Why don't /k/alifornian's CC Obrez pistols?>cheap>as reliable as the host mosin>muh stopping power>non-restricted magazines>not considered assult wepunzI see no faults here
>>61445729>Legally a SBR>SBRs are illegal in CADelete your thread retard
>>61445729You left one out:>SBRThat one is a pretty big fault in CA.
>>61445729where are you finding obrez for cheaphave you ever shot a full sized mosin? are you a noguns
>>61445771>where are you finding obrez for cheapI assume he's talking about buying a mosin and then cutting it down himself.>have you ever shot a full sized mosin?Are you trying to imply the recoil would be bad? Lol, with a barrel that short it's going to be very weak.
>>61445771just go to LGS and get a shitty barreled action with a fucked up bore. No import marks, no registry, not legally a rifle
>>61445799Unless it's been demilled to ATF standards--which, IIRC involves cutting the receiver apart in three places with an oxyfuel torch--then it *is* legally a rifle.
>>61445754Tell me, a Eurofag, how the thing in the OP can in any way be construed as a rifle
>>61445841Once a rifle, always a rifle in ATF’s eyes.
>>61445841Because it started out as a rifle
>>61445869LelMy local laws are cucked as fuck but I'm pretty sure I could get one of those registered as a pistol (may need silhouette sights to avoid upset from cops though)
>>61445793>mosin for cheap>current year>>61445799go and pick one up right now
>>61445825but if it has no import marks how can you PROVE it was ever a rifle and not a pistol? Unless the ATF is keeping a registry, which I believe they're legally forbidden to do?
>>61445904Bought picrel like 3 days ago for $400. Next store over was selling for $800. Not a shitfucked barreled action and it has import marks but my point stands.
>>61445929for $400 you could've bought an actual pistol>not an obrez>not a barreled action with no import mark>is legally a rifle
>>61445950you asked for a cheap mosin, retard.
>>61445957400 is not a cheap mosin you double nigger
>>61445904>>current yearSure they're no longer as dirt cheap as they once were, but even at $400 they're still firmly in the low end of the gun market.
>>61445926>but if it has no import marks how can you PROVE it was ever a rifle and not a pistol?Mosins were never made as pistols in the first place.
>>61445901>it's a rifle that had the barrel cut and the stock removedSo, a pistol?
>>61445929Lmao this retard spent $400 on a shitstick Mosin!!!
>>61445967It's not a cheap /mosin/, but it is a cheap /gun/.
>>61445981>So, a pistol?Not according to the ATF. Per the ATF if it was made from a rifle, it remains a rifle.It's right on the ATF website>A weapon made from a rifle is also a firearm subject to the NFA if the weapon as modified has an overall length of less than 26 inches or a barrel or barrels of less than 16 inches in length.
>>61445989No, it isn’t.
>>61445901Are you defending Californian laws?
>>61445989>>61445971400 is not a cheap gun, for that 400 you could've bought 2 calvary carcanos
>>61445979Says who? There's no record unless it was documented while imported.
>>61446025Says history you dumb fuck. The ATF is not retarded. Go and find a mosin action that was made from the factory as a pistol.
>>61446013no just wanted to make the tranny joke, I'm sorry, I can delete the post if you want
>>61446009No, I was talking about your retarded obsessed tranny analogy.
>>61446043that's not the same guy as me (I made te tranny joke, my apologies)
>>61446012Anon, people regularly pay tens of thousands of dollars for old west colts, rare lugers, fancy shotguns, etc. A $400 mosin ain't shit.
I'm sure you can buy a Remington 700 action then make a short pistol chassis for it. Granted, the action has to be registered as a pistol already or something like RECEIVER
>>61446037>Calls people dumb fuck>Has no idea what burden of proof isIf there's no import record, there's no t was ever a rifle. Thousands of mosins were imported in the 1950s from Spain in that exact state, without serial numbers marked on the receiver. Get the fuck off of /k/ and Google some basic mosin history retard.
>>61446090*There's no trace
>>61445746>>61445754Is this an sbr in Cali? I thought this would fall under pistol
>>61446088Remington DID offer one for a short timehttps://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2019/10/30/tfb-review-remington-700cp-a-pistol-remington-700/Discontinued as of September 2023 from what I can tell
>>61445771>have you ever shot a full sized mosin? are you a nogunsThe recoil will be nonexistent at this barrel length since barely any of the powder will have the time to burn out by the time the bullet leaves the barrel, you're the noguns here.>>61446113>Is this an sbr in Cali?It's an SBR everywhere in burgerland because it was manufactured from a rifle, unlike these AR/AK pistol abominations.
