Moonman editionPrevious thread:>>93966989>New to The Horus Heresy? Here’s Everything You’ll Need to Get Startedhttps://www.warhammer-community.com/2022/05/30/new-to-the-horus-heresy-heres-everything-youll-need-to-get-started/>Official FAQ/Errata/Downloads:https://www.warhammer-community.com/faqs/#the-horus-heresyhttps://www.warhammer-community.com/downloads/#the-horus-heresy>Thread FAQ (very old, remembers Age of Terra)https://pastebin.com/iUqNrrA8https://pastebin.com/8riDmnhS>30k TACTICA & TIPShttps://pastebin.com/Tm2P4QLphttps://1d6chan.miraheze.org/wiki/Age_of_Darkness-Warhammer_30k/2.0_Tactics/General_Tactics>HH1 Black Books<slash>folder<slash>Mm8nlDLR#zBOQhHGcCacWYRSdK7f4oQ<slash>folder<slash>NqlCmSpI>HH2 Rules and Supplements<slash>folder<slash>Mm8nlDLR#zBOQhHGcCacWYRSdK7f4oQ<slash>folder<slash>1rki2Q6D>Miscellaneous Extras (Visions and Old Rules)<slash>folder<slash>Mm8nlDLR#zBOQhHGcCacWYRSdK7f4oQ<slash>folder<slash>Q61izSiS『Adeptus Titanicus and Legionis Imperialis』>Adeptus Titanicus Rules and Supplements<slash>folder<slash>Mm8nlDQ<slash>LR#zBOQhHGcCacWYRSdK7f4ofolder<slash>IukARSLT>Legiones Imperialis Rules and Supplements<slash>folder<slash>Mm8nlDLR#zBOQhHGcCacWYRSdK7f4oQ<slash>folder<slash>Fi9kQSwB>List of Titan Legions with Badges and Colourshttps://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/17Jccq0V--SwJifLVLwbisYnQeqLlS2pMSiPbGXp1Brs/htmlview>More listshttps://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/List_of_Titan_Legions>What size magnets do I need?5x1mm>Tacticshttps://1d6chan.miraheze.orug/wiki/Adeptus_Titanicus/Tactics>homemade missions:https://clawsandfists.blogspot.com/2019/09/matched-play-missions-for-adeptus.html>Thread question:What's your favourite piece of fluff or/and post models.
>>93976033Vgggh...the old days
Having read that Angron/WE novel posted a few threads back, I have a hard time seeing how any Loyalist World Eaters exist in the Heresy. They're so desperate for space dad's approval they literally hammer spikes into their own brains! The betrayed Legionaries could just be those who mutinied on Ghenna angainst Angron.
>>93976203What about terran born warhounds that never had much time under angrons rule and were instead attached to some other fleet
God solar auxilia look so fucking cool but I've always hated horde armies, including tank spam. Is there a viable way to do Elite mechanized infantry kind of like 40k Scions?
What is the firing angle of the hull mounted weapons for the Kratos? It says (Front, Left) and (Front, Right). Do they both just shoot in the front arc or can they shoot on the sides as well? I’m confused.
>>93976312firing arcs are going away with 3.0
>>93976298Veletaris doctrine with the flyer for a dedicated transport. Should start to add up real quick.
>>93976324Sure. But would you please assist me with my question? Thanks
>>93976340nah im good
>>93976312Main rulebook has pictures that specify all the weapon arcs exactly anon. It can't get more straightforward.
>>93976312If you want to go to the source, Page 205 of the core rules.If you want the tl;dr Hull (Front, Right) shoots into the front firing arc and/or the right firing arc.
I'm guessing I'm SOL, but is there any way to point me towards the audiobooks? I got through Pharos, but now they're gone.
>>93976363I have the rule book and maybe I gave it too much thought. But the hull weapons of the Kratos can’t actually cover the entire left and right arc. They only turn like 90 degrees. I guess I still haven’t moved on from the older rule set. Do these firing arcs give the idea that that the tank turns itself to aim at the enemy? Thanks for the insight. That other guy is a massive faggot.
>>93976033Xestobiax trouncing Legio MortisThe Raven Guards final actions on Istvaan VThe Incursion at Xana IIHousr Vornherr holding Ryza Secundus to the last manStorming the city of Endeavor
>>93976203loyalists and traitors are possible in any Legion simply because of the rapid replacement of legionnaires and the already widespread and disconnected nature of Legion commands prior to the outbreak of civil warif a single UM assault company that wasn't called to Calth can capture a SoH strike cruiser and assemble a flotilla in a matter of months, anything can happen
>>93976324so are dice, from now on everything will be a series of coin tosses
>>93976450The firing arcs are an abstraction this edition, they have no relation to how much the weapons on the actual model can move.
>>93976298Like the other anon said, going Solar pattern cohort and running veletaris is a good way to keep things relatively elite, especially if you take some dracosans, malcador tanks and leman russes for heavy firepower. You’ll still be coming in at 60-70 models but most marine armies run that amount of infantry anyway
>>93976325Hmm, 2x40 veletaris sections with 10 command with power weapons, 2x10 with volkite and 10 with Rotor Cannons all in arvuses is already 1630 points, which I'd a good start for 80 infantry. Thanks anon, I'll consider it after I'm done with my night lords.
Question, IK in DAngels you can have a character join a unit that has a different wing, but lets say you have a Stormwing cata praetor with a Deathwing Cenobium unit, would they be able to use a Dedicated Transport? Since the DTs have to take a wing as well, I assume it'd have to be the same wing as the unit taking it, but could a different wing IC board that transport with the unit? Sorry if this is a retarded and obvious question, I am retarded
>>93976547Seems cool. Flyers coming in hot to drop the troopers in contested territories, blasting as soon as they disembark. Reminds me of old school clone wars stuff.
>>93976522It is what it is, but I don’t like it. I miss the old firing arc rules. Made much more sense and was “realistic”.
>>93976469>Xestobiax trouncing Legio Mortis>The Raven Guards final actions on Istvaan V>The Incursion at Xana II>Housr Vornherr holding Ryza Secundus to the last manThese are all impecably Kino, but to answer the thread question >>93976033One of the best pieces of fluff comes from the recent Siege of Cthonia: >You have this old Chad commander of the Imperial Fists called Adamus who promised to a dying Luna Wolf commander that he'd always stood for the pride and honor of the XVIth, back in the early Great Crusade>Luna Wolf commander gifts him a bigass Moonsilver Blade>Heresy happens and the promise can no longer be fulfilled, but the Chad fist attempts to treat the Sons of Horus with a modicum of respect, despite believing they no longer deserve it>End of the siege comes>Everything is fucked>Ashuhaddon and Garrius' armies are in an all-out fight>Word Bearers demonfarm is spamming neverborn all over the planet>Dark Angels are preparing to blow Cthonia to smithereens, killing both traitors and loyalits alike like the fucktards they are>Chieftain Rayeve and the SoH inductii are trying to make an escape to the hive city spaceport, but get overrun by demons>Their desperate vox transmission gets answered and its none other than fucking Adamus, come to fulfill his oath, and to prove that some things matter more than life itself, even in the face of armageddon>Thanks to his help, Rayeve and the Inductii manage to escape, and Rayeve keeps the Moonsilver Blade ever sinceIt's just an impossibly Chad move.
>>93976572Dedicated transports only need to be the same wing as the unit they're purchased for. That's the only restriction, any unit can embark on it after deployment, any number of IC with different wings can join the unit and start deployed inside the transport with them.
>>93976593>Veletaris rushing out of scuffed up Arvus flyers to save the dayTruly the good shithttps://youtu.be/9rUiFIORZy0?si=dHCdJ8LvW8S_s3cS
>>93976618You don't even draw LOS from the weapons anymore, ranges only. If you can draw LOS from any point of the vehicle inside the firing arc it's allowed to shoot, we're already halfway to 40k schrimplification.
>>93976619Siege of Cthonia was so good and then look at what we got later
>>93976625TYVM anon, I assumed as much but I wanted confirmation.
>>93976632>Solar auxilia arrive to rescue a marine battleforce led by knight errants besieged by traitor mechanicum
>>93976636>Raven Guard deliverers being boss and beating the Alpha Legion at their own game>penitent Thousand Sons sacrificing themselves to hold back the demons >5 Legio Osedax double melee warlords charging twenty titans>actual defensive strategy instead of just Big WallGod it was beautiful
>>93976033>tqMy favourite battles/campaigns are Bodt, Isstvan 3 and Prospero. I'm planning to add to the epic armageddon Sarum cohort 8 thanatars so I reach 88 automata and 24 other daemon engines so those reach 44. After that I'm probably getting some tech-thralls and cyber hybrid carnivora. Statlines are mostly homebrew. I'm also planning to do Mor's forces too but so far I only have done some dreads. As for 28mm HH I finished the gun clanner sentinel and I'm mostly waiting for WGA to ship the 3rd party vraksians kickstarter so I can get some bits to convert the other ones with some more 30k-ish looking guns.
>>93976632>>93976685https://youtu.be/7ZnL4mcU5dg?si=MHBQSH6x1dO9x9irKINO
>>93976636i really wonder how much of Cthonia was notes pulled out of old FW desks if everything since has been irredeemably mediocre at best
Do the traitors have cool fluff? The loyalists have a buffet of final stands and noble sacrifices and overcoming the odds at the final hour but the traitors just sort of show up and twirl their mustaches.
>>93977051That's what happens when you start the war with an overwhelming advantage that thr opposing side has to blunt as much as possible no matter the cost in men or material.
