Hindsight is always 10/10

>>16535659
I dont think you need hindsight to know that warmongering against countries allied with other great powers will blow up in your face with tragic consequences

One could definetly argue that Danzig wasnt worth the gamble of total destruction of Germany and millions of German generations lost.

These kind of discussions generally however always gets gaslighten to everything Britain could and should and would have done so that Hitlers ambitions wouldnt backfire.
Hitler himself cannot have any responsibility or agency for the situation.

>>16535655
>how do people justify this sheer level of catastrophic incompetence?
Because they are sociopaths who don't care if they die as long as they got to torture and kill others.

It's really that simple.

>>16536027
The purpose of Hitler's plan was the preservation of a race that was under threat and is currently being driven to extinction. All races deserve their own place to exist.

>>16535655
Forgot the part of creating concentration camps for German prisoners to slave away and die at to manufacture low-brow consumer slop.

>>16535655
The 20th Century is defined by supreme self-confidence and hubris.

>>16535655
>Does everything he can to prepare for the inevitable growth and expansion of the USSR and communism
>Expects that Britain wouldn't behave like an insane fratricidal maniac who would rip herself apart to destroy Germany
Dilate, obsessed Swedetranny
Also
>poland
>allies in any serious sense with england
LOL

>>16535787
>Hitler himself cannot have any responsibility or agency for the situation.
Your favorite tactic is to accuse your opponent of everything you are guilty of, tenfold

>>16536035
Look, I just found one.

>>16536157
The decades between 1929 and 1949 are the stupidest decades in human history. Also horrific, but the horrors are all made out of rank stupidity.

What makes it worse is that we failed to learn anything from it.

>>16535787
>Hitler himself cannot have any responsibility or agency for the situation.
Yes he can. This retard had every chance to de-escalate the situation and chose to burn everything to the ground out of spite.

>>16536193
is this the part where you pretend to be retarded for the tiniest crumb of attention?

>>16536285
look, he's doing it again! >>16536202

>>16535655
> "8 million dead Germans"
I never thought about it before, but how come le 6 gorrillion is so much when as many polish people and more germans died during ww2?

>>16536193
>Does everything he can to prepare for the inevitable growth and expansion of the USSR and communism
Did he do that by allying with the Soviet Union and invading anticommunist Poland?

>>16536342
Germans weren't systematically exterminated and put on cattle cars to the worst summer camp in history.

>A lot of Poles got exterminated
When Jews talk about the systematic extermination of their people, they aren't obliged to mention every other terrible thing that happened while it was going on.

>>16536355
this is the most limp-wristed retort you can come up with but you still seem to think it's effective

>>16536359
germans were systematically cleansed in the range of 12-14 million from eastern europe and dumped into those same camps, but instead it was in the dead of winter.

>>16536360
Nice non-answer commie.

>>16536360
It's effective enough you haven't responded to it

Funny how "everything he can" still wound up with Commies ruling half of Europe and him dead in a cuckbunker

>>16535787
Danzig obviously wasn't the reason for war against Poland. It had to be conquered to open the way into Russia. Like others itt pointed out, it was ultimately about the existence of the germanic race and without doubt it would be in a better position now had he won. It's of course unfortunate in this context that Great Britain did not see this far

>>16536366
First off, show me a number that says 12 million Germans were sent to camps by the Soviets.

Second off, those who were sent to the Siberian wastes were German soldiers who had participated in the invasion of the Soviet Union in a war of extermination.

>>16536369
Every time I respond to it, you ignore it and pretend I never answered it

>>16536378
>that says 12 million Germans were sent to camps by the Soviets.
Not my claim, nor do I accept it as a goalpost. I'm talking about the mass ethnic cleansing of Germans post 1945
>were German soldiers who had participated in the invasion of the Soviet Union in a war of extermination.
Kek this is what ivan tells himself, like bolshevism was not inherently an exterminationist, megacidal ideology. What a joke.

>>16536390
Nice evasion there, Ivan.

OP spends 24 hours, 7 days a week with these threads, repeating the same babble ad nauseum, pretending he hasn't had his points addressed repeatedly.
For what purpose? Is it just to be annoying? Does he think he is winning against le chuds by behaving like a schizophrenic.

>>16536399
You'll have to prove you're arguing in good faith first, sorry.

>>16536396
>germans were systematically cleansed in the range of 12-14 million from eastern europe and dumped into those same camps
Show me those 14 million Germans in Soviet camps.
>I'm talking about the mass ethnic cleansing of Germans post 1945
Show me the proof this happened.
>But Bolshevism is bad
Nazism is worse for everyone involved, including Germans.

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>>16536403
I accept your concession

>>16536405
>>16536409
Unmedicated schizophrenia

>>16536414
You lost anon, you're not allowed to talk.

>>16535787
Danzig a small city state with German native? Why the issue?

>>16536618
Gambler's ruin is a bitch

>>16535655
He loved his people which is why he was forced to invade a belligerent junta that turned down 10 years of diplomatic good faith.
>allied to other great powers
Poland did not have a single formal alliance with any nation, no one would touch them because they were an illegitimate state.
Britain and France formed an anti-German pact because they had an irrational fear of Germany because of how well Germany performed in WWI and how Germany had smashed France in the Franco-Prussian war.
Germany is demographically much better off than England or France, Germany reunified itself, and Germany has a higher GDP per capita than Britain and France.

Germans really are the master race compared to The West.

>>16535787
>you see m8 I had to bomb the ever living fuck out of european cities and civilians because we can't just let you have what you want now!

>>16535787
I like how >>16536202
>>16536280
>>16536377
>>16536618

are so rabidly anti-German they do not see you are on their side lmao.

Britain and France are never blamed even though they made the conditions for Hitler, they declared war on Hitler, they made a regional dispute into a global conflict.

Yet in the same breath these people will blame Germany for WWI because
>the Kaiser elevated it to a global war
>The Kaiser declared war first
>The Kaiser gave a blank check to the Austrians which emboldened them
Still today a thread is up where they say "Germany shouldnt honor their longstanding formal alliance with Austria Hungary"
But then they will say in this thread "BRITAIN HAD TO DEFEND POLAND IT WAS A HECKIN HALF SECRET ANTI GERMAN PACT"


So which is, do we exonerate Germany in the 1910s or do we exonerate Germany in the 1940s?


Why was Britain willing to trade its Empire for Danzig?
The Focus, a group of international jews, like samuel untermeyer, were lobbying the British government to declare war on Germany and prosecute the war on Germany.
>>16536027
we are talking about Germany, not the jews.

>>16536355
Yes, because Britain forced Hitler to make a high risk diplomatic play, then Hitler launched the largest offensive to date against the USSR.

Why are you arguing OprBarbarossa was pro-USSR?

>>16536716
>Britain and France are never blamed even though they made the conditions for Hitler, they declared war on Hitler, they made a regional dispute into a global conflict.
Declaring war on someone who repeatedly wiped his ass with every treaty he ever signed and repeatedly crossed every line that was drawn in the sand is like shooting a rabid dog.

Nazitards are too dishonest to discuss anything with them.

>>16536722
>who repeatedly wiped his ass with every treaty he ever signed
he didn't though
Munich had no stipulations about further territorial expansion or the creation of a protectorate in bohemia
This whole meme you're screeching comes from the british claiming they "felt like the 'spirit' of the treaty was violated" lmao
the only ones to blame are the western allies, for pissing on any attempts at good faith diplomacy from as soon as 1933

>>16536721
>then
It wasn't right after the war started. In fact, Hitler even proposed the Soviets to join the Axis, so they could destroy Britain together.

Listening to Hitler apologists is like hearing a nigger explaining why he robbed the store.
>Society made me do it
>It shouldnt be a crime
>You should mind your own business
>Cops genocide us daily
>Someone else would have robbed it
>If you had just let me do it there would have been less damage
>Fuck wypipl

>>16536737
Yeah, they remind me of BLM.

>>16536359
Germans were systematically exterminated in Czechland according to the Runciman, a British foreign affairs agent.
jews and Poles were not systematically exterminated.
jews and poles committed war crimes by taking up arms in civilian clothing.
Then they call it a systemic extermination when reprisals for partisan activity take place.
Dont be a terrorist war criminal and you wont get reprisal'd.

>>16536745
>according to the Runciman, a British foreign affairs agent
I asked you about this last time. You weren't able to find this part in his report. Maybe this time you'll have more luck.

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>>16536745
>Dont be a terrorist war criminal and you wont get reprisal'd.

>>16536035
The German race wasn't "under threat" in 1939. There were 7 Germanic nations (Germany, Austria, Switzerland, Liechtenstein, Luxembourg, Free city of Danzig and Volga German ASSR) at the time and many more German communities spread across Europe which were all destroyed in the aftermath of WW2. Ironically, had Hitler not invaded anyone there would've been way more Germans across Europe today, and cultures like the Prussians, Silesian, Pomeranians, Danzigers, Baltic Germans, Sudeten Germans, Volga Germans and more would still be prevalent today.

>>16536745
>>Czech officials and Czech police, speaking little or no German, were appointed in large numbers to purely German districts; Czech agricultural colonists were encouraged to settle on land confiscated under the Land Reform in the middle of German populations; for the children of these Czech invaders Czech schools were built on a large scale; there is a very general belief that Czech firms were favoured as against German firms in the allocation of State contracts and that the State provided work and relief for Czechs more readily than for Germans.
This is extermination. You're actually worse than BLM.

>>16536722
>every treaty he ever signed
????????????
Hitler did not even have to entertain coming to the table with Britain and France, yet he did over and OVER.
You say every treaty, what treaty did he break with his good faith allies?
When defended his allies, rescued them from imprisonment, and held up their armed forces even as those same allies were ready to abandon him.

But Hitler offended England by joining Germany and Austria? Hitler spurned England by putting an end to the genocide of Germans in Czechland?
What business does England have in this part of the world?

If the USSR wanted to say, shore up their good friend Cuba with missiles, the US would declare war on them because that is well within the US sphere of influence.

Why do you always forget to mention those "treaties" Hitler broke were nothing but bad faith roadblocks meant to keep Germany under the thumb of Versailles?
>it was like shooting a rabid dog

Are you jewish? you post like a psychopath.
you kikes mad the rockets buck broke your American system? maybe youre english, why is your GDP lower than a nation that was 25 years ago a second world state that had come out of losing two world wars?

In either case, you wont say because you are ashamed of who you are, that is why you put forth such juvenile polemics to Germany - you feel inferior at what Germans have accomplished.

that is what women and brown people feel about White men.
look in the mirror and ACK accordlingly.

>>16536679
>irrational fear of Germany
>because of how well Germany performed in WWI and how Germany had smashed France in the Franco-Prussian war.
I love how you contradict yourself in the same sentence.

>>16536754
>its my responsibility to repay your reprisals towards partisans with even deadlier reprisals towards you
smartest harris fan

>>16536732
>well we cant engage in debate because you're so dishonest you'll talk circles around us
LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL
fucking trading post race cant even handle the NatSocs living in America LMAOOOOOOO
what happened to that high verbal IQ chaim?

>>16536735
>It wasn't right after the war started. In fact, Hitler even proposed the Soviets to join the Axis, so they could destroy Britain together.
>it wasnt right after the war started
no one said it was.
when Britain and France made the anti-German pact around Germany, Hitler had to look for some way to balance out the diplomatic playing field, the enemy of my enemy is my friend, Hitler made a short term truce with the USSR to counter the anti-German pact Britain and France had set up around Germany.

Why do you leave this out? Why do you always forget this?

>>16536737
>>16536740
>you arent allowed to defend yourself from foreign aggression

Why do anti-Hitler chimps sound like the US state dept or the IDF?

>>16536763
Even better, now building Czech schools and settling Czechs in the region was a full scale genocide.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prussian_deportations
Seems like Germans have been genociding Poles since the 19th century.

>>16536775
>short term truce
It probably wasn't short term if they proposed them to join the Axis and destroy British empire. The fact that Soviets wanted more influence in Europe was one of the reasons why Hitler betrayed and decided to destroy them instead of forming this alliance.

