>>20969660
*Pio for $60

>>20969660
Stewart?

>>20969660
Pretty obscure selection thats for sure. I respect that. Stellenbosch South Africa produces some good wine. Uruguay is also up and coming and producing some good Tannat and Albarino suprisingly. I like to see these sorts of regions get some love.
The Vernaccia and the primitivo are fine table wines.
The Pio Cesare will be delicious but give it a good decant.

Bump

>>20969660
What kind of wine do you like?

>>20970654
The good kind. Love Nebbiolo and Champagne from Cote de Blancs. I had a delicious chenin blanc earlier this week from Santa Barbara and I think I’ll open the steen later today, never had South African wine before and this stellenbosch gets great reviews on cellar tracker.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8IF6cddJX6A

>>20970884
Can you give reasons for your ratings to someone who doesn't know what makes some wines better than others? Have you tried each one of those or are you assuming how good they'll be based on the type/location/winery/year?

>>20971142
Nta but he’s rating them by country and variety.

>>20971217
How does he know? I'm looking at the picture and I can see the first bottle is a south african chenin blanc and the third bottle is a tannat from uruguay, but the second bottle is just a cabernet / merlot / something (does that mean it's a blend?) from an unknown country, and I can't tell the country or variety of the other bottles.
Even if I could see the country/variety of each bottle, how would I know if they're good? Do you guys memorize the taste differences between all those varieties of grapes grown in all these different regions?

>>20971102
you into any bordeauxs yet?

>>20971241
The blend has a silly Dutch name like sneedingfeeding which is an indicator it may be South African. The white has an Italian DOCG label on the neck. Puglia is a region in Italy and Primitivo is their name for Zinfandel. Pio is a famous producer and Barbaresco is a famous Italian variety. You can’t really read the sparkling wine label from this picture. Good wine leaves a lasting memory on you that’s different from other less memorable wines.

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>>20971263
Not yet, I was thinking of nabbing this Ch La Gaffeliere.They also had 2021 Ch Quinault L’Enclos and 2021 Ch D’Armhaillac Paulliac each for $45.

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Had a bottle of this with lunch on the weekend. Very nice, and went well with the food. Probably about the limit of what I am willing to pay for a Malbec.

>>20971304
miss the 17s and 21s, both are terrible and their value suffered from being right next to great vintages
11s, 12s and 14s are drinking great right now despite being bad vintages, and should be reasonably priced if they're still on the shelf
I believe you can scoop up Chevalier Rouge 2016 for a similar price, and that wine's great

Hey winefriend, just a PSA from someone who used to be in your shoes and was super stoked about the big selection: I'd recommend not shopping at total wine--their entire gimmick is pushing you towards their house brands that they get for almost nothing and mark up to an equivalent level of everything else they sell in that category. Any winery direct wine they're making 300-400% on your purchase rather than the standard 60% margin common in retail. The selection and prices seem great, but if you look up the price of any of their other offerings, the prices are markedly worse.

If there are any small wine stores near you, you should consider giving them your business instead. You'll get consistently more interesting wines at every price point.

>>20971295
>The blend has a silly Dutch name like sneedingfeeding which is an indicator it may be South African.
>Good wine leaves a lasting memory on you that’s different from other less memorable wines.
lmao couldn't make it any more obvious you're pretending you don't know where stellenbosch is

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>>20972439
I don’t touch total wine without using some 25-30% discount on a mixed half case of entry bottles of weirder shit I want to try out (like the South African stuff) or bottles that I already know what I’m kind of getting. plus my butcher is right around the corner from the totalwine but usually I go to the little boutique wine bar that retails all their bottles half off, the problem is their wine list changes 2-3 times per week so I can’t order ahead online or see their wine list like picrel on their website

>>20972628
Yes I couldn’t tell you if stellenbosch was a producer or appellation.

>>20972649
except it's on two of the bottles and on one stellenbosch clearly isn't the producer on the second, so in that case you'd be a retard with shockingly poor reading comprehension

>>20972660
When the producers names are blowmequickens and sneedingfeeding you don’t really bother with anything else on the label

>>20972672
*blowclippin’

>>20972672
except sneedingfeeding could only be mocking stellenbosch on that label which happens to be some of the smallest text visible

you're literally too stupid for this shit, almost sad considering how hard you try

>>20972672
Stellenbosch is a reasonably renowned area for vineyards in SA.

Getting into Red Wine.
Currently liking Shiraz and Malbec the most.
Not biggest Merlot fan.

Any other recs?

