Türkiye's KIZILELMA became the first UCAV in the world scoring an A2A kill. It's equipped with Murad AESA radar developed by Aselsan. It executed firing with Gökdoğan BVR missile produced by Tübitak SAGE.https://x.com/BaykarTech/status/1995017739522449609?s=20
shortened WEBM for the lazy
>>64577757>trialnot a killadmittedly cool, though.
>>64577760is future warfare really going to be drone spam?
>>64577883yeathat robot will be able to conduct 15G+ maneuvers for evading and dog fights. The meatball in the cockpit will have no chance.
>>64577883*Drone swarms controlled by autonomous AI.We are going to beg to get nuked.
>>64577893Ace Combat 7 vibes
Further steps for KE project-Flight with indigenous TEI afterburning turbofan (likely to occur in 2026)-1.2 mach flights (2026-2027)-Missile launch from internal weapons bay (2026)-Improving of AI dogfight skills (2026 to 2030)KE is going to be a great wingman for KAAN
>>64577757Awww mang, we were supposed to get the first A2A test kill with the Ghost Bat next month
>>64577924SAAAAR
>>64577757air to air kill for a practice target, are you retarded? wait, you're turkish, nvm
>>64577948>i-it doesnt c-count!
>>64577883the future of this board is roach spam>>64577936why not include cold fusion and a man on mars while you're at it? all of the above are equally as likely for turkey.
>>64577948what would make this not work against a real target in an actual conflict scenario?
>>64577924>>64577948This is just sad at this point
>>64577970counter measures? electronic warfare? evasive maneuvers? peer opposition?
>>64578003that's all shit the missile has to worry about, not the aircraft launching it
>>64577956obviously? whats next, spamming missiles at your own drones so you can say your f22 look alike has a 100-0 record?
I'm fucking surprised Americans with their extremely bloated budget didn't do this before.
>>64578010SAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAR
>>64578015Americans have been launching missiles from drones since the 90s. They have missiles that they know can hit air targets, and they have drones that they know can launch missiles, actually running it in a live fire exercise is basically just a formality. Honestly, I think letting Turkey be the first to do it, and with their own indigenous tech, almost sends a stronger message. Even some of the less capable NATO members can develop and field this capability.
>>64577956>t. graduated top of the class in Modern Warfare, involved in numerous secret Rainbow 6 raids, has over 300 confirmed kills in CounterStrike
>>64578025as far as i am aware, there is no American drone out there that can field A2A missiles. Sure, US drones can fire hellfire and shit but this is totally a different story.
>>64578026No dropped out after MW3(og one)
>>64578025twenty fucking years ago a Predator drone launched Stingers at Iraqi MIGs. it didn't hit and was eventually shot down by another MIG, but the point is that America has long had an operational drone-launched anti-air capability of sorts and can easily ramp up to launching AMRAAMs if desired>>64578035you're aware of jack shit
>>64578038Why are you mutts so fragile when it comes to "firsts"? No shit USA could (and going to) be able to do a2a kills with drones. Who is arguing against that? Just stfu.
>>64578044>Why are you mutts so fragile when it comes to "firsts"?who fucking started the thread trying to claim a "first" you retarded turkroach lmao. then you chimp out when people provide evidence to the contrary
>>64578048nigger show me an article with american drone shooting an a2a missile to a flying target and i will stfu.
>>64577760I can't wait to see these wipe out Israels airforce in the future Turkey Israel war.
>>64578038so, they mounted a stinger tube on a predator and presumed this would scare off actual jets. And it didn't work.Like they put broomsticks on B-25s' tailgun mount on during the Doolittle raid.
>>64578044>we're the first we're the first we're the first>actually, you're not>who cares about being first stfuDriven by hunger, a fox tried to reach some grapes hanging high on the vine but was unable to, although he leaped with all his strength. As he went away, the fox remarked 'Oh, you aren't even ripe yet! I don't need any sour grapes.'>>64578053https://www.wired.com/2012/11/predator-defenseless/now STFU, turdie>>64578060>And it didn't workit worked thoughthe target was scared off
>>64578082broomsticks on predator doesn't mean US did this first. Please stop being such a fragile mutt boy.
