The general thread for Manga / manga-styled comic-making, manga-style illustration and related comic work. That said, everyone is welcome here.Support each other and talk about your work or the work of others that excites you. Inking, character design, paneling / layout, writing, planning, and other discussions are all welcome.Post resources, questions, in-progress pages, breakdowns of other works, etc. If a work is not yours, credit the maker (unless it's fucking obvious like a full page of One Piece or something).Thanks to everyone for making /mmg/ a level-headed and helpful place. Remember, drawing and making comics and manga are difficult endeavors, and we're all in this struggle together.Previous thread: >>7997149 Some resources:/asg/, our stylistic sister-thread series for those focused more on illustration >>>/ic/asgBooks:Understanding Comicshttps://e-hentai.org/g/2042453/83e7da6ed0/Making Comicshttps://annas-archive.org/md5/d55168f7579c1e23275d1fc9f0a2255dManga in Theory and Practice: The Craft of Creating Mangahttps://annas-archive.org/md5/2877da11e2f852d220853e9944e6ea49Story: Substance, Structure, Style and the Principles of Screenwritinghttps://archive.org/details/RobertMcKeeStorypdf/Even a Monkey Can Draw Mangahttps://kupdf.net/download/even-a-monkey-can-draw-manga_58b9ca16e12e89233badd376_pdfThe Shonen Jump Guide to Making Mangahttps://mega.nz/file/i81imLpI#GcheJ9Jjk3lw1RE9nQWgL4RG4wEBNOcRmgA-iaU6WpgVideos:"Manga Senpai/Tokyo Name Tank", "SMAC! THE SILENT MANGA AUDITION COMMUNITY"Habanero Scans: https://www.dailymotion.com/HabaneroScans/videosManben link can be found on archive.org on different pages separated by season: https://www.reddit.com/r/manga/comments/1bu9f0y/found_all_of_naoki_urasawas_manben_and_manben_neo/Urasawa Channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCkIFOAoFm47XOAlJwTa6Ieg/videosOP image is from Ifufunohi, a oneshot.
>>8005341Other open comic publishers:Dark Horse ( https://www.darkhorse.com )>Dark Horse still welcomes your submissions, and all submissions will still be reviewed, just as they always have been.>All unsolicited story/series proposals must have a full creative team on board. Writer-only proposals will not be reviewed.Image comics ( https://imagecomics.com/ )>Image Comics only publishes creator-owned material. They do not contract creators; they’re only interested in publishing original content for which you would retain all rights.>Image Comics publishes creator-owned/creator-generated properties and THEY DON’T PAY PAGE RATES. Image takes a small flat fee off the books published, and it will be the responsibility of the creators to determine the division of the remaining pay between their creative team members.Drawn and quarterly ( https://drawnandquarterly.com/ )>Please email a low resolution PDF with at least 20 pages of comics and cover letter to submissions. Do not send dropbox links, scripts, or proposals. Please read our submissions FAQ.Fantagraphics ( https://www.fantagraphics.com/ )>submission page: https://www.fantagraphics.com/pages/faqTop Shelf Productions ( https://www.topshelfcomix.com/ )>Regarding submissions, we're easy. Just email us a download link of what you'd like us to review. NOTE: We cannot accept cover letters, plot synopses, or scripts unless they are accompanied by a minimum of 10-20 completed pages (i.e., fully inked and lettered comic book pages).Additional publisher lists:> https://jasonthibault.com/definitive-list-comic-publisher-submission-guidelines/> https://writingtipsoasis.com/best-independent-comic-book-publishers/
>>8005342Some western / indie publishers of Manga:Saturday AM ( https://www.saturday-am.com/ )> Digital indie magazine, seems to be on the up-and-up> Open submissions for long-form series; also distributes series currently being published elsewhere.> Regularly publishes one-shots, making it a good potential outlet for already-finished work.Oni Press ( https://onipress.com/ )> Technically indie, but at this point large enough by comic standards to be mentioned in the same breath as other publishers.Antarctic Press ( https://antarctic-press.myshopify.com/ )> Longtime large-indie publisher of OEL / manga-esque books.> Seemingly taking submissions at present if https://antarctic-press.myshopify.com/pages/submissions is anything to go on.Yen Press ( https://yenpress.com/ )> Started out as a small indie publisher of original / Korean material, and has grown reasonably popular since.> As of 2016, it is also one of the western arms of the Kadokawa Corporation, with Kadokawa owning a 51% stake.> Editorial inquiries can apparently be sent to yenpress@yenpress.com, however, they apparently are not open to new submissions at this time.Viz Media / Viz Originals ( https://www.viz.com/originals )> *The* western manga publisher.> Currently in the exploratory stages of setting up an English label.> Submissions are open and several books have been announced. However, progress on the label seems to be moving very slowly.> Still might be worth a shot anyway.Shrine Comics ( https://shrinecomics.com/ )> Small indie manga publisher> Seemingly attempting to make the transition to physical volumes> Allows crossposting to other sitesIconic Comics (https://www.iconiccomics.com/)>A bit like Oni Press and Antarctic Press>A small publisher with a focus on indie works with manga inspiration
>>8005343/mmg/'s very own anon-led anthology: /ic/onographyhttps://discord.gg/QYnFBves7Vhttps://forms.gle/d3a2Cwwd44sJYyqv9(Anthology project is defunct but the discord is alive)Additional community added Resources:Mangafonts: https://mangafonts.carrd.co/Hiro Mashima YT: https://www.youtube.com/@mashimaCh/videosGanmo, a job listing board for manga assistant work: https://ganmo.j-comi.co.jp/postsHow (You) can help /mmg/:> Know about a contest or a publishing opportunity? TAG THE OP and post a link.> Have a new resource? TAG THE OP and link / mention it for inclusion.> Don't be a crab> Have a link / DL for a mentioned resource? TAG THE OP and mention what you're supplying a link for.> SCREENSHOT / PASTEBIN effort posts that help you for posterity.
Feels weird being first post. Here's my latest comic on bucket crabs. Always looking for feedback/suggestionsCurrently drafting/lining hefferchu chapter 8 and fixing chapter 2 for print run (if anyone has experience, please lmk)https://www.twitch.tv/efsius1/https://www.youtube.com/@efsius1/streams
This guy makes over 6000 a month, and he literally only draws a page a week of his fetish manga. Is this the way to go? I can get a page done every day, so honesty is the answer just fetish stuff half the week, and then manga the other half?https://www.patreon.com/supersnacksized
>>8005371Nice dude, I'll check out your stream, always love seeing artists process. No complaints, characters are cute, only thing I guess is the background is "fine", but who gaf about backgrounds alot of published mangas have "fine" backgrounds cause backgrounds suck>>8005372yeah but you have to draw that...
Reposting herehttps://globalcomix.com/read/d69318b6-4255-4333-8b93-bd348394dab8/1
>>8005372theres no point comparing yourself to others, there are millions of people with better lives despite doing much less than you. And millions of people with worse lives despite working harder than you and longer.
A nerd living in his virtual reality world, an empathetic woman and a tough reporter are involved in a war that the population absolutely celebrates. These protagonists hold the key to ending this war.https://drive.google.com/file/d/1tdzn7a-NowBfvOVos8E2FGMkK_T-j8LU/view?usp=drive_linkmade in 2022
A fight of opposing ideologies within the royal household...https://drive.google.com/file/d/1vptmj1q0sNVfbFNyf3sLIYqxO9kSOVA7/view?usp=drive_linkmade in 2023
>>8005427Caught between imaginative memories, real fears, and social pressure, he tries to find his place in the world. Initially celebrated as exceptionally gifted, he becomes increasingly isolated due to difficulties at school and neglect at home. Dreams and memories blur together, and reality often seems distorted. The child’s perspective shows how insecurity, feeling overwhelmed, and being an outsider can take their toll.https://drive.google.com/file/d/1_kzq0uOV2HycKipGO-iTmQFJLlLhQ2-q/view?usp=sharingmade in 2023, Chapter 1
No titlehttps://drive.google.com/file/d/1lP7eATjDaVmoEyzqWnxNgyXcXbau3N11/view?usp=sharingmade in 2024
Character Design ArtbookThe mascots of the districts of Lower Austria are special characters that each represent one of the districts. These characters reflect the origin and name of the district and often draw inspiration from the district's coat of arms. In total, there are 20 districts, resulting in 20 different mascots.https://drive.google.com/file/d/1fAH2jLEOH3hf6zySmjovTCLUreC0149I/viewmade in 2024
This comic is loosely based on the Austrian film *Der Junge Mann aus dem Innviertel* (1973) and depicts key events in Adolf Hitler’s early life—including the death of his parents and his failure to gain admission to art academies.The focus is on a Hitler who himself embodies the very characteristics that the Nazi regime later used to marginalize so-called “asocials”: unemployed, homeless, and without clear prospects. In the comic, he wears the same badge that was later given to people considered “inferior.”Translated with DeepL.com (free version)https://drive.google.com/file/d/1vemY7qgID-dagO9HTggkC9OFuR_8fa6Z/view?usp=sharingmade in 2025
>>8005429Chapter 2made in 2025
>>8005441https://drive.google.com/file/d/1OtMpTrHbleikqOudz7WWwP9DdZ7k1l-y/view?usp=sharing
One pagermade in 2026
>>8005396Cool seeing your progression, why arent you continuing it? I guess at the end of the days its study, even if you dont finish it
Latest work"World Revolution & Coffee" is an 8-page educational graphic history that uses the real-world history of the East German coffee crisis to explore macro-political theory, global trade, and socialist economic planning.https://drive.google.com/file/d/1-8A4ez1UeOStXSEaIm5Th-gNzFpHQyuQ/view?usp=sharing
>>8005450I really liked the coffee comic, I'll check out the rest of your comics tomorrow
Any publication date yet, Alice-anon?
>Come up with a brilliant original idea>Google it to see if it already exists>It doesIs there any worse feeling as a creator? I feel like I was born too late. It's impossible to create anything original anymore unless you're a genius.
>>8005476You worry about making something original when you should be worried about making something good.
>>8005476Nothing is original, everything is being created inspired by something. Just give your idea a weird original spin. Do the story on reverse, swap the gender, or the species, or the time period. There's a million different ways to tell the same story.
>>8005445After reading about things like the 60million Ebay settlement case, or the dancing (((Amazon))) slaves, the doge disaster, the Epstein president, etc, these old memes looks so silly and obsolete in comparison with our present orwellian reality
>>8005477Being original has many advantages, on top of making your work memorable and helping you stand out from the crowd. There are many examples of good manga that end up being forgotten right away after people read them. That's the only thing I worry about, but I guess most of you are fine with that. That's the one thing that worries me though I guess most of you don't really care about that.
>>8005488Everyone wants to be the next Murata someone who's good at drawing but sucks at everything else, and would rather leech off pre existing ideas from someone else rather than craft one themselves because believe it or not, getting good at drawing is easier than writing
>>8005484>>8005458why do i get the feeling that this is him, replying to himself. The way >>8005484 reads, seems similar to stuff this guy has said in the past. Speaks like a boomer
>>8005488You can pretty much reduce any story further and further down to find that most fiction has the same skeleton anyway. And basic storytelling elements like the Hero's Journey and the 3-act story method literally date back thousands of years. Your job is to make a way to find it compelling.Even the most highly-regarded fictional franchises are literally just reskins of previous, older stories.
Looking for feedback on what I have so far as I work on chapter 5. I know chapter 1 is rough and am probably gonna rewrite it at some point.https://thefoolsjourney.thecomicseries.com/
>>8005491chill out you fucking sperg, if you're not 30+ you dont belong on 4chan
>>8005490well I don't know about any amazing story that looks like chris chan comic
>>8005488Original doesn't mean memorable nor does it necessarily help standing out from the crowd. Making something good does.>There are many examples of good manga that end up being forgotten right away after people read themAnd there are many, many more examples of the same for original manga. There's plenty of original ideas, but they mostly suck.
>>8005502So you're saying it's better to write generic crap that readers can find done better somewhere else instead of actually finding your own original idea and giving them a reason to remember your work? Are you writing an isekai manga by any chance?
What is good but affordable paper for manga? I'm not sure yet if i will draw the draft and the inks on the same or on separate sheets.I try to learn to work with the light table, but it feels pretty contra intuitive so far.
Posting in the new thread because no one seems to have noticed in the previous one. If you find it unappealing or bad tell me. I am a wage slave starting today fuck
Should I read up some theory before trying my hand at making another comic or should I just go in? Last project died for irl reasons but I want to make something, it was really bad though and idk if going blind is a good idea if I want to make something readable at least. I did read save the cat and understanding comics but it was a long time ago and I don't remember much, on top of never having written anything. While typing this, I realised this is a really high mountain to climb. Oh well>>8005563I like it
>>8005548I'm saying you should worry about writing something good instead of worrying about writing something original. It's not a riddle.