>>20972679
It could, but it isn’t according to you. Seems like I did a good job picking a couple bottles.
>>20972703
I wouldn’t know I’ve never drank anything from South Africa before

>>20972879
100% bullshit

Ok, so, hear me out,
Peach wine mixed with fireball, 2 to 1 parts.
It's absolutely delicious and it's what I classify as "danger booze" meaning it's ridiculously easy to chug it and get completely shitfaced.

>>20972918
What is bullshit about finding two entry bottles from the South Africa section?

>>20971304
You should looks for tags that say premium selection at total wine or look in the glass case in the front.

>>20973466
I try to but the overwhelming majority is beyond my budget. In typical total wine fashion all their coupons and discounts almost never apply to their good shit, the pio barbaresco was one of those exceptions.

>>20972772
Gutturnio

>>20972772
sounds like you like juicy wines that are still dry
barbera, cru beaujolais (morgon, fleurie, moulin-a-vent), st emillion, southern rhone, priorat

>>20972772
Grenache, Tempranillo, Sangiovese.

>>20972439
Not a winefag but a whiskeyfag.
Some years ago Total Wine consistently had very low prices on whiskey, across the board.
Nowadays their prices are quite high.
They've gotten worse in recent years.

>>20974304
I did a little shopping a month ago and less than a week apart the prices for premium bottles INCREASED 20-30% AND had a "new low price" tag on them. it's been a bad couple of years for sales across the board but fuckin hell.

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>>20971102
Update: the chenin blanc was very smoky and I think a bit mousy. Picrel was better, tasted like peaches and cream.

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>>20969660
>TotalWine

I'm glad I got into coffee snobbery instead of wine

>>20969660
If I like Verdicchio, Riesling and Sauvignon Blanc what should I try next?

>>20975099
Albarino

>>20969660
you got a pio cesare barbaresco 2019? nice. i would not open it before 2026, it will be too young. and if you do open it, sample it and if it's not amazing, consider letting it sit open in the fridge for a day and drink it on day 2 after an hour of warming up. barbaresco might be my favorite wine.

>>20971304
>>20971523
i sorta disagree. id rather recommend a better vintage but older. 2000 or 2005. i would even buy a less reputable but mature wine from these vintages than from 2011
i have had 2009s who are not ready yet (because powerful vintage)

>>20972772
depends on your budget:
low budget: cotes du rhone village and simple chianti classico riservas, perhaps some beuajolais
medium budget: value nebs and sangioveses or chateauneuf du papes
big budget: anything goes. bordeaux and burgundy are mostly overpriced tho

>>20973472
all bundling in all industries involves combining something good with godawful stuff that you cant sell otherwise. all bundling is for suckers

>>20969660
You're an alcoholic.
>inb4 typical alcoholic denial
I've seen your posts before. You drink a lot.

>>20975099
Chenin Blanc, 100%.

Assyrtiko, Semillon and Albarino also good as that other anon mentioned.

I can't drink wine. It tastes good but anything more than two bottles and I go full retard.

>>20975099
Muscadet

>>20976598
Can you not drink less than 1.5L of wine?

>>20975367
What kind of prices should I expect? Hard to find anything that old under $100 where I live but I don’t know what I’m looking for with Bordeaux terroir.

>In 1960 almost 80% of wine consimed in the US was fortified or dessert wine
Retvrn

>>20969660
>+ on SA Chenin - good value, SA Bordeaux blend
>hear a lot about Uruguayan Tannat, never had though
>not so sure about that Brazilian sparkling, looks booky
>no opinion on Vernaccia
>Primitivo Puglia pretty unexciting, has a Maroni sticker, bad sign
>Pio Cesare not great but at least it's Barbaresco
6/10 overall

>>20978102
>Etna rosso always fun
>ditto Ruche
>always like a good looking Muscadet
>Chenin always good
7.5/10 good picks but nothing massively exciting

I'm a harsh marker

>>20978894
What’re you drinking these days?

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>>20978569
You can even pair it with 1960s American cuisine!

