>i respect native people & want to give them a win in my setting.
racial bonus to save vs smallpox might be a good start

There's not a way to do this that doesn't piss people off. Also there's already a ton of Native American nations? They have land and everything. It was a continent full of many different kinds of people and their descendents, still existing, have conflicting societies and political agendas as could be expected. This is kind of a dehumanizing idea in general. If you genuinely want to do this and aren't shitposting then I would advise you to increase your level of detail. Focus on a few really populated groups and have realistic internal and external tension.

___My__ nation would be quite mad about being moved yet again to yet another place they didn't have any connection to and not being able to return to the Mississippi delta, as one example. And that's a pretty major nation as far as indigenous groups go, with international ties and was once an ally of the early US Government before they were betrayed.

>>92490395
>So I'm working on a setting & part of it is the native americans creating their own "nation" in the great plains & some of the southwest
The problem with this idea is that natives are not homogenous. There are dozens of different tribes with different cultures, different languages, different traditions and histories, different lands, etc. While you could probably get some to confederate with each other as a means of survival, if they could, they would probably try to establish independence for their own groups, not as a whole. For example you might have the various Siouxan tribes uniting to form a nation in the Great Plains, but they're probably not going to unite with, say, the Navajo (who themselves would likely form their own independent country) due to both geographical and cultural distance.

>>92490472
So I've done a (modicum) of research & I do want to be respectful & I'm probably doing this all wrong but my intentions are pure.

I figure that the tribes in Dakota & Oklahoma, & the southwest would band together into some sort of loose alliance. Everything east of the Mississippi is claimed by other factions, Texas is its own thing, & Mexico is coming up from the south to grab land too. West of the rockies is also claimed by others. So basically the tribes would have the whole middle of America give or take. It's not like there are many natural borders to draw lines so the other factions might have a presence there, they don't have the power to claim it. I have Navajo, Cheyenne, etc tribes around where their modern day populations are. These individual tribes would follow their normal leadership, & they would interact with each other in a loose confederation of like minded interest. No one is always gonna see eye to eye & I'm sure there are all kinds of internal politics I wouldn't know the first thing about. All in all they would want to show a unified front to the outside factions, but I have no clue what to call this territory. I didn't want to call it something possibly offensive & generic like "the Tribelands" I figured the different individual peoples would name it something homogenized, I just have no clue whatl

>>92490593
Well. Let's kick the hornets nest and ask: where, when and how did the shitty war that Balkanized the United States kick off?

>>92490629
First there was a WW3. America, Europe, & Japan, vs Russian, China, & Middle East, this isn't a perfect description by any means, my write up of ww3 has more to it but its not needed for this thread. Then magic returned! (Haha i am so original!) Then a big civil war state side over that happening, some for, some against, some in-between. This was just after a lot of political unrest following ww3, America could just no longer pretend to be able to get along together & geographical/political lines got drawn.

>>92490731
my brother in christ you are describing Shadowrun

>>92490395
You got to think more european. Different tribes are like different houses. Their own heraldry, their own ways like they to dress or cook. Like accents. Emphasis or demphasis on specific letters of words when speaking.

Like okay, hypothetically, lets say you got a tribe that likes to live near a river, another that lives in the mountains, a third that lives in the forest, and a fourth that lives on the prairie. Whats similar to them, but how are those different from each other?

>>92490870
Little bit Shadowrun, little bit RIFTS. It's not like there aren't 100 generic fantasy settings, I can't have my post apoc magic America setting cake & eat it too.

>>92490593
Turtle Island is generally what groups call the continent if they don't want to respect the concept of "America". So maybe some reference to that?

>>92490395
>i respect native people
But not enough to actually do your own research
>& want to give them a win in my setting
So it's just yet more white savior complex. Gotcha.
>nor do I have a friendly native dude to ask these questions too
"If only I had some friendly, pliable Redman to stripmine his culture from!" Seriously dude?

How do you guys always manage to he more racist than the neonazis?

>>92490914
Bro you catch more flies with honey. At least he's trying.

>>92490395

You're right that there are multiple peoples, with no single population dominating, and they'd likely have English as their de facto lingua franca.

The problem with any particular language is that, well, it's one group's language. They'd probably call it something lame like the Great Plains Federation or something.

But that's lake.

Pick your favorite tribe and say that the Native state movement started with them and use a name in their language.

>>92490911
>Turtle Island is generally what groups call the continent

Turtle Island is what a handful of Native people call the continent, but which has somehow entered mainstream media as the "Native name".

Remember that most groups did not have trade networks spanning multiple continents and so did not need a word for "continent". Even "Turtle Island" refers originally to all of the land in the known world as opposed to some discrete landmass.

