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Twink Brahms edition
https://youtu.be/0tHdavyycsE

>How do I get into classical?
This link has resources including audio courses, textbooks and selections of recordings to help you start to understand and appreciate classical music:
https://pastebin.com/NBEp2VFh

Previous: >>120368527
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Essential Chinese and Korean composers?
>>
>>120476947
nip nong bing bong
ching chong
>>
https://aah.zentral.zone/
Hunt
>>
>>120477012
ning bing bong is my favorite chinese composer
>>
>>120476947
Unsuk Chin and you're done.
>>
>>120476837
Brahms only good work.
>>
>>120477018
incredibly stupid
>>
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aXFHyXb5csI

rolling with this album today
>>
>>120477666
....heh.... forgive me my master, these plebeians just cannot understand how your work -no, your soul itself- lives on through your teachings
*microtonal fugue starts playing*
>>
>>120478676
insanely retarded
>>
Somebody please help me remember what the piece that plays at the beginning of this Japanese radio show is
https://youtu.be/t2N-XsDT3nk?si=gRDjUgsXYR13qf5n
>>
>>120478764
No idea but you should listen to real music.
>>
>>120478821
You have no clue whatsoever what I listen to (it's not tchaikovsky or nipponese radio), and we will skin and hang all of you brown redditors with your fodder replies
>>
Schumann's late works are underrated. No one talks about the Gesange der Frühe or the Requiem and the third violin sonata is the least recorded of the 3. I think it's a shame.
>>
>>120478748
i'm sorry that you can't grasp Bach's work, anon.
>>
>>120479318
I used to be able to play the 1st part of Gesange der Fruhe back when I was learning the piano
I really liked it back then. I may have posted about it on here but it was a few years ago so I dont remember if anyone replied to me
>>
>>120479393
I'm learning it right now myself
>>
>>120479347
totally braindead
>>
>>120478764
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hXmyzeTI_zo
>>
>>120479581
do you know counterpoint anon? can you compose a fugue?
>"Aaron Hunt is a musical genius and a pleasure and honor to have as a teacher."
>"Aaron is equal parts exacting and encouraging, with an encyclopedic knowledge of the works of Bach and his peers. It would be hard to receive more comprehensive and hands-on instruction in Baroque counterpoint without traveling back in time 300 years."
>"In my entire scholastic career, no teacher has ever taught me more in a classroom setting than Mr. Hunt"
Mr.Hunt would be more than willing to help you with all of those things; for a fee, of course.
it is NEVER too late to master counterpoint
>>
>>120479615
unimaginably dumb
>>
>>120479318
That's because it's almost universally acknowledged that he seriously declined as a composer. Grieg recommended, as a general principle, not to listen to another past opus 50. The piece that isn't a stodgy mess in his later period is the major exception.

>inb4 some inexplicable and irrational personal attachment to one of his worst works
>>
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>tfw wyn hear Beethoven's Klezmer music
>>
>>120479694
It wasn't Klezmer, it was Hebraic.
>>
>>120479658
>Grieg
lmao
>>
>>120479607
Thanks man!!
>>
>>120479746
>We wuz da real Israelites p
>>
>>120478890
Come at me bro
>>
>>120479658
This is my rule for Beethoven. Except it's his early work. Nothing before opus 47.
>>
>>120477409
The 2nd concerto is better.
>>
>>120483599
Mozart > K200 only
>>
>>120484267
Maybe even K.300 onward if you want only the "mature", fully formed Mozart. With the Jeunehomme concerto (271) thrown in.
>>
You guys don't deserve this, but here you go
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q6U8AqRNyU8
>>
Schnittke's Penitential Psalms are amazing.
>>
>>120483599
But this is completely better. Beethoven was only getting BETTER, it's not like his early works were bad as such. In fact, everyone knows how brilliant many of them are. It's not like the 3rd symphony just came out of nowhere.
>>
>>120485029
>It's not like the 3rd symphony just came out of nowhere

It kind of did. The difference in quality between early period Beethoven and middle period Beethoven is huge.
>>
>>120479658
so true wagnersister
>>
>Coming upon the first "Razumovsky" quartet after the six of Op. 18 is like coming into a new artistic universe. It is like a first reading of Chapman's Homer, a first visit to Athens or Venice, a first kiss. The richness of detail, the originality and fertility of musical idea, the commanding coherence, the sheer smooth density and complexity of it all, are fairly breathtaking
>>
>>120485349
>It kind of did.
Nah, you should be able to see how it follows on from his previous two, even if I agree that, yes, it's an enormous jump in quality.
>>
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>The most tremendous genius raised Mozart above all masters, in all centuries and in all the arts. A light, bright, fine day this will remain throughout my whole life. As from afar, the magic notes of Mozart's music still gently haunts me. He is the highest, the culminating point that beauty has attained in the sphere of music as for one moment in the history of music all opposites were reconciled; all tensions resolved; that luminous moment was Mozart.

>Mozart creates music from a mysterious center, and so knows the limits to the right and the left, above and below. He maintains moderation. It always sounds unburdened, effortless, and light. This is why it unburdens, releases, and liberates us. He never abandons himself to any one sense; even at his most ecstatic moments his mind is vigorous, alert, and on the wing. He dives unerringly on to his finest ideas like a bird of prey, and once an idea is seized he soars off again with an undiminished power. It does not give the listener time to catch his breath, for no sooner is one inclined to reflect upon a beautiful inspiration than another appears, even more splendid, which drives away the first, and this continues on and on, so that in the end one is unable to retain any of these beauties in the memory. It is particularly difficult to perform.
>>
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>>120486123
>His admirable clarity exacts absolute cleanness: the slightest mistake in it stands out like black on white. It is music in which all the notes must be heard. Free of all exaggeration, of all sharp breaks and contradictions. The sun shines but does not blind, does not burn or consume. Heaven arches over the earth, but it does not weigh it down, it does not crush or devour it. Easy to read, but very difficult to interpret. The least speck of dust spoils them. They are clear, transparent, and joyful as a spring, and not only those muddy pools which seem deep only because the bottom cannot be seen. His simplicity is merely purity. It is a crystalline thing in which all the emotions play a role, but as if already celestially transposed. Moderation consists in feeling emotions as the angels do.