>>61446131obrez is still going to have more recoil than an actual pistol caliber pistol, look up videos of any obrez being shot
>>61445729P365s, hellcats, shield plus, and max 9s are available. Before that it was ruger ec9s, shield (single stack), kahr whatevers, glock 26, xd subcompact, and sig p238s. CA WAS 10 years behind. The issue isn't the guns it's the carry laws and stupid pissing matches with other anti gun states on who can word jew around bruen the most.>Inb4 blackpilling about bruenIt was always going to be retarded "tee hee ooh what's" tier retardation from the anti guns. The important part is that there's a new beating stick to hurt them with.
>>61446090It still started life as a rifle. Therefore it’s a rifle. I don’t understand how hard this is for you to comprehend?
>>61446085Okay.It’s still not cheap
>>61445729>stopping powerI think it's more penetrating power, anon.
>>61445841The definition of SBR includes:>a rifle having a barrel or barrels of less than 16 inches in length;>a weapon made from a rifle if such weapon as modified has an overall length of less than 26 inches or a barrel or barrels of less than 16 inches in length;Remember, this class of firearms wasn't restricted because they were considered dangerous or scary in their own right, but to prevent chopping down rifles as a workaround to the real target of the NFA, handguns. So when handguns were removed from the NFA before it was passed into law, the rest of it stopped making any sense.
>>61445729Many reasons.>Mosins haven't been cheap in almost a decade.>It may be "reliable" but is still far harder to operate than a regular pistol.>Doesn't really get much power due to the short barrel.>Half the legal magazine capacity.>Definitely not an AW.Oh yeah also.>Very bulky >Not safe to carry with a chambered cartridge.>Safety is almost non usable.>Expensive ammunition.>No front sight.>Have to play rules lawyer with dealer and CA DOJ to even legally get one due to SBR rules.>Can't make one with a re-weld since it's not on the handgun roster. Would have to be an original virgin receiver.A regular modern compact 9mm is going to be easier to acquire ad far more practical.
>>61445729I too would like everyone in caliwali to break their wrists.
>>61446113No such thing as a factory obrez so they are all converted rifles. That makes them SBRs.
>>61446351Actually informative, thankses
>>61445729California has a "handgun roster"Californians cannot buy "new" handguns unless they are on said roster.To get on the roster the manufacturer would have to submit a handgun to the CA DOJ for drop safety testing that has a loaded chamber indicator, chamber loaded indicator, magazine disconnect safety, and manual safety (trigger safety, grip safety, or thumb safety).They would also need to pay the CA DOJ a $300 fee to add the handgun to the "approved for sale" database.On January 1st of each year they must pay a renewal fee of $300Here are all the handguns on the rosterhttps://www.oag.ca.gov/firearms/certified-handguns/searchIf a Californian wanted a handgun that is not on the roster they would have to find a person willing to do a private party transfer.The odds of finding someone that owns an Obrez is incredibly small, just like your PPand unlike yer Mudda it won't be cheap
>>61447067Can't Californians get CZ race guns at all then?
>>61445729Hearing status:EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
>>61447209Some of the Shadow models were on roster but fell off. If you buy one from someone who bought it while it was on roster or moved to CA with one then yes, but you'll pay a substantial premium. About 1.5-2x what they cost new.
>>61445729I would rather defend myself with a .22 revolver than this if given no other options, and I'm not even a Califag.
>>61446972It ain't going to break shit with a barrel as short as your IQ is low.
>>61445841>EurofagKill yourself.
>>61445929>Bought picrel like 3 days ago for $400.Are you fucking retarded? Lmao
>>61447236This is very fucking true. I modeled this in Quickload, assuming a 4 inch barrel which I think is actually longer than what this has. Muzzle velocity: 1100 fps. Barely even supersonic. Muzzle exit pressure? 46,000 psi. That is going to be one motherfucker of a muzzle blast.
>>61448195I refuse
>>61445729Not califag Where do I acquire obrez?
>>61448225They almost never appear for sale. You buy a mosin and you form 1 it. If you don't care about it being a mosin you could buy a bare receiver for something like a Rem 700 and build it as a pistol from the ground up.
>>61448220Are Ivans even allowed a rifle on glory hole duty?
