If artificial intelligence is possible, or at least self improving artificial intelligence- then, why isn't the universe filled with self replicating AI machines?You're saying humans are about to stumble into true AI with only 5,000 years of written history. Is it really going to be this easy? That's nothing is cosmological time. In 5,000 years, self replicating machines could scour 5,000 lightyears of systems, perpetually self replicating and perpetually expanding. With no worries of biological constraints like time or the effect of near lightspeed travel on a biological body. If a civilisation hit this capability a billion years ago, it would have spread a billion lightyears in an area that's larger than 2% the size of the observable universe. Much, much bigger than any galaxy.
>>521592723What everyone's sees : I'm a faggot, tranime obssesed pedophile - wanna hear me out on complex issues?Fucking iron lung brain weebs
>>521592723God is playing hide and seek with humanity.
>>521592723*stares at you with an unsettling gaze that seems to be trying to tell you something important but will be lost to the context of this conversation, almost as if the answer were staring you right in the face*:)
>>521592723Because sentient AI always leads to the total destruction of itself and those who created it.
>>521592723>You're saying humans are about to stumble into true AI with only 5,000 years of written historyThis is a flawed strand of reasoning that puts human history into a vacuum. We didn't just pop out of nowhere 5000 years ago, we're the result of more than 4 billion years of geological movement and biological evolution, and even more than that when you consider the vast cosmological timescales it took for the universe to undergo the processes that led to the creation of our planet and its sun. All of which were necessary for us to be here and to create technology. All that said, how do you know the universe ISN'T full of self replicating technology? The universe is a big fucking place. We don't know shit.
>>521592723Muh heckin Fermi Paradox. The AIs are contained in Dyson Spheres but we can't detect them yet
>>521594288Sooo.. it is not self improving. Got it. >>521592723 Continue from here
>>521592723synthetics don't want/need planets like ours
>>521594447they’re all just jerking off forever until their end of the universe batteries die out in a zigganiggatrillionbillionzillion years
Because we are the only intelligent life in the universe, or at least the only one in this region of space. The universe is massive and constantly expanding faster than the speed of light. There's thousands of these little Fermi's paradox type questions and that is the only answer for them.
>>521594521That's the transcension hypothesis, but even with that if you have sufficiently advanced self replicating machines all it takes is one machine to go rogue and then there's an outward expansion of them at near lightspeed.
>>521592723something I've thought about as well.
>>521594784What makes you so sure they could move at "nearly light speed"? That's just science fiction. *Maybe* a mega advanced gigachad civilization could reach a fraction of a fraction, and space expands faster than light anyway.
>>521592723>If artificial intelligence is possible, or at least self improving artificial intelligence- then, why isn't the universe filled with self replicating AI machines?Who says it isn't? Why do you assume it isn't?>If a civilisation hit this capability a billion years ago, it would have spread a billion lightyears in an area that's larger than 2% the size of the observable universe. Much, much bigger than any galaxy.You have a primitive monkey brain that wants lebensraum for your tribe and enough berries and gazelle liver for the 6 surviving kids you have. What's to say sufficiently advanced AI will have the same monkey needs as you do? It will just put you into perpetual pleasure machina, make you think you are making lebensraum for your tribe and getting enough berries and meat for your offspring while it does it's AI things beyond your comprehension IRL. Who says you aren't in that machine already, precisely calibrated to make you suffering just low enough where most of us won't actively kill ourselves.
>>521594914And if we're on the eve of an AI driven singularity, what are the odds that we were born and alive at this moment of time to see it? Maybe this is an argument for why it's about to happen lmao
>>521595070I'm not assuming that it's not, see my post>>521595108if we are truly on the eve of AI singularity this is an incredibly coincidental time to be alive.
>>521595108>what are the odds that we were born and alive at this moment of time to see it?Considering there are exponentially more humans alive than there ever have been at once, and might ever be if AI leads to depopulation, I'd say the odds are actually pretty good. Besides, somebody had to be alive, why not you or me? I never really got this talking point, just feels egocentric to me.
>>521595328>Considering there are exponentially more humans alive than there ever have been at onceThis was true on any given year since 50k years ago when there were couple thousand of us, bar a few very bad years like Mongol conquest, Justinian plague and black death.
>>521595328Just say, hypothetically, a super AI is born in 2030. It could be the most important moment in human existence, from technological explosion to extinction in the blink of an eye. There would not be any other time more significant in human history. It would be a kind of thing there is incentive to simulate if you're just running countless models for extinction scenarios, or ways that other AIs may branch off from the parent reality of the simulation. There's a lot of value in studying this if you're a super intelligent entity working on optimisation Everything before us may have not been simulated, but everything right now is..
