I've never seen a single legitimate argument why this game is "bad" let alone the worst souls game. It's always just regurgitated opinions from a video essay.
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>>749237010black gulch and a few areas are legitimately bad + various bosses are uninspired.But that doesn't make the game bad, because it's been that way since DeS.2 is an experimental iteration on the formula, and people can't handle that because they wanted Das1: 2, despite also crying later about FROM rehashing too much.2 also tried new things like dynamic boss fights which people never give it credit for
>janky animations>key content cut >bad systems like durability and torch time>good systems like poise totally busted Otherwise it’s a gem in the rough
>>749237010The fromsoft community aren't exactly known for being intelligent. In fact the entire fandom is based solely around memes and get their ideas exclusively from them and ecelebs.In reality DS2 is one of the better Dark Souls games because the environments actually have thought put into them and there's rewards for exploration. That shift triggered the cattle though because they were used to running past every enemy to the boss. When that was taken away they had to cope with "the game is just shit bro," "the hitboxes don't make sense bro," "those archers clearly in view on ledges above me? They're hidden and cheap bro."
>>749237010It's the best FromSoft game but still not a good game.
>>749237497Yeah exactly, excluding 3 Soulsborne games are all very creative with many innovations. People just think of them as rollslop but they iterated on the formula immensely between all games (apart from 3, which is just 1 part 2).DS2 is the most metroidvania-esque in the series, with branching dead end paths, some of which can only be reached by having specific items/stats.Also>Respecting>Ascetics> Hexes>Wider fast travel>Power stancesFromsoft add and remove more shit each title than the Pokemon games
>>749237929It also did a lot of things to make the game harder which, naturally, caused an insane amount of ass blasting >can be attacked at any fog gate which cancels your attempt to go through>iframes are no longer free and have to be adjusted two separate ways through adp and atn >back stabs have a start up animation and cant be initiated 10 miles away >dedicated guard breaks actually doing their job which took away everyones turtle shell >mobs arent powerless to stop players from sprinting through everything and are deliberately placed to punish you for doing so >additional enemy placements in ng+Dark souls 2 is without question their most hardcore experience and that is far too much for normalfags to handle
Imsim elements were underbakedAnimations are poorer quality and relatively weightless compared to even DS1 and DeSSoul memoryMost bosses and the OST are quite mediocreEnding is an anti-climaxCan't repair weapons at a blacksmith unless completely broken, making the otherwise fantastic Exalted Conqueror run kind of annoyingStill a great game, but quite rough around the edges
>>749237010I will tell you then, this game is the worst Souls because it wanted to dive too deep in the being hard aspect. Souls games are not about being hard, they're about the dark journey.The stacking HP loss penalty for dying was too harsh. Estus should heal you instantly like in the other games, not heal you over time. The base i-frames on rolls were too low, and the player character speed was too slow with high stamina costs for everything.The mals also had way too many enemies, weapon durability decayed too fast. There were too many hassles making the game too stressful and difficult, the game was punishing and not comfy like the others.
>>749237010Ignorance was defeated/v/ is a DS2 board now
>>749237010Another great shit bait thread, same one sharted out for years by now. Can't get enough of it, don't stop! (stop)
>>749238909>Souls games are not about being hardThey are now that normies use them as bragging rights.
>>749238452>can be attacked at any fog gate which cancels your attempt to go throughThis was simply retarded. On some bosses like Smelter Demon you had to actually kill the enemies on the run back, or they would fuck you up before you could enter the boss arena.It should be like in the other games, you spawn super close to the boss to try again or you can at least sprint and ignore the enemies in the run back. Some run backs were simply too long and absurd
>>749237929Every souls game rewards exploration and has thought put into the environments, that's like the baseline design philosophy, which 2 doesn't do much better or worse at than the others
>>749237010Worse areas, less interesting to explore, more linear with less optional rooms and shortcuts to find and everything is connected in a nonsensical mannerTerrible enemy design, lack of variety, all humanoid type of shit and shit ton of mobs everywhereWorse controls, lacking full 360 movement and working solely on 8 directionsShitty bosses, boring to fight, boring visual wiseRidiculous enemy tracking, full 360 degrees don't matter if you try to move aroundWorse hit boxes, completely bs shitEnemies have infinite stamina, no cool down between attacksPoise is none existentI-frames are locked behind a status that needs levelingOnline matchmaking relies on amount of souls you collected You want more?