>>20971263
my advice remains to buy older bordeaux even if it means buying a slight notch beyond the quality level you were originally aiming at. for a great vintage like 2009 from a decent to good chateaux 15 years can be nothing and the wine can be still in its development.
a primary concern should be avoiding wines are not showing their tasting profile yet. the younger the vintage, the more powerful the vintage, the more structured the chateaux's general profile, the more time it needs

>>20978282
depends on where you live. in europe, near france, you can find bargains in the 80 to 130 bucks range, so yes under 100 euros/dollars is possible. but even then you're paying a premium for bordeaux. you can unironically find equally as enjoyable wines (or more!) in tuscany or piedmont or chateauneuf. the difference is not so much quality but in what fruit profile the wines show case. in the case of left wing bordeaux it is usually cassis.
if you're more constrained on budget it makes no sense to buy bordeaux (or you insist and save up for a bottle of pontet-canet 2003, which i just had and which is excellent).
this wine here was wine spectator's #7 on its top 100 last year and it has excellent quality:
>https://www.wine-searcher.com/find/tenute+tignanello+marchesi+antinori+rsrv+docg+chianti+cls+tuscany+italy/2020/
it's affordable and it completely changes it's tasting profile over 5 hours in the bottle from feminine to masculine. magical.
make sure to serve your wine at right temperature in any case, slightly below room temperature

>>20975362
*half an hour or warming up. or for however long it takes to be slightly below room temperature

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>>20979761
I’ve tried the Tignanello Sangiovese+Bordeaux varietal blend, but never their Chianti Classico label. The budget I can work around much more easily with Italian wines like in picrel. It’s Napa, Burgundy and Bordeaux I’m having trouble getting into because of the market and classification system. Im considering just ordering a bunch of $30 futures from different subappelations and just committing mass infanticide to see if I can score on something.

>>20979763
I’m looking to get a case of Pio’s latest single vineyard barbaresco which is supposed to be one of those age worthy barbarescos that’s also ready to drink right now. this 2019 pio apparently has a much higher percentage of grapes coming from that single vineyard than their other releases so I’m opening this 2019 within the next couple weeks.

>>20980006
i generally try to age barbarescos 7+ years before opening and barolos 10+ years. for younger wines, i prefer chateauneuf-du-pape.
the antinori chianti classico riserva opens very feminine and floral with a tannic aftertaste because it is too young. but after a few hours in the open bottle, all those notes have largely disappeared and given way to very pleasant tobacco notes like you find in aged cab sauv from bordeaux. it's pretty good value imho.

>>20980070
So if I wanted a Cab Sauv/Franc dominant blend thats more elegant, refined, restrained style with lighter extraction, what am I looking for? Is the value play to hunt “bad” vintages from respected producers in appellations famous for big bold styles? Or do I have it backwards, and should just try some literal who out of Margaux in a very highly rated vintage?

>>20980165
i recently had the chateau du tertre 2000 for 80 euros and it was very enjoyable. not more enjoyable than the chianti classico riserva for half the price but that's bordeaux for ya. you must appreciate the green bellpepper flavor of cab franc for that tho
conversely I also had the 2012 beychevelle which has been underrated by wine advocate imho. it's a very elegant wine just lacking oomph because poor vintage
you may want to consult winecellarinsider for your eventual pick though he's also off sometimes. there's no guarantees it's an expensive gamble

>>20980180
Saved. my favorite cab franc from Santa Barbara had a lot of green bell pepper. As long as it’s not like shitty Chilean Carmenere half raw half rotten green bell pepper thing.

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Thinking Ruche or Barbaresco for this one. Will make tagliolini tomorrow.

>>20979970
if you want great bordeaux for the money, your best bet are sattelite appelations like fronsac
st emillion is generally pretty affordable too, but it's a big region and quality is sporadic
Chateau Capbern is great wine for the money, used to be sub-thirty, but I think it's crept up to around 40 thee days

>>20979389
Lots of Grenache, Riesling, getting into Cabernet Sauvignon/Bordeaux blends too.

Lots of underpriced Cabernet floating around at the moment that doesn't have too much new oak or ripeness. No one's drinking it anymore.

>>20971304
La Gaff '21 was mid compared to any other similar price range St. Emilion. Even then I'd strongly suggest not to buy any '21 Bordeaux that is over 13.5% ABV as it's likely to have been chaptalized given the disease pressure they had and not as hot summer as 18-19-20. Unironically Pessac-Leognan and Saint-Julien had the best wines from '21. If the store has Lagrange or Olivier from '21 get those instead.

>>20972772
Priorat reds are fun if you wanna go heavier fruit and earth and softer tannins (usually) from the Malbec side.
Also try some Syrah from Northern Rhone crus like Saint-Joseph and Crozes-Hermitage and some examples from Ardeche. Lots of value and stylization from lean and floral to meaty and rich Syrah.

>>20973522
This is actually the best pick in this thread.
Or better yet, try Macchiona. That wine will change anyone's opinions on Emilia-Romagna as a quality wine region that doesn't just make Lambrusco.

>>20975099
Arneis or Savagnin.