>>16536750
really? Here's the excerpt you were looking for
From the Runciman report:
>Czech officials and Czech police, speaking little or no German, were appointed in large numbers to purely German districts; Czech agricultural colonists were encouraged to settle on land confiscated under the Land Reform in the middle of German populations; for the children of these Czech invaders Czech schools were built on a large scale; there is a very general belief that Czech firms were favoured as against German firms in the allocation of State contracts and that the State provided work and relief for Czechs more readily than for Germans. I believe these complaints to be in the main justified. Even as late as the time of my Mission, I could find no readiness on the part of the Czechoslovak Government to remedy them on anything like an adequate scale... the feeling among the Sudeten Germans until about three or four years ago was one of hopelessness. But the rise of Nazi Germany gave them new hope. I regard their turning for help towards their kinsmen and their eventual desire to join the Reich as a natural development in the circumstances.
>>16536754
>losses his best airmen
>destroys less than 3% of their intended targets throughout the war
>remembered as a war criminal by literally everyone

Anglo long term planning at its finest.

>>16536757
The systemic removal of people from their homes, communities, and the destruction of their way of life is classified as a genocide by the Geneva Convention.

>BLM BLM
why is the jew so fixated on negroes? is it because E1BVLLs took his women in the Bronze Age?
Maybe that's why they hate Hitler, because Hitler was E1b and Hitler has been psychologically buck breaking the jews for the past 90 years.

afro-asiatics, not even once.

>>16536793
I posted the same part. Where's this extermination? You know what, don't even bother, I'm through with you. I recognize your posts, your constant lies and dishonesty and I won't be wasting more time replying to you.

>>16536765
>Germany might be able to beat us in a war
>That means Germany will inevitably declare war on us and kill us all

Is the second line a rational or irrational concern relative to the first line?
It is irrational.

Learn to read.
>>16536784
>building czech schools and settling czechs in the region was a full scale genocide
nice pivot.

Removing Germans from their homeland and terrorizing them with a militant foreign police is a form of genocide.
You have moved into the terminal cope stage of trying to make it sound absurd rather than actually argue if it was or wasnt genocide. You have accepted it was genocide, now you just want to slander it as a "it was genocide but isnt it a little ridiculous" lol

Concession accepted.
>Prussian deportations
>genocide
?????????????
They were deporting temporary laborers lol, not even remotely comparable to an actual genocide.

>>16535655
>how do people justify this sheer level of catastrophic incompetence? how can you possibly believe "he totally loved his people bro" while he played such petty egotistical games with their entire existence to fulfill his personal ambitions?
There's a lot of people who can't see through the propaganda of today. The same retards also can't see through propaganda from 80 years ago. Then there's people who absolutely need to be a victim because they've gone their entire lives without actually being one and nazi ideology has being a victim and trying to be privileged baked in via racial hierarchies.

>forms the Sudetendeutsches Freikorps to subvert your host nation and conspire with Nazi Germany to be annexed
>commit acts of terrorism including assassinations, bombings, kidnappings and sabotage while agitating ethnic violence via propaganda and targeted attacks
>czechs expel you post war
>NOOOOOO GENOCIDE
The German cries out as he strikes you.

>>16536791
>it wasnt short term
It is the definition of short term because it specifically had an end date that was planned well within the decade, not at all even remotely similar to a long term alliance.

Also, who cares if someone allied the USSR? The USSR was run by Stalin more than it was run by jews.
The jews were forced to play second string.
>MUH COMMIES
come on now, commies are a problem because jews are a problem.
Communism has been a vector for jewish tyranny, but when jews arent allowed to run wild and rape children or murder your beloved leaders, communism is a poor attempt at Utopia and nothing more just another mysticism.


Hitler had designs on the USSR because he saw its land and resources as necessary to win a final showdown with international jewry which had the West firmly in its grasp.

>>16536821
>That means Germany will inevitably declare war on us and kill us all
War has been constant in Europe throughout the past millennia, and there was a lot of german resentment post WW1.

Once Germany started expansion and annexation, said alliance just kicked into high-gear.

>>16535655
Hitler was a jewish plant that started WW2 as a process of natural selection
The "death camps" were actually a way to weed out the weakest of the jews, ensuring only the strongest could survive and do what is necessary to lay claim to Israel.
This super race of "jewbermensch" was powerful enough to fight off the entirety of the arab world on their own, as well as use their soft power to conquer the west

>>16536809
>where's the extermination
right here
>>>16536793
>>Czech officials and Czech police, speaking little or no German, were appointed in large numbers to purely German districts; Czech agricultural colonists were encouraged to settle on land confiscated under the Land Reform in the middle of German populations; for the children of these Czech invaders Czech schools were built on a large scale; there is a very general belief that Czech firms were favoured as against German firms in the allocation of State contracts and that the State provided work and relief for Czechs more readily than for Germans. I believe these complaints to be in the main justified. Even as late as the time of my Mission, I could find no readiness on the part of the Czechoslovak Government to remedy them on anything like an adequate scale... the feeling among the Sudeten Germans until about three or four years ago was one of hopelessness. But the rise of Nazi Germany gave them new hope. I regard their turning for help towards their kinsmen and their eventual desire to join the Reich as a natural development in the circumstances.
The whole purpose was a systemic effort to make life unlivable for the Germans, that is a genocide according to Article II section (c) of the Geneva Convention.

>constant lies and dishonesty
yet you can not point out a single one.

You are have been humiliated and now you are looking for a way out because the facts are so thoroughly against your position and so thoroughly in favor of Hitler.

Feel free to leave the board entirely if you really feel its 'infested by nazis'.
take another L.

>>16536781
only israel and the us are allowed an independent foreign policy

>>16536860
>Feel free to leave the board entirely if you really feel its 'infested by nazis'.
He's here on his one-tranny crusade in the name of R*ddit and he's delusional enough that he won't stop

>>16536828
??????
We are talking about the Sudeten Germans being genocided by the Czechs in the 1930s.
not whatever nonsense the corrupt slavic apes pulled later, though I am not surprised jewish aligned nations would behave in subhuman ways towards the defeated.
>>16536850
>uhhhh wars happen and Germany was recovering, which means our two super powers are in danger of becoming extinct or however 3/5 of the planet is colonized.
L O L
you are a clown, this is the worst the straw grasping has ever been.
delete your post.

>>16535787
>Hitler himself cannot have any responsibility or agency for the situation.
hold up, explain. how do you explain Hitler having no agency. he literally created a grassroots movement to support him, got elected into power and from there fortified and aggregated all of the power through his office and himself

>>16536891
because they're /pol/fags shitting up the board
DURR DUH WEST IZ BAD HITLER GUD XD

>>16536887
No such thing. Sudeten Germans were guests of the Czechoslovak state and should be expected to conform to the policies of their host nations. If they didn't like their policies then they should've gone back to Germany under the Heim ins Reich policy. Instead, they formed a terrorist group in 1938 and launched an undeclared war against the Czechoslovak state attacking innocent civilians with the aim of sparking an ethnic war and getting Czechoslovkia annexed. They succeeded and Czechia was forced to subsist under tyrannical Nazi rule. They were subversive parasites and Czechoslovakia had all the right to remove partisans from their lands. The Sudeten Germans did exactly what they claim the Jews did to Germany, subversion and agitation.

>>16535655
Pro nazis are shocked that le war and its consequences are bad but only when the onus is on their side.

>>16536860
>infested by nazis
It's literally only you, lol. Your posts are easily recognizable and you post in virtually every thread about Germans and Nazi Germany. And you always post the same shit.

>>16536912
>Sudeten Germans were guests
Sudeten Germans predated the Czech state, if anything the opposite is true.
>you must conform to the policy of genocide if you migrated to a state after its creation
even though you have incorrectly applied this to Czechland, I like the sentiment, you should inform the state of israel and the holocaust museum of this precedent.
>tyrannical nazi rule
no such thing as "nazis".
National Socialist Germany had more freedoms for even Czechs while ruling Czechland.

>>16536912
also
>subversion and agitation
nonsense, the Czechs held all positions of government, held all the power, and the Germans and Sudeten Germans had no desire to make Czechs into trannies or prostitute to their children like the jews did to Germany.
The two are simply not comparable.

Nice try though, I can see you're running out of ammunition.
Would you like a lend-lease? If you openly state you wish for the destruction of israel and an end to organized jewry I will renege on everything I have said.

>>16536784
>jewish like vermin
Based Otto and Tsars Nicholas

>>16536927
While the Sudetendeutsche predate the modern Czech state, this is a pedantic argument. It was the Přemyslid dynasty, who were Slavic in nature and rulers of Bohemia that invited the German settlers to colonize the Sudetenland for economic prospects, they have always been guests. The power dynamics changed when the Habsburgs took over and empowered the Germans, but the Sudetendeutsche should not have expected preferential treatment when the Slavic dominated Czechoslovakia was formed, they should've either conformed to the new status quo or leave, which was made accesible and encouraged by Adolf Hitler and the Heim Ins Reich program.
>policy of genocide
Never happened, instead the Sudeten Germans subverted their host nation and was punished accordingly. Perhaps the Sudeten Germana shouldn't have turned to terrorism and conspiracy.
>National Socialist Germany had more freedoms for even Czechs while ruling Czechland.
Czechs should be in charge of their country, not a German appointed Reich Protector that ruled like a despot.
Your argument that the Sudeten Germans should've been allowed to do whatever they want is equivalent to letting the current Arabic/African migrants be allowed free reign over the West.

>>16536954
The Russians weren't happy about this.

>Contrary to Bismarck's original intentions, the expulsion contributed to the worsening of German-Russian relations and the erosion of their long term cooperation – resulting in a shift in Russia's external policy which finally led to the creation of the Franco-Russian Alliance soon transformed into Triple Entente, which fought the German Empire during World War I in 1914–1918.

>>16536984
Source book?

>>16536934
>nonsense, the Czechs held all positions of government, held all the power,
As they should, Czechoslovakia was first and foremost a country for Slavs.
>Germans and Sudeten Germans had no desire to make Czechs into trannies or prostitute to their children like the jews did to Germany.
Schizophrenic drivel. The Sudeten Germans conspired to bring about the end of Czechoslovakia by forming a paramilitary army that attacked, killed and kidnapped Czechs in order to instigate an ethnic war and spark Czech-German hostility, which succeeded. That is subversive behavior and should be dealt as such.
I don't care for Israel or Palestine, if both of them want exclusive right to exist in the Holy Land and neither wishes to compromise then they should be left to fight each other and let the winner rule via the principle of might makes right.

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>>16535655
He was too autistic to learn anything from WW1.

>>16536991
>>16536974
Enjoyed Polish troop trespassing Czech Church

>>16537010
Why are you moving the goalpost? The discussion was about the Sudetendeutsche, Germany and the Czechoslovak state, not about Poland. I don't believe that Poland was in the right to invade Czechoslovakia, but given the circumstances of letting their ethnic minorities fall into the hands of the Nazis I could understand their concerns. Isn't that what Germany did with Czechoslovakia? They were concerned with Czech "genocide" so they invaded.

>>16537010
illiterate brown

>>16536991
Czechoslovakia was a fake country and does not even exist anymore lmao.
>>16537024
that wasnt me.
but it is interesting you are hyperfixated on Germany when Poland was accused of being in bed with Germany for doing to Czechoslovakia what Germans had always done but with far less legitimacy.
>"genocide"
Why the quotations? it was a literal genocide according to the Geneva convention.

Dont genocide Germans, Germany wont invade you.

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>>16537210
>Dont genocide Germans, Germany wont invade you.

>>16537210
Because the Polish invasion would never have happened in the first place had Germany not conspired to dismember the Czechoslovak state with Hungary, Tiso, the Sudetendeutsche Freikorp and greenlit by the West. While I personally condemn the invasion as a violation of Czechoslovak sovereignty, I can still understand the position of the Poles that needed to protect their minorities from Germany. You only need to look at the treatment of Poles during and before the war to see that they were correct in their assumption.
>it was a literal genocide
Not even the UN recognizes it as an act of genocide, only as a violation of the ICCPR. It wasn't premeditated, or else all of the Germans would've been expelled the moment Czechoslovakia gained independence. It was a direct response to the Sudetendeutsche conspiring with Nazi Germany and subverting Czechoslovakia.
>Dont genocide Germans, Germany wont invade you.
Don't subvert your host nation and you won't be expelled.

>>16536899
well, I figured he could have some kind of insight, if not something so fucking retarded to post it could have gone into a collage of posts like in the times of yore.

>>16537287
>there are still Germans living in Poland rent free physically and psychologically
based?
based
>>16537309
>would never have happened?
What do you mean? Poland was expansionist, do you not consider restoration expansionism?
You consider German restoration expansionism but not Polish restoration?
So which is it?
>Czechoslovak state
not a real country.
>Czechoslovak sovereignty
of what concern is it to you how Germany, Austria, Hungary, and Poland handle their dejure subjects?
What about German sovereignty? by what rights was German land ripped from Germany at Versailles?
>oh uh, they uh lost a war
so everyone is vindicated in breaking up Czechoslovakia right?

