More scifi settings need Laser Swords.
>>97078536I'm partial to how they did the laser rapier in the System Shock remake.
>>97078536I personally prefer the idea of an energy field on a solid object rather than a purely energy blade.
I'm currently part way through a book series where the rarest weapons are swords made of an engineered exotic matter that is capable of severing the fundamental attraction between molecules. The end result is a physical blade that can cut through any matter that isn't something else fundamentally unnatural like long chain carbon structures.
Thread hijack but it's an inevitable topic: The whole gun vs. sword debate that always comes up in sci-fi type settings is the dumbest thing I can imagine but only because of the mental gymnastics to justify the use of using anything that isn't a gun but it mostly seems to come from the idea of having the weapon as the only thing the PC (or anyone else for that matter) uses to the exclusion of anything else.
>>97078536Star wars forever tainted the idea of laser swords.
>>97079509If you want melee weapons you just need to bite the bullet and have Dune style shields.
>>97079509Guns on space ships is a bad idea, especially if the guns are good enough to penetrate the hull.
>>97079651You really don't, but that obviously depends on the flavor your sci-fi happens to take on. Some dude slaughtering street filth and civilians might as well use a blade along with a pistol because he's not expecting a threat and just keep it right in its sheath and use a more conventional weapon if faced with someone that is actually dangerous to them (or at least they don't underestimate).>>97079688Yeah but are we always in a spaceship? You could pull something like Outlaw Star where Gene and Hilda were in that station where they couldn't use their guns but plasma torches and paint ball guns are apparently fine. You'd imagine people would be carrying knives and other such weapons for obvious reasons.
>>97079718The best answer I have seen is personal shields that are extremely resource intensive to produce. So officers and elite troops would have shields but massed infantry would not.
>>97079509Could be a space boarding party tool rather than a purpose built weapon. Cutting through hulls and bulkheads and maybe enemy crew if they don't surrender right away. Had an idea for a hand-torch like in Alien Isolation, but with an adjustable head so you could hold it like a combat knife in an opposed boarding action.
>>97079688The idea of space boarding actions is fairly retarded to begin with. Assuming a very large craft which needs internal policing for a moment, frangible bullet guns will beat batleth enjoyers 10 matches out of 10. Also, if you look at real life ship boarding actions this applies. Orbital-build ships will have heavy hulls and self-sealing systems (micrometeors). You won't shoot through that. So the only thing left is stuff like fuel and vital machinery, which can be avoided by modern SEALs just fine or repaired after control is retaken. And on the gaming front the whole attraction of sci-fi is that I get a cool weapon not a sharp stick. Melee is for gay retards who want to wrestle bears (not the animal).
>>97079743As much as I love Dune the fact that "lol Dune shields" has become a thought terminating cliche is as soul crushing as it is devoid of any creativity because any downsides are intentionally left out and not factored beyond the fact that using lasers turns them into nukes.
>>97079796Personal shields that block guns but not melee are only as uncreative as the person writing the setting.In the books I mentioned here >>97079467, personal shields are hard countered not by energy weapons but by AI powered snake-like drones that the enemies of the main character use as supplemental ranged weapons. The snakes are thrown and then seek the nearest warm body, burrowing through armor and into flesh, making them effective against unshielded targets. If they hit a shield they just bounce off, hit the ground, then attempt to slowly crawl through the shield.
>>97079835What book series is this suppose to be? Regardless, I think I would have something akin to Mass Effect where the shield probably only covered the vital parts of the body and wasn't the end all, be all aspect of defense.Then again, the same tech that made the shield also allowed you to make a quick use blade even with the cerberus ninja fag boy.
>>97079860https://www.goodreads.com/series/231285-the-sun-eater
>>97079761Have industrial tools function as weapons.
>>97078536What is a way to implement laser swords in terms of practicality and plausibility according to scientific knowledge and theories?
>>97079979Keep personal weapons tech at or below WW1 levels.
>>97079373>dismembered by a clear sexbothow embarrassing
>>97079979
>>97079835>but by AI powered snake-like drones that the enemies of the main character use as supplemental ranged weaponsHoly shit this is retarded. A tiny flying drone with a bomb makes infinitely more sense
>>97079718>>97079763It's less about actual factual realism, and more about a justification that will shut the non-autards up.