>>93977051>The loyalists have a buffet of final stands and noble sacrifices>dying for the (((emperor)))>noble
>>93976619>>Dark Angels are preparing to blow Cthonia to smithereens, killing both traitors and loyalits alike like the fucktards they arethis is legitimately the greatest and funniest thing to ever happen in the settingliterally no explanation or warning unless you've read 1000 novels, they just show up, exterminatus, and leavewhen they turned up in the end of the Martian book I was giggling
>>93976619
>>93976619Rayeve was straight up the best character in Cthonia.
>>93976634do you think this game system that runs on D6s is a good simulation of reality
>>93977658we have this slice of kino in 4k nowhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-y7Faoa9o4Q
>>93977670No, but it's the little things that make it feel more real if you catch my drift
>>93977754Is that Titanicus I see?No, it's not.
>>93977777Checked
>>93976619>>93977653Anyone have the Cthonia book? never read it
>>93977832>https://workupload.com/file/bQUnRYJNxNcI think it may still be here, plus other places like ZlibraryLots of Kino fluff here. I personally believe that the Thousand Sons of Sul Kontep (MVP of the siege btw) are what become the Brotherhood of a Thousand, whereas the Cthonian fists under the megachud Garrius are what become eventually the Marines Malevolent (M32 founding + chapter creed of assholery and pettiness)
>>93977653They are the proof that Lion is the most autistic Primarch. You cannot explain this BS unless it is wired at the genetic level
>>93977754these are great
What is the decryption key for the hh2 rulebooks?
>Angron Primarch book cuts off right before the Russ fight>Kharn Skalathrax novel cuts off before he betrays his LegionI feel blueballed
>>93978287It's over
Man am I just retarded or was the extended nose section of the plastic spartan kind of rough? It felt like I almost had to force it to bend to get everything into contact, which is a new one for me.
>>93978710Lots of large tank kits are like that, had some similar problems with the triaros, just the tiniest bit of warping can cause problems, atleast it’s better than resin tanks.
how much time do you guys spend on your tacs?
Had fun working on these last night. I saw lots of whingeing previously about the Castellax kit, but it's been a blast so far. What are you anons working on?
>>93979174Building Solar Auxilia, the bayonets have been annoying I might just remove the bayonets. Waiting for my airbrush to show up in the mail to get around to painting so I can finally no longe rely on priming with spray cans
>>93979190>so I can finally no longe rely on priming with spray cansThanks phoneposting, I obviously meant longer. Also would make basecoating faster
>>93979190>>93979199Make sure you practice on test models first. There's also some cool techniques that you might want to learn first to use on your army as a whole, not to pigeonhole yourself into one style by painting without using the advantages of the airbrush beyond blocking quickly.
>>93979208Well shit I don't got any spare Solar Aux minis atm... hrrrrm
>>93979213Just get some ETB Primaris off eBay or something. Airbrushes take a small amount of getting used to, but I'd want to get my first few sprays on testers rather than models I want to proceed a project with.
>>93979225Oh that's whatcha meant. I got tons of spare minis I thought you meant to try the color scheme on LOL I'm retarded
>>93979232We're all retarded at this hour anon. Yeah, have a play about with it, work out how your airbrush likes to be used, really get an idea of how to clean it (that's the worst part of airbrushes), work out the PSI that gets you your best results, have a play around with different styles of airbrush painting (i.e. are you going to spray a darker base colour, then a lighter one over the top to keep the darker recesses, or are you going to do purely use it for quick blocking, are you going to use zenithal priming and then spray your basecoat over, or are you going to use it in the fancy wanky ways that youtubers do like spraying yellow over pink?)
>>93979284Alright then, thanks anon!
>>93979174Working through the base color blocking for my Vulturum iconoclast. Bone is layered up, on to the black.
>>93977653>literally no explanation or warning unless you've read 1000 novelsIsn't their exterminatus campaign given an entry on the timeline in the core book?
>>93977653>they just show up, exterminatus, and leaveThis is just the FW writers being hacks and flanderizing the DA. They are the "Final Solution, it never happened but they deserved it" legion, but it's still retarded that they wouldn't have allowed to leave or helped the loyalist survivors of Cthonia, specially when they're mostly IF and Dorn is still alive. There's also that nonsense about the Lion being suspicious about Corax loyalty and Russ having to vow for him, with the RG allowing themselves to be under the DA's command. Or the Khan being now a glory hound trying to kill Horus by himself like Russ.The characterization of the legions in recent FW stuff is waaaay off.
>>93979165Either the absolute bare minimum, which is ten men plus a vexilla, or I go balls to the wall with an AA/phoenix rapier sergeant, twenty bodies, vexilla, augury scanner, bayonets, and an attached AA/phoenix rapier apothecary.
>>93979174Finished off most of my old plastic leviathan for my istvaan 3 boys.Need to find his base but the two dead traitors will add some spice :)Used the new Pro Acryl Magnesium paint for the metals, its like p3 pig iron but better! big recommend.
>>93979590>painting titans without an airbrushI admire your resilience
>>93979676>main writter die of cancer>characterization of the legions in recent FW stuff is waaaay off.Makes you think.
>>93980081It’s a labor of love, and a monument to all my hubris.
One thing Lucius doesn't doesn't get enough shit for is his helping sabotage the Book of Magnus.
>>93980223It’s to be expected that the quality would decrease but not to the extent we’ve seen, it’s like they left some narcissistic pea brain in charge and fired anyone with a modicum of talent or experience.That’s how drastic the fall in quality has been.
>>93980489It's the oppossite, I think. There's no longer somebody with a vision in charge for better or worse. That's why there's so many continuity problems, contradictions, and rules written like the rest do not exist. It stinks of people doing the bare minimum for their job, with the leads having a checkbox mindset because they'd rather be working on Necromunda or Blood Bowl. Even the AT books were written with more care.
>>93979174Very slow going on some assault marines. Low morale but they have to get done.
can't decide if I should give my thallax chain bayonets because they look cool or If I shouldn't give them bayonets because I get to imagine any time they get into melee they are backhanding and throttling the hell out of anyone they can get their hands on
>>93976033Good afternoon Praetors.I want to post updated photos of my Tyrant Siege terminators squad.Mix of recasts, 3d printed parts, GW bits and hand made bits.C&C welcome.
>>93980763
>>93980780
>>93980785
>>93980792
If it has not been said yet, the MEGA has the Martian Civil War.
The diddy mobile now has a pilot. I just need to figure a way to cleanly remove the chaos pads to replace them with MKIV pads.
>>93980800Some interesting conversions. I like how you turned the grenade discharger in to some kind of ass-mounted power pack. I personally prefer the unique helmets from the original kit, but your conversions look pretty nice too.
>>93978287then kharn book isnt really about kharn desu, theres a reason he isnt in most of it. Its about the legion and how they cope, personified in the two captains, the blood priest and the kaedere.That talk between the berserker and the apothecary woman is basically the story writ small I think, where do you go when you're already dead. The palatine blade was also a surprising chad.
>>93979676>, but it's still retarded that they wouldn't have allowed to leave or helped the loyalist survivors of CthoniaBut thats what they are, autistic morons too far up their ass about purity and secrecy for their own good.
>>93979676>but it's still retarded that they wouldn't have allowed to leave or helped the loyalist survivors of CthoniaThey gave a clear warning. If you're loyal, cease fire and get off-world now. Anyone who didn't do that clearly wasn't loyal.
I wish sicarans were better, theyre so cool.
>>93981442Have you tried the sicaran omega? My buddy has one for his dark angels and it's done Murderous things to my vehicles, though it doesn't work on dreadnoughts for some reason
>>93977205>with an overwhelming advantageDid they though? In terms of numbers the loyalists probably had the overall advantage, even with Istvann going how it did, and as the defender they have that massive benefit going for them too. Theres a reason terra went down how it did, and its not just that Horus has daddy issues. For the loyalists it was a desperate last stand, for the heretics it was the culmination of a "swift" decapitation campaign because they lacked the overall manpower for a conventional war with the imperium at large and they knew it.
>>93981454give it brutal(3)
I don't even play HH, but I bought a box of thallax and cataphract terminators today because the models are so cool.
>>93981454I’ve actually had okay experience with it on dreads. Usually 2-3 wounds per round not counting the lascannon sponsons.
>>93981473OK but unironically armorbane should be brutal 2 vs the dreadnought types, and sunder changed to the reroll wounds one.
>>93981483Yeah but there's a difference between "2-3 wounds" and "one shotting a kratos"
>>93981507I mean, I think both of those are pretty impressive for one honky tonky tank.
>play night lords>everyone I play against coincidentally have searchlights, scanners and nuncio on everything>play mech>arcus users all somehow happen to have neutron flux warheads>play blood angels>opponents somehow always have a master of signals to fuck with my deepstrike I'm not ok bros
>>93981462Horus had 9 legions, anywhere from 1 million to 1.24 million marines by most sources.The defenders had 1.142-1.147 milion marines, but lost easily 240k at Istvaan (RG went from 80k to maybe 4k. IH from 113k to maybe 10k, and Salamanders noted as being chapter strength by the end of the war, so going from 89k to maybe 3k or so)This give Horus a significant advantage in marines alone. He also gets the larger part of the mechanicum, and by all counts got easily half the imperial army, if not more. Pile on top better gear, more time to plan, the addition of daemons... The traitors had the advantage in almost every regard.
What was the point of Katsu in the end?
>>93981614The thousand sons had far less than any other legion even before prospero, the DA and UM had more than the others.
>>93981614How many examples are there in the fluff of traitors winning fair and square in a straight fight without the benefit of surprise or backstabbing like at calth?
>>93981614To add to that pre-heresy Horus was already doing logistic fuckery where the traitors elements got the more advanced equipment while the loyalists got shafted.
>>93981501What made you think I was being ironic?