>>749237010funny, I've never seen a single legitimate argument why this game is "good" let alone the best souls game. it's always just mindless retarded tribalism that ignores actual legitimate arguments because some of those arguments might've come from a video essay.
>>749239171>you have to kill enemies on the run back forcing you to play the game >just take the run back out and spawn me outside the gate so i dont have to play the game Elden ring really was catered right to you brainless mutants
The game didnt feel all that difficult to me (aside from DLC)The aggro that you pull if you try to ascend towards ancient dragon, was the only time it felt like I had to run past the mobs (and managed to at the third try, despite the last three dracoknights or whatever they are called being placed to fuck you up if you try)
>>749237010I like the DLC a lot but outside that I think the game is quite disappointing. There are basically no good bosses in the base game.
>>749239168From soft falling for the meme is exactly the problem
>>749239361>ADP badoh no, you have to put points in it unlike DS1 useless stat (resistance), what a tragedy
>>749237010Saying that you've never heard a single legitimate argument on why DS2 is bad when it's been discussed ad nauseam for years on every social media platform since it's release means you're just a faggot fanboy with your head in the sand. Anyway my main issue is that the base game is such a drag to complete to get to the DLC. It's a game that's 60-80% fluff to get to the parts people actually talk about liking. Also lifegems are too easy to get and it makes estus completely pointless post last giant.
Would people complain as much if it was a Kings Field title and not a Dark Souls title?
>>749239854ADP sucked mainly because there's nothing in the game that tells you what it actually does. When you level up anything else you can see the relevant numbers go up in your stat screen, but there's nothing that tells you when your iframes increase. You just have to upgrade your ADP enough that you start to feel the difference, and the difference has to be significant enough that you can't chalk it up to getting better at dodging. Realistically, most players will only learn what it does because they went online and read about it. And yeah, once you know what it's for it's not that big a deal to put some levels into it, but it still leaves a sour taste that the game never tells you something as important as this.
>>749239432Not only Elden Ring, but all the other games on the franchise. Face it, Dark Souls 2 was too hard and stressful, that's why it's the most hated game on the franchise
I'm playing it again since Seamless dropped, it's been at least 10 years since I touched it. There's some very minor complaints but it's still amazing.
>>749237010Any time this game gets defended there is nothing positive to say. It’s only “this game isn’t that bad bro”. Yeah that’s totally a reason to play the game.
>>749237010I just like it for having it's own story and not sucking Ds1's cock like 3 did. Vendrick and Aldia are cool characters and emerald herald is best girl.
every time I try to play it I am repelled by its troublesome quirks that just feel so bad to stomach. I don't hate it but it's the sort of game I'd have to give a shit enough about to mod all those problems out and boy I tell ya I just don't give that much of a shit. I'll be playing sekiro, dark souls 3, bloodborne, and elden ring instead, if I play anything at all. I'll play a knock off like lords of the fallen or the surge before I play dark souls 2
>>749239432The game is the exploration, not the combat which has always been mediocre on its own but is good for adding tension to the act of exploring. Forcing more combat for the sake of it just pushes the experience further towards mediocrity.
I don't think it's bad but I do think it's ugly.
>>749240376Nice picture for ants, nerd.
>>749237229Aiiiieeeeeee! Is that a square room? AAAAAIIIIEEEE Mr orangeman save MEEEEE!I... Is... Is that an empty square room just like in my HECKING creepy paste Rino's!
>>749242565this but unicornically
>>749237010i found the game fun but there are some legitimately retarded decisions, specifically related to aggro, that make me groan when I play it. The dlc's are the worst when it comes to iron keep tier 'enemies rushing at you from off screen'
>>749240601alright that's fair, I can agree
>>749241407oh, that's pretty cool
>oh boy cool torch gameplay>game's not dark>looks like shit in most places
>>749238909Dark souls 2 isn’t that hard though. The stacking HP loss is just a balanced iteration of the soul/human mechanic in DeS. >but what about the cringe cutscene where they say you will le die Not really a big deal compared to actual gameplay mechanics.
