What would it take for you to buy an EV?
>>27590945Not that shitty brand. Tell you what, you stop making Tesla shill threads and I will consider not shitting all over your brand on the internet for free because it's funny. Buy an ad, fuckface.
lighter weightsmallermove away from ipad-on-wheels tech npc gimmickryi'm not opposed to evs in principle, they really are the ideal car for someone who doesn't drive more than 50 miles a day and owns a home, but none of them inspire any passion or lust (that new hyundai n might). also the lingering question about resale/longevity/becoming $60k e-waste in a decade needs to be solved
>>27590945Infrastructure. Nice 18650 you have there, what happens when it goes flat.
>>27590945If corners aren’t cut, this shit doesn’t catch on fire easily and allows me to easily escape if there is a fire, isn’t insanely expensive to maintain and repair, and no driver-assist shit.
>>27590945Literally, impossible. EVs are a massive, obvious scam to anyone that isn't fucking stupid
>>27590945a dumb EV, no real computer bullshit just analog power controls, no bluetooth or phone app, no iot, no wifi,
>what will it take to plug in and charge your carHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAH
>Costs the same as a regular gas car>Takes 5 min to recharge, same as filling up a tank> Doesn't look like a bar of soap> Isn't prohibitively expensive to fix, like getting totaled in a fender bender> Battery is easily swappable and not more expensive than an engine to replaceWhen is EV comes out, I'll buy it. Until then they are just giant Iphones, impressive gizmos that are just destined to the landfill after a few years.
>>27590945>well built>charging times comparable to gas>EPG that exceeds hybrids>performance that is not capped by limiters of any kindreally the minute porsche gets a good battery i may think about it
>>27590945It would be non-tesla car.
>>27590945Range is actually fine. ˜230 miles is perfectly fine as a 2nd car.Battery degradation bothers me more than range. How long will it take for the battery to become useless, and when it does, it costs more than the car.Fire risk.Touchscreens and other bullshit.No over-the-air updates or connectivity. I just want a key. I don't even care if it has remote locks.I basically want a 1998 Honda Civic that happens to have a battery. Don't care if it's fast. I don't want a bunch of dumb features. If I could find the guy who decided to put a touchscreen inside a car, I could break his fucking hands.
>>27590945Minicab bros have adopted Prius bigtime here,that's pretty much where EVs shine.I won't be getting one while someone else will collect me from whatever hell hole I find myself in.
>>27590945A pure-white ethno-state with fire-safe charging enclosures.
i would buy an EV if it had a gasoline powered V8 instead of those gay ass electric motors and batteries.
EVs have absolute dogshit resale value. I actually have no qualms about owning an EV besides that
>>27590945you're not going to convince anyone in this board when majority here thinks keyless entry is a witchcraft and they'd rather use a physical key and lock
>>27591065>cue the story of the Always Sunny guy getting locked out of his bricked Tesla in the basement of a parking garage
Not sure if this thread is full of stupid libs or stupid boomers, since they sound the same when discussing Teslas.Regardless, Tesla is the official white man’s car
>>27590945range at least 400 km in freezing tempsheater works without compromising range at -25 Ccan charge at useful rate at that temperaturecosts under 30k
>>27590945WaterproofRock crawler off roadingA full charge with solar panels after a day in sunlight Easily serviceable Light weightMake these impossible things happen and MAYBE I’ll consider it
i'd buy an ev if literally every ice vehicle and manufacturing plant suddenly exploded, and all the information related to making them was destroyedon second thought i'd probably just spend the money on firearms and rations since the world would quickly devolve into chaos in that scenario
>>27590945A lobotomy.
>>27590989This shit.At least some brands, NOT TESLA, are making cars look good. BMW, Hyundai, Ford, etc. are all making cars that at least don't look like mashed shit like Tesla. But a real killer, even with infrastructure, is charge time for me. I travel relatively frequently and adding significant time to a drive to sit and recharge sucks ass. Then there's the issue that in the winter the range is even worse and charging even slower.
Why do people have higher standards for EVs than ICEVs? I guess EVs are just inheritly superior.
>>27591183because EVs need to be like diesel to steam engines. they need to be better in every single way or else their is no point in changing what is well known.
I just think it's cool that I live in an age where EVs are now a viable form of personal transportation. I'm glad I wasn't born too early to see it or to be too old to really enjoy it.
>>27591208But they are. They don't polute, don't catch fire nearly as often, cost less to maintain, have much more lower end torque, and work better at more extreme temperuates.
>>27591150>Current gen BMW designs >Looks good Pick one
>>27591215HAHAHAHAHAHAHA
>>27590945I already have a Volt which is one of the more EV-like PHEVs and it's pretty good. 155,000 miles and 11 years later and no major out of warranty issues yet.The interior is nice. It has a warm and cozy yet futuristic aesthetic, like a comfy spaceship.
>>27590945I would drive one if someone gave it to me for free.
>>27591232
>>27590945I tried it for a week with my buddy's. I hate it. I hate the fact that I have to plug it in frequently, and I hate the supercharging system.>It's so easy, like plugging in your phoneno it's not, in fact my phone can wireless charge that makes it far less cumbersome and literally thought-free>superchargers are so widespread and easy to useyes to the former, no to the latter. Why do I have to reverse park to fucking charge my car. Before "le anon can't reverse park", reverse parking is still thousand times more cumbersome than just pulling by a gas stall and you can't deny this. The whole ev experience is just a pain in the fucking ass. Each issue might be very small but it's literally a death by thousand cuts.
>>27590971>>27590973>>27590989Basically all of this plus a house with a garage. It would still be a 2nd vehicle and not my primary/only car though.
>>27590971https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4aTzuUrdyIcHave you seen the TC2? Yes it is expensive for what you get, but it does exist. There are a few other brands selling similar lightweight electric vehicles focused on the driving experience. This area really just needs some more regulatory clarity to allow lightweight vehicles to exist again, and encourage some larger players to enter the market or to allow the current small players to scale up out of the regulatory exemptions for manufacturers that produce only a few vehicles annually which limits them by necessity to high price brackets.As for the concerns over batteries. Battery re-use and recycling is a thing, and the latest generation of batteries are good for hundreds of thousands of miles in a car before their secondary uses. Higher capacity LFP or sodium battery packs may be good for millions of miles.That combined with battery prices trending below $50 a kWh I think the concerns about EVs being expensive and abandoned are largely unfounded.
>>27591215>They don't polute, Making EVs is more pollutant, charging them require burning more.fossil fuels than even the most wasteful 18 wheelers, and due to their weight they wear our rubber tires faster causing more toxic fumes >don't catch fire nearly as oftenand when they do it is impossible to put them out>cost less to maintainwith the major asterisk that it will total the veh if anything needs ro be replaced, compared to even the most catastrophic ICE failure resulting in new parts being added in>have much more lower end torquewhich is immediately useless as vehs like trucks and suvs that need low end torque use up way too much charge for the gen 1 lithium batteries>and work better at more extreme temperuates.lol lmao, tell that to all the stranded tesla midwesterners
>>27591324so a kit car. the grand solution is just kit cars?
if you make the entire state of israel dissapear I'll put cordless drill powered rollerskates on my feet but I will not buy an ev car.
cut it out with the faux futuristic non-tactile bullshithave a temperature dial i work though muscle memory and door handles I can pull with force in the winterENOUGH WITH THE IPADS
>>27591362Always has been.Enthusiast vehicles aren't really volume products, and the only times they have really broken through to have mass market success is when the conditions in the industry have forced more people to consider small, lightweight vehicles.Kits and low-volume sports cars are just the natural state of vehicles for enthusiasts, and electric powertrains make it easier than ever to build.
>>27591383>always has beeni think the last 100 years of vehicle production after henry ford proves that point wrong faggot
>>27591236I'd sell it and buy a 416 stroker ls3 with magnusson heartbeat
>>27591387Show me the eras within that where enthusiast vehicles were actually dominant. I think you will find that outside of times when only wealthy enthusiasts had access to cars, or where the general public had to prefer small lightweight efficient vehicles that coincidentally appealed to enthusiasts, you are confusing selective preservation of vehicles people cared about, with what was actually prevalent on the road at the time.Henry Ford for instance wasn't making a lot of vehicles aimed at automotive enthusiasts to build his business, he was mostly making what we would in the modern era call a UTV limited to a top speed in the 40s.
