>European AA systems powercrept US patriot how true is this statement?
>>64502045>russia’s upgraded missile attacks that patriots have struggled to stop Russian narratives belong in the trash. You should feel bad, OP. Any “struggles” with patriot are due to insufficient supplies from the US due to kremlin puppets like Trump
>>64502050The fuck are you talking aboutPatriot is a +30yo AA system something "new" performing better than patriot is not russian narratives you nigger
>>64502057>Russian's "upgraded" missiles are new and thus performing better than 30 year old patriotXaxaxa + 50 rubles for you
>>64502045>Patriot: Developed 1976, entered service 1984>SAMP/T: developed 1990s, entered service 2010Anyway, MEADS dabs on both of them.
>>64502133>what's a "Theseus">inb4 I was only pretending to be retarded
>>64502133I thought MEADs was a new plug-and-play system architecture? Not new launchers, radars, or missiles?
>>64502151ship of theseus is certainly a thingbut if have to keep updating within the same dimensions you are going to lose efficiencyjust look at the A220. Boeing and Airbus simply kept ship of Theseusing their old air frames. Then Bombardier came with a completely new design and it would end up eating all of Boeing's market share even in the US.
>>64502045SAMP/T is more comparable to the standard series than Patriot
>>64502045patriots have always kinda Shitty. MIC glossed over alot of the issues in the 90s and then eventually they got sent to ukraine. Pro Ukrainian mandatory positivity pushed people into thinking they'd gotten better.
>>64502045How does sending 30+ year equipment to a battlefield going to improve it? Wouldn't learning how the current up to date systems perform be more important?
>>64502185Only thing on the rise in russia is aids rates and the churka population percentage.
>>64502045>the United States is losing it’s edge.You would have a point.If the US gave a shit about ground-based air defense. Which it doesn’t really.
>>64502045The French have a massive motive to take advantage of the US being cunts and trying to take their arms contracts.As for how "effective" any system is there are so many factors that without data we can't know shit.
>>64502151An F-16V is still an F-16.>>64502165>I thought MEADs was a new plug-and-play system architecture? Not new launchers, radars, or missiles?It's basically a Patriot sidegrade - new launcher, new AESA surveillance and fire control radars, vastly improved networking, fires PAC-3 and IRIS-T. Decent option for the yuros but the Army decided to just stick with Patriots until the LTAMDS gets rolled out. LTAMDS is going to be a gigantic upgrade, especially when whatever follows up PAC-3 MSE gets integrated, and given that the INF treaty is ded I wouldn't be surprised if it eventually becomes the basis for a BGM-109 replacement.>>64502461US air defense is only ground-based until it gets airborne.
>>64502045>according to frog manufacturer of frog AA systems, frog AA is actually better than american AAkek
America is a second rate power now. EU and China are the new protagonists of the world.
>>64502045>frenchies lying about military competencyMany such cases.
probably technically true but due to operational factors rather than technical sophistication, I doubt ukraine is getting many PAC-3 MSE or even CRI nowpatiot has ten times the sales than the frog-italian abomination
>>64502045both are good>>64502050>Russian narratives belong in the trash.this and thus
>>64502050>kremlin puppets like TrumpHe's more a kremlin muppet than a puppet
No shit, US acts retarded
>>64502215>How does sending 30+ year equipment to a battlefield going to improve it?Half of the AA efficiency isn't hardware, but software. Breaking news at 11.Software which constantly gets updated with revised rules, routines and so on. The more a system is used, the more data you can get from its targeting, the better you can adjust the software. IF you actually bother to do that. It seems that recently american retards stopped doing this.
>>64502045Yeah, the US gave Ukraine its most advanced air defense systems...
>>64502045Current deployed SAMPT doesn't outperform the most modern block of PatriotOlder models yes obviously
>>64502045This guy is the most quintessentially smug and ambigously nafri French I've seen today
>the french system is actually better>says the frenchHmmm
>>64502045>euroniggers finally catch up to 50 year old air defense systemwho cares
>>64502045>frog says frog systems are better than pigdog americans who they have been trying to usurp since the end of ww2
>>64502078shut the fuck up and read properly.
>>64502045>Franco-Italiandoesn't France have a massive budget crisis and Italy is just in the gutter? Also, the Patriot system is a couple decades older than the new euro gear.
No idea if this is true, but I read reports that the Russians managed to upgrade their Iskanders to evade Patriots. I assume SAMP/T isn't common enough for them to have bothered with that. Afaik there is only one SAMP/T battery in Ukraine. Still from what I read, PAC-3 MSE at least is superior to SAMP/T. I really have no clue though, just putting out what I read somewhere sometime.
>>64504367air defense is a useless cope anyway. what good is 90% intercept rate when the remaining 10% are enough to cause wide spread destruction and the intercepts cost you more money than the enemy?
>>64504389you need deep strike capability too to prevent the attacks from coming in the first place, but that doesn't mean air defense is useless
>>6450438910% of the total damage is a lot less expensive than 100% of the damage you retard.