>>92490970
>that's lake

That's lame*

>>92490998
Sure, you're right. But do you have an alternative to offer? If not, then using the hokey thing that's entered into common in-group and out-group use is better than a blank space.

>>92490914
>I am having difficulty finding a clear answer with the research I have tried so far
>Not looking to be a savior of anything, I just thought it would be cool. Hate me if you want
>I would prefer the opinions of the people this would effect & get proper insight that I don't have from personal experience, nor from my failed research attempts

>>92490970
Maybe Prairie Commonwealth?

>>92490970
>But that's lake.
Its all lake to me.

>>92490731
Careful anon. You might attract the redditors. 2ACW talk gets shut down pretty fast, but now they're doing the same for WW3. Or worse: argue that America will win and turn the wholesome world into a whole big chungus. I'd take Mad Max over Redditworld any goddamn day.

>>92491183
Prairie's become more of a Canadian term, but sure.

>>92491213
>Redditworld
Ah yes:
>Your whole life... Yes, all of it, now revolves around upvotes. In fact, people upvote, downvote you in real time. Over how you're doing your job, over your driving, shit the phone clock even observes and votes on what time you set to wake up. It's the Chinese social credit system on crack cocaine.
>Have negative karma? You can't drive a car. You have to use the government subsidized bus.
>Antinatalism took off, now most people reproduce through clones.
>Clones have shitty childhoods, only know their 'genetic precursor' from paperwork. They never met the asshole and if they did, it's because they needed those good grade upvotes.
>Remember kids, you get good grades, your related genetic material male has more karma which means more toys!
>The age of consent has been lowered. It is Reddit, after all.
>Anyone who disagrees with any of this gets banned.
Imagine a funko pop stamping into the face of man. Forever.

>>92491213
Meh I call it something other than WW3 in setting, I'm just giving cliffnotes here. The civil war is just that too, idiots with magic & a stressed government unable to figure out what to do with it before other parties decide to declare independence.

>>92491346
None of this has anything to do with topic at hand

>>92490472
>There's not a way to do this that doesn't piss people off.
Basically this.
If you try to do it, as a non-native, there will ALWAYS be a group of twitterite keyboard warriors who are like
>Why is a white guy doing this?
>You didn't do enough research
>This is not properly representative
>This is simultaneously too close to real, my life is not your fantasy
>Oh you're clearly obsessed, stop acting like we're a cool idea and not real people

I'm not saying you should not do the thing you're doing, OP, I'm just saying that you should absolutely be prepared for twitter to open fire on you, and the only thing that will change is what part of your work they decide to rip into.

>>92490908
Nah.

>>92492999
and on a more "actual worldbuilding advice" level, the kind of detail that will be considered "correct, respectful, not just the white man fetishizing natives" is not the kind of detail players tend to want.

The average player does not read the lore of whatever game they're playing in detail, and if they do, the lore is surface level. The kind of details and stories and such you'd need to supply to convey the differences when the cultures are this similar is too much. Very fucking few players stop to read, say, every story cut-in box in a WoD rulebook.

Telling stories usually relies on reducing things down, not going autistically detailed. Players are not gonna want to read a 200 page lore-only handbook on why this group and that group are subtly different, nor are they going to remember all of these things in play. There's a reason that star trek liked the "planet of hats" formula so much - viewers immediately grasped it. If you have to stop every time your players meet a new group and explain what they already know for 15 minutes, they're gonna get bored.

The level of detail that will be demanded is not the level of detail that most TTRPGs want.

My one bit of advice: don't go the Coyote & Crow route and actively try to alienate any non-Native players from playing Native characters in a Native setting "out of cultural sensitivity", and then later tell people they're racist if they don't play Native characters in a Native setting.

Choose a goddamn lane and stick with it.

>>92493780
Also, be sure to have a freaking game. Pit the tribes against each other at a tribal level, and people at the personal level (unless your goal is to play in the "Noble Savage" myth), create some good external threats that are valid too. Might go watch the movie "Blood Quantum" for some ideas on a zombie apocalypse, but people of Native blood are immune to it ("what if I'm half Cherokee, and a quarter Ute?" "Welcome to the question of blood quantum!" "Hey, that's like the movie's title! So do they address that issue?" "Uhm, no, not really. But it's got Native actors and Natives behind the camera. And zombies." "Sold enough!" (it's actually a decent enough zombie apocalypse movie))

>>92490395
>My problem becomes that I don't have a good idea of what kind words to use to name the area/nation
just use the real names the places had? I'm sure you can research that yourself
>i respect native people & want to give them a win in my setting
cringe. Not what you said, but the fact you felt the need to say that.
>Different tribes have different languages & even then, would they just use english because its convenient or a native language for heritage?
idk man, you're the worldbuilder. You decide. I don't know anything about how the americans and native americans interacted.
>I can't find anything that speaks to how they viewed & labeled shit beyond their own individual tribes
okay? use that as a basis. your players won't be able to tell the difference.