>>97080044>a clear sexbotthe only difference between assembly line drone, murderbot, and sexbot is the firmware
>>97078536Do energy swords count?
Ladies and gentlemen, and those that lyeth betwixt or beyond... GURPS.
What will really start fights in sci-fi is explaining that regular smokeless powder guns of today will still be in regular use and not lasers as personal weapons in the future. Well, contingent on certain assumptions about manufacturing anyways. Even with very optimistic tech like SMES a regular gun is just really simple, effective, and as powerful as you want. Maybe if SMES are ubiquitous and precursor chemicals used in gunpowder are more controlled than inert metals and silicon and SMES are as common as any other battery then maybe coilguns would be more common? But bullets are still safer and probably still simpler to manufacture and store than SMES and the slugs or darts or needles a coilgun would use, not to mention the fancy electronics needed for a more exotic gun. Maybe a portable laser gun would make sense since all you need to worry about for logistics would be>can I replace lenses on this easily, and store them for transport>can I easily get electrical power to recharge this It's very sad for exotic weapons enjoyers.
>>97080361What's really gonna bake your noodle is when you discover explosive-tipped crossbow bolts...
>>97080378Low rate of fire is less appealing. The bolts are larger and thus more difficult to store. Form factor of the weapon makes it difficult/impossible to conceal.You can justify moving away from regular guns if nobody builds explosives, since the precursor chemicals are similar and you'd be using the same supply chains for your nitroglycerin. Then again... why wouldn't you use nitroglycerin? It's not that hard to make and the components are pretty fucking abundant. And it's useful in construction and mining. So, you probably can't? Unless you make some special fancy super cheap armor extremely common of course, because otherwise guns are just generally simple, cheap, effective, easily stored, easily concealed, easily supplied, etc. It's very irritating.
>>97080352Ew. That's gay.
>>97080286sci-fi is just an aesthetic veneer you put on the story
>>97078536Made one for a specialized tool in mage the ascension for my 'totallynotaprototechnocrat' mage for when he's not blasting lasers beams and microwaves. Currently it's a little thrown together so I'm using some early NMH beam katanas as references, but i want to upgrade my tech soon and I'm not sure if i just want to move up the NMH upgrade tree.
>>97079979>Entire genre built around 'what if X impossible technology was possible'?>'tismanon pops in>IT HAS TO BE PLAUSIBLE ACCORDING TO SCIENTIFIC KNOWLEDGEVerne and Wells didn't write the first contemporary sci-fi stories to talk about 'realistic' shit that happened to be set in space.
>>97078536Since when did Dead Space have laser katanas?
>>97079872Go to bed, Chris
>>97080615It's not just that laser swords are impossible, it's that even if they WERE possible, swords are just not worth it if guns are an option. Ranged weapon superiority over melee is what cost the fucking Neanderthals their grip on Pleistocene Europe, that's how far back this goes, and space is LITERALLY ALL TRAJECTORIES. That's how orbits work!So if you want laser swords to work you need to crank the players' access to guns down to, like, Japan and England level, death penalty for posession style.
>>97078536I think HF blades tend to work better, but can't deny it looks badass.
>>97078536Talk about it in the worldbuilding general.
>>97079509anon, all you need to do is balance their statse.g.Laser: 2 damageLaser sword: 2 damage + strength (2)Average HP: 8At range it takes 2 turns to get into melee against a laser gun user.Done. That's all it takes. Tweak to preference and add all your other flavoring and options on top. Maybe make Long Range weapons suck in Melee. Whatever.You don't need any lore justification or contrived mechanics. Just put the sword in the game and make it good.
>>97081137I was about to argue against Christ posting on /tg/; but after thinking about it, he absolutely would post here
>>97078536The necromorph fears the engineer
I’ve never understood the whole idea of having a laser sword as a separate weapon to your gun equivalent in a sci-fi setting. If you can miniturize a laser/light/beam emitter into a handle, why wouldn’t you just make it into a bayonet with a pistol grip button or just wrist mount it
>>97083024Bayonet is an accessory to the gun. This makes the sword enjoyer upset, they want to be an equal and separate weapon. It's just gotta be this way, okay?