>>27590980>>27591368This. If I'm going going to get an electric car, I want to be a car, that just happens to be electric. Stop trying to reinvent the wheel.
>Better aesthetics, it's fucking ugly>less touch screen stuffThat's about it, but I'm not keen on having Class D fire hazards near my house. Even the NFPA is starting to figure out all these Tesla tech masters with their super charger walls are unmitigated Class D fire hazards. There is no code right now requiring a fire arrestor for these things and if you thought they were expensive now..
>>27590945>not an iPad on wheels, needs to be like an XL trim in price and functionality>needs to have a 500+ mile range and infrastructure that can charge it as quickly as I can fill my tank with gas>needs to be able to tow without losing half of its range>needs to be diagnosable and serviceable by the average Joe, not requiring diagnostic computers and firmware updates that only the dealership is able to push out.Its literally impossible, which is why I'll never own one.
>>27591662Also it needs to not lose half its range in extreme temperatures. Because that just won't work for me.
When there's no more manual transmission ICE vehicles left on the market. Thank you for beta testing.
>>27591675Not even extreme temperatures fuck them up. They start fucking up once temperatures drop below 40F which is hardly extreme.
>>27591662>needs to be diagnosable and serviceable by the average Joenot saying you're wrong but you're not going to be able to buy any new car with the current trend
>>27591690That's like half the year where I live. I've got 40 year old diesels that start and do fine in -10F which is pretty much the entire month of January. How could they goof up something so simple?>>27591701It would be technically easier to have a forscan-esque system on electric vehicles, and since their parts by their nature are more modularized than ICE vehicles there is no reason why they shouldn't be swinging the trend.
>>27590945Gibsmedat for free and with a lifetime warranty on all repairs and maintenance.
>>27590989Basically this.As a result, the only EVs that suitable for me are smallish-scale RC cars, because at 1:5 it gets on par or even more expensive than ICE.And even then charging the battery for an hour is preferred to fast charging, and they still are a major source of inconvenience because of how you have to store and handle them.
>>27590945Here's my list:>improve the home buying market so I can actually set up a place to charge it>charge times need to be improved>batteries need to be easily removable and replaceable, they also need to not cost more than the car to replace, also consider battery swap stations rather than charging stations>battery life needs to improve>battery longevity needs to last longer>vehicle fire safety needs to improve DRASTICALLY, I don't want to get locked in a burning vehicle or have my house burn down when it's parkedNitpicking: I drive a hybrid and multiple times have parked the vehicle with my foot on the brake, then forgot it wasn't in park and the vehicle slammed forward into a curb, sign, car, etc. Do something more to remind the driver the car is on. I will also not drive a Tesla because they've only been making cars for 12 years, those things have a plethora of major issues to iron out still. I like the idea of silent cars that don't shit out stinky noxious gas, but I won't even be buying another hybrid after getting the bill for a new battery pack. I didn't save any money over these years due to needing to fix the expensive battery when it wore out, so these vehicles are really only temporary electronic devices that don't actually save us money. Legislating against planned obsolescence would help whip these corpo fucks into shape as far as actually trying to make long lasting products. My car shouldn't have the same lifespan as my fucking iPhone, and even that should be required to have a longer lifespan when it's clear they only make them to last a couple years so you're forced to toss it in a landfill and buy a new one.
>>27590945P O N T I A CT R A N SA M
>>27591887>forgot it wasn't in park and the vehicle slammed forwardAlso I don't even know why they do this. The gas engine is shut off so the vehicle shouldn't need to roll forward due to an idling engine. With an EV you should have to put your foot on the "gas" to make it roll forward. They should do away with the car rolling just because you took your foot off the brake. That would solve the issue I have with my hybrid if they didn't make it automatically roll forward.
>>27591892>forget to put the car in park>this is somehow the car's faultimagine if the car didn't roll forward when you let off the brake. you already forgot to put it in park except now you lost your reminder, so instead of scuffing your bumper you come back to your car an hour later only to find it parked in a ditch across the street with a screaming pedestrian trapped underneath.
>>27590945They need to weigh and cost half of what they currently do. No clutch pedal is gay as fuck too.
>>27591934Right but most people are used to driving gas vehicles, always account for potential human error. With a gas vehicle you have the reminder of the car making noise and vibrating. With electric there is no such noise, and really no reason for the car to roll forward without pedal input anyway because there's no need for the engine to be idling, there's no engine.So in some situation where someone pulls into a spot or on the side of the road and thinks "I'm only gonna be here a second" then answers a text or something, forgets it wasn't put into park and decides nvm I'm gonna get out. The car just jumps forward silently. This is something EV manufacturers have probably already accounted for, but my hybrid was older (2015 Prius of shit). It would beep if you opened the door with the "engine" still on so you'd have to be hella distracted to leave it in gear and walk away from the car.
>>27590945100k cash lying around
>>27590945They are going to need to change the name in order to stop bastardizing the man who shit on the types of vehicles they make. Also for them to start calling them "battery cars" instead of disingenuously hiding that fact calling them "electric"
>>27590945I need to be able to pull up to a charging station and leave in less than 2 minutes with a full "tank" which gives me 500+ miles of REAL WORLD range. Every single ICE vehicle on the market is capable of doing this. No I have no interest what-so-fucking ever in plugging in my vehicle every time I use it.
>>27591887>charge times need to be improved250 to 350kW which is the standard current electric cars is already good enough for under 10 minute 150 mile top ups on 300 mile cars.Next generation is 600kW, or enough to add 300 miles in 5 minutes to the new generation of 500 mile electric cars.Honestly it is too fast now. I hate that I now usually have to unplug before everyone is ready to continue.>battery swap stationsA few brands have tried it like NIO, but there just isn't much demand for them. It was an idea born out of brainstorming how to make EVs capable of endurance racing, but the FIA decided to go with Hydrogen instead.The problem is there is no money running a public station offering either one. Battery swap or hydrogen fill up would be needed on less than 1% of trips and cost too much.>battery life needs to improveThe current generation is about a million miles on a 75kWh LFP pack. How much longer do you want them to last?Hybrids use smaller batteries with older more expensive cell chemistry, so don't think a Prius battery is the same as an EV.>they also need to not cost more than the car to replaceBeen the case for a while. A Leaf swap is often under $3000 for replacing a 24kWh with a 40kWh. The horror stories of the '$30k leaf battery' are from dealers that just didn't want to be bothered.Sodium ion should get the price under $50 a kWh, and should scale up to the point they become as common as lead acid or disposable AA.>vehicle fire safety needs to improve DRASTICALLY,Hybrid cars which are the worst. NMC electric cars are safer than pure gas cars. LFP and Sodium ion are safer again by an order of magnitude. Solid state simply won't burn.The horror stories you've heard about people burning to death in their car are all false, or maybe some incident with BYD.In any case you should always carry an escape tool, burning to death in gas cars or drowning actually happen all the time.
>>27592276Die cultist
make a kit to retrofit an existing car to EV. one that costs under 20 grand. one without the computer screen and gadgets.
>>27590945Nothing. Quite literally nothing. I will never buy an EV. Picrel is all I need in life. I'm currently restoring two of these.
>>27590971This is unironically me. I probably drive less than 50 miles a week, a gas tank lasts me well over a month it feels like. I really want a tesla just because my car is older, but I really can't justify a car payment for something that I simply don't need. My only hang-up is my 2012 Honda Accord has ~117k miles on it, and I feel like I'd get the most out of it now, vs waiting till it dies and getting 10% of what I would with it running.Also, I built picrel, and now have even less of a reason that I "need" a new car.