>>92490395
It wouldn’t be a single nation, any more than Europe is. You’d get a confederation of their nations if they banded together, especially since the main reason for them TO band together is to retain their identities. The main language spoken at international meetings would likely be determined by the nation wielding the most economic and military power—if they settled on a single language at all. However, it wouldn’t be unreasonable to instead see heavy use of translators.
>in the great plains & some of the southwest
If you’re going to do this, PLEASE look at their original territories, rather than going for a post-Trail of Tears paradigm.

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If you find the specifics too daunting just use broad culturo-linguistic areas, as in pic related.

Like India, there could be 5-8 official languages in such a large and diverse confederation and it could still act like a representative unity.

>>92494734
>heavy use of translators
Maybe. Historically, there's also pidgins, trade languages, and sign languages that regions would develop. Contrary to what was said in the thread earlier, chains of trade and cultural exchange (and war, and raiding, and all the other vices of humanity) connected people from now-Peru to now-Alaska, now-California to now-Florida. People ended up with artifacts and stories from across the known world.

I just don't believe OP when it goes "I'm working on a setting" no fucker you're not.

>>92490924
The point of the prior anon's wasn't to persuade, it was to bump while concern-trolling.

>>92495536
>They can barely lead a protest
What was the Trail of Broken Treaties, then?

>>92495002
Did the natives themselves have a word for "Great Plains"? Cause I looked into the Cheyenne & the Souix & I saw something about the "Algonquin" being some type of overall culture but I can't find any kind of information about larger regional culture names, only the smaller individual tribes. It's like finding Wales, Scotland, England & Ireland but not being able to find the name United Kingdom, or Great Britain, or any of those kind of subcatagories. You guys say "hey look at Europe as a guide" but Europe had things like the Holy Roman Empire which included multiple kingdoms within itself, or even just the EU being a political power of multiple nations working together. I'm just trying to have a few tribes under one umbrella. Right now it's just a nameless place on the map, I have other factions that will need to refer to this territory, it's not the centerpiece of the game I intend to run, but it needs a name. I'd be like making a NOTEurope fantasy game & leaving Russia blank, technically I can do whatever I want, but the people in the setting would still need to have a name for it.

>>92493780
The game isn't centered around the Great Plains, it'll be along the Mississippi & it's tributaries. If a player wants to play a native I don't care one way or the other, but there are plenty of white/brown/black/yellow/blue/purple Americans around too

>>92495456
I am, if you don't believe me leave the thread or sage I don't care about your negative fucking attitude.

>>92491273
How about "Dakota Reclamations"?

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>>92490395
>"Nation"
Counterpoint, you should form some kind of confederation based horde that is about to make the rest of the continent shudder.

There are already First Nations with histories there. Dakota, Steppe Cree, Crow, Pawnee, Blackfoot, Sacree, Plains Ojibway, Teton, Omaha. And those are the pure cut and dry groups, not even getting into others or the Metis. You can contact them for info because we're in the information era. But to create a major contender, you need something that transcends the smaller tribal variations and takes advantages of the strengths of the regions. With a Confederacy you can take any of them, or any other group that finds its way there and forms a cultural entity that accepts hegemony. Not just Metis but any post Colombus people. Hosts of Mormons, Navajo, Canucks, Afros and Hoosers joining in on the upsetting of the balance. Pick a starting point and pick a Khan of the Freed Nations. The rest; the linguistics and the commerce will fall into line.

>>92495456
If you don't believe people that claim to be doing low effort shit like "working on a setting", what the fuck do you believe?

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>>92496291
This is roughly what I am aiming for. If you have any more info I'd appreciate it.

This is a rough map of the territory in question. It goes from north of Texas up into the Canadian wilderness. Everything else is ruled by different factions of Old America.

>>92496444
So to cross examine this with Anon's language map, you'd be looking at an alliance of nations in the Blue area with some of the green. Attitudes between these (First?) Nations vary but they generally unite to keep outside factions from fucking around in their borders. Even nations with historical beef like Dakota and Ojibway take a policy of Me vs My Brother, we brothers versus my cousins, we cousins versus the rest of you white eye fucks.