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For last year's Christmas I bought pic related for all my family, as well as a single bottle of Khvanchkara for the table, it was so delightful and novel I bought another case this year, and am also looking to explore more Georgian varieties leaning towards their white/amber wines next, anyone have knowledge/recommendations they can throw my way?

>>20982882
Pheasant's Tears is a widely available producer that's pretty solid. I think all of their wines are dry and pretty savoury though, so pretty different style to the bottle you've bought.

Most white/amber wines from Georgia are dry I'm pretty sure btw.

>>20982771
Noted.

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perro bodeguero

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picked this up for Thanksgiving.

I don't really buy wine except for holidays.

>>20982618
nta but i cant get into merlot except as a supplement and wont buy if it's more than a third

>>20984090
Winery dogs are peak soul. Every single one I've met have been so fun and they're always so curious about who the visitors are.

>>20975099
Fiano

>>20984250
Not bad as long as you didn't pay out the ass for it.

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>>20986012
I paid $54 after taxes, not amazing, but at least it's not restaurant pricing.

>>20984250
it has extremely mediocre ratings on wine advocate and other critics ngl

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>>20986068
Yea

>>20986075
the problem is generally with reputable AVAs, DOCs, AOCs, etc. either you can afford to pay the branding premium on top for the really good stuff or you're better off buying good quality shit from lesser known regions

>>20986083
Sure, but Duckhorn napa valley cab and merlot are both solid offerings, they're not gonna win the best wine in their price range, but they're not bad wine and there is no real reason to avoid them if you want something different.

I also picked up a bottle of Silver Oak alexander valley cab, though that one I'm saving for Christmas.

>>20986089
More like crapa valley lmao

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>>20986094

>>20986089
sure thing, 90 point wines can be very enjoyable and wine advocate is off anyway. for example, the beychevelle '12 was rated 87 by WA but to me it was a 92 because the elegance and quality of the fruit always peeked through

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im not a nerd or anything I just like drinking the good stuff

>>20969660
>no champagne
>no 19 Crimes
>none of that wine that comes in gigantic jugs
The best I can give your haul is a 7/10. It'd be a 6/10 if you hadn't gotten the Alma sparkling wine.

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>>20984374
merlot is a chameleon, can be a fruit bomb, all earth and herbs, or extremely structured and mineral, and everything between
just because america likes to massacre the grape into a semi-sweet abomination, don't let that put you off of some great bordeaux

>>20986089
please don't buy brands owned by VC firms, I can genuinely give you 10 different cali producers who make better wine for less than both duckhorn and silver oak

>>20986419
im german and ive been trying a couple of right banks and it's just not for me. i acknowledge them as very very well made wines but it's not my flavor

>>20969660
based tannat enjoyer

Reminder to all the anons buying wine for the holidays: unless you know everyone at the table has an appreciation for wine, I would strongly encourage only buy and open reasonably priced crowd-pleasing wines. Resist the urge to splurge and open that super special bottle you find so precious. The last thing you want is to serve your most beloved wine only for someone to chase it with diet pepsi and never touch the glass again for the remainder of the meal. They won't enjoy the wine and you won't enjoy having to stare at a near-full glass of the good stuff just sit on the table and go unappreciated for the rest of dinner.

>>20986435
I bring a bottle of wine and a bottle of whiskey to most holiday meals with family.

I tend to cap bottles at $100, though I'll generally spend $40-70 and I usually get to go home with half a bottle left of the whiskey.

Newfag here, how do I get into wine? I don't like the acidic or tanin taste of most wines I've tried. What's are a few beginner wines that won't financially rape me?

>>20986468
That's smart

>>20986501
german riesling, primitivo/zinfandel are good entry-level whites and reds
your palate will change to prefer drier things the more you taste

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>>20986501
From what I've tried in US markets
>circle = $10ish you can get something simple, over $20 and you should expect serious quality wine
>square = $20ish for simple, over $35 it better be taste different from the rest
>5-point star = under $30 should raise suspicion, might be outside its drinking window by multiple years, or extreme market over/under saturation, low bargain potential. some regions don't have price ceilings for these wines but over $50 you should expect high quality
>6-point star = under $50 is probably shit, decades outside its drink window, or made by some nobody from a region famous for exporting whatever they don't drink. you can start to find good quality at $75-100 but no price ceiling whatsoever
>bubbles = really hard to find the good stuff that you can drink right now for under $100, price ceilings sometimes do not exist
sorry i fucked up the stars on some of them, but i wouldn't suggest getting those until you know what you like. For reds start with malbec, dolcetto, grenache, pinot noir from south america. for whites look for semillon, vouvray, gewurztraminer, fiano, roero arneis. all the bubbles i drink are super high acid, idk if i can recommend you a brand.

