Here is a thread for discussing the Warcraft RPG and associated Warcraft lore.What would you do with Alterac, Stromgarde, Stormwind, and Lordaeron to make them more distinct from Dalaran, Gilneas, and Kul Tiras?
>be me>make conlangs>don't know where to post
>>92463814Geography affects culture and society.>AlteracMountainous by far more than the others, higher altitude, more isolationist/independent. Depends a lot on where in the time-line you have your game taking place of course; Alterac when it was a proper Kingdom would have some traditions, some local mythology about their banners coming up into the ranges to chase the Trolls from "Human" lands for good. Post-Horde invasion though, major spike in criminal activity with the formal government crushed by its former neighbors, major grievances with the other human kingdoms for roasting them, anger at King Perenold for trying to treat with the Orcs rather than their Alliance, etc. Fewer people in the latter, more a fortress of banditry than a national centerpiece. Either way, take a look at the Basques residing in the mountains between France and Spain, and that should give Plenty of inspiration.>StromgardePre-horde invasion Stromgarde should probably be a Major powerhouse. Lots of farmland potential, open highlands with little danger from the south (only one choke point to hold) and allies+trading partners to the north and the west. Amani empire is an old enemy, one they regularly have to hassle with and chase back into the hills, but otherwise they have fantastic potential for conventional Knights, Mounted Cavalry, a couple of cities or at least several large towns as farming amalgamations. Lacks a major trade Port however, so they're technically a Regional influence rather than anything that could stretch past Khaz Modan or past the Alterac mountains. Hillsbrad might be a mid-range point of contention with Lordaeron.
>>92463814I would wipe out all of them except for Stormwind and Gilneas, so that I didn't have to put in any actual work.Also, I would just make Gilneas monsters, like vampires or mummies or something.Oh, wait, we can keep Kul Tiras too. I'll just never do anything with it for years, but if I ever do, I'll just lean ridiculously into that whole 'navy' thing.
>>92464206>Alterac Humans are criminal BasquesI dont know how did I not notice that Syndicate is Mafia version of ETA, you could even paint their masks orange and they would fit right in
>>92464206>LordaeronControl of the coasts, several major internal water-ways (Lake Lordamere, Lake Darrowmere, the rivers associated with them, lends to a lot of their fortitude and extended claims of land. Stromgarde has more Knights, but Lordaeron can field a bigger actual Army, as well as having a more united religious front with The Light in tandem with good relations with Dalaran & Silvermoon for magical support/know how in a pinch. Not enough for it to provide Infrastructure, but enough that they have some court mages and aren't completely at a loss for anything supernatural without The Guardian on hand. The extended lands will lead to a more cosmopolitan population. The Light helps hold that together. Before Stormwind, Lordaeron would've been exemplar of the WoW human racial of diplomatic bonuses because they're having to get along with everyone, but by doing so they're holding the Alliance, or at least its predecessors, together. >StormwindStormwind is a Huge outlier by the way the WoW map puts them in isolation. They don't have the other Kingdoms to lean on, they don't have the Deep Run Tram to connect them until post-horde-invasions, they have every reason to be a Very different bunch of people prior to that point. They, like Stromgarde, have a lot of good land for their agriculture, but Redridge gives them iron-rich red dirt hills, while Elwynn and Westfall are fantastic bread-baskets. The big kicker that differentiates them is that Elwynn and Westfall actually have viable coasts for ports, and Ironforge is Still their closest viable ally. Stormwind's culture really pushes less against any one race or culture, and more against piracy from the southern cape. Their heartlanders would be fairly chill, but everybody hates the renegades that opt to head south into the jungles and take their chances making their name.
Quel Thalas, Gil Neas, and Kul Tiras seem to be connected. Perhaps Quel/Gil/Kul means something like island or peninsula, or any land with great marine potential? Tiras also appears to be connected to Tiris-fal.
>>92464311I can almost understand what you mean with Gilneas and Kul'Tiras being associated (Gilneas is that green peninsula, while Kul'Tiras is the Island chain controlled by their navy) but Quel'Thalas is a pretty big distance from both of them, and the Elves pulled some bullshit that makes it hard to get to it without going through the main gates (Or so a GM told me when I asked wtf happened because I tried to swim to elf-land from Lordaeron).Really, the big split between Gilneas and Kul'Tiras is that Gilneas can hold its own as a high-ground castle kingdom. They've got a port, but I suspect they handle more ship-building for Kul'Tiras than actual naval capacity; their own people are somewhat hinterland bound, and there's a line of mountains that separates their border from Lordaeron's. Though it's weird as hell that Stromgarde's got those two islands out there to Gilneas' west, but I think they got used as an Australia sorta place, toss the undesirables out there sorta situation? Damnit, fine I'm booting up my goddamn game, one second.
>>92464385Alright, a log-in and a bit of wiki-walking later>StromgardeStromgarde was the premier human civilization for a while, first major power among their number, and Tol Barad (those little islands they claim) were built up back then. Stromgarde got worn down by a bit of over-extension and local domestic problems in the Arathi Highlands. Stromgarde is probably going to have a lot of Old Honors & Heritage that doesn't quite shine with the same polish it once had, all the way to the tragic ruins that are most of what's left of it in modern WoW. Those islands were also major staging grounds of the Alliance when the Horde came northward the first time. Not a whole lot still there in terms of historical value, but after the horde's invasion ruined it, it got somewhat repurposed as a prison for the Kirin Tor (Dalaran) and the Wardens (Night-elf jailers of things that need to be bottled up.)
>>92464385Etymology can be often shrouded by layers of change accumulated over generations of speakers. Many fantasy games rely on names made of two parts and Warcraft is no outlier to this trend. You'll notice most places follow this trend: first the terrain is defined and then a name is attached. Further inspection reveals that the three places I've listed seem to share a suffix -as. I'm propositioning that the three geographical locations share a linguistic background.
>>92464499From what little lore I recall>Quel'Thalas stems from the Quel'Dorei (high-born) elves that lived there.>Gilneas I'm really not sure.>Tiresfal seems to pull from creation-myth levels of background information, as it is where Tyr, of the ancient Titans, fell. It's also where the institution of The Guardian began IIRC, but I'm not as sure of that one. Kul'Tiras probably draws something similar, though the What of Tyr that Kul is supposed to mean I'm not sure.
>>92464550You have to admit that Quel, Kul, and Gil sound similar, and that Thalas, Neas, and Tiras end in -as.
>>92463814>StormwindI've often wondered about this. Up until the Horde shows up, their closest neighbors are the Dwarves and the Gurubashi Trolls. Assuming they broke off from Arathor a couple of centuries after the Troll Wars, several questions arise.>Did they travel by land or by sea?>How did they initially treat the Gurubashi, and did that ever change?>What was their reaction to the War of the Three Hammers (which was only 230 years before the Dark Portal)?Given prior antagonism, I can't imagine the founders of the Wrynn line would have been happy about the Gurubashi being there, but the Gurubashi (unlike the Amani) don't necessarily hold lands humans would want to live in. They've got the tropical swamp and rainforest of the southern tip of the Eastern Kingdoms, whereas nearby Brightwood, Elwynn, Westfall, and the Wetlands are bizarrely temperate. Shouldn't they at least be subtropical?Anyway, I can imagine the initial Vrykul/Arathorian styling of their culture taking on a number of Dwarvish (and even Gurubashi to a somewhat/much lesser extent depending on relations as time goes on) aspects. Interestingly, their closest Dwarven neighbors are the Dark Irons, led by Clan Thaurissan. This might mean that said clan actually has some backing from Stormwind during the War of the Three Hammers, pressing the "we live right next to you and control ALL of your overland trade routes" button to summon the Wrynn king of the day's aid. This probably wouldn't affect the war's conclusion too much, so with the emergence of Ragnaros, Stormwind would be cut off from overland travel to the north entirely.This goes one of two ways. Either they intensify overseas trade with other Human kingdoms in the aftermath, or they start placating the Gurubashi to secure their southern border after the loss of resources and allies to the north. Who knows how that affects Stormwind culture?
>>92464676I think that we should think of Stormwind settlers akin to dutch boers before the arrival of the brits. Few but resilient people in a hostile land, in which their culture was shaped by the fact they're isolated from the rest of their civilisation.
>>92464206You're making me think a little bit of Bretonnia with that description of StromgardeAlthough wasn't it mentioned the Stromics were adept at mountain climbing?
>>92464271>>92464206I think Stromgarde would have some earth based shamans akin to the tidespeakers of Kul Tiras. There's the Circle of Elements and Stromgarde seems like it would have a lot of Vrykul influence given that they were the original human descendants of the Vrykul. And since Vrykul have shamanism, Strom probably has some Vrykul influence in that area too.
>>92464740>BretonWhy is this so common in fantasy games?
He did nothing wrong
>>92465100Sadly he did. By an attempt to exterminate undeath he went down the rabbit hole.