>>27592315https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=98mlJ1N50DUThere are short-range EV conversion kits that are even cheaper than that. The expensive ones are often that way because they include a restomod classic and have 60kWh and more power.>>27592099He just didn't like that all the battery cars back then were DC. All the EVs today are AC. Tesla Motors is named what they are because they originally use Tesla's AC motor design. Now they use an updated more efficient AC motor.Also keep in mind that the battery EVs of 120 years ago often had battery packs with less capacity than a modern electric motorscooter. Competition for horses. He couldn't forsee 100kWh battery packs in cars or compact AC inverters that made battery electric cars competition for internal combustion.I think Tesla would be vindicated that engineers are finally starting to pay attention to the series hybrid systems he describes.Pure internal combustion was a wasteful mistake only enabled by subsidies.
>>27590945>>27590959>>27590971>>27590973I will only buy an EV if it runs low 7s on street tires. low 9s off the track is too slow for me
>>27592373If you want a cheap runaround for less than 50 miles a week. Look at picking up a used Leaf, or a 500e, or something along those lines.I know a few people who swear by the Leaf, and I got to drive a 500e and it was a lot of fun.Volt and BMW i3 are also decent options if you want something that can occasionally drive further.Used Model 3s are also about as cheap as they're going to get now. If Tesla goes defunct the prices will likely jump up.
>>27592424Die cultist
>>27590945Light weight Good range in cold weatherFast cheap and readily available chargingMechanical door handles and locks throttle steering and brakes that aren't controlled by black box CIA niggersAlso, 30k or less.
>>27592432>aren't controlled by black box CIA niggerswhat are you hiding, why aren't you being a patriot
>>27590945>What would it take for you to buy an EV?Live scalping of Elon Musk by an actual Indian war chief.
>>27590945>What would it take for you to buy an EV?Better batteries.More specifically batteries that are safe and not a fire risk that could burn my house down while the fire department looks on helplessly and which either recharge in a period of time comparable to refilling a gas tank or which have a range of over 500 miles regardless of weather so that I could drive all day on a road trip without needing a charge. And they have to do that on a price that's comparable to a hybrid.I do not believe in man made climate change, I do not believe that lithium mines are better for the environment than oil wells and I don't think we can afford to switch the economy's transportation system to electric any time soon.Beyond that I fundamentally like the feel and sound of gasoline engines and am inclined to prefer them to electrics regardless of utility.
>>27590945>californiaI might do it, the gas price here is skyrocketing to heights I never imagined was possible in america because of leftards
>>27592405>He just didn't like that all the battery cars back then were DC. No, he shat on every mechanical engineer for being aloof at the fact that 90 percent of the energy was just being wasted as heat instead of generating electrical power. It had nothing to do with DC more then it had to do with batteries.>Also keep in mind that the battery EVs of 120 years ago often had battery packs with less capacity than a modern electric motorscooter. Competition for horses.>He couldn't forsee 100kWh battery packs in cars or compact AC inverters that made battery electric cars competition for internal combustion.He was smart enough as modern engineers when he read the power density charts and concluded we will never have a battery worth a piss, plus it's a moot point in the case of his wireless power transmission (which he wasn't even applying to this problem). Still to this day the combustion engine loses most of its power in the form of heat because legally there is no method to capture that heat and turn it into electrical power (especially since that means the exhaust will no longer be to EPA specifications to pass on an emissions test). The can was kicked down the road until this coping mechanism of compacting batteries, even designing insane contraptions such as battery infused car frames was passed off as acceptable. Why? Due to a horseshit psychosis that carbon is a first sin and that somehow perturbing an archaic herzian waveform across miles of resistance to charge the most ineffecient power storage devices is somehow more efficient that transporting potential energy.Funny you mention "forsight" when he himself said scientists would be the bitch of rotating magnetic fields for every future "discovery" they make using a device plugged into a wall outlet.
>>27590945All analog or all onboard software being free and opensource
Solar charging.
>>27592507>t. 13 year old
Killing yourself would be a good start. Fuck off EV shills. How about we worry about younger people having money and owning homes first before we worry about another CONSOOMER product that ends up being a lifestyle/someone's personality.Seriously, go die. The fuck kind of question is this and why are you so concerned about what people drive? Average people can't afford new cars, period. That should be first and foremost the thing to be addressed, not what dumb EV kike shit you want to force us to drive.
>>27592507Solar charging is just too weak and slow to be meaningful for something as powerful as a car. You could do it with like a golf cart.
>>27592518Disagree. Solar charging is only currently too weak. Solar cell efficiency is still very weak; the absolute best we have on the market right now is still only 24% efficient.
>>27592510 >Average people can't afford new cars, periodThey can if they're subsidized using fake money.>That should be first and foremost the thing to be addressed, not what dumb EV kike shit you want to force us to drive.If you actually think they want you driving, why shill "15 minute cities" so hard?>It's not about forcing companies to start making EV's and phase out gas engines>It's not about making people hate EV's. >It's about doing all of this while you implement draconian laws so that by the time people realize it, you won't be getting an electric or a gas vehicle because the delays/set backs will prevent you from doing it.You literally have to wait months if you want anything worth a piss. Lada could overtake half the car market right now and they're the ones that set the precedent for bring bread lines to car manufacturing.
>>27592490>He was smart enough as modern engineers when he read the power density charts and concluded we will never have a battery worth a pissHe was living in a world where the best batteries you could put into a car had the equivalent energy of about 1/3 of 1 gallon of gas, or about enough to drive at the pace of a horse for 100 miles.Today the best production batteries that can be put in a car are about the equivalent of 4 gallons of gas, or enough to drive at highway speeds for 500 or even 600 miles.Batteries don't have to be anywhere close to gasoline for light duty vehicles because electric motors are amazing.>Due to a horseshit psychosis that carbon is a first sinNo, due to the very real scientific evidence that releasing carbon into the atmosphere that has been sequestered since the carboniferous period is very bad for human civilization.You might not like reality, but the truth is that yes sending electricity over wires is vastly more efficient than trucking around fluids.Especially when those fluids required electricity both part of their production, and for their delivery at the end point.If you're filling up with 100% Iowan Ethanol then that isn't a problem, but there is still a lot of admixture from hostile foreign nations removing carbon from geologic sequestration to burn it.>scientists would be the bitch of rotating magnetic fields for every future "discovery"Its not like we're unaware of this. Which is why DC from batteries gets used when needed.
>>27592510>How about we worry about younger people having moneyIts not like there aren't advocates for UBI, free college, and universal healthcare. A bunch of student loan debt just got forgiven, and the cost of meds for my family is a lot less now than it was.>and owning homesNot everyone has to live in California or in major cities. Housing is cheap in the rural Midwest. Reconnect small towns to the major cities with rails and it won't be as much of a trade-off in terms of where you want to live.No one is forcing anyone other than the major corporations to do anything, and the only thing they are being forced to do so far is acknowledge the fact that they are falling behind, and being warned they will not be bailed out again at taxpayer expense.
>>27592568Your entire argument falls flat once you realize what petroleum based substance is used to not only make them, but charge these batteries. You are throwing these numbers without weight/power density in mind. I'm aware enough batteries in series can outperform a gallon of gas, but when their combines weight is more than a tank it's a moot point.>No, due to the very real scientific evidence that releasing carbon into the atmosphere that has been sequestered since the carboniferous period is very bad for human civilization.That being?>You might not like reality, but the truth is that yes sending electricity over wires is vastly more efficient than trucking around fluids.And you have absolutely no way of explaining how it does this do you? No of course not, because it's physically impossible and your talking out of your ass like the shill you are. You probably even believe that electricity travels and has a speed too despite the premise of power generation completely blowing that concept out of the water.>Especially when those fluids required electricity both part of their production, and for their delivery at the end point.You burn crude and condense to refine it. The vehicles also run on the shit (unless of course you disingenuously incrementally start adding unnecessary electricals to them which reify the need for electrics to be on the vehicle in the first place.>If you're filling up with 100% Iowan Ethanol then that isn't a problemYou're so ignorant you don't even know how much petrol they waste to make that. Yes it isn't a problem unless of course you're a combustion engine that deteriorates from the poor quality of ethanol fuel.>Its not like we're unaware of this. Which is why DC from batteries gets used when needed.It's also how hooligans "discover" dozens of "particles" due to big halbach arrays which for some reason they rename "particle accelerators". What will they rename the electric field next, amirite?
