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Happy 19th Birthday 4chan!




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Princess Irulan
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Chani
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>>4503455

Sorry but this version is complete garbage compared to the new one.
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>>4503500
Sorry, but atm I prefer the old version. BTW: we have to wait for part 2 to be able to make a final judgement.
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>>4503500
The recent version has no soul, it's totally devoid of any humanity. Everything about it is empty, the acting, the costumes, the sets, the cinematography, etc. Some of the casting is atrocious too. Despite being set on a barren desert planet, the novel itself is dripping with vibrancy, colours, sounds, emotions, action, you are transported to a completely different universe. It completely engulfs you. All of that is missing in Villeneuve's Dune. It manages to make an exotic space opera truely mundane.

The 84' version is not a good film either really, but for different reasons and it does get some things right. It manages to capture some of the exotic vibrancy of the novel, or at least does a decent job attempting too. Most of the casting, the sets, costumes, the music is all engrossing and interesting. It captures some of the essence of the novel which the latest doesn't. Where it fails is mainly the writing. I don't know if the film had productions problems, but it feels like the film isn't finished, or like they were rushing to get through scenes.

As someone who's a big fan of the novel, I prefer the 84' version but I don't think you can make Dune into a film. There is so much that can only be transmitted via written word. That said I think a tv series would do a better job. Be able to spend the time exploring events and characters that is required. I haven't seen the 2000 mini series, I'll have to get around to it.
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Chani
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>>4503500
What a type you must consort with to not fear beating for a remark like that.
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>>4503611
>>4503500

Murdered with words
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>>4503470
Every time I see Sting dressed in that stupid outfit brandishing a knife at the camera I just lose it.

He's lucky his music is good.
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>>4503500
I liked how big the ships and buildings felt. That's about it.
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More of the ships, miniature EFX, please.
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>>4503459
>>>/wsg/4741761
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>>4503514
This. Bro knows what's up.
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>>4503740
Oh yeah, and Salusa Secundus was fucking fire. We need more throat singing in cinema.
>>>/wsg/4742058
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>>4503514

Total BS. The recent version is excellent, you can clearly see it has its own style and soul, you can like it or dislike it, but clearly its a Villeneuve film, and you can see it in every frame. Saying "it has no soul" because people are not running around in clown costume is stupid. Villeneuve Dune has a very particular atmosphere, the music, the cinematography, it has its very own style, you can feel the desert, the emptyness, the heat, the ambiant spirituality/prophecy just in the music. It's way better than the old one which looks goofy and doesnt feel like the book. You could argue about the casting, but imo the new one is better, just look at Chani, in the old one you have an anglo saxon girl, in the new one you have an exotic girl. Now you could argue that Fremen are more "arabs" than blacks but Zendaya is a far better choice than the previous one. I dont like Chalamet and yet i think he was good in Dune.

The biggest reason why boomer trashtalk the new Dune is because they are boomer and they dont accept the fact that zoom zoom have a better Dune than them.
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>>4504251
I'll reply soon and explain why you're wrong.
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>>4504251
You sound like a whiny kid, not saying you're wrong, but your "argument" sure makes you sound wrong
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I m not a huge fan of 1984 Dune, but my favorite part of it was the soundtrack, and I am a fan of Hans Zimmer and think he did a good soundtrack for the new Dune, but the 1984 soundtrack is more epic to me
https://youtu.be/9AkZV6FxK3Y
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>>4503514
>As someone who's a big fan of the novel... I haven't seen the 2000 mini series, I'll have to get around to it.

Something you haven't been able to do ONCE. Ever. You're THAT much of a "big fan of the novel". The kind who'll crap on for paragraph after paragraph about the latest movie's supposed failings while not having watched the TV series which would do the " better job" you proposed. You're so much of a fan you haven't EVER been able to find the time, even though it's been out for over two decades. You'll get the punishment you deserve when you finally park your lazy ass in front of the TV and watch it. Here's a taste...

Bene Gesserit
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In the year 10,191 everyone will dress like a renaissance fair.
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...a bad renaissance fair, a really bad one.
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The famous banquet scene.

