Genuinely, why did it struggle so much in getting an audience?
>>151286643I can't speak for anyone else, but I watched the old flash animations back in the day and found them very charming, so I went into this series wanting to like it. The pilot just didn't hold my interest, whatever charm the old newgrounds stuff had just isn't there in the modern stuff, at least not for me. I don't hate it, but I don't like it much either, it's just mediocre for me, and I don't feel the need to keep up with it at all.
I only watched this because funny fecal swede I like is in it but I couldn't get past the MC's horrid voice.
>>151286643Shrike is ugly and his schtick is annoying. He tries to be Ren Höek, but with more random mispronounced shit in Spanish that no one asked for
Unappealing characters. The evil space dino is one of the only decent looking characters.
>mc name is Shrike>doesn't resemble a bird at all, instead looks like some ugly as fuck off brand earthworm jim
>>151286643the characters are fucking hideous and it's boring
>>151286643>called Monkey Wrench>does not star MonkeysFalse advertising.
>>151286643Aggressively unfunny
It's difficult to care about the characters and the overall world building was fairly stereotypical or uninspiring for the genre. That being said the series is getting better over time and still worth an audience.
>>151286643I feel so fucking bad for him.>>151286693Well said, green-haired Kaiba
>>151286643People will start spamming it around once that one shitty girl is introduced.
>>151287153Will there even be fans with attention spans that long?
We're living in a time where hundreds of 90s kids who have always wanted their own TV show now have the power to make it independently on their own.However the issue is that TV kinda sucks. Unlike movies, short films and comics, TV HAS to be censored and family friendly because its a free service that anyone can be exposed to, so majority of what you get on the idiot box is commity approved blandness churned out at high quantities.For an independent production to feel so neutered and watered down, like a TV production, I gotta ask "why aren't I watching other independent creations that are more interesting?"
>>151287219Neutered? That’s not something I thought about. What makes it so neutered?>>151287219
>>151286643The two leads are ugly and have shit voices
>>151287153Which girl?
>>151287248It's an independent cartoon yet it perfectly fits in the mold of a television series crafted from bureaucracy. Never willing to get truly weird and unconventional, or do anything to stir controversy.The show is as free as a wolf but chooses to behave like a lapdog for a master it doesn't have.Most people find this boring. Monkey Wrench's fans are all aspiring independent creators themselves and very few are just regular people who chose this everything else that is already out there, like anime.
>>151287283I’m sorry, can you be a bit more specific. I agree with you wholeheartedly but I’m trying to wrap my head around it. It’s like I’m being told water is wet but now I want to know why that is.>inoffensive protags>safe toilet humor>loreshit>worthless background designsSomething like that? What do suits desire most?
>>151287321>>safe toilet humorwhy would you want anything extra...besides, tv animation has gotten excessively disgusting about toilet humor between ttg and family guy. also that spongebob movie where he deeply inhales real life piles of shit
>>151286643Dumb tranny furry audience is already being served by Hazbin Hotel, MLP youtube poops, Sonic.exe, etcCharacter designs lack appeal imo. How you gonna make a guy with a beard wearing s graphic tee that says “beard” a main character? I know furries have the lowest standards of perhaps any demographic but it’s not even funny bad, just boring
>>151287274Monkey Terran that will show up next episode
>>151287367I don’t think her design is strong enough to spam threads for. She’s kinda plain, she looks like a background character.
>>151287421>>151287367She is not worth all the tedium.
>>151287345>why would you want anything extra...So that’s the long and short of it? That is pretty pathetic, but for TV animation going far in that regard feels more like a crutch. What kind of art should indy animation strive for? Definitely not this.
>>151286787>He tries to be Ren Höekholy shit you're right, I don't know why I never noticed that.
>>151286843>>151286913>>151287258Monkey Wrench has its pros in the animation department and some of the worldbuilding/occasional jokes, but yeah this is what really hurts it. Shrike and Beebs are just so lame they drag the whole show down a couple notches.