>>27591453>>27591368BMW already did that>waaah waaah muh sniffer!
>>27592608>petroleum based substance is used to not only make them, but charge these batteriesDidn't realize the hydroelectric damn that charges my car uses oil instead of water, crazy tell me more
>>27592608>Your entire argument falls flat once you realize what petroleum based substance is used to not only make them, but charge these batteries.nigga I live in COAL COUNTRY
>>27592310It's a quiet car that doesn't spew stinky shit out the back. As someone with many brain cells, I find the loud noise and stench of a nearby road to be offensive. Interior noise and rattle of my own vehicle bothers me too, so the idea of a quiet non-stinky car, that also saves money on fuel and goes fast, is something to consider. I still have my concerns and I don't think they were realistically answered. I still see Teslas stopped on the side of the road or being towed, and hear about them catastrophically engulfing in flames. Still too expensive as well, the tech ain't practical yet.
>>27592623Sure thing. For one, water is a terrible lubricant so you can't use it for the turbines. It uses both oil and water. Then there's the transformer oil of course. It's also dependent on there being water to generate the power. Then of course there's your car itself, whose batteries, frame and assembly that rests on the foundation of the oil that forged it in the first place.
>>27592623>>27592639Plastics are also a petroleum product.
>>27592630>bitimuniuos coal not cokeCoal is simply the hardest metal of oils
>>27592643I was waiting for a chance to explain to him why dielectrics are a requirement for power generation. I wanted to see if he was going to tell me magnet wire was coated in pitch tar or some retarded shit like that.
>>275909451000+ km range on a charge, infrastructure that doesn't suck balls, minimal battery issues in cold/hot weather.
>hey we shuold cut down on our needlssly wasteful use of oil>UMM AKSHULLY WE USE OIL TO MAKE PLASTIC BAGS TOOWhy so threatened?
>>27592654>We should recycle indestructible products until the companies that shilled this idea to us are able to make them not indestructible anymore.Just make bakelite again ffs.
>>27592577Most people live in big cities, not to mention the cost of rural cities is going up because everyone is leaving major cities, but it still doesn't make enough of a difference.You can avoid it but it WILL become your issue too, at some point. Make no mistake about it. Avoiding a problem isn't solving one. No, it isn't feasible to simply uproot your life and say goodbye to your family. It's a bandaid solution.Major corporations run our lives. Them being forced to do things will affect you too, it's obvious. It has happened and is happening before your eyes.>>27592534It's why EV sell well to begin with. Free money. I probably would have gotten one last year if my incentive application wasn't left blowing in the wind after funds ran out.They need both. Gas cars bad. Electric car good. Public transportation good.
>>27592632Die cultist
87 in Canada is currently 7 USD per gallon, meanwhile electricity is like 2.8 cents per kwh overnight (2 cents US). Why the fuck wouldn't I go electric assuming I was already in the market for a new car?Getting off oil refined by Americans and instead using nuclear power made by Canadian designed and built reactors using Canadian mined uranium is just a bonus. Every nation should strive for energy independence
If I could sell one for a profit.
>>27592687Guess where most of Americas oil comes from, you fucking leaf?>Why the fuck wouldn't I go electricbecause you literally don't have a financial option to.
>>27592740Read that post again you illiterate mutt, American REFINED oil
>>27592418no way it runs 9, wtf
>>27592746>So energy independent they ship their oil to us and buy it back at a premium. I thought Joe was bad.
>>27592674You're the cultist. Gasoline cars are pretty arcane.
>>27592807>No u>EVs are barely gaining any traction for maybe a decade>Hurr durr, gas cars are obsolete>ARCHAIC>ARCANE>HORSE AND BUGGYSure bro. Yet, everyone drives one. Get real, cultist. You're on an AUTOMOTIVE board. Gas cars have been the norm for decades, what basis do you have to come in here and talk shit and say they are archaic and outdated when they are the norm and also heavily preferred when you talk to actual enthusiasts? You will never be a real woman nor drive a real car.
>>27592852COPETesla Model Y is the best selling car in Europe
>>27592518>>27592531The aptera car might be able to pull it off, mainly because of its aerodynamic design. Gets the range of a Tesla with a battery half the size
>>27592852Buddy I think it's time we find something that isn't a stinky glorified steam engine. You can't tell me if someone actually built a water powered car that you wouldn't drive it, I would just because that's high tech and convenient. EV idk if it quite fits that bill but it seems more convenient than the current stink explosion engine at times.
>>27590945Hey Elon how ya doin.If you can fit your asshole inside your own asshole I'll buy a Model S LR.
>>27591124>Tesla is the official white man's carThat'd be the Corolla.
>>27592945>"EV">Fucking battery>>27592945Electricity is generated using glorified steam engines run on coal you sperg.
>>27590945I would never buy a gay ass fucking ev
>>27591124>Tesla is the official white man’s carNo
>>27593013Coal to generate electricity is fucking archaic too. Geothermal exists, nuclear fission exists, shit we're even on the brink of nuclear fusion and that's a technological singularity tier innovation. Cars? Stinky oil explosion turn rotor, lmao. They're lagging way far behind.
I'd rather have an EV over taking a filthy negroid bus or train, but would never care to own one for fun. Any shitbox EV to get from A to B would be fine. Maybe I'll pay attention if some people start building their own EVs that can do crazy shit.
>>27590945>What would it take for you to buy an EV?Range and charging time equal to ICE vehicles
>>27593176Every fucking technology you just listed boils water to turn a fucking rotor of lodestones. You know what's archaic? Still not knowing how the fucking lodestone works.
>>27590945>What would it take for you to buy an EV?It takes less than a minute to fill up my tank with petrol, if it was running empty. So if I were to buy an EV, it should also take less than a minute to charge the vehicle to full. A full battery replacement should cost the same or less than an engine replacement in my petrol car. That's about it, really. I've driven one before and it was ok. Gets the job done. If they fix these two problems, I would definitely add EVs to my considerations. The rest of the stuff, I don't really care. They have a/c and chairs and look normal on the inside just like any other car, so I can't complain there. But the requirements to use it and own it is just retarded. If you want to get me to accept a replacement for something, it should be better than the old thing, not create more problems. We definitely need to get past the need for repairs, and servicing, and shite. Simple vehicles to own, should be the commuter car of the future. It's amazing that ICE vehicles, with all its complexity, and the entire industry surrounding it, has lasted as long as it did. They're way overdue for a replacement. It doesn't even have to be EVs that replace it. Whatever magic sauce can power up wheels to move on their own. That's what we need. Less reliance on external products like fuel, spare parts, or electricity and more independent machines that can repair themselves. What I'm describing is basically science fiction. I'm way ahead of you EV cucks.
>>27592913>In Europenobody cares about eurocucks, faggot
>>27593232In fact while I'm on the subject I may as well just throw it out there that even a fucking steam car is more environmentally friendly than an EV and more efficient. Now instead of using the steam to drive mechanical parts, have it generate power instead like in actual power generation. You can now have you retarded "Start-stop" systems without it destroying bearings and the engine, "batteries" in the form of steam tanks. You would use less than a quarter of the fuel since you're now actually utilizing most of the energy you would have wasted instead of just using the the highest potential to turn some over engineered rube goldberg machine. You could also use practically anything that burns as fuel since all you're doing is the same thing electric power station use. It's genius, where is the shill saleman who will sell me a car that can "sell the energy back" to the power company? Oh right since that would actually work it doesn't exist.
>>27592913EVs have been largely subsidized in Europe for a long time so people got "more" for their money than their regular car counterparts. Most european counties also have oppressive discrimination regulations against regular cars. The sales aren't because the customers WANTED EVs, it's forced onto them. As the subsidies are removed, EV sales will plummet. And they must because the cunts are losing income by making EVs cheaper.
if EVs become more like DIY computers it would be interesting. option to upgrade or delete components like massive screens, optional physical buttons or very good haptics, and control over open source software. no subscriptions or paywall features, no void warranties for changing things or bringing to an independent repair shop. many options for parts and whatnot.
>>27593263What you're describing is exactly what the founders of Aptera are designing for. They claim parts on the car will have individual QR codes with an instructional video on how to service that part.