>>8005580The worst thing you can do is stop. Just keep making things dude. It takes hundreds of pages to improve, "reading up on some theory" will only delay improvement.
>>8005563they/them vibes
>>8005334>Oh, also I guess unsurprisngly the MHA author is a US comic fan, and murata likes spidermanAs much as they say they like these things, they don't actually copy anything from them at all. Nothing about their works resemble US comics in terms of artistic approach. They do their panelling in the way manga does panelling, they have manga-like speedlines, they have manga-like speechbubbles. Even the way they design their characters is only superficially inspired by US comics, but they don't make their characters middle aged dudes in 1800's circus costumes. All Might is the closest example and even he totally deviates from the US comics model by not actually being super buff.The superficial qualities of US comics, ie superheroes, really aren't important at all. It's the underlying artistic techniques that matter. And manga does not copy a single one of these at all.
>>8005580Thank you>>8005597I'm not they them
>>8005476You just have an awful mindset.>have an amazing idea>search it, other people had the same idea>accuse them of stealling MY IDEA and lawsuit the shit of out them
So here is an odd thing about AI currentlyyou could write and draw tons of pages and nobody will read it or get very scarce feedback from the Internetbut AI can write you tons of compliments and seemingly nuanced takes on your work. Google Drive even will let you make a fucking podcast of a man and a women talking about your work for 20 minutes.
>>8005648But it's not a real opinion at allYou might as well just make up your own hypemen in your head and save the electricity
I was thinking of developing a comics platform. With the difference that the authors could publish both the comic/manga AND the text/dialogs separately. There would be options to have them side-by-side (no idea if would be possible to develop a mobile experience without going a step further and allowing RAWs without text to also be uploaded).Then I imagine it would work to have both custom machine translations on these for other languages and allow users themselves to contribute with translations line-by-line of dialog.So any comic could, in theory, benefit from multilanguage reach, and quality would go up with popularity. Or it would be just a nothing-burger.Has any platform tried something similar yet?
>>8005648goood morning saaaarr!!!
Hahaha. Interesting OP image.
>>8005655This makes no sense to me. That would be like publishing a movie with just the audio or with just the visuals. They do not exist as separate. A comic is both art and story fused and inseparable.
>>8005692It is the full thing. It is more akin to publishing a movie and also providing the transcription for subtitles independently so it can easily be translated to other languages by users and machines.
>>8005449I lost the drive for this story at some point and was forcing myself to finish. It was a torture to keep drawing it lol
The final chapter of Oswald is on the 6th...>>8005549Id advise against using drafts on the same paper if you're light tabling. You'll use double the paper. Cheapest method would be any 135kg + paper that you personally find good and drawing your own boundry lines on. Anything with printed ones will cost more. I used to use deleter, but switched to IC because I got a good deal in bulk. >>8005563I like the art a lot, but the lettering could be done better.
In general, should we focus on attaining some minimum level of art (/int, /adv/) before starting to work on a manga project, or start as early as possible and study while solving problems for the manga?
>>8005973You should at minimum be able to communicate in pictures what is happening in the scene clearly
>>8005973Making a comic/manga is a good way to improve your art. It demands you draw all sorts of poses and angles you wouldn't normally draw, forcing you out of your comfort zone. It also demands you draw consistently, so one character always looks like that character without deviating from their model. It demands you draw a whole bunch of random things you might never draw like cars, and buildings, and guns, and whatnot. There's the motivation to draw a whole bunch if you ever want your story to be more than 2 pages.The only real reason not to dive straight in, is because it's very difficult so you're likely to burnout. And it WILL look bad if you're beginner, so you might not want to ruin your passion project with bad art.Even still. There are a whole host of techniques and skills to be learned that apply exclusively to comics/manga, namely panelling, pacing, movement, that sort of thing, and the only thing that's going to help you improve in those aspects is comics/manga. If your ultimate aim as an artist is to become a comic/manga artist, then you should just dive into it. Pick a project that you're not so concerned with ruining and get your feet wet with it. Don't worry about the story being any good, or even care about finishing it, once you've made like 100 pages, you'll be halfway to being a pro artist anyway.
>>8005394NOOOOOO SHE'S EATING HIM ALIVE AIIIIEEEEEEEE
>>8005438I'm gonna be honest, Hitler was never really that interesting as a person.
>>8005973I agree with a lot of what >>8005976 and >>8005980 say. There's also the inherent meta work of getting good at making comics itself. Storytelling as a comic is also itself a skill, and you're not going to get better at it without getting stuck in the mud. Try starting something like a simple four panel comic and work from there. It should be more than enough at least from a "dipping your toes" standpoint. Additionally, while some baseline skill is good, what matters more is that you actively and consciously practice drawing itself while you make the comics so that your fundies do not stagnate. Several /mmg/ anons started years ago and if you were to look at the start of their respective comics versus now, there is clear noticeable improvement.Lastly, don't feel bad if you decide that comics aren't for you. It really is not for everyone and is a thankless grueling hobby. Keeping at it requires a certain level of autistic retardat- uh, "perseverance," to continue despite it all.
I'm reading Vagabond right now. I was never interested, but decided to read it as research.Drawing such detailed art for such a decompressed story is insane, really.It's quite good, so far, good drawn overall, well that's what it known for and is supposed to get better later on.But the backgrounds are tasteless, unfortunately. Overrendered, overly detailed, without a focus. I don't know why the Japanese do it. It was done the same in Europe hundreds years ago. Detail everywhere, horror vacui - fear of empty space. There is quite a lot of empty space and negative space, it's not a forign concept for the artist, but for some reason he lets his assistants overrender many pages. Maybe, he thinks diligence is a good thing. Assistants get paid, should work as much as possible, but it's contra productive, really. I'm glad that i will never in my life be able to afford assistants, so i can draw the backgrounds myself.>>8005836>Id advise against using drafts on the same paper if you're light tabling. You'll use double the paper.What do you mean, i don't get it?
>>8005643Everybody put your ideas away, Nintendo is itt
>>8005488If we don't worry about that it's because we're more invested in expressing the ideas we already have rather than scouring media to make sure there are general ideas that haven't been done yet. If you care too much about everything else before starting your story, its only real value will be in the originality of the initial idea and not much else, in which case any amount of closer scrutiny will reveal that there is not much value to be extrapolated from the story itself. Like an article where the headline is the only interesting part, or those manga that start out with a unique premise before devolving into generic shonen shit.
>>8005580What the other guy said but also research some techniques on whatever you think is lacking in your style. There is really no reason you can't do both. If you have time to doomscroll, you have time to read and watch videos on art stuff.
>>8005622They take inspiration in the best way which is by being inspired but doing it their way in their own style since for the most part there is nothing artistic worth copying in modern capeshit or even a lot of older stuff
>>8005999The detail in a lot of manga backgrounds, at least in the last ten or so years, seems less impressive when you remember they're just tracing off photos most of the time.
>>8006012In the interest of learning, it's often just as helpful to learn how not to do something, as it is to learn how to do something. It's just as helpful to learn what wild berries not to eat as it is to learn which ones are edible.And by learning the negative of something, it often reveals an otherwise subtle positive you may have missed.For example, you may or may not have noticed that manga is incredibly easy to read. In terms of physical readability. It's easy on the eyes. Most people take this for granted, and when they make their own works they are confused as to why it is not easy to read. What is it that makes manga easy to read?There are many reasons, but one reason that I found through reading western comics, is that specifically modern western comics are not at all easy to read. Older western comics however are. long story short, the answer is scale. In manga and in old western comics, the panels are fewer in number, generally larger in size, and the contents within them are zoomed in considerably more than in modern western comics.... and in most amatuer comics.Go look at any random manga you like, you'll be shocked at how zoomed in all the panels are. In almost every panel the character's bodies or faces are half cropped out of the frame. You almost never see a fullbody shot unless it's an introduction, or if their fullbody is relevant. It's easy on the eyes because the drawings are big enough that you can see them clearly at a glance.And that sort of thing only became obvious when I saw the negative of it, when you see it being done poorly
>>8006015Sure, the best way to draw or paint landscapes is from life. Same for humans and everything else. But i think using fotos in the context of manga is alright.Tracing is more of a problem. Drawing nature, landscapes, spaces is art. Giving everything in the picture a sharp outline is not. You learn it after a couple of months of studying landscape painting. Basic concepts.The assistants lack that, probably. Backgrounds is part of the storytelling. You have to set the focus. Pic related, do i emphasize this part of the building, or that? In case of many manga the answer is no. No emphasis, no focus, everything is sharp, everything is detailed.Alienation of the worker, exploitation of the low class, late capitalism, all that.
>>8005999If you use good paper for the draft, then a new clean sheet of good paper overlayed to do the good sketch + inks, you'd be using 2 sheets of good paper per page
>>8006033
>>8005973>>8005973>should we focus on attaining some minimum level of art (/int, /adv/) before starting to work on a manga project, or start as early as possible and study while solving problems for the manga?Both.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vewpIvzTf8A
>>8006033It's not just that, modern comics think more detail is better and they have more tools to make that happen more easily. Older comics are more readable because backgrounds were simpler and they made smarter, more artful use of color rather than trying to fully render everything both in lines and color like we get now.
Is 4-koma style used for non-comedy mangas as well? If yes, any examples to give a read?
>>8006056Google "4koma manga that are not comedy"
>>8006059But I want to hear from anons of this community so we can create a bond and find meaning in the ways of life.
>>8006069Tch! I threw away such sentiment long ago. Friendship and bonds will get you nowhere because something about betrayal and my dark secret past. *throws the google search at you cool style so it sticks out of the ground* The next time we meet...we'll be enemies.
>>8006047I pin the blame on digital.When you're drawing on phyiscal paper, it's very easy to get a sense for how big a drawing is, and how much is too much or too little. But on digital you can zoom in a great and I think many comic artists today zoom in far more than they should and end up drawing details that are too small.
>>8006075
>>8006075:O :O :O NANI?!
>>8005836>I like the art a lot, but the lettering could be done betterThank you, I find Arial to have a certain philosophical quality especially when its poorly fitted into the bubbles, but it might be just me so I'll think about changing how I do it
I came across this interesting read I thought I'd share it here. Maybe it'll be useful to some of you. The full story is actually much longer so I shortened it to just a summary.Back in 2010, a legendary thread popped up on a famous Japanese web forum from an ordinary, totally unremarkable 17-year-old kid. Up until that summer, he was just coasting through a high-level prep school, hitting a wall trying to keep up with his peers. Then, a friend boldly declared he was dropping everything to become a musician because life is too short to live with safe regrets. Inspired, our narrator decided to risk it all and chase his dream of becoming a manga artist.But right from the start, he was trapped in a massive creative delusion. He’d draw stuff heavily ripped off from existing tropes, but completely lacked self-awareness, genuinely convincing himself in his own little bubble that he had invented a revolutionary new genre. Looking back, he admits he would have saved himself years of agony if he had just faced reality and quit then.Things escalated when he somehow caught the attention of an editor from a major publisher (Company S) a battle hardened veteran handling top-tier Shonen manga. Meeting him was absolute brutal reality. The editor would rip through his manuscripts at lightning speed, flat-out telling him that his stories stood zero chance of winning any competition and that he completely failed to convey any genuine human emotion. Yet, right when the kid's soul was about to utterly shatter, the editor would drop just enough backhanded praise or point out a tiny silver lining to keep him hooked on hopium.(1/4)
>>8006129In the end, the grand series he always promised never made it to print. The psychological burnout was so absolute that after everything crashed down and he cut ties with everyone, he couldn't even summon the mental energy to build anything creative from scratch again. Job hunting was a nightmare.Fast forward to today. He’s surviving thanks to another former aspiring manga artist friend who tossed him some basic freelance illustration gigs. It doesn't pay enough to fully live off of, but it keeps him afloat and gives him just enough confidence to walk outside and talk to people again. His grand manga dreams are dead and buried.But the wildest part of the whole ordeal wasn’t just the rejection, it was the absolute psychological grinder of dealing with the industry behind the scenes. He talked about how working under that veteran editor felt like walking through a minefield. The guy wouldn't just critique the art. He would dissect the entire logic of the story panel by panel, pointing out how the characters' actions made zero psychological sense and how the pacing completely dragged. Every meeting felt like an execution, but because the editor was seasoned enough to occasionally mix in a tiny shred of constructive feedback, it kept the kid trapped in an endless loop of false hope, making him think, "Next time, I'll get it right."(2/4)
>>8006130He spent years pouring every ounce of his youth, energy, and sanity into drawing, thinking he was grinding toward greatness, only to realize he was just spinning his wheels in a mud pit. When everything finally imploded, including the messy personal betrayal drama with his inner circle. He completely shut down. He mentioned that even years later, the mental exhaustion lingers. The thought of trying to build a creative project or plot a story from scratch makes his stomach turn because his brain is just completely fried from the trauma of that failure.Nowadays, he keeps his head down, doing low-level digital art and illustration work thrown his way by a sympathetic old friend from the manga forums. He can't even share his current portfolio because he's terrified of someone connecting the dots back to his old anonymous internet persona. Looking back at that 17-year-old kid who thought he was going to be the next big thing, he left the board with a sobering final thought: if you ever feel the urge to throw away a stable life for a half-baked creative dream without any real talent to back it up, just remember his story and maybe choose a safer hobby.(3/4)
>>8006132And that really is the essence of why that 2010 thread became such an enduring internet legend on Japanese forums. It wasn’t just a funny story about a kid failing at a hobby. It was a brutal, unfiltered autopsy of what happens when youthful delusion crashes headfirst into the merciless wall of the commercial entertainment industry.A lot of people on the boards at the time went in expecting a typical "follow your dreams and never give up" shonen narrative, but instead got slapped with the sobering reality of the grind. It showed how easily an impressionable teenager can get trapped in an echo chamber of their own making, fueled by bad writing habits and a desperate need to feel special. When the curtain was finally pulled back, there was no dramatic redemption arc or secret masterpiece published at the end, just a guy quietly picking up the pieces of a normal life, working freelance gigs in the shadows, and leaving behind a stark warning for anyone else naive enough to think passion alone is enough to conquer the industry.(4/4)
>>8006087That's definitely a big part of it. I can't help but zoom in a bunch myself.