>Mozart makes you believe in God because it cannot be by chance that such a phenomenon arrives into this world and leaves such an unbounded number of unparalleled masterpieces. It represents neither the prolonged sigh of faith that characterizes so much of the music written before his time, nor the stormy idealism which cloaks most music after him. Rather he is that mercurial balance of the skeptic and the humane. Like him, and in him, we can always discover new worlds.

- Maho Hiyajo
>>
>>120486123
>>120486127
thank you tranime sister
>>
>>120484851
Wrong link? I don't see the big deal
>>
>>120484310
>No violin Concerti
>No concerto for flute and Harp

Ishiggy Diggy
>>
THIS IS MEDIEVAL MUSIC:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YSCgKsvUeA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qDTK6vLhzd4


THIS IS RENAISSANCE MUSIC:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bdqoLEyFG-o

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5gVapS7XeAM


THIS IS MANNERISTIC MUSIC:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mnTjhQkgCD8

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x7QJr2xsVyM


THIS IS BAROQUE MUSIC:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b6tCzmyy2Cc

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=773F18XhaTo


THIS IS ROCCOCO MUSIC:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Jio1HP94R8

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WGfaoiHL6i4


THIS IS ILLUSTRISTIC MUSIC:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k1-TrAvp_xs

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gbf1LVE4UKM


THIS IS ROMANTICISTIC MUSIC:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l4ImL0Rblk8

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=891JUSQplzU


THIS IS MODERNISTIC MUSIC:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HAnXTHUU4ks

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hQ2Hz53wzuA


THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS «CLASSICAL MUSIC».
>>
Schumann

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7lID4Q50YZ0
>>
>>120487894
You don't even like music based on these recs
>>
>>120487894
thank you schizo sister
>>
>>120488126


YOU DO NOT EVEN HAVE A TASTE, JUDGING BY YOUR OPINION.
>>
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>>120487894
>ROMANTICISTIC MUSIC:
>>
>>120488206
thank you schizo sister
>>
>>120488206
>>120488206
Anyone who esteemed Glass is an enemy of music
>>
>>120487894
There's no such thing as "baroque music" or "rococo music". There is of course music from the baroque and rococo periods, but that's a different thing. Baroque and rococo are names that refer to the visual arts primarily and say nothing whatsoever about the music produced in those eras.

Same for "Renaissance music". No such thing. Renaissance artists took as their models art and architecture from classical antiquity. Obviously music composers had no such models.
>>
>>120488408


YOU ARE IGNORANT.

YOUR OPINION IS THAT OF SOMEONE TO WHOM MUSIC IS JUST «PLEASANT SOUNDS».
>>
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>>120488544
>Literally posted Glass and a romantic composer instead of Schoenberg and Stravinsky
>Preemptive "no u"
>>
>>120487894
There may not be "Classical music" but there IS "NEOCLASSICAL Music"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wNsuLDFbZww
>>
>>120488544
thank you schizo sister
>>
>>120479658
what did cause this decline?
>>
>>120488866
Syphilis.
>>
>>120484973
>Schnittke
I just googled him, I didn't know Mencius Moldbug had a classical composer twin brother
>>
>>120488871
For some reason Schubert only got better!
>>
what programs do you use for composing?
>>
Cesar Franck's string quartet may very well be his best work.
>>
>>120489423
Ableton and Musescore
>>
>>120489455
No it's the heckin' MLP symphony!
>>
>>120489544
what the fuck are you talking about
>>
>>120490436
Think he's referring to a melody in the third movement that sounds a little like the MLP theme.
>>
>>120489544
Muss es sein? Es muss sein! Es muss sein!
>>
>>120490449
>knowing what the MLP theme sounds like
couldnt be me
>>
>>120490449
>Think he's referring to a melody in the third movement that sounds a little like the MLP theme.
Jesus christ
>>
>>120487894
>makes up words like 'illustristic'' and refuses to use established ones
Based retard.
>>
talmbout bach b
p-p-p-p-peach of a composer
>>
Imagine being the orchestra that records toddler show music.
>>
>>120491068
orchestral musicians are soulless jobbers with 0 talent so they don't mind
>>
>LE HECKIN PRODIGY!!!!!
9/10 prodigies grow up to be cookie cutter unimpressive fags
>>
>>120491094
Whom do you quoth?
>>
>>120490661
Wut?
>>
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Whatever did Shostakovich mean by this?
>>
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How hard is Scriabin's fourth sonata? Its my goal to play it.
>>
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Gade mogging Brahms again
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=G7TIpNub-Q0
>>
>>120494148
excellent question scriabincel
>>120493935
excellent question shotakonbitch
>>
feeling sad and trapped in this shitty city, recommend me some piano tunes bros.
>>
>>120494870
which city?
your answer will change which piece i shall post
>>
>>120494940
Palestine
>>
>>120495106
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QKc_w-45zfE
>>
What composers actually continued Schoenberg's vision for melodic pantonal music?
>>
Chopin