>>151287321Essentially its all in the writing. The character dynamics and episode structure. It's all something you'd find in a television show pitch bible, which are made to ensure the business suits "look see? we can play by your rules!"The character designs are fine and are actually one of the things that don't matter, cos as long as what the characters DO is interesting then its okay, but they don't, so its a bit harder to put up with the characters only looking "okay-ish". I can acknowledge that the series is quality made and Zureal is a very skilled and experienced man, but I just wish he was a bit more of a creative man as well.Maybe his downfall is that he's just so sensible and well adjusted as a person. Maybe he needs to become a bit of a degen to make something more interesting, or get blackpilled on what humans are truly interested in and learn to work with that reality, instead of being blissfully ignorant of it.To be fair, at the end of the day he should only make the show HE believes to be compelling, he should just focus on what he likes, and if that means a safe TV show with safe characters that makes him feel nostalgic and cozy then that's totally valid, its not impossible to get something sincerely good out of that. However, judging from his deleted social media posts, the lack of recognition does seem to be eating away at him.
>>151286643Characters are too ugly, I've never even clicked on the pilot.
>>151287367If she was already introduced as the MC, this would've done a lot better at getting that gooner + liberal bitch audience
>>151287367I like the design of her robo arm
I genuinely like this show and do wish it had more of an audience. But, for a show that clearly wants to be a 90's cartoon, it kinda lacks in that department at times. It's not gory or violent, it doesn't have much in terms of "eye candy" characters, the humor and animation is def fine, but it still lacks that "oomph".
>>151287460> get blackpilled on what humans are truly interested in and learn to work with that reality, instead of being blissfully ignorant of itNTA but I'm not sure what you mean. Like more horror/edgy elements?
>>151286643look at it
>>151286918This.
>>151287451What are you even asking for here? To see someone take a shit? Why is "safe" toilet humor on your list at all. I really hope you meant using toilet humor in general is safe and trashy, not that you're disappointed the guy isn't being more disgusting about it beyond what you've not got enough from TV limits.
>>151287554Manga and anime are full of sex and violence and people love that shit, its a global force now. (And I mean VIOLENCE violence, like truly mean spirited and deranged violence).Even some casual misogyny/racism from certain authors/showrunners is still met with a shrug and a "yeah but who cares" because what they make is just so darn entertaining.
>>151287591I am sorry, I thought that’s what you were arguing when you asked “why do you need anything extra.” Unless you’re someone else.>>151287595Violence violence would be pretty sweet. I muss Berserk like that.>>151287460Thank you for putting everything in words. It’s goid to be sensible and all, the British are infamous for that, but I suppose there does need to bd something raw and human behind the character relationships too. This all feels like the typical third act break up right now, how long does he want the series to continue?>To see someone take a shit?Not to be facetious, but that would be pretty shocking and against what suits want. I’m not advocating for it, but now that you put it out there it’s kinda funny to think about.
>>151286643BECAUSE SHRIKE IS SO UGLY!
Protagonists are pretty milquetoast, its a dynamic which should work but Beebs there isn't the same level of grit which made it work for Spike/Jet.The best antagonist got introduced last episode. Good design, good animation and good threat, sadly all the previously introduced ones just felt so-so. Agent-K is the runner upWorld building is alright.Music is alright.Humor is... eh? Alot of the characters feel like token comic relief and yet dont really have that funny of things to say or do.Animation is the highlight and without a doubt the reason to watch the show.I do like this show but its probably a 7/10 at best and a 4/10 at worse. Zeurel being butthurt about it not doing as well as GLITCH's stuff really screams insecure but he has to understand the other shows have elements which pander to others while his animation is 100% his vision. - heck even when he DID try to pander to lgbt shit they picked such a boring ass character it just made people confused.