>>8006129>>8006130>>8006132>>8006133It will be different for us.Do not believe in you, believe in me that believes in you.
>>8006115Holy basadiño
>>8006133I don't really understand your type. Why is it that the pursuit of prestige is so overprioritized, so glamorized, when people talk about drawing comics they never remark much about their love for what they are doing as though it's an afterthought. In situations such as these I can't help but think that failure is inevitable if you are disconnected from that aspect of creativity.The publishing sphere is 99% unknowns. Maybe what he was hammering into you is more like a rhetorical "what makes you think you belong here?" And that's a question I think should be posed to every empty headed person who can't name a publication besides the big three. Why can't you draw your story and be happy?
>>8006129>>8006130>>8006132>>8006133This kind of story is totally out of date because it implies there's any risk involved with following your dreams.There WAS a risk in the past. In the past there was the choice between a traditional career that was reliable and stable, vs the risky venture of becoming a manga artist.But nowadays that divine doesn't exist. There is no stable career path anymore, and so venturing to pursue your passion no longer qualifies as a risk because you don't have anything to lose.
How do I best make use of thumbnails?
>>8006161draw comics only in thumbnail form and see how good they are. thumbnails and storyboards is 90% of the actual work and what you shoud be getting good at.
>>8006130>The guy wouldn't just critique the art. He would dissect the entire logic of the story panel by panel, pointing out how the characters' actions made zero psychological sense and how the pacing completely draggedGoddamn I would love to work for that guy. I wonder which authors he actually published.
>>8006156>There is no stable career path anymoreThere absolutely is, but most people are little bitches these days and can't handle real work. Tradies are NEVER hurting for work or money. They make big bucks and will never not be in demand and short supply. Except you have to actually learn something, get dirty and put your heart into it. It requires you take active control of your own success. You fuckers just want to sit in a chair and scratch your ass all day and get a sweet paycheck. That option only ever existed for the already rich and their lower ranked family, and you ain't them.
I'm just coasting until either UBI or the mass culling, bro.
>>800616180/20 rule. 20% of the work is responsible for 80% of the quality. Thumbnailing is that 20%.You draw very small, undetailed versions of the comic so you can quickly iterate and change things so it reads clearly and tells the story you are trying to tell and includes all the bits you wanted. It's the iteration process that results in good stories told well. Without thumbnailing the work first you're just flying blind and hoping it ends up good (it won't). What's easier, realizing you hate the direction you went and throwing out a bunch of pages that took you a collective 30 hours to draw or 30 minutes?
>>8006194>>8006178Do we have some http://setteidreams.net/settei/ version for manga names?
>>8006129>He’d draw stuff heavily ripped off from existing tropes, but completely lacked self-awareness, genuinely convincing himself in his own little bubble that he had invented a revolutionary new genre.Every teenager does this for basically every subject of mild interest to them.>Yet, right when the kid's soul was about to utterly shatter, the editor would drop just enough backhanded praise or point out a tiny silver lining to keep him hooked on hopium.Classic, basically how casinos work. Give people just not enough but with the hope of getting more.>>8006132>don't throw away all your personal connections and life for a half-baked ideaI mean no duh, but it's not entirely his fault since he was too young to know better and it's bad luck getting an editor who prioritizes the hardass side of things too much.>>8006133It's not necessarily just a "this is the reality of life" deal, it's just the one end of the spectrum with "you can do it!" on the other side.
>>8006183None, he bullied them all into suicide. The great filter.>>8006190>You fuckers just want to sit in a chair and scratch your ass all day and get a sweet paycheck.Hell yeah.
>>8006194>undetailed versions of the comic so you can quickly iterate and change thingsThis part is important to anyone who doesn't understand this yet, if you make your thumbs too detailed you'll feel like you're making sanitized soulless versions of the originals when you move onto lineart.t. retard who did that
>>8006156Nah yeah, it feels nice knowing everything is kind of fucked at least from a creators perspective. Like with the world crumbling around you you have no reason to adhere to the fucking rules or standards of the past cause its not like those fucking standards have done the industry at large any fucking favors. Like despite every industry failing around me(hell even the glorious land of the rising sun might get fucked given whats going on with the yen over there) I still see good work being made by small groups/solo creators on the internet with their own comics or animations. Like I submitted my shit to that fucking Kodansha contest, and in the off chance that I get editor feedback(cause I know there is no way in hell Im winning that shit) that says 'you need to change this' or 'this character should take this path' I could probably get away with sticking to my guns and do whats right by me cause I dont got the pressure of trying to fucking "make it" in the traditional sense
>>8006127Arial is the cheap version of helvetica haha. But it's not just font choice, but there's some rules/tropes of comic lettering. Use a sans serif font*, center weighting and all capitals. However on capital i, when it's a pronoun (I said hello), then it's a capital i with serif. When it's a capital i in the middle of a word it has no serif.
>>8005995It's interresting how unremarkable he was
>>8006133>just a guy quietly picking up the pieces of a normal life, working freelance gigs in the shadowsFunny how I picked safe path and still end up like this. Guess some things you can't escape
>>8005396Your art's pretty rough, but I really like your demon designs, and your protagonist - I never caught his name - is a good design for being so simple.I think this is the best panel in the work.
>>8006056There are plenty. Many of the Manga Time Kirara series are 4Koma, and I think they tend to vary in subject matter, but I can't say for sure. The only one I've read is Machikado Mazoku/The Demon Girl Next Door. Its mostly a slice-of-life with some comedy, but it has an over arching story about Magical Girls and Demon girls and some weird, mysterious stuff going on in the background. So, while it does tend to have some comedy, it does have plotlines and fights and stuff in it.
>>8006129>>8006130>>8006132>>8006133It's obvoiusly crab bait.But still, what a fucking bitch. He had it all at the yungest age possible, a sensei he never learned from, a lot of opportunities, he fumbled all of them, becouse of muh glorified zoomer sadness.What a bitch. If you aren't ready to die for art, don't even start.He brought dishonesty over his whole family, there is only one way out for this lilliput.
Guys, is there something proper to read about the density of comic books, has anyone worth listen to ever talked about it?I hate comics that are too dense most of the time.Especially if there is a wall of text.Im perfectly fine with reading books, when reading a book i can enter a flow state and just read. You are imerged into the text and your mile stonce for distance are pages you turn.But a comic page with too much text breaks the flow for me. The symbios of text and visuals stops working. If there is a big block of info dump and all i have to compensate for it is a small drawing of a head with one emotion, it does not work anymore.
>>8006411What's there to say? Sounds like you already have your opinion formed anyway.
>>8006413pyw
>>8006416>>7998651
>>8006411I think its just bad comic making if they put too much text and its not an intentional quirk. And I mean like over 4 lines per bubble, that's when its its too much.
Anyone remember GameTrailers.com? They used to have a forum and thats where I posted that stuff that is depicted in the comic
>>8006466
>>8006468
>>8006466Stop spamming pages. Nobody else on /mmg/ does this. Create a single gallery link and be done with it.
>>8006473its just 3 pages chill
Regarding zooming levels. Yes, if you lock the size of your brush and lock your zooming, at least if you never zoom more than 100%, it looks less uncanny. But it's so fucking awkward to do.I really think digital works for teams only, or for very simple styles.If you have a team and you switch do digital, you can ditch the office building, everyone can work from home, you can edit the same document life. Yeah, i bet you save money and time doing that.Or if you do little strips, with very thick, bold, simple shapes. There are no details anyway, you can work fast and it will look holistic.But if you work alone and the style is somewhat complicated, not strips but proper manga pages, i don't think you would save a lot of time working analog. In my case personally i sketch faster with pencil on paper. Faster, more aggressive and more precise at the same time. You have no liquify, you can't cut stuff out and make it bigger or something like that. But i bet i am at least equaly fast. Inking would be slower traditionally if i would do a proper art piece. But inking a page for scanning allows much more room for mistakes. You can't white out mistakes on a proper drawing, for manga it's fine.You have an extra step with scanning and adjusting, yes. But overall.I really don't think digital is better for solo cartoonists. If you like digital more, than sure, but if not, i don't think it's rational to switch.
>>8006473It's an imageboard. Let the man post his pages.
>>8006478When I switched to digital it was for practical reasons. I didn't have the money to be buying the professional materials all the time. Instead I spent a few hundred once on the tablet + MangaStudio and didn't have to think about it again until it was time to upgrade years down the road.
>>8006480>I didn't have the moneyWell, that's unfortunately true. The cost for trad stuff got out of hand.I would say you would need at least 50 eu montly, if you draw regularly.
>>8006411Because comics are an harmonious blend of art and story, they are more akin to film or animation than a book. The art largely dictates the pacing/timing of the scene, and so if the text is too much, it feels jarring. There should be only as much text as is possible in the timing of the panel.
>>8006033>>8006036I think a lot of this comes down to publishing constraints. I've read several comic people complain about how little space they're given to get it on paper. You're almost forced to have small panels and lots of text.
>>8006520contWhen you read a long bit of text in the book, you don't imagine one singular pose from the guy saying it. You imagine it as a whole scene, lkely with different camera angles and poses. (Or atleast, if you were to adapt such a thing to film that's what you would do)But in a comic, that work is already done for you and now you have to simply watch what is given to you. So again, the drawing in a panel should match the text in the panel. If there's too much text, it'll feel weird and jarring.
>>8006521Nobody is forced to buy a comic. If the product is shit, nobody will buy it. There's no point in making a substandard product. If you have to comlain and say "oh it's bad because bla bla this and that reason" the only response anyone can give is "then why did you even bother to make it at all if it's shit?" The minimum accepted quality is good.
>>8006523What? Yeah, I don't like it in (american) comics either. They've driven themselves into an evolutionary dead end. I don't know why you think I'm defending them, just saying that the very artists working on these comics agree with you. In the vast majority of cases artists cannot draw what they think is good, they need to draw everything in the script that gets passed down to them.
>>8005372this only works if you are into it, the fetish is felt like newtype connection between artist and viewer.>t.fetishist
>>8006529I don't think you're defending them, I just like ranting.I remember having an argument a while ago with someone over this page here, notice the wonky eyes. They argued that they're wonky because they were drawn quickly and the artist was making so many pages per month that he didn't have time to make each face perfect.But that's not an option. You have to make a ton of pages per month AND they all have to be of a good quality. This page is hideous, I don't want to read it. In the artist's efforts to put the page out on time, they've ruined the whole thing. It wasn't worth putting out at all in this state.
>>8006549To be fair if I was given a page with dialog like that I'd be pretty checked out too.
>>800654999% of times you can blame the inker for shit like this.>But that's not an option. You have to make a ton of pages per month AND they all have to be of a good quality.But he didn't make them of good quality and the world didn't explode. He got his paycheck, kept his job. Why is it not an option?>he didn't make good art!geeg
>>8005341I don't plan to shill every thread, just posting this here because someone in the last one said there were issues with uploading on my manga site.Please let me know later (still rebuilding the site often today, so maybe tomorrow) if it still doesn't work for you, I'll look into it again.
>>8006556The effect doesn't have to be immediate for it to still have an effect. The effect here is that people will think it's shit and cease to continue buying comics, which... as anyone can clearly see, they have. And when people don't buy comics, the company doesn't make any money and that artist will cease to be paid. So yes, by making a shit product in a markey where there is no tolerance for subpar work, you will lose your job.Nobody listens to shit music. The minimum acceptable quality is good.
>>8006340Glad you liked it. Honestly I think I could have done better if I havent tried making it full color. And at some point I just wanted to finish it already.
