You need to be level 14 in Pathfinder to cut someone with a broken bottle.You need to be level 12 to kick someone in the balls.Both options are strictly limited to a specific class.This is coming from a system where PCs quickly become untouchable gods to regular townsfolk, much, much before they can knee their nuts.
Anyone can attempt to cut someone with a broken bottle or knee them in the nethers. The former is an attack with an improvised weapon while the latter is an unarmed attack.You're focusing quite heavily on the flavor and attempting to claim those feats are the exclusive way to perform those sort of actions, and I'm going to be extremely disappointed with /tg/ if this thread has any further posts.
>>97584943>Implying OP doesn't already know all that.
>>97584943You can make a creature take bleed damage with an improvised weapon baseline?You can make a creature sickened with an unarmed attack baseline?
>>97584870No, you need that in Pathfinder 2, which took a lot of the dogshit gamism from games like 4e, ironically enough.
>>97585015>You can make a creature sickened with an unarmed attack baseline?You can with a level 2 rogue feat, its just a lower condition to sickened and isnt assured to inflict a status effect with a single action. This is high level because of the extremely good action economy. Pathfinder is a fucking revolting system i wouldnt wish on my worst enemy, but this isnt why
>>97585203Anyone should be able to attempt it without a feat. This is what Dirty Trick should have been, instead of the dogshit they printed several years after the system came out.
>>97585211PF1e>You can attempt to hinder a foe in melee as a standard action. This maneuver covers any sort of situational attack that imposes a penalty on a foe for a short period of time. Examples include kicking sand into an opponent’s face to blind him for 1 round, pulling down an enemy’s pants to halve his speed, or hitting a foe in a sensitive spot to make him sickened for a round. The GM is the arbiter of what can be accomplished with this maneuver, but it cannot be used to impose a permanent penalty, and the results can be undone if the target spends a move action. If you do not have the Improved Dirty Trick feat or a similar ability, attempting a dirty trick provokes an attack of opportunity from the target of your maneuver.>If your attack is successful, the target takes a penalty. The penalty is limited to one of the following conditions: blinded, dazzled, deafened, entangled, shaken, or sickened. This condition lasts for 1 round. For every 5 by which your attack exceeds your opponent’s CMD, the penalty lasts 1 additional round. This penalty can usually be removed if the target spends a move action. If you possess the Greater Dirty Trick feat, the penalty lasts for 1d4 rounds, plus 1 round for every 5 by which your attack exceeds your opponent’s CMD. In addition, removing the condition requires the target to spend a standard action.>muh AOONot nearly as disruptive as they are in 3e and there are many ways to minimize the risk.
>>97585211Anyone can make other people bleed in pf2. But not anyone can inflict the bleeding status condition.Do you think characters who get stabbed by a sword aren't bleeding? I don't like pathfinder 2 either (it's just a worse D&D 4e just like pf1e is worse D&D3e); but your complaint doesn't really make sense in a system with abstract HP like any version of D&D and pf.
>>97584870This is also coming from the system with demigod street thugs who are each as deadly as a dragon or lich
>>97584870Woah, Pathfinder is shit? Stop the fucking presses!
>>97584870You can cut someone with a glass bottle or kick them in the balls. You don't get to automatically do a bunch of status effects to them. This is how the game represents the fact that level 14 characters are better at fighting than level 1 characters.
>>97584870>plays gamist filth>surprise pikachu face when you stumble in gamist nonsenseHow about you play an actual ttrpg instead of something you can define at best like an analog video game? Pf2e is the kind of game you have to approach as a strict tabletop skirmish game with absolutely no immersion through your "character" which isn't anything more than a set piece over a board, play it as you would play fucking heroquest and you'll be fine. If you want a real ttrpg either go simulationist (brp, gurps, traveler, rolemaster, ad&d, etc...), narrativist (pbta, fitd, fate, pta, risus, etc...) or anything in between these two coordinates (genesys, savage worlds, mutants and masterminds, etc...). If your game has character options that are excedenly granular, nonsensical (as your example) and exception based then you're playing a fucking board game with customizable set pieces, not a ttrpg.
>>97585778>wojak nigger makes a retarded postevery time
>>97585545>getting cut from a bottle doesn't make you bleed unless it's from a high level character, and it certainly would never leave any particles or shards, and such an injury definitely wouldn't impede one's ability to fight, unless the wound was from a high level character>getting hit in the balls doesn't cause nausea unless it's from a high level character
>>97586296No, it doesn't automatically inflict the mechanical status effect. Do you fucking think every single sword attack in the game should do DoT because there's a bleed effect and swords cut you, you fucking retard?
>>97585808>>97585778I can't think of a time where a wojack has EVER helped the person who posted it on /tg/. It's always been a mark of a brainless outsider here.
>>97586315I think the developers of a system should take more effort to make that system more consistent.Things that would affect normal people like us, like shards of glass and nausea and bleeding, should be lower level, especially considering once you get into higher levels you're facing monsters from other dimensions and existential threats. You don't need to be able to fight a dragon to cause bleeding with a glass bottle or nausea from a nutcracker; these limitations don't make characters feel like they're exceptional. In fact, it makes them feel even more pathetic than the average human of our world.
>>97586355It is routine for DMs to describe characters being negatively affected by attacks, which then have zero mechanical teeth. Disorientation from a strike to the head that's just 10 damage. The feeling of cold in your extremities as you approach your last few hit points. Bleeding and bruising from wounds. Then next round you act normally with no notes.These feats provide a severe, reliable, mechanical bite that is not normally present. The fact that you see the words "persistent bleed damage" and begin crying that "SO YOU CAN'T BLEED AT LEVEL 1???" is because you are deeply retarded.