>>749240637>>749240835I can only be happy that fromsoft still hasnt given these types of “players” the actual easy mode you constantly end up on your knees begging miyazaki for
>>749237010It's bad because it's too hard
>>749238909Objectively correct post.
>>749237497black gulch is pure kino.Yes i ran through it without dying my first time and it was super hype, sorry it was a pain in your ass.
>>749238909IIRC the characters move a lot slower when you try to strafe and when you lock on, so people that complain about moving slowly are just causing their own problems by trying to play the game like its ds1. walking without lock on makes you much faster in combat
too much corridor walking
>>749244230There doesn't need to be an easy mode, it's just that every souls(like) game should be exactly as difficult as Demon's Souls/Dark Souls 1, the only correct difficulty.
>>749239171No, you're just soft
>>749237010Ok we all know DaS2 sucks so my question is what creates a DaS2 contrarian?
>>749245973>what creates a DaS2 contrarian?someone who think DaS2 sucks
>>749245973Thinking Dark souls 2 is bad IS the contrarian opinion. Thinking it’s the best is also contrarian. But bad? Yeah ok lmao the sequel sold like hotcakes that doesn’t happen to shit people hate
>>749246256>the sequel sold like hotcakes that doesn’t happen to shit people hate
>>749237010I just want to play this on mac, does anybody know the best way? I tried pixel port and it's honestly dogshit
Its the only souls game where you can be a bare fisted fighter and laugh at all the equipment damaging enemies.Bare fists deal insane damage with Vanquisher's seal.
>>749246512Install system32
been playing a lot of this again since SC came out but my friends don't usually have time so i've been creating pvp invader builds in my spare time. playing through the game to make them is fun in general, buildcrafting in this one beats out all the other souls games except maybe elden ring
I have my criticisms I have them for all the Souls games. After Elden Ring I kinda want them to go in the opposite direction back to Demon's Souls. I'd rather have like 6-7 highly polished "legacy" dungeons that you can complete in any order (with changes depending on what you do) then more open world slop. Also someone teach them how to write they are really leaning on visual designs and everyone loving it when a VA with a UK accent talks ye oldey.
>>749239171>never played the gameRetard, if you kill them 10 times they're gone forever. If you're having that much trouble on a boss the runback actually becomes easier than the other games, if you ACTUALLY PLAY THE GAME
>>749237929>the environments actually have thought put into themOh yeah like the lava elevator
>>749246453Are you actually, fundamentally, mentally retarded?Do you think people are more likely to buy something else in the same series if the previous entry is:BadOrGoodHow’s Star Wars going buddy
>>749237010Game feels like shit fundamentally because of the deadzones and poor animations. If you play Dark Souls then Dark Souls 2 it's immediately obvious DaS2 has inferior gamefeel.That by itself is enough to rate the game the lowest in the franchise, we don't even have to talk about the actual content (which is endlessly flawed).
>>749247970>If you play Dark Souls then Dark Souls 2 it's immediately obvious DaS2 has inferior gamefeel.Didnt happen to me, on the contrary even. I like the game too much to move on to DaS3, currently on my second character (sorcerer, magic only with a dagger main-hand to finish off mobs). >>749240990how is it ugly? just the view from Majula is better than anything in the original
It's simply because of the name. Dark Souls 2 is much more of a sequel to Demon's Souls in terms of gameplay, world structure and overall tone than to Dark Souls and that disconnect is where most of the problems stem from.
>>749237010Souls players are unable to alter how they play these games. Thats why when ER dropped everyone was autistically screeching that you could use summons. It took me 5 minutes to get used to the movement in ds2 but for some people I guess thats too much work or something
seamless mod unironically fixed most of the game's issues (too many enemies yet too easy, poor deadzones, soul memory, etc.)
