Ok, what's the bottom line on the AK-12?I have followed the discussion about it with little intrest and from what I have gathered seems to be something like:- basically much like all other Russian "military modernization programs". Essentially just slightly upgraded version of what they already have, extremely expensive and marred with "all the money on research and production has disappeared" and with minimal amounts of actual units produced. Those units that have been produced have gone to parade troops or some internal security troops or gucci special units. Most of the cannon fodder will not see anything other than AK-74's or even older 47's any time soon. I guess it works about as well as any other AK, which is "It does the job" but nothing special. My question is: Was this assessment correct? Or am I full of shit? How is it actually?Answers from people who have actually shot with the gun will be appreciated. Also, not looking for hate (or love) for the gun, but honest assessment.
>>64567227It’s an upgraded AK-74. It’s like their version of an M4a1 block 2. Wish they went with the battlefield 4 AK-12 though. That thing was mad sexy.
Also it’s in wider use than what you say. Hasn’t replaced the 74 but it’s not exactly obscure at this point.
>>64567227A modernized AK-74 was a good idea in theory, but the fact that they went with that crappy polymer handguard rather than the aluminum one from the prototype is a tragedy.
How many iterations are they on with the AK-12, four? Five?
Improvements: sights, more fire-mode options (though the 2-round was done away with), attempt to fit a built in rail, stocks on all versions are decent for adjustable folders. [Opinion: it looks really cool overall]Drawbacks: Cannot remove gas tube (harder to clean), magazines are decent but I've heard kind of fragile and they're not interchangeable to use on a 74, muzzle brake is a unique fitting that other brakes of suppressors won't fit to (In fairness, I believe this was changed)
>>64567778Self-correction on the magazine point, I guess you CAN use the 12 and 74 mags across both rifles. >>64567347I want a 2016 one so bad.
>>64567227Early models apparently had issues with wandering zeroes on the top cover and furniture, seems that new ones don't. Otherwise it is a cheaped out version of your classic Zenitco Catalog Special. It isn't unique in any way, but is technically sufficient to muddle the AK74 into some kind of modernity while still allowing the Russian army to use the massive Soviet era factories designed to make millions of rifles with a minimum of production line changes. Guys that have been shot at by them and have had a chance to use them in combat themselves, like Valgear, don't think they're bad rifles. But he didn't exactly say it was the best thing since sliced bread, either.
did these "middle" prototypes ever show up in any games or media? the early one was of course very popular, and now the finished versions are showing up, but the examples from the period in the middle when the guns were actually undergoing testing seems to have not had as much of an impact
>>64567336they actually did make a variant of the production gun with an aluminum handguard (at least the upper half, the lower's probably still polymer), but it doesn't seem to have gone anywherethe 2023 model does include revisions to the handguard, but I'm not sure what those actually entail in terms of material and construction
I'm just always so sad when we stepped down from this>>64568831to this>>64568848Like I know part of it was always propaganda and "aesthetic" for obvious purposes. But going fully back to the full lever controls and the original dust covers made it readily apparent it's just a 74 with new furniture. The controls are barely the same. Hell, it's probably the same "manual of arms" shit you hear whenever we look at new rifles for the military, which is semi-valid but always just ends us up with an AR-15 with shit taped to it. Because there's money behind it, too, kickbacks, etc.Turns out east and west probably aren't that different on this at all, kek. I just like polygonal cover, it looked like something actually new.
>>64567227>Ok, what's the bottom line on the AK-12?I kept calling mine an AK shotgun and it seemed to piss off some anon. So naturally my Saiga 12 is forever called The AK shotgun forever and I hope that pisses someone else off! Also, fuck you original anon who was pissed off over "AK shotgun", bwahahah!
>>64568838This is the one. The "Sig 551 we have at home" version was an actual effort to evolve rather than trying to apply the MagPul catalog to the 74.
>>64568850Why on earth would they get rid of the finger ledge on the selector switch?
>>64569150it uses an ambidextrous thumb switch like an ar-15
>>64567227It was an attempt to bring the AK platform into the 21st century, and I think it kinda? workedBut that hardly matters if they're not mass issued
>>64568803Rainbow 6 Siege has that version, I think (or a quite similar looking one)
>>64568894Son, I'm only gonna tell you this once. Lay off the drugs.
>>64568803A few games of the early-mid 2010's that featured the ak-12 use the first prototype (BF4 and R6 Siege are the first that come to mind), a few afterwards have the 2nd one and nowadays it's whichever one the devs felt like doing.
>>64567227There were a few prototype runs with more radical new features (mostly the same bad ideas everybody else tried in the '00s-'10s) but the final production model ended up being pretty much just an iterated improvement on the AK-74M.
>>64570008Yeah, that's kinda what I gathered... "A modernized AK74, with modular rail attachements and some small quality-of-life improvements like thumb-selector for fire mode, but other than that... same old, same old." Still works, still kills. "AK-74M +1"I mean, not that there's anything wrong with that. A gun shoots, a gun kills. It's just... it isn't anything new. I am fairly certain that some Israeli/Finnish Galil/RK has done the same (and better) already decades ago. And the weapons factory boss in Russia now has a new Datcha.