So which is it now? Do we defend Germany fore restoring its own sovereignty or do we condemn the West for denying sovereignty?

Really, this is simple, The West will justify any pro-Western position and condemn any counter-Western position, but I like seeing you tie yourself in knots.
>not even
nope.
The UN uses the geneva convention's definition.
Whether it was recognized by the world at the time as a genocide is irrelevant, it was a genocide by the definition given in the Second Geneva Convention: Article II section C.

rest of your post is drivel
>subvert
???????
Why do you call self defense subversion?
Subversion is when you prey upon the population of a friendly host nation under the guise of assisting them.

Sudeten Germans predated Czechoslovakia and Sudeten Germans were only acting in accordance with a defense of their community. They were not trying to make Czechs into trannies or prostitute slovaks like the jews were doing to Germany.

The comparison is simply not there.
Again, nice try though.
Take a verbal IQ test, I think the jews are vastly overrated in IQ, they seem to be around that 89 mark, similar to their other negro admixed cousins in the levant.
Where do you think that knappy hair comes from chaim?

>>16536923
>you always post the same shit
and its never refuted because it is undeniably factual.

Reality is simply against you so thoroughly that one person can throw off your entire shilling op LMFAO

>>16536193
>Does everything he can to prepare for the inevitable growth and expansion of the USSR and communism
lets take a look at that logic, why dont we
>soviet union has to go through romania and poland to touch germany
>romania and poland have an anti-soviet alliance
>they are also both garanteed by france and the UK
>any attempt by the USSR to push into europe will drag romania, poland, france, and the UK into war AT THE VERY LEAST
>be hitler, savior of europe
>attack poland and break up the poland/romania alliance
>sign away half of poland to the soviets
>invade france
france and the UK can no longer continue guaranteeing romania nor can they afford to declare war on the USSR
>the soviet union gets free reign and invades balitc states and takes territory from romania
>entire anti-communist network is completely dismantled and the soviet union is given europe on a silver platter
>based hitler was just trying to fight the soviets bro!

>>16536679
>He loved his people which is why he sent 8 million of them to die and destroyed his nation to fulfill his ambitions

>>16535655
because they hate jews
that's literally what it boils down to
>destroy tens of millions of white people
they-they were being led by jews! it's ok!

>>16536781
by "foreign aggression" of course you of course mean poland not willingly ceding territory, and by "defend yourself" you mean invading to take territory by force

>>16535655
He believed his own hype. The thought process seems to have been "Our enemies outnumber us but we'll just win because we're German".

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>>16535655
he was mentally ill and g*rmans were retarded enough to follow him

>>16538091
>>soviet union has to go through romania and poland to touch germany
Stopped reading here, you're a fucking retarded ape incapable of listening to reason

>>16536679
if he loved his people so much why did he sent literal women and children out to die while he hid in a bunker instead of surrendering?

>>16538136
>just surrender bro
that would be no different than saying "here, rape these women too!"

>>16538135
yes you stopped reading there because you have no argument

Would've been avoided if the French stopped being French.

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>>16538144
Would've been avoided if the Germans stopped being German

>>16538147
frenchman still seething over losing in 6 weeks

>>16535655
>he believes the propaganda narrative
Hitler recreated the russian civil war, and led the “white army” to Moscow. He named operation after the most famous german crusader king of the middle ages. He also wanted a WW-part-2 where germany beat the allies. If you know anything about WWI and its aftermath (which you dont), you would undertsand hitlers motives and actions without hesitation

>>16538150
pure irony

>>16538103
>>16538136
he thought of it as an existential war, to be or not be. If they thought there would still be a Germany after the war, do you really think Goebbels would have killed his entire family?

>>16538160
no, not really

>be allies
>demand unconditional surrender
>make negotiation literally impossible
>make genocidal plans that would result in the destruction of the german nation and the deaths of 40% of it's population which then leaks
>complain that the japanese and germans aren't surrender and that they must be crazy for fighting on

>>16536716
>they made a regional dispute into a global conflict.
Yeah. Its always seemed funny to me how Austria gets hated and blamed for its actions against serbia, “turning a regional conflict into a world war”, yet britain and france are never held to that same standard. Despite the cassus belli in each case being incomparable. Austria had far better a claim for war than britain or france did.
>germany was expansionist and invading its neighbors
So was serbia, which had attacked Turkey, Albania, and Bulgaria, and appeared to want to invade austria-hungary next.
>well then germany violated its treaty!
Serbia violates numerous treaties, with numerous great powers, with zero regard, and in total reckless abandonment. It really was an illegitimate state run by a party of psycho ultranationalists.

Furthermore, serbia had almost openly admitted to murdering the heir to austria. Britain and france had no such ammunition against germany.

So why does austria get the hate for turning the regional fight into the world war, but britain and france are applauded for turning a regional fight into a world war? Inv4 muh holocolaust atrocity homoisms.

>>16536735
It’s bizarre that you would even claim this nonsense.

>>16538169
yes really, considering naonazis still seethe to this day that they couldn't win the war they started

>>16536756
The white race was beginning to fall under threat. That was hitler’s goal of prevention. He also wanted to preserve european empire over the third world, and keep europe as “caput mundi”.

>>16538179
I want you to think through your retorts next time. Put in effort.

>>16538174
>So why does austria get the hate for turning the regional fight into the world war, but britain and france are applauded for turning a regional fight into a world war?

probably because the UK was simply honoring their defensive treaty with poland to come to their aid against a hostile invasion? the UK didnt "turn it into a world war" just because they came to polands aid in agreement with their treaty, Germany turned it into a world war by invading a nation with great power allies knowing full well what they were doing.

>>16538183
>The white race was beginning to fall under threat. That was hitler’s goal of prevention.
By killing tens of millions of white people and only 2.5 million Jews?
Yeah, that doesn't check out.
Also Hitler was never "pro-white". He was strictly a German nationalist.
>>16538183
>He also wanted to preserve european empire over the third world, and keep europe as “caput mundi”.
How in the absolute fuck did civil war strengthen Europeans?

>>16536745
>Poles were not systematically exterminated.
Polish nationalists were considered more dangerous than Nazis and were murdered on sight, yeah, but Poles in general weren't genocided.
>muh reprisals
That's a war crime broseph. Sorry to break it to you but the nazis were le bad

>>16538183
how exactly was invading poland and starting a war within europe going to "save the white race"?

>>16536745
>its not systematic extermination when you systematically exterminate random villages based on their ethnicity as a reprisal against resistance activities

lol this mental gymnastics

>>16538209
>Polish nationalists were considered more dangerous than Nazis and were murdered on sight, yeah, but Poles in general weren't genocided.
Millions of ethnic Poles were killed by the Nazis and millions more were killed by the Russians that were given access to Poland by the Nazis.
The Germans even kidnapped thousands of blonde Polish children that were given name changes for their incorporation into German breeding programs.

Seriously the people obsessed with Hitler come in only three flavors.

(1) Jews that worship Hitler for validating their eternal victim complex. Constantly act like they were the only people who died in WW2 when in fact far more non-Jews were killed. Over ten times more.

(2) Feds ( 4hcna is a well known intelligence gathering honeypot).

(3) Autistic people and Mexicans etc who unironically think Hitler was a hero. Akin to some Russians who think Stalin was a hero and Chinese that think Mao was a hero.

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>>16536763
>Hitler did not even have to entertain coming to the table with Britain and France, yet he did over and OVER.
Yes he did, if the HOA sits you down over burning down your neighbors house, you probably ought to listen to them before they call the cops.
>You say every treaty, what treaty did he break with his good faith allies?
He annexed Czechoslovakia after taking the Sudetenland and pinky promising that he wouldn't go further.
>When defended his allies, rescued them from imprisonment, and held up their armed forces even as those same allies were ready to abandon him.
Doesn't change the fact that he was absolute cancer to the European state of affairs and an absolute thug
>Hitler spurned England by putting an end to the genocide of Germans in Czechland?
Exaggeration
>If the USSR wanted to shore up Cuba with missiles...
we almost did declare war for that but unlike Hitler, nobody in the USA wanted to spark the largest human conflict in history over a minor slight.
>those "treaties" Hitler broke were nothing but bad faith roadblocks meant to keep Germany under the thumb of Versailles?
The Versailles treaties were already being flagrantly violated with the re-armament and expansion of German militarism, and his belligerence towards his neighbors once the leash was slightly loosened shows that it should have been even tighter
>seething this hard about a mad dog being put down
Fido was biting the neighborhood children anon, he had to be shot and crushed and burned. Maybe in your favela you allow mad dogs to run wild but in civilized countries we don't tolerate blatant aggression towards sovereign nations. Nobody cares that someone was mean to you, you aren't allowed to kill their families.
>all this seething
lmaaaoooo grasp those straws harder you fucking troglodyte

>>16537627
We did refute it, you're just too fucking stupid to understand it

>>16538137
Incorrect

>>16536734
>who is to blame for this murder?
>Is it the murderer for engaging in what is a clear pattern of behavior?
>NO, ITS THE VICTIMS, THEY WERE BEING MEAN TO HIM
Case dismissed anon, I sentence Adolf Hitler to suicide in a cuckbunker and the German state to partition.

>>16538266
>can't actually demonstrate why one party is the victim and why one party is the perpetrator other than muh feels
kek

>>16538285
Invasion of sovereign nations is a crime anon.

Get in the cuckbunker, the Soviets are here lol

>>16538245
>unlike Hitler, nobody in the USA wanted to spark the largest human conflict in history over a minor slight.
Mortal enemy parking Armageddon in your backyard is a minor slight.

>re-armament and expansion of German militarism, and his belligerence towards his neighbors once the leash was slightly loosened shows that it should have been even tighter
Allowing mongol savages to come conquer you with no resistance because you signed a paper.

>tolerate blatant aggression towards sovereign nations. Nobody cares that someone was mean to you, you aren't allowed to kill their families
You mean "sovereign" like the nations whose indigenous population is being replaced by the 3rd world right now?

>>16536035
Hitler only cared about Germans you stupid neo nazoid mutt.

>>16538898
>Mortal enemy parking Armageddon in your backyard is a minor slight.
Yeah
>Allowing mongol savages to come conquer you with no resistance because you signed a paper.
Shouldn't have lost
>muh immigrants
Cope and seethe

>>16538913
>>muh immigrants
>Cope and seethe
what's the line of thinking here?
you cant defend the fact the West has completely torpedoed itself over Hitler so you just
>yeah well a 55,000 year old race (the only race to walk on the moon and collapse infant mortality) going extinct isnt THAT bad right??

>>16538902
>only cared about Germans
demonstrably untrue as Hitler wanted to send 150,000 men to defend the British Empire from any and all threats.
Germany would fund the largest expeditionary force in history - forever - solely to defend British interests.
How can you say this man cared solely for Germany?

>>16538934
>55,000 year old race

>>16538250
>we did
nope, you never once provided any evidence contrary to the evidence I put forth.
All youve done is "yeah well thats a good thing" or "nuh uh.... oh well, I mean, is that REALLY so bad??"

You have completely conceded everything and now you seethe because reality is against you.

>>16538193
The Soviets invaded Poland a week later, yet they never declared a war on them.
UK didn't even reach the mainland until after Poland had already fallen.
Then the UK & France celebrated "victory" with Poland and most of Europe under subjugation of mongol savages, who committed mass murders and rapes.
What "aid" is this you speak of?

>>16538228
Hitler cared first and foremost about the German volk, not "the white race". Hitler wanted to unite Germany and was concerned about the Soviets, or the S
savage horde ally that had engulfed all of E-Europe and committed countless atrocities while the west celebrated victory.

Now 80 years later, the 3rd world is a generation or two away from making indigenous Europeans minorities in the whole west.

There's only 1 party in the west that is still winning.

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>>16535655
He thought they could beat them that time

>>16536280
He made several peace offers to GB but Churchill's sugar daddies had other plans.

>>16539161
>Hitler wanted to unite Germany
right, he was a warmonger who thought he could go around 20th century Europe pressing territorial claims, and it obviously blew up in his face. this entire mindset meant he and his people were doomed from the start and he is easily the worst leader in German history

>>16535655
WW1 wasn't seen as horror by the participants. It's just that afterwards anti war propaganda, typically by people who didn't take part in hostilities kicked into high gear.