>>749249636soul memory is an extremely funny flaw of dark souls 2 because it doesn’t actually matter but has no reason to exist it really just doesn’t come up, you can coop a boss for dozens of hours and not get filtered by soul memory, it just doesn’t happenbut at the same time, why? It’s like if you installed a giant guillotine to sit right above your bed as you sleep. You know it’s safely secure and isn’t going to fall and kill you. But literally why? It still makes you think >ok but what if I do get filtered by soul memory/get killed by this giant blade
How do I move the statue out of the way from the leverOr am I supposed to fight all those big dudes at heides first
>>749237010poison lava tower elevator
>>749237010>Agility is an awful mechanic that makes the game feel bad to anyone who doesn't look up what to do on a wiki>All the good boss fights are in the DLC, so people had months to collectively form an opinion that the game was undercookedMatthewmatosis is still a retard
>>749246512Just use Windows 11, buster!>>749246630LMAO!
>>749238909>The stacking HP loss penalty for dying was too harshSomebody hasn't played Demon Souls
>>749240835Forcing you to kill enemies during a boss run back us good game design. It punishes the player for dying to the boss and creates more stakes.
>>749237010just don't care what fat loser game boys think unless you're knowingly one of them
>>749237497Black Gulch is amazing once you learn how to run it cause it's linear as possible.
>>749239421Majula is by far the best hub area, by a long shot.
>>749252859Indeed. Has the best fire keeper too.
no infinite red eye orb
>>749253030stop invading people
>>749237929>DS2 is one of the better Dark Souls gamesThere are three Dark Souls games. It is the third best.
>>749237010It tried being experimental with random things while horrifically undercooking everything that made the first game good. Level design is especially bad.
>>749253281never, it's too fun
>>749253030This!>>749253281>Wahh stop invading me because I'm too scared about getting humiliated when I get killed by enemy players! :(Kek!This is what you sound like!>>749253647I'm glad that you're having fun.
>>749253281Just dont connekt to the internet bro
>>749253801But I like the messages
>>749237010The game is filled the the fucking brim with design choices that can only be described as "but WHY though?" That's al I have to say on the matter.
>>749253883>need humanity>try rear>amazing chest ahead>be wary of sniperI mean once you've read one you've read them all
From someone who likes the game just fine, the legitimate arguments are:>Soul Memory (Scholar added a ring to mitigate the effects of SM, which is an admission by FromSoft, as far as I'm concerned, that it was not a good system)>ugly in places (lighting and textures range from PS2-tier to very good)>movement feels slower than DaS, and rolls aren't as "free" unless you level up Adaptability>generally unpolished, with some janky animations and grab hit hitboxes, although these latter are present in every From game to a greater or lesser degree>enemy placements are sometimes a bit much, testing your ability to manage a crowd rather than responding to an interesting movesetPeople say Adaptability is just a bad addition, but I've always contended that it was necessary once they added Vitality as the armour stat, evening out the stat spread for builds.
>>749237010Arguments for DaS2 being good boil down to>but they tried something different!!! It's different so it's good!!!!! YOU DON'T UNDERSTAND!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>>749251787It's only potentially good game design if the combat and level design are good, and DS2's are generally mediocre, so all it accomplishes is making you replay a bunch of mediocre content for the sake of difficulty.
>>749237010It feels bad to play, something between the animations and sounds or whatever, it just doesn't feel good.
>>749257785Many of the changes made for DaS2 have been included in each subsequent game, so clearly they were on to something.
>>749237010It's jankino
>>749237010It's a good king's field game but not a good souls game
shitty gamereally bad
>>749247069No. In the other games there's no run back at all, you respawn at the boss door, or you can easily and safely just run and ignore all enemies because as soon as you start the entering fog animation you're invincible. Also enemies in Dark Souls 2 chase you for way longer compared to the other ones.
>>749251669Dark Souls 2 penalty is harsher. Demon's Souls will halve your health but it will stay at that. You can keep trying the level/boss without being too fucked. Dark Souls 2 if you keep dying you need to burn an effigy, it's not really viable to keep trying and learning patterns with 10% of your maximum health as the maximum
>>749261993I haven't played DaS2 in a long while, but I'm fairly certain that hollowing maxes out at 50%.
It has the best artstyle out of the three. 1 is too generic and 3 is overdesigned. 2 has this fairy tale vibe and everything truly feels dusty and ancient.