>>93981620curry
>>93981635They were sitting on 89-90k before prospero. More than the raven guard, on par with salamanders.
Everytime I look at the Krios Venator, I can’t stop imagining it shooting out cannonballs even thought I know that it’s supposed to be shooting just thin beams of light
>>93981454Its annoying that it doesent have the pie plate from the deredeo. I get its designed to hunt tanks, but killing elites would have been nice as an option.
>>93981723Im imagining a big wave of light, like something from dragonball.
Starting Mechanicum, how should I equip my Thallax?
I might be stupid, but I looked over Betrayal and did some searching - do we know what the Praetor-equivalent title for World Eaters is? It seems like they jump from "captain" straight to "legion master" with no one in between, where other legions have another rank in there.
>Pg. 89, Character Casualties>For example, if a player selects a Legion Praetor as part of their army and uses it as the army’s Warlord, but that model is removed as a casualty in play and suffers a negative effect and the controlling player elects not to use that Warlord in following battles, then that player would not be able to select any models using the Legion Praetor Army List entry in their next battle.Does this include permutations like the two Terminator Praetors, despite technically being separate listings? Would it be a dick move to just move over to a different type even if it would be valid?
>>93981812Page number is nice, but which book?
Is a venerable dread acceptable for a box naught replacement?
>>93981802centurion maybe?
>>93981819kit-wise?
>>93981818Oops. Martian Civil War, the new book.
>>93981830Yea kit wise. I’m trying to find anything g remotely close to a box naught. What do you think?
>>93981837They're more ornate than the usual for the era but you can pick the less ornamented parts and have no issue. You'll probably have an easier time contacting your recaster of choice to get one of the FW boxes though. Plus you'll have more arm options that way.
>>93981755As with everything in heresy, you equip dependant on the role you’re giving the unit. Thallax are shooting specialists that skitter and scatter all over the place but can also take anti-vehicle wargear and deep strike in to cause havoc in your opponents lines.>If you’re taking 3Small units excel at deep strike guerrilla ops and snatching objectives at the end of a game. Take melta bombs and multi-melta and destroy expensive vehicles with very little investment>if you’re taking 6Take photon thrusters and start on the field, moving up and taking potshots at enemies to cripple them with the blind. They aren’t the main “fighters”, usually acting as a support group for another unit. Good flex unit if you can’t decide what you want your thallax to do>If taking 9Run plasma fusils and go infantry hunting; plasma fusils are infamous for being a menace thanks to secutor myrmidons, and combined with six other lightning guns you can bring lots of pain whilst still maintaining a degree of safety thanks to the shoot-and-scoot rules. Great for taking objectives held by enemies
>>93981802According to Liber Hereticus they retain most of the standardized nomenclature such as praetor, centurion, sergeant and so on, but may append those titles with a honorific that references some martial attribute or accomplishment of theirs. But in short, they still have praetors just like everyone else.
>>93981837If you go with the less ornate options, and make sure to remove any 40k-specific icons, you should be able to make it work.
>>93981812RAI I would say yes, but RAW no. It only mentions army list entry and theyre different entries.
>>93981882Got it. Just trying to figure out what title a character would have had, and just "praetor" works for me.
>>93981812>>93981886I would actually disagree on this one, it specifies same unit entry, and for some legions this could lock you out of RoWs or - in some cases - even HQs altogether. Terminator praetors and PA differ enough that it's not the same unit, and doesn't play the same, so there's a non-zero impact, on a rule that specifies it's optional anyway.
>>93981861>>93981885I can buy the venerable dread kit. This would be the variation I would use. I don’t know if the other head piece is acceptable. What bits would not be allowed besides purity seals. I’m sorry anon I don’t know anything about recasters or what the old FW Kit even looked like with options. I am Salamanders and would need to find a flame storm cannon bit too.
The anti chain factions arguments convinced me to remove it
What a goof.
>>93981925Good news, the same casters that have the flamestorm will have the MkIV Ironclad dread body.I think that setup is fine personally. It's a bit overly Gothic, but it's salamanders, you can get away with a lot as "artifice and decoration".
>>9398192540k specific stuff will mostly be purity seals, and the tendancy towards more ornamental decoration in general. Salamanders can get away with that though. The Crux Terminatus is also a bit iffy, and debated heavily.The other heads might be okay in principle, but you'd want to double check.As for the flamestorm cannon, there are options. Which country you in?
>>93981920>and for some legions this could lock you out of RoWs or - in some cases - even HQs altogetherI dont think there is a legion that only has praetors. But yes, it has consequences, something I believe is the point, you cant "dodge" the negative effect from losing your praetor by just taking a different praetor.As written however, you can, because it specifies unit entry so you just swap unit entry. Your cataprachtii praetor dies? just take him in tartaros and its all good
>>93981812>If I put my warlord in a different armour does that magically heal his wounds?This isn't 40k. We are not primaris level or retarded yet
>>93981620A narrative tool to depict the human element of the siege from the beginning to the end. Conscription, trench warfare, survival against all odds. There's a reason he ends up holding a baby at the end.
>>93981812Why go out of your way to play a narrative campaign if you are going to try and lawyer your way out of the consequences of a narrative campaign?Just play a normal game...
>>93981952>>93981958The crux is the medallion right? I could just chop that off. I figured some of the ornate details would slide because Sallies put a lot of work into their armour and weapons. I have never purchased from recasters and don’t even know where to start. I know you guys have to be hush hush for obvious reasons. I live in the USA.
>>93981462Anon, traitors had every advantage possible.Horus as Warmaster could just send whatever equipment and whatever legion he wanted to wherever he wanted. Because of this Dark Angels were in middle of nowhere and got bogged down for years by night jobbers, this is why Calth worked out in first place, this is why BA were at signum. This is why he managed to convince Russ to kill Magnus bleeding loyalist legion and turning other traitor. Horus also made sure that his legions get all cool new stuff like MK IV first before heresy starts.As for numbers traitors got 8 full legions, Meanwhile loyalists lost 3 legions day one, Ultras lost half of legion in single day, Blood Angels almost fell, but got away only with heavy losses, Wolves bleed themselves out agains 1k Sons, only legions that weren't rekt at the start of heresy were Scars because Horus believed Khan would join him, Dark Angels and Imperial Fists. Mars and half of Mechanicum followed Horus. Game was rigged agains loyalists hard. Only things that went agains traitors was fact that legions started turning chaos and retarded and fact they had to siege Terra that was being fortified for years by guy who is best in galaxy in building castles. But numerwise loyalists lost 3 legions in single batle, and half of most numerous legion in single day, numbers were hard against loyalists.
>>93981981>As written however, you can, because it specifies unit entry so you just swap unit entry. Your cataprachtii praetor dies? just take him in tartaros and its all goodsure, rules wise. But since this is a rule based around the idea of representing characters in a narrative way, there's three ways to play:- My <Legion Praetor> died, let's take a slightly different <Legion Praetor>, nearly no consequence, but you're playing purely gamely, and in that case, why use the rule at all?- <Bob the Slob> got injured, so <Tim the Slim> is taking this battle. He fights different, different weapons, different WLT, more importantly, it's a battle that doesn't go on tom's record. It's not part of his story. The consequences are narrative, as they should be.- <Bob the Slob> got injured, so for the next battle, <Bob the Slob> swaps out his tartaros for Cataphractii. This is you playing gamey for narrative purposes, and you really only cheat yourself.
>>93982020You're correct on the crux, not all recasters are that sneaky - some are actually quite easy to find if you look around - and I'm afraid I can't suggest anything for the US.
>>93981958Many of the decorations are optional and there's several different options for the glacis and shoulders, including fairly plain ones. And considering how decorated some of the legion specific dreads can be, it's not like 30k can't get decorative.
>>93981723>>93981750>The Pulsar-fusil is a multi-chambered particle beam cannon designed to fire volleys of destructive energy bolts that detonate explosively upon impact.I always imagined it firing something like the wraith plasma mortar from halo.
>>93982060>>93982068Thank you for the helps anons. Btw what is the general rule of thumb for any dreadnoughts? 1 per 1000 ya? Even for Castra Ferrum?
>>93981944
>>93981802Either Praetor(Liber Hereticus and LIGMA Beta Garmon) or Captain(Khran is praetor). Heraldy and ranks are a big fucking mess, don't overthink it anon. Worst offenders I think are Emperor's Children, Night Lords and Alpha Legion, liber shows them with "normal" squad markings, then marines in liber itself don't show any of unit marks from previous page and it wasn't used in black books either. Like come AL using stock unit markings.
>>93982186>what is the general rule of thumb for any dreadnoughts?They're cool and you can never have enough of them.
>>93982040>As for numbers traitors got 8 full legions,Anon are you aware that there was an event that lead to the dropsite massacre that left the SoH, WE, EC & DG at 60% strength or less correct?
>>93980763>one poorfag could only afford a piece of tank track as his dick shield>sarge got a launcher for his launcherWhat a silly bunch of goofs, but that doesn't mean they're bad.
>>93982018I mean, all the better to be prepared for either outcome in case you encounter someone else who might pull this off, or another issue trickles down as a result of it. Like the other anon having a point with someone possibly losing RoWs by now lacking a Master of the Legion, that forces a player to make a new list. Granted, the next battle doesn't need to happen immediately after, but may not be the best logistical circumstances for someone to be suddenly put under.Interpreting a new Praetor as a completely different character I suppose softens the blow, but trying to be more inventive and work around the lack of MotL, if feasible - is probably more interesting.
>>93981620Always liked the scene when he’s in the trenches outside of the palace walls and one day a bunch of guys with rad meters are silently walking around the trenches in protective gear and the next day his unit gets issued anti rad pills and medicine without being told much of anything. Something really bleak about it all.
