inside are especially susceptible to this. On cheapo SCART cables video leaking into audio causing buzzing is common, can also have composite leaking into RGB which would again produce a bit of a dot crawl effect. Signal leaking between the RGB lines wouldn't be very noticeable.
>>
where the FUCK can I go to just fucking buy a massive trinitron/PVM that I want? ebay has nothing
>>
>>4379301
I had to drive out of state to pick up a nice professional monitor. I don't work weekends, so I made a little trip out of it and saw a few sights and things on the way there and back. It was actually a fun little trip and I enjoyed the experience. Nice to get out of town once in a while, you know?

I'm pretty sure the money I spent on gas was still way less than what I was looking to spend on eBay.

In terms of finding one, you've gotta search a little bit. There's a thread on the crtgaming subreddit that people will post TV's and monitors for sale. That's where I found mine. You can also look into some of the CRT related Facebook groups and the shmups hardware forums, as I frequently see monitors for sale there as well.
>>
>>4379301
if you want a massive PVM you'd better be prepared to spend around 1k at least unless you find one of those once-in-a-lifetime deals. just stick to consumer shit or presentation monitors if you want massive.
>>
>>4379358
where the FUCK can I buy a Trinitron KV-36FV310?
>>
>>4379381
somewhere, just gotta look. why do you want the fv310 when any wega will be just as good if you use a sound system and stay away from component? it has two things over a more common model like an fs120, the comb filter which is only used for composite, and the subwoofer which wont matter if you use a proper soundsystem. I seriously suggest you look into a 36" that isn't a wega though, and I say that as someone who owns KV-36FS13
>>
>>4379385
>stay away from component
meant composite
>>
>>4379381
FV310 series also has the better HV regulator.
>>
>>4379385
>somewhere, just gotta look.

I will literally pay $300+ plus the moving costs for this damn tv in good condition. I can't even get a ballpark estimate of what these things cost if someone actually sold one
>>
>>4379417
I really want to know why you're so dead set on the FV310 when WEGA sets vary so little from model to model. Have you actually looked at the specs sheet and compared it to a more common model? Also, you should find a free or cheap 27" black Trinitron to tide you over if you don't already have a CRT for SD content. Just having something, anything, will give you an idea of what you really want in a set instead of shooting for the le reddit meme set, the FV310 that is.
>>
>>4379423
I have a lot of money to burn setting up this retro room and I don't have the patience to constantly search. I've already got a good trinitron. I want to pay for what is best of the best and be done with it.
>>
>>4379423
>>4379438
Also my wife isn't going to put up with the bullshit of waiting and having an impromptu weekend trip and moving more shit in after it's set up
>>
>>4379438
>>4379440
then look into presentation monitors like I said earlier. if you have cash to burn then don't waste time on consumer sets when mitsubishi and nec made amazing monitors in the 36" to 40" range
>>
>>4379447
oh....then where can I buy one and what models are going to be the top shit?
>>
>>4379450
the usual places, ebay, locally, etc. might want to hit up the guys at the broadcaststore website and talk to them cause they have all sorts of contacts it seems. for models I can't really help you much other than with the nec stuff which follows the convention of "multisync xmXX plus" with capital X's being the size, like xm37 plus. just do some googling like "presentation monitor crt" and you'll find shit out there for information, oh an join the discord the guys in there are helpful.
>>
>>4379456
yeah but, like, ebay doesn't seem to be searchable for these unless I know the model number. Is there an active bartering/selling community where I can just buy a good one?
>>
>>4379475
do your research and find the models that interest you. start with shmups I guess, they have a pretty active community around crts iirc. and like I said, join the discord.
>>
>>4379482
what resource will tell me the specs I need to look for if I want to play X console?

I assume it's something like it need to run 240p and 480p if the most powerful console used is the n64
>>
>>4379528
do you have any interest in playing ps2, xbox, wii, or gcn? if not, then an SD set is what you'll want as the only consoles you'd be playing go up to 480i max. an SD set will play both 240p and 480i perfectly because it's what they're made to do. if you have any more questions I'd be willing to answer them on the discord.
>>
>>4379528
Without modding a NTSC N64 does 240p/480I S-Video, so find something with at least that.

