>China developed economically when their peasants were smart cookies, they managed to tolerate drudgery for decades, first under Mao and then in the sweatshops. Meanwhile the less intelligent in the African congo in that gravel viral documentary ran by Chinese managers, have to be tardwrangled into simple jobs constantly.
a third of the chink population is still doing this. chinks are the product of thousands of years of slavish agriculture while congonigs lived free hunter lifestyles over the same timespan. i mean what do you expect if you're playing iq reductionism and ignoring race culture climate a whole people's history

>>25294258
>smart people wouldn't be happy doing menial work
I'm not. It's extremely boring. I would rather be exploiting my brainpower; that'd make me happier.

>that a caste of retarded, slower people who get their embryos drenched in alcohol is needed
In a capitalist society, consumers are needed. The consumers do the labor the producers don't want to do, and with the meager compensation other producers give them in exchange for that labor, they will enrich all producers through purchase of their goods and services.
They need to be stupid and pacified in order to not become dissatisfied with the system and seek to disrupt or dismantle it.

>This idea is presented pretty uncritically.
Perhaps because it was presumed further explanation would insult a knowing reader's intelligence.

>Not all intelligent and competent people are ambitious
On the contrary, not every intelligent and competent person can tolerate a dysfunctional system they are faced with and risk their time energy and well-being pursuing something within it or beyond it.

>a shitload of Ted Kaczynski like spergs
Again, someone who merely hates the current configuration of the world and would prefer a different one.

Also, if Soma was that good and the pleasures were that abundant but rationed, why would the population tolerate being rationed it? Why not make a black market of soma? Why not conspire with one another to bribe some manager so they watch their gooning porn on tablets? Someone stupid enough to be a mechanic on a machine and a middling caste would still have the intelligence required to form a cartel and bribe their superior. Lower castes would absolutely be debt trapped with more intelligent higher castes exploiting their high time preference and giving them soma up front now for the principle plus interest next week. This would absolutely destabilize their society.

Addicts aren't liable to be controlled and they're creative and motivated specifically around getting their hit. Contrast the pleasures of their porn, sex and drugs with the drudgery of menial labour and of course they'd minimize the former and maximize the latter.

Unironically their society would start to resemble ours. Everyone would aspire for lazy girl jobs and to NEET, and it'd accumulate debt in order to delay the collapse of the system.

>>25294289
>It's extremely boring.

Yeah nigga, no shit, that's why those jobs are abundant with little competition, and firstie countries flood in Jeet and Filo migrants to do them. They don't magically become fun and enjoyable if you're retarded.

>They need to be stupid and pacified in order to not become dissatisfied with the system and seek to disrupt or dismantle it.

Again, it's the stupid people that cause the problems at those menial jobs too. In a supermarket, it's always the most stupid fuck up that's dumb enough to steal product under a security camera. It's not the smart guy at work that's siphoning petrol from gas canisters. It's the dumbest individuals that disappear on drug benders and come back to work fucked up. Even at that level, the relatively smarter individuals are the ones that do their job consistently and competently.

>>25294258
Control freaks who run monopolies do tend to pursue all manner of subjugationist tools.
The lowering of attention span was no accident, it was and continues to be deliberate. Zoomers and younger will not be good workers, but that's not the point. A tyrant would rather rule over ashes than give up power.
The masses must be pacified and weakened on all levels for this purpose.

Why do you think women didn't make men as beautiful as they are? Same thing, monopolization of power.

take a uni class and say this to the prof, he will think you're super smart and super interesting

>>25294404
Really? It seems like obvious criticisms to me, I'm just some uneducated chud and I never got what the circlejerk over this book was. The political commentary was obvious (Ford, Freud, Ford, Freud, Marx, etc). It'd be better written as a speculative essay.

There's some highlights, the contrast of the taco bean eating reservation with the pristine sterile World Government society hit hard, especially with his mom getting shitfaced drunk on hard hitting alcohol every night. Then she goes home fucked up, looks fucked up, and basically self euthanises with soma. It's sorta comparable with how heroin addicts accidentally overdose not when they're most addicted, but after a few months of absence and overestimate what's a safe dosage.