>>93982218Istvaan III losses were rectoned to be much less in Massacre. After purge traitor legions were depending on legion 75% to 85% of strenght
>>93982216I constantly read you’re a tool if you bring 6 dreads in two separate talons. I just don’t want to be a douchebag. I love dreads too but don’t want to cause my opponent to have a bad time.
>>93982315When I hear about that sort of stuff in the context of Warhammer I'm always reminded of the pills in Storm of Iron.
>>93982186Rule of thumb is just be cool. Dreadnoughts are strong, so taking a disproportionate number is going to make things suck all round. 1-per-1000 is a solid starting point, but a melee boxnought vs a fist/melta contemptor isn't exactly equal. Boxnoughts are still painful to kill, so don't overdo them if your opponent can't handle that.
>>93982255I double checked - every legion has at least four sources of MotL - Primarch*, Praetor, Delegatus, and at least one named characters. Some are deep in legends and shit, and it's plausible they lose all those in one battle, but it's less likely.*Primarchs obviously run the risk of the points values.
>>93982358>you’re a tool if you bring 6 dreads in two separate talonsYeah that sounds pretty dull. Your opponent would get upset at you having so few dreadnoughts.
>>93982216Castaferrum my beloved
>>93982408I bring three dreadnought talons and infiltrate them with Alpharius to ensure my opponent gets to experience the maximum amount of dreadnoughts for the maximum amount of time each game.
>>93982408RETVRN
I've nothing to really say about this, it's just that I remember this book was announced a year ago and I thought it was already out on shelves.https://www.warhammer-community.com/2024/09/24/marc-collins-interview-is-the-pen-mightier-than-the-auric-hammer/
>Literal redditors posting on /hhg/
>>93982512Damn, the haft of that thunder hammer has some serious girth to it.
>>93982512>That same hubris that will drive him all the way to Terra, and the walls of the Imperial Palace.Uh, finaly we may see more of the EC during the Siege even if only in flashbacks.
>>93982512jesus that art is embarrassing
>>93982552Bet we'll still hear nothing about what Fabius was up to. Really strange how a number of long established characters, who were part of the story long before HH became a game and a novel series, just vanished at some point during the HH novel series. In favour of tons of OC doughnut steel cringe characters.
>>93982512Art is bad
>>93982512That hammer is way too thick and the arms look short and stubby.
>>93982587There were HH games before Fabius and Lucius. Personally I'm still waiting for Valgo Marter's return.
>>93980940Just my two cents, but I'd replace the beakie helm with another, smaller amp.
>>93982559>>93982660Book covers are ads. For collectors there's also pic related.
>>93982490>no biker dreadnought>no plane dreadnoughtsLame.
>>93982678My bad, forgot about Epic>Death Guards>UM and TS fighting eachother on Rynn's world, the future homeworld of the Crimson Fists
>>93980940You did build a bluetooth speaker into that Rhino to blast hot tunes during a game right, anon?
>>93982723Reminder that we still don't know why Alexis Pollux made the Crimson Fists use the same paint scheme as pre-heresy censured loyalist NL (dark blue with red fists)
>>93982713>take a deredeo>remove legs>replace arms with thrusters>use speeder rules
>>93982512>Marc: I enjoyed building the world of Tatricala as a stage for Eidolon’s pride and his folly. I wanted somewhere where he could have proven himself enough to be exalted by Fulgrim and have that moment loom large over Eidolon’s character arc.I don't like the sound of this. Any depiction of Eidolon being good at his job is a betrayal of his character.
>>93982738Could just be coincidence. The Crimson Fists were founded with the most level-headed Imperial Fists that were the most accepting of the Codex Astartes, so perhaps they choose blue because Guilliman's Ultramarines wear blue. The red fist is because of the IF ritual where Dorn and a marine elevated to a high command position did a blooded handshake.
>single lightning claw + combi bolter/combi weapon terminatorsIt looks good visually, but it's not good, right?
>>93982770You're basically paying the points for shred.I find I have the opposite issue though.
>>93982770Single lightning claw is the sign of evil, the opposite of good. On a more serious note, terminators don't have a pistol or other second melee weapon so a single lightning claw + ranged weapon is decent enough on foot slogging tartaros terminators bullying MEQ troops.
>>93982793>the sign of evilSold.>>93982789>the opposite issueI really like the look of the Cataphractii claws, but most of what I'd throw them at also has 2+ saves, making LCs not exactly great.
>>93982559>>93982660>>93982671Like it or not, anons, that's what the peak male physique looks like. Fulgrim has spoken.
>>93982770It's not like it's terrible but you are giving up having twice the attack of 2 LCs just to get a combi-weapon that is probably not going to perform anywhere near as good. If you regularly fight militia the minor combi-weapons can be a lot more useful but I haven't seen them all that much desu
>>93982707That one is much better.
>>93979165Kino shit man, just started my land speeders myself. Personally anything more than base, drybrush/edge, and shade for each section is way too much, especially in an army like night lords that need 40+ basic infantry to be really viable. Lightning is too good looking though so it’s worth the extra minute making it look good
>>93982820>but most of what I'd throw them at also has 2+ saves, making LCs not exactly great.Terminators are great at killing MEQ with impunity.Throwing them at other terminators is usually only going to end in mutual destruction, there's no point to it...
>>93982820>I really like the look of the Cataphractii claws, but most of what I'd throw them at also has 2+ saves, making LCs not exactly great.I like most claws, I just like them more in pairs. You're not wrong that they're not the best against 2+s, but that's true of many things.
>>93982820The best thing against 2+ saves are things like magna-melta predators or laser destroyer vindicators shooting them from - way over there.
I imagine a large reason thallax want to kill themselves 24/7 probably has to do with the fact they’re forced into using their gun left handed
>>93977051Spreading the Truth brother.Don't you think everyone is just sick of all the lies?
>>93981592Are you telling your opponents what you’re bringing? Counterpicking is a shitty strat but people can’t help themselves
>>93982832One of the few 30k players around here does run Militia, so they'd get at least a little use there.You know what, we'll go for the aesthetic on this squad. I think I still have all the parts lying around. Single claw it is.
>>93982770Finger claws for power fists, wolverine claws for lightning claws.
>>93983205I mean, if you magnetize the combi weapons and actually try to run them primarily as shooting terminators the single claw is no a bad option if you still want to keep them cheap. I'd so this with tartaros to keep them cheaper since they are gonna have to avoid other terminators anyways
>>93977051If you want a traitor last stand, look at the final battle between the Dark Angels and the Night Lords in the Thramas Crusade. The NL were tricked into assembling in legion strength, caught with their pants down (much like the loyalists on Istvaan), fought a desperate battle, but in the end were broken and scattered.
>>939815922 of those problems can be solved with snipers, just saying
I found a reference in Extermination to Dark Angels where they're called Angelis Tenebraium. Did the other legions have names in high gothic? I don't think I've seen any for them.
>>93983329I feel like the old IH decal with the clawing fingers should see more use in HH.
>>93983086All Thallax are lefties. It's why nobody else in the galaxy is.
>>93976469>Xestobiax trouncing Legio MortisWhat did they do?
>>93983498Why aren't they in Ordo Sinister?
>>93981592>Searchlights, scanners and nuncioNone of those remove the -1 BS from night fighting, so you still have that. Scanners and nuncio can be sniped out of units You are fielding snipers in the backstabbing sneaky legion, right? and searchlights are somewhat of a double edged sword, as those also make enemy units ignore the night fighting range limit when shooting at vehicles with them.>Neutron flux warheadsThey're quite shit, breaching 5+ and instant death only does D3 wounds to automata anyway. Honestly speaking they're an utter and complete waste of points when you compare their damage to the regular arcus missiles, so anybody taking them is doing you a favour really.>Master of signalsAgain, snipers. They're pretty mandatory for any list that wants to do anything with reserves.
>>93982701That’s actually genius. Good thinking anon, but I have to troll my IH bro by having one of his dudes under the boot.>>93982737I actually did leave the middle vertical plate out for just that.
>>93983716Excellent work anon.
>>93983648Because they aren't horrible soulless defectives. Not all lefties are gingers, anon.
>>93983868You're right, they should all be put to death instead. Suffer not the sinister to walk among us.
>>93983448In that same bit the WS are Cicatrixe Alba and BA are...Angelis Aima, I think.And seeing how the Space Sharks are Carcharodons Astra, then Space Wolves would be Lupine Astra or something.Lupus Luna became Filorum Horus, like the EC are the Filorum Imperator.Ferrum Praelorum (IW), Pugnii Imperialis (?) IF, Dominus Nox (NL, "Ave Dominus Nox" remember?)Pugnii Ferrum IH, Astartes Ultra (UM as seen in the SM Vidya), Praetors Mortalis (DG), Praetors Corvus (RG), Astartes Alpha (AL)Word Bearers... Verbumforos?Idk about World Eaters or Salamanders
How bad an idea is it to stick a termi praetor with a mob of regular termis instead of a command squad? Double the guys, but worse WS and no Line.
>>93984392Depends on which legion you play. Certain legions can definitely make that work thanks to warlord traits that modify to hit rolls or WS. For all the others you're gonna need a chaplain.
If the dice were to have rolled a different way, which god would the Lion fall to? My bet's on Slaanesh or Tzeentch, leaning on Slaanesh.
>>93984450He would have been the arch traitor.
>>93984497I'm more partial to dorn being the arch traitor
>>93984549Why?
>>93984554Because he liked the fanfiction.
>>93984554dorn is more opposed to horus directly in the fluff, I'd have lion take the role of lorgar if I was faction swapping the heresy.