>>151286643I wish he leaned into the more edgier action-y early 2000's energy he had in his original script instead of trying to fit into the Reddit/Band-kid crowd
>>151287836I hope it isn’t age that did that to him
I know the reason why people act this was is because the show takes a stupid amount of money to make, but I really can't believe people honestly act like hundreds of thousands of views isn't a huge audience. It's disproportionate to what the show costs to make, but it's more than most people get.Personally my biggest problem with this show is how everyone takes it so fucking seriously here. You'd think this WAS something made by a studio with how much it's scrutinized and nitpicked. I don't watch it but it seems like people are a bit overly critical of it just because the creator bitched about it's low views once. Which, yeah, it's ungrateful for the reason I said above, but people treat this shit like it's not made by like 10 people.
I miss when he done The Locals.I also miss the joe.to TF2 servers where they got the audio from.
>>151287847I feel like we’re hard on it because it was made by a seasoned vet and we wanted him to do better.
>>151287847It is a testament to the quality of his work desu
>>151286643Personally, I like it despite the shows flaws. I actually want to see more of it and where its going. Though my biggest gripe is that the first four episodes feel tonally different, and I wish it sort of kept up the frenetic action of the first episode a little more often. I don't need a space opera show about saving the universe from evil terrans. Just having two grungy mercs with rough backstories trying to make ends meets while picking up a terran kid and keeping her hidden was all I need.
>>151286643I watched the first episode around the time it came out and I just didn't like any of the characters and the pilots plot just kinda bored me, does it get better? Semi related, around the time this first dropped i had a dream that it became a hugely popular meme to take the Shrike makeship plush that was being promoted at the time, dunk it in various liquids, and hit it as hard as you could against the nearest wall multiple times. It got so huge, makeship released an "updated" Shrike plush that's only difference was that its legs were longer so that people could more effectively dunk it and hit random shit with it. To this day I can't look at this show without thinking about that dream
>>151286643It succeeds at looking like something I wouldn't wanna see in 2001.
>>151286693Same, I grew up obsessed with classic Zeurel cartoons about fifteen years ago, he's a man of quality.However I do feel bad, he's included Monkey Wrench in plenty of indie animation showcases but I don't know if people are necessarily biting.
>>151288338I wish you had more influence, anon. That sounds based af.
>>151286643There's a lot of foundational issues, but if I had to pick the biggest, it's: Who is this even for?At this point, not even Zeurel seems to know what he wants in terms of both tone and atmosphere. He wants it to be full of lore and have grounded moments of drama, but he also wants to showcase and inject as much of his bombastic and zany sense of humor as possible. Not to mention, the first choice you should probably settle on when deciding to do a character driven show like this, is to make the characters actually interesting or worth following.
>>151288435>cute girlsThirty percent improved.
>>151288435>He wants it to be full of lore and have grounded moments of drama, but he also wants to showcase and inject as much of his bombastic and zany sense of humor as possible.Nigga that's fucking everything that's successful.Marvel movies.Digital Circus.One Piece.
>>151286918I am angry right now, angry about monkeys.
>>151288474>marvel moviesHave two generations of premade fanbase, hundreds of millions in shilling, and the finest cgi slop money can buy>digital circusHas a waifu protagonist >One PieceTook years to get there and has a lot of crazy shir going on
>>151287283It even has fake commercial breaks.
>>151288862Doesn't disprove my point, dumbass.
I get that nostalgia is all the rage but I never understood shows and games that just try to emulate a bygone era. These kinds of episodic 80s space adventure cartoons already existed.
>>151286643It's too long, and if I wanted to watch Cowboy Bebop I'd watch Cowboy Bebop.
>>151289028You're a fucking retard and I don't even like MW that much. 6/10 after ep.5
Imagine having a fat bastard and a weird ass roach human hybrid be your main protagonists bro </3
>>151289240It's literally indie Cowboy BB bro..