Nobody talks about how he predicted gooning though, right down to the excessive focus on interracial porn. I don't know if porn was racist back then in the same way, or Huxley was ahead of his time in predicting BNWO PMVs, but it made me laff that he clicked onto that personal degeneracy.

>Smart people wouldn't be happy doing menial work
They don't need to be happy, they need to be pacified enough so that they wouldn't change anything, which is exactly what happens: Soma. There are multiple instances where smart people express their self-dissatisfaction, but they're not dissatisfied or brave enough to do anything about it. This happens to gifted burnouts all the time. Those who are brave are taken to exile where they can do non-menial work, but not in a way that effects the world order.
>there's a shitload of Ted Kaczynski like spergs working in sawmills stacking timber all day
John the Savage is the stand-in for exactly this kind of person. You didn't read the book
>And not all stupid people enjoy monotonous drudgery and swallow it down effortlessly. The workweek was specifically designed to be just long enough that people wouldn't have enough free time to think about their drudgery. Most of their work is unnecessary and superfluous. Also Soma.
>Why not make a black market of soma?
They always had just enough to keep it as a reward but never fear running out of it, like a dog waiting for food in its bowl. Also they're too stupid, comfortable, busy, undersupplied, unorganized, and weak to try anything like that. Soma is an artificial scarcity.

In conclusion: You didn't read the fucking book

>>25294258
>smart people wouldn't be happy doing menial work
Smart people chase long term happiness over short term happiness. Look at how Asian Americans are coming from third world war torn countries in Asia and then building family structure within a generation, an educated immigrant children for the next generation, and becoming millionaires in the next.

The parents are smart, they dont like cleaning toilets or running a small shop in the ghetto. They're doing it so they can invest in the future and reap the rewards.

>>25294879
Dumb people don't like cleaning toilets or being in the ghetto either, they just lack the faculties to climb out of the situation. Most cope through "temporarily embarrassed millionare" syndrome until they're old, thinking their mixtape or sports career will take off. Only really setting into acceptance in middle age and then coping with something, joining a gang, church, turning to drugs.

They're exactly like the Changs but more delusional. Most people hate lowly positions and repetitive work, this should be completely obvious. But most humans are universal in this regard, they want to improve their situation. It's personal faults like laziness, it's narcissistic delusional hubris, or plain bad luck that really drives them into a bad position.

>>25294872
If it's not about happiness then why permanently retard them? Didn't the book have a whole dialogue with the Chadpreet world controller about how a society of Alpha Pluses couldn't function? It's been a while since I read it, but the general argument was that some would throw crying tantrums over being smart but having to wagecuck and it'd destabilize their society, while the retard midget epsilons like dull retard work and find it tolerable.

>They always had just enough to keep it as a reward but never fear running out of it, like a dog waiting for food in its bowl. Also they're too stupid, comfortable, busy, undersupplied, unorganized, and weak to try anything like that. Soma is an artificial scarcity.

It can't be an addictive desirable drug and also something that they can't want more of past their allotted amount. The foid coming back with John the Lolcow and guzzling excessive quantities shows it can be abused. You can't have it both ways, if it's that good and the psychological mechanism that the world state hinges motivation for wagecucking on, then of course they'd be psychologically motivated to find workarounds.

>>25294872
But yes, Kaczynski was a bad example, he somewhat applies though because he did do menial labour jobs during his time innawoods from time to time, apparently.

I more meant that you find highly intelligent, pro-social and content people that are often fine doing menial work that they like. Orchid work, farming, cleaning, etc. One of the top scorers in the country in my school year for the final exams went on to work for minimum wage 7 years down the track. He's a bit of a weirdo, but he's happy and puts in a solid 40 hours.

>This happens to gifted burnouts all the time

No such thing as gifted burnout, it's just the same as stupid burnout.