Spacing Guild or some such.
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Last but not least, the emperor of the known universe, Shaddap Da Fork
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>>4503514
>I don't know if the film had productions problems,
That's no excuse, either way. Fact is, every film has production problems. Dune '84's problem was David Lynch. He's a functional lunatic with no appreciation of science fiction. That's why "Blue Velvet" and "Wild At Heart" were classics but also why Dune was a disaster. No matter. At least you've admitted to being as ignorant as you obviously are.

>Where it fails is mainly the writing.
...because those laughable "high tech" sets were acceptable after three Star Wars movies? Once again you've discredited yourself on the subject. Just to give other anons some idea just how bad Dune '84 was on this point... This is from an ornithopher control panel. from the background of >>4503483

Any old fag electronic hobbyists recognize what it is? Yep, it's an old analog volt-meter that's been re-painted. That's how low-tech the sets really were.
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...that moment when you realize the readouts of an old Messerschmit BF109 looked better.
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>>4503459
Virginia Madsen was gorgeous in the 80s.
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>>4504251
>The biggest reason why boomer trashtalk the new Dune is because they are boomer

...and you're just as bad as the the dummy you were criticizing. Why do you assume he's a boomer? He's trashtalking the new Dune because he's a dumb-ass, an ignorant dumb-ass who hasn't even bothered to watch the very TV series he argues "would do a better job".

That's why he's trashtalking the new Dune and for no other reason.

>>4504615
...compared to this drivel? >>4503514
They're both idiots for different reasons. At least the "whiney kid" you're criticizing has the virtue of being correct about what Denis Villenueve accomplished in his treatment of the novel, where every other attempt before it failed.

Anyway... It's the year 10,191 and they're still using Sykes Fairbairn daggers. The screen-cap loaded properly, btw. Those are "shield" effects.
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>>4504892
Yes, she was.
Thanks, David. You fucked that up, too.
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>>4503509
>>4503514
>>4503611
>>4503740

The fact that you actually look at the 1984 version and say that somehow the 1984 version captured the essence of Vladimir Harkonnen better than the 2021 version, you are either deliberately full of shit, or just a completely deluded nostalgiafag.
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>>4503475
in this and Blade Runner, what a woman....
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>>4504897
spice addiction
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>>4505040
It's time to round zoomers up into camps.
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>>4505040
>you are either deliberately full of shit, or just a completely deluded nostalgiafag.
Pic related.

You fail at logic as you fail on fact.
The 1984 version accurately reflected both Vladimir Harkonnen's aggressive homosexuality and his incestuous pederastic relationship with his nephew Feyd. In once scene, the Baron attacks a young male slave arranging flowers. While that wasn't in all versions of the film, they all include actor Kenneth McMillan's constant love-sick homo-simpering, "Feyyyyd.... lovely Feyyyyyd".

Those aspects of his character, repeatedly referenced in the novel, did not appear in the 2021 film. Villenueve didn't want to offend Hollywood's faggot lobby who are quite proud of their agenda.
https://ew.com/tv/how-glaad-is-changing-hollywood/

TL:DR: Your position just got BTFO on all points.
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>>4503704
>He's lucky his music is good.
I have bad news for you and Sting, anon
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>>4504894
If you knew anything then you would know why they went back to knives
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>>4503500
They're both trash.
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>>4505542
I do. Quote Herbert where he wrote they were still using Sykes Fairbairn daggers, though.

I'll wait.
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Less arguing, more images.
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Not the greatest film but atleast it wasn't woke.
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>>4503483
Look at that cast.
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>>4503500
The new one is just more woke bullshit.
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>>4505040
You obviously havent read Dune
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>>4506384
That shot was crazy, the FX guy explains the entire image is a miniature that they placed on a tower in a parking lot, and the tiny door of the spaceship with the actors walking out was a full size set in the parking lot placed at the exact distance from the model tower where they would match up in scale
https://youtu.be/QR34AOCz0xc?t=162
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At least I can look back on the version of Dune where the lead wasn't a massive twink.
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>>4505507
>All
>I can see
>Is an Atredies
>that I want to kill
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>>4505040
The Baron is a brooding and evil BUT he's also somewhat pedantic and childlike, which is completely missing from Dune 2021.