So what's the lore reason for Warlocks being accepted in the Horde and Alliance during the post-Wc3/start of Vanilla WoW time period?Like I get the Forsaken are down to do whatever it takes to put themselves ahead, but why is Thrall letting Orcish Warlocks slum it in the Cleft of Shadows?The Gnomes having Warlocks 8s understandable since they seem to have a recklessness about them when they discover new sources of power.But are Human PC's supposed to be portrayed as Warlocks posing as Mages?
>>92465199Human warlock trainers hide in a basement.
>>92465199Theres no reason other than blizz wanted playable warlocks. Edgy shit was popular back in the 90's and early 2000s so they needed something to appeal to the trend.
>>92465199IIRC, the remaining Orc Warlocks told Thrall they'd use their experience with demons to help suss out any attempts to put the Orcs back under the Legion's control, and that convinced him they were too useful to kill off.
There’s an incomplete wiki called Vanilla WoW that was helpful in splitting the lore between Warcraft 1-Classic and later.Much stronger focus on what each races does rather than the convoluted backstory/history.
>>92465199There isnt really a good answer, but the first Warlock that showed up in the upon i believe was on an alliance warship in one of the books. Right next to King Varian, in fact. And Varian always struck me as a pragmatic no nonsense kind of guy. So with the grand war against the horde being waged everywhere, i can totally see him allowing the more resonable and trustworthy warlocks practicing their craft for the good of the alliance. They are a powerful asset, after all. Just dont step out of line and get any funny ideas, or you might get an SI:7 visit while you sleep.
>>92463814>What would you do with Alterac, Stromgarde, Stormwind, and Lordaeron to make them more distinct from Dalaran, Gilneas, and Kul Tiras?For Stromgarde, i would embrace the fact that they are the very first human empire. Its where all the other kingdoms came from, so you should still find small traces that hint at cultural developements embraced by the other nations to a much stronger degree. Like being the first human nation that made use of arcane magic. Yes, Dalaran did it better later one, but Stromgarde was first (and more strict in its laws). Same goes with the light. Yes, Lordaeron might have been the light powerhouse, but it probably started in old Strom. So you should find various old monuments of the stromic glory days. "This is lord this and that, who founded the gilnean colony. And over here is lady such and such, who led the first grand expedition south, to what would later become Stormwind." Furthermore, give them a nordic or scottish vibe. Trollbane has been depicted in the old artworks as pretty much a fur clad barbarian with a giant axe and a horned helmet. The highlands (scottish highlands?) are clustered with stone circles like Stonehenge. So give them some vrykulian shaman inspired cults.
>>92464967Because Arthurian myth and legend.
>>92466098What about Alterac?They were the rivals of Stromgarde and fought wars with them, yet despite the large difference in power between the two kingdoms, Alterac seemed to be considered a rival.I imagine the Alteraci as being more politically underhanded and sneaky, and that's how they were always able to match Stromgarde in a defensive war. Like the Lannisters.
>>92466485I would make Alterac a former economic power with connections everywhere. Keep in mind that they are essentialy the gatekeeper to the northern half of Lordaeron, unless you want to take the great detour around the lake. With coffers filled with border taxes, they might have regulary made us of various merc groups. And once the nation went to shit and the nobility went mafia, those connections where still in place to enhance the syndicates fighting strenght.
>>92464206>take a look at the Basques residing in the mountains between France and SpainTake a look at Armenia too
>>92464206>Pre-horde invasion Stromgarde should probably be a Major powerhouse.Nah it was already declining power and Stormwind (shitton of even more fertile land+trade with dwarves) and Lordaeron (trade with elves) were rising stars
Enough about these stale human kingdoms. What about the situation the horde finds itself in at the end of warcraft 3? The orcs are stuck in a red desert cause thrall thinks thats what draenor was like when it wasn't. The humans are stuck in a deadly swamp, the trolls at least have a tiny tropical island to inhabit and the tauren, while retaking their homeland are under constant threat from the centaur.How exactly is the horde supposed to make this place livable?
>>92465199>So what's the lore reason for Warlocks being accepted in the Horde and Alliance during the post-Wc3/start of Vanilla WoW time period?1) Blizzard was too lazy to make more than 2 factions2) Christie Golden mained human female warlock
>>92467853Irrigation, fishing and overseas tradedon't forget that Durotan is a coastal region, so they need to take as much advatage of that as they can
>>92467853>How exactly is the horde supposed to make this place livable?What do you mean?Orcs and trolls are much harsher than centaurs and Taurens are native to central Kalimdor. If Centaurs or quilboars prosper there Horde wouldn't have much of a problem.
>>92467884>orcs>farming anything besides meatI don't think you understand how orcs work.
>>92467893The centaurs are nomadic and the quillboar have their weird bramble terraforming. It doesn't matter how harsh you are if you live in a desert and theres nothing to eat. I doubt you can make a functional sedentary society based entirely off of boar breeding.
>>92465199>So what's the lore reason for Warlocks being accepted in the Horde and Alliance during the post-Wc3/start of Vanilla WoW time period?They weren't much.Thrall kept warlocks in Orgrimmar because he wanted to keep them closer to his reach rather then let them run around Kalimdor. Alliance warlocks always were hidding.Warcraft TTRPG mentions that most of the warlocks are loyal to themselves (arcane corruption) or to Burning Legion and "uncorrupted warlock" is rather exception
>>92467853It gets even weirder when you remember that during Vanilla (or the years between WC3 and Vanilla), the Horde had a thriving slave economy (which implied the infrastructure for it).Remember that time Varian was an amnesiac gladiator slave owned by Rehgar Earthfury, who is a close friend of Thrall? Granted, he owned Varian (and Broll) for maybe a couple of months (and Valeera for slightly less time than that) but still. That's weird, isn't it?
>>92467949>and theres nothing to eat.But there are quilboars and centaurs around.>based entirely off of boar breeding.And fish (including murlocs) and kodo and thunder lizards
>>92467965>the Horde had a thriving slave economyBecause they had gladiators?Also, anyway it makes sense, since due to amount of Kul'Tiras PoWs humans and elves needed a certain legal status within the Horde
>>92467949>I doubt you can make a functional sedentary society based entirely off of boar breeding.It's not like Horde had too many mouths to feed.DarkSpear was a minor troll tribe which lived on isolated isles. Taurens were on the edge of extinction when Thrall arrived. And Orcs consisted of 2 clans who lived in constant guerilla war with Alliance and orcs they freed from camps and all of them suffered casualties in the Third war
>>92465199Thrall knows that Orcs will practice Warlockery one way or another, so he lets them think they can do it under his nose and feel like big shots leading to blunders like Neeru Fireblade. And hey, some of them remain relatively loyal to the Horde so win-win.
>>92467853>How exactly is the horde supposed to make this place livable?By taking wood from Ashenvale. That's why they end up in constant conflict with the Night Elves that has escalated so far that they play capture the flag about it (oh and killed their demigod over it).
>>92467975You can't make an entire sedentary society out of wild game hunting either.
>>92468120While wood is certainly a useful resource, you can't eat it.
>>92468195That's what the boars are for, but they also make use of scorpid flesh and cactus apples.The real head-scratcher is how they get their water because there's like two tiny puddles in Durotar, their one "river" is just the ocean pretty much and the Barrens oases, while having some depth to them, are under constant Centaur occupation and I can't imagine could provide for the surrounding settlements' massive populations.
>>92468285Mountains between Ogrimmar and Azshara
>>92468285The river? You mean the southfury? Thats definitely not just the ocean and perfectly suitable for drinking water. And I've said before you can't build a sedentary society off of boar breeding and wild game hunting.
How would you make a Haunted Mills "dungeon"? The fields are open ground with the mills and such. Maybe it's a case of the Darrow fuckers are milling about and you have to make the route yourself to reduce the time spent crossing the fields filled with mindless deadSystem wise, Drums of War has an alpha or beta PDF floating around
>>92468797>DarrowAgamand, fuck
>>92463814>Alterac:Make them mountainous Connecticut/Switzerland. No armies; but money, big names, prestige. Big expensive manors and if there are troops, they're well equipped mercenaries. Extremely small area densely packed with manor holdings.>Stromgarde:Maybe a bit high on themselves. Lineage, lineage, lineage. BIG name heroes on every tapestry. Intense hatred of trolls. Faded glory for sure, but that doesn't mean their few knights aren't extremely effective. Most everything concentrated in a single holding on the map.>Stormwind:Essentially early U.S colonies. Their isolation and rugged individualism made them who they are. Lots of innovation, free thinking, varied population. Huge access to mass resources. Many small holdings dotted across the territories. Intense fear of another invasion. Lots of local heroes and legends.>Lordaeron:Most powerful humans on the map. Lots of alliances. Elves in the streets and on the roads. Big armies, big estates. Wealth aplenty.