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tH2JEjGHvU8
>>
>>120495306
Dallapiccola, Skalkottas, Krenek, Kokkonen
>>
>>120494870
>>120495106
https://youtu.be/zpMdr9nBJc0?si=oOgN4Vtdk2ntZ3hN
>>
>>120494940
>>120495106
little fucker, im in dallas
>>
>>120495627
thanks, needed that
>>
>>120489544
Based
>>
whats up with modes
>>
Any gustav Mahler bros?
>>
Meatloaf.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9X_ViIPA-Gc&ab_channel=MeatLoafVEVO
>>
>>120497372
what about him?
>>
>>120494221
Baaaaaaaaaaased
>>
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>This music which is in perpetual evolution is probably the most highly musical invention of Wagner – it places the emphasis for the first time on uncertainty, on indetermination. It represents a rejection of immutability, an aversion to definitiveness in musical phrases as long as they have not exhausted their potential for evolution and renewal.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GMiUMcfinG4
>>
>>120499822
Technically Liszt was doing it before, but he was a hack.
>>
Bach wrote programmatic music. Mozart wrote programmatic music. Beethoven wrote programmatic music. GET OVER IT CONSERVICHUDS.
>>
>>120500585
Sure, but their music is completely comprehensible and enjoyable without said program, so it's all good.
>>
>>120500585
Yes because the categories are fake and essentially self-promotional tools for Wagnerism.
>>
>>120500775
So is the music of Berlioz, Liszt, Wagner, etc.

>>120500887
>implying brahms and the conservatives didn't buy into the idea just as much
>>
>>120501078
Brahms didn't and had a cosmopolitan taste for all kinds of music. That critics were happy to sort themselves into Wagner's strawman is of no interest to me.
>>
>>120501191
>Brahms didn't
Only in private, officially he was just as anti-programmatic music as Hanslick or Joachim, who he was good friends with, or anyone else in the movement. Very early in his career, I think in 1861, he created and signed his name on an anti-Liszt pamphlet that really kicked off the animosity between the two sides. It's more like he made an exception for Wagner because he liked his music, but he didn't do the same for anyone else.
>>
>>120501343
What he thought in private is the only thing that matters regarding his music. He was embarrassed to have participated in the creation of that article as a young man and didn't publicly comment on the matter afterwards. Joachim and Clara were always much more invested in the debate than Brahms. He also had a dim view of Hanslick's opinions on music.
>>
>>120497245
Well anon, it turns out when you change the positions of the half-steps in a scale, it dramatically alters the feeling. Generally, the closer they are to the root and 5th, the darker the mode.
>>
Myaskovsky
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=bYb5D4KUlLs&pp=QAFIAQ%3D%3D
>>
>>120501698
>name is Canova
>has a picture of a Michelangelo sculpture
>>
>>120499822
>>120500585
>>120501078
>>120501343
thank you wagnersister
>>
>>120489455
I've recently been listening to more of Franck. I've been enjoying it more than I thought. I mean he doesn't get talked about a lot so I didn't expect much. Makes me wonder who else I've been sleeping on.
>>
>>120501852
franck’s decline in popularity in the modern day is only emblematic of the fact that the general public no longer understands what classical music is about.
>>
>>120501852
See
>>120501698
>>120494221
>>
>>120501903
sucks
>>
>>120493935
Catullus 13
Cenabis bene, mi Fabulle, apud me
paucis, si tibi di favent, diebus,
si tecum attuleris bonam atque magnam
cenam, non sine candida puella
et vino et sale et omnibus cachinnis.
haec si, inquam, attuleris, venuste noster
cenabis bene; nam tui Catulli
plenus sacculus est aranearum.
sed contra accipies meros amores
seu quid suavius elegantiusve est:
nam unguentum dabo, quod meae puellae
donarunt Veneres Cupidinesque,
quod tu cum olfacies, deos rogabis
totum ut te faciant, Fabulle, nasum.

Simply put, they are all totos nasos (excuse the lack of macron). Whole noses, for the uncultured.

That is my theory at the very least, even if it is a little bit far fetched.
>>
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>>120502080
So does Ffffffranck
>>
>>120502752
Pretty sure he was just naming the Jew, fren
>>
>>120502849
Fair enough.
>>
>>120502839
insanely retarded
>>
>>120502752
>>120502849
It's an opera based on the Gogol short story "the Nose". But feel free to imagine any random bullshit if that's easier for you.

>>120501852
César I assume. Try Eduard too
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z_cUDWn-kmY
>>
>>120502915
>Meme good
>Obscure bad
>>
>>120503082
totally moronic
>>
>>120503516
Name one thing Franck has on those others
>>
I have an idea for a classical music game where you would listen to a short segment of music and then guess things about it
like the composer, name of the work, year of composition and idk what else