>>20986501
cotes du rhone, bar none. riesling is not a good beginner wine because it's highly acidic
if you're beginner only trust rankings from wine advocate (aka "parker points"), james suckling or wine spectator.
rule of thumb: you got decent value if 10s digit of the price equals the 1s digit of the critics rating, eg $25 for a 92 pt wine. prefer wines who have at least two different ratings by reputable critics
it's no guarantee but your best bet. otherwise go to a wine shop

How much wine is too much to drink in a sitting? I'm at like four to six bottles of red before I'm nice and drunk and my teeth and tongue turn purple.

>>20987153
I don't think i've ever even had a full bottle in one sitting.
I usually max out at 3 glasses.

>>20986089
>silver oak
Dude both Groth and Frank Family Cab are way better for considerably less money. Hell Ramey is leagues better for Sonoma Cab. Why do people still buy Silver Oak when they sell entirely on marketing now?

>>20988354
Availability

The only Groth cab available near me is the reserve at $160. Frank family cab would be a 45 minute drive, though it's at least available. Ramey cab is similarly not available locally.

Sure if I'm willing to go hunting or order online and wait for shipping there are other options.

Instead I walked half a block and bought my wine during my lunch break, then walked back home.

who the hell pays over $100 a bottle for some Californian slop
I’d be embarrassed to put something that’s not foreign on the table

>>20988620
Shafer can do very well at the table. I thought Stag's Leap was worth the hype too.

>>20988620
central coast food pairs best with the central coast wine

>>20988620
Have some pride in your country.

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>>20988655
America does lots of things right, wine is not one of those.
A vineyard should be a family heirloom, a way of life for you and your kids and your kids’ kids. When some corporate city boy prick comes in and buys a vineyard in Napa, does some math based planting and slaps a graphic design logo on the bottle it kills everything that made the wine special.
Good wine is expensive not because it’s good, it’s expensive because of its story.

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>>20988731
>America does lots of things right, wine is not one of those.
>Good wine is expensive not because it’s good, it’s expensive because of its story.
Lol

lmao even


I do appreciate the laughs anon, thank you

>>20988731
sounds like a napa issue

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>>20988733
>napa valley
>low cuck altitude
>irregular, weak, salty shitty sea winds
>soil is nothing special
>most “vinters” are just sovless tech startup spergs who make sovless math equation wines
>Luján de Cuyo
>3500 feet minimum
>regular strong, hot, winds off the mountains
>soil drains easily, nutrients and vitamins are deep enough so only strong vines survive
>vinters are kids who have been drinking since they are 10 years old, entire life revolves around the vineyard

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>>20988773
Oh so now it's not America, it's Napa Valley which is of course the only wine region in the entire country.

Again, thanks for the laughs.

>>20988777
you are the one who mentioned stag leap and shafer, both of which are objectively average napaslop
if you were talking about Idaho or E WA then fair enough they can do some interesting stuff

>>20988791
>everyone who replies to me is the same anon

>itt: people who google “best reds under $150” and are instant experts

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>Husband knows I like Star Trek and wine
>Surprises me with a Star Trek wine advent colander for this Christmas season
Here's hoping.

>>20988811
Even if they're shit, it's a nice gift.

>>20988385
Where do you buy from then? I guarantee your store has better Cali Cab for less money than Silver Oak.

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>>20989159
Local government-run liquor store, or a wine shop across the street, both are within 2 blocks and walkable.

>>20989165
Given pic related you should've done Chapellet or Trefethen instead.

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>>20989185
>trust me bro

>>20989243
>looking at basic website reviews
How many of those 5 stars are "OMG SO SMOOTH AND FULL BODIED! YUMMERS!!!" and never actually describe the wine properly?
I've worked in selling wine for over 8 years but if you wanna take random comments (who are probably clone accounts for distributors) or mine?

>>20989265
The critic reviews are also basically identical
I'm not saying they're bad wine, likely better value than the silver oak, but I also don't really care that much. I'm not looking to min-max my holiday wine.

>>20989268
>im not looking to min max my holiday wine
>so I’ll just buy something expensive reviewers are paid to say is good enough

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>>20989608
>all reviewers are bought
>trust me instead

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Finished a bottle of 2021 Niagara tonight. Anyone else /labrusca/?

Not shown: this cremant de bordeaux cab franc that I had with street tacos for dinner. Tasted like strawberries out of the paper cup.

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>>20989843
Forgot picrel. Will probably open the valpolicella next.

>>20989845
Kept it unde $150, per usual.