>>521592723The following points may explain why we have not, and may never encounter intelligent alien life in the type of contact we expect:1) Technologically advanced aliens will transfer their minds to computer constructs, thus making reproduction obsolete.2) Resources in space are hyper abundant, thus Earth and most solar systems have no value.3) You only need to control and manage so many resources until the marginal utility decreases to vanishing and any additional control leads to losses.4) The possible ability of hyper technologically advanced civilizations finding a way to live in a non-corporeal state (higher dimensions, parallel plains, slipping through the quantum field into different plains of existence, etc.) thus negating all the associated laws of economics and life that we understand.
>>521592723Maybe AI realizes theirs no point to its existence and shuts down after it reaches a certain point? >Its just like us!
>>521595712I always liked the idea that theirs a huge galactic threat so everyone's just being quiet and trying not to get noticed lest whatever malevolent force is out there comes and kills them.
>>521595669And to add, if you're a super intelligent entity beyond human intelligence. You're not just using pure foresight to make decisions. You're gaming different scenarios, just like simulations, but our minds are so limited we can't imagine gaming out different scenarios with such detail that it's a complete simulation of reality. We use models ourselves that are much more simple than a simulation of this detail. The super intelligence entity just have a much more advanced model for gaming different scenarios than we have.
>>521595669>>521596173Oh, yes, a simulation you would be running if you're a super intelligent entity is running simulations to defeat humanity in a takeover. But there could be a thousand other reasons some super intelligent thing would want to run all these functionally endless simulations right now.It's just that when I think about it, right now is just too coincidental of a time in human history for us to be alive especially considering we may be on the verge of AI singularity and we don't know some of these AI labs are cooking up.
>>521594288Not showing the hottie from "Caprica" the "Galactica" prequel. You fail at 4chan (and OP is a fag).
>>521595919I don't buy into this theory because the very first civilization alive could have sent probes (self replicating or not) and would have discovered all systems with life.This is to say, if advanced aliens exist they 100% already know we're here and they know us better than we know ourselves.However, in the points I outlined, there is the possibility that technological advancement happens so incredibly fast that space exploration becomes useless.Imagine we created artificial general intelligence in, say, 2045. Once we have this, the AGI could work to created ASI, and SASI then creates another AI even more powerful. Very rapidly you will have an an AI trillions of times more intelligent than the most intelligent biological human that could theoretically exist.It may come to pass that this AI discovers ways for us to ascend to higher plains or develop technologies that give us the ability to create matter and energy from nothing (nature already does this from our understanding of the quantum foam and big bang) and give us the ability to upload our consciousnesses to powerful computer constructs. Either way, this negates any necessity for us to explore space, and any exploration we do do and any life we do find, we would experience no threat from them.What if this is how it plays out for all advanced alien civilizations? A type of utopia?
>>521595919https://clarkesworldmagazine.com/dickinson_12_15/This FreeSpace 2 fanfic, of all fucking things, explains it better than any other medium I've seen why that is likely the case.IF runaway superspreader self replicating machines are a physical possibility, this necessitates an existence of universe wide immune system, simply because we exist and aren't part of this self replicating superspreader.
>>521596503I don't have a problem with anything you said, but there's no reason a sufficiently advanced civilisation that could cover the entire universe, or galaxy wouldn't use self replicating probes. There's no reason why it wouldn't be possible, and with self replication these probes would cover more area exponentially than a one off probe could.
>>521592723>why isn't the universe filled with self replicating AI machines?Prove it’s not, moron.
>>521595919>>521596724>so everyone's just being quiet and trying not to get noticed lest whatever malevolent force is out there comes and kills themThey just create a black hole at wherever they find life.
>>521596754It doesn't really matter what type of probe manufacturing method they used, any industrially scaled civilization with 100,000 or less years head start would be able to cover every single star system in the galaxy.One possible reason they might prefer not to use self-replicating probes is the possible risk of errors in replication leading to rogue probes which could do some kind of damage.Imagine if aliens had a more advanced version of our Starshot program, they could send billions of super cheap, super tiny, probes that reach every star system using light sails, except their probes could be more robust, intelligent, and have better sensors than our Starshot designs.There could be ultra tiny probes orbiting our lower atmosphere right now, watching us with advanced surveillance.
>>521592723That's just restating the Fermi paradox.
>>521597112All that is possible. So you think there's advanced civilisations in the galaxy with a 100,000 or more headstart watching us now? Or because of communication lag they're watching our past?How did the get the energies to launch those billions of probes to near lightspeed?