do you think it's retarded
>>
>>120503528
absolutely braindead
>>
>>120503607
It's just a poor man's Piano Puzzler (NPR)
>>
>>120503618
I'm not asking for status updates on your state of mind, I'm asking for a justification of Gade's relative obscurity against Franck.
>>
>>120503654
incomprehensibly idiotic
>>
>>120503639
never heard of it but yes
more like a zoomer version of that and it would be real recordings
>>
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>>120503687
That's what you aaaaaare!
>>
>>120503784
extremely stupid
>>
>>120503654
You can't be this stupid.
>>
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ggn8riHTDqw
-45
>>
>>120504045
Not an argument
>>
>>120504401
>>120504418
It doesn't warrant an argument any more than your identical remarks about Brahms do. I genuinely wonder if this is a bit to make Wagnerites look retarded.
>>
>>120504445
Franck is not even as important as Brahms though. You are simply a slave to populism. You have no argument.
>>
>>120504485
Gade sounds even less like Franck than he does like Brahms. Get your hearing checked.
>>
>>120504445
They are not identical remarks about Brahms. My only point about Brahms is that he's not a top five composer and he sounds much like other composers who even go before him. Meanwhile thinking Franck is some canonical visionary is completely unjustified and insanely moronic as you would say. You just need to open your ears, instead of having the safest possible positions.
>>
>>120504530
Why is that relevant? Franck is a late romantic composer. Just another drop in the ocean of fluff, really. Poulenc sounds nothing like Bartok, are we now weighing apples and oranges as the idiotic idiom goes? (It's oranges btw). Is your brain-dead insinuation that composers cannot be compared unless they sound similar; we cannot know if Bach is better than Stravinsky?
>>
>>120504681
Okay I have to come clean, I thought Franck was born in the 1840s. I must have had him confused for Faure or something. I still don't see why he is better thoughever.
>>
>>120504586
>>120504681
It should be relevant to you since you apparently find these three composers indistinguishable, but it's admittedly irrelevant inasmuch as you're likely motivated by old-fashioned and conventional ideological hostilities and prejudices more so than sincere unfamiliarity with what makes Brahms and Franck 'sound like' Brahms and Franck.
>>
>>120504840
I NEVER said they were all indistinguishable. Rautavaara is distinguishable as hell and is he even in the ten most important composers? Hardly! But Brahms fails to be so much more original that he ends up being the fourth greatest composer or whatever Brahmsians say about him. Meanwhile Franck just seems like one of those composers we arbitrarily lift up like Telemann? Could've just as easily been Langaard. Give me your top 3 Franck moments that make him such an immanent figure, I'll wait.
>>
>>120505016
If you admit that they're distinguishable then you don't have a point because it's founded on a meaningless and superficial comparison.
>>
>>120505074
My point is there are other composers who existed before Brahms who fit into the idiom oft attributed to him, namely the late conservative style of romanticism. I'll admit he's a great melodist and that developing variation is an interesting formal concept.
>>
brahms has 2 prominent qualities all the other composers from the 19th century lack: 1) coherent long melodic lines (only chopin has that); 2) superior polyphony
and he has 1 flaw: relative harmonic banality/heaviness.
only the choral bruckner (especially the motets) was better than him between beethoven’s late string quartets and mahler’s 8th symphony (the only good thing he wrote together with the 9th and the lieder). symphonic bruckner is garbage, same as wagner’s except for the preludes. frank doesn’t even deserve to be mentioned in this context kek.
>>
>>120505386
>wagener’s
*wagner’s operas
>frank
*franck
>>
>>120505386
Too many hot takes to break down in one post.
>>
>>120505878
the shout out to bruckner's motets is based though
>>
>>120505386
>Schubert and Mendelssohn don't have long and coherent melodic lines

Based retard
>>
It's time for another episode of BASED or CRINGE?
https://m.youtube.com/shorts/Expb582GxVk
>>
>>120506308
bringe
>>
>>120505386
>coherent long melodic lines (only chopin has that)
immediately stopped reading
>>
>>120506468
We all should have lol
>>
>>120505386
Virtually everything in Schubert is a melody
>>
>>120506038
>>120506704
schubert's phrases are made of 5-6-7 notes, retards. chopin and brahms' are made of 15-16-17. is this place like lit where everyone talks about things they don't read?
>mendelssohn
kek
>>
>>120506944
Well I guess since Schoenberg's are made out of 48, he is the greatest melodist of all time.
>>
>>120506968
that wasn't my point of course. you can choose either length or brevity. mozart created beautiful short tunes, which he variated with ease. from the 19th cenutry, AFTER schubert and mendelssohn, the idea of "melody" changed from singable "circular" sets of notes to linear clusters, it was pretty much a return to the baroque, in this respect. pretty much everyone* in the 19th cenutry tried and failed, liszt for example and wagner, then the 20th century changed everything.

*(from the 19th century bellini is kind of an "outlier" for me. his melodies are long without losing a certain structure and rationality, but he is responsible for the shitty belcanto tradition which infected the italian musical culture for 120 years. gabrieli, monteverdi, frescobaldi, corelli, gesualdo, allegri, vivaldi, scarlatti, albinoni, pergolesi, boccherini, cimarosa, tartini, cherubini, clementi... and then busoni, dallapiccola, malipiero, casella, pizzetti, petrassi: this is the great italian tradition, not that la donna è mobile meme trash).
>>
>>120507240
>pretty much everyone
*pretty much everyone except for chopin and brahms that is
>>
ok best recordings of Schumann and Brahms's symphonies? Only definitive "favorite" for me so far is Mravinsky's Brahms 4
>>
>>120476837
What compels people to play defense for their favourite composer or rank composers against each other? Is this the psychosis of Americans raised on football and two-party politics?
>Brahms?
Love 'im
>Mozart?
Beau'iful
>Stravinsky?
Bloody alright mate
Day in the life of a classical geezer
>>
whats up with perfect 4ths? they're "perfect" and yet they are considered dissonant?
or they're considered dissonant in some contexts but consonant in others?
maybe i'm misunderstanding but i've seen it called both things
>>
>>120507255
Chopin sucks. Also show one of these Brahms phrases. Generally I think of a phrase as being when there is an identifiable sequence. I can't think of a Brahms melody that has a 8+ note phrase.
>>
>>120508349
There's nothing else to talk about. Everyone is dead and everything new sucks so the only thing you can do is argue about nonsense, or go "hey look at this piece:" "oh yeah i know it. its good"/"oh i didn't know it. im going to give it a listen now"
>>
>>120508352
Don't ever watch Adam Neely. To me, they are consonant. Simple as.
>>
>>120508384
it sounds consonant to me as well. I was watching "early music sources" yesterday (which to be fair, is about 1500-1600s theory so i guess the thoughts might have changed) and was just now watching some guy called "jacob gran" talking about writing counterpoint
>>
>>120508432
Well yeah, follow the rules when doing exercises, even if they seem arbitrary at times.
>>
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>>120506968
It would appear so
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>>120508362
I would even say sequences that have a 'period' of 10+ notes is antithetical to good melody writing.
>>
>>120508352
>>120508384
>>120508432
>>120508696
none of you are ever passing species counterpoint lol
>>
>>120508757
i aint passing shit because i have no music education and i will never sign up for or attend a music class
i am just doing self-study in my own spare time for fun (and for free)
>>
>>120508757
Correct. I didn't waste money on something I can learn autodidactically as opposed to getting a certificate that has career prospects.
>>
Who are some happy lesser-known modernist composers? I'm tired.of this relentless angst!
>>
>>120508757
Literally everyone who I took it with passed and they didn't even learn it. It was so bad hahahaha
>>
>>120508372
no true, we can talk about and compare different recordings
>>
music for being extremely, incredibly gay? Bonus if it also relates to having a small penis.
>>
>>120508352
That is right they are consonant when used in fauxbourdon and disonant when used in conjunction with the pentatonic scale.