>>97083103Maximum gay. This is why I think it’s hilarious in lore Jedi get fucked by shotguns
>>97080615>Verne and Wells didn't write the first contemporary sci-fi stories to talk about 'realistic' shit that happened to be set in space.So you admit it's a faculty of imagining the impossible and improbable, then.
>>97083024>>97083103>>97083143why combine them, you can just carry both, they're not that heavy or large
>>97080361Exotic guns are still an option. Plastic cases, electronic triggers, higher pressures, fancy bullets...>>97083024Get both: have a compact continuous beam laser weapon.
>>97083808>Exotic guns are still an optionFancy bullets and high pressures I'm on board for, electronic triggers less so for various reasons.
I just made ranged weapons so OP that after a big galactic war between various factions they saw the insane casualties numbers and decided to set intergalactic rules for warfare. Now every one uses purposefully lower tech guns because of regulations.
>>97081124They do have the ability to manipulate gravity and sci-fi telekinesis. Would a laser blade be that big of a stretch?
>>97084143Dead space does have laser blade tech. You see it in a laser chainsaw in the animated Dead Space: Downfall and you can use a laser knife for pistols and laser hatchet mod for long guns in Dead Space 3.
>muh reasoning fags>schoolboy one-uppingwhat a shit thread
>>97084289It's the bulk of any "conversation" that goes on.>>97084178I haven't watched any of the animated stuff for Dead Space so that accounts for that lapse. Then again, I can't really bring myself to be interested in the setting beyond the first game.
>>97084363I agree, /tg/ is low quality
>>97081548>tradcath larper pseud who writes a Dune fanfic to own the libsHe's /tg/ incarnate
>>97084600The only way he'd be /tg/ incarnate would be if he didn't start or finish his series
>>97084600Is that the general flavor of the book(s)? Guess I dodged a bullet.
>>97084289>>muh reasoning fagsWhat does this mean?
>Closely aligned with the Sangheili's rigid sense of honor, the energy sword is the signature weapon of the Sangheili, and its usage has historically been regarded as both an expression of a Sangheili warrior's clerical honor and his personal combat skills. The Sangheili pride themselves on their skills with the weapon, which they regard as holy, and believe that it is better for a Sangheili to fall on his sword to redeem his honor than to die dishonorably. When a Sangheili openly displays the absence of an energy sword on their body, it likely either indicates supplication or a condescension suggesting superior prowess.>Since the weapon utilizes shaped plasma rather than traditional solid matter, the energy sword lacks any solid material in which to hold or impale anything; the sword does not cut or carve in the traditional sense, but rather boils anything it comes into contact with.>Injuries caused by the weapon are often gruesome. Stab wounds by the energy sword are, in most cases, fatal, as the blade passes through the body, leaving the organs and tissues cauterized by the extreme temperatures produced by the blades; wounds inflicted by the energy sword are sealed by the immense heat. Body fluids in the area of the stab wound are flash-vaporized upon contact; organs and tissue within the area of the stab wounds can suffer life-threatening damage as they suffered residual heat damage, while vessels and arteries are effectively blocked.In short, meme related. It is not intended to be practical, it is to inflict terror in the enemy and establish status. This could be invoked broadly for all energy swords, such as lightsabers, beam sabers, etc., and for HF blades and chainswords.
>>97084823Basically, it's trying to justify putting swords in vs just putting swords in >>9708151440k is a setting that has lasers guns, fighter planes, and weapons that can blow up entire squads. It also has swords. It has no lore justification for them. It would not be improved for having a justification. No one cares.But for some reason people think swords need to be justified in games when you can simply justify them mechanically and be done.
>>97085247>Anon dosen't know that 40k justifies swords in its own setting Lol.
>>97085256Post the justification.You won't because you can't.
>>97084871you forget said sword has killed >super soldiers>7 foot tall ape warriors genetically adapted for centuries of physical combat>super disease parasite beings that can adapt to anythingand that's just off the top of my head with individual examples. Are you seriously pretending the covenant didn't rape whole battalions of marines before high charity got infested? Your point falls flat. Especially when you realize a race considered more dumb and less skilled than the Elites (the brutes) use a hammer as their most iconic tool and that thing has insta-crippled Spartans as well. An elite with a plasma sword rapes an entire platoon of humans before he's ever wounded.