>Serious contender for least progressive person on this board
>Still running a better setting involving the natives than OP
In my post-apoc setting the Inuit won out because the NWO types didn't give enough of a fuck to try and save them from the coming Enfuckening when they kept going 'Get on the train and get taken to a place we don't know so you can help us? Yeah, we heard that one before. Pull the other one.' Only for them to win out because the entire shelter thing was a roach motel for humanity itself.
Now all of the survivors are, to some degree or another, clinging to the Mighty Quinn for salvation.
You need to be less self-conscious, that's the trick at the end of the day. If you spend all your time wondering if someone is going to get offended or if you've white mans burden'd hard enough by giving them The Nice Things then you're not going to follow the logical throughline of the setting.
Do, there is no try, ect.

As a man from Oklahoma, I've always found native chicks to be hot. That is all I have to say.

>>92490434
Perhaps a learned skill. Pox is a city disease. Eurasians are used to city diseases because of millenia of dense city building.

>>92490395
>My problem becomes that I don't have a good idea of what kind words to use to name the area/nation.
It would just be the US but without the hardcoded racism and slavery, anon.
After all, the Constitution was just plagiarized from the Great Law of Peace from the Haudenosaunee.
So if you're wanting a conglomerate of nations joined together as super state... Native Americans literally invented the concept.

>>92510435
And what would it's name be?

>>92511430
United Nations of America if you're boring.
United Tribes of America if you're larping.
United Khaganates of America if you're mongol larping.

>>92490731
You know, natives are (somewhat dependent on how you count them), a pretty small minority of the population, so in the case of a war that ravages the continent their numbers would be even further reduced.

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>>92511430
>Horselands Confederation
>Buffalo Confederacy
>Firebelt Grasslands
>Smoke & Grass Covenant Lands (tribal pacts often took the form of two exchanged tokens)

See https://dictionary.plainscree.atlas-ling.ca/#/results
>paskwâw
Dialects: Cree:
Grammar: Independent, 0s
Immediate Derivation: /paskw-/ + /-â/
Stem: paskwâ-
it is prairie, it is open prairie, it is bald prairie, it is treeless grassland

Also, regarding languages:
>Two other communication systems bear mention. The Métis of the Canadian Plains spoke Michif, a trade dialect that combined Plains Cree, an Algonquian language, and French. Michif was spoken over a wide area. In other areas many tribes used Plains Indian sign language (PISL) as a means of communication. This was a system of fixed hand and finger positions symbolizing ideas, the meanings of which were known to the majority of the tribes of the area.

You know what would be fun? The southern empires pushing their way north. The Aztecs are an easy example, but we all forget that the Aztecs never pushed north because there was another Native Empire north of them that had Copper and Bronze tools and weapons. What if one of them settled their shit with the other and went expansionist into North America.

>>92496199
>How about "Dakota Reclamations"?

The Dakota are a specific Native group.

And frankly, not a very well-liked one (in the period right before getting mogged by America, they were a violent people who were at war with basically all of their neighbors).

I'd stick with Prairie.

>>92490395
>what kind words to use to name the area/nation

I'm an fbi Nez Perce, I'll say something you can consider or not. Various nations and tribes in this world use the terms nations and tribes mostly. Some internet research in this regard could be valuable if you look at it right. There's a few who call their collectives something else, but I can't think of what they are now. One was a tribe I visited in Washington State. Another was one of the tiny reservation in SE California.

Nez Perce are a /Tribe/ with various /bands/ within the tribe. The Navajo are a /Nation/ made up of /clans/.

As someone said just below your OP, there's no way to do this that doesn't piss people off--yeah, maybe. But doesn't mean you shouldn't try if that's what you want. From my perspective, if you don't intend harm, I don't infer harm. I've had a few decade in this world to hone my bullshit meter, and it goes off a lot around (mostly) white college kids in the rpg world--a precious and unique snowflake recently told me I was like a self-hating Jew because I call myself an "Indian" instead of... whatever she thought I should call myself; I told her she was being anti-Semitic for the self-hating Jew comment which everyone except her thought was funny--but it's nice when I encounter someone honestly trying to get into crossing cultures.

The Balkanized bit seems just as precarious, but also equally as interesting. Does the balkanized US nation have it's own Tito as Benevolent Dictator, or is it in the midst of a Slobo rising to power?

The cause of this war is gonna put as many 4chan fa/tg/uys into a tizzy as playing with Indian nations likely puts the whiney college kids into one. Which means: it must be a Good Idea®.

You need a mechanic were the Spaniards come and start to the impregnate all the women.

>>92514539
Thanks for the info. Is there any place you recommend for me to research?


The balkanization goes pretty much

Northeast - Evil magic hating corporate empire, pretty much a dictatorship of rich assholes operating in the open instead of behind closed doors. They are the "true American government"

Southeast - good ol' boys still holding on to the "old America republic" ideals made of southern states that took issue with how the other guys where doing things.