>>92467853>How exactly is the horde supposed to make this place livable?Not at all. They're the Horde. If they were a civilization they wouldn't be called a horde. Thrall was the only one with any inkling about what it's like to make life better. Orcs tough it out and don't build anything.
>>92468285I remember there being plenty of farms in both durotar and the barrens. The southfury is freshwater. Remember that kalimdor is like 98% untamed wilderness, so competition for resources is basically nothing (in the scheme of kingdoms/empires/mass holdings competing for fertile land and or water)
how would you expand on the bare bones lore the Void Elves got? Curiously they seem to cooperate suprisingly well with the army of the light, their total opposites when it comes to powers used.
>>92469368For pre invasion or post WC3?
>>92469528From the moment of their creation in end of Legion onwards, i guess.
>>92464243Congratulations, you've just made WoW timeline before WoW timeline. You should add that Gilneas for some reason are all Worgen before the events of WC I too.
>>92469551If you're lacking ideas, a better question might be, do you have to have them in your game? There's a million other things in this setting to flesh out and draw interest on.
>>92469578>If you're lacking ideas, a better question might be, do you have to have them in your game?Im not quite having a warcraft game on the horizon, but should we ever have one, chances are the boys will be interested in playing in the current timeline of retail, with its variety of playable races. So having void elves come up isnt all that unlikely.
>>92469368Night elves were already the dark wood and wood dark elves of the setting.
>>92469368The concept of void-corrupted elves within Alliance ranks is retarded. More retarded is only that Alleria, being Turalyon's wife, became a walking void aberration.Not to mention how bad they want to be reintroduced to Quel'Thalas, not caring that their presence somewhere near Sunwell itself may cause it to become a literal black hole, swallowing the world whole.
>>92463814Shouldn't the Dark Iron Clan hold more territory than just the Blackrock mountain?I mean they are all over the are in WoWWhat's supposed to be in all this unclaimed space?
>>92470292I mean given that they seem to have lost the War of Three Beards (or at least, lost the most out of it) i could see them having a rough time in terms of aboveground territory, but they probably have a pretty expansive subeterranean set of holdings beyond the "borders" of blackrock.Anyway, Dark Iron Women.
>>92463814Offtopic question:Has anyone encountered a RP server (especially unofficial ones), where the gameplay was basically RPG session in game?
>>92469368At this point you might as well homebrew your own raceCoal Goblins for example had a single sentence describing them in one of the books but they do sound interesting enough to get more fleshed out. Maybe they even have their own Coal Hobgoblins.How about introducing dark elves, as the missing link between night elves and dark trolls? Say that they somehow got isolated from the well while they were still in the proccess of mutating>>92469571Pretty sure that was the intentThough Stromgarde did get restored in BfA but they didn't really expand on it after that. They'd probably make them a 1:1 copy of Romans or some lame shit like that
>>92470364I don't know if you've seen the roadmap for future expansions. They won't bother with it that much, since everything heads towards ending World-Soul thing into formation of the Azeroth titan.So far the only thing I got about another expansion after The War Within, is that somehow all elves will be united int one faction.
>>92470292They hold the searing gorge and blasted lands too
>>92470349>i could see them having a rough time in terms of aboveground territoryWhy would they?Does anyone else occupy it? There is the Thorium Brotherhood but how old is it?>>92470568Then the OP map is false.
>>92470358What do you mean by "basically RPG sessions"? Like guided plots by a DM?
>>92470703Yup.An characters acting basically as overglorified figurines, that use addon as sorta character sheet.
>>92463814Pleasantly surprised to see that well over a decade after WoW's peak, there is still a dedicated Warcraft lore/story thread on 4chan. I stopped caring about WoW's story after WoD but still love the aesthetics and gameplay, about to resub to prepare for the MoP remix.>>92463814>Alterac, Stromgarde, Stormwind, and LordaeronI think Stormwind is fine as is. I remember there being an interview with the WoW devs where they said that they had actually wanted to go to Outland early on, but they decided that players needed to start in a mundane, familiar setting like Elwyn forest or the Barrens before progressing into increasingly fantastical worlds. Stormwind serves its purpose as being a generic starting kingdom, the issue being that the game went on for 20 years and Blizzard placed all of the good services there like transmog and reforging and portals so that's where people camped at for 20 years, and Stormwind just isn't flavorful enough to last that long.My impression of Lordaeron from the WC3 cinematics was that it was supposed to be majestic, with the beautifully carved stone architecture. Like Rome but medieval, maybe gothic architecture, vs Stormwind which is more wooden and basic.>>92465100>He did nothing wrongAs pragmatic as preemptively slaughtering people before they turn is (and not enough time had passed for everyone to eat the bread, it's possible only a fraction of the town might have turned), it's still murder and wrong. The morally right thing to do would have been to have quarantined people in their homes and then only kill people after they have turned.1/2
>>92465199>what's the lore reason for Warlocks being accepted in the Horde and Alliance during the post-Wc3/start of Vanilla WoW time period?They're not. Warlocks being a prevalent player class ≠ their prevalence in lore. The Alliance population worships the right and abhors anything to do with demons or the shadow. The Warlock class trainer in Stormwind was practicing in secret in a basement underneath an inn. Warlocks had more history in the Horde but they were still practicing in the Cleft of Shadows out of sight, and then in MoP they all got executed. Wilfred Fizzlebang at the Argent Tournament was a seemingly pleasant person, but he was a warlock and when he died no one mourned his passing and people said he deserved it.>>92465199>why is Thrall letting Orcish Warlocks slum it in the Cleft of Shadows?IIRC in vanilla there was a questline about a Burning Blade sect in Orgrimmar whose leader Thrall suspected of plotting a revolution, but Thrall didn't arrest him and was instead keeping tabs on him. Could be the same thing with the Warlocks in the Cleft of Shadows where he thought that maybe they might not be that bad, or maybe he could extract more information out of them if he kept having them under surveillance rather than just executing them. Then Garrosh did just that.>>92465199>are Human PC's supposed to be portrayed as Warlocks posing as Mages?Probably. There is no way anyone could be waltzing around Stormwind with a demon by their side or casting green fire magics without horrifying people around them and getting an unpleasant visit from the paladins/Church of the Light/Stormwind guard.2/3
>>92465271>Theres no reason other than blizz wanted playable warlocks.Also this. Metzen didn't want Death Knights to be playable, but he was overruled because the other devs thought it'd be cooler. Metzen didn't want High Elves in the Horde but again got overruled. When you look at the behind the scenes planning process for WoD, the devs wanted to do an expansion about Garrosh gathering up minor races like Troggs, Quillboar, Gnolls, etc, and forming a mongrel Horde, and only went with the alternate universe Iron Horde because someone convinced them that was cooler.>>92467853>The orcs are stuck in a red desert cause thrall thinks thats what draenor was like when it wasn't.In a Cata short story, Garrosh asks a woman in Orgrimmar why they are living this way in the desert, and she tells him it's because Thrall decided that his people needed to repent. That starts pushing Garrosh's disillusionment with Thrall and his dream of uplifting the Orcs and turning them into a mighty empire, with the rebuilding of Orgrimmar as a iron city being his first move towards that.>>92467853>How exactly is the horde supposed to make this place livable?They have shamans who can call upon water elementals, and then in Vanilla WoW, Tauren got retconned into being druids, so they could help green up the place too. Really with shamans and druids the Barrens and Durotar could have been turned into fertile farmland.>>92468285>The real head-scratcher is how they get their water because there's like two tiny puddles in Durotar, their one "river" is just the ocean pretty much and the Barrens oases, while having some depth to them, are under constant Centaur occupation and I can't imagine could provide for the surrounding settlements' massive populations.The world is supposed to be larger than what is represented ingame. It is possible that in lore, only parts of the riverbanks are under hostile control, or there are more rivers branching off from the Southfury, etc.3/4
>>92470358>Has anyone encountered a RP server (especially unofficial ones), where the gameplay was basically RPG session in game?I have. Moon Guard has guild and server organized RP campaigns, with events having 300 people show up and then a dozen DMs branch off dragging 5 to 20 players with them and then they /roll 20 while alt+tabbing back and forth between spreadsheets that list their abilities and traits and the DM describes what's going on, like an invasion of Rothide Gnolls in Lordaeron who spreading plagues and people nearly being drowned by sludge elementals. Most of these events are scripted with the DM having laid out the goal (stop this lava elemental from reaching our encampment. Assassinate this Djaradin general. Steal this void artifact from this Gnoll encampment that is driving them crazy. Etc), but there was one unscripted event I had been in where players were making stuff up as they went along and the DM went along with it and was there to referee the abilities/traits and whisper information to people who rolled high. If you're interested then join the various Moon Guard RP discords. The one I'm thinking of that does the huge week long 200+ player RP campaigns is Warcraft Conquest, they do one campaign once every 1 or 2 months but the guilds involved also do their own smaller events and with other guilds too.