>>93984572Opposed to him in what sense? Doesn't seem to me they necessarily have anything like the same roles if they switch sides.
>>93984549Nah Dorn is a follower, not a leader. He needs some figure above him to serve with undying loyalty and to accept orders from without question. And the Chaos Gods are not like that, they're more about watching those below them act independently and reward or punish them depending on how much they liked what happened.
>>93984497Didn't the gods actually want the lion over Horus?Like how khorne wanted sangy and slaanesh wanted the khan
>>93984583Dorn in the recent heresy stuff is treated as a rival warlord to horus, it's honestly an angle I like from a historical perspective.
>>93984589I don't think the Horus we see from false gods up to wolfsbane is actually horus, but that's a whole other discussion
>>93984572>dorn is more opposed to horus directly in the fluffWhat made you come to this conclusion? The person who is directly opposed to Horus is the Emperor himself, that's pretty clear. Dorn had no direct dealings with Horus of the SoH until the traitors arrived at Terra and the siege started.
>>93984600He's the rival in so much as Horus is the overall leader of the attacking force, and Dorn is the overall leader of the defending force (besides the emperor) but that's mostly down to their particular strengths. Horus is charismatic, Dorn is a good defender. Switched, neither would fit the other's position.
>>93984615I've always seen the emperor as off the board completely following magnus' folly.
>>93984606Horus is written like shit in the HH novels. He's mostly absent, we never get to see how much of a charismatic leader and brilliant tactician he is suppose to be. Then in the SoT books we finally get to read a little more about Horus, only for him to be stewing in his goon cave overdosing on the chaos juices just to go 'I was only pretending to be retared' at the end. And his tactical brilliance? 'Send in the next wave.' It's an absolute joke.
>>93984645>in the HH novels.Found the problem.
>>93984645I wouldn't even say hes written like shit, he and ferrus both suffer from not getting enough page time to properly develop
>>93984633So was Horus. All we see Horus do is sit aboard the Vengeful Spirit faffing about until the very last moments of the Siege of Terra.
>>93984666I think horus was firmly off the board after russ stabbed him, prior to that he is a piece that is in play, even if he's rarely used
>>93984661How the hell does a guy whose name is in the title of a novel series that's well over 50 books doesn't get enough page time for character development?
>>93984720We don't get much time with Horus before he gets stabbed, like even during horus rising the seeds of corruption are there
Reading Embers of Extinction and the writing is hilariously shlocky with the author trying his best to characterize Perty as a 5D chess player. The narration drops phrases like how Perturabo's logic is "Not the textbook definition of logic – but Perturabo’s logic" and that he "wasn’t afflicted with the disease of normalcy." It has a scene where he reforges Forgebreaker (in his very poorly ventilated workshop) and purposefully fucks up its "perfect" weighting because of a gigabrain contingency plan to surprise any opponent who might grab the imbecilically weighted hammer from him in melee. And apparently he doesn't brush his teeth because they're all covered in sooty grime when he opens his mouth. The story would be boring as shit if not for the unintentional comedy.
Anyways if I am faction switching the heresy Dorn - Arch Traitor Sanguinius - Falls to KhorneRuss - Falls to Tzeentch Ferrus Falls To NurgleVulkan Falls to Slaanesh
>>93984744literally autism
>>93984741There's like one scene where Horus complains about all the byrocrats giving him shit and he gets those visions while stabbed, but besides that his motivations are not laid out very clearly.
>>93984744>he reforges Forgebreaker (in his very poorly ventilated workshop) and purposefully fucks up its "perfect" weightingThat makes sense.
>>93984821Early on there is this very clear plot thread with fulgrim about the humanities clearly being needed amongst the legions but the excess of them also being an issue
>>93984744>gigabrain contingency plan to surprise any opponent who might grab the imbecilically weighted hammer from himUh, "a chain would suffice"?Fr idk why Perturabo has more difficulty wielding Forge breaker than Ferrus, even if he added weight to it.Ferrus wielded it with his bare hands. Perturabo also has Primarch hands, and also servo assisted arms.Technically he should be even stronger
>>93984928Yeah, Guilliman, who is like Howard Hamlin of the setting also thinks about what role his legion will perform after the crusade is over and plans for them to become administrators etc. There are many plausible reasons for the primarchs to have rebelled and I count vainglory and hubris among them. I think the novels that I read didn't capture these motivations very well.
>>93984821>Horus wants to Ted Kachinsky the whole system down The deification of the Emperor and its consequences have been a disaster for the Imperium of Man
>>93984789Ferrus and Vulkan are unexpected, how'd you come up with that?
what number should I stop reading the books?
>mfw I realised that the ONLY brand new unit in the Martian Civil war book was another FUCKING PISSER FISTERWho the fuck thought that loading the Martian Civil War full of Exemplary Battle and Legacy units was acceptable?
>>93985005Ferrus has iron hands, having them rust would be a similar fall to what we see with angron (the nails poisoning him) Vulkan would be a perfectionist and akin to the blade that corrupted fulgrim + the sounds of the temple of laer he would encounter something and then become hellbent on forging perfect objects
>>93984970theres a quote in one of the novels about how most of the legions have a use in a post great crusade world besides the world eaters, they were made to tear this world down not to live in the next
>>93985051I have a conspiracy theory that the Heresy team originally wanted to release rules for all the daemon engines with martian civil war, but the fuckery with those units getting deleted from 40k forced them to scramble and release rules for them in 30k early.
>>93981328>They gave a clear warning. If you're loyal, cease fire and get off-world now. Anyone who didn't do that clearly wasn't loyal.I'm certain it's just a coincidence
>>93985135Weren't the world eaters originally meant to be paladin types? With angry rons original primarch ability being able to absorb other people's suffering
Idk what's the point of the Butcher's Nails. Allegedly it makes violence become a source of dopamine, yet it is the Emperor's Children the ones who get the Murder Boner
>>93985257>Idk what's the point of the Butcher's NailsIt heightens aggression.>Allegedly it makes violence become a source of dopamineI think its more that it punishes everything that isn't violence. Its like this constant source of pain and irritation that only goes away while/after you kill something. Its a torture device, its not very practical. It does however make people act like violent maniacs, which means implanting it in people gives you good suicidal shock troops.
>>93985233That's only fan speculation. What we do know is that the WE had a strong sense of brotherhood and being the masters of close combat massacres, Angron being so loyal to his fellow gladiators he was ready to die with them and never emotionally developing past that moment, and that Angron killed the eldar aspect warriors send to kill him right after crawling out of his crash-landed gestation pod.
>>93985257It removes violent inhibitions, heightens aggression, punishes every moment of non-violence, and inhibits the instinct of self-preservation which can be a huge advantage in close combat. There are historical examples of just going full ham instantly in duels, without considering defending, was a very deadly and effective tactic - the major downside being the number of times a mutual kill happening. Marines being very resilient, being able to recover from grievous wounds, and wearing armour, does mitigate that issue a lot. And with the instinct of self-preservation being hard-baked in over millions of years of evolution, you can't just train and indoctrinate that out of a marine entirely. Something like the butcher's nails would probably be the one of very few ways to overcome that.
>>93985220That's the unicursal hexagram (it can be drawn without removing your pen from the page or retracing any lines); it's used (from the Renaissance onward) in hermeticism and (with a big gay flower in the middle) in Thelema. As a form of knot (which can be tied with any cord), unicursal hexagrams probably trace their usage in non-permanent mediums into deep antiquity (as the string-obsessives of the various ages of Greece would tell you).It isn't the Ulster star and quite honestly I don't see where this conspiracy theory has come from, it's not like those nazi prods can even run their own shithole let alone the world.
>>93983687Man we need a updated Mhara Gal.
>>93985400No.
>>93985334Naw bro there's plenty of marines not flinching and trading otherwise deadly blows with regular enemies. Especially heart shots: they both get stabbed in the heart, but marines have a spare so they live to keep on killing. It happens to Khyr Vhalen vs a Xenarch in 30k, and to Cato Sicarius vs an Eldar in 40k.>>93985272Yeah sounds like the wrong way of doing it. Rewarding violence would be easier than punishing all non-violence.
>>93985454Nah bro, rewarding violence means people will pursue violence until they are satisfied - at which point the violence stops. Deny a person peace unless they are committing violence means they will never stop committing violence in a never ending quest to escape the pain that not committing violence brings.
>>93981328>They gave a clear warning. If you're loyal, cease fire and get off-world now. Anyone who didn't do that clearly wasn't loyal.What a retard thing to ask to the loyalists in the midst of battle. I kneel before such autism
>>93985454Yeah bro it's a torture device, no shit it's not utilitarian for the victim. They go in slaves to make them retard berserkers.
>>93977754One of the few people who makes batreps fun to watch
>>93980345Wait, Lucius does something?
>>93985631The autism of the fists came up against the autism of the dangles, and the dangles wonThe cthonian fists inductii were cool, I wish we got more stories about legionaries that aren't terran or from the legions home planets
>>93985703I'm torn between the nice presentation and narrative feel, and the abomination models they used in the first one.
>>93985454>Yeah sounds like the wrong way of doing it. Rewarding violence would be easier than punishing all non-violence.It depends on what you want. Rewarding violence encourages a participation in violence. Punishing non-violence encourages violence as the sole thing taken. The butchers nails are not a device to make effective soldiers, they were a tool used by the highriders to punish slaves and create mindless brutes for their arenas. Their benefit when implanted into the astartes is that said mindless need for vioelence is very good for brutal shock assaults, because overwhelming violence without restraint or fear for self does have a very real effect. It however carries a plethora of downsides.The world eaters did not become better via the butchers nails, it did not improve their overall efficiency as a legion. What it did was make them share angrons pain, and in doing so alleviate some of his bitterness and hate for his own legion.