>>16539122
I dont get it. Why is it some sort of argument for Hitler-apologetics that Britain and France was never able to actually save Poland?
Is this supposed to put a moral dilemma on the topic? Does the murderer get to walk because the murder was never actually prevented?
Iraq conquered Kuwait before the coalition defeat Saddams forces. Should the war have been called off because Saddam defeated Kuwait before they could arrive?

I dont get your fucking logic at all.


>>16539172
>Peace offers
>Let me keep everything I have conquered before you can rearm and actually oppose me

How generous of Hitler.
PS: All of Britain wanted war but stormfaggots have a hard time coping that fact. They need to screech about The Focus while ignoring that both Labour and Conservatives wanted Germany to surrender.
Doesnt matter if Churchill was controlled by 6 gorillion jews, he couldnt have sued for peace even if he had wanted to, nor could he have continued the war even everyone was against it. Churchill had no real power. The real power was with Attlee, Chamberlain and Sinclair. Stormfaggots dont understand parlamentarism.

i dont see nearly enough people talk about the fact that that Hitler wasnt some rags to riches grass roots homeless guy who made it big by his own sheer will, but actually a glownigger intelligence agent

>>16539408
nta but I think the point is that GB and France were not interested in actually saving Poland nor even in preventing a continental hegemon (else they would have done something about the USSR as well). Instead it was plain germanophobic action

>>16539864
that's because your retarded subversion doesn't work

>>16539949
>he doesnt know
lol. who do you think sent him to run the national socialist party in the first place? he didn't just show up because he liked the cut of their jib, he was an intelligence agent sent to take over the party

>>16539927
>lse they would have done something about the USSR as well
they literally had a whole diplomatic system set up to completely buttfuck the ussr if they tried to push further into Europe, which Hitler completely destroyed, handing the soviets half of europe on a silver plater, after which they spent the rest of the century in a cold war against them

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>>16539122
>The Soviets invaded Poland a week later, yet they never declared a war on them.
because Hitler had invaded first and the Allies couldn't fight the Soviets and Germans at the same time, r*tard
>and most of Europe under subjugation of mongol savages, who committed mass murders and rapes
Nazi regime was objectively worse for Slavic people. Stalin allowed Poles and Czechs to have their own states, while Hitler planned to exterminate and germanize them (Generalplan Ost). There would be no Poles and Czechs today if Germany had won the war - Churchill saved these nations from annihilation.


If Germany didn't carve up eastern Europe with the Soviets, and then the USSR attacked Poland/Romania first:
-The whole of Europe would unite against Bolshevism and support the invaded country.
-The Soviets would be fighting alone, there would be no lend lease from Americans.
-British and French bombers would destroy Soviet oil-production facilities in the Caucasus (Operation Pike)
-There would be no propaganda material for Soviets to total war, there would be no "Great Patriotic War". During Operation Barbarossa Germans murdered thousands of innocent civilians, burned whole villages, starved cities and mistreated Soviet POWs - German invasion greatly mobilized Soviet society to total war.

The truth is that without German chimp out Europeans would be better off. Independent Finland, Romania and Poland had much greater potential to resist against Soviet invasion, because they could unite the whole western world and would never become a threat for other countries (the complete opposite of German expansionism and aggresive policy).
Btw. if Germany played it smart, they could offer their guarantee to Poland in case of Soviet aggresion, for Danzig and extraterritorial highway to Prussia. But these were never real offers, just mere pretexts to destroy independent Poland and vassalize it.

>>16539122
>a week later,
i love how you had to plant this lie to try and exaggerate your point because you knew it would sound better that way

>>16540031
17 days = 1 week
stormfaggot logic

>>16539927
The assurance was enough to save Poland. Why would Germany attack a nation under the protection of UK and France?
Britain was legally binded to declare war if Germany attacked, otherwise it would have been a second Munchen.
Do you know why USA never attacked Cuba? Do you know why USA never invaded North Vietnam?
Because they had assurances.
So again, their assurance should have been enough to save Poland, even if they didnt have any viable plan to take offensive actions against Germany already in 1939. Why would the Germans attack and risk igniting a world war?

>nor even in preventing a continental hegemon (else they would have done something about the USSR as well). Instead it was plain germanophobic action.

Yeah so they're just gonna start ww3 immediately after ww2 ended with millions more casualties from death and starvation because stormfaggots might chimp out about it 80 years later.

Oh no wait, it was the JEWS.

>>16540028
>If Germany didn't carve up eastern Europe with the Soviets, and then the USSR attacked Poland/Romania first:

Stormfaggots also pretend like the Winter War and the purges never was a thing.

If there had been no Hitler, and USSR started ww2 on their own, the purges would still have happened.
The only difference is that the Soviets wouldnt realize how bad their army was against some poor ragtag handful of infantry divisons in an isolated forested in Finland.
They would realize it when going up against well prepared and equipt Polish and Romanian divisons against real defensive lines.

For christ sake the Finns had no heavy equiptment, no armor, no airforce, barely no artillery, they were using bottles as granades, and they destroyed an entire Soviet army in just a couple of months. Has the Winter war been memoryholed in these debates?
If the USSR started ww2 for whatever reason, they would have been fucked.

>>16539408
Money talks and bullshit walks. The British gave up their currency and fought for their bankers. Churchill wasn't the only one either. It started before the Great Game, and accelerated with the Napoleonic Wars.
More specific to WWII they only declared war on Germany not on USSR
And France attacked Germany first. It was a feint probably or a provocation or an attack nonetheless.
TLDR: WWII was started by London bankers and finished by New York bankers. Most if not all of them jews.

>>16540185
>And France attacked Germany first
Actually they didn't; they started to posture with some "Phoney War". This means that Hitler still got his one another chance to withdraw from Poland and negotiate peace. But he has chosen to launch an attack against France.

>>16540222
>is engaged on Eastern Front
>receives report French launch their anticipated assault somewhere along the border
>"we were just posturing mon ami hon hon hon"
I guess Stalin also was posturing when he sent his divisions to the border in attack mode. Hitler just misunderstood their friendly intentions.

>>16538388
so what gives Britain, the US or France the right to enforce that? Who is going to punish them?
>>16540028
>that atrocious reddit meme
YOU NEED TO GO BACK

>>16540231
The French and the Brits were prepared for the defense of Benelux, not for an attack. That's why they were outflanked and lost. Initially that is.

>>16535655
Things looked pretty decent bro until Dec 1941, when it became clear it'd take atleast 5x times the effort to take the USSR down. Even in mid 1943 you could have made a kinda deranged argument Germany could BTFO the Western allies, looking at their losses and developing a moany Iraq War-esque attitude and declaring the liberation of Europe over, Naples is enough because the the homeland of pizza is conquered. Then they could broker a peace deal with the USSR.

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>>16540232
>YOU NEED TO GO BACK
Only one who needs to go back is you. Hitler worshiping wehraboo /pol/tard.
Unfortunately this board is infested with you cunts.
>HURR DURR JEWS DID IT

>>16540293
So you admit you are a redditor?

>>16538193
>probably because the UK was simply honoring their defensive treaty with poland to come to their aid against a hostile invasion*?
*unless the Soviets do it, then it's ok

>>16540311
Not perfect but better than nothing.

>>16540297
Lol I would be banned from reddit within a minute because I hate globohomo as much as the next person.
I just dont suck Hitlers dick and circlejerk every fucking topic that even remotely includes Germany or the nazies you dumb fucking retard. That doesnt qualify me as a redditor, even less as a leftist. Only /pol/faggors like you have deluded themselves that worshipping Hitler is some sort certificate to not be a redditor.

The only thing you are capable of is shitposting and parroting bitchute and zoomer propaganda that lacks both logic, reason and sources. Youre fucking vermin to the board and can only explain history with jews.
Fuck off

>>16540374
24/7 hours a day with your butthurt
OBESSESED

>>16540377
Do you ever stop worshipping Hitler or is it something you do 24/7

>>16540185
Ah so you're finally admitting that Churchill was merely just a stonecold patriot with the same attitude towards Germany as Horatio Nelson had to France?
Good, then maybe you can shut the fuck up about the jews controlling him for once?
Churchill was selected because he had been a do-or-die-for-the-empire type of character long before ww2 and even ww1. The parlament selected him in 1940 specifically for this reason and not because he was some good man, so it wouldnt have mattered if he was controlled by 6 gorillion jews. Everyone knew his stance on Germany and thats what they wanted.

Britain was only legally obligated to declare war on Germany because
1. The assurance was specifically aimed at Germany
2. Poland never declared war on the USSR

It also wasnt feasible to engage both at the same time, the likelyness would have been that USSR would have been dealt with if Germany was defeated by the established plans which anticiapted a quick victory against the much weaker Germany.
By 1945, the war had gone sideways and millions were dead and cities destroyed and economic and social collapse not just in Europe but the world. Everyone wanted the war to end. Only stormfaggots wanted ww2 to continue.
It wasnt even the same war in 1945. France and Britain were completely subservient to the will of the United States, and the US wanted to trust in the UN to resolve future issues, not launch Barbarossa 2.0

>>16540311
The thing is that the Soviets attacked 3 weeks later which is more important to the explaination than you might seem to understand. Hitler likely expected Stalin to honor the pact and attack Poland simultaniously in order to deter Britain, but because Stalin waited, Britain and France saw only one aggressor at the time. By the time the Soviets attacked, war had already been declared on Germany. The alternative would have been to "Undeclare" war on Germany.

You're also looking at this completely from a vacuum perspective.
The USSR had not spent the past 4 years pissing everyone off by breaking treaties, pacts and promises, or threaten war everytime they didnt get their way.
You make it sound like this all happened one morning and so we should only try to explain it from that timeframe.
No, Poland was the final straw.

Neither of the ejewcated here have bothered to read outside of their school textbooks.
>Go & read AJP Taylor. His book "Origins of the Second World War" was controversial only because he intended to counter the popular British narrative of war. And mind you, there were lot's of historians who yelled at him but nobody ever has been able to "Debunk" his work, which comprises solely of the official diplomatic communications between Germany, Italy, Czechs, Poles, English, French & Soviets.
>Viktor Suvorov, an ex-GRU soviet Intelligence agent. A man with such a high credibility revealed the impeding Soviet Invasion of Europe which Hitler successfuly foiled. - "Icebreaker: Who started the Second World War"
>Stephen Mitford Goodson's "History of Cnetral Bankin & Mankind's enslavement" about the common lies regarding the 1933-1945 German economy, including the "Armament production myth".
Y'all better read somethin than to spit here on anyone who looks sane
>Churchill was funded by Jews just before rising into Politics - Sir Henry Strakosch, a Jewish banker if you want a name.
Communists were basically Jewish children, everybody knows that. From Marx to Trotstky to Yagoda. Roosevelt was under the slipepr of Morgenthau. Six members of his cabinet were Jewish.

>>16540534
>AJP Taylor.

Taylor isnt even controversial. Pretty much every historian has accepted his thesis that ww2 was a geopolitical struggle and that Britain severely Fucked up during the interwar period by disowning its relations with France. Historians today have even taken it further and explains that appeasement was merely just a preparation for war rather than to avoid it, that Chamberlain just needed more political manouverability to confront Germany, and more time to prepare UK rearment.

>Viktor Suvorov
This is where the bullshit starts.
Suvorov isnt a historian, wrote his book before Russian archieves were even available, use zero citations and sources for his thesis, he basically makes it up on baseless assumptions.

Not only does he not have any sources for his claims, but it also defy all logic.
A lot of questions which Suvorov never answers.

1. Why would the USSR prepare for an offensive war after what happened in Finland?
Finland proved that the Red Army was unfit for war, that the purges had destroyed the entire foundation of a functioning military, that the Red Army needed a severe overhaul

2. Why would the USSR prepare for an offensive war if Germany had just defeated France at record speed, using mechanized divisions that the Soviets did not even have (they had previouslt been abolished)

3. Why did the Soviets honor their trade quotas and even increased their trade quotas with Germany even in 1941?
The Germans did not fullfill their quotas and began to outright ignore their share of goods for all the oil and rubber and food they imported in 1941, specifically becasuse the Germans were preparing to break the pact.

4. Your only argument is "look at how many divisions they had at the border".
But were these less number of divisions than what existed in the previous Stalin-Line? Why were these divisons spread across the entire frontline, and not grouped? Why were they busy building fortifications in 1941

>>16540625
Cont

5. Why do you ignore the fact that is was completely logical for Germany to invade the USSR in 1941?
Germany had no way to engage Britain at sea and air and overseas as all of these categories was a war of resource attrition which Germany couldnt win, and yet they need to find a way to either
A: Convince Britain to sue for peace
B: Gain an edge over Britains resource availability.