>>61446022while this is true, the downside is that you now own two carcanos
>cut down mosinJust like my day z playthrough
>>61447209There are two ways to get one1. You buy it off someone that already owns one, typically that will be a Cop (they are exempt from the roster) or someone that moved into the state with one.2. You find an FFL with the right license that will make the pistol single shot only if possible and sell it to you. (this is very rare)Off the top of my head the only people I know of that will mess with the single shot exemption stuff is a guy on Reddit called "Wojtek Weaponry" who does mostly Ruger guns, and a shop called 2A Zone that will do a smattering of stuff for $$$$https://www.wojtekweaponry.com/California-Compliant_c_332.htmlhttps://www.2azone.com/catalog/handguns/single-shotIf you want a Shadow contact one of them and ask if its possible and how much
>>61448828It’s cheaper to equip the second shooter at the grassy knoll that way
>>61448757Probably not since they sold his rifle to me
>>61450180>2. You find an FFL with the right license that will make the pistol single shot only if possible and sell it to you. (this is very rare)Thought they shut the single-shot exception down w/r/t temporarily-disadvantaged semiautos? (Still an option for revolvers AIUI.)
>>61445929> check out how cheap this mosin was, only cost $400.It really is over, surp bros. Feels bad.
>>61446009but if you had a braced pistol, which would now be an SBR, and take the brace off of it, it's now a pistol and not an illegal SBR?
>>61446214it was never LEGALLY a rifle. Legality matters. I mean fuck, you can find PISTOLS with 20 inch barrels if you shop around enough, but they're still pistols. The point in unserialized, barreled mosin actions is that it is in the same null state as an AR-15 lower. Neither rifle nor pistol, hence you cna make a LEGAL OBREZ from it.
>>61451489>The point in unserialized, barreled mosin actionsOh cool, so if you make an obrez out of a thing that literally doesn't exist, it's legally a pistol, that's great, thanks for clarifying.
>>61451489retard
>>61451477Nope. When you make something title II it stays that way until deactivated.
>>61445729.22 obrez
>>61446037>Go and find a mosin action that was made from the factory as a pistol.With some cuts and welds you can be the factory making it as a pistol.>chop receiver>reweld an inch shorter >shorten bolt to match>500 s&w barrel>50 state compliant obrez that's just as powerful as a full size rifle
>>61450241>Still an option for revolvers AIUISingle shot revolvers exemption was never a thing. Single ACTION revolvers are exempt from the roster and you can convert any DA revolver to single action to get it in the state legally.
>>61451858Show 1(one) example of thisAlso >welding a torch cut receiver>what is heat treat
>>61453406>telling retards to blow themselves up and commit felonies is bad
>>61446131>>61446975So what you're saying is theres an open market for factory made Obrezs?
>>61453578No.A properly, legally destroyed receiver cannot be welded back together (this is the entire point of the ATF changing their process of deactivation)Anything less than a properly destroyed receiver is still a rifle, and thus any obrez would be a SBRA Mosin receiver cannot be easily stamped like you can an MP5 or AK or what have you.If you’re setting up a machine shop to produce receivers, you’d be better off with anything other than a Mosin set up.All this combined means that any factory made examples are going to be expensive, defeating the entire point of buying a Mosin.And also, Mosin pistols are, in general, fucking awful to shoot.
>>61453578There's no fucking market for this shit retard.