>>27593240It takes less than a minute to plug and unplug my car at home which makes up 90+% of the energy I use to drive. I've actually saved hours of driving to and waiting at gas stations because of this.
>>27590945$1 price pointFollowing inclusions:Attached garage to house with all connected fast chargersGarage is fully fireproofSolar system and battery installed, Japanese design and manufacture onlyNo road use fees
it doesn't fucking explode just sitting in my garage
>>27590945A petrol engine.
>>27590945The only EV I want is Aptera>lightweight>long range>charges itself>right to repair>zippy as fuck>looks cool
>>27592444>I do not believe in man made climate changeThe beautiful thing about science is that it is not beholden to subjective human characteristics such as opinion, emotion, or belief.
>>27593448Yeah! How can he not see that the hundred years since the industrial revolution have cause CO2 levels to go from .032% to .038?!
>>27592852>EVs are barely gaining any tractionMaybe out in the appalachian mountains among the poorest and most inbred people in Americahttps://www.spglobal.com/mobility/en/research-analysis/firstever-major-us-metro-area-hits-50-electrified-vehicle-regi.html
>>27592807>I think scary weather is going to kill everyone because politicians told me so, and you're the cultist if you don't believe itCultists these days
>>27593476Literally every major car company including Tesla has rolled back because of poor sales, try googling harder next time cultboy
>>27593572Dunno if you noticed, but companies are struggling to move ICEs as well, interest rates skyrocketed in the last year. You'd know this if you were a functioning adult and not some SEA monkey paid to shill on 4chinz of all places
>>27593448True, which is why incorrectly appealing to IPCC authority is a logical fallacy, and therefore anti-science as well.
>>27593578>but companies are struggling to move ICEs as well,Thats not even remotely true, because the roll back on EVs has returned investments in hybrids. Used cars from 10 years ago are outselling EVs ffs. Cultists like you unironically need to die violently, it seems its the only way to get shit through that dumb fuckin brain of yours
>>275909451) 400mi range that doesn't take 1.5 hours to charge in a packed supermarket parking lot, assuming there's an available charging station that actually works.2) A normal fucking car that isn't overly designed to look like it came from outer space3) Rational layout inside where my most frequent touchpoints aren't buried in the infotainmentThey already have this - PHEV.
>>27592353coomer larping as a boomer lol
>>27593580Nice alternate reality you live inhttps://www.press.bmwgroup.com/global/article/detail/T0441021EN/bmw-group-continues-on-bev-growth-path
Last week I heard an advertisement for roadside assist for EVS. That's odd why would an EV need roadside assist? Hmm?
>>27593683I love how desperate you are on google. Meanwhile in actual reality https://www.consumerreports.org/cars/buying-a-car/when-to-buy-a-used-car-a6584238157/https://spectrumnews1.com/ca/la-west/transportation/2024/03/11/used-evs-depreciate-10x-faster-than-gas-powered-cars#:~:text=Used%20electric%20vehicles%20are%20depreciating,with%20a%203.6%25%20decline%20overall.
>>27593703>August 2023>March 2024
>>27590945Not a EV skeptic, I just want used EVs prices to drop below $5K with 200 mile range/access to charging.
>>27593715Lol and?? Whats changed between 1 month or a year? you dumb fuck
>>27593722A lot, which you're clearly unaware of because you have no idea what the fuck you're talking aboutMeanwhile that BMW post was from a week ago
>>27593725Your cultist link from a week ago LITERALLY does nothing to nullify the object fact that EVs are getting BTFO by used ICE cars, with prices RIGHT NOW reflecting that
>>27593729The fuck are you babbling about? Only poors compare new and used cars. Unless you want to argue that the entire used car market is BTFOing the new car marketNigger logic
>>27593292I agree with you as my wife has one, I will say they are absolute shit outside of normal commuting to work or around town. Just a huge limiting factor is where you can actually go
>>27593732>Only poors compare new and used cars.No, rich people are very concerned with the depreciation of the assets they buy. A 10+ year old Camry IS LITERALLY, OBJECTIVELY, more valuable than a new POS EV
>>27593292>when the cultist thinks anybody is buying their retarded bullshit
>>27593736Rich people don't see cars as an asset, only poors think that way. Cars are a transportation expense, and they can easily afford to spend more on nicer transportationProperties, businesses, investment portfolios, those are assets
>>27593742>Rich people don't see cars as an asset, only poors think that way.Okay so you're 12 years old lmfao dumbass child
>>27593742>>27593744Whats also ironic is you're talking about nigger tier behavior, while saying that rich people have the logic of an ultra nigger gangster rapper when it comes to cars HAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
>>27593744Found the poor
>>27593750Nobody gives a shit what little kids like you think
>umm akshully rich people all drive used corollas like me!
>>27593753You just spent the last hour pissing and shitting yourself, seems you give a shit lmfao
>>27593754Where ITT does it say that stupid?>>27593758>pissing and shittingWhat like googling irrelevant nonsense and still coming out wrong? Awww little tiny child, gonna cry?
And here we see the election tourist is buck broken by EVs, thank you and good night
>>27593766Run away now little babby, back to mommy
>>27590945Swappable batteries would be a start
>>27593769Yeah, an amazing idea, have some local mechanic loftly swap your 2 ton battery that
>>27593769Nio already does that, but it effectively locks you into a lifetime battery lease. Meanwhile BYD is making batteries that'll last the lifetime of the vehicle
>>27593773That's not what I mean. I mean batteries made for easy swapping, interchangeable between vehicles. Arrive at the battery station (formerly gas) and leave 2 minutes later in your fancy German car with a full charge.
>>27593790okay, so you're thinking of sci-fi fiction
>>27593790>>27593792https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hNZy603as5wIt literally already exists
>>27593795>verified checkmark sales pitchZoomers are fucking retarded animals that will believe anything they watch on instagram
>>27593805>want a thing>here's the thing>"noooooo shills reeeeee"Mental illness
>>27593809>please please believe the sales pitch!Its not my fault your a dumbass little kid that puts their trust in commercials. I bet you also think Boston Dynamic is 2 weeks away from replacing factory workers with robots
>>27593795>>27593805Still not as good as gas, which is universal. Or propane, ffs. They don't make you get a subscription to propane bottles. Propane bottles aren't vehicle-specific either.
>>27593851That's why I said it was a meme, you don't even own the battery. Fucking Hyundais are charging in like 15 minutes now, and chink cars are even faster than that. We're getting to the point where batteries are charging fast enough and have enough range that you can easily top off during a piss breakOnly thing left now is to actually build out the infrastructure. America's biggest problem is the lack of electrical transformers, there's a 2 year lead time on them. The fact that critical infrastructure like transformers aren't made in the country is appalling and needs to be brough up
>>27593851Its not just that, what the retarded zoomer doesnt understand is the commercial he watched was entirely curtailed. Like, 100% of their efforts went into making 1 battery get swapped with tons of editing. They didn't show its capability on dozens of different cars, or anything remotely close to a real life usage setting. Same reason I bring up Boston Dynamics. They stress ALL of their funding and resources into having a robot be capable of executing a few tasks for a 5 minute video. THATS IT.
>>27593855>Fucking Hyundais are charging in like 15 minutes now, and chink cars are even faster than that.Nobody is buying your stupid ass twitter LARP. Redditors like you seriously need to fucking die, you're too terminally stupid to exist on my planet
>>27593857That's literally a public swapping station, retard. You asked for the thing and were given the thing
>>27593860>waaah waaah I hate reality!
>>27593861>>27593864>its reality its reality!>can only provide a silly commercial and thats it Children these days think they know shit lmfao
>noooo all those google maps locations are just commercials! anyone who made a video about it is a shillNever thought I'd see a meltdown this bad on /o/
>>27593874>still no link or any evidence, other than a commercialWhats a matter little guy??
/pol/bbot is broken, sad
>>27593861>>27593874>meanwhile in realityhttps://www.carscoops.com/2024/02/ev-sales-in-germany-fall-55-percent-after-incentives-end/
>>27593878wtf did these germans even watch the commercial!??!?