>>25294902
It's not about *their* happiness, it's about maintaining a world order. Happiness is key, but not necessary, to doing that. There is no proof that the exile is even real and not a secret execution.

And there are different degrees of addiction, dumbass. Heroin isn't as addictive as weed, is it? People can still be dependent on weed for stimulus while not resorting to ripping out copper wiring the moment they don't have it. You're treating them more like mindless animals than the well-GMO cattle they've been designed to be since birth.

>>25294905
The existence of smart people enjoying menial work doesn't deconstruct anything about Brave New World. Nothing is stopping Alphas from doing leisure activities. Now you're just pointing out the fact the book didn't mention every tokenism.

>No such thing as gifted burnout, it's just the same as stupid burnout.

You have to be trying to be retarded at this point

>>25294902
>Most cope through "temporarily embarrassed millionare" syndrome
nah, most do what is in their interest. The "temporarily embarrassed millionaire" syndrome is a communist ideology leaking through to impose upon real people's thoughts and motives. People are just pursuing their self interest, no one's embarrassed or thinking they temporarily fell from millionaire status.

You should try again and formulate a real answer instead of the communist algorithm

>>25294919
Except pleasure and function is the mechanism for maintaining this order, it's the organizing principle. It also serves as their ideological and psychological motivation, hence their socialization into pro-sex attitudes.

If it's the organizing principle and the foundation of the world, what keeps them in line efficiently and with less supervision, then it should keep them calm, complacent, pro-social, well behaved and orderly. I'm saying that alternating the most intense pleasures between sessions of the most mindless retard drudgery wagecucking will not do that, and we can see it doesn't do that because it doesn't do it in our world. If people wagecuck in order to get a drug and goon, then they'll be motivated to find a shortcut and cut out the wagecucking. All someone has to do if float that possibility through easier methods and they'll be incentivized to take it. The World State in this world is completely vulnerable to renegades offering pleasure without the labour. And considering the World State is highly obsessed with stability, this is a glaring fault.

This is how it works with weed all the time, women fuck guys they don't like for weed and stay in relationships they don't like for weed, men work jobs they hate for more weed. Sure, yes, in specific instances they do all this because they can't get it otherwise. But if an option to get weed without the extra wagecucking or fuck some tweaker who has a seemingly permanent layer of cold sweat on him, they'll take it. They take the path of least resistance.

>>25294923
It does because the book explicitly states that the government is capable of making everyone a highly intelligent chad but chooses not to, that's the crux of the caste based self imposed stagnation. I vaguely remember there being one part where Chadpreet Mond was reading a report about the possibility of such a system but deciding it's too risky for stability.

>>25294936
Well what do you mean by temporarily embarrassed millionare? I mean the tendency for poor and stupid people thinking their present circumstances are due to factors beyond their control that are unfair but most likely temporary, and that their true potential is wealth and greatness. It doesn't have to be literal millionaire, but it often is.

The poor and stupid do have a tendency to think they're genuinely think they're smart and talented in a Dunning Kruger sort of way. Even if they've scored bottom marks on a test, they'll insist they have some secret "street smarts" or whatever that's unmeasurable, and preserve their ego by imagining situations where they're secretly the top dog. Many of the most incompetent and stupid people I've ever met have 100% scorned working McJobs thinking they're above it. "I don't wanna be making money for someone else, I wanna be like Drake and OWN the record company you know, that way you're the manager and they're making money for you". They genuinely have this PepeNEET mentality of the economy just being pure parasitism at every level, and aspire to be nothing but the person everyone defers to. Of course in western countries these sorts of fuck ups coast by on NEETbux, typically to preserve their ego, but in places they can't they ironically flounder on the bottom level.

I just feel Huxley had the wrong sort of perception of the lower classes and dumb people, and probably hadn't interacted with them. Thinking that the best adapted for those roles are the cognitively stunted because they'll be at the intellectual level to enjoy the drudgery. The unfortunate thing is even at that level it's better, both for society and the individual, to be pro-social and intelligent.