>>64578082Holy fuck kys for making my click on that link.
>>64578094there are more informative articles on this, but only those who put in the effort to look for them are worthy to read them
>>64578058what do you think who will win
>>64578097please come back when Americans have a drone equipped with its own RADAR, EOTS and IRST, that can lob a2a missiles without network guidance.I'm sure either Elon or Anduril will get into this business.
>>64578035a missiles a missile, anon
>>64578107
>>64578107F-16s have flown and participated in dogfights without a pilot in the cockpit. You know what else F-16s can do? Lock targets and shoot A2A missiles.
americans losing their shit in this threadthis is even better than china threads
>>64577890That’s not how it works retard
>>64578226that's exactly how it works retardthis robot is intended for the missions and flight envelope outside the limits of the meatball in the cockpit.
Amerigolem MQ-9 was outfitted with a sidewinder in 2020 and engaged a target drone via datalink.https://theaviationist.com/2020/09/11/mq-9-reaper-drone-fires-live-aim-9x-block-ii-aam-at-bqm-167-target-drone-simulating-a-cruise-missile/This makes Turkey first to shoot aerial target from a drone via radar guidance.
>>64578122True, the QF-16 tests showed you can remote-fly an F-16 airframe and experiment with autonomy, but they’re still just target drones and testbeds, not operational unmanned fighters. That’s very different from something like Kızılelma, which was designed from day one as a UCAV with its own A2A kill chain.Also, QF-16s can’t do everything an F-16 can, their avionics are heavily stripped down and they don’t carry live A2A weapons in remote mode. I’m not saying the US couldn’t build an A2A UCAV, but pretending QF-16s are equivalent to F-16s is just absurd.Captcha: G0YSS
Serious question, why is Turkey the only one working on a fighter sized CCA like this? The YFQ-42 and 44 are tiny in comparison and the Chinese GJ-11/21 drones seem to be more optimized for land attack. Those two countries could obviously match anything Turkey puts out so why are they going in a different direction? Because intuitively this seems like it shits on all the other cca designs to me.
Sublime. With this most recent achievement, fate has in a single stroke, marked the decline of the west and spelled a new era of wondrous prosperity and peaceful global dominance for the Ottoman bull, which promises to firmly stand in sharp contrast to the historically bloody ascent of western powers and the cruel subjugation it brought to the humbler nations of the world. With the blessings of Ottoman quantum TB-2 drones, quantum miniature cruise missiles, and quantum enhanced watermelons will be the instruments with which TÜRKIYE affirms its noble stewardship of 21st century world politics and offers the non-western world a different option; an humanist alternative to the depredations of Western leadership and the opportunity for a more equitable and dignified multilateralism.
>>64578658range and payload requirements i guess
>>64577757An A@A kill is against an actual enemy in a combat environment. And definitely not a test scenario.>>64577765You don't know that is it cool. Wit how they set up tests it is more likely that it is extremely lame.
>>64577890Why would you be doing 15G maneuvers in a BVR air attack?
>>64578736>>64578658there is tai anka-3, designed with a very low RCS, more dedicated for a2g & sead missions
>>64578756because the geography of Turkey and surrounding countries may force fighter planes to conduct dogfight. This thing won't fight over vast ocean, duh.
>>64578598>their avionics are heavily stripped down and they don’t carry live A2A weapons in remote modedon't or can't?
>>64578658There's not a lot of point to it, you still spend a lot of money but the AESA the UCAV in the post is carrying for example is more or less similar in detection range to a later F-16A radar. You can save lives since nobody is in the driver's seat I guess but there isn't a lot of extra survivability nor capability you get with something like this over an F-16 and you don't really save much money either. You're better off going with smaller but more attritable and cheaper CCAs controlled by an F-35 type aircraft since your expensive aircraft in that scenario never has to actually get killed
>>64578257No, it isn’t. Because the pilot is not the limiting factor in terms of sustainable G’s
>>64578848>thinking mountain can hide tagets forcing planes into dogfights>when you have GPS targeted bomb, top attach mode missiles and cruise missiles with automatic terrain detection and evasion maneuversif you're about to fight other north african, middle eastern and caucasus armies then yeah, sure it make sense.anything else and you're worm food.