>>92470740i did encounter people making character sheets and working pretty heavy with dice rolls and ability bonus in a plot, but that was just one guild and only in their personal guild plots. And that was back in Legion. So its not a common thing. You would have to look around and hope to either find an existing group or make one yourself
>>92470966Here's an example of how many people show up at these campaigns. This was several days into a campaign, after a lot of people had stopped attending.
>>92470987another campaign 6 months later, again several days in
>>92470966Was that an official one?>>92470974I've played on the private server akin to what >>92470966 described, but with far less people. But still, mechanics could be busted, since everything was in server's DMs timestamps and character sheets.Too bad that when I mentioned it anywhere on /tg/, people don't consider it any RP experience.
>>92469368I would retcon the void elves out of existence. Fucking retarded concept.
>>92471048Same here. Blizzard just wanted to add High Elves into Alliance ranks without making them redundant recolor of Blood Elves.
>>92470987huh, odd but interesting
>>92470887>only went with the alternate universe Iron Horde because someone convinced them that was cooler.Boy I bet they regret that decision, not that they would've been able to execute the mongrel horde better.
>>92471013>Was that an official one?Yeah Moon Guard is a retail server. AFAIK Moon Guard is the biggest RP server for any MMO. You have access to 20 years of transmogs, mounts, elixirs, foods, engineering items, and toys to augment your character, and there are robust tools like Total RP or the party markers to facilitate the RP. I've checked out LotRO, but there just aren't as many tools there, and there is just so little flexibility in the lore there compared to WoW. GW2 had some RP, but again less tools, and there weren't factions, when faction identity is so important for RPers and guilds to rally behind. I also checked FF14 but there is no serious RP scene there like on Moon Guard. You don't see 200 Flame Centurions marching through Ul'dah on their way to an RP event to fight Ixal or a made up Garlean Legion. It's just coffee shop RP or prostitution.
>>92471063>Blizzard just wanted to add High Elves into Alliancehigh elf posters are the Qanon schizos of wow forums. They've spent years begging for a race that was added in the first expansion of the game
>>92471102I heard someone saying that Argent Dawn EU is larger in total number of roleplayers, but i dont know how legit that is. US has its split between moon guard and wyrmrest, EU is devided between AD and the german + french one. Dont know if the other languages have similiar large rp realms
>>92471102I guess this is what the server I was playing on wanted to be. But it wasn't for everyone, since typical WoW player from my country mostly played either retail or private high rates. So basically to have an account there, you had to send an application that showed DMs your basic grasp of RP. Also, at some point they were making some minor changes into the lore.Of course, all of this is long gone, with no trace of its existence except of few outdated mentions in old posts of some forums.
>>92470769>As pragmatic as preemptively slaughtering people before they turn is (and not enough time had passed for everyone to eat the bread, it's possible only a fraction of the town might have turned), it's still murder and wrong. The morally right thing to do would have been to have quarantined people in their homes and then only kill people after they have turned.No. This is cope. The grain had been distributed before they arrived so there was no realisstic way to determine of anyone had or had not eaten it. A quarantine would have required a prolonged military occupation of the city by the army that was already dealing with hordes of ravenous undead directed by necromancers butchering their way through the kingdom. The city was also under direct assault by Mal'Ganis and his necomancers and undead at the same time, who were breaking down doors and force-converting people into undead, so there was no time to establish a quarantine and they'd have lost half the city attempting to enact one while also fighting the dreadlord's forces, and taking casualties all the while.Arthas made the correct decision, he was just so stressed and worn down that he explained the situation very poorly to Uther at the time. But Uther and Jaina neither proposed nor attempted any alternatives. They were too craven to try something themselves, and too arrogant to demean themselves by helping enact the only viable solution that was presented at the time.Nothing Arthas did after leaving to Northrend was the right move, but everything he did before that was correct.
>>92465100Its a meme, but actually he did plenty wrong. Especially if we judge his actions without the knowledge of hindsight. >we sucked in his role as authority figure for he could not keep Uther and Jaina in line>he failed to properly explain the severity of the situation and how he came to his drastic solution>his very first suggestion action is a mass purge, which makes him seem unhinged and unstable>instead of asking for alterantive options or council, he threw a temper tantrumhe failed at leadership big time
>>92470358Long ago in vanilla, there was a PVPRP server that was literally nothing but pen and paper rp's turned wow players. It was a blastMuch easier to RP when the game didn't make your character "legends, savior of the universe, gods among men." I'm a female paladin refugee from the scarlet crusade. Leave me alone, blizzard.
>>92471274I feel you bro.The only WoW lore-related accomplishment of my main character (I have few others), was to participate in defeating Zul'jin and Amani in general. Other encounters were rather concepts of the DMs that were leading group's plot.
>>92463814Where can I download all of Warcraft The Roleplaying Game PDF's? Anyone have a link?
>>92471218Why did Jaina even fuck such a psycho
>>92471218I've always thought that maybe Arthas would do better if he convinced Uther for military blockade of Stratholme, to prove that he's right. This way maybe a fight with Mal'ganis would be harder, with all that masses of zombie canon fodder, but he wouldn't lose Uther and Silver Hand's support.
>>92471191>The city was also under direct assault by Mal'Ganis and his necomancers and undead at the same time, who were breaking down doors and force-converting people into undead, so there was no time to establish a quarantine and they'd have lost half the city attempting to enact one while also fighting the dreadlord's forces, and taking casualties all the while.Keep in mind that the alliance didnt knew that. All they knew was that Mal Ganis was said to be inside of Stratholme by word of Kel Thuzad. But when arriving at the city, it wasnt in flames, there are no ghouls in the streets and no abominations killing people. All arthas saw when making the choice to purge was some infected people. Thats it. That was the amount of information he had to form his course of action around
>>92466098>The highlands (scottish highlands?) are clustered with stone circles like Stonehenge. So give them some vrykulian shaman inspired cults.I was actually thinking of some sort of Grail Damsel-esque sisterhood in Stromgarde. Grail Damsels wield both Beasts and Life magic. I'm not sure what the WoW analogues would be. I originally wrote them as being followers of the old Vrykul Way that secluded themselves after the Light became more popular, but I'm not sure how well that would work.
In terms of the lore, what race makes the best slaves?
>>92471909Orcs. The ogres had them, the Legion had them, the legions puppets had them, the Humans had them, the legions remnant had them again. Its like a constant porno, luke. And they were good friends.
>>92471951Nah, orcs are too rebellious. Having orc slaves turned out poorly for all those people.
>>92471306Biggest accomplishment during our time was the invasion of stromgarde. Was so much fun, must have taken 6 hours. Hit and runs into the lost city, along with the laughter as we barely survived the constant respawns.Had another time in the sunken temple, where we had to hunt one of the summoning shamans as a boss from our hinterlands campaign. great memories in that dungeon. The old team speak button noise is forever in my head
>>92472193Our war with Amani was spread though multiple sessions. Our guild started as rag-tag bunch of different elves that got tired of government's inaction towards Amani, and then it turned into special military unit.Pic related is my AI gen of what my character was intended to look like.
>>92471895>Beasts and LifeYou're looking for Druids, yeah.
>>92463814Did they ever make a map like this but kalimdor before the orcs arrived?
>>92469368First things first, I would try to focus more on the fact that the reason Void Elves even exist in the first place is because of the scholarly pursuit of forbidden magic (Void Magc) and them being banished for said pursuit of that particular type of knowledge/magic. Overall, The Void Elves are more or less structured similarly to the militaristic Silver covenant, but instead of being a vanilla High Elf flavored faction, they are "Void" flavored High Elves with no actual downsides to dealing with the Void. This is especially egregious because instead of focusing on their scholarly origins, they got shoehorned into an already established role within the various subfactions of the Alliance (High Elven Rangers/Magisters). To correct this, they need to be taken towards an angle that reflects their pre-established origins of scholars and magisters who have been banished due to their pursuit of "forbidden" and "dark" knowledge/magic. Their entire organizational structure needs to mirror the archeological/scholarly cult aspects that you commonly see within Lovecraftian-style tales. There are already hints that those who have undergone changes to become a Ren'dorei are in a constant struggle with whispers from the void that test their sanity. So why not push further on that as well? The Ren'dorei as a whole are shown to mentally stable to such a degree that their merging with the void might as well not even exist when it's already established that even the lowest of Void-worshipping cultists grow insane due to their dealings with the Void and its aberrations.
>>92471102>Moon Guard is the biggest RP server for any MMO.>RPЩa cщгкыy
>>92471379Here you go brohttp://telivan.cool/Pages/Archival/Wowrpg/Wowrpg%20archive.html
>>92471408It was him or Kael'thas and Jaina isn't into twinks
>>92470358Ah there used to be, Prologue/Legacy. Insta max level, WotLK core, free for all pvp unless grouped, stats were all contained in necklaces based on pvp season gear so you could wear whatever, permadeath not just from DM decree but also pvp with an execute/capture mechanic when you beat them but you needed a proper impetus to kill someone or they could refund it, no mindless ganking. GMs were DMs and could puppet modules off the bat at anytime, or have ongoing plotlines to sign up ahead of time for, and the servers would undergo occasional world resets to change the setting, usually going through the plotlines of an early expansion.It was, of course, completely ridden with drama and degeneracy. But boy was it glorious, especially when you found a circle of dank lads to share group concepts with.