Heartland - the best military magic users in the world, but led by a bunch of bickering self made "kings"

These three fight the most & mostly seem to forget that anything west of the Mississippi.

Mississippi - Merchant kings & taxes, anything is for sale

Great Plains - mormon compounds, Elf refugees, & Native Americans, all failing to get along

Texas - Texas pretending it deserves to be relevant.

Southwest - Madmax, Las Vegas, Area 51, & Mexican cartel lord's

Northwest - evil magic users and mutant super soldiers

Cali - California finally broke off with Baja California & now its a bunch of gay pirates & hippies

>>92490395
Look up landback on twitter and copy that

>>92490395
This channel has given a lot of influence to my own worldbuilding, maybe it can help:

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCEqNbbsx0i7fhwRt0saYIcQ

It's more about archaeology instead of tribes as they are today, but I'm sure you can find something useful in it. My setting is pretty much derived from an interest in North American geography and its ancient societies, though I wouldn't say I an trying to do an alt history as much as I'm using them as a basis to develop from.

As for naming, you might want to use English because everybody knows it, but if you want to do something interesting you can try implementing Hand Talking which was apparently a widespread sign language used as a lingua franca throughout America.

>>92496444
I dunno. Any Native American state would quickly follow Sterling's Dies the Fire and look European after two generations. They've intermarried extensively with the Europeans and in the aftermath of the apocalypse, they would have to make alliances with their neighbors in order to survive. Pure blooded natives really do not exist anymore, both sides of the Rio Grande. A Native Arminger trying to create a LARP ethnostate would get ganged up on by the neighboring white supremacists and the cartels who now find very convenient allies in the midwestern farmers.

A wise chief would have to play up the native shit while intermarrying with the landholders, maybe playing up saving farm girls with los illegales as a propaganda move (Mollie Tibbets is still remembered). The chief would also need to integrate the Dutton types into the government before Sanchez de Cartel and the Fuher make better offers. And make no mistake: one tribe would dominate and rise to prominence. Since it's the Midwest, it's probably the Sioux peoples.

It'd be an interesting state, but man. They'd look more Cimmerian than Lakota in forty years.

I mean, it really depends on what natives yous talking about.
Like, I tried looking into it and hoo boy there's fucking trillions of them seperated into millions of different culture groups. It feels like north america had like fucking five europes crammed into it.
But as a guy with Haida blood in him I'd say that Raven is a must include. Raven is a cool fucking guy.

>>92520064
You poor little flaccid mommy's boy racist.

>>92490395
Look up the major reservations across the United States, most of them are associated with their own tribes and it should tell you where they would crop up in different places.

Something you should know though is that Natice-Americans are very westernized. Most of the reservations look like your typical white-trash suburb (except with native-americans). So you know, they're not hunting and skinning their own deer unless it's with a rifle and the good-old-boys. They're gonna expect plumbing, electricity, wifi, all that stuff. At least as much as anyone trapped in flyover country does.
>>92490593
Confederations/Federations were common and would probably continue to be likely as people naturally are gonna want to pool resources to increase their communal power.

English would probably be the common language for these polities- use of native-american language is rare and even if it wasn't different tribes have different languages. Correspondingly- there'd probably be little point in changing all the signs around to rename things. For instance, most Native Americans still use the term 'Indian' even though that's a misnomer that dates back to Columbus. But they use it because they didn't have a word for 'everyone whose not a white guy' before white people showed up, and 'Indian' was a good a word as any. Similarly I imagine they wouldn't feel the need to invent new place-names for locations when every Native-American in the country knows what Texas is. Probably they'd reserve names that would distinguish locations from the United States identity in like legal documents (like say renaming Texas as 'The Native American Federation of Texas').

>>92519688
Modern day tribes are pretty socialist sharing what little wealth they make equally amongst the tribe (it's Indian Casino's are often seen as pillars of the community because the wealth they make gets divided amongst the tribe).

They straight up mail you checks if you're in the tribe. Though they require you to be sober (in terms of both alcohol and drugs, I think weed is fine) and you need to have a certain level of tribal heritage. IE if you marry a white (or asian or black) guy your kids get half as much money as they would have if you married a native american guy. Naturally this is an effort to preserve their heritage, and also try to keep the community from drifting apart and depopulating.