6. The Germans were likely more motivated to fight the USSR than the USSR was motivated to fight Germany after the debacle in Finland. The Winter War and the French campaign showed the obvious superiorty of the wehrmacht and the obvious inferiority of the Red Army. Hitler had a window of opportunity to strike as soon possible before this edge could be rectified.

7. The Soviets apparently did everything to stall for time and even ignored warnings of a German preparation to attack. This contributed to the German success as frontline units were ordered not to respond to any "provocation". Stalin knew the Red Army was not yet fit against the wehrmacht and needed more time, he had to believe Hitler was not going to break the pact.
The Soviets tried to join the Axis in 1941, and Hitler deliberately ignored this specifically because he was planning to attack while Stalin wanted to buy more time to course-correct the Red Army from the purges.

8. The German invasion makes more sense when you take economics into factor. Germany was a army-based military. Britain was a naval-based military.
After the defeat of France, the Wehrmacht was huge but could not be used, and how long would Britain stay in the war? The huge army had a cost to be maintained and would have to be demobilized to reduce the cost. Hitler had to make a choice to demobilize the army in a time when morale and experience was at its peak.

>>16540690
cont

9. The German trade quotas with the USSR was insufficient, especially in food imports, and Germany had to constantly raise the quota in order to meet the demands.
This gave Stalin opportunites to demand more influence, especially over Finland, Bulgaria, Iran and Turkey.
The situation would have been far more feasible for Germany if they could simply control these resources on their own instead of being dependent on Stalin and appease his demands.
Again, why would Stalin want to invade Germany when he is practically getting everything he wants from the status-quo?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German%E2%80%93Soviet_economic_relations_(1934%E2%80%931941)

10. Ignoring logic and reason. Are there any actual sources that the Soviets were planning to invade? Why has there been nothing found in their state archieves?
Mind you, the Soviet state archieves only opened up AFTER Icebreaker was published, after the collapse of the USSR, so Suvorov would have had even less access (none) to them than modern historians.
Theres no document to suggest Stalin would have planned or approved for such actions. The only documents found has been contingency plans by the army command (which isnt very spectacular, since even USA had plans for a war with Britain, War Plan Red).


>Churchill was funded by Jews just before rising into Politics - Sir Henry Strakosch, a Jewish banker if you want a name.

And Hitlers family had been financially bailed by Eduard Bloch. Does this mean Hitler was under the shackels of the jews? Does this explain why he protected jews during the war while letting Germans be firebombed?
How does Strakosch explain anything about Britain? Churchill was selected because the Labour party wanted someone who was uncompromising on the war with Germany. That's why Churchill was picked, not because of his merits (which were terrible), but because he was one of the few conservatives who agreed with the labour party that Britain must defeat Germany.

>>16540690
You didn't even read Suvorow. There are are literally hundreds of citations in his books and he _directly_ answers some of your questions. The ones which make sense that is. (re 2, they obviously did have motorized divisions and obviously they were not structured identically to German mechanized divisions).

>>16540825
btw. you can read Mark Solonin (another Russian author) if you want to have conformation of Suvorov's thesis in recently available archives.
But whatever really, it just says that Hitler did what Stalin wanted him to do but he had his own mind and his own strong state and he bears his own responsibility for actually initiating the hostilities. Suvorov doesn't exonerate Hitler.

>>16540825
No the Soviets had abolished mechanized divisions, and they were only re-introduced after the Wehrmacht success against France.
By the time of the German invasion, they were still being fitted and staffed due to the rapid reformation.

And no, Suvorov doesnt answer ANY of these questions and neither will you. His book uses zero citations and his arguments are based on assumptions.
It's fiction.
Stalin probably would have broken the pact under the right circumstances (and I say probably because its my own speculation that I conjured out of my own assumptions), but to argue he was planning to do it in 1941 makes no sense, not even in logic, let alone sources, and you're going to need more than a single paragraph post to convince me.

Another argument would also be why were the Soviet forces divided into three echelons all the way to Smolensk if they were preparing to attack? Again it makes no sense.

>>16538237
None of these claims ever happened

>>16538193
Just sounds like UK fanboyism if you ask me. Why was the UK allowed to attack the Ottoman empire in pure aggression? I just think it’s interesting that you guys always seem to never write paragraphs condemning the actions of that empire. It’s almost apologist tier.

>>16540911
>but to argue he was planning to do it in 1941 makes no sense
Suvorov's explanation of the date is that Stalin had started a huge, slow, (for deception purposes) rolling mobilization two years prior (with conscripting many people who didn't do their service in previous years) and their term would end in September 1941' so his army would be the strongest in the summer and gradually getting weaker later on. It is corroborated by the huge initial losses in Barbarossa. Also, he cites many opinions of war strategists that mobilization equals war, etc.
I consider this off-topic. Hitler was the main culprit for me.

>>16540430
NTA but jews had inordinate influence over Churchill because jews like henry strakosh paid for his degeneracy and made it possible for him to keep his estate.

>>16541003
>Hitler was the main culprit for me
cont, because all, factual or not, Stalin's plans would mean nothing without Hitler's offensive in 1939.

>start a war based on racial purity and the idea of a master race
>get absolutely heemed and btfo by two mutt armies

can't make it up.

>>16538941
>the West Eurasian type didnt exist prior to 1934
I wish

>>16541003
Again, this is just an assumption based on anecdotes.
Suvorov can make the claim that the BT tank could travel fast on roads. Germany has better roads than Russia, Hence they were preparing to invade Germany.
His argument is based on novelties that are blown out of porportion
It's nothing but conspiracy theory.

Also, Hitler had decided to invade the USSR even during the French campaign (OKW draft of the invasion the next month was Operation Otto).
This was before the Soviets had even annexed the Baltic states and forwarded their divisions to the German border, it was before the Molotov line. Suvorov doesnt adress this fact and neither will his supporters here.

>>16539188
>removing military juntas is warmongering
what do you call England colonizing half the planet then?
>uhhhh it was ok at the time
so we are ladder kicking now?
>its only wrong for you to catch me so I get to keep my head start

>doomed from the start
worked for the Americans
>worst leader in Germany history
again, the Americans who did this became a global inspiration.

You didnt even know Schacht and Hitler based their economic and martial plans on the AmRev until I told you.
Take another L.

>>16541013
>The jews were controlling Churchill

What about Chamberlain
What about Arthur Greenwood
What about Clement Attlee
What about Edward Wood Halifax
What about Archibald Sinclair
What about Anthony Eden
All of these men were either party leaders or high ranking faction leaders within the party. All of these men wanted war with Germany in 1939 after Germany invaded Poland.
Attlee and the entire labour party wanted war with Germany already in 1938

What about the entire Briitsh parlament?

When Britain delcared war, the motion was put before the parlament:
"Motion put: That a sum, not exceeding £500,000,000 be granted to His Majesty, beyond the ordinary grants of Parliament, towards defraying the expenses which may be incurred during the year ending on the 31st day of March, 1940, for securing the public safety, the defence of the realm, the maintenance of public order and the efficient prosecution of any war in which His Majesty may be engaged and for maintaining supplies and services essential to the life of the community."

The vote was unanimous, meaning every single MP voted yes.
On the motion of introducing conscription, the vote was 340 votes to 7.


According to the /pol/ logic, every single MP in the British parlament, including the head of state (the king), was under jewish influence. How far does this jew ad-hoc argument stretch to explain everything and anything?
Is it so hard to believe Hitler singlehandedly drew the ire of Britain on him and not because the jews made them do it?
Churchill was selected in 1940 purely because of his do-or-die attitude towards Germany by the Labour party. They knew who Churchill was before he was selected. He could have been enslaved by 6 gorillion jews and it wouldnt have changed anything.


The burden is actually on you fucks to prove how Churchill was able to continue the war if the parlament and cabinet was against it.
But I expect this post to go unanswered. It always does.

>>16539408
>I dont get your logic
well it wasnt a murder.
pointing this out is to point out how Britain and France were politically shallow with no other aim than fabricating a cassus belli against their Middle European rival.
This removes the veneer of moral supremacy The West has enjoyed regarding WWII.
This is important because if we are to present an unbiased telling of WWII one has to break down the emotional barriers to the reception of this narrative.
>conquered
?????????????
What did Hitler conquer? What did he take by martial conquest that wasnt already within the German sphere?
>all of Britain wanted war
nope.
War support was very low.
>stormfaggots
its stormweenie, 2015 migrant.

Even if they supported the war at the time, the vast majority came to regret the war - Source Unknown Warriors by Nicholas Pringle.
A collection of accounts of British veterans. They said they wouldnt have enlisted had they known the outcome, and a plurality said they would have preferred if Germany had occupied England.

It is the staunchest refutation of your retarded "NEVER NODZEEE" views.

>Churchill couldnt have sued for peace
no one is asking him to, it is pointed out Churchill NEVER came to the table EVER.
No one asked Churchill to take the first step, all they ask of him is "Why didnt he accept peace when it was offered?"
He had the majority of power, the final say, and was extremely heavy handed with his own generals and political leaders when it came to the USSR.
>Attlee
also lobbied by the jews
>Chamberlain
died early on and was also lobbied by jews like strakosh
>sinclair
another target of The Focus.
>you just dont understand parliament
If Britain is forced to fight, even if its people and its state did not wish to, to whom or what do we ascribe this lack of agency or enslavement?

>>16536193
>Expects that Britain wouldn't behave like an insane fratricidal maniac who would rip herself apart to destroy Germany
Should have listened when they said not to do things.

>>16539864
>>16540018
You are retarded, Himmler investigated Hitler behind Hitler's back.
His family was retarded, one Hitler worked for a jew but had a falling out, Hitler's friends attributed his path in life to his passion for German art and history, and Hitler was most interested in private with the American West, Norse mythology, and the British Aristocracy.

also, people arent against glowies because they glow, they are against glowdogs because they are subversive and hostile.

>>16541059
>Also, Hitler had decided to invade the USSR even during the French campaign (OKW draft of the invasion the next month was Operation Otto).This was before the Soviets had even annexed the Baltic states and forwarded their divisions to the German border, it was before the Molotov line. Suvorov doesnt adress this fact and neither will his supporters here.
It has no bearing on supposed Stalin's plans of exploiting the capitalists' war for the purpose of European Revolution. I can easily believe that Hitler could have attacked the USSR not as a "preventive strike" but also just because. But this doesn't exonerate Stalin from guilt either because he did continue to trade with Hitler (despite trade blockade by the allies) before the clash. You can at least say that it has turned out to be unwise.

>>16536193
>England says not to do the thing or they'll go to war
>do thing
>complain they went to war
Truly Perfidious Albion strikes again.

>>16538183
>He also wanted to preserve european empire over the third world, and keep europe as “caput mundi”.
Literally the exact opposite. Britain and France were still in favor of keeping their empires prior to 1939, while Hitler consistently sided with proto-third-worldist/decolonization freaks like Bose in India or Al-Husseini in the Levant, not to mention the alliance with the explicitly anti-European Japanese.

>>16540025
yeah, Hitler gave Europe to the USSR by killing so many Slavs the Eastern Bloc could not field a full strength division until 1960.

The West gave Europe to communism, furthermore the West pioneered denazification which removed the four olds in Germany then removed the four olds in England and America and all of Europe.

>>16541101
>Should have listened when they said not to do things.
>DO WHAT I SAY NOW!
>>16541116
>Britain deliberately interferes in and disrupts German-Polish diplomacy
>then acts like they had no choice they were good boys who dindu nuffin
the absolute state

>>16540028
>the allies couldnt fight the Soviets and the Germans at the same time
so the best outcome is they fight the people who are friendliest to them and most like them?

The West was controlled by jews, this is why they wanted war with Germany, they supported embargoes on Germany.
The French in particular also harbored an ethnic hatred of the Germans whom they attributed to their string of defeats and decline.
>carve up Eastern Europe with the Soviets
The military junta in Poland was removed and the two former and rightful owners retrieved their land.
It wasnt "carved up".
>the whole of Europe would be united against Bolshevism
It was, except in the West.
>The Soviets would be fighting alone
They were, if not for the West.
>British and French bombers
none wanted, none needed. Furthermore, why even fight Germany at all? Why not just stay out of it and focus on shoring up their own interests within their actual sphere of interest?
>Germans murdered thousands of innocent civilians
nope.
Germans were hailed as liberators, and overwhelmingly it was Ukrainians, Belorussians, even Russians themselves bring forward jewish commissars and their families and requesting the Germans execute them - Source, Peter Nicols Britain's Blunder.
>without British chimpout Europeans would be better off
True.
>German expansionism
doesnt exist, Germans never once went beyond land formerly ruled by German speakers.
>aggressive policy
doesnt exist - see above.
>these were never real offers
yes they were, thats why everything was put into place as a show of good faith.
Do you even read about this conflict and its political lead up or do you just spout things that you think make sense from watching the history channel?