>>8006562>Nobody listens to shit music.they do though.
>>8006549Pages like these are why I can't read a good amount of western comics. Nobody talks like this, the coloring doesnt look great, the art doesnt look great at all, the paneling is boring, etc. I would rather read a damn webtoon, and I already don't like webtoons... but at least they aren't infested with awful Gen X writing.
Does anyone here actually like manga/making manga or is it just a bunch of /co/migrants grumbling about how the home industry committed suicide. You guys do know you don't NEED to copy the japs right? Especially when you're not even interested. You can always just make western styled stuff like usual. There won't be alot of readers, but it's not like half-hearting these skinwalker ''manga'' would do any better.
>>8006599I do and I posted my stuff>>8005426
>>8006599IMO, there's not nearly as much of a stylistic divide between manga and comics as it appears.Let me be clear by what I say here. By style, I mean things that either comics or webcomics deliberately do as part of their choice, like being set in New York, or wearing Japanese school uniforms.But outside of this, the difference between manga and comics is not style but skill.Comics don't look like manga, not because they're opting for a different style, but because manga looks good and comics look bad. The artists in comics simply don't know how to draw properly, and this skill divide is so great that any good looking art is immediately recognized as manga, and any bad art is comics. The result is that anyone who wishes to make good art in this medium, appears to want to make manga instead. They don't actually care about the stylistic choices like being set in Japan or any of that, but they do care about making good art. And anyone who sneers at manga and desires to make comics is veritably insane.
>>8006521>>8006036someone in another thread on /ic/ talked about why western comics are so shit. Its because each part of the process is a completely different person and also something they're trying to be competitive in. They're not in it together or unified in vision, they're just trying to make the best thing they can to make themselves look good. The writer doesnt know a thing about the art or the colors, so he writes something he thinks is cool and wants the page to be full of text. The artist wants the art to be amazing so he draws without regard for where the text will be. etc etc
>>8006608>They're not in it together or unified in vision, they're just trying to make the best thing they can to make themselves look good.Same with manga, the assistants and the patriarch are two different entities, with different goals.Therefore there is such a stark difference between characters and backgrounds in most manga.
>>8006636Nonsense. Japan is a strict hierarchical country and assistants to mangaka are totally subserviant to the mangaka. The assistant has absolutely no directorial input, they are given clear directions by the mangaka, telling them exactly what to do and they do not deviate from their given instructions.Assistants often have to spend the first few weeks of their employment learning to mimic the style. The mangaka often has to make dedicated style guides for the assistants, detailing even the most minute artistic decisions to be made such as the specific way to draw trees, hatching, how hair is to be rendered, etc.
>>8006411>>8006422HxHfags, our honest cope?
>>8006639The principal and agent dilemma was even true 2k years ago, between slaves and masters. The slaves tried to do what's best for them, and it was often contrary to the interests of the masters.Japanese "hierarchy" is bullshit, just a larp. If the assistants do what they want, you can't do anything about it. I mean, look at any manga, thats not drawn by one person, you will see how the assistants sabotage the whole thing.You could say exactly the saym about burgermerica. It's the most capitalist country, and if marvel pays the best money, to the best pencler, artist, incer, colorist, aouthor etc. by the low of the economy, they will produce the best work... yeah, sure, if you look at reality, thats not the case.Mangakas are pussies, instead of playing idol master, they should draw more. The only way to greatness is drawing everything by yourself. Thats a law of nature, you will never ever be able, to make assistants do good work. They will always backstab you.
>there is only superhero or shonen manga slop
>>8006636>Same with manga, the assistants and the patriarch are two different entities, with different goals.I don't want to feed into this east vs west shit but you're dead wrong. It's true that western comic production is very heavily partitioned (deliberately so), but the same can't be said for manga. The author is the one who ultimately decides who works as their assistant and whether or not said assistant's work on the manga actually makes it in. A penciller at Marvel has no control over who inks his work or how and the inker has no control over who colors it or how. If an assistant's work doesn't gel with the manga then they're let go and the author just finds another assistant.
>>8006652>you can't do anything about it.You can fire them because you are their employer. Please stop talking on topics you have no knowledge on.
>>8006657American situation is worse, but manga is bad as well. And you can't do anything about it. You wold have to be a mastermind and control your people all day long, not making anything else and maybe then. But most likely even that will not work. You are hitting a wall, the best minds on Earth can't solve for thousands of years. Even the assistants of Trump do everything to fuck him over. You are arguing against reality. Show me a manga, with great backgrounds drawn by assistants. You can't.
>>8006659You fire the old ones, (which is not the way to go in Japanese society by the way) the new ones will do the same. How high are the chances to get a unicorn? 1 to a million?
>>8006660What the fuck are you ranting about? What does this shit have to do with anything in my post? I'm getting baited by a fucking bot again aren't I.>>8006661Gee I don't fucking know bro, ask all the manga authors who have assistants and seem to do just fine. Walk outside and you might just find that the sky is blue, too.
>>8006660>Show me a manga, with great backgrounds drawn by assistants. You can't.Fist of the North Star, Berserk, any Morita Masanori manga, fucking Attack on Titan ffs. Have you read a manga before? Suck my hairy nuts.
>>8006595>nobody talks like thisIn fairnessNo one talks like manga characters either.
>>8006654Someone post the pic that's like "I want an ADULT comic!" and the examples include muh holocaust comics
>>8006669>BerserkThe same a said about Vagabond is true for Berserk as well. >>8005999>Morita Masanori I haven't read that, but from google search, its the same phototracing stuff as usual.>Attack on Titan It looks somewhat wonky as well as the characters, so i will give you half of a point for that.
>>8006654I really dislike this style of comic. I expect the artist will probably assert that the amatuerish crosshatching is deliberate. But can they even do good crosshatching if they tried?And they always have these really inexpressive dot eyes, but can they even real proper eyes if they tried?The art in these kinds of comics really brings very little to the table. It's more like just a picture book with a higher average picture count, but it's not really utilising all that the medium has to offer. And in general it looks amatuerish so why should I give a shit about it?
>>8006682Persepolis is another example. Is the art deliberately drawn so amatuerishly? or does the artist just simply have no skill? If it is deliberate, why? What does it add that would not be far better conveyoed with more skilled art?And before you mention ONE. ONE tries, and ONE has actually improved a great deal.
>>8006683I thought art doesn't matter according to this thread
>>8006683>Is the art deliberately drawn so amatuerishly? or does the artist just simply have no skill?Both.>>8006683>If it is deliberate, why?Short answer is postmodernism.
>>8006683I'm going to be honest, I would probably not enjoy Persepolis more if it had better art. I like that it's drawn simply. Also, I don't think the artist can draw any better anyway. It'd be like asking Ludwig Bemelmans to draw Madeleine better or to have Antoine de Saint Expury draw The Little Prince better. The art itself is objective /beg/ or even perma-pre-/beg/, but it's full of soul and it works for the subject..... and I don't think any of them could have drawn better. >>8006688Overall it doesn't matter, but exceptions can still arise based on what artist you're talking about or even which anon you're talking to.
>manga characters vs backgrounds (assisted)someone post the CSM pages
Alright lets find an answer to this once and for allHere is a compilation of manga panels from a wild variety of manga, many of which are extremely famous. I have deliberately chosen panels that feature both the main characters in clear view (because they are certain to be drawn by the author), and complex bakckgrounds (because they are likely to be drawn by assistants).Are they stylistically disjunctive? Are they unbearable to look at? Is your immersion forcefully stripped away from you and you are unable to enjoy the story?Perhaps you will reply with a cherrypicked example of a particularly amatuerish artist who does know how to direct his assistants. Well can you demonstrate that this is a common practice and that harmonious blends of character and backgrounds are not the norm? Because edge cases are just that, edge cases, exceptions to the rule. I have shown here some very famous manga, manga that most would agree serve as examples for others to follow, examples of how manga is, not how manga isn't.
>>8006683>And before you mention ONE. ONE tries, and ONE has actually improved a great deal.geniune question is my art postmodern amateurish or trying like ONEfirst page of my comic
>>8006718page 100current newest pages>>8006466
>>8006720different styles:>>8005450>>8005438
>>8006718Compare pic related to your pic.Despite ONE's janky drawings, there are a myriad of traditional manga techniques on show here. The speedlines, the sfx, the camera angles, the perspective, the panel shapes and sizes, the speechbubbles design. The only thing that's really particularly amatuerish is the art itself. And as you can see, it's not comically amatuerish anymore. It would fit in this general easily and wouldn't even be nearly the worst here.Your art however, while it too is amateurish. Yours does not follow any traditional manga practices like those that I've mentioned. Even if your art were spectacular, it would still not look like manga.
>>8006716
>>8006720One thing that western artists do a lot, that manga artists seldom ever do, is drawing attention to the medium itself through fourth wall breaking elements or other sorts of abstractions.It's rare even for manga speechbubbles to even break out of their panel boxes. Sfx text often does but even then it's not entirely.The panel boxes are never weird. They are always simple rectangles with no design given to them, and the only deviation is during action scenes where they become diagonal, and even then, not all manga artists do that.Abstractions like in your 3rd panel, are rarely used. Instead you will see a realistically depicted flashback.
>>8006726one of the biggest recent manga.This is just shockingly bad.
>>8006727Something like pic related is never done in manga
>>8006724I want to try to drive this point home harder, because I believe it can be of great help to beginners.While learning to actually be able to draw is of course very important in making a good looking manga... you can help boost yourself forward a great deal by simply copying tried and tested formulaic ways of drawing manga.This isn't to say make your manga lazy and derivative. It's more like... these are good form. Like putting your fingers on the piano keyboard in an established form, or hitting a baseball with a bat using established good form.If you took any random good manga, and replaced the drawings in the panels with hapharzadly drawn beginner squiggles, but left everything else the same like the sfx and speedlines, etc. It would still look and read pretty good.You should spend a great deal of time paying close attention to these ways of drawing things in manga and use them in your own manga rather than attempting to reinvent the wheel.
>>8006727>>8006730Japan is less corrupted by the deconstructive force of postmodernism.
>>8006716Whats your question?
>>8006733This here is an attempt to abstract out common artistic techniques used in manga to great effect. Removing the character design, removing the panel shape, removing the context, and just showing the technique itself. I kind of want to redo this because these are quite old, but you can still easily see alot of clever tricks here.If you want to draw a character shocked at a phone call, you can add spedlines in this manner. If you want to draw a character realize something shocking, you can make the background black and add this kind of white starburst and line thing. Etc.And there's really no end to what you can learn if you just look. You can learn exactly how to draw almost every part of a manga, from the lines, to specific background details, clothes, specific shades of hair, skies, lightning effects, fire effects, angry faces, happy faces, etc etc etc.Look at other manga, and see how they do it. Build up for yourself a large reference library of manga examples and see how they do things.
>>8006727toriyama proves you wrong lol
>>8006740the exception to the rule does not disprove the ruleIn western comics they break the fourth wall in almost every comic. In manga it is extremely rare
>>8006716>drawn by assistantsChad Nihei WOULD NEVER
>>8006740The anon you're quoting even said "manga artists SELDOM ever do."
>>8006727>>80067414th wall breaking seems to be generally reserved for comedy stuff like SZS
>>8006743I don't know this artist, but it's entirely possible for assistants to be trained to draw even extremely fantastical backgrounds. It just takes more time training.
>>8006743I like tower dungeon (btfos his last couple of flops) but it really makes me ask how the fuck he ever drew blame to a schedule.
>>8006741>It's rare even for manga speechbubbles to even break out of their panel boxesVery false, read more mangas.Also, 4th wall breaking and playful/creative paneling are not the same thing. There are many manga artists who do enjoy playing around with paneling.
>>8006749You must post examples to prove your point. A large compilation like >>8006716 would be suitable.
ok so everyone agrees that manga rapes american comics. How about european comics? A lot harder to compare IMO.
>>8006756I've never seen these elusive "euro comics" that everyone is so keen to point out whenever people shit on western comics.All I see is boomer shit and kiddie shit.Where's the Kimetsu no Yaiba of western comics?
that's bait.
>>8006747>I don't know this artist,Zoomie, hahaha.>it's entirely possible for assistants to be trained to draw even extremely fantastical backgroundsYeah, lets teach an assistant to draw like Nihei, you idiot, haha.>>8006748You can read his interviews, wasn't fun for him.
>>8006756>How about european comics?Blacksad has very, very nice art overall. All drawn and colored by the same artist.But i don't think there is a second Blacksad out there.But another example of a holistic work, drawn by one person.
>>8006562>Nobody listens to shit music.Let me call up every country fan.
>>8006769
>>8006654>furfaggotryOpinion hakai'd.
>>8006769luther arkwright.
>>8006688Are you the guy that was losing his mind when people pointed out that writing and drawings are intertwined to make manga a complete experience?
