can someone explain to a beg like myself why fechin and john singer sargeant are so big among realist painters today and not, say, repin?
It probably just comes down to where they worked, Repin is Russian, JSS and Fechin are americans, thus the art academies only talked about them
>>7735002Because they're "Americans", however nominally
>>7735058nah, it's not even that, sargent barely ever set foot in the US, he spent maybe 3-5 years of his life there, totalfechin is more of an american than sargentit really is just about having a claim on their work
John Singer Sargeant had a better aesthetic and worked faster with simpler tools. Repins paintings took months or years to finish and had more grotesque motifs (he wasn't painting rich milfs).
Modern realists can't into actual techniques older than 1700s academics who were already doing alla prima, that's why they like to copy Rembrandt, Fechin, and Sargent. For reference look up videos of many of them painting.There is also this meme that Sargent was such a good painter every single brush stroke was intentional, and he worked 40 times over on one painting to make sure he made it look effortless and this is "true mastery."
>>7735002>John Singer SargentIs this a weird internet meme or something? His paintings are really ugly. None of them famous. I'm sure they look better in person, but that's even more true for truly great paintings. I honestly think this is the result of astroturfing by art dealers and money launderers. Some form of gaslighting to manipulate the price.
>>7735117madame x is famous, or was infamous at the time at least>>7735101>rembrandt>1700s
>>7735122I never said they knew of Rembrandt's technique, they don't, they probably don't even know Fechin's, they just know that their art works look caked on, and "painterly" so they're the easiest to emulate.
>>7735117The absolute state of /ic/
>>7735117Okay, Bubblebass.
>>7735117I don't like them either but no he's been astroturfed since forever because he was always working as a portraitist for rich people from the start.
As a Sargent expert, I can say that no one here has answered correctly.All of you are NGMI
>>7735442>As someone who loves to suck cock none of you have properly described the deep homoerotic pleasure and love felt by sucking another mans cock properly to explain why so many faggots are gay nowadaysWe know faggot. When we discuss why you're gay we discuss why, not why you enjoy it, assbandito.
>>7735443Don't project your fantasies onto me you uneducated ape.
>>7735002Impressionism bias. (And that's a good thing)
>>7735445But I will, I will Sargent nigger, because you come from it from a POV of enjoying it, for those of us who don't we have to hear it from those people, and look at their work and figure out the REAL reasons ourselves with critical thinking skills you lack.
>>7735002pyw
>>7735117>I honestly think this is the result of astroturfing by art dealers and money launderersArt always been political, since the renaissance.Elites wanted luxury, that’s why the whole thing is full of money-grabs, nepotism, and speculation.The avantgarde is basically that pushed to absurdity, where guys like Clement Greenberg literally decided what was art and what wasnt.We could have a rational, scientific take on aesthetics, but Hans Sedlmayr smeared with the NSDAP, so any critical take on the status quo just boils down to "u fascist."
>>7735002>Sargent>"american">everyone says he's great>Repin>Russian (The yucky nationality)>literally whoit's that easy
>>7735698Everything is that easy when your brain is smooth.
>>7735698There is some truth to this, probably. Repin blows them both out of the water.
>>7735058>>7735080but Fechin is Russian, he studied at the St Petersburg Academy under Repin, and only moved to the US after he turned 40. Come on, guys, step your game up.>>7735117>astroturfing by art dealers and money launderersI honestly think something like this is happening with Bouguereau and the whole clique of patrons behind him. Not saying Boug is not great, I love his work, but his reputation was on the ground and his work was selling for pennies (which is why you can find some of it in some random fucking museum in Wichita or something) until this american dude showed up and bought it all and then proceeded to pump up his image. This guy is the founder of the ARC (Art Renewal Center), which is full of weird stuff. Then you look up his daughter on instagram and you think "holy shit, this person is the jury on one of the most prestigious painting awards in the world?".>>7735002Sargent is great when he's good, his brushstrokes are elegant and his values are super simplified yet they work perfectly. However, he has a ton of shit works that just never get shown. But outside of portraits, he's got nothing. His watercolors are meh (Zorn mogs him bad), he tried to do grand compositions like Repin and failed miserably, his urban views of Venice are trite and mogged by Whistler's.
>>7736397Fechin is a symbol of American cultural superiority over Russia. It's also telling that you have an issue with Fechin not being American because he grew up in Europe and only came to America late, but not Sargent, who was in his 20s, fully trained and developed when he first visited America, and spent less time than Fechin there by a factor of 8
>>7735002>fechin and john singer sargeantBoth are beloved be Americans and claimed as Americans as well. I have very big problems with understanding American identity and nationalism. Like is Sargent ethnically American?Whatever, thats only reason. American mass culture is dominating over the world. It very shallow and as far as i understand Sargent is the only painter popular in America. When an American youtuber or artists speaks about le loose brushstrokes, they ALWAYS mention Sargent.Anyway in Russia Repin is way bigger than Sargent.In the rest of Europe they to rewrite Repin as Ukranian for political reasons. Thats what people care about, they dont really give a fuck about the actual art.
>>7736397>but Fechin is Russian, he studied at the St Petersburg Academy under Repin, and only moved to the US after he turned 40. Come on, guys, step your game up.that's the joke. Sargent is also not American in the slightest, but they're so desperate they grasp at any connection when it suits them
>>7736600to be fair, Sargent is more american than Fechin in my eyes, because both Sargent's parents were americans, so he grew up raised by americans, speaking american english, etc. Fechin was raised by russians speaking russian. And because of the fact that Sargent travelled around so much, we can't find another dominating nationality (he's not Italian, not French, not British) so the only dominant nationality left is American. Just a thought.