Villeneuve just ripped off Colonel Kurtz from Apocalypse Now.
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Great book. The rest in the series went meh pretty quick though.
I actually liked the 1st movie mostly. The mentats however were totally miscast, much better in the new version
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Dune 2 was game for it's day, gameplay engine way more sophisticated than early warcraft.
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>>4506762
>where the lead wasn't a massive twink.
Protip: Maclachlan and Chalamet were both 25-ish when they played the lead.

Back in the 80s, Maclachlan WAS a twink. He was just as smooth and hairless as Chalamet today. There were even gay AF publicity photos where Maclachlan showed off his toned twink torso.
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>>4506936
Are any of the sequels worth reading?
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>>4506948
I dont know, I look at maclachlan and I think wow what a handsome guy, I would kill someone for that jawline, thanks for all the kinos.
I look at chalamet and I think wow what a fucking megafaggot, I wish I could beat him up and steal his lunchmoney and laugh as he cries and runs away to get a teacher to help, fuck you the king sucked except for the hilarious pattinson parts.
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>>4507409
Whelp... At the risk of turning this into a huge /hm/ discussion, over the years "twinks" have become a lot softer. It's something of a shock to flip through old gay porno mags from the 80s.

Young, smooth, skinny guys in their early-mid 20s had a toughness to them they don't have anymore. It's especially obvious when you go back another decade to the 70s when "twinks" were still called "chickens."

I gave it some thought over the years and I'm fairly certain I figured it out. Back then, young men spent a lot more time outside doing manual labor from an early age. I don't just mean rural farm work, but even in the cities, they usually earned money doing hard, crummy jobs getting paid off the books because they were way underage.

All of that affected how they developed physically. It isn't like now, where younger guys go to the gym and work out. Gym bodies are very different than the body of guys who never went to the gym in their lives but got up every day at dawn and put fuck-knows how many miles on his bike doing a newspaper route before school since they were 11. Add an part-time/ after-school/ weekend job, and it put on a different kind of muscle.

Guys had much more physical hobbies back then, too. They went outside, played sports, fixed up motorcycles and run-down cars, looked for trouble, stole shit, that kind of thing. Nobody spent day after day playing video games or hours on YouTube/ 4chan/ FB/ or whatever, because those things didn't exist.
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>>4507129
Serious answer meme.
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>>4507652
Man, did you call it. Especially with B.Herbert, with the help of ghost writer K. Anderson, these novels completely lack that ‘AhHaa’ moments of insight to the human condition that made F. Herberts’ work monumental. B.Herbert is just making money off of his fathers’ notes and ideas that he rejected for good reason. I read three of the ‘Brian and Kevin’ Money making Roadshow, that I literally threw them into the trash so that no one else would read them by accident
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>>4507781
Wasn't my work, but it's still accurate especially about Kevin and Brian behaving like grave-robbers.

There is no way Frank Herbert wrote enough "notes" to produce twenty shitty "dune" books and counting. As for the movie...
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>>4507652
Frankly, I read through five, and was more and more disappointed the more I read. I should have stopped at Dune.

BTW... y'all know it's an allegory about oil, right?
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>>4507652
Cheers mate. So I'm thinking maybe option 3 is the optimal choice. I'm a scifi fan but I don't want to read anything watered down.
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>>4504058
I don't feel anything. It's quite lifeless.
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>>4507819
>BTW... y'all know it's an allegory about oil, right?
Not just oil or an allegory, but also a direct representation. So says, the author himself. From Frank Herbert's essay, "When I Was Writing Dune"
>Potable water was to be an analog for oil and for water itself, a substance whose supply diminishes each day. It was to be an ecological novel, then, with many overtones, as well as a story about people and their human concerns with human values, and I had to monitor each of these levels at every stage in the book.