>>93981868Corporate-mandated Pickme
>>93985726They were used by the highriders, but not made by them. The nails are dark age tech the imperium can't really figure out - no way some dorks who get massacred by marines made them.
>>93985740No, theyre some bastardized DAOT shit. The neural interfaces of the gehenans were similar (based on the same STC) so who knows what the original purpose is for.
>>93985740Angron's Nails are the OG tech. The rest of the legion's implants were inspired by them, but were entirely made by their own apothecaries>>93985726>>93985684>>93985616Hmm guess so. Idk feels a bit pointless. As if marines had compassion, fear and remorse that the Nails had to suppress. They already had none.
>>93985840>As if marines had compassion, fear and remorse that the Nails had to suppress.Oh, no, don't be silly, that's not the point of them at all. The point of them is to turn people into retarded psycho killers.>wtf but that's stupidWelcome to the DAoT, there's a reason why the Eldar barely bothered interacting with humanity during that period.
>>93985840>As if marines had compassion, fear and remorse that the Nails had to suppress.Sort of? Marines certainly arent "endless aggression". Even with the psychoindoctrination you have self preservation, brotherhood and yes even "humanity" in there.Tell some space marines "here is a crowd of 10,000,000 random people, kill them with your fists" and there would be some qualms as they go about it (and yes, thats basically what happened on gehenna)The butchers nails remove that, they leave nothing but the desire to rip and tear. You arent concerned about honor or duty or your brothers in arms, you just want to kill.It does not make you a better soldier, but its not meant to, it makes you a rabid animal that wants to kill.
>>93985862The eldar were too busy having orgys, they probably were all 24/7 live streaming the war with the men of iron while they smoked warp pcp
>>93985840>feels a bit pointlessThey do not serve a reasonable practical function. They are torture devices for tormenting slaves. What don't you get about this? Why are you criticising the wrack for not serving any good for the health of the poor sod strapped to it?
>>93985862>Welcome to the DAoT, there's a reason why the Eldar barely bothered interacting with humanity during that period.The reason is bad writing bc GWs timeline makes no fucking sense. The eldar should have collapsed before humanity even got to space travel.
>>93985740That's the Black Library lore, which makes no sense given the earlier lore about how the legion was setup. Honestly Angron's story is poorly written because the writer is twisting himself in knots to try to make the emperor look like a good guy when he shouldn't have bothered.
>>93985953Why should they have collapsed?
>>93985917>the wrackWracks are the dark eldar minions.Racks are the torture device.
>>93985953No, the eldar collapse being "relatively recent" is actually great as explaining why the great crusade can be so successful.
>>93985616>Nah bro, rewarding violence means people will pursue violence until they are satisfied - at which point the violence stops.There are a lot of people for who "enough" is never enough, you contrarian psycho.What the fuck is happening to this general?
>>93985988>>93985974NTA but the timeline of the Eldar is pretty fucking stupid. The spend about 60 million years as apparently the more or less galactic top dog after the necrons go to sleep, have no substantive interaction with humanity when they're even more so galactic top dog, then commit death by snusnu, and by the time they show up in the horus heresy books they've already divided into the factions more or less recognisably as they exist in 40k.For a roundup, that's 60 million years of static success tempered by descent into debauchery on one end, all societal development they ever seem to undergo happening in under 500 years, then 10,000 years of static dying-race-itis.
>>93985974>>93985988It makes no sense bc humanity has a massive galaxy wide empire at the same time that eldar do. And eldar are a bunch of degenerates so getting along is not even an optionThey should have collapsed for the same reason but not have Slaanesh be born immediately, have a gestation period as it eats all the souls from the eldar that died in the fall.Like that they leave a power void in the galaxy and DAoT humanity conquers it.In this period eldar can have some time to learn how to deal with the soul stones and all that jazz. Humanity then has it's war with AI and that's what causes their collapse. All the war causes turnmoil in the warp and cuts off the domains from one another. Then Slaanesh is finally born, maybe due to some extra eldar fuckery and that's what opens the path for the ImperiumThen Slaanesh is finally born and fucks humanity
>>93986113We dont know how they interacted with DAOT humanity and I think thats on purpose. But it could probably be somewhat inferred that the collapse of DAOT humanity is what created that total dominance that caused their eventual collapse. The only other power in the galaxy just died as far as you are concerned, of course you just start doing nothing but blow and hookers. Why wouldnt you?The "dark eldar" also existed even pre-fall, theyre just the eldar who left the empire to live in their private webway resorts because the taxman and or space FBI cant get you if you live outside their jurisdiction. The CWE likewise existed pre-fall in the sense that while the path systems werent a thing you had eldar going "maybe murderfucking 24/7 bad" and leaving the empire.
>>93985715The Cthonian fists inductii are probably the Marines Malevolent: early founding, and where else would fist successors get such a callous and spiteful chapter culture?
>>93986113>by the time they show up in the horus heresy books they've already divided into the factions more or less recognisably as they exist in 40k.That's more because of not caring about consistency than being intentional like how chimeras and valkyries are in the books despite some other sources saying they are post heresy.
>>93986177There are several pieces of lore that insinuate some human technology in 40k is the result of joint development with eldar during the DAoT and that DAoT humans were so cut above everything else that not even orks wanted to mess with them.But you can't just say that eldar are ruling the galaxy and humanity is too while eldar are already a bunch of torture enjoying psychos. It really makes no sense
>>93979174Also castellax. Still waiting for my multimeltas to arrive, but I think the drills as siege-wreckers work decently well.
>>93986113Eldar-Chaos lore is inspired by the Elric SagaThe Eldar Empire is a parallel to Melnibone: still top dogs, but much of it has fallen to the Young Kindoms after centuries of apathy and the edgy elves turning inwards, only venturing forth to get what they need to temporarily quelch their base pleasures. Like the Drukhari, who never abandoned such lifestyle.
>>93986175>It makes no sense bc humanity has a massive galaxy wide empire at the same time that eldar doCool, so you had two powerful technologically advanced empires of space wizards existing at the same time for a couple thousand years before humanity terminator'd themselves back to the stone age. Hell, for all we know it was the "triumph" of the eldar empire over the DAOT humans that finally pushed them into full space rapist "we will create a god" mode. Also, all the soulstones and jizz? they only became necessary after slaanesh existed. >>93986202Why not? The galaxy is a big place. Both the DAOT humans and eldar empire were these unchallenged powerhouses, so either they learned to coexist, did have some sort of war going on or simply existed in different places. We know for example the eldar empire was largely clustered around what is now the eye of terror, guess DAOT man simply wasnt there at the time.
>>93986223>Both the DAOT humans and eldar empire were these unchallenged powerhousesImagine thinking that the DAOT were a powerhouse. They were a more civilized species, who often coexisted alongside aliens, unshackled by autistic dreams of totalitarianism and conquest.The Imperium was and is a powerhouse. Aliens all over the galaxy felt the Great Crusade like they never felt any of the DAOT pocket empires of humanity.
>>93986182I like this
>>93986223>Also, all the soulstones and jizz? they only became necessary after slaanesh existed.Yea, and it's weird that Slaanesh comes out of nowhere and they already know how to use them or how to get around their own death like the DE do. The warrior paths too. Like other anon said eldar spend 60 million years doing fuck all and then just figure out all their stuff from 40k in a few hundred years while humanity is already there.We do know humanity ruled supreme during the DAoT they were not going to share the galaxy with what's effectively dark eldar when everyone collectively hates them.>>93986223>Why not? The galaxy is a big place.If at least they would have made the core of the eldar empire be in the segmentum obscuria you could use that as an excuse for them not interacting. But they went and put it right next door to Terra
>>93986254>They were a more civilized species, who often coexisted alongside aliens, unshackled by autistic dreams of totalitarianism and conquest.Yes, and they had technology that the imperium at its peak cant even imitate. The DAOT humans (assuming they were united, which might not be the case idk) were a powerhouse, with abilities and power far beyond what came after. They just werent massive retards.
>>93986182>Cthonian fistsThat’d be a good name for some dudes.
>>93986254>>93986286>They just werent massive retards.And that got them all betrayed and enslaved by the same xenos they were buddy buddy with the second they showed some weaknessAt least they served as an example for why you don't suffer the xenos to live
>>93986280>and it's weird that Slaanesh comes out of nowhere and they already know how to use themThe race of advanced space wizards figured out a problem to a solution? Say it aint so!The eldar know how souls work, the eldar have technology that can steal souls, why wouldnt they figure out how to put their souls inside a stone or to steal someone elses?>We do know humanity ruled supreme during the DAoTAnd we also know the eldar empire ruled supreme between the defeat of the necrons and their own collapse with the birth of slaanesh. >they were not going to share the galaxy with what's effectively dark eldarWhy? Were they going to go to war with the eldar empire at its peak? Or were they going to have their little technocracies in peace while the eldar have orgies at home?>But they went and put it right next door to TerraThe eye of terror is not "right next door to terra". Its in the same half of the galaxy.
>>93986338>And we also know the eldar empire ruled supreme between the defeat of the necrons and their own collapse with the birth of slaanesh.YES, AND THAT'S HAPPENING AT THE SAME TIME AS DAOT HUMANS. IT MAKES NO FUCKING SENSE
>>93986338>The eye of terror is not "right next door to terra". Its in the same half of the galaxy.It's right fucking there
>>93986367Just don't worry about it?
>>93986330>And that got them all betrayed and enslaved by the same xenos they were buddy buddy with the second they showed some weaknessno the Men of Iron fucked them up and hostile Xeno powers, who have always treated out groups poorly, took advantage of their weakness.There were xenos that still lived with humanity in peace who wer killed in mass during the Great Crusade and some of the bastards were deviant bastards that fucked and created new hybrid strains with their human allies. The Proto-DE still took slaves to fuel their parties, greenskins still looked for scraps, and overtly predatory Xenos still used humans as livestock.