>>61451489>it was never LEGALLY a rifle Yes it was. Fucking dumbass
>>61451477>but if you had a braced pistol, which would now be an SBR, and take the brace off of it, it's now a pistol and not an illegal SBR?That's correct, whether it's a brace or an actual stock.ATF's "logic" is that when you take the stock off a weapon that was originally a rifle, you're making a new "weapon made from a rifle". But if you add a stock to a pistol (making it into a rifle), and then later remove the stock, you're not making a new weapon from a rifle, but "resurrecting" the original, not-made-from-a-rifle pistol.That's why every AR15 I build from a virgin receiver starts life as a pistol (maybe a 16" or 20" barrel pistol, but a pistol nevertheless), then I put the buttstock on later.See https://www.atf.gov/firearms/qa/can-i-lawfully-make-pistol-rifle-without-registering-firearm
>>61451754Not correct. Reconfiguring a firearm so it no longer meets the relevant definition does remove it from the NFA's provisions.I think this misconception arises from specific cases where modifications that look like they should remove a firearm from NFA, don't. But these cases result from the definitions themselves depending on the weapon's history (either by the text of the definition, or in ATF's interpretation), not on a general "stickiness" outside the definitions.W/r/t machineguns, drilling the third hole in a semi-auto AR-15 receiver makes it NFA (machinegun), but welding up the third hole of a full-auto AR-15 receiver doesn't remove it from the NFA. This is because the definition includes a machinegun receiver, which ATF interprets to include any receiver that has been a machinegun, unless and until it's destroyed.W/r/t SBRs, putting a stock on a <16" barrel pistol makes it NFA (short barreled rifle), but removing a stock from a factory SBR doesn't remove it from the NFA. This is because the definition includes "a weapon made from a rifle".But in other cases, such as putting a longer barrel on an SBR to satisfy both >16" barrel and >26" overall length, there's no stickiness -- as soon as you change it, it's no longer governed by the NFA. And likewise for restoring a pistol that's been converted to a rifle (whether SBR or not) to its original pistol self, which avoids the historical aspect of the definition ("made from a rifle") by the logic in >>61453913
>>61453625>Anything less than a properly destroyed receiver is still a rifle, and thus any obrez would be a SBRThe way around this is to purchase portions from two legally destroyed receivers that overlap and weld them together. IE: the back half of one rifle receiver is completely, irrevocably destroyed. The front half, with barrel attached, is not legally considered a receiver any more.The front half of a second rifle receiver is completely and irrevocably destroyed, leaving the back half intact.The two halves, from two distinct, legally destroyed receivers are now nothing, they are paperweights. They can now be re-welded together into one new, functional pistol receiver.
>>61453406>>61453558There's a long history of rewelding title ii firearms into title i firearms. Thousands and thousands of machine gun receivers have gone through the process with no trouble.>welding bad Where do you think all the stress in a bolt action receiver is?>>61453578No one would want to buy one for what they'd cost>>61453625Cool thing about welding is that it's an additive process so even if a plasma torch takes off a bunch of material you can usually put it back. Every deactivated mosin I've seen has had an intact trunnion with the cut far enough away that the heat treat wouldn't be affected.
>>61445729Are you going to cut up a mosin Only to reweld it again because both federal and state laws are retarded
>>61455004>No one would want to buy one for what they'd costPretty much this. LugerMan in PA had like 6 or 7 Obrez pistols for sale on GB some time ago.You might have seen him mentioned on ForgottenWeapons, he was the guy who produced the 10mm Lugers Ian reviewed.As expected of his shop they were really, really nice, the nicest obrez to probably ever exist, but they were priced accordingly, I think somewhere around $1200.Found a review of them here lol:https://www.handgunsmag.com/editorial/obrez-mosin-pistol/466694
>>61453625>A Mosin receiver cannot be easily stamped like you can an MP5 or AK or what have you.yes it can. I posted a form 1d obrez in this thread.
>>61445729You can take a pistol and convert it to a rifle>See Heritage Rough Rider 16 inch "Pistol"You cannot convert a rifle to a pistol due to ATF laws that have been around since the 1930s. >You cannot take a bolt action rifle like a Moist Nugger and convert it to a pistol.
>obrez nuggetWould the fireball be as big as I imagine it to be?
>>61451754And how does one prove a pistol was previously a rifle? What if you just don't tell them?
>>61456739I have one. The concussive blast if you're under an overhang or next to a solid object at an outdoor range makes my nose run after like five shots.I would never touch it off indoors. It'd get me permabanned.
>>61445746Even if it didn't count as an SBR, wouldn't it then count as a pistol (and thus be illegal because it isn't on the handgun roster)?
>>61456561Sorry, I meant stamped as in a stamped flat. As opposed to milling.
>>61451817turning one of the Howa 7.62x39's into an Obrez would be great
>>61445869>>61445872They will never be a real pistol?
>>61445729The fault is living in California.
>>61445989You could get a totally superior rifle with an (not the best but you actually have the ability to easily mount one) optic, shooting 1 MOA, in a better caliber for $100 less.
>>61445869Once a faggot, always a faggot in my eyes. Not you, just sayin'.
>>61456764If it's an AR receiver there's no way they can prove itIf it's a bolt actual receiver of a firearm that every factory example of has been a rifle, and it has proof marks and/or serial numbers that prove it was a rifle at some point, the burden of proof will be on you to prove that it did not leave the factory as a rifle. If >But what if it did leave the factory as a pistol, huh? Was a good defense, there wouldn't be thousands of destroyed sawn-off rifles and shotguns for sale as parts kits