>>16541071
That was a good read. Not a stormfaggot just admiring this diamond in the pile of shit that /his/ is.

>>16540063
>Britain was legally binded
nope, Britain was breaking treaties all over and felt no compulsion to follow Versailles or the abide by the Geneva convention, nor did they have any issue with casting aside allies during wartime such as the Greeks and Polish Government in exile and also the Czech pro-Western faction.
Britain had a choice, furthermore if they really didnt have a choice, then is Poland really worth the entire Empire, the Home Islands, and Anglo-Saxons racially?
That was the price.
>The USA never attacked Cuba
They invaded Cuba multiple times lmao.
>never invaded North vietnam
They conducted multiple operations in north vietnam.
>immediately start WW3
which they did, it was called the Cold War.
>millions more casulties
Which they had no problem with lmao.

also
>BRITAIN HAD TO IT WAS LEGALLY BINDING...except the USSR cant be fought because uh well uh

Also, the USSR was much weaker in 1945 than it would become.
it wouldnt be WWIII, it would be The West rolling over an army they outnumbered 3:1 and had a material superiority that is hard to imagine.
A material superiority at that particular time greater than what they had over the Germans.
>it was the jews
strakosh
baruch
untermeyer

Yeah, it was literally the jews

>>16540086
>stormfaggots
go back.
>winter and purges were never a thing
who says this?

>the USSR was le paper tiger
Right, until the Western allies began giving infinite gibs LMFAO.

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437 KB JPG

>>16540222
>it was just posturing to invade the Saarland with 85 fucking divisions

>>16540293
>>16540374
>i am le based
nah, youre a jew who doesnt like the hostility of liberalism towards jews and you obviously dislike Hitler because he fought jewish power

>>16541154
>Britain deliberately interferes in and disrupts German-Polish diplomacy

Why is this an argument?
The more I hear it, the more I begin to wonder, what is the argument here?
Because what you are actually saying is that everything was fine as long as Poland was the underdog and thus had to comply in negotiations they did not want to endure, but simply had to in order to avoid being destroyed.

But as soon as they were in a position of strength equal to the germansthanks to Britains position, and thus could assert their own interests, which was not to do everything Germany told them to do, then suddenly this is a bad thing?
Why?
Why couldnt the Germans just respect the fact that Poland did not want their demands?


All Hitler had to do was not invade. He could have resumed negotiations at another time. A better time. A time that wasnt just a few week after he had invaded Czechia which put everyone on high alert over his real intentions.

>>16540484
>literally waiting two weeks is all it takes to fool Britain and France into going extinct
L O L

>breaking treaties
nope.
Hitler never had to even entertain the idea of "treaties"
Why would Britain demand a treaty over Czechoslovakia or Poland? nations they do not border, do not share a history with, and have no cultural economic, or political interest in?

They were used solely to roadblock German restoration and to provide a cassus belli to justify a war against Germany.

>>16541181
Honey, if this war was won by the Jews there would be no such thing like Germany anymore. With full support of the Soviet Union no one would have protested.

>>16540625
Suvorovs methods were like Varg, he shouldnt have known at the time but he was actually correct as we see from the Soviet Archives and from speeches given by Stalin at the time.
Stalin gave two speeches in 1939 about the USSR needing to look beyond its borders toward martial conquest to expand the Revolution and prevent a regression into complacency.
>he was just saying that
unlikely given that we can now read his private correspondences, he really was a true believer, for whatever reason, he actually and literally believed in The Revolution.
Boomers love to wax poetic
>communism was just a ploy to control people
for jews yes, for Stalin no, the man was tried and true Red blooded Red.
>why would the USSR prepare for a war when Finland
The USSR got more concessions out of Finland than what it originally set out to do, it also reformed its army and had demonstrated itself more than capable of military action in the latter months of the Winter war.
>why would the USSR prepare against Germany
because Germany was a rising power and the greatest barrier to a pan-Slavic communist state?
The Reds were building airfields and railways into the West.
>why did the Soviets honor their pacts with Germany
because the USSR wasnt stupid and knew a war with Germany could go either way, therefore more preparation was required.
>Germans did not fulfill their quotas
no, they did, right up until the attack was about to take place and when war had become inevitable.
To Stalin war was not inevitable because he was not fighting the bizarrely fanatical western jews.


Stalin even stated to Hitler his final goal was Peter the Great's ideal Russia.
Stalin was also likely nostalgic for an older Russia where Caucasians played a more prominent role which I personally think profoundly influenced how he saw his role in Russia.

>>16540690
>Germany had no way to engage Britian at sea
not really, Germany had a plan for a Naval rearmament that could contest the ocean, it was cut short by the war and really it was cut short by the fact the USSR and Britain were not at war.
I agree with the rest of your post.

>>16541221
>Because what you are actually saying is that everything was fine as long as Poland was the underdog
You're just asserting it because you want it to be so. Hitler's requests toward Poland were reasonable, would have cost Poland very little, and would have ensured healthy relations between the two nations.

>But as soon as they were in a position of strength equal to the germansthanks to Britains position
They weren't, though, they were just spurred into hostile and suicidal aggression because the British promised them nonsense they couldn't possibly come through on

>Why couldnt the Germans just respect the fact that Poland did not want their demands?
"hey can you stop mistreating the ethnic german minority, which I, as a German nationalist leader, have a responsibility to protect?
"DON'T FUCKING DEMAND ANYTHING OF ME FUCK YOU!!!"
As has been repeated to you, yet unable to penetrate your thick fucking skull, You cannot characterise German-polish diplomacy as simply "hitler demanding things for no reason". When you have a diplomatic problem, you solve it. You don't leave the status quo and then cry one party tried to move the situation to am amicable place.
> A better time.
That's simply not how the situation was in 1939. More instability in eastern europe means more chaos for the USSR to exploit while petty europeans states fight over minutiae.
You'll deny this matters and that the USSR wasn't a threat (somehow) because it's convenient to you.

>>16540728
>any actual sources the Soviets were planning to invade
Yes, Stalin gave two speeches declaring the necessity of military expansion to further the Revolution and Stalin stated his "end state" Russia which included The Baltic Sea minus Sweden, and all of the former Russian Empire.
>Hitler's family
but not Hitler himself nor did eduard bloch put any demands on Hitler himself or upon his family, whereas strakosh was literally apart of a lobbyist group trying to get Britain to take and sustain a conflict with Germany.
>Churchill was selected
by people who were in touch with The Focus, also had Hitler not been selected, the Focus would have just shifted their mark to whoever was selected.

You can not deny the jewish influence on British statecraft at the time.

Why do you devote so much effort into belittling and denying it?
You talk about classified documents, Britain wont even release its government meetings from the era because every name on it would be jewish.

>>16541245
pay no attention to the fact fdr advisor list is like skimming a bar mitzvah guestlist goyim

>>16541285
Must have been pretty merciful after all. Or powerless.

>>16541285
>le advisors are heckin jooz
nevermind the fact the list the stormniggers post usually is populated by people who aren't actually jewish, the ones that are also have accolades, accomplishments, and/or education to back up their role as an advisor. same goes for the non-jews.
FDR had people who knew what they were talking about. Hitler had people like goerring, someone who probably had trouble wiping his own ass and was nodding off on opiods during most of their meetings.

>>16541285
Or as I like to call them, "Morgenthau and the Gentiles"

>>16541071
>What about Chamberlain
met with untermeyer and was lobbied by the Focus using Churchill as a vector.
>What about Arthur Greenwood
personal friend of Churchill
>What about Clement Attlee
Met with The Focus alongside Churchill at the Savoy Hotel
>What about Edward Wood Halifax
bizarrely pro-Churchill warhawk.
>What about Archibald Sinclair
literally joined the Focus in 1936.
>What about Anthony Eden
literally on the payroll of The Focus via strakosh.
that's four out of the six you listed, that's a majority who are under significant jewish influence.

What evidence do you need?
>the entire British parliament
Parliament isnt sovereign, Parliament is subject to the parties and the parties share their power with the party leaders and most popular figureheads within the parties, that is a parliamentarian coalition works.
but you knew that already.
>the vote was unanimous
like the US votes unanimously today in favor of israel.
>according to pol logic
???????????????????
>everyone was under jewish influence
????????????????????????????????
I just showed you a majority of the prominent British politicians from your own list were under jewish influence.
What more do you want?

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>>16541328
>the Focus

>>16541071
>as it always does
It has been answered repeatedly.
Just like it was here
>https://desuarchive.org/his/thread/16403750/#16405511
and here
>https://desuarchive.org/his/thread/16367652/#16369366

You are in denial.

>>16541245
There is no such thing as a Germany anymore. The German speaking lands of Middle Europe are multiracial, multicultural, and currently under military occupation by a foreign power.

That is what jewish victory looks like yes?

>>16541300
or maybe they got what they wanted because Germany pays reparations to israel, while the holocaust is something of a state religion which is illegal to blaspheme, and Germany will in two decades be minority German.

>>16541347
Congratulations on the time machine working but you're in the year 2024 now, not 1946. Might be best for you to return to your own time.

>>16541347
remember, everyone's a poojeet until proven otherwise
so why do you care about what goes on in germany, saar?

>>16541337
Yeah the anti-German group founded by an international jew who called all international jews into a holy war with Germany?

>>16541364
>>16541370
schizoposting

Another L for tel aviv

>>16535787
Nazis was claiming that Britain et al was run by jews and that jews wanted to destroy Germany
So yes maybe he could've predicted that they would idk try and destroy Germany

>>16541381
The Federal Republic of Germany exists, I think you might be the schizophrenic if you disagree

>>16541372
>Yeah the anti-German group founded by an international jew who called all international jews into a holy war with Germany?
literally all of that is bullshit david irving spewed out his sickened british asshole. the focus was a group of upperclass left-leaning individuals who could ally with the conservative churchill under a common goal of ending nazi appeasement. that's it. they'd come together and brainstorm political maneuvers they could take to undermine hitler's attempts to strongarm europe.

>inb4 the 'judea calls for war against germany' newspaper headline posted

>>16535655
He assumed anglos wouldn't stop him from defending europe from bolshevism. He was wrong. Never trust an anglo to be reasonable.

>>16541538
Did the Slavs started to be subhuman after bolshevism or before?

>>16541419
>founded by untermeyer
>funded by strakosh
>untermeyers 1930s meetings in Paris
You were saying?

Organized jewry was the cause of WWII. This is simply undeniable.
>Le Irving
It’s from Nicols actually.

>>16541635
How did they force Hitler to attack Poland.

>>16541635
>funded by strakosh
funded... and then what? so churchill could swan dive into comically large pools of gold coins?
the focus headed research into nazi germany and her crimes, and any such research will demand money to head them.
its funny how, for stormfaggots, its always 'X colluded with/funded/founded Y' and then that's that. there's no more talk into the dealings of these people, what they discussed, where the money went. they leave that up to the reader to decide, and of course their intention is for the reader to go for the worst explanation possible.

>>16541245
they let germans as a people live because they would make good cannon fodder in case the cold war went hot. It is no coincidence that migration to Germany accelerated after the unification with now over 25 million (!) non-germans in just a few decades

>>16541399
And which Reich is that?

>>16541210
Coped harder rotted rat

>>16541639
What does this have to do with British jewry?
Also, concession accepted. You’ve stopped denying jewish influence now you’re pivoting to justifying Britian’s actions under jewish influence.

Britain emboldened Poland by giving them assurances against Germany causing Poles to rebuff ever more charitable German overtures.

>>16541688
I didn't concede shit you faggot. I have showed you that your babbling is self-contradictory as Hitler received a clear warning that starting a war will end bad for him and HE did it anyway. No "secret plot" here.

>>16541680
>*sniff* u-up *sniff* yours w-woke moralist!

>>16541716
cont. btw, if you concluded from this post >>16541559
that I _agree_ that Slavs are subhuman then you are more retarded that a wild pig. It just (also) shows that you are lying faggot.