>>97085257the fact chainswords were just chainsaws used by colonists as a universal implement? It's why chainaxes exist. Are you retarded nogames?
>>97085344I quoted official Halo material though. This is the in-universe lore on it. Sangheili use it because of cultural reasons, it's extremely powerful but plasma rifles and even the pictured shotgun kill all those same things just as well. Better arguably, even in-universe let alone in gameplay.>An elite with a plasma sword rapes an entire platoon of humans before he's ever wounded.This is more because of his physical prowess and martial ability though. A Spartan can murder an entire squad of Covenant with his fists, both elite soldiers still use rifles most of the time (plasma rifle in the case of the Sangheili).
>>97085357anon, that doesn't explain why they bring them to gun fights
>>97085404there is no example of a common shotgun killing a spartan. There is several examples of spartans getting shishkebab'd by plasma swords. One is considered a common tool. The other is considered a weapon only earned through valor and prestige. The fact a spartan with all his tech loses to a elite with a sword in an even 50/50 split of outcome does not mean suddenly the sword in question is the reason for the elite's disadvantages.
>>97085454>there is no example of a common shotgun killing a spartan.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pUzDBy75lUg
>>97085419actually it does. Poor people bring hunting rifles as militias against modern invading armies. Does that mean it's effective? No, but it has logic behind it. You're a disingenuous faggot so of course you're not going to actually apply logic or think on this. Because that's what people like you do; purposely pretend as if you don't understand the topic thus making all discourse impossible. So I'll just repeat; you are a disingenuous faggot and a nogames.
>>97080462Need the artist for this one; I want to hire them.
>>97085466>he uses vidya multiplayer confirmed just a /v/ tourist
>>97085522>the games aren't canon>tourist, when the franchise is definitively a vidya onelol, lmao even
>>97085545the multiplayer isn't canonWell, except that one game where it turns out the multiplayer is actually sim training.
>>97080462Well. Yes and no. Buckle up, buckaroos, we're gonna have some education here for just a second, because this is important.Sci-fi is not about lasers and spaceships. It isn't sci-fi just because you have guns and technology. Nor is it fantasy just because you have knights and castles.Sci-fi is about asking "what if?" as contrasted against fantasy which is about asking "why?" In particular, fantasy is concerned with exploring the fundamental characteristics and meanings of what it is to be a mortal, living human. Sci-fi is about exploring the consequences of changing that. This is because in the real world technology is precisely and specifically the means by which we transcend our limitations.Star Wars is fantasy. Star Trek is sci-fi. LotR is fantasy. ASOIAF is sci-fi.
>>97085689>ASOIAF is scfi
>>97085522NTA, but you have no sense of humor bro
>>97085774asoiaf is weirwood networks and nanomachines
>>97085774>>97085836Sell me on the argument, as I've neither read the books nor watched the show, and my personal knowledge of the series extends only as far as the scene of the blonde chick getting piped from behind by Aquaman
>>97085850Admittingly my knowledge of ASOIAF begins and end with the dragon queen lady getting railed and dude getting his head squished like a melon, but 5 minutes of searching these connections appear to come up as "theories" that mentions the weirwoods being some kind of network system and some kind of connection to westwood which I havn't, and wont, bother to look deeper into.
>>97085467Big game hunting rifles are actually great for dug in snipers, and people hunt deer with ARs now. Chainaxes are fucking dumb.
>>97085623>except that one gameHalo 2, 3, 4, 5 all explicitly are war games/sims for the multiplayer. 4 and 5 talk about it more, but even in 2 Lockout, Beaver Creek, Zanzibar and more are all designated War Games maps. It wasn't settled that this was the case in CE, but you could reasonably apply it retroactively since it's consistent across the rest.Just FYI.