>>120508384
That's right you can tell just from looking at the way he presents himself, that he has found the perfect fourth to be unworkable (a weaker choice) from his noodlings in the pentatonic scale, which is the result of his unconscious bias for veritcal jazz music.
>>
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Any problems? also am I allowed to use a 12th? I know you're not really supposed to use 5ths very much and especially not parallel but playing it back a few times it sounded fine to me and especially since its so far away it doesnt sound like the 2 melodies are fusing together

(Below is the cantus firmus and above is my counterpoint)
>>
>>120508352
They just don't sound good.
Simple as.
That's how all counterpoint rules came about. People who think they're "le arbitrary rules" have no ears.
>>
>>120509261
Are you retarded? They sound great.
>>
Bach

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ONJe0ZTXkKo
>>
>>120509261
I bet you think "doesn't sound pretty" is the same as "doesn't sound good"
>>
>>120509651
It sounds both tho. What exactly is generating this supposed dissonance? It is literally the third ratio in the harmonic series.
>>
>>120508764
>>120508765
>>120508838
lol these niggas failed species counterpoint. point and laugh fellas
>>
>>120509239
shockingly embarrassing
>>
>>120510129
How do you fail when you're not enrolled, dipshir. Standard music theory is something 100 IQ's can understand and you actually spent tens of thousands of dollars to learn a fraction of it. I'm laughing at you, lol.
>>
>>120510200
just give up and admit you failed babby’s first species buddy. it’s not too late to save yourself from the shame.
>>
>>120510140
i finished watching the video and most of what I did was the same as the solution given so I'd say i did pretty well. I grade myself 85/100
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>>120510279
extremely retarded
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>>120510250
I can't fail if nobody is judging me.
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>>120510279
There are usually multiple solutions.
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>>120510291
lol, pussy
>>
>>120510323
Not at all, when I was doing exercises, I ran them by the Academic Music Discord server all the way back in 2020 and they approved them. Why are you so proud that you passed the easiest part of conservatory?
>>
>>120510312
yeah obviously i'm not saying its perfect or the only solution
its just that this particular problem was given a solution (the rest werent) and I was pretty close to it

I did make some mistakes with the leaps (I forgot they had to be consonant leaps, this was brought up later) so i fixed it up and changed it around afterwards
>>
>>120510370
Okay good. All I meant is that your solution wasn't necessarily wrong.
>>
>>120510360
thank you discord porn addict sister
>>
>>120510407
You're on 4chan, numbnuts! There is literally an "ad" with a woman showing off her bare ass as we speak. I hope you fall for that phishing scam btw.
>>
>>120510433
I've literally never seen porn on Discord. But apparently you have an idea of how to access it. I think you're probably the porn addict between us, since you seem to think of discord as some porn haven.
>>
>>120510470
thank you discord porn addict sister
>>
10407
10433
10496
thank you (You) addict sister
>>
>>120510516
thank you discord porn addict sister
>>
>>120510670
Not even the same guy lol
>>
>>120510697
thank you discord porn addict sister
>>
>>120510312
Not according to riemann. He literally goes off on a tangent about there being "one true counterpoint" in the opening to his text on that matter
Complete nutjob
>>
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>>120510723
Discord isn't a platform, it's an entirely new medium. The reason you will never bea true artist is (aside from the fact you don't respect the silence that serves as the foundation of creativity) you don't see the potential in anything, least of all yourself, so you are happy to play the part of the gibbering buffoon and endlessly repeat the same phrases forever as your flesh cinders in the flames of hell.
>>
>>120510780
thank you discord porn addict sister
>>
>>120510812
>>
>>120510845
thank you discord porn addict sister
>>
>>120510880
Anybody know who you are?
>>
It's a bot! Just stop replying you retards!
>>
>>120510905
thank you discord porn addict sister
>>
>>120510916
It's actually too mechanical to be a bot.
>>
>>120510916
>>120510975
thank you discord porn addict sisters
>>
>>120505386
>brahms has 2 prominent qualities all the other composers from the 19th century lack: 1) coherent long melodic lines (only chopin has that); 2) superior polyphony
You really think Beethoven, Wagner, etc. don't have this? The polyphony especially, that claim is ridiculous. But you really think no other 19th century composer, aside from Chopin, occasionally wrote a long coherent melodic line? Did you just start listening to classical a month ago? And shitting on Bruckner, Mahler and Wagner for no reason, you cannot justify it.
>>
>>120510916
>>120510975
I think it's a human whose mind became like that of a bot. A modern tragedy.
We should not hate it, but pity it.
>>
>>120509239
>Any problems?

Your two upper voices are swapped. That's why the stems are overlapping.

I'm not sure why you've doubled the cantus firmus in the bass and treble clefs, but ignoring that, you've got an unresolved leading tone in the upper voice at the end of the first bar and the beginning of the third; you've got successive leaps in the upper voice from bar 1-2 and 4-6; you've got big unresolved leaps in the first and sixth bar.

Those are the main issues. There is another thing called 'beaten' 5ths or 8ves (quinta battuta / ottava battuta) wherein you're not supposed to leap into a perfect consonance with both voices simultaneously as you do at the end of bar 5, but that's far less egregious than the rest.