480p support is nice if you want to do PS2/DC/OG Xbox/Wii/GCN
>>
Is there any way of having Windows display the desktop "correctly" while using a superwide resolution, like 3840x240?

So far I'm happy with the results but it'd be nice if I could change the aspect ratio on that and not just emulators/video players.
>>
>>4379627
Don't think there's any easy way to do it, Windows generally assumes square pixels, and there's no native asymmetric scaling support. Under linux you can using xrandr --scale 0.0833333x1 to give a 320x240 display without needing to convince the video driver to do a super low pixel clock. May be possible to use third party display warping software intended for video wall/projection setups.
>>
>>4377805
>not using Donkey Kong for the demonstration
>>
>Retroarch

why do I get screen tearing in SNES games but not in GBA games?
using bsnes-performance and mGBA
>>
>>4380445
What's your monitor refresh rate set to?

Threaded video off, vsync on?
>>
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This guy selling his what seems it's a Philips 30PW9110D CRT tv for $950 MXN (includes furniture)

https://www.cnet.com/products/philips-30pw9110d-30-crt-tv-30pw9110d37/specs/

anyone knows its cons? should I get it?
>>
>>4382830
That's about $50 USD, seems a bit steep for a consumer CRT. I've seen tons of similar CRT's being given away for free around these parts.

I wouldn't pay that much for it, personally.
>>
>>4382838
yeah I thought the same thing, I'll keep saving for a PVM then, thx
>>
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Here's my setup with my PVM 2530 with accessory APM speakers.
>>
>>4383167
super nice man
>>
I currently have my snes, genesis, ps2, og xbox and modded n64 all using component cables plugged into a component switch into my consumer sony crt. I've been looking into getting a PVM or BVM in the near future but now I'm kinda confused as to how I'd be connecting everything into the monitor. Would it be as simple as getting a component to bnc adapter? Or should I have originally gotten SCART cables and converted to component for crt in the meantime? I know some monitors have direct component inputs, but would that give the best possible RGB picture? Obviously I just want the best possible picture with the least amount of cable mess and hassle. How do you guys "future proof" your cables for tv or monitor upgrades?
>>
>>4383313
Component is fewest cables, and is going to be largely indistinguishable from RGB on a PVM. That said, and I could be wrong, but I don't think every brand of PVM is going to support component, I know SONY's usually do, but not sure about others.
>>
>>4383324
Thanks for the response. That's pretty much my concern since there's no telling which monitors would be coming my way so it's something I really can't be picky about
>>
>>4383402
Honestly, if you're running straight component from most of your machines, a nice consumer set isn't a bad situation at all. Certainly continue your hunt, but you can accommodate whatever you find when the time comes.
>>
How do you all calibrate your sets?
>>
>>4383651
I eyeball it with 240p Test Suite.
>>
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CRT noob here, is it worth it?
>>
>>4383806
Read the second sentence and get it.
>>
>>4383806
Maybe. Do they say what model it is? What would you want to use it for?
>>
>>4383869
No mention of model, but this pic. I'd use it for pre 360 era consoles.
>>
>>4383876
Just respond to the ad and ask. But make sure to mention it's located on the back though. I've had people just respond with "idk"
>>
>>4383904
will do
>>
>>4383904
>>4383905
also what model should I be looking out for?
>>
>>4383907
There are lots of models that are good, really. I would look for a CRT that's got component inputs if you're in North America. If you can find one that also has s-video input, that's also a huge plus.

In general, curved CRTs have less problems than flat-screen CRTs. That's something to keep in mind.
>>
>>4379661
>May be possible to use third party display warping software intended for video wall/projection setups.
Not him, but interesting idea. I'd have use for something that could do that.
>>
>>4383876
Digital processing, no 480p, fuckhuge you'll never get rid of it. Id pass
>>
I just picked up a Sony trinitron and the picture is blurry, even when using component and s video. What could be causing this?
>>
>>4384858
What sort of blurry? Pictures are always helpful.