>>97085257armor/resilience outpaced firearms
>>97085850I'm the anon he's makin' that stupid face at. Here, let me:ASOIAF is sci-fi because it's about the consequences of transcending one's limitations. Ascending the throne as a woman. For example. A man being transformed into an immortal undead monster, and then outliving his usefulness as a forgotten tool only to wreck vengeance upon the land long after his original reason for existing had been made moot. A priestess worshipping an extradimensional entity with unknowable motives and plans, and serving its interests while straining to peer beyond that veil to glimpse eternity without permission... all because she wanted her life to have more meaning and significance than she could possibly have as a mere mortal woman. A bastard boy wishing he could find a family in which he belongs, only to discover that the entire fucking world is burning because his ancient family - entirely by accident and without him even knowing. A boy who gets obliterated by an eldritch horror that subsumes his mind and body to transplant a non-temporal consciousness completely alien to human perspectives.It isn't fantasy because none of these characters the story is revolving around are actually telling stories about their own original nature. Cersei isn't pondering what it means to be a woman. She doesn't care about that. She wants that fucking throne. Bran isn't asking himself why it is that mortals experience history in a linear manner from past to future and only from their own perspectives. He's erased / driven mad when his perspective suddenly does become eternal and plural. Jon isn't asking himself how to find happiness and content in life. He mopes around until he's spontaneously elevated to the most important single person in the entire goddamn world with zero warning.Sci-fi is about "what if things were different?". Fantasy is about "why am I here, and who am I?"ASOIAF is sci-fi. It isn't fantasy. This has nothing to do with lasers and robots. It's not about the means
>>97086205>cont'dThe means by which characters transcend their limitations is what technology is, fundamentally. In a setting where magic is real, then that magic is just another form of technology, as far as the narrative is concerned.The questions that characters engage with are what determines whether it's sci-fi or fantasy. Not the costumes they're wearing as they do so.Star Wars is fantasy. Star Trek is sci-fi.LotR is fantasy because it's about the nature of courage and virtue as innate essential qualities of mortal souls. ASOIAF is sci-fi because it's about the consequences of people choosing to go beyond the boundaries which have limited their lives to that point. That they use magic or sociology to do this is irrelevant.
>>97086205>>97086227I see the problem here. You equate transcendence of physical limitations with sci-fi. That is often a theme in sci-fi, but not the sine qua non of the genre. Neither is self-discovery necessarily the essence of fantasy. Each of those themes can be explored in each genre. and here's how they look imo:>Transcendence of limits>Sci-Fi: What if a limit no longer existed? For your "ascending the throne as a woman" example, the sci-fi implementation would be some combination of: "what if there was no longer a throne," or "what would happen if there were no longer women" or "what would happen if all thrones were given to women," not the journey of the character herself.>Fantasy: "What happens to -her- when -she- gets the throne?" "What happens if she destroys the throne?"Self-Discovery:>Sci-Fi: What happens when we try to understand ourselves too much? What happens when we lose the concept of the self? Fantasy: What happens to our hero when he discovers that he was a prince? What happens to a kingdom when they discover that their history was a lie? etc.Sci-Fi is more "logical extension of ideas," whereas fantasy seems to be more grounded in the emotional journey of a character or ensemble. Thank you for expanding my knowledge slightly beyond Emilia Clarke getting pounded by Aquaman, however.
>>97086473Don't misrepresent what I said. I didn't say physical limitations. I didn't say self-discovery. I didn't imply it either. You need to actually address the point, not just construct your strawman.I'm not debating. It's not some kind of argument that you can "win" somehow. This is literally how these genres are defined. It's not just something I'm claiming. I'm not the origin here. I'm explaining something to you that you didn't know. If you want to change how the genres are defined, you've got centuries of work to do. Good luck with that.I'm not arguing or debating about it. It is not for you to change any of this. If you need something clarified, you can ask a question and I'll try to explain or point you in a direction where you can read more.
>>97085257>big giant super human soldiers use melee weapons because they can move fast and can rip armored humans in half with ease >orks are big dumb tards who can crush a human with a slab of metal and shrug off huge amounts of damage>eldar doge ranged shots and can slice people open>choas just likes the feel and they are psychotic tooWow. Amazing. Took me 2 secs using my brain to post how 40k justifies melee weapon use when space tech weapons are available.
>>97081374Sometimes its hard to reconcile the fact a turkey cutter is essentially a HF blade in essence.
>>97084823people arguing over suspension of disbelief
>>97088493Isn't suspension of disbelief at least partially contingent on verisimilitude?