Hope that helps, anon.
>>
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>>120512025
To visualise the worst bits: here.
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>>120512025
>>120512108
Ah thanks anon. This was my "final" version which I think addresses some of the things you mentioned, but i'll try to fix up the mistakes that are still there (Or new ones I probably created)

Also I doubled the cantus firmus because I just liked the way it sounded more. I dont really know how to get better sounding instruments installed
>>
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>>120512144
>>
>>120511997
thank you discord porn addict sister
>>120512144
>>120512499
total garbage
>>
>>120512541
What? My correction, or OPs counterpoint?
I'mma take a stab in the dark and suggest that the reason you're criticising without correcting is that you're upset that even OP knows more about counterpoint than you do, and they're clearly a beginner.
>>
>>120512568
comically moronic
>>
>>120512578
Mad
>>
>>120512610
hilariously dumb
>>
>>120512568
>>120512610
stop replying you idiot
>>
Reminder to report and ignore shitposting.
>>
>>120512628
>>120512641
rather stupid
>>
>>120509651
Child-like understanding of music and aesthetics
>>
>>120509239
Not good.

Any time you make a leap larger than a 3rd, you need to balance it with stepwise motion in the opposite direction subsequently. You break this rule in the first measure.

You should try to avoid moving to a perfect 5th by leap as much as possible. In measure 5 you have done this despite having plenty of other options. Also at this point the interval between the two voices is greater than a 10th, which should again be avoided as much as possible.

There are many other mistakes but I have better things to do.

You might want to invest in music school
>>
>>120509683
Men 100x smarter than you pondered this over the course of hundreds of years, and concluded that the perfect 4th is a dissonance
>>
>>120513139
>the virgin "well other people said so" vs the Chad independent thinker
>>
>>120513005
I agree, thinking "pretty = good" and "ugly = bad" shows an embarrassingly child-like understanding of music and aesthetics, and is the kind of thing the anime-poster would believe in.
>>
>>120508352
It's because the perfect fifth is the basis of harmonic stability, and as the first partial is so present even in single tones, so adding a fourth above a given root in that context necessarily creates dissonant seconds or sevenths.
>>
>>120513310
>"pretty = good" and "ugly = bad"
Objectively true.
>>
Let me guess, you "need" more.
>>
>>120513827
yes
https://youtu.be/_uM9kaRTwao?t=686
>>
>>120513801
just get a trip so we can filter you, Animeposter
>>
>listen to 50s mono recording
>sounds like shit
>turn on reverb
>sounds good
why did none of you tell me this
>>
>>120513139
Men 100x smarter than me have also said it's a consonance.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=83ytb6AWRAk&t=225
>>
>>120514598
>just get a trip so we can filter you
>we
>>
>>120514598
You also need a trip for the same reasons, two word spammer.
>>
>>120515044
I hate him too
>>
>>120508362
>>120508745
Waiting....
>>
>>120514931
because it's both depending on context.
"dissonance" doesn't necessarily mean "discordant" or "harsh" sounding, it just means it needs to resolve somewhere. A perfect 4th usually sounds like it should resolve to a 3rd.
>>
>>120515116
Feel free to wind the video back. It's his rankings of all the intervals whatsoever.

>A perfect 4th usually sounds like it should resolve to a 3rd.
Skill issue!
>>
>>120515116
Also even the major third is dissonant in the context of an augmented triad and can resolve to a minor third with a fourth on top.
>>
>>120511817
beethoven is not a “19th century” composer, he still entirely belongs in the viennese school, like schubert, that’s why i mentioned the late quartets above.
and the first sign of naïveté is exactly you shapeless taste in which everything fits in, everything is good, and anything can be anything. wagner wrote one one “prestigious” fugue (i still consider it garbage but whatever) , which is that of the meistersinger, the one introducing the brawl (from the second act iirc), he even shitted on the counterpoint and on bach in his completely retarded writings (except the bits about the jews, those are based)
i listen to classical music from the day u was born, i am probably the only one here.
>>
>>120515258
>(except the bits about the jews, those are based)

O no...! and you were doing so well...
>>
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>>120515258
>I listen to classical music from the day u was born, i am probably the only one here.
No, there is another.
>>
Schumann

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NTVgb5tbjD8
>>
>>120513298
>>120514931
>>120515144
>>120515173
this nigga is never passing species counterpoint EVER
>>
>>120515438
Okay? Maybe I don't care? But I followed all the rules to a T on dozens of exercises. Also I know it's you, as you never capitalize the beginnings of your sentences. Also you're a libtard who won't use the hard "r"
>>
>>120515510
lol retarded ass bozo is never ever EVER passing species cuh
>>
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Major third = leading tone = do not double
Perfect fourth = dominant seventh = do not double
>>
>>120515144
>It's his rankings of all the intervals whatsoever.
??
>>
>>120515258
Anon you are retarded, I am sorry...
>>
>>120515896
It's on order from most consonant to least consonant. He calls p4 a consonance, cope and Sneed.
>>
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>>120515544
Don't care, still making music
>>
>>120516060
rather pointless
>>
>>120516168
There is nothing more pointless than these spam posts
>>
>>120513072
>You might want to invest in music school
i will never give you my money
>>
>>120516880
>>120516941
incredibly retarded
>>
>>120516941
Based
>>
>>120515258
>he even shitted on the counterpoint and on bach
You really think the guy who wrote Meistersinger shitted on Bach and counterpoint? He did that when he was a Hegelian, while never denying Bach's genius, yet did a 180 after reading Schopenhauer. Between 1854 and 1883 he basically worshipped Bach and counterpoint.
>>
>>120519565
so true wagnersister
>>
>>120519565
Wtf does a Lutheran composer have to do with an agnostic philosopher?
>>
>>120515258
Glad I'm not the only one who thinks the fugue in Meistersinger is goofy as Fux.
>>
>>120519565
>Between 1854 and 1883 he basically worshipped Bach and counterpoint.
of which there is no trace in his compositions and rightfully so since at least he wasn't some max reger who wrote one thousand of clueless, tasteless, pedantic, ugly fuguelets which only had the purpose to torture his students. and schopenhauer hated the guts out of wagner's music, we know it from his own letters. on the other hand, even wagner's schopenhauer-ism was totally "fashionable" and superficial and i doubt he actually read more than 10 pages of schopenhauer's or hegel's. also it's fake what you write, wagner never spoke well of bach or the polyphonic tradition once. but leaving alone polyphony, wagner couldn't write anything that wasn't opera because his music is literally the ancestor of movie soundtracks and indeed he even "theorized" the gesamtkunstwerk. in his time he was a figure akin to that of some 21st famous movie director. his ring of the nibelung is basically the 19th century lord of the rings (even the literary material is the same, it's probably not casual). now, i love medieval mythology and fantasy, but one thing is tennyson and browning's poems, while wagner's netflix tier librettos are a whole different one.
>>
>>120521288
thank you wagnersister
>>
>>120509069
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oByViX0t-IE
>>
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>>120521288
>The number 1 Schopenhauerian in all of history until a real David Morse in 12 Monkeys comes along and pushes the big red button creating a Children of Men scenario
>Superficial devotion
>>
Liszt