>>64577757sublime
>>64579156They don’t, not because the F-16 airframe can’t do it, but because the QF-16 conversion literally removes the combat stuff. They strip out the radar and weapons systems and replace it all with remote-control gear and safety/kill switches. These things are built to be shot at, not to shoot back. So it’s not about “can’t” in theory, it’s just that QF-16s aren’t set up or cleared to do anything like an actual UCAV such as Kızılelma. This doesn’t make them “inferior” they’re just built for a different purpose. They’re meant to be targets and testbeds, and there’s nothing wrong with that.>>64579282Okay, explain to me how a living, breathing human in the cockpit who is susceptible to being harmed by high Gs even after extensive training is not a limiting factor for high-G maneuvers
>>64577757Meme tech
>>64578257The robot is intended to be cheaper to replace than a full human piloted fighter. It exists to get the missiles closer to the target without putting a human pilot in danger.
>>64577890>>64578848dogfights aren't a thing anymore
>>64578752Given that this test was rushed to try and beat Australia to it, I would absolutely not be shocked if there's something smoke-and-mirrors going on.The number of people in this thread that seem to have no clue as to the intended role or history of UCAVs does not make me inclined to take their word for it being on the level.
Will this be like an unmanned missile truck? What's the difference between this and a larger triangle shaped drone?
I am not even turk but it's obvious Ataturk was a chad, we would have had far less global issues if more raghead countries had had rulers like him.
>>64580632Because it’s not. With modern g-suits and techniques, most airframes (the exceptions generally being small dedicated acrobatic aircraft) will bend and break before the pilot reaches the limits of their body.
>>64582160Even with the best techniques, the human body has a hard limit. You can’t just ‘G-suit’ your way past that. Sure, a pilot might "handle" a MOMENTARY 15–20G spike with extreme training, a G‑suit, and luck but even then we’re using the word ‘handle’ very generously. The airframe may cope with high G, but the pilot is the limiting factor. Modern G‑suits and AGSM help, but humans can’t sustain anything above 9G for long and sustained period (sustained is the key word here) without risking G‑LOC or blacking out. Also Aircraft are far more resistant to G‑forces than pilots so you don’t need to ‘break apart’ the frame to incapacitate the pilot with G‑force.>>64581997Kızılelma was designed with A2A capability in mind from the start. They didn’t just rush to strap an A2A missile on it because ‘oh, the Australians have one, we have to beat them.’ It’s part of a planned development process, not a reactionary move. Also, Ghost Bat's A2A testing was announced too late by air development standards to actually 'rush it' into the Kızılelma project.
>>64581729>dogfights aren't a thing anymoreThen what was the point of putting a cannon on the F-35?
>>64582434was it ever used in combat? no?how about in the ukraine war, did anyone score a jet A2A kill with guns?
>>64582445ukraine is all flatland. If ukraine had mountains like Turkey, guns would be quite relevant in a2a combat.
>>64582464so it's a no the reason the f-35 has guns isn't >mountains
>>64582465there are many cases where BVR won't happen and terrain is one of them.
>>64582470just not truesorry but your 15G meme is just a meme you made up
>>64582464>ukraine is all flatland.What are the carpathian mountains
>>64582370Anon I think you might be a little bit retarded if you think 'rushed something so they can try and claim first' is the same as someone saying 'they from scratch did all of this in a week'.
>>64582473So, you are not aware that radars can't see through terrain. This is just sad at this point.
>>64582495except the radars that are relevant in this context aren't on the ground
>>64582502radars above can see through mountains but radars on the ground can't you say.
>>64582509do i need to draw it for you
>>64582514no need to, i can see from a mile that you are an imbecile.
>>64582518it’s very clear that you're mentally deficient if you can’t comprehend how that tactic largely fails against airborne radars
this anon will be remembered, i will keep this screenshot
>>64582066I regret to inform you but you are a Turk now. Sorry but you have to live as a Turk from now on, i know it is sad but there is nothing we can do about this.>>64582492First, there is people arround here who are that much retarded, so i had to clarify. Second, The point was that Kızılelma’s A2A capability was part of a planned development, not something rushed just to ‘claim first’ against Australia. Kızılelma had its first flight in 2022, and development had been underway long before that. But some people here keep claiming this is just a 'lame test' rushed to be done for the sake of being first, and that it ‘doesn’t count’.