>>97086509What a laughably arrogant and aggressive response. You said:>"Fantasy is about "why am I here, and who am I?"You included (counterfactual) examples of what would be fantasy:>"pondering what it means to be a woman">"asking himself why it is that mortals experience history in a linear manner from past to future and only from their own perspectives">asking himself how to find happiness and content in lifeI paraphrased this to self-discovery for ease of discussion, which apparently is deeply offensive to you.>Don't misrepresent what I said.>I didn't imply it eitherWhat term would you prefer for the class of themes that you and I both seem to agree apply to fantasy?>This is literally how these genres are defined. It's not just something I'm claiming. I'm not the origin here. I'm explaining something to you that you didn't know. If you want to change how the genres are defined, you've got centuries of work to do. Good luck with that.I'm not arguing or debating about it. It is not for you to change any of this. If you need something clarified, you can ask a question and I'll try to explain or point you in a direction where you can read more.I am a published author with a graduate degree in literature from a university that you, and frankly everyone in the world, has heard of. Please do not presume to speak to us like we are imbeciles. Your conclusory appeal to authority (without even citations!!!!) is not merely shameless, but shameful. It's like... just your opinion, man.
>>97078536More sci-fi settings need giant mechs.In fact, how come sci-fi settings are so compartmentalized? Its like the opposite of fantasy settings where everyone has dragons and elves and stuff. People are even trying to get Beholders on their settings even though they're copyrighted.Meanwhile sci-fi settings only have very specific things. Lightsabers are what, a 50-50? Giant mechs only appear if its SPECIFICALLY a sci-fi about giant mechs.A good amount of them don't even have alien races, so its just humanity.Really odd divide, am I the only one to notice this?
>>97088820Sci-fi is by and for autistics who like compartmentalizing. Much like the chicken tendies and the mash potatoes and the corn on the plate, the mecha, the drug that makes people smart, and the aliens cannot touch on the plate.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wAwdRNxy_UA&t=101s
>>97088820A dragon usually works by established and easily comprehensible rules you can discern with a singular working braincell. Same with swords. But mechs, they come packaged with so much potentially broken bs (artificial muscle, neural links, doohickey reactors) you can't be lazy on the implementation. Otherwise your readerbase full of nerds and powerscalers will revolt. ...Also hard scifi authors usually tend to always go with tanks. The fictional gun platform equivalent of everything will evolve into crab.
>>97090596But drones have made tanks obsolete. Well, even more obsolete than IFVs and Javelins already did.
>>97087355That's just preference. Not an explanation for why swords are viable. A bigger guy can carry a bigger gun, after all, and a swordsman who can train to cut bullets in half could've probably learned how to shoot opposing bullets instead.But 40k doesn't need an explanation, it just has swords and they work. Any game can do this.
>>97086205>>97086227Actual, genuine retardation.
>>97080541The only Laser "Sword" I like. Laser swords shouldn't be actual swords with a fucking BEAM that some how stop itself from FTL itself into out space. I will also accept it when it looks more like a flare with a long flame coming out of it.
I like Turn A's beam saber.
>>97079509Same reason you still teach martial arts to soldiers nowadays:Shit happens. Knife fights occasionally happens, even in modern drone-and-artillery-centric wars https://www.the-sun.com/news/13208992/horror-video-russian-ukrainian-soldiers-knife-fight/So you carry the sword for ceremonial reasons and they only get used in rare weird situations.
