I was just thinking about this. we all know that the top 3 companies in the US would be WWE, AEW, and TNA. however, I'm not really sure who the number four would be. There isn't really a clear leader among the smaller companies, although some are bigger than others. at one time it was probably GCW but they fell off quite a bit. at present, I can't really decide if it would be MLW, NWA, or JCW. all of them seem to be drawing around the same, at least from what I can tell. what does peedub think?
>>19726748probably mlw since they have a lot of reasonably well-known former wwe midcarders. most people wouldn't know anyone in nwa, gcw or jcw
>>19726748OVW is number four considering they’re literally the only American Promotion that is STILL conservative and traditionalist compared to all American Promotions
>>19726748NWA, GCW, MLW or JCW are the only actual answers you could make an argument for if you're only talking about American promotions.
>>19727651Nobody watches mlw
Tjpw
>>19726748Which one has a national tv deal or was closest to one? NWA. That's your answer. But...Which has most loyal and wide spread fan base ? JCW. The gap is closing fast. JCW is becoming hot and made for cheap late night tv slots
>>19726748TNA lol
>>19726748aew
ROH
NWA fell off so hard from where they were some years ago, so they can't be. So it's gonna be MLW or JCW whoever gets more youtube views for their full shows.
>>19727387Just looked up their roster and you're not wrong. Also wtf Dario is the GM there? Might need to actually watch this
>>19727873actually they've been making an impressive comeback since getting that roku deal. they only fell off because they got screwed and darth vader'd by the CW.
The fact GCW has been putting on weekly shows gives them the edge to me. Every other indie seems to just film 3 times a year, chop up the footage and then upload it an hour at time into the void. GCW, even if I’ve never liked a single match, is providing regular work. >>19727757I’ve watched and enjoyed MLW with the caveat that I have no idea when shows come out and I always fast forward past their lucha shit.
>>19726748JCW
>>19726748mlw because they don't cater to any one niche audience
>>19726748It's still GCW easily. Good house almost every weekend and solid PPV buys.
>>19726748Contenders >GCWBloodsport deal with WWE, big shows a few times a year, passionate fan base. Still some deathmatch shit, indieslop, and no TV deal.>MLWWWE retirement home, past it's prime, big names occasionally, where a lot of great wrestlers pick up attention before getting signed to a major promotion. No TV deal, shows get as low as 30-50 fans if no big names are on the card.>NWAOwned by rich money mark. Old skewl slop, few big names, mostly older guys "on their way up", some young women before they make it big. Not a lot of mainstream fan support, can't remember if they have a TV deal.>JCWlol no. They're getting a lot of hype though, depending on how this year goes I could see them taking over GCW has the big indie.Right now I would say number 4 is GCW. It's the main indie promotion that WWE lets signed talent (albeit shitters and jobbers) wrestle for.
>>19728864having a little bit of a working relationship with WWE is not the criteria here. we're talking about who draws the most, and it damn sure isn't GCW.
>>19728890GCW ran 75 shows in 2025, in terms of butts in seats they mog everyone else. MLW and NWA don't run anything close to that.
>>19728918the number of shows is also not the criteria. again, we are talking about who draws the most. is there any way that we can obtain some objective neutral data regarding show attendance? because every time I look at a GCW crowd it's the same little bunch of jersey shore mutants.
and by the way, WWE is willing to work with GCW a little bit, but that's the case for the same reason that they are willing to work with TNA. WWE, TNA, and GCW are all owned by members of a certain hooknosed middle eastern tribe.
>>19728924their show attendance is around the same as the other guys and they do way more shows jcw is gaining ground tho, will beat them if they get more momentum
>>19728975I think your info is outdated because GCW hasn't been drawing well for a long time. they were kinda big for a short time but then most people realized that GCW is terrible and that you have to be gay or a tranny to actually enjoy their slop.