>>749237010>this opinion is invalid>…because it also appeared in a video essay???
>>749248456So do you enjoy games set on the moon?
>>749261707>literally has never played a souls game except Elden Ring
>>749261993>>749262382Even so you can just cling ring in Demon'sWorld tendency was overblown too I think, only in NG+ was it particularly noticeableYou can get really strong really early in Demon's Souls either way so it's not like it matters as much
>>749261707>In the other games there's no run back at alli miss when people didn't shamelessly bullshit like this
>>749237010>I've never seen a single legitimate argument why this game is "bad"And you never will, because it isn't.
>>749237010Replayed it with seamless co-op. It's actually insanely bad in some areas and the bosses are all garbage but that's mainly due to the series getting better bosses over time. Adaptability, garbage animations, and lack of stamina combined with hordes of enemies that can recover and trade blows with you easily make it a terrible experience. Not to mention the game is ugly as fuck. Uglier than the 2 games before it, and no the lighting system doesn't make up for it.
>>749261993%10 only happens when you're marked with sin, which is when you've killed innocent NPCsOtherwise it caps at %50, just like demon souls
>>749237010I like the MP system of DeS, DS3 and ER better than the fixed number of spells of DS1 and 2
>>749245091>IRC the characters move a lot slower when you try to strafe and when you lock onThey don't, compared to DaS1. 2 lets you move faster, more responsively and and more freely while locked on. The core mechanics are just better.
>>749237010Maybe if you weren't a pedophilic shit eating nigger you could tell when a bad game is bad.Get well soon, nigger.PSStop eating shit.
>>749245973They were molested when they were kids.There is no difference between jacking off to Sonic, raping children and liking DS2.
>>749262725If you discount every legitimate argument you can say there is no legimiate argument.Simple mind of a sexual deviant.
>>749250228eh? isnt soul memory just there so you can get matchmaking around your lvl?
>>749250358you need a fragrant branch of yore to cure petrified people, they are scattered all over the game and some you can buy from NPCs (like the old lady melentia or whatever's her name).
How do people normally distribute stats in souls games? I've just been doing enough to equip a weapon then dump the rest into like str or dex, do people normally invest into hp and stam?
>>749269678for normal characters, i usually dump ~5 points into VIT. Then the rest into whatever primary scaling stat + END.
>>749269678In DS2 you need a lot of HP to trade with enemies (because it's a shit game).
>>749237010>I've never seen a single legitimate argument why this game is "bad" let alone the worst souls game.ADPnerfed health after death ruins the game
>>749270748just dont get hit, you retard.
>>749237010no balder side sword
>>749237497black gulch is 20 seconds long
>>749273626>nerfed health after death ruins the gameOh boy you would hate Demons Souls.
>>749237010Well, to be honest.I would never call DS2 bad. It's just the least good one.Genuinely would still play it if the PvP community was still alive and popping, people talk about the abundance of souls as if it were a negative but I found it made everyone have the freedom to do crazy and dumb shit with their build that made the PvP a fun guessing game.But nah, the PvP is dead, so too is my interest.DS1 for level design.DS2 for PvP.DS3 for fun bosses.If you dont agree with me you're 98% chance a larper who never played a single Fromsoft game aside from Elden Ring, 2% chance clinically retarded.
>>749253281>red man bad
>>749269678It's honestly something you should look up info online for due to the mechanics of multiple different soft caps and the like. DS2 in particular needs an explanation for AGI which is one of the most important stats in the game.But yeah, HP and Stam will usually make much more of a difference than extra damage stats will, at least up until you start hitting soft caps.
Im playing it with my friend in coop. My two biggest issues are1. The game feels like shit unless you upgrade your agility so you have to spend early game on this tax instead of making yourself stronger.2. We have completely different builds and we are not able to kill treasure lizard reliably, it would be great could if your guy attacked the target im locked in
>>749237497>people can't handle that because they wanted Das1: 2Oh really? People wanted the sequel to be a sequel?Shit I never thought about it like that. You're so fucking insightful.>despite also crying later about FROM rehashing too muchImagine getting your opinion filtered by the fucking goomba fallacy and still getting it wrong.You can make DaS 1: 2 without rehashing shit. Game companies do it all the time.