>>151289240NTA but I don't know why a mostly episodic comedy cartoon has to be 30 minutes.
MW is like a tasty looking cake but when you actually take a bite out of it it's all frosting. The show has no substance behind it.
>>151289283Yeah, especially when 4-5 both end with the same kinda cliffhanger, just with the rock guy instead of the green box. >>151289302ThisNew green guy was kinda neat, but I honestly liked the fucking vending machine more than anything else in ep.5
>>151286643I don't know what this is.
>>151287367She looks like the character from Hi-Fi Rush, and a robotic prosthetic? There's another character from the same game like that, plus Rivet from the newest R&CConsider me skeptical as fuck
>>151289009It does, you're just too stubborn to admit it.
>>151289460>this doesn't work because it has serious moments and wacky moments>"there are lots of things that have worked while having those two things">yeah but they're popular even without thatThe point I'm making is if it was really so damning then it would ruin those already successful things, but it not only doesn't, it becomes their defining features and propells them into further popularity.
>>151286749hello fren
>>151289302This looks tasty to you?
>>15128953850% of the TADG is garbage. It's a fake indie production that is only successful because of brilliant marketers that have specially designed it to move merchandise, so it can shrug off being terrible most of the time.Everyone that truly loves One Piece can tell you that the drama is a fucking joke (and not a funny one) and that Oda will fail to deliver a satisfying conclusion because he is obviously being tard-wrangled by his editors. It's basically a very long and slow ship wreck. Anyone following the story for the "serious" aspects is a complete idiot.Marvel Movies are the only thing you mentioned that owes part of its success to balancing drama and comedy well enough- but like the other anon said, a good amount of it comes from their flashier aspects.Point is, your examples aren't successful *simply* because they combine drama and comedy, like you say.Also, believing that simply mixing these "just works" without taking the -how- into consideration means you have no idea of what you are talking about. You are the real dumbass here and two persons taking the time to explain why you are wrong is much more than you deserve.
>>151289750I like the colors and the shading, some locations in the show look very pretty I guess.
>>151289750Damn son i bet those shoes are extra stinky.
>>151289750>>151289750Pretty sure anon meant that the tasty part is the setting, animation and sound design, while the characters are the element that lacks substance.
>>151288435Hnnnnnghh
>>151289754>Shit's on TADC>Watches OP>Watches capeshit>"You are the real dumbass here"It's fucking pottery. NTA
>>151286643Glitch kept getting asked 5 times to pick this thing up and always turned it down. The TADC gag episode is en route to being the most viewed video on the channel. Internet cartoons have to have lore, gay shit, and goonable characters to be successful.
>>151288448Aren’t there enough animated shows that were off-ramps to trannyism
>>151290432>Internet cartoons have to have lore, gay shit, and goonable characters to be successful.LmaoHundreds of 2010s animation artists with pilots/pitches wished what you said is true
>>151286643lame MCs. Both in design and in personality.Everything else around them is interesting. But we're forced to follow these charisma drainers.
>>151289830We need shrike feet pics, thatll save the show.
>>151287460>The character designs are fine and are actually one of the things that don't matter, cos as long as what the characters DO is interesting then its okayI agree with the rest of what you said but good character design can easily make or break a videogame or animated show. Look what happened to Concord because of their designs.
>>151286643Shrike's characterization lacks contrast. In spite of his (presumably) wild origins, he's just an ordinary struggling, whiny bum. If he was at least a little bit over-the-top like his old Vash-on-crack personality.. now THAT would be a strong contrast to all the seriousness.Back in 2010, most of Zeurels characters had very nutty personalities that contrasted well with their serious, sometimes extremely dark backstories. This is what Monkey Wrench is missing. The protags are just too mellowed out in an attempt to make them more mature and serious, which perfectly reflects what happened to Zeurels writing in general over the years.