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3nnyPelCpX4
>>
>>120521288
Max Reger is based though
>>
>>120522177
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=VvIQzD5412w&pp=ygUVcm9iYmVkIGJ5IGdlbmUgc2hhbGl0
>>
>>120522927
Based on autism. Guy can't write a melody to save his life
>>
>>120522962
thank you wagnersister
>>
>>120522997
I detest Wagner!
>>
>>120523004
so true wagnersister
>>
>>120522962
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZY9QwK-hutg
>>
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FO3smKY9MXo

Does anyone know what this piece is called? Shazam and other sound-based searching methods aren't able to identify.
>>
>>120523052
sounds like la folia
>>
>>120523034
Lol. Lmao even. sounds like me fucking around on the piano at 16
>>
>>120523112
I see the similarity but still can't tell for sure. Thanks.
>>
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For some reason I have this weird Alban Berg shirt from Old Navy.
>>
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poop eating
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>>120523647
Really, this is important
>>
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>>120523647
h-hot...
>>
>>120523825
Rope
>>
>>120523210
so true wagnersister
>>120523825
thank you tranime sister
>>
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>>120523847
blasting ropes to that? hell yeah
>>
>>120523967
thank you tranime sister
>>
>>120522962
autism is based. if you're not autistic you don't get classical
>>
>>120523227
well many different composers wrote different works based on that theme, so you can look around for that
>>
>>120523951
I detest Wagner.
>>
>>120524260
Gotcha. I'll go on a bit of a search.
>>
>>120523967
Guess how I know you haven't shot a rope in years?
>>
>>120524343
thank you wagnersister
>>
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>>120524528
All you are doing is proving your own lack of taste or discrimination with this bold endorsement of Reger. He is a joke and looks like a bloated toad. There is no Regerian paradigm that stands in contraposition to Wagner. Reger is an eminently worthless composer and only fart-sniffers like you care about him
>>
>>120524592
you've outed yourself as a total newfaggot by replying to the spammer
>>
Please please recommend me pieces similar to the chitty chitty bang bang child catcher's theme. I really really like it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8rdgKCTHmwI
>>
>>120489455
It is a really great piece. Franck's music has a very distinct character uniquely his own
>>
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>>120521288
Read a book dude, you sound like a retard. The entirety of Meistersinger is in a pseudo-Bachian style.

>Whoso would seize the wondrous individuality, the strength and meaning of the German spirit in one incomparably speaking image, let him cast a searching glance upon the else so puzzling, wellnigh unaccountable figure of Music's wonder-man Sebastian Bach. He is the history of the German spirit's inmost life throughout the gruesome century of the German Folk's complete extinction. See there that head, insanely muffled in the French full-bottomed wig; behold that master, a wretched organist and cantor, slinking from one Thuringian parish to another, puny places scarcely known to us by name; see him so unheeded, that it required a whole century to drag his works from oblivion; finding even Music pinioned in an art-form the very effigy of his age, dry, stiff, pedantic, like wig and pigtail set to notes: then see what a world the unfathomably great Sebastian built from out these elements! I merely point to that Creation; for it is impossible to denote its wealth, its sublimity, its all-embracing import, through any manner of comparison.
- What is German?, essay by Wagner

>"How shallow and conventional does the sonata form—that product of Italy—seem in comparison [to the fugue]! It was only by breathing such tremendous life into the accessories of this form that Beethoven brought music back close to Bach."
>Again, of Beethoven and Mozart Wagner said: “As far as fugues are concerned, these gentlemen can hide their heads before Bach. They played with the form, wanted to show they could do it too, but he showed us the soul of the fugue. He could not do otherwise than write in fugues.”
- Cosima's Diaries, record of Wagner's private opinions
>>
>>120527400
oh hey you got one generic and rhetoric exaltation of bach re-edited out of a obvious political chauvinism and made for amateur retards like you, when bach was “a la page” again, vs what he actually thought and wrote to technicians:

Counterpoint, as the first stirring of a sheer Individualism intent on ever clearer utterance of self, began with sharp and acrid tooth to eat into the simple symphonic vocal-tissue, and turned it more and more visibly into an artificial consonance of inwardly-discordant individual utterances—often only toilsomely to be upheld. [...]
If we now picture to ourselves the Drama of the Future, in its realisement of the Poetic Aim defined by us above, we shall find therein no room at all for the exhibition of individualities so subsidiary in their reference to the drama that they may be employed for the purpose of giving a polyphonic rendering to the harmony, through their merely symphonising share in the melody of the main personages.