>>27593878You dumb ass didn't even read the article lmfao
>>27593883the cope begins
>electric with rotary range extenderI'd buy it, not that it will ever actually be produced
>>27593883https://electrek.co/2024/01/31/europes-biggest-ev-market-is-about-to-hit-a-perfect-storm-of-problems/>NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
>>27593889No you won't
>>27593857I don't doubt the video is real, but it still doesn't make me want one of those cars. Proprietary batteries, thanks but no thanks. The way I see it is you either have batteries as a commodity just like gas or don't bother with them. Walled gardens for my car? Fuck off.
>>27593894Why do batteries have to be a commodity if they're designed to last the life of the vehicle? Are engines a commodity as well?
>>27593894>The way I see it is you either have batteries as a commodityIts simply a silly story anon, the idea you're going to have a battery powering a multi-ton vehicle, and that battery can removed willy nilly and replaced, let alone on hundreds of thousands to millions of vehicles annually.. Just grow up and join the real world son
>>27593896>to last the life of the vehicle?Current cellphone batteries don't even last longer than 3 years, and their charges are greatly compromised too after a short amount of time. WTF are you talking about
>>27593890>For its part, BMW says it is now investing $711 million (€650 million) to convert its main factory in Munich to exclusively produce electric vehicles by the end of 2027Oh, oay
>>27593904Yeah, Fords said a lot of that talk here, ya know, until reality smacked them in the face and they abandoned it
>>27593902fuck huge actively cooled car battery is nothing like a tiny, passively cooled cell phone batteryNCMs are good for 800-1000 charge cycles, LFPs are pushing 2000-3000 charge cycles, before falling to 80% capacityAssuming a mediocre 250 miles range, that's 250k to 750k miles of driving before it loses enough range to not be considered "good enough" for EVs
>>27593908Cool cultist nonsense bro, Im not a massive faggot or a retard that believes in redditor tier dogshit
>>27593896>Why do batteries have to be a commodityTo be true gas analogues in my eyes. I don't care about the lifespan of one individual battery, I care about avoiding charge times by quickly swapping them just like I'd quickly fill up the tank.
>>27593905Ford made shitty EVs that no one wanted. Mach E is a terrible value compared to the Model Y, and the Lightning can't tow while the Silverado and Ramcharger can
>>27593909>noooo thing bad, reddit!
>>27593911All evs are losing in sales to old toyotas, you cultist piece of shit >>27593913>mommy why doesnt he believe my copy/paste r/futurology bullshit????
>>27593911Yeah but Joe pretended they were good kek
>>27593917That's his job, can't admit that China has leapfrogged the US in the automotive space
>>27593921Well he shouldnt because redditor cultist nonsense isnt real life
>>27592432>Mechanical door handles and locks throttle steering and brakes Not needing the windows to move to open the door.Zero touch screensNot cramped interior Is this really to much to ask?I honestly could use a small commuter ev, but don't want to pay 50k for a second vehicle.
ditch the shitty lequirkygimmicks
>>27593289>>27592938To bad Aptera half way a scam for how long it is taking.
>>27590945a clutch pedal and under 2500 pounds
>>27590945I’ll “buy” a Tesla if it’s completely free. I’m not paying a single cent for the car, taxes, or for the license plate or first registration. I’d also have to get free Tesla insurance, a fast charging port and battery installed in my garage, and solar panels connected to the charger and battery. I also want their best warranty on all parts and road-side assistance. Take the telemetry out of it too. I still want updates, but I want to manually install them. No recording devices inside either. I don’t want Tesla spying on me or bricking my new car. I also want more than the 200 mile range. Make it self-extinguish if there is a fire. Anything less than that and I’ll just keep my shitty car that is more reliable and that I can actually repair myself. Even with gas being almost $4/gallon, it’s not that expensive considering I get more range, faster refueling, more reliability, and cheaper maintenance.
this board is full of Neolithic mongoloids
>>27594132>t. trend chaser
>>27594148old thunderbird
>>27594158Wouldn't mind one desuhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MHuIEl2-lzs
>>27594132Pay your rent you little worthless bitch nigger
>>27590945No updates or internet connectivityAn electric motor swap into an older car would be ok with me for around town or commuting
>>27590945For them to be a form and fit replacement for my trucks at similar used prices.The only reason to own one is high fuel prices but petrol is cheap and a lot cheaper than replacing vehicles which run fine, are cheap to maintain (I do all that) and do not require taking on debt.
>>27593607Larping? I literally own a 1968. I just was out driving it, but go off queen. >CoomerLol, projection much? I will never buy an EV. I'm building a special backup engine optimized and hardened for running pure ethanol if they ever try to force gasoline out so I can brew my own fuel like some people did in the 70s during the OPEC oil crisis.
>>27594094> No recording devices inside either.NOOOOOOOO BRO, BUT ELON NEEDS TO SEE YOU! THEY GOTTA BE ABLE TO SEE INSIDE! YOU DON'T TRUST THE EMPLOYEES? YOU'RE POOR!>But between 2019 and 2022, groups of Tesla employees, opens new tab privately shared via an internal messaging system sometimes highly invasive videos and images recorded by customers’ car , opens new tabcameras, according to interviews by Reuters with nine former employees.
10 year battery warranty including cover for impacts through floor.
>>27594884You're not building shit, you're just LARPing on the internet
Tesla is strapped for cash right now. That's why their prices dropped trying to rake in some money.
>>27590945I’ll buy an EV when the battery pack and electric motors have been replaced with an RB30DET and all the infotainment systems + tracking devices have been entirely removed from the vehicle.
>>27590945Small, cheap, fun to drive hatchback with at least 230 mi range.
I live in an apartment in NYC without a garage, id have nowhere to charge it easily. Would need every street to have chargers available more or less.
>>27590945Honestly a lot.The main thing would be property.EV is next to useless if you dont have where to charge it, hence id need to have my own house. Espcially since I live in eastern europe where most apartments are old commie blocks where one struggles just to park the car let alone charge an ev.Then. id need it to be one thats fun to drive as its the main thing i want from a car. I know that evs offer good acceleration but imo thats a one trick pony.Also battery degradation needs to be worked on.And if I were to buy an EV most likely it would be that honda E model. Since it would be perfect to use in city. The range of 100 or so kilos is usually more than enough for day to day tasks.But in reality I think a hybrid would be a better normal vehicle than an EV.
>>27590945I bought a Polestar 2 b/c after the market crash you can get a 70k EV for 30k used under 15,000 miles and it's far better than any new ICEV you can buy
>>27599269lmao
>>27593720if you cut your desired range in half, you can get a Nissan Leaf or a BMW i3 for about that much these days.
>>27599286100 mile is useless for me. I travel ~200 mile road between states, so need that
>>27590945i just want a nonsmart car ev. i get comforts but not this obsession to make them tech milestones or whatever
>>27599356get an old american land yacht and throw the Ford EV crate motor in it. You've got a shitton of room around the chassis to fill with batteries too.
>>275909451) price. they need to be cheaper than otherwise equivalent ICE cars, not taking performance into account. its extremely easy to make a 500hp EV, and its a good thing, but its not enough to compensate for being worse in other ways. 2) make charging at home possible for people in apartment buildings. right now, the EV audience is only those who own their own homes. 3) make them less gay. im not going to buy an EV if it looks like shit, if the interior is infested with screens, capacitative buttons and climate control is buried 3 menus deep in the infotainment. make them look good, make them usable.
>>27599492Performance EVs are already cheaper than performance ICEVs
>>27590945I just did. 36k for an under 3 second 0-60 and no oil changes or gas ever is pretty attractive. If you can't charge at home tho you can't really own an EV
>>27592444>I do not believe in man made climate change, I do not believe that lithium mines are better for the environment than oil wells and I don't think we can afford to switch the economy's transportation system to electric any time soon.Wait until you find out we are on the cusp of not having enough CO2 for plant life on earth.
>>27602825Source: Bill Nye the Tranny Guy told me so on InstashartSage goes in ALL fields.