>>749263318DaS2 has a cling ring too though? and you get 4 fucking ring slots.
>>749237010If you watch videos of idiots who shit on the game you quickly come to realise just how bad they are at it, but instead of acknowledging they're shit at video games they just blame the game.
>>749276223Yeah aiming attacks in DS2 is fucking atrocious.I understand you're not always meant to lock on, especially in group fights. But when I am locked on, it's honestly pretty mandatory for my attack to consistently aim at the guy I'm locked on to.
>>7492763151. Post gameplay footage.2. Hi, hbomb fan. >>>/lgbt/ is that way, >>>/pol/ is that way, >>>/out/ is that way. I don't care which one you pick but you'll feel more welcome in one of them.
>>749237010Brown people just want hype aura moments so From gave them DS3 and they ate it up as the best game even though outside of 5 bosses the rest of the game is complete shit.DS2 is rough but at least was experimental, an invader npc that uses mimic, one that disguises as an ally phantom, this shit would be so easy to put in a later entry but they don't do it, because they learned to play it safe. If the game is not about rolling and the epic bossfights then it's bad.
>>749276387Not an argument, I accept your concession.
I'm more lenient on the games flaws because it tried a bunch of new things of which some of it sucked but mostly because of the rushed development.
>>749276432>I don't basedface at the cool bosses with unique movements, cutscenes, attacks and rewards.>Instead, I basedface when a player model npc follows a set of scripted actions.
>>749275867It doesn't matter in Demon's Souls because it's an easier game with better hitboxes and no fucking adp. I love Demon's Souls, i hate Dark Souls 2.
>>749276935Anon basedsmirked as he basedposted this
I have 250 hours in Demon's Souls, Dark Souls PTDE, Dark Souls Remastered, and Dark Souls 3. I have 300 hours in Sekiro and Bloodborne. I have 700 hours in Elden Ring. Shit i even have 100 in AC6.I have 15 hours in Dark Souls 2. It's just a terrible fucking game.
>>749240835>Forcing more combat for the sake of it just pushes the experience further towardsNightreign
>>749238909Das2tranny has literally 0 counter arguments to this post lmao
Its not even debatable to me that 2 is better than Souls 1. Its like saying Sonic 1 is better than Sonic 2 or ME1 being better than ME2. ME1 has it's strong points but ME2 as a whole is undoubtedly the superior game as a whole and the one you are most likely to replay. Regardless, Dark Souls 1 lovers are mostly driven by nostalgia.
>>749270748which enemies force a trade? I dont remember this ever happening besides blue smelter demon draining your hp on proximity (and the queen if you dont destroy her curse-inducing flames)>>749277570>It's just a terrible fucking game.why do you feel that way?
reminder most DSbabies started with DS3 which is the worst one and it's not even a dark souls game, being a bastardization of bloodborne combat with swords and endless rolling
>>749277602Pointing out a mechanic and saying that it's bad is not an argument. DS3 has HP loss too but nobody cares because the health bar doesn't display it, each area has 20 repair powders and titanite shards so you can use several different weapons without caring about scarcity or grinding, every single gank can be evaded by throwing an alluring skull or kiting the enemies towards open areas. Or better yet, just use the 1H UGS moveset for crowd control.
>>749277801Not an argument, I accept your concession.
>>749277909Thank you, /v/GPT.
>>749277743>why do you feel that way?Because literally every single part of the game is bad. Moving and playing your character feels sluggish and unresponsive, hitboxes are absolute garbage, blocking feels bad, the zones are boring, most of the bosses are boring, the game just looks shit visually, i think the npcs are boring, the health penalty on death sucks, the way healing is done sucks, the stats suck, the way you level up sucks, fragrant branches of yore are fucking annoying, soul memory is retarded, weapons lose durability too quickly, etc. Majula has nice music. That's it. That's the only positive thing i have to say about the game.
>>749238909>The base i-frames on rolls were too lowI never understood this complaint. I never levelled agility playing this game and always felt like I had enough iframes to roll what I wanted to roll.