>>16541658
>then what
then became bizarrely anti-German and behave in irrational ways antithetical to the flourishing of British people.
>the focus needed funding because it needed to research German crimes
The 'Anti-Nazi Council' (founded by a jew btw) needs GIBS! to fund "research" into German crimes committed in...1934.
So.... what crimes were committed in 1934 when The Focus was founded?
Oh right, none, zero. They were founded because jews did not want an industrial power becoming independent of the jewish financial system.
>then thats that
what else is there to say?
The Focus gives money to British politicians, those politicians now say and do things in line with the interest of the group that gave them money, what else is there to read into this?
>dealings of these people
how much do you know about political dealings of a corrupt nature in your own time? now consider how much would be unknown from a bygone era.


First you denied jews had any power at all.
you were wrong
Second you denied jews had power in England
you were wrong
Third you denied jews had power over Churchill
you were wrong
Fourth you deny jews had power over Churchill + others
you were wrong
Now, fifth you deny the jewish power over Churchill and others influenced their actions.
hint: you are also wrong
What will be next?
pro-tip: you will likely also be wrong.

>>16541639
Why are you goalpost moving? What kind of pilpul is this?

>>16541749
>So.... what crimes were committed in 1934 when The Focus was founded?
you're trolling
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Night_of_the_Long_Knives
https://www.sciencespo.fr/mass-violence-war-massacre-resistance/fr/document/general-chronology-nazi-violence.html
>February 1, 1933: Hitler dissolved the Reichstag after the failure of negotiations with the centrist parties.
>February 2, 1933: Through the decree for the protection of the German people, freedom of assembly and the freedom of the press were restricted. Göring, the Interior minister of Prussia, mobilized the SA as an auxiliary police force.
>March 21 (31?), 1933: the Dachau concentration camp was built on the site of a chemical factory in Munich, and that of Oranienburg in the Berlin suburbs; this signalled the emergence of extra-legal repression practices against opponents to Nazism.
>April 1, 1933: The first boycott of Jewish-owned shops was implemented.
>June 21-26, 1933: The SA, acting as an auxiliary police force, instigated a week of riots in Köpenick, a predominantly working-class, southeastern suburb of Berlin. Many political opponents to the regime, as well as some Jews, were kidnapped and detained in the SA sections’ premises, where they were mistreated. 23 people lost their lives. (Bessel, 1984)

and thats all the ones i felt like copy-pasting, but please, help yourself

>>16540235
They lost cause they never expected blitzkrieg and Hitler's political maneuvering in the East. Their plan was to pit the Third Reich against the USSR, which they eventually managed to do.

>>16541716
You have already conceded to me, among other things, jews played a pivotal if not critically necessary role in the outbreak of WWII.
>bad things would happen
bad things happened to everyone, Britain lost their Empire and now meet a worse fate than Germany, albeit both will be the same unless organized jewry is finally removed once and for all.
>clear warning
who is Britain to tell Hitler what he can and can not do halfway across Europe with a corrupt junta that has no formal, historical, political, or economic connection to Britain?

Was Danzig/Poland/Czechland/ and or Hitler worth the Empire, the Home Islands, and the British 'race'? That was the price.

According to British veterans, no it wasnt, and they would have preferred if Hitler conquered England than to see England become what it is today.
Source: Unkown Warriors by Nicholas Pringle.
well over 95% of British veterans asked about the conflict said it was not worth fighting, let alone dying, considering the state of England they saw.
and they were saying these things as early as 1970.

imagine what they would say today.

>>16541768
>You have already conceded to me, among other things, jews played a pivotal if not critically necessary role in the outbreak of WWII.
I didn't say that you lying faggot and I specifically denied your purposeful misinterpretation.

>>16541765
>removing corrupt pedophile gangsters
This isnt a crime.
>dissolved the Reichstag
this isnt a crime
>jewish propaganda restricted
this isnt a crime
>labor camp for communists where guards and prisoners labored and even sang together
this isnt a crime
arguably this is the ideal system.
>boycotting jewish businesses
this isnt a crime
>SA
they were punished for their crimes by Hitler in the night of the long knives remember?

So what crimes were committed?
>these are the only ones I could find
I know, and among them only one is even remotely a 'crime' by German standards at the time and the perpetrators were eventually punished for it.

So please, name a single crime committed by Germany prior to the formation of the Focus.

>>16541780
>these aren't crimes
lol

>>16541774
nope.
Right here >>16541639

You stopped arguing over jewish control and pivoted instead to this new angle where you attempt to justify British action under jewish influence.

You lost, chaim.
You conceded, willingly or not.
Maybe get your IQ checked, they have verbal tests now.

what ever happened to that high verbal IQ? all these jews today, low IQ, low t. losers whos women mate with the lowest goyim over the wealthiest jew. SAD!

Wehrboos have worse victim complex than anyone

>>16541784
>NOOOOOOO THIS IS ILLEGAL THE LEADER OF A COUNTRY CAN NOT TAKE EXECUTIVE ACTION
please, my friend, show us the lawbook where this is the case.

>>16541126
>Britain and France were still in favor of keeping their empires prior to 1939
Completely wrong. Britain had already granted India independence in 1937 via the results of their national vote. Independence was postponed when war broke out in 1939, but would have been given by 1941 had war not broken out. Britain also promised independence to all of its colonial empire in 1941, with its decrees in the Atlantic Charter. These are not the actions of an empire that wants to stay together. A third example comes with the Franco-British condemnation of Italy’s invasion and colonization of Ethiopia.
>Hitler consistently sided with proto-third-worldist/decolonization freaks like Bose in India or Al-Husseini in the Levant
Seems like that only started happening after war broke out. Realpolitik and all that.
>the alliance with the explicitly anti-European Japanese.
Another alliance which was only due to realpolitik. Before the war, Germany actually opposed Japan by aligning itself with China.

Hitler, OTOH, supported Italian colonization of Ethiopia.

>>16541790
Well they are being persecuted by the most powerful mafia to ever exist.

>>16541786
I have asked how, according to you ( not me) the Jews influenced Hitler to attack Poland because it was Hitler's action which caused WW2.

>>16541803
>it was Hitler's action which caused WWII
nope.
Hitler did not escalate a regional conflict into a war of super powers.
>how jews influenced Hitler
They didnt influence Hitler, they influenced Britain via their leadership to make Poland a fall guy so Britain would have a cassus belli to level Germany back to post-Versailles levels.
Britain escalated the conflict.
France invaded Germany.
organized jewry facilitated the anti-German pact which escalated a regional dispute between Germany and a corrupt military junta into a global war.

>>16541154
Learn how to realpolitik hans. Better than crying because you kept losing to the brits in their own system.

>>16541810
Yes, I am sure 80% German Berlin is just dying to know the secrets of 30% English London.

>>16541308
>nevermind the fact the list the stormniggers post usually is populated by people who aren't actually jewish
Post the list then

>>16541809
>They didnt influence Hitler, they influenced Britain via their leadership to make Poland a fall guy
The Jews didn't influence Britain but EVEN IF THEY DID (you lying faggot) it would have been Hitler's fault because he attacked despite the clear warning that this will cause the intervention.

>>16541810
>ok it was England's fault but that's a good thing

>>16541822
>the jews didnt influence Britain
what do you call jewish financiers being in touch with and outright bribing British leadership to be then?
>HITLER ATTACKED DESPITE THE WARNING
So if I walk onto your lawn and warn you that if you ask me to leave ill kill you that means you are at fault if you ask me to leave and I kill you?

This is the reasoning.
Britian had no authority to "warn" Germany.
Britain has no right to tell Germany what it can and can not do with renegade military juntas posturing on the German border and oppressing German people.
This is such a bizarre thing for Britain to do.


Britain always had a choice to stand down.
Even after the war began, Britain had a choice to accept the numerous peace offerings.
Britain always had a choice.

>Germany had a choice to
their options were to abandon their own people to a foreign and hostile regime.
Their actions had reason, ethics, and course.

British actions were shameless naked economic interest born out of jewish greed to rule through gold.


That is just a fact.

>>16541834
Hitler had started a war with a country which was in an alliance. Btw, it was a natural, geopolitical alliance too as Poland is one of only few countries on Earth with which Britain never waged a war.
Hitler knew perfectly well what political alliances are; he gambled, started a war and lost, simple as that.

>>16541869
Poland and Britain didn't have a real "alliance", they slipped them a blank cheque last minute kek

>>16541871
How chuds seethe about that fact.
Kinda like the Ribbentrop pact.

>>16541871
It was real, worked as intended. Do you mean metaphysically not real?

>>16535655
He had multiple points where he could have calmed the fuck down but thought he was invincible and kept escalating. The successful anschluss with Austria and annexing the Sudetenland was an extraordinary diplomatic coup. If he'd stopped there he'd be remembered as a highly controversial but incredibly successful leader. A Germany with Pomerania, Silesia, East Prussia and all of Austria would be an absolute economic powerhouse today.

>>16541834
>So if I walk onto your lawn and warn you that if you ask me to leave ill kill you that means you are at fault if you ask me to leave and I kill you?
This analogy would be more someone telling you not to walk on that guys lawn after you already walked on two others or he'll kill you, and then you do it anyway.

>>16536035
A race that not only had control of most of the world but had a speshul status within several that gave them free shit and made it physically impossible to fail within those societies?

>>16541060
>removing military juntas is warmongering
going around to all fo your neigbors threatening ewari they dont willingly cede territory is warmongering
>what do you call England colonizing half the planet then?
yes colonialism was bad anon
>worked for the Americans
americans never did anything similar to what hitter did
>again, the Americans who did this became a global inspiration.
again, america was not a small country in continental europe who did anything remotely similar to what the US ever did


this is all such fucking cope lol

>dude america had wars and stuff therefore its somehow a good thing for hitler to knowingly start a ww1 style cascade effect by going around invading people in continental Europe

yea, fuckin genius, its no wonder 200 iq big brain boys like yourself live hitler!

>>16541104
oh well if himmler said so!

>>16542156
>this is all such fucking cope lol

It really is.
And they believe this is one day going to change the narrative among historians.

Their argument is just a massive REEEE that Hitler wasnt allowed to destroy Poland in peace and quiet and the fact that German lost the previous war.

>>16541133
yes he objectively gave europe to the the USSR by destroying the alliance that was set up to oppose them and taking them on with a much smaller and poorly supplied force.

> but "he killed so many of them bro !"

clearly he didn't kill enough because they won, and almost certainly wouldn't have won if they were also fighting France and the UK as was originally planned before Hitler chimped out and shit up the place

>>16541869
Britain and Poland had no formal alliance.
>Britain never waged a war
???
Britain escalated a regional dispute in someone else’s sphere of influence into a global conflict.
>Hitler knew what the alliances were
Yes, which is why he never expected Britain to torpedo their empire over an irrational pact, make Poland a fall guy, and use a very roundabout strained cassus belli to wage a total war to unconditional surrender.
>started a war
Which war? Germany did not declare war on any major power nor on any dominion of a major power, nor on any formal ally of a major power.

>>16542042
>we intended to self immolation and go extinct
At least you don’t speak German. In 50 years you won’t even speak Germanic you’ll speak some form of Arabic or Hindi

>>16542081
>walk onto neighbors lawn
>some random guy kills you
Make that make sense to anyone who isn’t schizophrenic
>>16542085
???
Whites literally slept on pieces of rope after 16 hour work days in dangerous conditions being paid a pittance.
Whites labored and suffered more than any other race. Industrial labor conditions had a higher morality rate than any other labor conditions at the time.
Browns don’t have that dog in them.

>>16542367
>which is why he never expected Britain
A pretty poor move to expect Britain not to honor their threats. Considering the same thing prompted them to get involved in the last war.

>>16542367
>i know Hitler started the war waging hostile invasions to press territorial claims, but its not his fault because he gambled that their allies would not honor their treaties!

lmfao

>>16542384
>Make that make sense to anyone who isn’t schizophrenic
>hey buddy I talked to the owner of that lawn and said I'd attack you if you walk on it
>walks on it anyway
>gets mad that the guy who said he'd attack you if you walked on the lawn attacked you
It seem pretty clear here the winning move was not walking on the lawn.

>>16542384
>Make that make sense to anyone who isn’t schizophrenic
>no you can't just have alliances
Why do germans constantly act like only they were allowed to do whatever they wanted and expect everyone else to play by some arbitrary geopolitical rules?