>>8006727This one is just lazy and needlessly self-fellating>>8006730This one actually looks neat since it bothers to direct the reader's eye
>>8006729Your standards are too high, it looks fine.
According to /mmg/ a manga is when you have a character and some speedlines
>>8006790>Your standards are too high, it looks fineCome on, bro. If any of us had been the one to make this and posted it on /ic/, we would have been roasted half to death and a fresh wave of "lol /mmg/ can't draw" would be everywhere for the next month.>inb4 it's because the artist is working under a time crunch or anything else like thatIf it looks bad, it looks bad. I blatantly prefer eastern comics over western ones because I think they're objectively superior in almost every single way you could judge a comic, but you don't see me carrying water for bad panels.
>>8006774Looks interesting. Not as good as Blacksad, maybe i will give it a read.>>8006777From a quick google search, it looks ugly as fuck.
>>8006797>we would have been roasted half to death and a fresh wave of "lol /mmg/ can't draw" would be everywhere for the next monthThat will happen no matter what, at least when someone here gives honest criticism to somebody who takes it as a personal attack and makes more than one thread about their seethe.
Godammit you guys are really wasting the entire thread with comic vs manga bullshit Again??? The same fucking topics over and over? The board filled with the same shit isn't enough? The stupid question general too? None of you will change your minds on this matter so why keep the sluperfest?
>>8006727ok
>>8006813That actually looks charming though. DC has a problem where the characters are too smug about breaking the 4th wall like every character has to do it Rick and Morty style.
>>8006756European comics are pure sovl compared to japanese and american slop, it's not even comparable
>>8006816>thing japan
>>8006816Agree, that's just a cute thing to do. It doesn't really break the immersion.I think the reason is, they arent breaking anything. It's not like they are "free" or as if they talk to you. The characters are taking the world still serious, they look at the next page and are amazed by it. Very different vibe.
>>8006820Generic cartoon slop in a gay furfag art style, try again.
>>8006813the Witch Hat artist worked in western comics for awhile, wich is where she picked up some of 4th wall break stuff. also in the context of the story it makes sense, in the context of batman something like >>8006730doesn't. manga does break the 4th wall but usually it's through jokes or a self aware trope instead of the design of a page.I think the comic vs manga binary misses the point, these are all techniques you can study and pull from to use in your own work. I personally like scott pilgrim a lot, Omalley has said he was inspired by ranma 1/2 and I think his use of manga like paneling was one of the reasons why the series was so successful.
>>8006812Should we talk about Kishimotos 0.1% hahaha?
>>8006821Not the anon you were responding to, but for real? You can't detect the auto-masturbatory smugness that comes off of some of these Marvel/DC panels? The smugness literally insists upon itself. And if it's not smugness about some Marvel writing sarcastic quip, then its about some random woke thing du jour they're talking about and then they're still smug.
>>8006036To me, I find western comics easy to read physically, but digitally not as much. I think there's a lot more nuance to it though. The following is speculation, but i think some of the reason is because of the more simple storylines older western comics would have, but post 80's where stories are written to be more serious and dialog heavy. combine that and lot of them are monthly and written to be only maybe 4 issue+ series to tell a complete story... you gotta maximize the space you're given in 20ish pages. While manga often have a weekly or monthly release with maybe not a set in stone volume count from the start? I also feel like weekly manga pad out their stories with low panel count pages, or action sequences that don't move the plot that much further to give them time to catch up on writing more plot. Either way, both have awesome work, and both have boring generic titles too. Picture is standard B4 manga paper and book, and standard 11×17 comic board and a book
>>8006850I wouldn't pay much heed to low effort shitposts. Imagine they just say the exact same thing again to imply that you are saying "thing: japan" but with more words. They are not as committed to the argument as you are but they will likely continue to make short posts designed to provoke you into making long posts defending your position. It's that Shenmue QTE where you have to not press the buttons.
>>8006178>thumbnails and storyboards is 90% of the actual work and what you shoud be getting good at.I think when Dave Gibbons spent 2 days pencilling, inking, and lettering each page of The Watchmen by himself, he wasn't thinking 'Thank god the 20 solid days I spent thumbnailing this one individual page are over, and now I can do the easy part which is making a 2 day page of pro art to a deadline'
>>8006883>It's that Shenmue QTE where you have to not press the buttons.It's been a long while for me since I played. Which QTE is this again?
>>8006895The only one I know from cultural osmosis, I think it's at a barber shop and the guy presses the blade to your neck and the button prompt appears but the trick is to not press the button for story-related reasons, the analogy being to not to respond to trolls.
>>8006890You can't be this retard...
>>8006899I did a 10x and forgot to subtract the 2So I should have typed 18 days thumbnailingThis is nowhere near as bad as saying 90% of the work is thumbnails and storyboard, which is literally, physically, conceptually not real
>>8006800You probably saw a current year page, Talbot has bizarrely got worse over time (dude is like 80 tbf). This was his first comic over, super talented guy. I love it.
>>8006906Anon, the last thing Mr. Dave Gibbons would want is to put all the ART WORK of penciling, inking, and lettering, just to look at it and realize it has dogshit pacing, panelling, and whatnot. Storyboarding is most of the work because it is the most meaningful part. Do you have any idea how long it takes, unless you are some type of genius, to actually plan a good comic/manga? Did you actually try it yourself? It takes a lot of effort and time, and you might redo it many times.And the percentages of that anon are to illustrate the point, not to be taken literally.
>>800690690% of the work is thumbnailing and storyboard when you are good at drawing. If drawing things is hard then sure, you will work harder on that. Its a balance though and inking vs storyboarding are part of the same pie that is your mental energy.
single page
>>8007090why
>>8007090>the top panel bottom bedframe>the bottom panel windowWhat....... exactly is going on here? What's with the clipping?
>>8007090>that Mario Party minigame wasn't just a dream
>>8005374Appreciate it. Background are my least favorite/most time consuming thing to draw, so I photobash most of them(part 2 of previous comic)
>>8006681>The same a said about Vagabond is true for Berserk as well. >>8005999So? You asked for detailed assistant work that fits the art style and both Berserk and Vagabond fit the description. >I haven't read that, but from google search, its the same phototracing stuff as usual.Goalpost moving, "as usual". Your kind is a plague. No more (you)s til I see some of your work attached.
>>8006682>I expect the artist will probably assert that the amatuerish crosshatching is deliberate. But can they even do good crosshatching if they tried?You're inventing a strawman to look down on.>>8006737Why are you pretending you can't read?>>8006748>but it really makes me ask how the fuck he ever drew blame to a schedule.Young and hungry. He was drawing other manga at the same time too iiirc.>>8006729Don't buy it then, lmao. All you're doing is crying that other people like what you don't.
>>8006797>If any of us had been the one to make this and posted it on /ic/, we would have been roasted half to death and a fresh wave of "lol /mmg/ can't draw" would be everywhere for the next month.False. I've posted worse and the world didn't end. The sole reason you care is because CSM is popular. That's it, plain and simple.
>>8006812Oh no, someone will have to make a new thread! The tragedy!Jesus dude.
>>8007166For you faggots to keep this bullshit? Nah
>>8007167The thread is called manga making general and it's been around for 6 years. Talking about the same topics over and over is the entire fucking point of a general.
Do you shill yourself on reddit? Worth it?
>>8007192There isn't anywhere to really promote a longform comic on reddit, not like the kind /mmg/ makes.>places like r/comics want only a akngle page thing or at most four panels separated into their own pages>people only want to read the unfunny badly drawn comics that are pophlar there>mods are blatantly biased in favor of their little reddit darlings, especially pizzacake>other subreddits are more about mangas and anime but will ban you if you talk about any manga/anime that isnt officially published or is already super popular>they'll ban you anyway for self promotion, even though by only talking about popular animes/mangas they are ironically doing promotion of that IP for free>dont forget about all the other dystopian rules all of these subreddits have>did you try to post in here without 3938483747 comment karma? BANNED>did you try to post in here without ALSO participating in this other subreddit? BANNED>did you post in this other subreddit at all, even just a single letter response like "k"? BANNED>did you follow the rules and are now allowed to talk about your comic but oops you posted about it 10 min before the posting window to do so opened? BANNED>did you thread all of those other needles but you hosted with the wrong imagehosting site that this particular subreddit has a melty about via its moderators because of some unknowable reason? BANNED>and dont forget, all of this is just for ONE subreddit. You better also make sure you do the exact same thing for EVERY SINGLE OTHER SUBREDDIT YOU POST TO :^))))))))))))))))))))))))>all the comic related subreddits that dint have all these asinine rules are deader than dead and there's no point posting>even if you post, there's a chance the entire subreddit is purged anyway amd your posts gone because of some unknowable reason because reddit mods wield power over 292848272747472 subreddits at once and if you annoyed them for some reason they'll hunt you and your posts down across all of them
>>8007170Then why are a lot of people here trying to make and shill for comics instead of actual Japanese manga? Serious question. Makes it seem like the manga community in the west is ultimately unserious about their pursuit if even the more hardcore, seedy parts of the dark internet like 4chan are so uncommited to being against le society.
>>8007290>r/comics>comicsHow would that be relevant to manga thobeit? Manga are not *just* comics and have technically superior artstyles for storytelling. Comics are just not it my bro.
>>8006790It looks like rancid shit. No wonder you lot are all terrible if this is your inspiration.
>>8006821This would only be a cool jab if thing Japan was not guaranteed to be better just by virtue of coming from a culture with more highly developed technique and just better culture around art.Now it only makes you look like soi that is trying to cope hard.
>>8006790There is no such thing as too high standards for art my bro. The best existing artists in Japan are the standard, not just mangaka, artists in general. If it's worse than them then it's not too high yet.Not everyone is going to be at that level but coping about it is not a good look and isn't helping anyone.
>>8006865>To me, I find western comics easy to read physically,Me too, because not reading is simpler I guess. Only read western comics as a child and I consider that a point of honor.Reminder that for each comic you consume you have to read 5 manga, 5 LNs and 5 VNs to counteract the rot it causes to the manga-creating part of your mind.
>>8007335>guy 1: set standards equal to the highest possible bar>don't hit it but still get noticeably better>guy 2: set standards even slightly lower than the highest thing>never get even 50% of where the first guy gotIs there a name for this phenomenon? I've been noticing through my research that there are too many cases of this in the manga adjacent communities in the west.
>>8007331Try reading the first line of the OP.>Makes it seem like the manga community in the west is ultimately unserious about their pursuit if even the more hardcore, seedy parts of the dark internet like 4chan are so uncommited to being against le society.People here are making comics and manga. One of us is even published in a japanese magazine. Have you done better?
>>8007342Yeah that is the problem in the first place. Manga-styled stuff should not be in the same place as genuine manga if you want an actually healthy creator culture. But I know this is a little too hard for the west to accept currently and hits a little too close to home for a lot of the thread.>o..one of us did good thing so that excuses the culturePredictable response but still not a good look and not an argument. If you get published that is your accomplishment alone. If you want it to be a cultural one, the culture has to be specific towards getting published in Japan and not just playing around with comics.
>>8007346>Manga-styled stuff should not be in the same place as genuine mangaThen we can't have a thread at all. A "genuine" manga has to be made by a Jap.
>>8007346Based on what? What makes you the expert? If you don't like it here then feel free to leave.>heh, so predictable!Why are you acting like you're a fucking anime character? How embarassing.
>>8007335Post your updated weekly 20-page batch of manga interesting enough for people to actually engage in. Go ahead, I'll wait.
>>8007350Here you go, retard.Now stop excusing dogshit art and lazy faggotry and get the cock out of your ass and draw.
>>8007347Why not? Do you guys not study Japanese artists and try to reproduce their techniques? Even learning to write in Japanese perhaps?How would that be different from genuine manga? >>8007349Based on wanting the culture to be more advanced. Comics have their own board already. Manga is more powerful artistically and needs to be given the proper respect that it deserves in the west.I want to change the culture or at least force a couple of anons to have doubts about the current culture. I'm not delusional enough to think this isn't angrying most of the thread but it still has to be said because we live in le society.>>Why are you acting like you're a fucking anime character? >y...you have an intuitive understanding of the style you're trying to write in. that's le bad!!!!Looks like I'm all set to be a better writer than.
>>8007351Holy shit, Akira Toriyama? Why didn't you tell u- hey wait a second...>>8007353Where's your genuine manga? How are you advancing "the culture"? Apart from just being an obnoxious tool, I mean. You can talk all day, it's meaningless if you put no actual work in.>you have an intuitive understanding of the style you're trying to write inActually, I do. Do you? Show me.
>>8007351>less detailed, simpler style No shit it's more polished, all you did was reveal how little you actually draw. Have you ever even finished a chapter of something that didn't look like uninteresting garbage?