Could need focus on the flyback adjusted and some convergence adjustments.
>>
>>4383806
>>4383876
it's an FS120, I can pretty much guarantee it. pretty much the most common WEGA there is, but it's a fine tv if you don't mind flatscreen issues.
>>
I get a red circle in the middle of my picture when I switch to component. It disappears once a game system is turned on, even stays away on games with black backgrounds. Any ideas?
>>
>>4385214

Here’s a pic of the same tv switched to s video. Why does it clear up?
>>
So, are HD CRTs to be avoided? I didn't realize they use scalers too.
>>
>>4385317
Avoid for retro yes, also they're like 9000lbs. If you want a CRT for playing X360/PS3 or newer on, they're pretty rad, but they cap out at 1080i, which isn't super awesome for newer stuff.
>>
>>4383651
No one actually cares about getting accurate picture quality. They just care about getting a trophy pvmeme.
>>
Aunt has a Toshiba 20AF44 in a closet. Should I bother driving an hour to get this thing or is it trash?
>>
>>4385712
Nice size, decent manufacturer, has component inputs, has 16:9 vertical mode, no HD bullshit, sounds good to me.
>>
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Which one of you retards paid $4129.28 for this BVM?
>>
>>4385214
It could be some kind of noise coming from the component inputs. What do you have plugged into it right now? Are you using a cheap cable that might not be well shielded? Does it happen if there's nothing plugged into the component inputs?
>>
>>4385940

Yeah, it happens when nothing is plugged into the inputs
>>
Can something (other than being an idiot and drop it) awful happen if I turn my CRT sideways frequently? I've been thinking of playing some of those vertical shooters.
>>
>>4386679
Oh by the way it's a fairly light 14 inch CRT so it's not exactly difficult to do.
>>
i know nothing about CRTs. is this criteria unreasonable:
decent quality, 4:3, component+vga/whatever else, auxiliary out, 20" or under
>>
>>4386873
if you're looking for retro use, having a VGA input is usually a bad thing, implies it's HD.
>>
>>4386880
i see
the plan was to use it for older consoles as well as my pc (MAME, retro fighting game netplay)
how bad of a thing is it for older consoles?
>>
>>4386890
Typically means it's at least an 'Enhanced Definition' set which means it has digital scaling and will add lag to retro games. Defeats the purpose of using a CRT, frankly. Also you're not going to find anything other than PVMs with an auxiliary video output.
>>
>>4386679
Should be okay. Colour purity may be a bit off when running sideways, due to the earth's magnetic field. That's only a temporary effect.
Airflow/overheating may cause trouble maybe? Just thinking out loud here, I've never heard of that being an issue.
>>
>>4383167
Where did you find those speakers, or did they come with the display?
>>
>>4386994
Thanks. I may consider it whenever I get good at these. I considered switching bindings instead but I don't know, it looks weird.
>>
>>4353938
normie here.
100% agree with you. I'm in the medical field and it's a fucking disaster whenever someone asks me in detail what it is they should, or shouldn't be doing...I'll go read the shit out of these docs. They are a great source of info
>>
>>4386974
>Typically means it's at least an 'Enhanced Definition' set which means it has digital scaling and will add lag to retro games
If it's a TV with a VGA input, you're absolutely right. But a PC CRT is definitely going to have a VGA(or similar) input and is the polar opposite; Absolutely no scaling, the caveat being that it's not going to work for older systems, but if they're running MAME or what have you, that would be the easy route to take.

>Also you're not going to find anything other than PVMs with an auxiliary video output.
There are plenty of Sony sets with a "monitor out" that mirrors the currently displayed input, usually only working for composite inputs else wise you end up getting just the Luma signal from S-Video/Component. I'm sure other makers have at least some models that work similarly. Heck, the Samsung GXTV even has that ability.