>>27591232>>27591243respectable take. i thought it was a neat and concept from gm. i liked that it came with forged wheels. i bet it was a good exercise for the gm engineering team
>>27590945I'm skeptical at first because I'm invested in the idea of complete destruction of third world countries and I love cleanliness. It turned out to be the exact case on top of the extra benefit of good convenience AND efficiency. Not to mention the thirdies fell for low quality chinkshit EVs they casually explode in malls lol, what a great time to be alive.
>>27603236It is pretty incredible considering GM went from making basically zero hybrids to making arguably the best one in the world for the time. A comparable new EV would cost $40-50k, yet despite the Volt being up to 13 years old and sub-$10k, it doesn't feel like a vastly worse experience for it. It's a testament to the engineering when a car can be this old and still feel modern.
>>27602771Is that battery icon for your car or phone? If the former, they really should change it to something less cute and phone like.
>>27590945>lower price>actual range 300+km (not "300km" in spec sheet)bonus point for faster charging
>>27590945Cheap enough to have chargers that charge my car from 0% to 100% in 2 minutes.
>>27603601>from making basically zero hybridsThey were experimenting with EV tech since the 90s if not earlierThere was a joint venture with BMW resulting in several hybrid Bimmers and full size trucks/SUVs from GM as early as 2005 or so, all production models, plenty of them still on the road.
>>27590945I'll buy any EV that's not Tesla if they license Tesla's self driving tech. It's probably well-optimized in the city I live in but damn fsd is real good when I tried my buddy's. Hate the cheap feeling car though.
>>27590945Cheaper, lighter, modular battery, physical buttons for common commands, no WEF bullshit, better charging infrastructure. As a bonus, 5C charging capability.
>>27593889>electric with rotary range extenderMazda is currently selling one, but it's some kind of SUV.
>>27593896Aren't EVs supposed to be green? Current EVs are basically designed to be tossed out when the battery fails, and it fails more often than it is recognized.
>>27594132>Neolithic mongoloidsThey were unironically smart.
>>27603648its for the car. You can change the % to the miles left. the car talks to my phone less than my old car with apple CarPlay. it has no idea what battery my phone is at.>>27603601the volt and clarity are really perfect hybrids. All hybrids should be plug in and able to drive under electric power only. Much easier, simpler and more reliable to make the engine a generator like in a locomotive.
Something like picrel is what I want from an EV. Basically the electric version of the Honda Insight. None of your gay ass ESUVs or pickups, just pure efficiencymaxxing. This thing has a 40kwh battery and still gets 400 miles out of it.I'd buy one if they weren't so expensive and didn't have all the controls on a (((touchscreen)))
>>27592276yeah battery swapping doesn't seem viable, if only one company did it it'd take a ton of resources and have stations super spread out, otherwise it'd require an unprecedented degree of standardization.
>>27605453I'd buy one if it had a 4th wheel
>>27606142The more I learn about 3-wheelers, the more having 4 wheels seems dumb. For example, there's zero torsional forces on the body. All the torsional forces are contained within the front suspension cradle, meaning the body will likely last longer and be less susceptible to creaks and rattles over time. When you combine that with cheaper tire replacements, it seems like a pretty obvious move to go 3 wheels.
>>27606864
>>27606864>just let me back up real quic-ACK
>>27606864The Aptera is simply too fucking wide because it has to counteract the inherent limits of its 3 wheeled design.
>>27607023>Aim for the space between a front wheel and rear wheel?>>27607029The max reversing speed will almost certainly be drastically limited to prevent this.
>>27607029Karl Benz went there.The Reliant is faster and has a roof and doors.
>>27590945For it to use basic fucking gauges and actual buttons , charge in 5 mins, can maintain 80+ mph for at least 300 miles, not catch on fire and trap me inside. You know basic shit I could buy a 90's Honda and fucking do with not problem.
>>27593261As much as I like this idea, it’d never happen. Electrical generation using steam is done using high pressure, super critical steam and turbines in most instances (geothermal power works a bit differently, but it’s an outlier). The former is an even bigger hazard than lithium batteries in a crash, because it means the car would explode and melt the skin off anyone nearby in the event of a failure or crash. The latter is an issue because high efficiency turbines are not well suited to being in a moving, bouncing vehicle. There’s a reason the internal combustion engine largely replaced steam everywhere, even if indirectly (such as in diesel locomotives), and it’s because steam powered anything is big, complex and requires a lot of maintenance. The other blocker is also that boilers are regulated basically everywhere, and require a train boiler technician to attend to them. Some places allow unattended boilers, but the requirements are onerous. The legislation for this is ancient (back to the late 1800s), and exists because any steam boiler is also a fairly effective bomb, particularly if high pressure steam is involved.
Make the engine have sound. Real sound. Make it violent.That's it. I don't care about power as long as it's putting down an acceptable 0 to 60.
>>27605118Study just came out saying the current generation of batteries were even more reliable than expected. Every current EV has a battery that can be replaced, and the battery is likely to outlast the car in most situations.Even Leaf batteries which have the highest failure rates get pulled out of cars, and used for home storage, and then often the Leaf gets its 24kWh battery replaced with a 40kWh pack for a few thousand.
>>27607536I hate electric whine and solenoid clunk in electric cars. Spokedokeys is probably the only answer.Sarah N reviewed a car the other day that has a bass speaker above the engine that makes car noise. That is pretty fcukd.
>>27605118Depending on how much you drive and how your power is generated, an EV can be considered greener than an ICE in 1-6 years. Federally mandated warranty on EV batteries is 8 yearsCurrent batteries have been lasting much longer than that, and even after their useful life in a car is over and the car is scrapped, they can still be used in stationary power storage
>>27607633The using old 18650s for storage bit will never be untrue.
>>27590945a v8
>>27590945i dont want an ev. why do ev shills only speak in sneaky "brazilian" terms
>>27593795>subscription based fuelreally nigga. also>get rear ended>battery falls out like u just dropped your phone in 2008
>>27591214>viable form of personal transportationonly if you are upper middle class and like throwing money away
>>27607796>only if you are upper middle class and like throwing money awaySo just like any other new car?
>>27607782I already mentioned it here. Just pointing this out because people who want swappable batteries don't understand what that entails.>>27593788
>>27590945A user serviceable battery and electric motor. If my poverty box can get to 500k miles without a rebuild then anything less is a step back
>>27607221>can maintain 80+ mph for at least 300 milesCan EVs with over 300mi of range not do this? I've been thinking about an EV, but is the max range not applicable to highway driving or something?
It has to be this exact car but street legal and 400 mile range on road tires, while carrying a replacement swap-in batteryby the time we get to that point we'll probably have perfectly safe mini reactors powering everything anyway
>>27607221>>27608089Your 90s Honda isn't doing 300+ miles at 80mph either
>>27607810that's true...
>>27590945>lightweight>being able to handle heat and cold environments>waterproof, so I don't have to worry about leaving it outside while it's raining>takes less than 10 minutes to fully fill up the tank instead of 5 hours>not complicated as fuck to fix something>good build quality>high range and ability to drive long distances>functioning dashboard where I can see what's going on instead of Aliexpress tier iPadEVs are none of that and you'll never be a real woman, OP
>>27590945Personally, I think Elon should roleplay more as his son wanting to go to nightclubs. Pretty based behavior.
>>27607604>Study just came outI don't care. Make the battery modular just like God intended.
>it's has to be atleast price competitive to a gasoline car >There needs to be enough history/data to know what sort of reliability can be expected and a network of dealers/shops/part stores to help with repair/maintenance>charging/battery size tech needs to catch up so I can expect at worse, (1) 30 min pitstop a week to charge the car. Although I may consider something sooner, once I have a house and can charge at home. 2 and 3 are the hardest ones to solve imo.
>>27590945it has to be smool an look like a 90s japanese coupe or roaster.
>>27592373Don't often see gas powered bicycles on /o/. Here's one of mine. German Ruff frame, Sachs engine.
>>27590945Remove spyware, touchscreens and constant software updates, i can tolerate everything else.
How about an ICE range extender?
>>27590945I have a 12 year old Chevy Volt and I couldn't charge it every single day for a few months and the battery got fucked up by heat and if I didn't take it out for a decently long drive every day, it would not start. Gets good mileage though.