>>8007353>How would that be different from genuine manga?You talk about culture of manga, but don't understand that culture comes from being born and raised in the middle of it? All the quirks of manga come from a lifetime of osmosis of Japan's society, values, superstitions, everyday behaviors, body language, etc. You can't internalize all this from reading scribbles on paper or even learning the language.
>>8007355Why would I dox myself my lil bro? By trying to plant seeds of doubt in the anons who are willing to listen. I'm not going to associate my work with these "extreme" for the west statements and gather needless hate.I doubt it if you're getting triggered by someone talking "like an anime character" (which is not even a real thing btw).
>>8007359All I heard was "I'm a whiny faggot" 20x. Good job anon, I'm sure you draw a lot!
>>8007356If I was Toriyama himself and posted my work you would call it uninteresting just to stubbornly feel like you "won" an internet argument"Uninteresting" is also one of the most vague and weaselly descriptions of anything you could use. It has no definition or measurement.
>>8007358That's external cultural stuff. Manga uses a specific set of art techniques that can be learned just like in anime. It doesn't have to be le based in 2020s Shibuya, Japan for it to be manga. If you think art can just be reduced to superficial or even deep cultural references it's a very shallow view on the art skills of everyone involved.>>8007360I'm doubting your reading comprehension then. It's not a good look for anyone trying to write stories my bro.
>>8007359Oh, I get it. You either make nothing or know your own work would be laughed at. I see now why you come here to bring others down.
>>8007361Appeal is actually very easy to determine objectively. If people like it, then it has appeal. And holy cope. Maybe YOU talk needless shit to "win" arguments, but that doesn't mean you have to project that onto me kek. Do you live in this thread instead of drawing or something?
>>8007364>you don't want to gather hate in an extremely toxic and cancel-prone culture so you must be le badPredictable cope. If that's the thing you have to resort to then your internal world is close to crumbling already so I have done my job.
>>8007363>Manga uses a specific set of art techniques that can be learned just like in anime.You're ngmi. Just a surface level poser, probably black too. I've seen it a hundred times.
>>8007365>Do you live in this thread instead of drawing or something?Where is your drawing?
>>8007367If you think manga or anime adjacent Japanese art in general is some vague cultural stuff instead of tangible drawing/painting techniques you legitimately haven't even started trying to draw genuine manga yet.
>>8007366Damn you're right, my world is crumbling apart around me, you predicted my every move.
>>8007371Another easy win for me. Enjoy your new reality.
>>8007368Right next to your prostate, you should dig a little deeper and find it
>>8007377Ah, so you admit your art is literal shit thenNo wonder you aspire to Begsaw Man levels of greatness
>>8007367>probably blackWhy the racisms? I personally know black people who are more based (more Japanese in their artstyle) than most in the west.
>>8007389serialized mangaka btwI'd tell you to keel over and die trying to be a weekly Miura but we both know you don't have the stamina to finish even one page
>>8007390>>8007367Speaking of black people, they are genuinely being systematically oppressed with anti-Japan bias right now and forced to be more comic-compliant. They might be the second honorary shounen Japanese after Brazilians if all goes well and they manage to gain their independence from the general american black "culture" and become more radical in their views by dropping their nostalgic attachments towards American culture.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=30ZdPT67luo
>>8007394>serialized mangaka btwWhich you are not.Why not?
>>8007395Fucking called it lmaoYou will never make it.
>>8007398I'm not an African-American person of color myself, but I fully support the BIPOC community if they make the right choice by seeking refuge in Japanese artstyles.Racisms are not cool in 2026 and we need all the support we can get in the west.>You will never make it.Not to make it about myself, but I'm not worried about my trajectory compared to the manga-lite stuff that is pushed in this thread if we're talking purely about becoming more like Japanese artists.
>>8007401You will never make it because you can never become Japanese, and your idea of what makes something "Japanese" is big eyes and spiky hair.You have no clue what your are talking about and will go down the same path as every other black "mangaka" who makes some shallow Narubleach Z knockoff that never gains traction.
>>8007336>This would only be a cool jab if thing Japan was not guaranteed to be better just by virtue of coming from a culture with more highly developed technique and just better culture around art.lmao. mangaka themselfes admit that the art world and the manga world is opposite (a good thing perhaps for some)manga is all about volume and wastefulness, the relative quality is a byproductthere were mangaka who cut their 11x5 size page in half to then scan it for their smaller scanner, because the original does not matter. says it all really.
>>8006682>>8006683Ermmm, didn't you know that having bad art makes your art more artistic, chuddy? Bad art is high art, high effort, high skilled work is low art and cringe.
>>8007401>manga-lite stuff that is pushed in this threadWhat the fuck are you even talking about? Is ANYTHING being pushed in this thread other than whatever the fuck you're ranting about?
>>8007407>there were mangaka who cut their 11x5 size page in half to then scan it for their smaller scanner,Dude what are you talking about. What decade is this from? the 60's? What publisher is this from? some random sketchy underground black company?Why would you think Shueisha doesn't own big enough scanners to scan their fucking manga?Literal insanity
>>8007407Manga is a part of the art world, the art world is anime illustration / anime animation adjacent art. Nothing else matters in this context my bro.The west does not have an equivalent high quality culture around art integrated with storytelling. Low standards and refusal to make authentic Japanese art are the biggest reasons.
>>8007403I don't wan to become Japanese. Japan needs to do more racisms in my view.It's purely about following the artstyles, which have tangible properties and rules you can repeat exactly to get the same result. It's not magic my bro. Did you actually try to draw like a Japanese artist? Did you learn nothing on that journey?>every other black "mangaka" who makes some shallow Narubleach Z knockoff that never gains traction.It's because they have shallower commitments to Japanese artstyles while still having lingering attachments to the west. I am entirely free from both so I am in a better position from the get-go.>>8007409I mean even the position that manga is superior being in debate and not the norm. That you should be doing things exactly like in Japan not being the default norm.In a higher culture where these would be the default (you know the average skill in the west would be much higher in such a world) nothing I'm saying would be met with hostility.
>>8007410He saw it on a video essay about mangaka so it must be true and relevant to today.
>>8007416You've got to be the biggest weeb pseud we've had in a long time.The funny thing about your kind is that for all your talk, your work is never good. Probably because you spend more time proselytizing than drawing.
>>8007410it was a documentary, don't remember whichit was a small time mangaka, and I don't think the publishing houses scan the manga...?>>8007413>The west does not have an equivalent high quality culture around art integrated with storytelling.movies
>>8007418>biggest weebI take that as a compliment, but that speaks a lot about how far the culture is from where it has to be. Nothing I am saying should be even remotely controversial.Idk man, I know a decent amount of people with more redpilled views on Japanese art and it always correlates with higher art skill.>>8007421Movies are a simpler form of visual art, is not equivalent because it's not 2D. Also i's a pseud/government infiltrated medium from the beginning so storytelling being subverted for other purposes is not uncommon culturally.
>>8007423>Movies are a simpler form of visual artAbsolute retard
>>8007424You don't have the same level of control as in 2D art. It literally is technically simpler and more limited in what it can portray inherently.The west being obsessed with movies beyond what they deserve is also a major factor for its stagnation.The best of anime is movies but perfected btw.
>>8007416>I mean even the position that manga is superior being in debate and not the normSo what does that have to do with "pushing manga-lite stuff"? This is a thread about studying manga techniques. You come in here and complain that we're not shitting on western comics enough or not shitting on whatever manga you don't like enough or whatever this incredible vague stance you're taking is supposed to be. But we do study manga here. We are, at the end of the day, making comics in the image of manga.All you've done is spout a bunch of empty platitudes about x or y being superior to this and that while doing absolutely nothing to demonstrate it and showing nothing at all that would give your words any weight at all. You've been asked to show you know what you're talking about and you've shrunk behind lame excuses.>>8007421>it was a small time mangaka, and I don't think the publishing houses scan the manga...?They can do. There's two aways to do it: either the author scans it and sends it to the publisher digitally or they package them up and hand over the originals for the publisher to handle.This is, of course, ignoring that authors may have reasons for scanning the pages outside of delivery (such as passing over to assistants, or a hybrid work process).
>>8007426>You don't have the same level of control as in 2D art. It literally is technically simpler and more limited in what it can portray inherently.Holy SHIT you are stupid, ignorant and utterly uncultured. There isn't a single comic or manga in existence that has half of the scene control and intention of literally any Kubrick film, and that's just one guy.
>>8007421>I don't think the publishing houses scan the mangaBro what are you talking about. How do you think they get the manga?Sure sure, today it's common for the manga to be digitally scanned by the artist, but that's only like, just this decade that that's become common. For literal decades the way it worked was the mangaka would send the manuscript over to the publisher in a manila envelope, and they would scan it there.
>>8007423>Movies are a simpler form of visual art, is not equivalent because it's not 2D> It literally is technically simplerUnbelievably retarded thing to say. Just a demonstration of absolute peak dunning-krueger effect idiocy.
>>8007431>but that's only like, just this decade that that's become commonThe fuck do you know?
>>8007428I'm complaining that the signal-to-noise ratio here is too low for a healthy creator culture to develop. Comic discussions are inevitable but I'm noticing that they waste too much time here and don't get enough pushback. >You've been asked to show you know what you're talking aboutNot going to post my work or dox myself in any way. It's silly to even expect this on an anonymous forum with a history people can look back on and connect the dots. I'm already saying too much as is.
>>8007433Because it happened during the pandemic and was a big thing, they didn't want to physically go to the mangaka's studio
>>8007426>You don't have the same level of control as in 2D art. It literally is technically simpler and more limited in what it can portray inherentlyAh yes, those brilliant mangaka who utilize all that control so they can>trace photographs>trace each others art>trace store-bought 3D backgrounds and dolls>literally just put a filter over a 3D background>now pushing for AI backgrounds to become the normYou have a sad, romanticized westoid fantasy of japs lmao
>>8007429>>8007432>literally thinking that 3D with preexisting objects and artstyle limitations has more control than 2D where you control every single pixel that appears on the screenLike I said, movie being idolized is a great factor in the west's stagnation. It might even be the underlying reason for comic idolization in the first place but I would need to research that more.>>8007438I'm talking about the mediums, not what some mangaka did in 2026. Technically film isn't even close to the complexity of 2D art.
This fag has got to be trolling
>>8007440>everything that makes me leak is trolling
>>8007437Anon I assure you the practice of scanning and delivering the work digital did not only just become a thing in manga with covid.Covid forced places that were not already doing this to change that. It did not only become a practice with covid. Do not confuse the two.But my point is that you should not be making declarations like that when you couldn't possibly know it for a fact.>>8007436>the signal-to-noise ratio here is too low for a healthy creator culture to developYet develop it has. Not that you'd know anything about that.>waaah I'll be DOXXED!Yeah, just like everybody else here has been doxxed, right? Pussy ass nodraw excuses.
>>8007440Getting emotional about someone stating basic things abvout the mediums (not even a value judgement on movies being bad) while not being able to make a single argument is not a good look my man.I get it that movies are your comfort media and highly regarded by society and you get smart-boy-points for namedropping directors in the current climate, but that doesn't make them artistically more complex than 2D art.
>>8007439Did you know that movies can utilize not only computer generated imagery, but also 2D mediums too? Hope this helps you realized how absolutely retarded a stance you are currently trying to defend is sometime down the road.
>>8007442>Yet develop it has.I'm just complaining that it's not as fast and as wide. I'll give credit where it's due though, the situation is much better today than it was some years ago where anime art was even more looked down on.By doxxed I mean connecting my more radical views to my other identities. It's silly to expect this from me in a culture where any suggestion that something is objectively superior is a cancellable offense.
>8007445That's bait.
>>8007445Yeah, something that utilizes a more complex medium can get some its complexity by virtue of integrating parts of it, woah anon.Your emotions are making you think like a reddit midwit with low level gotchas, it's not a good look for moviebros.
>>8007438trvth nvke
>>8007448Nodraw begone.
>>8007450>argument not foundIt's hilarious how moviebros are even more insecure about their medium than comicbros. Gotta drop these redpills more often whenever I get the chance.
>>8007446>I'm just complaining that it's not as fast and as wideShow me a better one.>By doxxed I mean connecting my more radical views to my other identitiesI've said worse and nothing has ever come of it and nothing ever will because nobody fucking cares. You're just making excuses because you have nothing to show.>>8007448A film can utilize 2D but 2D cannot utilize film. Ergo it's film that's the more complex medium.
>>8007438>>8007438nta but it's the same reason literature has more control than film. You can go anywhere and do anything in writing and drawing, compared to the money you would have to spend on sets and camera tricks. You could easily write or draw a scene where a character is falling from space down to earth from a first person pov. Not to talk of the surreal ontological disturbances that can be created in literature. That is control.
>>8007456There are things you can depict in film that would be clumsy and impractical in literature. You're just talking about differences in mediums, but not what makes it more complex or not. But literature is another discussion entirely anyway.
>>8007452isn't it a school day for you, little faggot? Go learn something.