>>97586381You spout the word retard and talk about retardation, but you demonstrate your inability to either read a post, or to address its point.What DMs do isn't the point.The "mechanical bite" should be reflective of character power, and measurable against the threats they are expected to face. The only time a higher level character should be getting bar fighting moves is when the game is about becoming a better bar fighter; if the game expects you to be facing world-ending threats and interdimensional monsters, a character should have learned those petty bar fighting tricks, or other moves equating to that level of mundane a long time ago.Ignore the point again, and you expose yourself.
>>97586631NTA but I think the point of the abilities isn't "you have to be level 14 to kick someone in the nuts", but more like "you have to be level 14 to kick someone in the nuts hard enough to impose these effects"
>>97586715Why would you jump into a reply chain you didn't bother reading? Just to repeat what that other illiterate already said?
>>97586756Sure, why not?
>>97586790>redditAh, that explains the illiteracy.
Level 14 is definitely too much, but I actually think it'd be an interesting idea for a lot of rogue abilities as they level up to be tied to overcoming one's own aversion to fighting dirty. In real warfare one of the biggest issues armies have is getting recruits to accept the moral responsibility of killing or crippling another human being. Usually their first instinct will be to shoot over the enemy's head.
>>97586870You should only be able to get the effects of shooting over someone's head at level 20, because that's good, consistent game design.
>>97586814>on 4chan>"reddit"But I'm the illiterate one.
>>97586897You are slime.
>>97586901Oh right, I forgot you can only get images like that from reddit, and not a website like... Oh, I dunno, a fucking IMAGEboard, maybe? But we don't have stuff like that, reddit's the only place you'll ever find pictures of anything ever.
>>97584870your lack of reading comprehension is why everything gets written out explicitly to a patronising level these days
>>97586952Stay mad you got called out.
>>97586967Kill yourself faggot. You don't even use 4chan
>>97586978Go spam your shitty reddit art somewhere else.
>Alright, what's everyone playing?>Just a simple farmboy fighter who took up a polearm and armor in search of adventure.>Just a common thief with a light spear.>Just a wandering minstrel, a bard with a bit of magic.>Just a village friar, a cleric with some healing prayers.>A LITERAL DEMIGOD! I AM THE MAIN CHARACTER! MY POWERS ARE STRONGER THAN YOURS BECAUSE THEY'RE DESIGNED TO BE!The absolute state of Pathfinder... you're sure it's better than 5.5e now?
>>97586990The fact you instantly recognized it as being from a reddit post tells me all I need to know
>>97586715At level 12, you can kick someone in the nuts very efficiently. You grapple, strike, and impose a negative effect all in one action, while avoiding the multiple attack penalty between the grapple and strike.This would be fine if there was a level 1 action that could just impose the negative effect in one action. As it stands, level 12 is the only precedent for kicking an enemy in the nuts.Similarly, you should be able to deal a small amount of bleed damage at level 1 with a bottle. Maybe by forgoing regular damage, or only on a crit or something.But Paizo is extremely stingy about codifying things in a system that's designed for it. Instead we only get mechanics for making a request or holding your breath after someone farts.
>>97586991What's the issue?There are abstractions, so inconsistency is okay.
>>97586997Yeah, it's not like there's anything that could make such a search as easy as breathing.How could an anon who doesn't even use 4chan find the source of an image so quickly?
>>97587025HOW COULD IT BE FOUND SO QUICKLY ??
>>97587006Yeah, but have you considered that abstractions make inconsistent game design okay?
>>97587037>from a roleplaying game>REEE REDDIT REERemind me again how I'm the illiterate one
>>97587062You demonstrate an incapability to properly respond to information arrayed before your eyes through a language medium.That's how you're the illiterate one.
>>97587083>wordswordswordswords>now I'M the smart one!Okay faggot
>>97587097>wordswordswordswordsYou'd know how to read those words if you weren't illiterate.
>>97584870kek what a horrible game
>>97587138What do you mean?Name even one flaw.You can't.
>>97584870>You need to be level 14 in Pathfinder to cut someone with a broken bottle.and deal multiple dice of persistent bleed damage as a bonus top the damage, effectively doubling your damage for at least one round and probably several more.>You need to be level 12 to kick someone in the balls.As part of a double attack that also inflicts a condition on the opponent at the same time with no extra penalty applied to the second attack, so you can suffer no penalties to either attack while also inflicting a condition.Disingenuous cunt.>>97586991"If you mix normal characters and mythic characters shit gets broken!"No fucking shit moron. that's why that is an option and not the norm.
>>97587244>deal multiple dice of persistent bleed damageHilarious you would call anyone disingenuous
>>97585015>moves the goalpostsI don't even like PF2e, I think it's simultaneously bloated dogshit and undercooked dogshit, but don't be disingenuous.Your initial statement was:>You need to be level 14 in Pathfinder to cut someone with a broken bottle.>You need to be level 12 to kick someone in the balls.>Both options are strictly limited to a specific class.As has been stated, you can still glass someone, you can still kick someone in the balls, but if you want the extra effects you do need the feats.
>>97587343You can't do those things. You can just make basic strikes.You can't stop someone's heart with a single touch either. Yet according to you you can, because reflavoring rules that don't match something at all mechanically is the golden standard for you.