>>27590945if it had a V8
>>27608153The fuck it ain't, range for a 1998 Civic is 404 miles if you're averaging the highway rating 34 mpg, which is probably 55-60 mph. Doing 80 consistently would knock that down to 300 miles. Not my fault that lithium has got your brain fucked up. >>27608089No they can't, they're inefficient at higher speeds which is almost inverse of ICE engines because ICE engines have transmissions.
>>27590945Put in an engine and make it an EREV, since I don’t have a way to reliably charge for less than the price of gasoline at this point in time even if I’m planning on getting into a proper house sometime in a few years.
>>27590945'Normal' car weight; sedans should be below 4000 pounds.Batteries that can be replaced if/when they fail. Needs to be as affordable as replacing the engine in an ICE car.Absolutely zero chance of spontaneous combustion while parked in or next to my house. If that takes a yet-to-be-discovered battery chemistry, so be itLocal township permitting needs to allow enough electrical service to homes to actually support a level 2 charger. My house barely has enough service for the normal shit I have now, no way could it handle another 50 amps from one charger, let alone more than one.No fake shifting or sounds. I will always have cars that do those things for real. If I am choosing to drive an electric car, I want it to drive like one naturally does. (CVTs with fake shifting are stupid too, and so are ICE cars with fake engine noise through the speakers). At the very least, make it so all this shit can be disabled.No all-touchscreen interiors. There was nothing wrong with where we were before this trend. Real buttons and switches for the things you need, like HVAC and operational systems, radio and other tech features can all be in a touchscreen for all I care, I barely use them anyway. This shit is just like software companies redesigning their UI every few years just to stay 'fresh' and making everything worse in the process; they refuse to accept that it was perfect before and no change is necessaryPrices need to come down. Most people can't afford most EVs on the market right now.
>>27612921Those things had tiny 12 gallon fuel tanks, only did 30mpg, and had literally no overdrive so fuel economy went to shit after 60mph because the engine would be buzzing at like 4500rpm
>>27612971>'Normal' car weight; sedans should be below 4000 pounds.RWD Model 3s are around 3500lbs to 3800lbs. The heavier cars over 4000lbs are AWD which adds weight.>Batteries that can be replacedAlready the case, and the only EV with batteries that fail has a good after market for battery upgrades that cost a few thousand dollars. Not that different from an engine swap.>Absolutely zero chance of spontaneous combustionAlready a lower chance of that happening than with internal combustion which is non-zero.Solid-state batteries that cannot burn are already in production, they're just a bit of an expensive gimmick.The whole fire thing is seriously exaggerated, it was really only ever a BYD issue.>Local township permitting needs to allow enough electrical service to homes to actually support a level 2 chargerSeems unlikely, but that is purely a local issue. Honestly for a sedan under 4000lbs you don't even need a 50 amp, most sedans actually max out at 30amp and 20amp is really more than enough.If your electrical supply is really that restricted, an off-grid system for your house is probably a good investment. An EV is a convenient thing to put excess power into, especially the ones that double as home storage.>No fake shifting or sounds. Fake sounds are unfortunately mandatory now by law. Find a used Tesla Model 3 from before 2019. I think that is when 'Pedestrian Warning Systems" became required.As for shifting, most EVs are fixed gear. A few have actual multi-gear transmissions. Fake shifting was just a Hyundai demo gimmick.>No all-touchscreen interiors.Aftermarket solutions are available. Again, this is a thing happening because of legal requirements, hopefully it ends because of legal requirements. Car makers did this because it was allowed and was the cheapest solution.>Prices need to come down.Used Model 3s are ridiculously undervalued right now for what they deliver and their reliability.
>>27612970Already a thing.Honestly BMW should try again. The concept of a carbon fiber lightweight EV with 40kWh of battery and a motorcycle engine is solid.They just fucked it up with the styling. Make it look good and people would buy the thing in droves.
>>27590945Need to be able to park it outside all night when it's -30 and then drive it 460km.
>>27590945>What would it take for you to buy an EV?A home with a garage and a steady income
>>27590945People like this >>27613019 need to disappear off the planet.
>>27590945nuclear battery, quality control
>>27613023That thing still only had 200 miles of range with a range extender, their current EVs can already do more than that
>>27613076Another one of the bizarre decisions they made with the i3 was to only give it a software-limited 1.8 gallon fuel tank instead of something more sensible like 8 gallons.BMW wants a premium price for their new BEVs, but they cost $10k+ more than a Model 3, they weigh 1000lbs more than a Model 3, they're less efficient than a Model 3, and they charge slower on a CCS network that barely exists.Why they think they can deliver an overall worse driving machine is beyond me.The problem with the i8 and the i3 wasn't their PHEV powertrain. They can't actually match Tesla yet when it comes to BEVs. So they should work on offering something that plays to their strength.
>>27593448>The beautiful thing about science is that it is not beholden to subjective human characteristics such as opinion, emotion, or belief.You'd think; but you'd be wrong. Science is funded with money and scientists are human beings. Their objectivity is largely a myth.
>>27613094BMW's EVs are equally as efficient as Teslas in real world usage despite being heavier and using converted platforms. They also charge just as fast because they start off at 200kw regardless of state of charge, and drop off slowerTeslas supercharger network is already opening up, and BMW will have access by the end of the summer, that was the only real benefit to Teslas in North America and it's going to be snatched away from them pretty soon. Elsewhere in the world Tesla is just another charging company, and in Europe Ionity is often the better choicePeople spend more on BMWs because they're nicer cars with real interiors and paint that isn't Mazda thin and needs to be wrapped. Teslas are the Corollas of the EV world, a commodity and nothing specialAlso BMW does offer most of their cars as PHEVs as well
>>27613101Except that as with corporate backed charts like the one you posted, the cherry-picked data to arrive at that skewed conclusion is easily spotted.Scientists get off on, and get ahead by exposing every minute error and corruption of data by their colleagues.The only thing Science requires you to trust in, is human's desire to shit on anyone who is wrong.The same thing that makes the internet work.
>>27613094Tesla can't match BMW when it comes to making cars. So they should work on offering something that plays to their strength.
>>27613114https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Replication_crisis
>>27613119So why can't BMW make a Model 3 killer?Should be simple right? Under 4000lbs.Over 300 miles of range.Over 500hp.More than 250kW fast charging.Under $52k.
>>27613114>Except that as with corporate backed charts like the one you posted,That chart is from the NOAA the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration. Its literally US government data.Its pure unfiltered data, the closest thing to the objective science you were pining for and you've chosen to ignore it because its telling you that the sky isn't falling.
>>27613129Why can't Tesla make a car where the steering wheel doesn't fall off?
>>27613129BMW doesn't make cars for poor people
>>27613121Which is as you can see from the article is something the Scientific community is well aware of, and vigorously working on fixing resulting in there being detailed study of that exact issue.Not sure what point you're trying to make other than trying to force the meme that if one thing in Science is wrong everything has to be wrong, so why not accept your preferred nonsense.Science doesn't work like that. Its not dogma.
>>27613135For a very limited set of the data cherry picked to produce the trend line desired. Notice how it is an odd length of time starting from a seemingly randomly chosen year.Just like your long-term chart by virtue of how zoomed out it is ignores how rapidly the CO2 level has risen during the most recent portion of the holocene.The world will be fine without humans, but human civilization would be seriously fucked by the CO2 and temperature swings depicted there.
>>27590945A car that has no circuit boards connected to anything related to the actual driving.So a pedal that directly controls the physical wire contact between the battery and the motor.No computers, no "intelligence", none of that bullshit. I don't give a singular shit about your fancy screen that shows you tire pressures, charge level, estimations and GPS, I don't want that screen to begin with. All of the essential shit (battery temperature and charge level) can literally be accomplished in an analog fashion and it'd be more power-efficient because you're not wasting electricity to run that stupid fucking screen. If I want a map, I'll get a fucking map when I need it.I'd also love an EV that weighs less than 2200lbs, but that's gonna take at least 20 years.
>>27590945
>>27613129BMW can't but Nissan could, same build quality.Perhaps that's a stretch Tesla might be worse.