>>8007452>come into a thread about making comics>HEH THESE MOVIEBROS AMIRITELol?
so any of you have people in your country that got into the japanese manga industry?for my country, there is this artist: @necrosishead that publishes this on shonen jump +https://shonenjumpplus.com/episode/17106567267180998284
>>8007457Depends if you’re talking about some theoretical perfect film or something that can be realistically made by you and me. Or are you living vicariously through famous directors? Even the best directors are limited by the physical reality of having to manage the camera. In a drawing you can do whatever camera angle you like without any tricks or CG (if you know how to draw well)
>>8007462>Or are you living vicariously through famous directors?Just like you are living vicariously through famous mangaka?What have YOU created?
>i want to paint my covers in trad. >no money for a quadrillion chinese markers.What do?
What the fuck are you retards even discussing?
>>8007467>paint>markersWell there's your problem. That's two different mediums.
>>8007462I'm just saying there's things films can do better. An author can describe in so many words a detailed scene or action, while a film can simply depict it. The medium is just better suited for showing. This does not mean it has more depth or control or complexity or whatever.What does, however, is that films can contain many different mediums within them and thus utilize the strengths of many mediums within a singular work. A film can blend mediums in a way few other mediums can. In film, you can animate cartoons alongside your actors. You cannot suddenly have your comic characters burst into animation in a comic (outside of webcomics, anyway). A film can integrate a musical score, while a book can only recommend accompanying audio. A film can have passages of prose, or even blend it into the scene, and so on. It's a medium that can contain many other mediums within it.And acknowledging this does not make me some cinephile or whatever. Simply having the knowledge of what mediums are capable of does not mean I wish I was a filmmaker. I've devoted thousands upon thousands of hours making comics, and I intend to devote thousands upon thousands more to it. I intend to be making comics for the rest of my life.
>>8007469So markers are for drawing?
>>8007467This is a cope. You're distracting yourself. You're too lazy to actually draw your cover. You're afraid you don't have the skill to be able to paint it well enough. You have convinced yourself that it is the lack of adequate tools that is preventing you. Specifically you have applied upon yourself the impossible to surpass obstacle of >I must have <tool> that costs <amount of money I have> + 1 before I can make my coverYou could make your cover with cheaper tools, I bet most of the artists you've seen actually use incredibly cheap tools. You don't need those expensive tools. Stop deceiving yourself.
>>8007478Markers are for coloring. Like a crayon.
>>8007481Projecting much, schizo.My question was, what should i use instead? Normally, i used to paint in oil.
>>8007488>Normally, i used to paint in oil....then why wouldn't you just use that?
>come into thread>more than 150 posts have passed since last here>past the bump limit too>start scrolling up backwards through threadWhat... in the goddamn......? It felt like I just made this thread!
>>8007492Some schizo with delusions of weeb grandeur riled everyone up again
manga is dying, why do you nerds still care so much? Real careers and money lie in webcomics/webtoons.
>>8007497Ah yes, all those Korean millionaire webtoonakas... totally not sweatshops 2.0
>>8007497>Real careers and moneyI'm doing it because I enjoy doing it and people have told me in person they liked reading my comic. I don't want a comic making career. And I don't care if I make money from it.
>>8007500Yes. For indie creators, it's the way to go. Just check out the top creators on webtoons and social media. All the big patreon creators are webtoons/webcomics, none are drawing manga style comics. Why is that?
>>8007497>saaars please do redeam the slopa saaaars!Sure thing paj.
>>8007507pyw
>>8007507And where are you on that top creators list?
>>8007497Maybe because I don't want to write romance and gay shit. And only webcomics with color are acceptable there. I can barely finish my deadlines with just inking.
>>8007507>always shilling this shit as the road to make it big, but curiously never doing it yourself and becoming a millionaire
>>8007497you're right I will start working on From Bullied Office Worker to LVL999 Ultimate Secret Class Assassin
What final form does /mmg/ aspire to for their comics/manga? What inspires you to create?For me, I wanna make a manga that captures the fun atmosphere of those 2000s slapstick stoner comedies while maintaining the refreshing stylishness of anime... In my own way ofc. Things like Harold and Kumar and Kung Pow have been a big inspiration, same with Ranma 1/2 and Golden Boy. I want to create stories that make me laugh through every step of the process. >>8007488nta but if you're deadset on trad, then watercolor/ink should be more accessible. Tho desu if you're having problems copping cheaper Chinese markers then you're probably going to be priced out of decent watercolor paper too. If I were you, I'd work on recreating the trad aesthetic digitally while saving for the splurge. There are lots of free digital brushes and textures available online for this exact purpose.
>>8005341Anyone have a link to the brush used for the texture on his jacket in the first panel for csp? I have found ones like it, but they're more like a stamp where you can't draw over it to make it denser
>>8007527The gauze brush? It's in CSP by default, no?
>>8007531damn I'm retarded, thanks
>>8007491oils take a long time to dry on top of being messy and depending on how efficiently you paint, they can take forever to finish. Oil isn't the kindest medium for mangaka or even just anime in general.
>>8007526I do have some water color paper, actually.Not sure if it will give me the right manga look.>>8007491Have you ever seen a mangaka using oil?
>>8007518>From Bullied Office Worker to LVL999 Ultimate Secret Class Assassinthat sounds based tho
>>8007539Do you have an example of the type of look you'd like to recreate?
Pastelle colors
crayonswondering if I should use them sometime for comics/manga
>>8007548I would like to see how you make an illustration like >>8007546 with crayons
>>8007544Something color full, somewhat flat, but with some trad texture.
>>8007556
>>8007426>You don't have the same level of control as in 2D art.If anything the end product is more complex, in fact manga is liked for the simplicity of picking up and reading a story by one person. Not only are you using the wrong kind of measurements to make a decent argument, you're not even arguing the point accurately.
>>8007548bro just use watercolorThe vast majority of manga covers are watercolor
>>8007556>>8007558You can recreate the marker look digitally fairly easily if you're willing to learn how textures and brushes overlay with each other.I found this shop that shows you how different trad mediums render so you can get an idea of how they look. Assuming you want higher quality, you're unfortunately going to have to shell out regardless.https://www.too.com/manga/en/color.html
>>8007580Thats copic markers, lol.>>8007581Nah, i lost any ambition regarding digital art. It lacks in scale and character. It feels like it only good for soulles slop. I don't think i want use it for my passion projects.
>>8007580I already do>>8005450
>he isn't making slop
>>8007585Best of luck anon
>>8007483Paint is just wet crayons.
>>8007518Bazz kino incoming>>8007539>Have you ever seen a mangaka using oil?Mangaka are artists, some artists use oil. You're creating an unnecessary divide for seemingly no reason, why don't you state why you think it's completely unfeasible or impossible for a manga to have some oil-painted art.
>>8007612You think paint is made of wax?
>>8007619Have you ever seen a mangaka using oil?
>>8007662So you can't do a single thing that you haven't seen someone else doing before? You are actually anti-creative?
>>8007518>From Bullied Office Worker to LVL999 Ultimate Secret Class AssassinI can instantly smell the rich bully antagonist that also happens to be a natural awakener class A and son of some guild leader/school director and will be BTFO very early multiple times.
>>8007671As the greratest American thinker once said, if wan't to do something, that anyone else do different, you need a very good reason for it. And i don't have a reason to paint manga with oil, bro.
>>8007678You do have a reason, sisBecause it's what you have available
>>8007526>For me, I wanna make a manga that captures the fun atmosphere of those 2000s slapstick stoner comedies while maintaining the refreshing stylishness of anime... In my own way ofc. Things like Harold and Kumar and Kung Pow have been a big inspiration, same with Ranma 1/2 and Golden Boy. I want to create stories that make me laugh through every step of the process.I see, so that Scott Pilgrim mention from earlier wasn't from a fan but from the creator himself lol
>>8007662https://letmegooglethat.com/?q=mangaka+who+use+oil+paint
>>8007526My comic will never be animated, so I want to get as close to the experience of anime while still being just a comic.
>>8007526>What final form does /mmg/ aspire to for their comics/manga?As a realistic target, something that is a mild cult following/fanbase. I'm just happy that people enjoy the story and have asked for more. If I dare to dream slightly, then something popular enough that there is some nice merchandise of it. Figurines, etc.>What inspires you to create?My story was burning a hole in my head and I needed to get it out. The occasional fanart I receive helps immensely too when I feel burnt out sometimes.
>>8007700Anime art is usually just the manga art but colored and less detailed anyway
>>8007766Serious question, why do they change/downgrade the artstyle so often for an anime? Is it to make it easier to animate? They almost always change the artstyle and make the characters look worse. it's not just a loss of detail, most of the time they change the lines of all the characters. Why? Is it just too hard to copy someone's personal style, and you need to drag it closer to a generic anime one to get every employee to draw them consistently?
>>8007769>why do they change/downgrade the artstyle so often for an anime?such as?
>>8007769In cases where this applies, I imagine it's a toss up between certain key animators' personal art styles, the studio wishing to punch up the stylistic quality from their perspective, or just being lazy and making it "generic anime style" because that's all they have the budget or motivation to do for a quick buck.
>>8007769At the end of the day, anime is an adaptation. It's done by a different company. They are under no obligation to follow what manga. They do however choose to follow the manga because that makes more money than deviating from it.
>>8007769>Serious question, why do they change/downgrade the artstyle so often for an anime?Anime art must be simplified further.
>>8007769>why do they change/downgrade the artstyle so often for an animeGo ahead and animate this. I want it to look fluid, and I want every single last detail remembered. Do it for the entire episode, all 22 minutes of it.
>>8007799AI can do it
>>8007799Someone should make that first panel the next meme everyone does their own version of like the jacko pose and the sailor moon screenshot
>>8007799It would be 3D now, easy peasy
>>8007800>>8007844you can not use a toilet
>>8007855Obsessed.
>>8007769>generic anime oneNo such thing.
>>8007534It's alright man, we've all been there.>>8007799Not the best example, man. The character designs themselves aren't particularly complex or detailed, and there are techniques in animation that you can use to get around having to draw some complex pattern in every frame.The better examples are things like Fist of the North Star or JJBA, where the artist simply draws the characters with a lot of detail and harsh shading. The adaptations of these works had to leave a lot of that behind because it wouldn't be realistic to expect the animation team to be able to animate that under the deadline. Manga designs aren't always suited for animation, so it's standard practice to hire someone to adapt the designs for animation.
>>8007918Should be "Ok I can see YOU'RE struggling" instead of "your."
>>8007408bitterness like this won't get you furtherpyw
>>8006683crazy that we still have people on /ic/ who think that is amateur art or easier than realistic morgan freeman portraits.
Last time I made a comic it was too long and real life got in the way so I had to give up. Gonna try again, something very short, like 9 pagesHow are these character designs? Left is a bored card game champion and right is a demon she challenges to a duel, basically the Devil went down to Georgia but card games and the devil is a twink slutAnd they get together in the end
>>8008071I think the designs look great, you look like you know how to draw well so good luck with the short comic.
>>8008071the horns on the right character look flat and not really following the perspective of the character's head, even if they are floatingthe head is overall way too round and kind of wonky in the lower jaw and side plane imoeven the torso and forearm feels a bit flat and very haphazardly constructed
>>8008109How's the design though?
Guys, what do you think of Odas art style. It's the most popular manga ever, but i have a feeling it's popular despite it's art style.I like it quite a lot, as an artist. But even i think from time to time, it is not as effective at shoving the serious scenes. The violence is always a little bit reduced, due to cartoonisness. Like Tom Jerry is very brutal, or should be, but it's so good artistically, it overshadows the brutality (at least in the original run). It's good for a wholsom kids show, but shonen despite it's name isn't really for kids, not anymore at least.I think the perfect action shonen art style is muratas opm (even though i only read the original) it does it all: pathos, humor, slapstic, crazy characters, violence, muscles, sexy babes... it's very, very effective for the genre. What do you think?
>>8008137>oda's artstylewhich one? He's got worse. Aging, less oversight. I don't dislike murata's art but it somehow gets tiring for a manga. Perfect action shonen art style? Bleach.
>>8008162I droped the manga at the don flamingo arc, it must have been 5-6-7 years ago, the art was still very nice. Expect, i don't like the paneling, or better i don't like the concept, the pages and pennels are for my taste way too dense, to much characters, too much dialog, too much of everything. Most of the time Oda uses zero screen tones, so the only contrasting values are the flat blacks.>gets tiring for a mangaI know he is dragging and padding the story, compared to the original. But his art is very diverse, isn't it? It can be funny, it can be serious, action, he is good at everything. His cartoonie parts arent as over the tops as Odas, sure but overall?Bleach, yes, i've never read it, actually, but that what i mean. Cool, elongated, quite realistic. I don't think that Kubo is as good at female anatomy, his girls are less lewd and fuckable, artwise i mean, Murata finds all the perfect angels to show off his girls bodys. In this regards he hast top game, Oh, great! comes probably close, but not many else.I plan to read Bleach, for some reason back in the days i only read OP and Naruto, but never Bleach.I have a feeling, Murata could draw any manga and i would like it, i mean, Berserk, One Piece, Vagabond, Soul Eater... it would all work fine, a lot of them would look better than original, i could not say the same about Kubo, or Oda. P.S. i draw my red line at Blame, i don't think Murata could draw Blame properly.