>>16542413
these people are not trying to convince you, these bizarre excuses that seem to make no sense to the outside observer exist to convince themselves

>>16542156
>all your neighbors
What did Hitler demand of the Netherlands, France, Switzerland, and Austria?
There was no warmongering. They expressly stated - Germany and Hitler - the reversal of Versailles was their aim.
If colonialism was bad then why the moral grandstanding on behalf of a colonial power?
>Americans never did anything similar
Yes they did, they invaded their neighbors for land - which is more than what Hitler did as he only sought restoration while Americans conquered, they broke away from the international financial system, they practiced economic nationalism.
In fact Schacht and Hitler took the four year plan from Gallatin and Hamilton.
>America was not a small country in continental Europe
Germany was not a small country and it’s irrelevant that they’re in Europe.
>who did anything remotely similar
Except for invade their neighbors for naked conquest, have identical economic systems aimed at total autarky, and break away from the British system of international trade.
Read the 1790 report on Manufactures. Germany did exactly this.

The rest of your post is you being poorly read on economic history.

>>16542169
>Himmler is unreliable because
Because? Isn’t he like the lynchpin for the holocaust narrative? If Himmler is unreliable the Holocaust has literally zero documentation.
>>16542183
The narrative has already changed.
Rest of your post is a straw man. That’s how we know we’ve won.
You mock then debate, then fight, then lose. That is the path you’re on.
Our victory is inevitable because the truth is on our side. You have lost the Mandate of Heaven.
>>16542186
>Hitler have Europe to the USSR by fighting the USSR
LOL
>alliance set up to oppose them
No such alliance would have lasted as long as jews in Moscow were in touch with jews in Washington and London.
>they won
Does that have anything to do with America giving infinite money and resources?
90% of the shells used by the Red Army were from the Lend Lease.
Artillery was over 40% of the casualties on the Eastern Front.
Americans literally provided the Lion’s share of killing power for the USSR.
>trust me bro the jews would do something totally uncharacteristic of them
LOL

Besides, I’d rather live under Communist rule than jewish rule. Stalin purged the jews and kept them in line. This is preferable to allowing them to exterminate us.
I would rather exist and be communist for 80 years than go extinct while being raped to death by a jewish mafia.

>>16542581
>There was no warmongering
you mean besides the part where he almost sparked ww2 first by threatening to invade czechoslovakia, then did invade poland
>If colonialism was bad then why the moral grandstanding on behalf of a colonial power?
because whataboutism is not an argument? im not "grand standing on behalf of a colonial power" i am saying that what Hitler did was very clearly both morally and strategically wrong.
>they invaded their neighbors for land
christ you are so fucking stupid. nothing America ever did compares to Hitler chimping out and knowingly causing a ww1 style cascade effect in continental europe

>>16542608
lol holy shit what a disaster of a post
>the alliance wouldnt have lastic because...because i said so! da joos controlled both countries just trust me bro!
>also based stalin exterminated the joos

>>16535655
Hitler worship is just an edgy way for young men to rebel against their liberal parents and own the jews or something.

>>16542387
Why was Britain making threats?
>>16542389
>hostile invasions
As opposed to non-hostile invasions.
>honor their treaties
When you make a treaty for the express purpose of going to war with Germany, then you go to war with Germany, what could Germany do to prevent this?
>just not invade Poland
If it wasn’t Poland it would be something else. Why should we assume Britain would cease its demands especially when it wanted to keep Germany subject to Versailles?
>>16542402
>get into a dispute with your neighbor
>random guy comes up to you and kills you
>”I warned you not to fight your neighbor”
The winning move would be to bite the bullet and ally with the USSR perpetually? Give them all of Europe if they ask it, on the condition jewry is removed, then punish England and France for being run by psychopaths.

>>16542634
>what could Germany do to prevent this?
by literally just not invading poland, yes , that is literally the answer
>it wasn’t Poland it would be something else.
something else like what?

>>16542634
>Britain would cease its demands
what demands?
>demands especially when it wanted to keep Germany subject to Versailles?
the UK had already virtually completely abandoned enforcing the treaty of Versailles

>>16542413
>>16542423
>Germany can do whatever it wants
Nothing Germany did was unreasonable. They only wanted a restoration to pre-Versailles Germany.
Why do you portray this as if they had designs on the planet?
It’s because you can not argue in good faith because your position is entirely untenable.

It’s funny to me none of you have ever given an explanation as to why Britain has a right to intervene in German-Polish disputes.

>>16542612
>almost sparked WWII by threatening to invade Czechoslovakia
???????????? Czechoslovakia Wasnt a global power nor did it have any formal alliances with a global power?
How could Hitler have started a WORLD war if he was fighting a small eastern European state with no formal allies?
Oh right, because England would for some bizarre reason attack Germany on behalf of a nation which offers them..... nothing....

>whataboutism is not an argument
its not whataboutism when someone takes an anti-German stance and turns a blind eye to much worse actual crimes while grandstanding over alleged German "crimes".
>what Hitler did was morally and strategically wrong
What is morally wrong about restoring your country to a pre-war state and reversing an unjust and oppressive mandate forced on you at
gunpoint?

>chimping out
Germany never chimped out, they made numerous diplomatic overtures to overwhelmingly unreasonable and corrupt governments.

Furthermore, yes, National Socialist Germany and the United States literally had the same progressive views, with both by peace or by war accomplishing very immediate political aims, both breaking away from the British financial system, and both relying on Protectionism/American School.

You have yet to contest any of these beyond stupid "no" why "because BECAUSE!"
>Hitler caused WWII
Hitler didnt declare war on a world power, Britain did.

>>16542626
>the alliance totally would have lasted
an alliance that didnt even exist LMFAO.
>UNTERMEYER DOESNT EXIST STRAKOSH DOESNT EXIST BARUCH DOESNT EXIST LITVINOV DOESNT EXIST

Why do you keep having these schizophrenic breaks with reality where jewish political actors phase in and out of existence? If they exist, they were distant and did nothing of note, if they are significant, they arent real and are a German conspiracy.
Whats going on?

>>16542627
>Hitler worship is just an edgy way for young men to rebel against their liberal parents and own the jews or something.
>sent from my iPhone
"Colt strong. Oohrah Slugger of 69"

>>16542662
>They only wanted a restoration to pre-Versailles Germany.
Hitler wanted unite all German speaking territories then expand in accordance with his belief in lebensraum, one of the central ideological principles of national socialism, and in doing so he made territorial demands from other countries, and when they refused to give cede territory willingly, he invaded them.

>as to why Britain has a right to intervene in German-Polish disputes.
lol is this a joke? Poland has every right to make defensive pacts with other countries , and Germany gave Britain the right to intervention by invading Poland with full knowledge of their defensive treaty with the UK.

There is a timeline, where he realized that he should stop while he was ahead. I'm curious as to what else happens in that timeline

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20 KB PNG

>>16542627
>or something.

>>16542649
>that is literally the answer
What right does Bettina have to arbitrate a dispute between Germany and Poland?
>what else would it be
Britain was already gearing up to go after Germany for re-armament.
Scroll up, apparently everyone in Britain wanted war according to one of the posters. You’re not her are you?
In any case, Britain wanted war, Poland was a fall guy. Britain didn’t actually care about anything but preventing a German restoration.
There is literally no reason Germany should be denied its restoration. It was entirely unjustified to go to war with Germany over their restoration efforts especially after the British approved of Polish posturing and told Poland they had anti-German guarantees.
Britain should have told the poles to come to the table and hand over Danzig or at the very least give Hitler a small strip of land for a road to Danzig that Poles could freely use but not obstruct.
>>16542655
>which demands
>don’t go into Czechoslovakia
>don’t go into Poland
>don’t go into your own country we have arbitrarily demilitarized (for thee but not for me)
>UK abandoned enforcing Versailles
They had broken Article 8 of Versailles long before Hitler even rose to power. The British still used Versailles as a talking piece to give themselves legitimacy against Germany despite them completely flaunting it.

>>16542707
>How could Hitler have started a WORLD war if he was fighting a small eastern European state with no formal allies?

HAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAAH you have no fucking idea what you are talking about holy shit! you dont have the slighttst fucking clue. funny how this seems to be the common trait of neonazi "historians"

Czechoslovakia was allied with Romania, and Yugoslavia, and France had treaties with all 3 guaranteeing support. When Hitler chimped out everyone was so desperate to prevent a war that the munich agreement was signed to try and make territorial concessions to Hitler to try and stop him from starting a full on war by invading

>its not whataboutism
when someone condemns hitlers actions and you say "what about britain!", that is literally, by definition, whataboutism

>What is morally wrong about restoring your country to a pre-war state and reversing an unjust and oppressive mandate forced on you at
you left out the part where this involves gambling away your entire race and nation by waging wars of aggression to achieve this ambition


>Germany never chimped out, they made numerous diplomatic overtures
and when they didnt get what they wanted, they chimped out and took what they wanted by force.

>Hitler didnt declare war on a world power, Britain did.

wow great argument!
>yes Hitler literally started the war by invading a country, but he did so without making any formal declaration of war so its actually Poland and her allies fault because they formally declared war AFTER Hitler literally started waging war against their alliance!

wow yea anon you really spun up some great mental gymnastics there!

>>16542738
>unite Germans into Germany
And this is somehow worth their existential existence to Britain?
>Lebensraum
Complete fiction. There is one (1) historian who claims Hitler had designs for Lebensraum and it’s from Hitlers journal a long time before Hitler even took power. Hitler’s views were evidenced by his actions and his statements and in the late 1930s he had no designs on Eastern Europe until they became a threat to Germany.
>central ideological principles of national socialism
No such thing.
National socialism was a spirit of Germany. Not a rule book or manual.
They had no guiding principles per se, they were governed by a dictator who really did lead with his friends by their hearts seeking to do right by their people.
>he made territorial demands of other countries
Nope. Restoring your own country is not a territorial demand. Czechoslovakia wasn’t a sovereign nation, neither was Poland, they were corrupt illegitimate Juntas or Pseudo-States that were carved out of former countries because the victors decided to punish the losers for the crime of opposing them.
>then Hitler le invaded
Yes, because when you oppress people and their ethnic kin exhaust every option to liberate them there is no other choice but war?
I mean, didn’t Britain use this same defense - but for the wrong reasons?
>we exhausted every option with Hitler, we had to invade Germany

>Poland has every right to oppress Germans then cry foul when Germany retaliates
Why?
A lot good that pact did them. Hitler wanted to make Poland an outpost against Asia in exchange for Danzig.
Instead Poland loses Danzig, in addition to their entire country, then only gets home rule back 60 years later and only if they tow the line, take the refugee, legalize the gay, the abortions, and become an Outpost of mutts.

>>16542728
>an alliance that didnt even exist
because Germany destroyed it by dragging everyone into war first, yes.

>>16542763
lol so the answer is no, you cannot actually articulate specifically "what else it would be"

>>don’t go into Czechoslovakia
>don’t go into Poland

wow yea those darn brits preventing German invasions of other sovereign countries!

>>16542792

>Complete fiction
funny how all neonazi arguments fall back on historical revisionism. sorry but your personal head canon is not evidence

>No such thing. National socialism was a spirit of Germany
youre so full of shit lmfao

>Nope. Restoring your own country is not a territorial demand.
making demands for territory from other nations is in fact making territorial demands, that is literally what it is
this is fucking insane cope, holy shit , you are completely disconnected from reality lmfao

>Poland has every right to oppress Germans then cry foul when Germany retaliates
lmfao you cant even use an actual quote from my post because you know you cant actually deny that poland had a right to make diplomatic alliances with other nations and those nations then have the right to enter the war if their allies are attacked

>>16542790
>the world powers of Romania and Yugoslavia
HAHAHAHAHAHABAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
excuse me
AHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHA
HAHAA
>starting a full on war
With who? Why would anyone be required to fight?
Why not do with Poland what was done with Czechoslovakia.
>HITLER WOULD LE KEEP GOING
You mean he would pursue his intended goals which he made known to everyone in the 1920s?
Why wouldn’t Britain simply rescind Versailles and reverse the cruel and unjust partition of the Central Powers?
Did Prussia take all of France?
No.
German expansionism is a myth which is used to peddle anti-German slanders.
Germany has always sought to consolidate itself.
There was no reason for the West to roadblock the restoration of Germany and to an extent Austria Hungary and even Russia.

You tie yourself into knots trying to justify a very irrational very aggressive foreign policy by Britain and France which was mediated primarily by jews.
>this is by definition whataboutism
No, because what Britain does is relevant because you are justifying Britain’s actions as an Arbiter.
If Britain is the arbiter as you say, then their geopolitical policy is relevant.
>gambling away your race and nation to achieve political aims via war
But enough about Britain, France, and the United States

>any war is a chimpout
So Britain and France did a global chimp?
>uhh technically he didn’t start it but he resistant the French invasion which means he instigated the war
LOL