Heard the fire selector on a bunch of the models found in Ukraine has a habbit of getting pulled so far down it gets in the way of your trigger finger.
>>64567227AK-12 is just a shittier version of pic related.
>>64567227I apologize for being born a polackenI did not asked for itI apologize to russiansI apologize to ukrainiansI apologize to americansI apologize to lithuaniansI apologize to germansI apologize to everyoneI did not asked to be born as khazarian crypto kike, pooplack
>>64567227>what's the bottom line on the AK-12The platform hasn't been competitive since the 1960s and nothing built around it can be in the future.
>>64567227Every new unit that gets outfitted gets an AK12 (ie, all the north koreans did, lots of mobiks do), they might have been rare at the start of the war but they're common as shit now. Youre basically right about the gun, its not really bad but people who were primed on a decade of videogames get upset about how unambitious it is for the time it took and the money that was spent. The 74M is a good rifle and the AK12 is a 74M that isnt restricted to dovetail optics and can mount a flashlight without zipties and hose clamps, so its decent enough. The burst fire was an obvious mistake they corrected quickly, the proprietary muzzle device that restricts the use of 74 muzzle devices is bizarre and inscrutable, and the polymer handguard isn't really that big a deal, its the G36 melting trunnion hysteria all over again. I still think they should have gone with a full monolithic receiver like the new Serb AKs maybe with a hinged lower like the AKV521 proto, but that was always a pipe dream.
What's the truth about supposed safety switch malfunctioning?Early 2022 there were reports of captured rifles with lever stuck somewhere past full auto causing a malfunction.Was this true or just a propaganda piece?Or did I just hop to another universe?Pic related: loved that movieCaptcha: RYATW
>>64567347Why get rid of the ability to customize your grip?
>>64567778Some other negative is there was no selector stop. Once over traveled the weapon jammed. Initial reports were a lot were recovered from troops in that condition. They panicked and threw selector past where it was to stop and rendered the weapon inoperable.
>>64572663It was confirmed. There's no selector stop and can easily throw it past where it stops and jams the internals up.
>>64567336Doesn't really matter when the average grunt won't run an IR laser or the like. I honestly think it's not such a bad idea to have a stock polymer handguard if you want to keep the rifle's price down.
>>64567227>will not see anything other than AK-74's or even older 47's any time soonI don't think 74 is in production anymore by Kalashnikov. In the units they are being gradually replaced with AK-12 and AK-15 as they are produced. Likely it will take 10-15 years to retire every older variant from the regular army units
>>64573616Probably cheaper to make it that way. The Russian military really doesn't give a damn about customizing weapons.
>>64573616because supporting your need to consoom and dress up your gunkopop isn't a priority of a foreign military
>>64567227It's a modernized AK-74M with some unique features. Apparently, it has some reliability issues, despite multiple iterations of AK-12, so the Spetsnaz in Ukraine went back to using 100s and 74s
>got rid of the 2 round burstsoulless russkie slaves.
Without the steep angle on the rear of the dust cover, later AK12s just look like a pile of aftermarket doodads instead of being their own thing.
Nogunz here. Why didn't they just fit the AK-74 with zenitco furniture and call it a day?
>>64573916Zenitco is heavy and expensive. Also its kinda shit, not that it isnt robust or functional but the idea that the official method of fitting is to hammer it in place with a mallet is absurd. As for why they didn't just produce upgrade kits to give 74s the same features, well they did, the 74M3. They were issued to some units, but not widely and were mostly eclipsed by the AK12, presumably because upgrading a million AKs with new parts requires a substantial number of competent armorers, which they didn't necessarily have, and adopting a whole new rifle sent money to the people with the right friends.
>>64573848It's easier to mount an optic and a handguard on these than on the standard AK-74; plus the AK-12 is supposedly cheaper to produce than the AK-74.
>>64567791>>64567347Play Squad
Is there literally any reason to use an AK in current year? What's wrong with slavs? Just make piston AR derivatives like everyone else
>>64567227The bottom line is its cheaper than putting new furniture on 74s, and thats what matters.Pic related, AK-74RMO. A lot of troops said they prefer it over the AK-12, but unfortunately its more expensive
>>64567227I wouldn't spend the money for it. AKM and AK100 are fine, and can be upgraded in the same way.
>>64575245Not enough benefit to justify replacement. Rifles just don't matter that much compared with all the other stuff you can spend money on.
>>64576033>dick and balls insignia on helmet
>>645739024 position selectors are a meme imo
The initial run of AK12s was pretty rough, but after years of real combat experience, the Russians are starting to figure out issues the rifles had. I wouldn't be surprised if we get new models in the next few years. But yeah, its and AK74M with better mounting options and likely a better barrel. Like another anon said, M4 Block 2 but AK.
>>645739022 round burst is retardedyou just want to be quirky with your special snowflake burst mode