>>8008137>Odas art style. It's the most popular manga ever, but i have a feeling it's popular despite it's art style.You couldn't pay me enough money to sit through and read the manga. Any random page, any random panel, any random chapter, you jump there and you're immediately greeted with visual vomit. There's too much noise 24/7. God forbid the eyes are given any white space to breathe in.>most popular manga everAll it tells me is that people like trash. McDonalds is still one of the worlds most popular places to eat, that doesn't mean it's good.
>>8008203Is the success completely random?
You should try reading and studying more obscure manga. Reading only mainstream ones will only narrow your worldview and cut off the possibilities of what you can develop in your art style.
>>8008253Not sure, what applying manga-filter to fotos of rocks will teach me.I wan't to draw a mainstream-style manga. Not pun-pun or something. It's fun to read, but i don't want to create it.I wan't to create something within the action shonen genre.
>>8008137I like Murata's art a lot and this is going to sound pretentious but it focuses too much on being perfect to look stylized enough for my taste. For shonen specifically it looks its best when there is at least a bit more cartoonishness injected into it like DBZ, OP, early Naruto, Shaman King, and so on. OPM is like the idea of "anime style" perfected, especially for action.
>>8008262Not him but The Climber does a lot of things you can learn from whether you like the artwork or not. You can take what you learn and apply it to any genre you like.
>>8005494>>8005450>>8005396>>8005371Why not talk about people that actually post in here and draw?
>>8008253Partially agree! People who are serious about their artistic development benefit greatly from broadening their horizons to gather a better idea of the type of art styles and stories they want to create. Anything that interests that individual is worth exploring!
>>8008273>>8008273>it focuses too much on being perfect to look stylized enough for my tasteBut Murata implements a lot of cartoon style drawings in his manga. I don't think i would agree on being perfect or wanting to be perfect.>OPM is like the idea of "anime style" perfectedI definitely can see that. As i said eralier, it would go with nearly everything. Which implies that it lacks somewhat in the style department. If someone would grind hard for 10 years and draw in a similar way as Murata, with the same quality, it would not be the same as copying One Piece.His style is generic but turned up to 11 skillwise. If he gets old and his skill drops significantly, he would overnight lose his style. One Piece drawn poorly is still One Piece.
>>8008277All of the people who have posted their comics have gotten a few responses. The ones who don't are either so perma-/beg/ that it's not worth engaging with them, or they're good (enough) that people just look at the work and move on. The last explanation is that there is a group of anons who have self-admitted that they only ever post but intentionally don't read anybody else's work.
>>8008278Indi manga is very niche, though. Reading Dostojevsky and visiting the Louvre would probably work better.No indi manga can really compete with classic lit or art.
>>8008287>The last explanation is that there is a group of anons who have self-admitted that they only ever post but intentionally don't read anybody else's work.This is such a sad state of affairs. How can people hope to benefit from posting here if they actively refuse to engage in the work? What's even the point? Farming (you)s? Smh...>>8008290Reading books is beneficial just on the baseline of being a human being. However, as a mangaka, it is entirely dependant on the type of content you want to create. Why spend time studying old lit if you want to draw about cats lazing around and eating the snack of the day? That is unless you have an idea (deeper commentary or gag) that would warrant utilizing such a text but that's only "if."
Im working on a Touhou fancomic aka doujin. Should I make it oriental or ocidental way of reading? Since is fanwork derivated from japan I should use oriental reading flow just for the sake of it.
>>8008278Shonen isn't about being artistic, it's about trying to copy what's popular.
>>8008284I know he does cartoony stuff during gags and such, I meant the main style he's best known for.
>>8008324Shonen is a demographic.
>>8008303>How can people hope to benefit from posting here if they actively refuse to engage in the work?If you put out your stuff without saying anything about it and you're hoping that maybe people will say something then that's one thing but if you really need someone to look at your work for any reason then you're free to communicate that in your post and you're more likely to get a response.
>>8008328Agreed, interest is a two-say street and anons who want engagement could benefit from asking questions or talking about the work itself. I just don't understand the point of wanting to be in a community but making it a point to not engage in it.
>>8008335Personally I hate the idea of being a "community"It creates an incestuous circlejerk that ultimately goes nowhere, not an industry. Comics made for and only receiving feedback from people who make comics are not going to be popular with a general audience. You develop different perspectives once you are on the other side and you can't go back.This is why I have always said that you fuckers always demanding everyone who criticizes you to "PYW", as if ONLY a better artist than you can have valuable feedback is just self-sabotage from a weak ego. Comic readers are NOT artists. They are however, your potential source of income, and what they think is much more important than your peers.
>>8008327It's a body type- I mean it's an age range.
>>8008335Yeah there's nothing wrong with posting pages just on their own so long as the person understands it doesn't create an obligation on our part to respond. Although usually those people aren't the ones complaining, it's nodraws white knighting for them by saying /mmg/ bad because not every posted page gets updoots.
>>8008350This is a very immature, self-destructive way of viewing community. Yes, what artists find impressive isn't always going to align with what audiences are looking for, but as aspiring mangaka you are all striving towards the same goal: making something those audiences would appreciate. An audience member may know that they don't like something, but they often won't be able to tell you why. This is where your peers come in to help you pinpoint your flaws and overcome those weaknesses in your work. Granted, this is assuming the community is invested in artistic development. >>8008381Fair enough, I just don't see the point but to each their own, really. At least they are posting work.
>>8008387nta but,there's something very odd about /mmg/. It's not at all like other generals on 4chan, it's not even like other generals on /ic/. I wonder if actually it's just a small handful of people but speculation aside, /mmg/ is remarkably hostile to any form of community. I'm honestly surprised there's even a discord.It may have something todo with comics itself. In the west, information is not passed from one comic artist to another. There are virtually no books on the topic and none of the famous artists share their knowledge. The result is that most comic artists are total amateurs.It's a bit like art industries immediately after an iconoclasm event. Without any guilds or other means of spreading knowledge, art quickly regresses to a primitive state and stays there until artistic communities re-emerge.I don't really know why comics artists are like this, but it is definitely a characteristic, and it is perhaps the biggest thing holding them back. Without community, you cannot collate knowledge. Everyone is re-inventing the wheel on their own isolated islands.
Any other crabs here? Why should anyone else but me succeed. It's a dog eat dog world.
I'm gonna use vtubers as an example here.If you don't already know, they're just twitch streamers with virtual avatars. What's important is that it's an entertainment industry, and every individual vtuber is gunning for the attention of viewers.But getting noticed is not just a matter of having the right virtual avatar or having the right personality. Being in a community is a massive boost to your reach. If you just stream on your own to the void, it's very hard to get noticed. You're one guy in an ocean of people, and the algorithm isn't doing you any favors either.But by uniting together as a community, and supporting eachother, you boost your exposure just enough that you escape that ocean of obscurity. On Twitch it's something like, the first page of any given category has streamers with tens of thousands of viewers, but by the end of the second there are streamers with only 1 viewer (themselves), and then after that there's some 30 more pages to go, all with 1 viewer.Furthermore, that community itself serves as a place to be for viewers to find other streamers like the ones already there. It becomes a hub of interest, further boosting its popularity.Being an indie webcomic maker is not too dissimilar to this. By posting on twitter or reddit, you're one guy in an ocean of people, you're on that page 30 of people with 1 viewer. It doesn't matter how frequently you post, or how good your comic is, nobody is even aware you exist. You might lucky, sometimes a streamer streams everyday to the void for 5-6 years before they get noticed by someone popular (who then gives them a boost). Maybe you'll post your comic online to nobody for 10 years and one day someone with thousands of followers with retweet it. If my sarcasm is not coming across clearly, what I'm saying is, you need community. You're not gonna make it on your own. By uniting together, you boost your chances from one in a million, to actually realistic.
>>8008402Forgot to mention. The reason I mentioned vtubers is becuase a great deal of the most popular vtubers aren't even all that talented. They're popular because they're in a community, they call these corpos. They're hired idols in a company. Their fame is derived from the community they're in. People don't search through 30 pages of nobodies, they go to where they know good vtubers already are. And often even when a vtuber leaves the corpo to be independent they lose the vast majority of their popularity.Comics are similar. People don't dig through #webcomic or through hundreds of pages of webtoon, no they go to Marvel, DC, Shueisha. They go to a place, a community, that has the reputation for providing good comics. It is in your interest to be a part of such a community for the express purpose of getting your comic actually seen by people, and not wallowing in an ocean of irrelevance.
>>8008393The comics market in my western country is stone dead, yet there are heaps of comics (sometimes called manga) workshops and illustration courses hosted by the professionals.
>>8008410If even 5 people in this general here, /mmg/ united together to form a pseudo comics company, a little collective of comics posting, and posted and retweeted eachother's comics. Every single one of them would instantly be in the top 1% of webcomics, and would receive the appropriate algorithm boost for it. If any of those comics are actually good, they will then have a realistic shot of becoming as popular as something like Scott Pilgrim.
>>8008414Yeah, and then they find schizopostings from one of us about juice or Obamna and we all get canceled, lol.
>>80084174chan is mainstream
>>8008393Understandably, people are spending their time working on their comics, but these threads are also some of the fastest on /ic/. I've mentioned this months ago, but the dominating conversation surrounding non-mmg works seems to invite a lot of derailment. The devil being that they can be very valid conversations that people could genuinely learn from- until they're not. It's not surprising that there are apathetic or even downright anti-social posters when there seems to be a constant drip-feed of sour-grape hostility that refuses to let up, not to mention that a lot of the mentality I've seen regarding comic creation in here is... not conducive to a healthy relationship with art, to say the least. Which is why I think the Discord is a lot more relaxed and constructive compared to the thread. >>8008417Just don't say insane off-topic stuff, especially with your work attached. Nobody cares about 4chan as much as 4chan does. But this could also be a lot to say about the way people carry themselves in here. It makes sense that artists serious about their work would be wary about associating with Gary the Scary, who has one unfinished page in a whole 3 years of shitposting. This is why it's okay to pick and choose who you invest your time in, and if people feel at risk of being left out because of it, then that can become an incentive to get their act together. You can't force people to want to associate with you, like your art, you also have to be appealing.
>>8008424I would argue that the "off-topic" posts, meaning "not posting your comic" are actually more beneficial to getting anons to work on their comics than if they chose not to make those posts.It takes a long time to draw a comic page, and there aren't too many anons here. I suspect they're already posting everything they're making as fast as they can. If you curtail any and all posts that aren't just content posts, then the thread will be totally dead and the anons here will have no longer any motivation to post their comics.By having a fast general, the place feels lively, and that's a positive environment to be in, it's motivating to get you to work on your comic
>>8008417brother have you not been to instagram in a while? hating jews is in right now.every time I'm in a group of people I don't know I always drop the "you're netanyahu/mossad strongest soldier" line and it always lands no matter how normie my audience is
>>8008414That would involve having socials like xitter.
>>8008428By "off-topic" I mean the conversation quickly degrading from "How did X mangaka achieve Y effect" (valid, constructive) into "X mangaka is bad, I am going to sit here and scream at people" (derailing, not conducive to art, make your own thread)>then the thread will be totally dead and the anons here will have no longer any motivation to post their comics.I think it's quite the contrary. A slower thread means more drawings, which means more focus on the works posted, which brings more meaningful interactions and critiques. Anons will often post their comics and they won't get any engagement (even if asking) because the thread is busy having off-topic arguments. But to be fair, it will only work if there is an actual shared investment in the artists posting. If that is not present, then a slow thread would be just as useless as a fast one.
>>8008442If you're a comic artist and you're not posting your comic to twitter, you will go nowhere.That's like saying "I don't use Discord, I only use IRC", well good luck, nobody is on IRC.
>>8008444You think people are choosing to post here instead of actively drawing? If they weren't making posts, they'd probably be jerking off or something. People have free time you know.
>>8008447The one's who show consistent updates or improvements in their comics? No. The ones who don't? Yes. >If they weren't making posts, they'd probably be jerking off or something. People have free time you know.They can enjoy their free time without derailing one of the few places available for artists to improve their work. If this general is not for focusing on improvement or engagement, then what purpose is it intended to serve?
>>8008447>>8008461Double-posting. On further thought, it makes sense if what you're getting at is that this thread exists to quench the loneliness of others. In that case, there is no point in seriously engaging with this community if active improvement is something you value. It also explains why there is a high level of apathy from those who choose to stay in the threads.