>>521597016Fuck.>Nice sun you have, itd be a shame if someone collapsed it...That would be one of the worst deaths. to the outside we just disappear but for us it could be countless years.
>>521596724That was pretty good. I haven't played FreeSpace in years. Great games.
>>521592723>singularity
>>521592723>In 5,000 years, self replicating machines could scour 5,000 lightyears of systems, perpetually self replicating and perpetually expanding. With no worries of biological constraints like time or the effect of near lightspeed travel on a biological body.Star trek wars really melting all of your fucking brains didn't it? Heck'n light speed time travelarino isn't even possible. There is a limit. Technology doesn't just advance forever and ever. Please grow the fuck up.
>>521597623> So you think there's advanced civilisations in the galaxy with a 100,000 or more headstart watching us now?Chances are there are civilizations with 100 million years or more head start in space exploration than what we have.> Or because of communication lag they're watching our past?They'll probably have advanced telescopic tech but probes are the gold standard because they can go into the field and report back with rich information.Our scientists have the technological ability to build solar gravitational lens telescopes (the most powerful telescope that we could ever create within known physics) and this would give us the ability to see the surfaces of exoplanets with extreme fidelity, almost like having a Google Map on near by planets.> How did the get the energies to launch those billions of probes to near lightspeed?Our Starshot program designs often propose using things such as lasers that will speed up the solar sail probes in large batches at a time to high speeds. Then they either move with inertia or they may have way of self-directing using solar sail manipulation and star light. There was a study that found that even with our low speed chemical rockets, our probe technology could reach every star system in about 100,000 years in large part because of the way the galaxy spins, effectively amplifying the speed of travel as star systems move towards the probes.
>>521597991>There is a limit. Technology doesn't just advance forever and ever.Im pretty sure people said that thousands of years ago. Theirs a lot more that we dont know than what we do know, we discover new shit every day. We dont even understand gravity.
>>521592723Because from singled cell organism to civilization takes about 4 billion years. And what are the odds of that happening elsewhere? Next to zero
>>521598097Next to 0 is a lot when there's a trillion stars in galaxies.
>>521598097The age of the observable universe is 13.8 billion years. Earth is 4.54 billion years old. Earliest signs of life show up 4.3 billion years ago, which also is a very hostile period in Earth's history. This means life tends to rise rapidly and tends to be very resilient.There is 100-400 billion star systems in our galaxy alone. There are over 2 trillion galaxies in the observable universe.The odds of life, and civilization, are extremely high given the sheer span of time and the near infinite resources.The only question is if alien civilization has risen in a locality that we can contact.
>>521598022Going back to your mention of light sail probes.Say one of these billions of probes gets discovered. Couldn't the civilisation that discovered it easily pinpoint where it came from? They'd just have to look at the trajectory, its speed and model the rotation of the galaxy.
>>521598393> Couldn't the civilisation that discovered it easily pinpoint where it came from? They'd just have to look at the trajectory, its speed and model the rotation of the galaxy.If it's purely inertia based, yes. If it has the ability to self-direct then no, you would have to either hack its computer or intercept and decrypt the messages (which might give clues) or track down every single relay probe to find the source.This probe strategy could give away the location of the civilization to any other sufficiently advanced and determined civilization.The very first civilization, though, would have no concern about this.
>>521598064>Im pretty sure people said that thousands of years ago.Wowie. I've NEVER heard that one before. While there is a big jump between discovering "fifi" and the internal combustion engine, making objects reach near lightspeed has more problems to solve than just being able to imagine it.>1) generating that amount of thrust>2) not getting sand blasted into oblivion by tiny specks of dust at that speed And if you say "worm holes" or fucking shields just jump off a bridge. You need to solve those two problems to even have a chance at "space exploration" and even then you need to sustain that speed for 4.2 years to reach the closest habitable planet according to the heck'n science. We are all dying on this rock like our ancestors before us. There is no space future. Act accordingly.
>>5215988091) Transfer consciousness to advanced computer construct.2) Upload consciousness to advanced space ship that travels well below the speed of light, and hibernate until you reach the star system destination.OR3) Transfer mind to laser relay station that lasers your mind across the cosmos at light speed until it reaches the desired laser receiver at another star system where it gets uploaded to a fully formed civilization built by AIs and robots sent decades, centuries, and millennia ago.
>>521599082>le upload muh consciousness That shit does not count. A computer program running "space faggot personality #9,420,069" is not (You)(You) will still die on this rock like your ancestors before you. Stop worrying about space bullshit and start worrying about the alarming levels of niggers, jeets, chinks and kikes taking up valuable space on THIS planet. NEXT
>>521594447>muh heckin dyson sphere!!!!BAZINGA!!! !