>>92490395
Best I can give you is that following the Boogaloo, the Republic of Texas (I don't know your setting but I'm just assuming Texas is one of the post-bellum states. I'm also assuming mostly contiguous tech levels not Mad Max esque wastes) decides they need a buffer state on their flank to protect from the North/East. Ever since the States started to seriously fragment, Native activists have been pitching the idea of an Indian "superstate" open to immigration by people from any tribe, nation or with sufficient native blood. The idea is controversial even in native circles, but Houston decides to propagandize the cause of a "powerful and sovereign Native State," and essentially gifts the eastern half of Oaklahoma and a portion of Northeast Texas touching the gulf to a combined representative government of the Indian nations of Oklahoma and Texas. The new state is named Hassina-Oklahoma after one of the earliest known settlements in the Red River region. While it is open to native migrants from anywhere in the Americas, government is principally by elected representatives/elders of the Cherokee, Choctaw and the other larger groups of the area. It's an imperfect and fractious union to be sure, but statebuilders in Houston hope that with access to a gulf port and a well-funded police force to fight systemic problems Hassina can grow into a useful vassal-state. The project goes awry however when the Hassina Tribal Congress begins cutting its own trade deals with various nations, making the most of its bustling gulf port and leasing its fishing waters to other nations for a cash surplus. As the statelet survives its first years, economic migration from North and Latin America grows, as natives (and those who can pass for such) of many cultures are drawn to the dream of a strong and independent tribal republic.

>>92524551
I wasn't planning on doing throw backs to buckskin loincloths & wigwams dude. I mean horses maybe, cause horses will be useful, but shaman magic will be a thing & I like the visual of a power armored dude with a headress & totems/emblems carved on his armor.

>>92514049
I was thinking Dakota the state, but you're right. How about Navajo Nation in the southwest & the Great Plains Confederation in the middle? That way there are two politics & it doesn't feel like a homogeny of "ethnic people here".

>>92526097
Okay, just had to toss that out there in case you know. Lot of stereotypes about Native Americans that don't apply in the modern day.

>>92526103
That's okay. Mostly i want them to be just another group of Americans, just ones with their own unique subculture at the forefront. I'm trying to avoid the "primitive" or whatever you want to call it aspects, no flint arrows, they have .308s. You see that in Shadowrun, where the 80's native-sploitation stuff was big so they have magic natives with magic bows on bulletproof buckskin, completely ignoring that they've grown well beyond that by this day & age.

>>92526229
Yeah, in my experience (which granted is not a lot) most Native Americans are basically the same as any Western Americans (which is to say 80% redneck, 20% cowboy) outside of having to deal with the reservation system and the cultural holdovers they've managed to maintain.

>>92520586
Case in point, if you dare to point out historical facts about someone certain people have deemed "protected" they scream wassism.

>>92527008
Your fetish for something does not make it a fact.

>>92527118
Bold of you, of all people, to say.

>>92490395
Just read a history book OP. Pick a tribe you like, read a book about them, and then write. These worldbuilding threads are always research threads in disguise.

>>92527118
It's a fact the tribes went to war for land and slaves against each other constantly, considered rape to be a natural part of war, and never came up with a written language until white people introduced the concept to them.

Ben Garrison

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>>92490395
>NAm RPGs
Far West is Based

>>92528775
I made no obfuscation that this was about research

>>92528775
Not OP. Got any particular tribes in mind, other than Aztec? I'm kind of doing similar - creating a fantasy race inspired by amerindian culture.

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Who remembers this trash?

>>92530494
I felt the best thing to do was not read it, so I didn't accidentally transgress by imagining things that my ethnicity is not permitted to imagine.
or to be more honest, I didn't read it because the author seems more interested in ideological masturbation than actually having fun

>>92530533
Yeah I didn't read it either for the same reason in your spoiler but some anons had and they were talking about it.
I think the funniest thing is the "nanotechnology 3D printer shit" that crafts all their weapons, armor and items for them.
Crafting should have been a trope to lean into heavily here and they handwave it all with "technology magic"
A little ironic considering the cultural importance and skill required in handcrafting all your tools and weapons. You'd think an author interested in "ideological masterbation" wouldn't erase their own culture with "robots do everything for us now"

>>92530985
I can understand wanting a culture to not be seen as "stuck in the past doing underwater basket weaving by hand", every culture tends to embrace new tools and techniques eventually unless they are HEAVILY curtailed by some overarching authority, typically a religious ban.

So I see why he'd say "we also use the nanotech" if he's actively trying to move away from the "hurr injuns still wear buckskins and whittle their arrows with a rock" stereotypes.

but like I said I have little interest in seeing what he thinks or why since he's such an aggressive dick about it all.

>>92531056
I'm not saying they have to weave baskets and knap their own flint arrow heads with a rock. I'm just saying having the "magic technology" craft everything takes away from a major trope they should've leaned into.
It's like taking away the craftsmanship of dwarves and giving it to robots controlled by the dwarves.

>>92531175
Yeah, I get what you're saying. Honestly this is tempting me to read it more thoroughly as an exercise in how not to make people wanna play your game.