>>97079509Basically the only answer you need is this:In any context where:1- You can attack/be attacked by surprise at a very short distance (typically: in an urban environment, but it can be an alien jungle)2- You don't have the possibility to have access to the most powerful weapons. For example, because it's forbidden, or may attract too much attention (if you are participating in shady/criminal activities) or because of limited ressources (post-apocalyptic world, or survival situations)Melee weapons become a perfectly viable choice again. Even if you adhere to the most strict realism.So basically: everywhere except a battlefield. Hell, even in modern battlefields you have a few occasions to get up close and personal, which is why some troops are still drilled in the usage of bayonets.Bonus point:3- (optionally) have units/characters/creatures that have either:- Even a limited ability to limit the stopping power of a few bullets (xenomorphs, cyborgs..)- Are fanatic/crazy/unfeeling enough to risk death without flinching (WWII Japanese soldiers, crazed drug-fuelled gangers, robots, hive mind bug alien drones...)- Have melee combat as part of their combat doctrine (basically, if you are highly trained to use a sword in close combat, are you are equipped with one, you are more likely to use it in close combat, probably)Even in Star Wars, if you only consider the original trilogy (the only one worth anything), it's pretty clear that the light saber is mostly a ceremonial weapon.It's used against other jedi/dark jedi during ritual combat; and it can give a clear advantage in street fights if you are well trained in using it.But presumably, even a jedi master would use regular war weapons on a battlefield (just like Luke uses space fighters instead of running around Hoth with his saber like an idiot, or use a blaster when escaping the Death Star).It's just that Lucas shat the bed with the prequels.
>>97080615>Verne and Wells didn't write the first contemporary sci-fi stories to talk about 'realistic' shitAkshually, Verne was always trying to stay fairly grounded in the science of his time.>>97083024>>97083103>I’ve never understood the whole idea of having a laser sword as a separate weapon to your gunYou can always go the Ulysses 31 way and have the sword be an alt-mode for the gun. Same energy source, you just use one when things get up close and personal.>>97080361>regular smokeless powder guns of today will still be in regular useI'm 100% ok with that, but1- Once you can figure out the tech, rail guns are an absolute upgrade compared to gunpowder, even just for a logistic point of view.2- What if you already have a bunch of lasers and high density batteries, for other purposes? Then it's easier than to build an entire, separate, production line just for guns.>>97080378>explosive-tipped crossbow bolts...you have my attention, please proceed
>>97078536One variation I've seen in slav sci-fi is a monomolecural blade with a built-in plasma sharpener. The blade would naturally dull even just by swinging through the air, so you'd need to constantly re-sharpen it and after about 1000 rounds the blade would be whittled into uselessness. Was still necessary due to both the presence of Dune personal bubbles and broad range energy fields that'd kill the momentum of any high-speed ammunition across a region.
>>97078536more fantasy settings need laser swords
>>97079509>Thread hijack but it's an inevitable topic: The whole gun vs. sword debate that always comes up in sci-fi type settings is the dumbest thing I can imagine but only because of the mental gymnastics to justify the use of using anything that isn't a gun but it mostly seems to come from the idea of having the weapon as the only thing the PC (or anyone else for that matter) uses to the exclusion of anything else.You're already doing a lot of mental gymnastics for having characters and not just one ASI expanding and taking over everything anyway
>>97079373yikes this picture is like the autogynephile national anthem
>>97093051>1- Once you can figure out the tech, rail guns are an absolute upgrade compared to gunpowder, even just for a logistic point of view.Not really. We are talking about killing men, infantry weapons. Railguns have ablation, you need to replace rails often. Railguns are also bad at high rate of fire. Armor on infantry isn't good enough to warrant an ultra-powerful, slow firing weapon. It's bad compared to sniper rifles for the same reason, ablation. Coilguns are a better choice, but you still need superbatteries and complex electronics, regular guns just need machined metal parts and a factory that turns nitroglycerin (common industrial explosive) into bullets. You might want to use coilguns, but the increased complexity for similar performance is questionable. The appeal is likely mass, it could feasibly be lighter for the weapon itself and for the amount of ammo it could carry. Maybe. The structural requirements are lower, no explosion after all. Less weight, similar performance, higher rate of fire is potentially preferable to simpler and more rugged and unable to cook-off like ultracapacitors or SMES can. Just some things to consider.>2- What if you already have a bunch of lasers and high density batteries, for other purposes? Then it's easier than to build an entire, separate, production line just for guns.Batteries in the form factor you need for your guns? Maybe they would be able to use generics (sci-fi AA batteries), maybe you'd need more custom ones (like car batteries) for weapons. You could argue for it. Laser manufacture will be more common, but probably really big ones. The tooling needed to make the big ones isn't the same as making small ones. It would still be another line, maybe in the same factory using the same logistics though so there is that. Guns are again just machined metal, is this more of a logistics burden? Maybe if you are bootstrapping a colony sure!Things to consider when worldbuilding, know your probable objections.