>>93985125Anon Ferrus is literally Fulgrim's counterpart and IH are mirror of EC. This is why they are so frieldny with eachother despite being diferent, both are perfectionist who want to be the best, just Ferrus and IH are more crude about it while Fulgrim and EC like to look pretty while being the best. This is also why 40k IH are turbo autistic about augmentation and using only cold logic, because flesh is weak so they can't be perfect marines with only flesh.
>>93986367Daot Humans were not a united group and if you're implying different military powers cannot coexist at the same time you're retarded. Krork and Eldar also existed at the same time why aren't you bitching about that?
>>93986367>IT MAKES NO FUCKING SENSEOnly if youre a moron who thinks the eldar empire was just the imperium but with elves and the DAOT was just the imperium but with non-lobotomized humans.
>>93986524>Krork and Eldar also existed at the same timeIs there any indication the krork survived the war in heaven as any sort of unified/collective power? It seems like they were basically spent and abandoned in the war, leaving the orks in their place
>>93984789>>93986520Seconding, IH are entirely slaanesh, its the pursuit of perfection, except through artifice instead of flesh. Russ is also entirely khorne, dudes a bloodthirsty retard. I get its fun to juxtapose him vs magnus with the tzeench thing but he has nothing going for him in that area. Hes not a plotter, hes not a visionary, hes not a psyker, dude just likes hitting things and war, and if he falls its going to be because he wants to do his viking war stuff on the galaxy at large without someone holding his leash. The tzeench "loyalists" are probably the DA, if not the lion himself, with their focus on secrecy and esoteric orders and forbidden knowledge. Probably a mortarion:nurgle situation there. Either that or the Lion is the archtraitor since Dorn is too much of a "number two".Guilliman would also rather suit tzeench actually.
>>93986574I'm going to throw in a wildcard and say Sanguinius - even if everyone aligns him with khorne - might end up being the arch-traitor. He's almost as good at everything as Horus, and probably surpasses him in charisma.
>>93986611Yup, Sanguinius could also be archtraitor, him, lion and bobby G could all fit that role. Although the G man might be more suited for lorgars role as the spokesman and bureocrat rather than the overall leader.
>>93986611>He's almost as good at everything as Horusno he fucking isn't, Ferrus and the Lion are.Everyone likes Sang because he's so "Noble".
>>93984789Mostly bullshit.>>93986574Archtraitor would be Sanguinius, Both Khorne and Slaanesh want him in heresy and Horus want him dead not corrupted because he is afraid Angel would usurp him, everyone loves Sanguinius and would follow him, unlike Dorn who is autistic and not very liked, he was loyalist Perturabo - being a bitch.As for Nurgle, Salamanders and Vulkan are "pure" Deathguard, they have same specialisation and are simlar but Mortarion loves every warcrime toxic weapon while Vulkan loves purification by flame. Ultras are WB equivalent, fanatical numerous, highly ideological, using mortals.Only tricky one would be Tzeentch, TS were tailor made for Tzeentch, legion of psykers with turbo mutation, no other legion have this trait, maybe BA a little but BA fits all chaos gods and Sanguinius works better as warmaster. I think Scars would be Tzeentchian, at least they were second most psyker heavy legion after TS. DA kinda works better as Al equivalent, super secretive and overall good, but instead of their own secret stuff they have Emperor's secret stuff.Wolves are Khornates 100% angry vikings(furry) who don't like psykers and cope about their rune priest not being psykers.
>>93986634I could see Guilliman preaching the logical reasoning for a possible rebellion.Or, if you want to take existing mirrors - have Corax mirror Lorgar. Instead of truth, freedom.
>>93986638Anon, point of Horus being Warmaster was fact that everyone liked and respected him. Only other Primarch that could lead rest of autists was Sanguinius. Ferrus, Lion Guilliman wouldn't be able to command characters like Angron or Alpharius, hell Guilliman had feud with Alpharius over his strategies, because it wasn't bobby's G way.
>>93986638What aspects do you think Ferrus and the Lion match Horus on that Sanguinius doesn't?
I was gonna post this when you were talking about dreads but I forgot.
>>93986795Very nice
>>93986827It just kinda drives home how James decided that quality Legion contemptors were just not gonna exist anymore.
>>93986841A shame
>>93986847It just keeps piling up, doesn't it?
>>93986858Yes, this bubble might pop eventually, but today is not that day
>>93986867For the Emperor.
>>93986872For the Emperor
i thought i would like the drop site massacre losers more after reading their books seeing how mid the resin uniques arei somehow actually like them lessih and rg fellas how do you do it
>>93986885RG player - I really like the Dark Furies, I'm 50/50 on the Mor Deythan, and I always liked classic Mark 6, jump packs and lightning claws. The inherent theme keeps me going, even if the fluff is... limited.
>>93986895thanks browhat does your army list look like?i respect you as a fan at least, probably have to make a lot of the fun yourself
>>93986914It's a bit variable, I'm quite slow building and painting, so I don't have a set list, there's some ad-hoc blu-tac kitbashing to fill in the gaps.I've currently got a couple of characters (a praetor, a chaplain, one terminator character who's either praetor or something else as needed), my core troops are a tac squad and an assault squad (I know they're mediocre, but it's jump packs dammit), some seekers, some dark furies, and I'm working on my terminator squads now - an all-talon deliverer squad, and some tartaros.I'm pretty light on vehicles at the moment, mostly holding out for plastic storm eagles.
>>93976619Of all the stupid shit to come out of BL. Of all the embarrassing crap to be written and all the weaboo shit to be canonized, Fafnir holding off the counterattack until he picked up an Imperial Standard to fight under was absolute kino.
>>93985731I thought so too before actually watching her, but the true pick me is the orange chicken if you’re going by the actual definition instead of just by looks.
Anyone know how bad the Mastodon build is? I got the hunkering for it after realizing that it'll fit the rest of my force that doesn't have an assigned transport inside of if perfectly, and it'd make a nice superheavy capstone to the project. I've done a brass scorpion, so it won't be my first resin superheavy at least.
>>93986876I remember the imperium as it was meant to be, as it could have been.
>>93987043Over
>>93986738Horus was Warmaster because he was the greatest, had seniority in the field, and knew how to manage people effectively. Sang was likeable not respected for his ability. Ferrus and the Lion were respected for their ability but hated because they were autist that didn't give a fuck about social niceties and having cordial relationships with others. Bobby was viewed as a tryhard and Fulgrim was a cunt. Every other Primarch had major ideological flaws that prevents them from being contenders to the position.>>93986747You mean other than seniority and superior generalship? Sang had the ability to speak pretty words and inspire others. Those are not traits that you want in your wartime leaders, it's something you want as a Line officer to inspire troops or due to his nature someone working in Civilian Affairs. All of that is secondary to Sang being a filthy mutant witch.
>>93987138>You mean other than seniority and superior generalship?Seniority mean very little, as for superior generalship, which you fail to define, I see no obvious evidence that Ferrus or Lion were necessarily superior to Sanguinius in that respect.>Those are not traits that you want in your wartime leadersThose are precisely the traits that made Horus warmaster.>All of that is secondary to Sang being a filthy mutant witchBoy, you're not ready to head how primarchs are made. But this line tells me you have no interest in an actual conversation, so have a nice night.
What are some good books or lore bits for Solar Auxilia factions? I'm having such a hard time deciding on a paint scheme for them, whether I want to do a canon one, or paint them as sci fi grunts from another franchise. I really love their vehicles.
>>93987193There are none.
>>93987193I’m having a hard time struggling to pick a color scheme too but for the opposite reason, I really like the lore of the Lord Marshal’s Own, and I like how the Manachean Bulls are from a semi autonomous micro empire like Ultramar (but smaller ofc). there’s also always the option to paint my own dudes but I have no clue how I’d paint them
>>93987193>>93987210Camoflague. Fuck the uniform.
>>93987235Eh, I was gonna do cano on the tanks and any fliers but IDK if I want the infantry to look like that, however Camo Solar Aix might be quite the look… but I’m not sure if I wanna do it
>>93987250Do it.
>>93987250*camo not cano, sorry am phone posting
>>93987235>>93987199Good points then, time to homebrew! I like the camoflague idea, maybe the solar auxilia get USMC uniforms...>>93987210It's a way harder thing that "Oh I love X legion, I shall paint X legion". I'd say Lord Mashal's Own in your case, since lore is usually more fun than just their origin personally.
>>93987256The biggest problem with camouflage is it can’t work on all boards, and that would bother my autism. IK basing has the same issue but that’s not 99% of the piece so it bothers me slightly less… but maybe
>>93987266Lord Marshal’s Own is cool so you’re right I might go with them in the end, my cohort doctrine army list wise is exactly the background that the Agathon Dominion Cohorts (the Lord Marshal’s Own ones) so maybe… Biggest “issue” (nitpick) is that they use Dracosans a lot and I don’t like Dracosans by literally who cares right?
>>93987283Yeah, you can always say that they used the Dracosans to get to the board if you needed a fluff reason for them to not be fielded.
>>93987267That's a personal problem. You adhere the camouflage to your base and if it doesn't match the game board that is because the game board's creator clearly had no imagination.
>>93986885What about us Salamander bros?
>>93987138Anon Horus quite literally pointed to Sanguinius as being only other candidate for warmaster and during heresy Horus was legit scared of Sanguinius falling to chaos and upstaging him as new warmaster of chaos so Horus ordered Sanguinius killed and not corrupted.It was given to us straight.