>>92475084Thank you very much!
>>92473448I wonder if it's possible for both shamanism and druidic magics in one person for an order like that ...and I realize I'm getting closer to Med'an.
>>92476137there shouldnt be any cosmic law that prevents a person from using both forms of magic. They dont negate each other or anything. But yes, they do put you close to special snowflake territory.
>>92476536Elf Priests in WC3 were Mage-Priests in the alpha and are called Mage-Priests in some WoW instancesI think wielding 2 different magics is a little snowflakey but acceptable. Like Valyrian steel swords in ASOIAF.3 is way too much, and 4 is deviantart tier.
What famous regional dishes would suit each kingdom in WoW?
>>92476861You know what sure, let's start off with the human nations.>LordaeronGiven the farming communities, large presence of Adorhal and Strathome as agricultural centers with sufficient reach to basically supply the entire kingdom, and general environment, I'm gonna think that Lordaeron really is into medieval era pies. Big steak and ale things, venison and gravy, probably even doing that thing where they'd put live birds in an empty pie crust and cut into it for weddings or whatnot, to let the birds loose.>AlteracThere's an item in WoW that says that Alterac's court was really into swiss cheese, and I'd buy it. A small mountain nation focusing on preserving what their relatively meager dairy can produce and getting really into like, cave-aging fine cheeses.>DalaranDalaran I don't think is a place that particularly gives a shit about its food, in the sense that culturally the amount of mages means that half the journeymen are feeding themselves off of conjured bread and water while on study binges. That said, I would also think that they'd be the culture to be in the process of developing molecular gastronomy, and experimenting with magic-additive cooking techniques.>GilneasGilneas is honestly really heavily coastal, and I would think that they'd probably have a lot of game food to go with it. I could see them leaning into grills, maybe even salt crust ones. Gilnean nobility going off into the woods to hunt a deer and then have the servants do a big slow pit roast sounds appropriate, and also suitably thematic to be something they also do when the worgen curse happens.
>>92477389>StromgardeStromgarde doesn't feel like it'd got a super defined food culture to me, but I'd think that it'd do well with a legacy of preparation more than anything. You might not get fancy dishes in Stromgarde, but you've got centuries of culinary technique to make them good. Possibly also gravies and sauces, for those cold highland nights.>Kul TirasSTEWS. Kul Tiras is a coastal nation with cold as shit weather, they absolutely have thick, hearty seafood stews and chowders down pat. Shellfish bakes too I'd think, and I think the tidesages would probably have functional enough aquaculture projects to do things like farm some fish or shellfish.>StormwindAs a newer colony isolated from its peers, I feel like Stormwind's cuisine is wildly experimental comparative to the rest of the Alliance kingdoms, but also initially focused on squeezing out as much as they can from the resources they had immediately post-colonization. As such, I think that Stormwind is the place that really leans into processing techniques. Sausages, deli meats, pickled vegetables, all coming as cultural artifacts from the era before Stormwind had the infrastructure set up to pull from the bounty of Elwynn and Westfall.
>>92476861Kul'Tiras should have boiled beer and pie with fishheads
>>92477389>>92477395Don't forget that in the setting even Stormwind humans (but mostly from Westfall and Duskwood regions) make food out of unusual ingredients, like spider legs, murlok parts and so on.
>>92477934So it should be Warcraft Stirland?
>>92477958>So it should be Warcraft Stirland?Well their models in WoW looked hideous and all three locations have shitty climate
>>92477975But Stirlanders are ye olde skinny peasants, while playable Kul'tirans are bulky.
>>92478175Yeah but there's also the stick thin human models
>>92478643Which are unplayable, and there's less NPCs with that model. Not to mention male (sorry, "Body Type 1") only.
>>92478704Tbh I don't think anyone wants to play skinny ass humansThough I'm not sure exactly who wanted to play fatass giant humans the size of orcs either
>>92465199It's different for each race>Humans it was never really legal and they were underground>Gnomes are curious little fucks without the same moral objections to fel as the other alliance races>Thrall let warlocks in so he could use them as unknowing assets against the Shadow Council>Forsaken are Forsaken
>>92477395Keep in mind that Stromguard is unique with dinosaurs running around. Want raptor steak or raptor Omelette? Gotta travel to the highlands.
>>92479499Oh good point. There's probably even a remarkable amount of troll cuisine in there, even if the stromguardians claim they came up with it first and the trolls claim they came up with it first right back at them. I've always thought that the forest trolls probably really favored the kind of low, smoke-cooked meats and vegetables that you can make without making a ton of light in the woods.
>>92477395Stormwind is like New York City by this point, a real melting pot but still generally acclimating into their own districts. You can go out for some Kaldorei Kebabs one night, a little Gnomish Self-Stirring Fry the next, and eat an entire wheel of cheese for the weekend because all decent Stormwinders LOVE themselves a little Elling Trias special.
>>92471961Only if you have orcs get out. Orcs in the camps fell into a deep depression to the point the guards didn’t even need to do their job.It was more explored in the unreleased point and click game where Thrall enters an orc reservation and everyone there just sulks and drinks “blackwater” which is just grog.
>>92480107That Black Ale was retconned into demonic blood withdrawal from the book Lord of the Clans.In Warcraft Adventures orcs were getting shares of said Ale to cull their bloodlust.
>>92480356Wish it worked that way with my dad...
>>92463814So, as far as I know, there are 4 ways to play a Warcraft trpg: the two original Warcraft RPG and WoW RPG and then there are two 5e-based splatbooks - one of which I found to have the more extensive content and books.So which system/splatbook do you use anons?
>>92470349Do NOT post dark iron women. I WILL cum.
>>92480523Which is the one you found the best?
My party has just arrived in the eastern kingdoms and is moving southward towards the bloated lands where they will fight off an army of undead iron horde orcs raised by a powerful necromancer and his cult of minions. That is all.
>>92479732Isn't Night Elf cuisine Korean? I recall them having kimchi for some reason
>>92480695It's from this site: https://orjanbp.github.io/wc5etools/Haven't found any other content more extensive aside from Blizzard's og two.
>>92481398Ah yeah, I remember seeing an earlier version of that, desu I think I preferred the one that had the hero classes being something you could only get at level 5.
>>92480523I think the 3e games have a lot of cool ways to make characters that branch out of the MMO classes, and I really prefer all of the detailed lore (which you could use fpr 5e as well obviously) But you have to deal with the baggage 3e brings, like boring Warriors and Rogues, trap options, etc.5e is definitely easier to play and if your players want to make their character from the MMO it does a much better job of having that happen. But I find the character building boring, bounded accuracy kinda sucks, and if you've been playing a lot of 5e you might be sick of it.I always thought Fantasy Craft could make a good base to adapt the Warcraft books to. It is a OGL game still but it's set out to be 3rd editons, "4th edition", if that makes sense? As opposed to Pathfinder's 3.75 approach. I don't think it necessarily accomplished everything it tried to do, but there's some potential there to make a good Wacraft game out of it I think.Fantasy Age (the Dragon Age system without the IP) might be worth a look as well, but I think the classes may be too basic to fulfill the Class fantasy you might be expecting from wow. But it does have support for blackpowder weapons and the stunt die/system is pretty cool.
>>92470349I wish Dark Iron girls weren't dwarves. They tick a bunch of my fetishes but I don't like shortstacks. This is a special kind of pain.
QUESTION: I'm thinking of creating an Alliance Pandaren DK to roleplay as. Is obviously going to be a Fourth Generation DK who was slain in the Fourth War and then resurrected, as that is the norm for Panda DKs, with 3rd gen DKs like Gravewalker Gie being the very rare exception. What I am trying to figure out is: why would a Pandaren leave their home to join the Alliance military in the first place? Only a small handful of Pandaren from the Wandering Isle (which had a small population, unless it's supposed to be much bigger in lore with more than a couple small hamlets) left to join the factions, so that would be exceptional. More than likely, Pandaren who joined the faction war would have come from mainland Pandaria (or perhaps random island villages out there, like Snow Blossom Village in BFA?). The Pandaren are bystanders. Why would they live the comfort and peace of home to fight for a different civilization against another civilization? Any martially minded mainland Pandaren who wanted to be protectors could just join the Shado-Pan or the Golden Lotus. The only argument I can think of is that after Sylvanas wiped out a civilization out of spite, the Horde would be perceived as a global threat that needs to be put down ASAP, so Pandarens would join the Alliance then to preemptively protect their homes, but that seems a little late for my character's Alliance membership to start, especially if they die on the battlefield within the year. Bolvar only ordered the Ebon Blade to retrieve the bodies of noble souls. A Pandaren joining the Alliance and becoming renowned within one year before dying would be rather exceptional. I feel like he'd need to have been fighting for the Alliance earlier for it to not raise eyebrows.