>>92530494
Never even looked at it cause it looked really bad.
>>92531175
Like make the nanocrafting or whatever it is an art, & bringing it into the cultural mentality than to just make it & leave it as a sterile setting feature?

How would your culture (in your opinion) treat power armor, lightning guns, & small REALLY good energy storage batteries (enough to facilitate said scifi tech)

>>92524582
They're also extremely autocratic. The two most important people are: the Casino owner, and the Sheriff. Whatever the Casino guy says goes and the Sheriff enforces it. The worst thing Chief Royal Flush can do is alienating his neighbors, especially since the midwest has a ton of neo-nazis, off the grid survivalists, cartel compounds, shit they even have cult compounds and freaking LDS strongholds. An ambitious chief would need to wino over the 'normal people' in order to even remotely stand a chance otherwise, they're lining up for brandings from Jose los Vampirio or Kommissar Himmler or sitting in a congregation chanting 'MAKE US WHOLE.'

>>92524551
>Most of the reservations look like your typical white-trash suburb (except with native-americans).
Watch Chloe Zhao's 'the Rider.' It's a really eye opening look at modern native americans.

>>92528983
The Comanche were particularly infamous for it. They were a big part of why Mexico never became a superpower and lost the southwest as they killed so many people and burned so much infrastructure.

>>92533202
Here's an idea. The Lakota have to face off with three major rivals:
>Cartel, with clown killers. They're feudalistic as fuck with manors and serfs, even if the names are different.
>The Fourth Reich (one of them, anyway). They LARP hard. Hated enemies of the Reds.
>The Church of Unity. All worlds will be consumed and made one. We will all become one. MAKE US WHOLE!

>>92490395
You got a capitol or place of significant import to the founding of this faction? You could go with "Confederacy of [thing goes here]"

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>>92530494
Came across several copies in the local Barnes & Noble last year. Flipping through it I got a chuckle at the task resolution mechanic of hitting a seven, and my mind went to playing craps at an indian casino.
Made it trough about five minutes of an actual play before shunting the video off.
Some nice art though.

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>>92490395
Take a look at a setting that's done it already, Shadowrun. Then poach what you think works about how they did it and start brainstorming things you'd like to see based on what you think didn't work from their vision.

>>92534360
The only interesting thing Shadowrun did was the Ghost Dance

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>>92519688
They already survived the apocalypse. What people saw until maybe 1899 literally was their Mad Max Biker phase.

>>92533298
Could you imagine? The natives only winning due to their neighbors being batshit insane? Vampiros and the Nazis fighting over sex slaves while the cult guys go full helter skelter. Things get even weirder when the true post-apocalyptic groups begin to appear like cargo cults and tribals, and the mutants if you truly embrace the genre. The age of the Red Man has come once more because the White Man and the Brown Man went bonkers while the Green Man lurked in the fallout.

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Since this is post-apocalyptic or whatever, I'm going to say that the Feds got Thirteened. This is now canon! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m_y4Ao5L6G8

>>92534067
>unopened shrinkwrapped books on his rpg shelf
This guy is 100% a grifter.

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>>92490395
Have you considered Rifts Spirit West? Written by an artist with part-Indian ancestry and has lots of amerindian lore and magic. Rifts Canada also has a lot of aboriginal magic, fetishes, totems, spirits for the Innu and other northern Indians.

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>>92490395
>tfw there is only one god, but that god has different names that describe aspects of the god, since his entirety is too great to be understood by mortals.
> that god, Heart of the World, to describe that he is the center of cosmology and that everything gravitates around him, wanted to create worshipers
>He failed several times with men made of clay and wood, until he finally created men from plants.
>an act of worship that allows the first men to orient themselves in their world by inserting themselves in the time of the divine, which includes defeating death
>Jaguar of the First Day is sent by Heart of the World to punish those who believe they are gods and break the harmony of society
>the dead go to the underworld without anyone judging them
>The underworld is controlled by lords of death, led by Bone Trail, who symbolically represent the common causes of death for men of that time.
I know it doesn't have much to do with op's question, I just wanted to put what I've read recently.

>>92530408
I'm just gonna go read some books.

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It better have some sick ass art

>>92544254
I'm using my own drawings & AI for art. I haven't made any with natives yet though

>>92490395
Shoo AI slopper

>>92545250
To be fair, I didn't realize it was AI when I posted it. 90% of Google images are AI anymore

>>92550592
Google decided that the human centipede is the model case for their services a while ago, yes.

So is this a world building thread or not? The After the End mod for Crusader Kings is giving me ideas.

>>92552890
I'm not sure. I AM building a setting. But mostly I'm just asking questions & trying to get an understanding of things

>>92552196
now I gotta go listen to that song about the human centipede again, thanks.