WHY THE FUCK DOES ANYONE CARE ABOUT AN ARTIST'S NATIONALITYIT HAS NO BEARING ON THE ART
>>7736916Sargent is known to have had an extremely cosmopolitan English (as in England) accent and was never described as speaking like an American
>>7737028Huh? Japanese makes better art. This is known. Even gaijins who moved to Japan seem to magically improved their art.
>>7737098yeah the Japanese people are sacred and blessed, they make even the people around them magical
>>7737109This but seriously
>>7736916>he grew up raised by americans, speaking american englishYou're thinking well-off surgeon family a 100 and some years ago that loved to travel everywhere had the same family dynamic as regular people now. Sargent was also fluent in French and spent a lot of time in France, then most of his time in England. He's a French-Anglo (brother nations, despite whatever they claim), out of all things, he's more Italian than American
>>7737472He's American. Don't take that away from us.
>>7737297i was being serious, they have delicate bone structures and beautiful eyeballs that tickle people's souls. they have magical bodies and brains.
>>7735095Repin's motifs are so much more interesting. I can't imagine looking at Ivan and His Son or the Laughing Cossacks and thinking, "Nah, I prefer frigid debutantes."
>>7735002Every artist alive nowadays is obsessed with Repin's painting of Ivan the Terrible and his son. But Repin's art is typically very blunt and almost harsh in a way that doesn't vibe with current tastes. He likes to use the kind of lighting and contrast that's almost hard to look at sometimes, with bold and decisive brushwork instead of the softer or looser stuff you see with Sargent and Fechin. He also didn't lean into idealization much. If someone was fucking ugly he'd paint them fucking ugly.
>>7741264>He also didn't lean into idealization muchHe was part of the peredvizhniki movement, which later evolved to social realism. It was intended to show the ugly part of life.
>>7741264What I'm hearing you say is that Repin is an actually good, truthful artist and the others are lying fags.
>>7737028>He doesn't care about the context, history, influences and different schools of artThings don't exist in a vacuum, but you're too simple to understand that. Ngmi (spiritual)
>>7743002none of that matters for art quality anon
>>7735443>RAAAAAAAGH! I NEED TO TALK ABOUT SUCKING COCK RIGHT NOW!!!!!
>>7736397hmmm
>>7735002People are already miserable so why would they seek out art depicting misery when they're already living it.Like Art deco was popular throughout the 20s during high crime, depression, and world war. On the other hand, during the 50s when times were good the popular things were crime shows, nuclear war and rock and roll.
>>7736916>both Sargent's parents were americanswho were ethnically european and he gew up in europe, with his ethnically european parents, in europe, as an ethnic european
WHO THE FUCK CARES IF HE WAS AMERICAN AAHHHHHHH
why dont you post his work for me to be excited about, i dont care about just names
He isn't even American.
>>7735002Sargent regained popularity last couple decades due to the internet and mostly by younger people who are just getting into painting.Actually, neither Sargent nor Repin were doing painting in the traditional sense. They were both more concerned with optical depiction of the real. In Repin's case in a more naturalistic way whilst Sargent had his own pretty girl aesthetic which worked well but was borderline classical realist.Again, they weren't really popular amongst those more artistically cultured. You could say Sargent stuff was even a bit tacky but he was nevertheless a great painter by his own accord, just like Repin.
>>7752698>they weren't really popular amongst those more artistically culturedShow me what was, pretentious faggot. Postmodernism?
There was a time where they all loved Ivan the terrible and his son painting.
>>7752698>they weren't really popular amongst those more artistically culturedsays who? I'll take the argument about Sargent, but Repin has always been one of the greats. Like anon here >>7752732 says, Ivan the Terrible has always been a popular painting. Repin has Russia's best academy named after him, and just in case you didn't know, Russia has always been a big contender in culture. Russia's literature, classical music, film, theatre and ballet can rival that of any other nation's, and the same goes for painting. I guess in America you guys don't know about any of this because you're all hung up on the whole communism thing, but in the rest of the world we all know of Russia's cultural importance.
>>7752703Post-modernism was just a few decades ago dood..>>7752755Repin's fame was confined to russia. sure he wasn't totally unknown abroad but still a minor figure compared to contemporary's such as Monet, Matisse, Degas, Renoir and dozens more.Both Repin and Sargent, weren't doing what was "cutting edge" at the time, so to say. They were more concerned in depicting things how they actually looked like, in a superficial yet very tasteful way..Sure you can say the Impressionists were also doing the same, and actually foregoing concepts that were always part of the painting tradition and would later be recovered on the turn of the century by the expressionists, the abstractionists, cubists, etc.. but impressionism was already on the verge and arguably trying to go beyond the first layer of appearances..And I completely agree that Russia's culture has always been majestic, I know because I travel there often. It's a country that celebrates their artists more than anyone else. Although, like Asian countries with great tradition, they were more or less on their own up until recently
Ilya Repin huh... Not to be snarky but wow... his works are so gorgeous and brimming with realism and human emotion...yeaj but done in a very tasteful way. When lesser people want to depict human emotion they tend to imbue a corniness thats more suited to a political poster or a mural.Thanks /ic/ I now have a new artist to idolize. I recognize half of his paintings through exposure to meme culture alone.Beautiful.
>>7737098>>7737109>>7737297Are you lost? This is a fine arts thread you dumb weebs. Go jack off to lolis or somthing.