>>64502045The Patriot has a horrible track record, it was shrouded in scandals during both gulf wars because it basically didn't work at all.It now works decently some of the time, but even the russians with their very limited SEAD capability have managed to nuke them with long range missile strikes.Doesn't take much to outperform the patriot desu.The navy's standard missiles seem to perform significantly better but patriot's have always been an utter shitshow.
>French equipment: built by Pierre Augustine (62), a Frenchman with a smoking habit and (at least) two mistresses. Will NOT work the entirety of August, not even if France is at war>American equipment: built by a sub-sub-sub-sub contractor of Boeing, who subcontracted the development of the missile to Randeep Akshit (23) from Ilderabad, IndiaWho wins?
>>64504389>when the remaining 10% are enough to causeMy brown friend, consider CringeAll missile precision
>>645046782
>>645046823
>>64502050>>64503608>US due to kremlin puppets like Trump
>>64504692>'please just ignore all the things trump says and does'
>>64504623Western foes. Arguably South Korean and Israeli arms companies.
>>64504765Let's just ignore schizos like you.
>>64504678>target destroyed so entirely nothing but a crater left???>>64504682Bush, direct hit, totally obliterated>>64504689field, direct hit, basically center mass???What exactly is your point?That the russias have so many missiles that they can afford to hypersonic a single soldier in a bush?
>>64504803>Is not miss, hohol always hiding where missile goes)))))))))
My name is Ford Lincoln Mercury of Colorado (where potato beetle is from) Oblast, Denver agglomeration, and the state of our ПBO is demoralizing. We should not confront Russia, as they are superpower in this field and we would lose face in such a conflict.
>>64504818Da, I too, Tex, a Texian from, the Austin think that everything is so anal sex in anal sex in the america that we should immediately secede and form, the state of Texia and keep our warm water ports secure with friendly states, like China and, Russia.
>>64504824>the state of Tekhas
>>64504831That's how Russians pronouns it. Ukrainians, too. TYEH-HASS
>>64504844>TYEH-HASSon second thought TYEHH-us is more accurate.
>>64504844>landings in the diamond antecedent == arrests and prison time for workers of the Almaz-Antei (the company which makes S-400)
>>64504858>Almaz-Anteiohhh yeeaaa, that's their name. That babelfish gibrish makes sense now.
>>64502050I don't think it's a discussion on Patriot being bad inherently, it's the fact that Patriot cannot cost-efficiently defend against a swarm of drones, nor that does it have the capacity to produce enough interceptors.
>>64504678>>64504682>>64504689this actually proves my point. notice how the missiles or drones got through the air defense and hit the base, ukie air defense was not able to stop them. and the power outages all over ukraine mean they at least have the accuracy to hit power plants.
>>64504970My brown friend, they've launched dozens of missiles at one target, some went through AA and still missed
>>64502461>If the US gave a shit about ground-based air defense. Which it doesn’t really.As evidenced by patriot missile systems on the internet... I mean what could go wrong, it's not as if the firmware is vulnerable... Oh, wait....
>>64504998>As evidenced by patriot missile systems on the internet...oh shit, on the internet? like the whole internet?what the fuck are you troglodyte even trying to imply? should I even care?
>>64505062>what the fuck are you troglodyte even trying to imply?That you have zero clue. About a lot of things, it appears. Not just why it's a bad idea to give an opponent access to vulnerable systems.
>>64505098>Today I will wake up, go on the internet, use my learned english skills to gloat about the fact that I needed the Internet to acess dubious details and plans for my nemesis' non-priority (due to doctrine) weapon from the 70s.I have been saying it for several years: You are insane enough to actually burn this world.
>>64505106With the directions your impositions on reality take, you're the one stepping closest to insanity. What am I gloating at, again? I don't have much to gloat about, it wasn't my research that uncovered the vulnerabilities. Mocking placing such a thing on an unprotected network, maybe.
>>64502045Possibly but I want to see an actual report and statements by the Ukranians themselves. Both not just one.
Denmark confirmed its acquisition and added two extra SAMP/T, maybe there is some basis to OP's claim.
>>64505261Isn't that because the backlog on patriots means they wouldn't get any for >10 years.
>>64502045Standard PAC-3 is more of a point defense ABM weapon. SAMP/T can fire Aster 30 which is more of a SM-6 equivalent, and Aster 15 only gets a smaller booster compared to Aster 30, it's still a bigger missile than PAC-3. It shouldn't come as any surprise that PAC-3 gets outperformed by that.
>>64504367>I assume SAMP/T isn't common enough for them to have bothered with that.I vaguely recall reading this too. That, or simply that the current political climate is forcing them to conserve and prioritize placement of AD systems of all types
>>64505418 (me)I should add that this doesn't mean PAC-3 is bad, you get more magazine depth, even with MSE, which boosts coverage (mostly against aircraft, but it does get a chonkier booster with a longer burn time). It's optimized for a different design point, SAMP/T provides area defense at the cost of magazine depth. It's better suited to Ukraine's circumstances, where they have fewer batteries than they'd like