>>92553210
What are you going for? Post-Apocalyptic (Fallout), Post-Post-Apocalyptic (Leibowtiz)? Because the two bring apart vastly different living situations and threats. In one, you have to fight off raiders and mutants. In the other, rival nation states and religions. In the former, you're dealing with the Master. In the latter, you're facing off against the Hannegan and the St. Louis Vatican or someone like Caesar.

>>92554376
"Reconstruction" after a near apocalypse

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>>92541485
I'm just gonna spitball here. The reason why the Feds didn't try to enforce their rule over the scattered and emaciated survivors is because they were destroyed by Mutants, possibly one of their own creations. Then the super mutants pour out of the secret government base and try to conquer the wasteland, making the local Reich and Cartel raiders look like nonissues to the Native tribe. They're stopped by pic related who kills the mutant leader and... Sets the foundations for the tribe to make a comeback.

Yeah, just copy the Fallout I story with a Native American Vault Dweller and integrate it into the mythos.

I like the Mapuche.

bump

>>92563779
Just let it die, I've gotten enough info to work with & now its just some retard talking about fallout

>>92534360
I can't believe they avoided research so much they didn't even get to the surface level knowledge that Sioux is a racial slur. They named one of their countries "Niggerfaggot".

>>92490395
>Different tribes have different languages & even then, would they just use english because its convenient or a native language for heritage? I can't find anything that speaks to how they viewed & labeled shit beyond their own individual tribes, nor do I have a friendly native dude to ask these questions too.
This is because there isn't some big Native American superculture. You can probably find some interesting commonalities or similarities, but you're going to be better served picking one or a few tribes and drilling down on them.

>>92490593
[Republic/Confederation/etc] of:
- The first letters of the founding tribes or groups' names, ala Pakistan (Panjab, Afghan, Kashmir, sIndh)
- America
- Indians (Amerindians often prefer "Indians" since they're both fake-ass exonyms anyway and that's one that's older/they grew up with)
- Some disgusting mush of words Amerindians use to describe the region in their different languages, like Chimerica in Hidden Agenda (all of Latin AmeRICA from CHIle to MExico)
- The name of the region in one of the languages, selected at random or whoever's the biggest.
- The official English name is something like "Confederation of North American Tribes" and then they just call it their personal equivalent for those words.

>>92528983
White people didn't come up with written language either, though.

>>92530408
Depends on what you want. The Quechua ran the Inca empire (hard to summarize, but big and interesting for sure), the Iroquois had an independent large federated polity, and the Comanche were horse nomad psychos.

>>92565607
"Turk" used to be a racial slur too. The Turks were a really small ethnic minority within the Ottoman Empire and Attaturk (which literally translates to "Father of Turks") and the Young Turks reclaimed the slur hard when they rose against the Ottoman regime.

>>92528983
There were multiple writing systems, you fascist retard. The rest of what you listed is just "generic human warfare".

>>92568023
Linked the wrong post?

>>92490395
>pic
Dude needs to choke out a wolf to get a boner.

>>92570186
Truly, people are people all over.

>>92570186
Maybe he has a certain knowledge and now he wants to prevent it by setting an example?

>>92570186
Seems normal to me

>>92490519
On top of this, you've got tribes that were in the same area or region but never ran into each other for a variety of reasons (such as sheer distance), tribes that only came to prominence after colonization (the Lakota were able to barter for smallpox and guns and went on to conquer the Midwest until Manifest Destiny caught up), tribes that were the post-apocalyptic remains of a big civilization (like the Mississippian civilization or the Ancestral Pueblo giving rise to a bunch of splinter tribes after their collapse), and tribes mostly isolated from others, like Hawaiians and Inuit.

I, for one, want to see more Hawaiian stuff to educate dem haole.

According to the Bloodlines book Gargoyles can be subjected to the enchant talisman ritual & then they can become the object focus for other rituals. Does this include Wards cause that would be a baller way to wreck shit

>>92565833
Love this, glad I still checked on this thread. I'm interested in an empire so I'll definitely check out the Quechua, but the other two seem interesting too. Thanks for the recommendations.

>>92565783
Written language spread with civilization, but indians hadn't managed it at all.

>>92569821
Wrong on all counts. Or did you think you could "um ackshully" Mayan or Aztec wirting and hope it counted?

>>92490395
Would they be based on the actual tribes as described on first contacts, or the modern histories served in most reservations?
I imagine if they were to returns to tribal settings many of the more warlike ones would revert to raiding other tribes and slavery.

>>92577990
They are based on regular ass natives in America given 20 years of near future tech, followed by about 70 years of intermittent civil wars