>>93987293Yeahhh>>93987295It is a personal problem, as I mentioned, which is why I probably won’t go with it… but it sounds cool. Maybe I’ll do Urban Camo, which is what I was gonna do on the tanks it side of small heraldry near the front
>>93986895Do you see any use for Breachers in a RG list? I have a bunch and am trying to settle on a Legion.
>>93987026It's quite annoying, but not the absolute worst. The floor is the hardest part as it's split into 3 parts with uneven detailing, meaning you have to eyeball straightening them. The fit of the rear door is iffy and mine snapped off the first time I tried to open it, but some 3mm magnets salvaged it.
>>93986182It's heavily implied that Crysos Morturg would go on to found the Marines Malevolent.
>>93987317canon fodder
>>93986885Autek Mor aka Moonman, this thread patron saint. He droped moon on World Eaters homeworld and he used moon because during his genocide of traitor worlds he ran out of nukes.
>>93987317They suffer, as too many units do, from gaining almost nothing from the LA. rerolling 1s to hit in melee is a relatively minor melee buff on a non-melee unit. Outside of that, they still fill the same roll as in any other legion, and you could definitely use them as a bit of an anchor force to keep the enemy distracted until deep strike arrives.
>>93987326So just walk them up the middle while the Mor Deythan, Dark Furies, and Deliverers do work? But which ROW? Also, how do people get Deliverers into the thick of it in the Decapitation Strike ROW?
>>93987339>how do people get Deliverers into the thick of it in the Decapitation Strike ROW?They're one of few terminators with in-built deep strike. And can go high enough in terms of squad size to fill a spartan. Both can work.
>>93987335see >>93987339I replied to the wrong anon. The RG rules from 1.0 were much better and simpler.
>>93987344Thanks. I missed that they don't have deep strike. RG really got shafted with weird rules interactions and no characters/unique consuls.
>>93987317It's criminal that Breachers can't equip Power and Charnabal weapons once per five models, nor swap their bolters for chainswords.
Question, if a drop pod scatters and lands on a unit, what happens? Does the drop pod fail to come in or does the unit have to move?
Man, the local event organizer for Age of Darkness is losing his *shit* that we had a Legions Imperialis event with more people than his. He's been complaining about LI nonstop, about how it's taking resources away from Age of Darkness, and he talks about how the reason Age of Darkness is so good is because everyone plays marines and uses the same units. Like he actually thinks mirror matches are a good thing. He's been calling people who play Auxilia "WAAC" because of how well they do in LI (NVM Astartes won the last event).I can't imagine wanting to play big Heresy at this point. LI just seems to have a chiller community.
>>93987401No Titanicus players around you, huh?
>>93987401Why can’t people just have fun and not worry about that shit? Sounds like the reason he doesn’t get more is he sounds like a prick.
The first Seeker Squad under Sergeant-senioris Sar Ywain with accompanying apothecary. A Calibanite recruit, Ywain's first deployment was to his homeworld's hinterlands to assist with clean up patrols tasked with cleansing any remaining beasts that had managed to evade The Lion's Great Hunt. Returning successfully, Ywain became one of the last Calibanites to earn the right to bear the honorific 'Sar,' an object of great respect and envy among the Calibanite contingent of the Legion. Highly regarded for his marksmanship and charismatic leadership Ywain advanced rapidly through the ranks, his destiny seemingly primed for higher command.All of this ended with his transfer to the 11th Order. Despite its status as a veteran formation and its long history of service, the 11th Order had garnered an ill omen among the more career-minded members of the Legion. It was rare that the hardened veterans in command positions would fall and rarer still for a member of the 11th to be transferred or promoted to an outside Order. If he shared any misgivings at his new posting, Ywain made no sign, remaining focused on the campaigns at hand and his skills at war. Ywain's skill with the bolter saw his elevation first into the Seeker cadre and then to sergeant of his own squad. By the outbreak of the Heresy, Ywain had risen to the position of Sergeant-senioris within the Seeker cadre, and was also known to hold positions as a Proctor of the Firewing and Cenobite of the Order of the White Feather. Ywain's fate after the Heresy is uncertain; while there exist a few scattered references to the marksmanship of a "Sergeant Ewaine" of the Lions Sable, it's uncertain if this is the same individual and no formation by this name is known to exist.Finally finished painting my first squad of Seekers. It only took me so long to get around to that this is no longer a great load out and the sarge now has an illegally-large hand.
>>93987447the dangers of masturbating too much
How noticeable is the scale increase between minis from 1.0 and minis from 2.0? I mean the original plastics and resin versus the new plastics.
>>93987447Cool models and backstory anon, although I'm pretty sure Power Fists are still legal for Seeker sergeants?
>>93987473
>>93987475Yeah, but you have to trade away their gun. Or their chainsword, which you get by trading their gun. And I'd rather have another Combi-plas than a Power Fist.
>>93987482
>>93987475yeah but you've got to exchange a kraken bolter or chainsword for them, and the only way he can get a chainsword is via exchanging his krankenboltergunnen for it>>93987447eh, you can still swap the bolter for a decent pistol
>>93987482The troops are noticeably different. Too bad. I have a lot of the original mk 3 and 4 guys.
>>93987298i like youdoubly so if you use the og camo pattern color scheme
>>93987722To be honest, it’s funny you mention that. I’m wanting to work up towards a close to 100% Subterranean Assault force with like 10-12 termites. Maybe throw in a dread or two. All in memory of the Assault on the Tempest Galleries. Not sure how I would pull off that scheme. But I think you might have convinced me!
Now that the plastic robots have started to roll out, what legions make them work best? Wanting to do a list using a forge lord/ praevian or even brethren of iron. what makes them work well enough to make a robot worth taking outside of mechanicum?
>>93987401Sounds like that AoD event organiser is a dipshit. Locally the HH community is very chill, everybody likes to see more army variety now that SA and Mech have plastic models.I refuse to believe any sane person can take one look at the SA rules and claim they're a WAAC army. You can barely call them functional, all SA got going for them are vanquisher cannons.
>>93987821non, desu.
>>93987418They're around, some of them play LI too.
>>93987824NTA but I’ve been debating taking a Rapier Laser Destroyer Tercio in my army to replace vanquisher leman russes since I’d like to have every unit be an infantry one, but is it not worth it over vanquished russes?
>>93987859must be nice
>>93987824>>93987863I think I wasn't clear enough, he thinks Auxilia *in Legions Imperialis* are a WAAC army. He has said, though, that Auxilia should be underpowered in Age of Darkness, and that if any Auxilia player is regularly winning it means they don't care about the fluff.
>>93987863The amount of firepower is real nice for how cheap they are. But generally rapiers die real quick once people figure out how much damage they do - and that's from my experience with marine rapiers. They're basically a glass cannon unit, even more so because they can't use reactions like Evade to try stay alive.
>>93987910Sounds like the definition of a CAACfag.
>>93987821Paradoxically, Iron hands and Iron warriors, both legions who are already sworn bros with mechanicum, also have some of the best Legion rules to Buff Castellax and thallax. Night lords thallax very easily outnumber other units thanks to Brutal 3. Imperial Fist mauler Bolt Cannon and Maxima bolter Castellax get full +1 to hit, and ultramarines can pair them up with a buddy to get the same bonus.
>>93985714Yes and no. He fights a duel to first blood as a distraction for another guy to do something. The duel itself is not written out on page. And Lucius lost the duel, naturally.
>>93987953>Paradoxically, Iron hands and Iron warriors, both legions who are already sworn bros with mechanicum, also have some of the best Legion rules to Buff Castellax and thallaxThe irony.
In regards to earlier in the thread, is it out of fluff to paint my Salamanders the old Rogue Trader scheme? Or should they all be green?
>>93988021do whatever you want
>>93987325Where do you get this lore that Morturg founded them?
>>93987821>IWThallax and Castellax have an easier time popping vehicles with +1 to penetration rolls>IHMakes their robo's extra tough against shooting with the -1 strenth to incoming fire>SWWS5 Vorax and WS4 Castellax>IFMauler Bolter Castellax's shooting on 2+>NLBulky (3) on Thallax means they're usually always adding +! to wound and penetration rolls
>>93987821I don't think brethren of iron is worth it unless you REALLY want that Thanatar.
>>93988144brethren would be interesting if the robots all got the legion traitbut yeah, as it stands you could just take an allied detachment
>>93988179that requires a bunch of extra models that don't necessarily appeal though.
>>93988186having a magos to make your thanatar be able to react is a small price to payand thallax are one of the better, if not best line options in the gameyou have to pay more points "unit taxes" with brethren than with an allied detachment
>>93988349>>93988349>>93988349
>>93987473Check out minicompare.info>How noticeable is the scale increase?Depends on the model but for the line troops they tend to be somewhere between half a head and one head shorter than the new plastics (depending on pose). If you're concerned about mixing old models and new models in the same army don't be, the difference isn't very noticeable from tabletop distance.Tactical rocks & corkboard are also options for those who are self conscious about the height of their toy soldiers.
>>93987932Damn shame, I wanted them mostly to be infantry cannons since I wanna do infantry only, but Vanquisher Russes can be my cavalry whatever. Sorry for su ch a late response I’m painting a room right now
>>93988198might just rock an allied detachment then. thanks
>>93986638>, Ferrus and the Lion are.The lion? He has the charisma of a doorknob but is otherwise a contender, powerful warrior, highly driven, skilled general and planner. Ferrus? Ferrus is just peter turbo 2.0.
>>93987554Then why do you need the new ones?They are shit kits in comparison
>>93983648kek
>>93986177>We dont know how they interacted with DAOT humanityThey didn't care about them at all, and destroyed them by accident.