>>4353556
I'm working on it, sorta.
>>
One thing that bothered me for years and I heard all kinds of shit about:

Is it actually true that a turned on CRT TV with a black picture actually wastes less energy than the average LCD monitor?
>>
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Why is my PC monitor doing some like halo effect or something?

Using a cheap HDMI->VGA adapter but I don't think it was doing that before

Like you can see the armor and elbow bleeding off to the right, what do?
>>
>>4387301
>HDMI->VGA
you done goofed son
>>
>>4387314
You got a better way to hook up a modern GPU to a CRT?
>>
>>4387321
Get one that outputs VGA or DVI with analog. You could also install an older/cheaper GPU in addition to your modern digital-output-only GPU and connect the CRT to that.
>>
>>4387326
They took away VGA and DVI-i on every modern GPU, 10 series and RX series

I do have a Display Port to DVI-i adapter on the way, doubt it would be any better though
>>
>>4387326
>You could also install an older/cheaper GPU in addition to your modern digital-output-only GPU and connect the CRT to that.
Think I tried that and my PC would not even boot up
>>
>>4387327
Yes, that will not be any better. Actively converting the digital data stream to analog signals defeats the purpose of using a CRT over an LCD screen.
I don't really agree with what you are trying to do, but the solution is to use a graphics card that outputs an analog signal. I don't care about the brand name or whatever, if it doesn't do that it is no help to you. Luckily you can still use it with a normal "modern" display type.

>>4387331
Sounds like a problem exists between keyboard and chair. Don't give up though, learning to make things work is how you git gud.
>>
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Just got my degaussing coil in the mail. Before I start, I want to make sure I don't screw things up. They say you have to use specific motions to degauss safely. You're not supposed to move the coil too fast or too close to the screen. How fast is too fast? How close is too close? If I screw this up how will it show on the screen? Is it possible to do permanent damage by moving the coil too fast or too close?
>>
>>4387301
crosstalk caused by bad shielding.
either from hdmi-vga, vga cable, or both.
>>
>>4387354
It could also be caused by the scaling or sampling. There's not going to be a perfect way to go hdmi->vga.
>>
>>4387352
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tRkXF3TKy54
>>
>>4387337
All I need is a simple way to hook up my PC to my CRT for like emulation and stuff, it's really not that noticeable in games anyways

My motherboard is pretty low end, might not support booting from X GPU


The AM4 platform has VGA outputs on the motherboards, but there are no Raven Ridge APUs to use it with yet. I'm considering downgrading my system once those come out.

>>4387354
The wire on the adapter is super thing I suppose.

Passive adapter as well

https://www.amazon.com/Moread-Gold-Plated-Projector-Chromebook-Raspberry/dp/B00SW9JI9A/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1510256303&sr=8-3&keywords=HDMI+to+VGA
>>
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>>4387383
Forgot my pic
>>
>>4387301
That's ghosting/ringing caused by impedance mismatch. Make sure to use quality 75 ohm cables.
>>
>>4387387
The CRT cable is fat as fuck, the adapter is an $8 passive adapter.
>>
>>4387393
at some point I had a decently fat vga-bnc cable that showed similar ghosting.

I changed it and sure enough, the ghosting went away.
>>
>>4387393
There's no such thing as a passive hdmi-vga adapter.
>>
>>4387405
Yes there is? That's what I'm using. An active adapter is like $50, but modern GPUs and Laptops seem to be able to use passive adapters

>>4387403
Sadly my VGA cable is permanently attached I have 2 of the same model CRT actually, but I don't feel like dragging the other one out of storage until this one dies.
>>
>>4387405
>>4387410
Like isn't this thing an active adapter? Or maybe I'm thinking of something else, like HDMI To RCA

https://www.amazon.com/StarTech-com-DVI2VGAMM10-10-Feet-Converter-Digital/dp/B00QL17514/ref=sr_1_3?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1510256982&sr=1-3&keywords=active+digital+to+analog
>>
>>4387417
>>4387410
>>4387405
I was totally thinking of like RCA To HDMI

https://www.amazon.com/Portta-Converter-Scaler-HD-SDI-Support/dp/B01MDNS3I9/ref=sr_1_21_sspa?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1510257159&sr=1-21-spons&keywords=active+HDMI+to+coaxial&psc=1