>>151290432>The TADC gag episode is en route to being the most viewed video on the channel.That's gunna be a dark fucking day for him after losing out to Lackadaisy (which they also referenced in an episode)
>>151290432>loreCheck>gay shitCheck>goonable charactersWell... depends on you ask
>>151288862I hope Oda lives to end his manga. I wonder what happened to Kentaro Miura to make his heart that bad.>>151290892Anything’s goonable if you get the right artist
>>151290388I don't watch OP, I just know people that do. I watch Mervel slop and TADC because my little brother likes it. So yes, you are the the real dumbass here, you shit-for-brains.
>>151291507You're the one running damage control on your shit taste.
>>151291525Hypocrite.
Why are we bringing up One Piece all of the sudden?
>>151291531>I only watched it because my friends / younger brother!>You're a hypocrite for calling me out!Oh okay, you're just retarded. Got it.
>>151291558Obviously because of >>151288474, retard.
>>151291592This discussion only happened because of your shit taste and stupidity and you want people to forget that by pointing fingers at another issue. You are doing damage control and you know it, asswipe.
>>151291595Ok. I like One Piece. When do you think it’ll end, they might just be getting out of a flashback
>>151291634>>>/a/piece
>>151291625>>151290388>NTAWas my first response to you in this thread, you fucking mongoloid. You were already going on about your shit taste before I arrived. Kill yourself.
>>151291665We are anonymous, imbecile, how am I supposed to know that? Make it clear if yiu want to be understood, idiot.Also you were still completely wrong about me AND your own shit taste, so you are the one doing damage control here, retard.
>>151286643The show have nice characters and great animation but the story is not so interesting, specially when other animations use the same concept of "comedy that gets deep and dramatic at some point".
>>151291713Do you not know what NTA means newfag?>NOT THAT ANON>Still doing damage control on your taste.>Calling my taste shit >Despite only calling out your own hypocrisyYou are defending your taste in marvel movies and one piece by fucking proxy, and don't even have the balls to admit you actually like either. So who's the one running the damage control?
>>151291794>my first response to you in this threadI was obviously talking about that, you worthless shit-stain.>You are defending your taste in marvel movies and one piece by fucking proxyNo, you want to believe that for the sake of your agument because you have no ground to stand on and never did.Also, you are clearly butthurt about me not liking TADC, which is why you focus on things you believe I like. You are complete hypocrite. And honestly, you going this far to defend that shitty show makes you more of a loser than anything else you or I could bring up, so I'll stop dealing dealing with your stupidty right here.
>>151286858His name is Shrike cuz it rimes with Spike
>>151286643Combination of ugly characters and sickly colors for me. I find the 'beard' guy in particular extremely off-putting, he makes me not want to watch it.
>>151287367That arm looks like it'll be pure hell to animate.
>>151291916These days, we have the technology!
>>151286643I think it got better by episode 3, but the pilot was weak all around. It tries to go for some comic book montage looking thing but none of the action has any impact or weight or anything, This shot is a great example. It sets up for this rad shot of his thrusters firing but they just light up and he lazily floats upwards.and like everyone else has said the main duo is just obnoxious Spike and flat boring Jet
>>151291875>I was obviously talking about that, you worthless shit-stain.Goalpost moved (WE'RE ANONYMOUS!!! HOW COULD I KNOW!!! OF COURSE I WAS TALKING ABOUT THAT!)>No, you want to believe that for the sake of your agument because you have no ground to stand on and never did.So says Mr. Peterson. You're just obfuscating things with your bullshit word salad. >Picks Mt. I hate Marvel, One Piece, and TADC but I'm still defending my fucking opinion about them as his hill to die on>You have no ground!>You're just a butthurt fanboy!I don't give two-fifths of a half-eaten shit what your opinion of TADC is, I'm just saying you're a retarded faggot for thinking it's the worst of the 3.
>>151286643Space King mogs it. Go big or go home, bitch.
>>151291931CARLOS YOU MOTHERFUCKER!!