Original screen-used costume. The synthetic materials were cheap and badly deteriorated over the years.
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>>4507819
Herbert coined the phrase "hydraulic despotism" to describe using a basic necessity as a means of political control. In two separate points in the series, he addresses this.

>As you know, hydraulic despotism is possible only when a substance or condition upon which life in general absolutely depends can be controlled by a relatively small and centralized force. The concept of hydraulic despotism originated when the flow of irrigation water increased local human populations to a demand level of absolute dependence. When the water was shut off, people died in large numbers. This phenomenon has been repeated many times in human history, not only with water and the products of arable land, but with hydrocarbon fuels such as petroleum and coal which were controlled through pipelines and other distribution networks. At one time, when distribution of electricity was only through complicated mazes of lines strung across the landscape, even this energy resource fell into the role of a hydraulic despotism substance.

>Hydraulic despotism: central control of an essential energy such as water, electricity, fuel, medicines, melange…Obey the central controlling power or the energy is shut off and you die!

So it's more than just oil. It's anything necessary for people to live.
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>>4507819
...and yeah, Herbert loves using his characters as stand-in lecturers. Even though >>4507652 praises God Emperor of Dune as possibly even greater than the original, it isn't.

Leto II, the titular "God Emperor" lectures everyone like that endlessly for entire paragraphs. Herbert even realized the effect a character like that would have on other people. After one particularly long rant, Leto II's major domo starts worrying about it.

>The Reverend Mothers are in for a bad time, Moneo told himself. He's going to preach at them. They detest that. This could cause serious trouble.
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The chrome snaps at the top of the Atreides uniforms weren't for decoration. They were for... this.
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Starlog magazine interview with Frank Herbert about the movie, sci-fi, sci-fi movies, etc.
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Just like Star Wars, Dune had its own bed-time story book with lots of pics from the movie.

Just like Star Wars, Dune ended with a big showdown duel, except they weren't fighting with flashlights.
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Since Dune came out one year after Return Of The Jedi, toy manufacturers had the idea it was going to keep the "kids' sci-fi" money machine running.

Someone actually thought a kid's crysknife would be a good idea. Little Fremen could have their own "Amtal Rule" back yard knife-fights. LJN even got as far as advertising it in their toy-dealer's catalog.
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Some parents' group found out and made a fuss. Combined with the increasingly obvious disaster the film actually was, LJN cancelled the #8040 D U N E™ WEAPONS GIFTSET.

Kind of a shame since, for a kid's toy, the crysknife was completely screen-accurate except for the size.
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>>4508548
>>4508556
I remember going into KayBee toys back then and this stuff was shelfwarming hard, but I still bought that orange gun. Here are props from the movie.
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>>4508567
It's a rare thing to find another oldfag as old as myself. Yeah, the stuff didn't move. Eventually LJN dumped all the action figures through that clearance company, "American Science and Surplus."

I'll trade you tacky Harkonnen pistol for a tacky Harkonnen dagger made from a knock-off Gerber MK-II.
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>>4503514
I like things about both personally, the old one feels a bit grittier and the sets feel a bit more lived in. Ironically I feel like the exceptions to this are Caladan and Geidi Prime, the former of which had scenes that really built up the relationship with Paul and his father and added a lot I think. That was just good adaptation on the part of the studio/writers/director/etc. I also felt like they didn't quite capture the scale of the 84 Dune, with some exceptions (the Atreides Fleet leaving/arriving in space was neat).
>but I don't think you can make Dune into a film
This is the core problem, there is too much internal monologue and internal conflict to really adapt this into a movie without us hearing the protagonist narrate the movie. It requires way too much exposition to convey the stakes and create tension. To their credit the score in the new movie helps a lot and was fantastic imo, and I'm still excited to see the next one.
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NB: The photos for the "Atreides Water Measuring Equipment" and "Harkonnen Cat Cage" are swapped with their descriptions.
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Dune '84 Trivia:
One element of the movie undeniably influenced Herbert's later writing. The big gold "sparring robot" which wasn't in the first novel at all appeared into the last one, "Chapterhouse Dune"

>A thin scratch reddened the back of Murbella's left hand where she had missed a move by the big mek. The automated trainer stood there in the center of the room like a golden pillar, its weapons flicking in and out – probing mandibles of an angry insect.
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Atreides pistol.