But I could have sworn a friend of mine bought a straight display port to VGA cable that did nothing.
>>
>>4387410
not externaly powered doesn't mean passive.
DVI-VGA are passive.
HDMI-VGA needs DAC, it's powered by the HDMI device.
>>
>>4387032
They are built specifically for 2030-2530 model PVMs. But they didn't come with my PVM.
I spent a year looking for them on ebay before I found a pair being sold for $100. So I bought them and had them hooked up to my monitor by a professional.
The sound quality from those things are amazing!
>>
>>4387489
>had them hooked up to my monitor by a professional
What did he mean by this?
>>
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>>4387385
What viewsonic is that? I have an e90
>>
>>4388131
E790, does 1600x1200 at 75hz, I think it can go higher though, but it made some noise.
>>
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>>4388141
I think yours should have a similar scanning range as mine.
>>
>>4388152
https://www.cnet.com/products/viewsonic-e790-crt-monitor-19-series/specs/
>>
Damn I like yours better
>>
>>4387337
How would you use a CRT without converting from digital?
>>
>>4388285
With a graphics card that has a RAMDAC.
>>
>>4388442
That is converting from digital. RAMDAC = RAM Digital to Analogue Converter.
>>
>>4388651
I know, but this is the only ideal way to do it. External DACs are for the most part garbage.
>>
>>4388651
You are technically correct, of course. But the RAMDAC in the GPU is as good as it gets, as >>4388702 noted.

IS there something stopping the use of a brand new RX and something lower like an R9 card that's compatible with CRT emudriver? In a few years you might get into trouble installing new drivers for AAA games because they might not support older cards, and AMD is shit for that. But other than that?

OR

Use a 10-series Nvidia card and a lower-end Radeon R9 that will take crt_emudriver? Can't you run two different GPU divers with Win 10? Might be even better.
>>
>>4388796

Hell, even old consoles convert to analog. How far back do you have to go before you get true analog out of something?
>>
>>4388796
AAA means "We spent lots of money on it", stop using it for literally anything else
>>
>>4388801
>AAA means "We spent lots of money on it"
Thanks for the echo.
>>
>>4388801
Like, literally, stop. Literally "literally" literally.
>>
>>4388442
>>4388651
>>4388796
Stop calling them RAMDACs. Those haven't been used for like 20 years.
>>
>>4388824
Discrete ones, sure. They were still integrated into the display controller until quite recently though.
>>
>>4388796
Having two versions of the AMD driver installed would likely cause issues, and the latest one modded with CRT Emudriver doesn't officially support any of the R9/RX branded cards (but some rebadged models may work).

Using old ATI/AMD card + a newer Nvidia card under Windows should work fine, I've been using mixed Intel graphics + Nvidia or AMD graphics for multi monitor support for a few years now, haven't had many issues.

>>4388797
Some Pong machines were mostly analogue.
>>
Will RCA switchers introduce any sort of input delay? My cheapo Sanyo CRT from 2003 only has one (mono) composite so I want to get a switcher whose video goes to the TV with the audio going out to a set of powered stereo speakers. I play a lot of rhythm games so input latency and synchronization are a big deal for me.
>>
>>4388909
If it's just a switcher, no. May introduce noise or pick up interference particularly from any other devices connected to it. If it's also got any signal processing or scaling features those may introduce a delay.
>>
Does anyone know if samsung crt tvs use the same input (AV1/AV2, etc) for both composite and s-video?
>>
>>4388915
Got a particular model you're looking at?

Should be described in the manual or just look at the labels on the rear IO if you've got a picture.