>>92483127>be mainland Pandaren>night elf adventurer bro comes by your farm during MoP>kills some Mogu and Saurok, saves your wife, saves your farm, heals your sick uncle>you befriend him>time pass, you hear of the horrors of Garroshs horde>you decide to travel and learn of the lands your night elf bro came from>these are pretty cool people, you like land and people>you also like the alliance, they stand for honorable values>you make even more alliance bros during your travel>the horde goes apeship again, but worse>the beautiful homeland of your night elf bro is gone>night elf bro nr. 3 you made a few years ago is dead now>your sense of justice is screaming to do the right thing
>>92482431Interesting. In summary, how would you say that Fantasy Craft differs from a 3.75e or a 4e? What things does different?
Why is warlock so bad?
>>92471218>theres not only a shit ton of dead, necessitating the strongest military action, but the plague is wider spread than is possible containgiven the even higher need to find the necros, he couldnt possibly made a better decision, splintering is inevitable, pretty fucking stupid to have brought his girlfriend, let alone some radical disloyal to the royal line, id have killed uther on the spot personally
>>92481398This is really cool, though I'd have some quibbles. It's definitely making me want to do a rule writeup for naga...Female naga get multiple arms and +1 Int, obviously, but while male naga would get +1 Str, I'm not sure what their other bonus would be. Natural armor?
>>92487554maybe use yuan ti as base
Are all the warcraft RPGs based on versions of D&D?
>>92487554Natural Armor, Powerful Build, and/or maybe something like the Half-orc racial where they can go to 1 hp instead of 0 once every rest
>>92491621That seems completely fair. Do you think women could get anything apart from multiple arms?I'm thinking that the various other mutations should probably be feats.
>>92491413Pretty much, both series are d20-based pen-and-paper RPGs and used the 3rd edition of Dungeons & Dragons. They were published by Sword & Sorcery, an imprint from White Wolf Publishing. From 2002 - 2005 The 1st Edition: Warcraft Roleplaying Game. 2005 - 2008 The 2nd Edition was updated version for World of Warcraft. Both are considered non-canon to Warcraft lore.
>>92493219>Both are considered non-canon to Warcraft loreWhich is ironic since they both rode on the cocktails and carried the magic of the Warcraft trilogy, being in the timespan between WC3 and WoW, and thus many would argue the peak of the franchise.
>>92487165Where?
>>92463814https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zic3vG5fApI
>>92493219good to know. If the 5e version is good it would be a lot easier to find people interested in trying that than basically any other system
>>92485482It's a lot to write up, so Ill just link you to someone that's already done the work.https://writeups.letsyouandhimfight.com/tibalt/fantasy-craft/Give the book a look even if the write-up doesn't inspire you, I think it's a pretty underated game
>>92481301Skewering meat is pretty Eurasian-centric regardless, and probably one of the only ways to make the prospect of eating spiders seem fun>>92480523>>92480695I really enjoy the 3.5e-based Warcraft RPG, the whole race levels giving you what are essentially your racials, the prestige classes letting you touch on various archetypes retail doesn't like Dark Alchemist or Witch Doctor, the Engineering rules stuck out to me as especially cool letting you tinker not just the mech suit you'd hope for but also a freeform 'wacky gadget' creation system, and the additional supplements add some very strong Warcrafty things like tier set gear and Legendaries if you want to get goofy with the scaling.
>>92463814Warcraft Chronicle has got to be THE case study on how to fuck up a fantasy universe forever.(hint; if you explain EVERYTHING in concrete this-is-how-it-is detail there is no more "fantasy" to your fantasy world (not to mention the contradictions and nonsense IN said concrete explanation))
>>92483127>trying to roleplay a Pandaren DKhow about; >just felt like being a DK YOLO"hero classes" were a mistake. should've had a sorcerer class w/ DK spec. or maybe the original idea for hero classes, where once you hit like, lvl 55 you can prestige your paladin into a DK.
I think a campaign of uncovering the demonic corruption in the night elf empire before the sundering and racing against time to stop Azshara could be pretty fun.Start off way out in the provinces investigating somethin unrelated and then the party is dragged into shady magic and demonic cults leading right back to the queen.Could probably be fun for people that don't care about warcraft too, bit limited racial choices though
>>92499850>bit limited racial choices thoughYeah what else is there besides elves?Trolls?Beastman like furbolgs and tauren?
>>92500302>>92499850Absolutely NO mary sue time traveling orcs.
>>92500750Imagine a High Kings of Azeroth expansion lol
>>92494083in the 3.x booksits just a worse wizard with a huge target in the form of a shit pet
>>92498914>the original idea for hero classes, where once you hit like, lvl 55 you can prestige your paladin into a DKThe secret special Jedi class in Star Wars Galaxies did that, where after accomplishing obscure requirements that differed from player to player and finishing a questline, any class could transition to the Jedi class, but it was a one way conversion. It sucks if you are very invested in your character and like how he plays, and then change to the special class thinking your character is going to become more fun to play... and it isn't, and you can't go back. Blizzard probably wanted to avoid that situation.
>>92496330>5EHeard the class system isn't as flavourful as the other 2 versions. 5E class system is apparently closely like how it is in the MMO.
>>92480523I use the second edition 3.5e adaptation, "World of Warcraft: The Roleplaying Game."Why? Because I find the power level of the average character to be comfortably in between that of baseline 3.5e and Pathfinder's hit-point bloat and class bloat. It's basically "Warcraft 3.75e" I'm the anon who made a lot of these threads last year or so and posted some homebrew stuff, glad to see they're still going. Currently got a rework of the paladin and death knight classes finished, I am putting together a *massive* rework of the warlock path and all the demons that can be summoned.
>>92500302pandaren? Also there would be a lot of troll tribes and two kinds of night elves so there would be options, just no super vanilla ones.Then again the setting would be very high magic and developed. Continent-spanning highways are mentioned in the lore for example. It's only the periphery where it's the stone age
>>92491881Hm, maybe some innate cantrips for the women?
>>92500302Could do made up races that existed in ancient times, and were wiped out by our after the Sundering. Or you could do minor races like Quillboar or Harpies and explain that they were civilized in the past, but after the Sundering degenerated into brutal savages.
>>92504895pic related
>>92505068I feel like that is way too complicated
>>92505068>losing XP when demon diesFor all 5th ed's faults, as a DM I do really like its milestone advancement. Much better than tracking XP for various characters. And also, fuck XP loss. Always a shit mechanic.That said, I did try to play a WoW-style Warlock in D&D 5e and once you get Summon Greater Demon it was like the fun old days of Vanilla summoning the Fel Guard and hoping it didn't break your Enslavement too early.Also took Vampiric Touch to try to simulate Drain Life, even if VT is a melee attack. And since you can recast it each round for a minute, I ended up in a loop with a Vampire biting me and healing and I told the DM I was biting it the fuck back and healing myself.
>>92507129>Fel GuardWhoops, meant Doomguard. With the fun little ritual that killed one of the people touching the little box.
>>92499850Do you have the map with the roads? Detailed map work tingles my autism.
>>92504895is the warlock thing the only thing youve made?
>>92509088sure, right here
>>92511305and bonus extra autism province names
>>92506980Yes I admit it's complicated, but I view it as an improvement over the obtuse companion rules from the Monster Guide. In that supplement, you have to wait until 11th level to get a 6 HD felhunter. In my ruleset, you can get a 6 HD felhunter at 9th level or an 8 HD felguard at 11th level, for example.
>>92510865I've posted a death knight pdf before. Here's this year's version (updated from 2023). It may be OP compared to some other classes but I tried to keep it in line with the "3.75" approach I mentioned before.
>>92511305>>92511323Nice. Thanks.
>>92500750Or humans...Or dragons
>>92500302The only real competitors to the Night Elven empire at the time were the Mogu and the Zandalari. Though from my understanding of the lore during this period, these two races weren't willing to test the Night Elves and wage active wars against them. Border skirmishes were supposedly somewhat common with the various subraces of the Trolls, but I think only the Jungle and Forest trolls were antagonistic towards the elves. The Pandaren were enslaved at the time and didn't dare to revolt until after Lei'shin's death and races such as Vrykul, Tauren, Furbolgs, etc. were either too far removed from the Night Elven borders or were probably considered as little more than roaming bands of walking animals that just moved around in herds (Tauren, in this case.)