>>97096483>one ASI expanding and taking over everything anywaylol, we are never getting AGI let alone ASI. Automated cognition, even crude cognition, is hideously inefficient. Presuming the creation of godlike intelligence is extremely dubious and borders on wishful thinking, certainly not a foregone conclusion in any case.>man will never fly!Flight is an existing phenomenon which we made a tool to do for us. Ultra advanced cognition is seemingly not an existing phenomenon you could expect to make a tool to do for us. The over-under on it is not good to say the least.
>>97096778Your flesh is not magic, sorry to say
>>97096971You spoony bard!!!
>>97079509>Mental gymnasticsAll science fiction is mental gymnastics to get around the unimpeachable fact that there are no aliens, there is no FTL travel, there won't ever be, and there's no reason to ever leave the solar system. And honestly there's not much reason to go that far.ALL Science Fiction is copium for nerds who need something to replace the rapture. You are going to work until you die, you are not going to get robot legs, you are not going to be uploaded into a computer and if you were it would just be a copy and you still die. There is no such thing as artificial intelligence, qualia is impossible to define or test for, and the singularity is soteriology. It isn't real.Everything that isn't you working until you die is fantasy, and you can treat it all the same way.
>>97097269Joke's on you, I barely even work.
>>97096971>Can't even prove that other people have consciousness>"We'll make an artificial consciousness though"
>>97097304As the Montenegrins say, a grain of work dries an ocean of rest.
>>97097269You sound like a happy, well-adjusted human being with a healthy relationship with his parents
>>97097337Unironically, he does.I know you hate him because what he says rings true and you don't know how to deal with that though.
>>97097363I don't know. Droning nihilism and surrendering dreams of something better doesn't sound like the machinations of a sound mind
>>97092941>>97093051Holy shit, Ulysses 31 reference, what a day.
>>97092926It's funny because I never argued otherwise. I'm arguing against the idea you need to bend over backwards to justify why stabbing people when guns are a thing is, and will always remain, a thing.The only difference is we're not Metal Gear Revengenance cyborgs with HF katanas kabar tossing multi-mega ton mechs.
>>97079509>mental gymnastics to justify the use of using anything that isn't a gunThe slow blade penetrates the shield
>>97079535Ok hipster
>>97080462No, Sci-Fi makes power prevalent, common, and obtainable simply by spending money. Fantasy makes power more rare, difficult to obtain, and relies heavily on talent.
>>97098046Personally I'm curious and thinking about if the gun really is the pinnacle of the infantry weapon. Is this the best power at the greatest practical distance for a weapon for infantry to use on other infantry? You always need infantry, and infantry need an appropriate weapon for dealing with other infantry, but outside of slight refinement on the rifle (like how spear saw multiple metas over 2000 or so years), is this it for the next several hundred years? I am experiencing a failure of imagination maybe, but for the usage needed I'm unable to think of something better than "blast someone with kinetic or thermal energy from a tube".
>>97096971We went through multiple huge tech leaps that got us all the way to the moon and we're still struggling to make a biped with good hands. It's not magic but it turned out to be much harder to reach than multiple other things we thought almost impossible.
>>97090596>you can't be lazy on the implementationYou can be. A lot of lighter settings do just drop them in the background. Don't have to explain everything, though it's fun to write.>Otherwise your readerbase full of nerds and powerscalers will revoltFrankly less of them than people think there are, and they're mostly going to argue with each other on the internet anyway. At worst one will ask you a technobabble question at a convention.
>>97098108With the help of any human female off the street I can make a bipedal learning machine with proficient use of hands that will certainly outperform any LLM on reasoning and power efficiency in 9 months or so. I can't use the same female to make a heavy industrial tracked machine that can safely self-navigate a worksite, move several hundred lbs with its arms, and also be teleoperated from anywhere in the world in the same time.
>>97098091No matter the circumstance, people are going to want to engage at a distance when able. First it with polearms, then bows, then guns, then cannons and so on and so forth. We have the ability to completely destroy whole cities and countrysides with bombs and yet people can still be beaten to death with blunt objects and stabbed and cut with sharped metal sticks.
>>97098108>It's not magic So one day it ands its functions can be made from scratch, and made better