S-video on most consumer TVs is shared with a composite input.
>>
>>4388937
I checked the user's manual. It mentions the s-video connector but it's not clear whether it is shared or not.
I have model CL-21S8 which has component but not s-video. Since this model has the same chassis as other models that have s-video I was wondering whether I can just solder the missing component to the board and use AV1/AV2 or if s-video is disabled in the firmware/eeprom.
>>
>>4389003
Looking at the user manual it allows you to give the S-video, component and all S-video inputs separate names, so the firmware does know they exist separately. If you're lucky may be a configuration jumper/pin, but it's more likely on an EEPROM somewhere.
>>
>>4388834
Still those are just DACs. There's no RAM part anymore.
>>
Do D32/A32's do 1080p?
>>
>>4389430
They might do 1080p/24 but that's for movies and nothing else.
>>
>>4389430
>>4389676
24psf which isn't really quite the same anyway.

Any no, they'll do 1080i and 720p, but that's as high as they go.

The only BVM out there you'll get 1080p from is the "CineAlta" BVM-F24.
>>
Need help identifying this Tron.
>>
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I just degaussed my CRTV.

It fixed some blueish discoloration but there still some dark splotches in the upper and lower left corners. Even after degaussing three times those dark corner splotches remain. What is wrong with my TV and how do I fix it? Does this have something to do with "purity" or "convergence"?
>>
>>4389914
definitely sounds like a purity issue.
>>
>>4389872
Only way to know for sure would be to have them turn it around and actually tell you the model, but it looks like an XBR48. If so, that'd be a really nice find, as it's one of, if not the only curved consumer Sony to actually have Component inputs on it.
>>
>>4389872
Thank you man. I asked to see the back. It's for free. I'll drive out tomorrow to pick it up. Lady said it's in excellent shape.
>>
>>4390101
you're one lucky son of a bitch if you can get that for free
>>
>>4389918
Are you sure?
Doesn't purity just affect color and not luminosity?
My corners are not discoloured, just darkened.
>>
>>4390202
They're related, if purity is out so that the beam isn't hitting all of the phosphor but is still clear of the neighbouring colours it can affect brightness. without changing colour much.

Can you bring up a blank red, green, blue image to check?

Can also be related to beam landing.
>>
>>4389872

it's an XBR; great regardless of exact model.
>>
>>4390218
Nah, in the corners like that it'll be purity. Good call though.
>>
>>4389872
>>4390101
>>4390606
It's a xbr 32, with component and svideo.
From a Mexican family. They want to meet tomorrow now at 6pm. It weighs almost 150lbs.
>>
>>4353592
Yes. Comparing broadcast monitors is easy enough, but it's hard to compare consumer sets.
>>
>>4391120

this thing looks sweet. Grab it if you have the space.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6eWWZIuB5eU

I passed on an XBR on Seattle CL because I have no room, but damn I wanted it. Look up above for the ad.
>>
Scanline generator got here today. Pc + lakka + crt.
>>
>>4391958
>>
>>4391958
>Scanline generator
Which one?
>>
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I bought a pvm-2030 and I'm learning how to config stuff (colors, geometry, contrast) The front panels are dead so my only option is to mess with a screwdriver. Pic related is a super famicom through S-Video. Sorry if it's not a good picture.
>>
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When I power on this 1351Q, it makes a really wimpy "zaaaaaaah" noise instead of the normal CRT whine and I get no picture. See pic; I had to repair the PSU board just to get this far. I'm told this is probably arcing inside the tube and that its probably beyond all hope, but is there any tests I can do on the fly back and the AC adapter that would confirm this?
>>
>>4390218
Ok, I put in a calibration DVD and checked red, green, and blue color fields.

There is no discoloration just darkened spots in the left corners. These dark spots are easier to see on a white background than coloured ones.

If this is caused by a purity problem can it be fixed in the service menu or do I have to open the back of the TV?
>>
Where can I get SCART cables for consoles that are actually shielded? I've had hit or miss luck so far. A couple have been okay, but most of them have a lot of audio interference.