>>25294939
It does do it in our world. It has done it in our world. Once again, you have ignored the other five reasons why they don't consider it a valid option. Who would be capable of delivering soma to them other than the authorities? They are too stupid to find another supply. They are too busy to find another supply. They are too poor to find another supply. They are too disorganized to find another supply. Have you ever considered that, maybe, a person would rather sit in semi-perfect circumstances for the rest of their life rather than risk throwing it all away for something possibly more comfortable? The reason why not a single person in the Epstein files has been prosecuted is for these exact same reasons. These black market vigilantes you keep imaging in your head don't exist because nobody is willing to risk their comfortable (ENOUGH) lives to disrupt the new world order. They are both promised pleasure AND threatened with fear. They're not gubmint monkeys that get paid thousands a month to sit around and do nuffin while also being released for felonies. Our world is legitimately more evil than the book in some ways.

I am once again failing to see why intelligent people not being barred from regular work disrupts the order. They are the ones given the freedom to choose things. They literally go on vacation. Giving choice to EVERYONE is not a stable option. You are making no point here.

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>>25294258
Being a manual worker is nothing worse than being a slave. A man is by nature predisposed to see the ultimate meaning in reflection and intellectual activity and seeking knowledge. If your job does not come in contact with these things, it’s over. It’s necessary. But it’s a sacrifice for society. You will be appreciated, but nobody wants to be in your position.

>>25294313
>Yeah nigga, no shit
I'm literally responding to op's insinuation otherwise, dimwit.

>>25294258
Your critiques shows that the point of the novel was lost on you.

>>25294258
There's a degree of pro-establishment propaganda in both Brave New World and 1984, wether the authors intended to do that or not. In both novels we read about perfectly orderly societies and protagonists stumbling on all kinds of problems with that is orderliness, like the reason of their problems is life in a utopia. The final days of Western civilization will look more like this extract from the history of the Italian republics:

The Roman nobles, under the last Emperors, seemed incapable of any great or generous passion; no desire for distinction animated them; they sought neither intellectual superiority, nor power, nor glory; strangers to public affairs, they would have believed themselves to be degraded had they entered into a civil or military career. Alone in the nation, they did, it is true, sometimes still manage to have their names remembered by history, but only to recount their riches and their misfortunes. One could tell how many precious vases the Barbarians had taken from their palaces, how many thousands of slaves they had seized from their countryside; but of themselves there was nothing to say; They were not made to leave any trace behind them: no character, no memorable actions, no talents, no virtues—nothing distinguished them from the crowd. They passed unnoticed on earth, in shameful obscurity. The rest of the nation, even more cowardly if that is possible, seems almost to conceal their existence from our research.

The armies were composed only of barbarians, the countryside populated only by slaves; one asks history in vain where the Italians were. In reading the annals of the last reigns of the Western Roman Empire, one needs a constant effort to remember that it was still a vast state; when one sees armies composed of a handful of men, the treasury depleted by the most paltry expenditure, the impossibility of resistance against the weakest aggressor; when the People and the Senate are silent, and a captain of the guards gives or takes away the Empire to unknowns, because there was not a single man in all the orders of the nation capable of seizing it with a firm hand; one would think that it was a question of a miserable fief, among some small barbaric people, and not of the sovereignty of the West, not of the nation which had inherited the name and civilization of Rome (1).

This is irrefutable: rotting societies become less orderly, not more. People like to imagine that the globe is ruled by all-powerful elites because it satiates their feeling of safety, even when they pretend those same elites to be evil. The truth is that history runs it's own course and cannot be controlled.

>>25294289
>I'm not. It's extremely boring. I would rather be exploiting my brainpower; that'd make me happier.
I do personally want a little bit more, but practicing walking meditation and free thought while stacking boxes from 4-9am goes so FUCKING hard in my life I'm so much happier than when I was supposed to run accounts