>>19728988they were doing well then popped off then shit the bed then went back to doing welltheir crowds are deceptive compared to others because they're all standing room. if you put them all in one side of a small arena with seats it would fill a lot of it up
>>19728864Is jcw getting hype or is it just 1 guy bumping his thread's tho
>>19729028slow and steady, but it's there
>>19729017GCW has a small but very dedicated fanbase, that's why they run a lot of shows. however, I see zero growth from that company. all the other potential #4 feds have experienced some degree of growth in the last year. take one look at Youtube views and you will see that GCW is being absolutely mogged by JCW, NWA, and MLW. Lauderdale tied his brand to politics and that was his biggest mistake. well, that and getting sabu killed.
MLW because the CMLL connection
>>19729068GCW's YT is just clips, that's JCW's main show
>>19729098well can you point us toward some more reliable numbers? because this question cannot be settled without some objective data and I haven't been able to find much on that.
>>19729098NWA's YT is also just clips and selected matches, and they're getting way more views than GCW as well.
>>19729145there's nothing reliable for anything below aew
this is what GCW is getting on youtube. they're struggling to get even 1k on recent videos.
>>19729163that's what I am finding as well, all the sites that track these numbers are only tracking numbers for WWE, AEW, and sometimes TNA.
>>19729169here's the recent numbers for MLW
>>19726748In terms of quality WWE
One of you indiebros make a general for these feds. Like /puro/ or /joshi/ but for the other American feds. The /nwa/ general was cozy but not enough content to sustain it. NWA, GCW, MLW, JCW, and then whatever else together though there's more to post.
WOW has an argument for #3. They get more viewers than TNA does, just they only run one arena and do nothing but TV tapings.
>>19729190I thought Mistico was the biggest draw in Mexican history and definitely a bigger draw than Dom? I guess Dave was wrong again
>>19727757Their streams, somehow, always draw 100k views in total, sometimes a few ten thousands more. I'd say they're a strong contender for N°4, they earn more money than JCW, and they certainly draw more fans in than the corpses of ROH and NWA
>>19729307I like that idea, I might do that. I'm the guy who was making the videos for the NWA general and there just wasn't enough interest to sustain that general for more than a few days at a time.
>>19729354as usual, dave is wrong but it is true that mistico is a big draw in mexico. he definitely isn't the biggest draw in lucha history though, because that spot would belong to El Santo without any doubt. mistico doesn't seem to be nearly as big a draw in the US, probably because fewer people in the US know about him.
>>19729432I don't want to devolve this nice comfy thread into an indie consolewar, but it's not at all fair to call the NWA a corpse. A few years ago you would maybe be right but Billy has at least managed to make them relevant again. the fact that they are even in the conversation for #4 is serious progress compared to where they were in the 90s and early 2000s.
>>19729321really? I didn't know they were that big. aren't they on roku now?
>>19729627Nice. I will make an effort to contribute and keep it bumped if you do.
>>197267481. WWE (Powergap)2. AEW (Powergap)3. GCW4. MLW5. TNA
>>19729746GCW is not even close to #3 lol good bait tho
>>19729746TNA has been on TV for decades. GCW and MLW aren't sniffing a TV deal even if everyone else goes out of business tomorrow.
>>19729957Nah, I'd be surprised if they don't get TV deals soon with the media rights feeding frenzy going on.
>>19729028Violent J is serious about it now. Even if they get their crowds by doing ICP concerts at the shows, it doesn't matter if they get people in the door. Like yeah, I wasn't going to JCW Stranglemania Live tour because I thought ICP's bodyguard Billy Bill vs "Sharon Osbourne's Lawyer" Dick Nipple in a double tables deathmatch was going to be a banger, I was going because I liked ICP and Twiztid and it was Psychopathic's wrestling fed. But if their bottom line showed they made more profit in one tour than ECW or WCW made all year, they were the number two company behind WWF. So are they number four? They are if they make the money. Do they? That's the question.
>>19730006they don't always get their crowds from the concerts. ICP concert tickets and JCW tickets are usually sold separately and not every JCW show has a concert going on the same night.
>>19730109From what I heard, they just wrapped up a set of tapings for this month leading into Juggalo Weekend and ICP wasn't even doing a concert there. It was Ouija Macc, Green Jelly, and Wakko The Kidd. Speaking of Juggalo Weekend, there's going to a few tapings of JCW Lunacy at Juggalo Weekend including a free admission show the day before in Fort Lauderdale, Florida.