I don't need some crazy multi-core coaxial cable with fancy metal connectors. I just need some average cables that won't make an offensive buzzing noise while I'm trying to play my game.
>>
>>4392901
>I just need some average cables that won't make an offensive buzzing noise while I'm trying to play my game.
You need to stay away from scart then. Use RGB BNC instead.
>>
>>4392901
Either look for second hand or make your own, the only new SCART cables you can easily get are custom built for pretty high prices, or cheapo shit with tiny single conductor cabling that's not internally shielded.
>>
>>4392931
Well those cables are just as expensive, or more expensive than the custom made SCART cables. I am using a SCART to BNC breakout cable as it keeps things simple. It would be more sensible and flexible for me to buy SCART cables at this point.

>>4392962
Are the officially branded cables usually pretty good? I might check around on European ebay and see what the prices are like.
>>
Anyone here use a CRT as a second monitor?
>>
>>4393878
I use one as my primary.

The difference is mine can actually display text in a legible fashion.
>>
>>4393891
I just hooked it up today, still gotta fiddle with the settings.

Also I know mine would probably look better if it was a direct connection, but I'm using UHF
>>
>>4393898
Try using accessibility settings for the partially sighted.

Seriously, it's gonna help a great deal.
>>
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>>4392218
>>
Who do I have to blow to find any pvm/bvm locally? Feel like there never any.
>>
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>>4393878
yes, but I use an actual monitor...
>>
>>4393878
kek
>>
What's a decent component cable for PlayStation 1?
>>
What is the consensus of the RCA tvs? Specifically the Colortrak Plus.
>>
>>4394278
PS1 doesn't do component, PS2/3 do.
>>
>>4394278
PSX doesn't outpout YPbPr. Get an S-Video cable instead. But if you want a component cable for PS2 and PS3 I can recommend the Monoprice combo cable that also works with Wii and Xbox 360.
>>4394282
>>>/v/ take your shitposting somewhere else, child.
>>
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Well after much fiddling around I got the colors to look way better and flying toasters. I'm feeling pretty satisfied right now.
>>
>>4394471
Nice Video Sender, I've had one of those on my eBay watchlist for a year or so, not quite sure if I actually need one.
>>
>>4379358
Not huge but I bought a Megaview 29 a few months ago for $425. Not a steal, but a decent price for ebay.

On the other hand if you want the best, you're going to pay. There's a BVM-A24 on ebay right now for $6850+shipping
>>
>>4393965
Those nails
>>
>>4395587
>a Megaview 29 a few months ago for $425.
With shipping ? Because that is a steal if shipping included.
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>>4395592

They’re not just for looks, they are functional too. Makes it easier to dig boogers out from deep inside my nose
>>
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I hope you gents are using the proper cleaning solution for your equipment. You are decimating the lifespan of your CRTs by using anything else.
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>>4396001
I use a damp microfibre cloth
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>>4367792
RGB is component, too
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>>4396001
I just go with spit and toilet paper.
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>>4396141

Trinitron?
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>>4396272
Filename dummy
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>>4396001
I don't want my CRT to be retarded though.
>>4396124
I guess s video is if we're being pedantic.
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>>4395546
Thanks. I bought it about 2 years ago and it took me about a month to find one for sale. I was shocked how difficult (at least then) it is to find one of these.
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>>4389872
Fucking cunt never got back with me....
>>
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WTF.

I set my camera to 1/60 shutter speed and I still get downwardly moving dark horizontal bars and moire on the screen of the TV.

How do you take photos of CRTs without these horrible artifacts?
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>>4397034
Camera shutter speed isn't particularly accurate, going 1/30 or 1/15 with a tripod can do a better job of hiding the refresh. For reducing moire artifacts, move closer/further to increase the frequency, or change your focus so it's a little bit off.
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>>4397054
https://twitter.com/NWPlayer123/status/930260444501237762
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>No one has a Iiyama Vision Master Pro 514 for sale
Fug
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>>4397229
>over half the replies are talking about Melee

jesus fucking christ when will this fresh hell end

I found out the other day that my two Sony Trinitrons are worth around $150 each now because of the inflation that these fags are bringing to the world of CRT's, even though if you actually go to tourney's you will see them using the worst of offbrand shite