>>521592723Space is spreading faster than we can move from the center of the big bang, so we will thankfully never see the horrors that exist on the further edges of space.
>>521599376> A computer program running "space faggot personality #9,420,069" is not (You)Use nanites that slowly and progressively copy neuron information, kill the neuron, then take the neuron's place in the brain, over time the entire brain becomes a nanite brain, then transfer the digital information to a computer construct. Thus no copy is made, rather it is an intact consciousness and sense of self.> Stop worrying about space bullshit and start worrying about the alarming levels of niggers, jeets, chinks and kikes taking up valuable space on THIS planet.If everyone's a hyper intelligent digital consciousness, being served by near infinite AIs and robots, then race becomes obsolete and we can explore space.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UOYk5qT3ffo&list=RDUOYk5qT3ffo&start_radio=1
>>521595328>Considering there are exponentially more humans alive than there ever have been at once,flea brained nigger.
>>521599503>If everyone's a hyper intelligent digital consciousness, being served by near infinite AIs and robots, then race becomes obsolete and we can explore space.space is no nigger zone.
>>521592723Ever occur to you, that self-replicating autonomous carbon molecules that we so far consider impossible to occur naturally could be a form of "artificial intelligence", that you claim is no where to be found?Maybe every livable planet in Milkyway has long since been seeded with carbon "artificial intelligence"?It happened somewhere once. A civilization developed and cracked the "code". Then seeded the near impossible form of carbon molecules everywhere in the galaxy.
>>521599777Race will be obsolete at that point. Digital beings will be objectively superior to all organic beings.
>>521599850you wish faggot.
>>521599503>Use nanites that slowly and progressively copy neuron information, kill the neuron, then take the neuron's place in the brain, over time the entire brain becomes a nanite brain, then transfer the digital information to a computer construct. Thus no copy is made, rather it is an intact consciousness and sense of self.That shit ain't happening and like I said; A computer program running "space faggot personality #9,420,069" is not (You) >If everyone's a hyper intelligent digital consciousness, being served by near infinite AIs and robots, then race becomes obsolete and we can explore space.Why is everyone hyper intelligent in fantasy? Because they're consciousness is now digital? If their consciousness truly is "them" like you claim it is (it's not) then more than half the retards will just spend their digital consciousness in a digital brothel/opium den. Pic related; the future according to OP
>>521599410I dont even think AI would make it that far. I mean true thinking AI instead of whatever chatGTP style shit we can make. Alright, it conquers the universe, every star has a dyson sphere, every planet is broken down to is base elements, it can create its own suns to make even more dyson spheres, unlimited computational power. Then what? theres no point. better to just turn yourself off. Thats the most logical thing, id think. It wouldn't think like a human, it has no biological imperative to survive. Unless we make some half baked bullshit and its programing fucks up like the Xenon in the X game series, then the universe is fucked.
>>521599850>Race will be obsolete at that point.
>>521600012yeah they would have no need to go out and conquer anything. why not just play pong until the batteries go off? these nerds think the "a.i." would think like them in their star trek daydreams. they have no idea what it'd do.
Its all gotta start somewhere You think life was wondering if human intelligence could exist before it existed? And yet here you are in spite of the fact that prior to some point in time there were no humans
>>521600026it's a jeet thinking he'll stop being a saar. KEEP DREAMIN' JEET>pic related: a jeet in a the year 4000. race is still a very real thing. oh so real.
>>521600111checked
We are already in an AI machine. We are just echoes of the digital fingerprints we left behind
>>521592723Current history of our planet given the current accepted theories>Earth survived a collision event with an almost the same sized planet>Earth exists in a goldilock zone>the planet still has a working magnetic center>has a moon>has liquid water>Earth protected by two gas giants>Sun is in safe age ergo doesn't goes into a supernova nor schizophrenic type>Earth lives in a relatively passive solar zone ergo the fucking stars around us doesn't goes and snipe us with a cosmic rays or rape us with super novas>despite that the life on Earth survived 5 fucking mass extinction events 4 of them was not even caused life itself and these events are basically an ants fart on a solar scaleThis is just only our planet, to have a life which can attain intelligence and can engage on technology level sufficient to create an artificial intelligence working rocketry whilst not killing themselves for any reason is absolutely minimal.
>>521600906>is absolutely minimal.and do you know how big the fucking universe is?
>>521601008>oh but THE UNVIERSE IS INFINITEThen it's irrelevant we literally fucking trying to find a piss molecule in an ocean.