The harmonised dance is the basis of the richest art-work of the modern Symphony.—Even this 'harmonised dance' fell as a savoury prey into the hands of counterpoint-concocting mechanism; which loosed it from obedient devotion to its mistress, body-swaying Dance, and made it now to take its turns and capers from its rules. Yet it needed but the warm lifebreath of the natural folk-tune to beat upon the leathern harness of this schooled and contrapunctal dance,—and lo! it stretched at once to the elastic flesh of fairest human artwork.

1/3
>>
A step in advance was taken when the general character of the piece itself, whether sad or merry, was hinted in its overture. (01) But how little these musical introductions could [154] be regarded as real preparers of the needful frame of mind, we may see by Händel's overture to his Messiah, whose author we should have to consider most incompetent, had we to assume that he actually meant this tone-piece as an Introduction in the newer sense. In fact, the free development of the Overture, as a specifically characteristic piece of music, was still gainsaid to those composers whose means of lengthening a purely instrumental movement were confined to the resources of the art of counterpoint; the complex system of the "Fugue"—the only one at command for the purpose—had to help them out with their prologues to an oratorio or opera, and the hearer was left to decipher the fitting mood from "dux" and "comes," augmentation and diminution, inversion and stretto.

2/3
>>
This rhythmic interchange and shaping, which moved not of its inner, own necessity, could therefore only borrow life from arbitrary laws and canons. These laws and canons are those of Counterpoint. Counterpoint, with its multiple births and offshoots, is Art's artificial playing-with-itself, the mathematics of Feeling, the mechanical rhythm of egoistic Harmony. In its invention, abstract Tone indulged her whim to pass as the sole and only self-supporting Art;—as that art which owes its being, its absolute and godlike nature, to no human Need soever, but purely to itself. The wilful quite naturally believes itself the absolute and right monopolist; and it is certain that to her own caprice alone could Music thank her self-sufficient airs, for that mechanical, contrapunctal artifice was quite incapable of answering any soul-need. Music therefore, in her pride, had become her own direct antithesis: from a heart's concern, a matter of the intellect; from the utterance of unshackled Christian soul's-desire, the cashbook of a modern market-speculation. The living breath of fair, immortal, nobly-feeling Human Voice, streaming ever fresh and young from the bosom of the Folk, blew this contrapunctal house of cards, too, of a heap. The Folk-tune, that had rested faithful to its own untarnished grace; the simple, surely outlined Song, close-woven with the poem, soared-up on its elastic pinions to the regions of the beauty-lacking, scientifically-musical artworld, with news of joyous ransom. [...] and thus another species of mechanical dexterity filled up the place which contrapunctal ingenuity had left forlorn. [...] The harmonised dance is the basis of the richest art-work of the modern Symphony.—Even this 'harmonised dance' fell as a savoury prey into the hands of counterpoint-concocting mechanism; which loosed it from obedient devotion to its mistress, body-swaying Dance, and made it now to take its turns and capers from its rules.

3/4
>>
There was a time in Germany when folk knew Music from no other side than Erudition—it was the age of Sebastian Bach. But it then was the form wherein one looked at things in general, and in his deeply-pondered fugues Bach told a tale as vigorous as Beethoven now tells us in the freest symphony. The difference was this: those people knew no other forms, and the composers of that time were truly learned. To-day both sides have changed. [...] What with Bach and Händel seems worshipful to us in virtue of its truth, necessarily must sound ridiculous with Fr. Schneider of our day; for, to repeat it, no one believes him, since it cannot be his own conviction. We must take the era by the ears, and honestly try to cultivate its modern forms; and he will be master, who neither writes Italian, nor French—nor even German.

so it's clear what did wagner actually think of bach: that he was important for his nation's musical history, but that his music itself was completely overcome.
and cosima wagner was a well known liar, newbie.
in the end she and wagner just adapted to the new times as they could, as always.

4/4
>>
>>120527640
(and in fact "sebastian bach" is the only composer he saves from baroque music, which was by far the pinnacle of european music - and therefore of music in general) 5/5
>>
>>120527657
*"saves" in that essay you posted, that is, not in general, because in fact he doesn't save bach.
>>
>>120527621
>>120527628
>>120527636
>>120527640
Yes he wrote this when he was a Hegelian, which is exactly what I said, and before he radically changed his philosophy of music in favour of a Christian pietism. He always thought Classical music found its origin in Christianity, but, for the Hegelian Wagner, though reocognising it had led to an incomparable developing of the art of music, he believed it had a negative result. He conflated the disintegration of the individual in metaphysical and religious reverence with the self-effacing effect of Classical music. If you're a pagan, and believe music should instead serve some sort of purpose in society or portraying man, such as in ancient Greece or Scandinavia, this thought process is entirely logical. The main difference being that the later Wagner, under the influence of Schopenhauer, thought this self-effacement, in religion and art, a good thing. His allegiances had been converted to the Christian world of music. Hence his continual praise for counterpoint and Bach and Western music in anything you read AFTER his Hegelian period, which, proper, was only between 1849 and 1854. And even in that period, I must repeat once again, he never ceased to consider Bach a genius. Even before this period Wagner was one of the earliest champions of Palestrina's music, attempting to return its performance in churches, to no avail.

Please stop speaking so arrogantly on things you know nothing about.
>>
>>120525019
I'm actually the oldest oldfag here. I like to.insult the.spammer
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>>120527821
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>>120525102
Mahler 3 first movement
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>>120527703
none of this philosophical MEMERY matters, you are actually irretrievably mentally handicapped if you think a book can impose any direction to a composer's music, as if he composed "as a hegelian" before and "as a schopenhauerian" later, which is the typical way of thinking by people who couldn't tell the difference between a violin and a viola. and in fact he held the same positions for all his life when it come to actual music and composing technique. yes, of course he generically spoke well of rossini once before dying. does it make a rossini enthusiast of him? no, he was the opposite throughout his whole life.
you sound like the typical low iq philosophy reader who thinks he is doing anything more important than reading some book by philip pullman. "learn to solve an integral equation before blabbering of soul", as robert musil said.



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