>>92511444thats cool, do you have a google doc or somthn?I was >>92487165so it was nice to see
>>92517385Not at the moment, but I'll probably make a read-only google doc at some point once I get more stuff compiled.In the meantime, here's an example from the demon rework, using a felguard. For comparison, the first two statblocks are from Warcraft d20's Manual of Monsters and the WoW RPG MonsterGuide.Note that "demon traits" in Warcraft d20 (the first one) include immunity to fire and resistance to acid, electricity, and cold 10, which the demon subtype in the second edition does *not* have (and neither does mine).The second Felguard can be summoned as a 7th level spell, and/or taken as a fel companion at level 15 according to the Monster Guide.Meanwhile, my version (rightmost) is summonable as a 6th level spell, and can be taken as a fel companion at level 11, provided the Warlock also has a base Charisma score of at least 14.
>>92463814>Alterac, Stromgarde, Stormwind, and LordaeronOne lives in mountans, one is scotland, one is next to a jungle and a portal to hell and evil dwarfs and one is le big
>>92518105Correction: felguards aren't supposed to start out with electricity resist, that's a mistype.
If I had to do a Warcraft campaign. I’d run it from Pre-Classic to Legion.Skipping WoD and compressing Cataclysm/MoP into shorter plots.That means the Elemental/Old Gods and Scourge/Legion plots get resolved with another pointless faction conflict beyond regional fighting.
>>92477395>>92477934Since the german version of the game has the Kul'Tirans speak with the thickest low german accent I've ever heard in any kind of media aside from werner movies, I can see them eating ungodly amounts of Labskaus, a meal consisting of canned meat mashed together with potatoes and served with different kinds of pickled vegetables and fish. Ideal for long sea voyages, and great if you have a hangover.
do you think the RPG explanation for the Warden's vengeance abilities makes sense?
>>92519384The German synchronization is amazingly well done and I've learned German thanks to that version.
>>92511444neat anon, I like your felguards abilities are more based on the vidya
>>92511444needs unholy aura
>>92464206WC2 Alterac map absolutely had a port though.>>92470769>As pragmatic as preemptively slaughtering people before they turn is (and not enough time had passed for everyone to eat the bread, it's possible only a fraction of the town might have turned), it's still murder and wrong. The morally right thing to do would have been to have quarantined people in their homes and then only kill people after they have turned.Gameplay wise they do all turn. >>92469368Remove them, ignore the Void being some unified thing that includes the old gods and is rival to Sargeras >>92470364I despise Cata hobgoblins which are completely redunant with ogres compared to the scrapped WC3 art for them.Also they're apparently deciding what the "Arathi" looked like and moving them to a stupid spot.
>>92467853>>92470887>>92468285>>92469138Also Vanilla retconned in the Southfury river which was NOT there in WC3. But it *IS* a truly massive freshwater river.>>92467878Golden's warlock acceptance is MoP era though.
>>92531893Also Kul Tiras was concerned over lordship of Alterac because it could threaten Kul Tiran naval supremacy
>>92519324The good thing about retelling the expansion storylines as a campaign is that you aren't obligated to hamfist the full Horde and Alliance factions into every corner, you can make WotLK primarily about the Argents and Ebon Bladers, Cataclysm about the players working with the Cenarion Circle and Earthen Ring, and so on.
Warcraft lore is so bad. It progressively got worse and worse and fucking WORSE with each expansion pack.The Forsaken realistically could have just as much been an Alliance race. Draenei should not have been playable. High/Blood Elves should have stayed Alliance.Also for some reason 10,000+ year old characters act like young adults. Fucking Tyrande. Not that elves aren’t retarded in this setting. Pic related.
>>92538354>The Forsaken realistically could have just as much been an Alliance raceSylvanas fucked that up by betraying Garithos
>>92538354yea i kinda liked it most when they did that lorebook at legion
>>92538523Garithos was a racist cunt. Amazing how the elves took him as the representative of the entire human race.
>>92538354Draenei spawned a ton of really good pornOn the other hand most of it is horsedick futa porn so....eh
>>92538354>The Forsaken realistically could have just as much been an Alliance race. lol no. Aside from the Garithos instance mentioned, there's no reason any human would trust any undead, especially undead lead by a bitch elf who still hangs around with one of the demons responsible for the undead plague in the first place.>Draenei should not have been playable. They should have as just the broken and not had the shitty retcon trying them to the Eredar.>High/Blood Elves should have stayed Alliance.High Elves who were along with Turalyon's expedition to Outlands, sure. Which we eventually got in the fucked up form as the Void Elves. Blood Elves who followed Kael? Fuck no. Again, because of Garithos and the Blood Elves themselves being stupid cunts.>Also for some reason 10,000+ year old characters act like young adults. Fucking Tyrande.This was indeed just bad writing. It was absolutely fucking retarded of Blizzard for having that quest or dungeon in Panda land where fucking Varian is teaching her how to be patient.
>>92540742>lol noLol yes. Do you know how close Lordaeron was with the other human kingdoms? Imagine your nation declaring your distant relatives enemies because they got butchered. It will probably piss a lot of people off. Dead or no, humans are human.
>>92540805But they weren't human anymore and everyone witnessed what the Scourge did. No one is going to believe it when an undead that you KNOW still has demons hanging around in its upper echelons comes up and says "We're totally not slaves anymore!" The rest of the human kingdoms were convinced they were just more Scourge and there was no trusting them. And it's not like Cuntvanas ever did anything to dissuade those notions.
>>92540849>But they weren't human anymore Stopped reading here>The rest of the human kingdoms were convinced they were just more ScourgeThey made humans intentionally retarded and isolational for most of WoW, until they needed them for some expansion; look at Gilneas, Dalaran, Kul Tiara, etc.
>>92540849>a human corpse isn’t a human corpse Baka~
>>92540873>still thinking undead ghouls are humanYou're fucking retarded. I accept your concession.And the entire Alliance since Warcraft 2 was only out of absolute necessity. The human kingdoms had strained relationships at best and King Terenas barely accepted the refugees from the Kingdom of Azeroth.After the Third War, there was nothing holding them together or any reason for them to keep spending money and manpower on other kingdoms' problems.>>92540901>a human corpse being puppeteered by demons is totally the same as a normal humanYou'd be the reason Lordearon fell.
>>92540922>puppeteered by demonsAh sweet a schizo, he thinks the demons are literally in the zombies’ brains, totally not external slavery. Just fucking declare all slaves enemies.
Draenei are cute. Cute!
>>92542960Where's her 18 inch equine penis?
>>92538354Games with more than one race of elf are shit by definition.
>>92463814>>>/v/673830206
The warcraft world looks a lot like Illinois and it reminded me that someone on /biz/ (actually /bant/) was discussing the fact Illinois has the second most coal in america, more than appalachia and less than montana, but has better coal than montana and that that coal can make illinois an extraction superpower sending it down the missipi to china (since they love burning coal there).
>>92544333The guy who wrote that was a faggot but I agree with him, cata was the last time I played warcraft and never looked back. Sinking into vashj'ir was great but everything that came afterwards was not so great. No problem with pandas just not my think. Simplified class system was also lame. Blizz is faggoty as any other california company now and deserves to die.
>>92538724In this house Garithos was a saint who did nothing wrong.
Lot of good ideas in this thread. If I ever run a Warcraft campaign (which I won't), I'd set it to just after the Frozen Throne. I'd keep Stormwind destroyed and refugees from Lordaeron, Dalaran, and probably Alterac are now moving south and shacking it up with the Stormwindian refugees around Southshore or trying to get into GIlneas. It's hard to find but I think there was some line about a possible heir of Alterac fled to Gilneas. Either way, I'd probably have Gilneas decide to check out what all this Scourge nonsense is about and they become the new, reluctant, main driver for a new Alliance.Create at least one new faction - the Outlanders/Illidari, and the High/Blood Elves go to them instead of the Horde. The Outlanders would include the real Draenei, Naga, and Blood Elves. Forsaken and Night Elves are neutral factions. Maybe eventually a fourth faction headed by the Night Elves that include Pandaren and are about healing and peace and love, man. Hm, the Forsaken would probably try to join Illidan's faction whenever possible.
>>92545411Why would Stormwind still be destroyed? The Second War happened when Arthas was a kid and he's an adult by the time of the third war. They'd have more than enough time to rebuild.
>>92538354>Warcraft lore is so bad. It progressively got worse and worse and fucking WORSE with each expansion pack.I don't think anyone itt disagrees with that.I think that most people, like me, are more in love with the idea of the Warcraft lore, what it used to be and what could've been.It's filled with all sorts of cool stuff(playable undead, the entire night elf faction in WC3, even in the first game the fact that you could play as the orcs who have their own storyline and politics is cool) that could've lead to something great under the right direction, but unfortunately we don't live in this timeline.That's why even now there are all sorts of fan projects, private servers and the like. Like this map for example was posted just a year ago for a project that's about recreating WC2 in Reforged.For better or worse, there are people who still love Warcraft, or at least the idea of it.
>>92543164Fun fact: The whole horse cock draenei thing was due to one particular Saudi prince's absolute obsession with it, and having enough money to hire every single artist he could find to draw it.