>>64582525you are an idiot. An airborne radar that can see valleys and rifts on a mountain range will have to fly in dogfight range.
>>64582609you underestimate the scale
>>64582614Are you from low countries or something? Now i suspect that you might have never seen a mountain range in your life.
>>64582650are you from a third world country or something? now i suspect you never seen how high aircraft fly
>>64582668kek, the dude thinks that every mountain out there is like the road bump they have in Belgium. What an absolute imbecile.An aircraft that will need to get whole picture of Taurus, Agrı, Caucaus Minor etc will need to fly directly above it. So that it needs to get into dogfight range.
>>64577924they should make a version that drops some money on this impoverished shithole.>>64582066he thought you can turn this shithole into a european nationalist style country (all while deporting the more urbanized christians to greece) where everyone and everything is going to be turk, and it's going to be a european style developed ethnostate out of nothing. in reality turks were 90% highly traditionalist villagers who understood no such thing. so after him it turned into a corrupt banana republic shithole and stayed that way. maybe it will fix itself next century idk.
>>64582015different companies.>>64582160bs. not that it matters.>>64582434because the boomer bureaucracy made f-35 a project where they throw everything and a kitchen sink on it. even then only the A model has a canon. waste of weight and space imo.>>64582464>>645826091. dogfighting doesn't have to involve a gun. in a dogfight you're still 100000x better off with an agile short range missile like aim-9x (or bozdoğan).2. lets say the drone has to work low altitude in the mountains. sure, then maneuverability matters and it will end up in a short range fight. a gun is still not needed here. also this requires advanced level of autonomy. in turkish geography, it's a nice, or even essential, capability to have.3. canard design is also potentially for short road runway operations. same reason for gripen.4. the bvr fight still very much matters and is effective over turkey. you can only terrain mask so much until a patrolling sensor illuminates your valley and a bvr shooter positions itself to launch on you. low altitude mountainous flight is an advantage but high altitude domination is still essential. so you also need triangles.
>>64582712I'm not the guy that claims dogfighting is dead. The dude has never seen a proper mountain in his life. Skip that, he's wholly unaware about EW and jamming.I'd say future a2a combat will happen 60% BVR engagement and 40% dogfight in places like Turkey and surrounding countries
>>64582702awacs fly at 9 to just shy of 13 km the EL/W-2085 which turkey might realistically face, can go to 16km you don't fathom the scale and i grew up in the northern caucasus
>>64582752it's 100% BVR and 0% dog fights that's the point you're missing
>>64582434>what was the point of putting a cannon on the F-35?to satisfy the arbitrary CAS requirements of some retarded GWOT vets
>>64582609>An airborne radar that can see valleys and rifts on a mountain range will have to fly in dogfight rangeaverage turkroach iq lmao
>>64582753so you are a puccian. Shouldn't you be drafted and die in a war zone? How did you evade conscription? Who gets sent on the front instead of you? I'm not mocking you, I'm just interested>>64582762Dude, you are an imbecile. Just stop posting.
>>64582777i live in the west since my early teens
>>64582767i don't have time to teach you basic math. Go ask your favorite AI tool, that how close your precious awacs need to fly in order to eliminate radar shadow behind a ~4 km high mountain range.
>>64582801>i live in the west since my early teensso since the war started in 2022? smart move
I always suspected that Americans are low iq nigger mutts, but this thread confirmed to me that they are low iq butthurt nigger mutts
>>64578099Israel will get these to shoot each other down
>>64577924What a retarded take for someone interested in geopolitics. Turkey's GDP per capita increased both in PPP and Nominal. These are the things that actually count. Not currency value.
>>64582434to spray at civies before you fly home, DUH
>>64586266Every serious country on Earth worries about keeping inflation low because it's awful for the economy in the long run but Erdogan knows best. Surely this won't backfire. Every other country is wrong to worry about inflation, Türkiye found the secret sauce.
>>64585229>americans are low iq butthurt nigger muttsis this your first time on /k/?
>>64586361Next time post inflation chart then. But my point till stands.