Dune '84 failed because the director believed this was acceptable after six years of Star Wars movies with everyone using real surplus firearms.
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>>4509531
More like Aphex Twin pistol
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is it me, or is the Captcha getting harder?
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>>4506408
that is fuckin wild, thanks for sharing the clip.
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>>4508334
I take it back there are no good Dune films.
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Its crazy to think George Lucas offered David Lynch the job to direct Return of the Jedi. I look at the result of Dune 1984 and wonder wtf Lynch would have done with ROTJ. I dont think it would have been a clusterfuck that Dune 1984 was because I think Lucas would have kept Lynch on a short leash directing-wise, but I think Lynch in the 80s didnt know he was the wrong guy for sci-fi yet, so the right call was made.
https://youtu.be/EJQ4vCu-S0U
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>>4511156
Well he didn't think he was which is why he passed up Jedi, right? And then he thought he had made a mistake so he made Dune... only to confirm that he hadn't!

But he got Kyle MacLachlan out of the deal, for Blue Velvet and Twin Peaks, so ultimately that's a pretty good result
>>
Dune 1984 was an absolute mess plot-wise but it was full of soul and had a great aesthetic and vibrancy.

The recent one is far more coherent, but it's got a very sterile, clinical feeling to it - all the rough edges have been sanded down. It's like a Marvel film but without the humor - the characters are really devoid of any sexuality or passion.
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>>4511213
>The recent one is far more coherent, but it's got a very sterile, clinical feeling to it
I agree, and Christopher Nolan movies give me that same feeling, too. I think both Villenueve and Nolan are good directors, and make smart choices with good visuals in their films, but there is that feeling of something missing with them.
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>>4511291
Nolan is far, far, far superior to Villenueve
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>>4511213
Exactly right. The new one had no life in it at all, which if you have read the novel is incredibly ironic because the novel is primarily about the depth and complexity of life.
>>
>>4511213 The new film was just another globalist/neo marxist film. Nothing can be released by the big studios that contradicts or opposes the current globalist dogma and none of the themes of Dune can really be explored because Dune is a deeply reactionary novel. Exploring monarchy, hierarchy, genetics, religion, the nature of power, war, etc.
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>>4503500
The new movie has zero tension or emotional connections with the audience. It's like it forgot how to be a movie. It moves from scene to scene like in a really weird dream, and yes even Inception did it better even though it stole from Paprika.
2049 was his only good movie.
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>>4511291
>>4511346
Nolan and Villeneuve are bland and reddit "serious" directors who are both overrated as can be.
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>>4503455
The 84 version is so much better than the new one. I'm watching it now, its actually immersive. Even if the writing is poor, does far too much telling instead of showing, the world they create is authentic, real. You can feel it.
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>>4511977
Agreed.
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>>4504855
I said A television show not THE television show. Referring to the medium of TV being better suited to telling a story like Dune. Just because they released a goofy, low budget show in the 90s doesn't negate that fact.
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>>4512105
The power of Deep Roy compelled you.
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>>4503500
Zendaya's casting is atrocious. ugly and uninspiring
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>>4504251
Zendaya ugly Sean Young pretty simple as
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Dune (2021) Review | Spicy Worms Edition™ | Smack Talk

https://youtu.be/O_yKD-ZQgkY
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>>4503500
NO! The future is WHITE! And MALE! And GAY!
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>>4505657
Why the hell not you philistine?
>>
come on over >>4471544
bring drugs
for the
Cops
aNNe feeL
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>>4508532
> The Irish who have been born and bred in Ireland liked it, it's the second and third generation Irish-Americans that are offended
And I thought that is a new fashion, boy oh boy...
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>>4503514
>I haven't seen the 2000 mini series, I'll have to get around to it.

Its my favorite version.
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