>>92546874I don't buy the Saudi prince thing, but it was some rich autist who did do that and now you can't post any draenei without someone asking about the horsecock.
>>92546884You make it sound like a Saudi prince can't be autistic, anon. I have a lot of friends in the smut industry. Dude was the equivalent of the Wonder Bread Man back in the day, except he paid REALLY well.
>>92546895>Wonder Bread ManAh there's a blast from the past.Apropos of nothing, what's Shadman up to these days?
>>92546906Did a dumb and got arrested for assault with a deadly weapon.
>>92538724Honestly I can see some reason in this. They could simply think that humans were so friendly and polite only when it were them who needed help, and elves provided quite formidable force in the second war. Once elven kingom got devastated, majority of their race wiped out, thus being weak and unable to provide anything useful for humans, they showed their true face. Also, I don't remember if Alliance in general provided any help for rebuilding Thalassian territories ravaged by Horde.
>>92546589Oh for sure, the idea in WoW are fun and neat and the aesthetics can be downright amazing, but the execution and writing is just terrible and teenager-ish. Had some AI rescrambled its lore/politics into something better and with a more tact to its tone, it could be amazing.
>>92545730Why would it be rebuilt? The time between the Second War and the Third War is ~10 years. How many refugees were there really? It got sacked, right? The Horde's main army was broken but there can still be a whole bunch of complications around actually resettling Stormwind. Like, for example...raising the funds - which the lack of canonically ended up being a big fucking problem. And what does it even really serve for Stormwind to be there? It could be more interesting if there was a Theramore analog there instead, like a somewhat neutral goblin cartel.
>>92549549Because you dont just give up on all those resources and lands down there? For if you do, someone else claims them. Or, even worse, if next time you come looking there is a rising Gurubashi empire expanding up north. And what if there is yet another invasion and Netherguard keep isnt enough? The entire south once again is lost. Lastly, there is this little thing called pride. Explain to the people that "nah, lets just dont."
for me, it's high elves
>>92550165whys your high elf dressed like a horde thot
>>92550273she's clearly not wearing hides and furs thoughbeight
FUCK the Horde.
>>92471895So I decided to expand a bit on this idea >The Stonesisters Originating from the rugged lands of Stromgarde, the Stonesisters are a fellowship of women who kept to the Old Ways of humanity. Though normally quite reclusive, they have previously come to the Alliance's aid in the past, channeling their nature and stone based magics to crush the Alliance's foes. I was thinking they'd gather around the Stonehenges around Stromgarde. I thought of a few spells that are basically druid or shaman ones but I wonder if there's a way to sort of combine them. So far I have >Stone BarrageWhile mages prefer ice or fire, the Stonesisters use the Earth itself. This spell rains boulders over an area, smashing foes and stunning them senselessThinking it'd be like the Tinkers Rocket Barrage- weaker than a Blizzard or Flamestrike, but cheaper and spammable >RenewalA simple blessing, the Stonesisters can call upon nature's blossoming energy to steadily heal wounds of their allies Basically the Night Elf Druid of the Claw Rejuvenation ability. I was thinking that compared to the Paladin's Holy Light spell, it'd heal over time but also be fairly cheap.Overall I wanted the theme of their spells to be less outright powerful than the Arcane or the Light, but less taxing on the caster and more repeatable. Humans preferred the more immediate power the Arcane had so their Old Way became less popular over time.Think this makes sense?
>>92551701>>92471895I think this is a great idea anon>>92476536>>92476800If you're running them in the Warcraft 3.5e tabletop, I would simply stat them as Shamans but let them add 1 Druid spell per level to their spell list, bam, nice and simple.
>>92471109>They've spent years begging for a race that was added in the first expansion of the gameThose abominations are not High Elves. They are like forsaken without the excuse of being dead.
>>92493219>Both are considered non-canon to Warcraft lore.This explains why I like those older books so much.
>>92550149The Stormwindians gave up on all those resources and lands when they lost. Rising Gurubashi/Goblin cartel empire sounds neat - and then when the Dark Portal opens again they have to deal with it, eventually turning the south into a three-way battle. And the Stormwindians can try, but maybe they should focus on the Scourge up north, first. Again, there are a lot of complications surrounding resettling Stormwind. My main issue is that, even in 10 years, it shouldn't be just up and done with like that so simply. Finally, they should've thought about those resources, lands, and their pride before losing the first time. I think in my setting, ultimately, the Stormwindians carve out a new future somewhere else. Does it HAVE to be all the way down there? Isn't Stormwind itself a relatively new human nation? How many refugees actually made it out of the Second War? I'm going to guess - not a lot.
>>92552873>Isn't Stormwind itself a relatively new human nation?Do you consider a 5-6 centuries old kingdom to be new?
>>92552873>How many refugees actually made it out of the Second War? I'm going to guess - not a lot.I believe there were also a lot of immigrants from other kingdoms. For example it was mentioned Anduin's servant Wyll was Lordaeronian and his wife was actually a Forsaken of Lordaeron.
>>92552208blood elves are another name for high elves. They're literally the same people. Being genocided and changing power source didn't make them a new race of elf
>>92553039No their eyes are green and their clothes red they're completely different
>>92553039>They're literally the same peopleThey literally aren't, and their culture is now shit horde - the same horde, as an example, that orders attacks to the Quel'Danil Lodge.
>>92553089By this logic, the forsaken are humans. It's just another step compared to what the BE are.
>>92553039Alliance High Elves just resorted to sucking human dicks for mana to sate their addiction
>>92552936Bull. No way it's that old. Even then, Stromgarde/Arathor are probably way older.>>92553030Even worse...I'd rather have a New Stormwind somewhere else than an Old Stormwind of immigrants.
>>92553226In Warcraft Orcs & Humans the First War started in 593 of the King's Calendar.While it wasn't stated what's the event that set the beginning it's a good assumption that it's the founding of the kingdom.
>>92553098the elves seem to maintain their culture just fine, they're certainly not adopting orc or troll culture. And alliance-aligned high elves are a tiny splinter group from mainstream high/blood elf society that have sided with the belves enemies.>>92553108>the forsaken are humansyeah, undead humans
>>92554086I love how you avoided the Quel'Danil Lodge.The Blood Elves are indeed like the forsaken. Monster now killing their former kin. Eviler than most of the villains, but with the plot armor and moral blindness of a faction pet of too many writers.
>>92554086the elves are FROM troll culture
>>92554374Since kaldorei are former dark trolls Does that mean blood elves are degenerated version of degenerated trolls?
>>92554650Yes as are a third of Azeroth's natives.
>>92553790That's crazy, but in the grand scheme of things, I still don't think Stormwind's history at that geographical location is that important. What other things of note happened there other than the First War?>>92554086>>92554198Have the blood elves be part of Illidan's faction. The Forsaken would go very well with Illidan's faction, too. I never noticed until now but that's his whole faction's thing, isn't it? Races that feel forsaken or rejected? The Blood Elves, the (real) Draenei, even the Naga kind of, if you remember how they evolved. Forsaken would fit right in there.>>92554650>>92554374Gay propaganda
>>92555663Illidan feels like he was the setup for a RTS expansion that didn’t happen.Though so does the theoretical Mongrel Horde, a faction made by throwing the creep models together.
>>92554374the abandoned troll culture like 15000 years ago. Even low born night elves back then didn't live like trolls
>>92553790>>92555663Actually looking at their wiki page Stormwind is 1,200 years oldWhich is a shame that they've completely forgotten the old King's Calendar but maybe that starts with the first Wrynn who became king instead
>>92552936Something's called new if there's an old.
The thread's on autosage?
>>92554198NTA, but:First of all, you really sound like a typical Alliance fanboy, who thinks that just because Blood Elves are in the Horde now, they're now cannibalistic savages wearing furs.Finally, as typical Alliance fanboy you have no problem with the existence of Void Elves, which, apart the fact the lore explaining how they're around is retarded, are danger to the entire Azeroth, since Alleria herself by STANDING near the Sunwell almost made it collapse into a magival black hole.
>>92559869Everything past WotLK is a travesty.t. not that anonPS: there's nothing wrong with being an Alliance or a Horde fanboy, it's the writers who fuck us over
Now I can't stop thinking about naga or forsaken demon hunters. Four arms. Four glaives.
>>92560011There have been sparks of decent ideas post-Cata.Warlords really ran itself into the ground in the 7.2 patch, but the storyline with all the larger than life personalities of all the old orcs was really good.Aside from them doing Doomhammer dirty.And I liked Legion's class hall system and artifacts. The whole "Iwwidan if da chosen one!" was retarded.BFA had some really nice zones to explore at first. The battle against N'zoth parts of it sucked.Shadowlands was all bad all the time. Zero redeeming factors.Dragonflight's dragon riding is really fun. Story has been uninspired. Dracthyr are lame scalybait.
>>92560396Never ever demistify death.
>page 11Good night, /wcg/. It's been fun before the autosage hit.