I mean fuck I'm someone who watches Melee from time to time but god the community is just such a shitfest
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>>4397264
I picked one not long ago for free, it might be one of the best display to enjoy some Dreamcast.
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>>4396616
Awesome, I have an (unfortunate?) soft spot for RF-only TVs, so I figure I should get one at some point. Can you actually play games over one?
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>>4397229
>240i
>420p
>420i
w e w l a d
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>>4397631
blaze it progressively
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>>4397862
>>
>>4353609
That toshiba tv pictured is actually dope af. Used it for years till it croaked. Picture was sharp and vibrant, light guns worked on it, sound was good. Looked good with stuff ranging from atari to xbox. Only thing is i wish it was bigger.
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>>4393878
I can't because I use super resolutions.
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Excuse the shitty quality.

If I use darker backgrounds on my TV (I have set the wallpaper on this to be a solid color for reference) it displays a few darkened vertical bars on the screen, only on one side. It can't be easily appreciated but it's there.

Would anyone know what's causing this? If I change the colors and use something clearer these just disappear or at least are not noticeable.
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>>4398215
How long are your cables? May be signal reflection
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>>4398523
2 meters. Gotta investigate.
>>
Anyone know why a Trinitron rotation option wouldn’t work?

In the service manual it gives codes to turn rotation on/off. When I type this in a new option appears in the regular menu which is a circle icon.

It changes to +1 +2 +3 etc but doesn’t actually change the picture at all. There was also a rotation test number which did nothing.
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>>4398764
Sure your monitor/TV actually has a rotation coil?
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>>4398764
I've got a non-trinitron monitor that does the exact same thing. Never was able to figure it out. I had to take the bezel off and manually adjust the screen by hand.
>>
Some tvs have the menu entry despite not having the control coils.
>>
I'm wanting to get into the PVMeme. Anything I should know?

I'm mainly wondering about size differences. Does a 14" have a sharper/nicer picture than say a 20+"?

I have two large sony trinitron in my basement game room, both the SD normal 4:3 and an hd letterbox one. They look good but I've been enjoying a 19" Sharp that I found on the curb. The Sony's have better picture, but the 19" just looks great. Higher pixel density?

I'd appreciate any anon's tips when it comes to choosing size.

P.S. I don't know the model on the sharp, but it has Svideo, component, and composite on the front. Looks good on anything from Atari to PS1 and PS2 . I'd just use it, but I want something super good for my bedroom.

Not related blog: I picked up some small Orion unit with built in VCR, but it surprised me, this is the first curb shopped t.v. that I've ever got that didn't work perfectly, even ones picked up after rainstorms. When I push the power button, I hear a click, like a relay or something, but no sound of the CRT powering up. Not sure what's going on there, is it fixable? If not I may just desolder parts from it to use on other projects.
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>>4399061
TVL count is key.
Similar TVL count will look similar on both size, only marginaly sharper feel on a 14".
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>>4399074
Furiously googles TVL count. Thanks for the info anon!
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>>4399061
Smaller monitors will look sharper, while larger ones of the same TVL count and resolution will have larger black spaces between the scanlines.

Without knowing what models exactly it's hard to say, but in general the same source on a smaller screen will look sharper.

I feel for the PVM meme, but I went with a Panasonic model with 750 TVL. I absolutely love it, and find myself playing more retro stuff now than I ever used to.

14" PVMs tend to be in that sweet spot of price, picture quality, size, and availability. I had to drive a few hours to get mine, but it beats paying for eBay shipping and having it show up broken. 20"+ monitors are harder to find, very expensive, and are super expensive to ship, and prone to getting destroyed by careless postal workers.

If you have the money to spend on it, do it. You won't regret it. I had a good 20" consumer Sony that had component inputs I was using for a while, but I eventually gave it away to a friend after getting the Panasonic professional monitor.

Your Orion TV could have any number of problems, and is almost certainly not worth the effort of trying to fix it. I'd just pitch it.




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