>>58253979
contend*

>>58253979
>I watch le youtube man and parrot xim now

File: stantler in the bushes.png (441 KB, 508x381)

441 KB PNG

>>58253987
I think pokemon challenged is a gigantic fucking retard by the way and I spent a good while advocating for Stantler when dexit was initially announced. It's literally nostalgia carrying these games, not even RBY has nearly the same amount of issues comparatively.

>>58253979
>I think the game excels at aesthetics
That's the only thing manchildren care about. They reward ideas over execution. None of them play the games and their opinions don't matter.

>>58253994
You think Gen II nostalgia is bad, we're living in an era where people think Gen III were ever good games. Masuda's a hack fucking fraud who was afraid his road to fame and fortune would ever end so he coasted for over a decade on what his senpai did for him after he crashed out from being unable to meet his deadline for the actual Pokemon 2

>>58254012
>I love shit designs and graphics
found the BWfag kek

Every single Pokemon game singleplayer is piss easy where you one shot 90% of your opponents with super effective moves

>>58254020
RSE has literally none of the issues I listed by the way, and the worst you can really say about them is, at the time it killed transferring periodically, and Ruby/Sapphire are very ugly for GBA games, whereas GSC look amazing for GBC games. Masuda was at least able to outdo gen 2 as a whole before becoming a corporate faggot.

>>58254023
>Every single Pokemon game singleplayer is piss easy where you one shot 90% of your opponents with super effective moves
Yeah so imagine the game where you one shot 90% of your opponents with regular moves because devs thought it would be funny to make the average level 15-25 for nearly all of the runtime lmao.

>>58254027
>RSE has literally none of the issues I listed by the way
yeah, because it has new issues

>>58254027
Gen 2 was already corptrash. The dex was designed to be marketable.

>>58254030
None of which obstruct the main adventure and story. You have so many more options and mechanics to play around with during a regular playthrough than you do in GSC, and you're actually rewarded for exploring the region.

>>58254023
as opposed to gen 2 where you one shot 100% of your opponents spamming rattatas

>>58254032
>people liking the designs is a bad thing
hello Unovatroon

>>58254032
All the dexes are technically marketable. Gen 2 got dumbed down for animators and plush doll makers
We call it "made to be shit on purpose" and the little kids ate that slop up

>>58253979
>a lot of the cool stuff is locked behind, not just late game kanto, but mainly very low spawn rates
a lot of the newer pokemon are deliberately 'meh' in comparison to the more common spawns. they're arguably there more for replays, post-game dex challenge, or an optional and almost 'hidden' hard-mode that you don't want the average player to stumble into. i think you also dismiss out of hand that all of the stuff in the game is cool. even if pidgey is familiar to you and everyone else who'd already played RGBY, it was here again with a new full-color sprite and an upgraded level-up moveset and tm compatibilities. everything was new and exciting
>this leaves 99% of the game to be very brittle and easy to combat, arguably easier than the Switch titles since after Bugsy, the game stops caring about having a proper level curve, you're always ahead even if you invest in a full party of 6
not if you invest in a 'full party' of more than 6. i think people who look at, for example, catching a caterpie and boxing it the butterfree after the first or second gym as some sort of sunk cost, suboptimal use of exp, or one-off exception, but it's actually modelling how you should play both RGBY and GSC. they didn't mean for you to maintain the same mons through the whole game, you were supposed to rotate everyone out
>movesets are ass, and while i'd rather every pokemon didn't have omni coverage to allow for team diversity, you never reach a fun or engaging mid game power spike in any type that isn't water
they're fine
>rewards for exploring are almost entirely intrinsice like more Unown or very underleveled unique spawns and gifts like Lapras and Tyrogue, completely antithetical to what RBY offered with 3 seperate legendary birds, all of which would likely immediately match your party level
these are 'hard mode' options which is why they're a bit hidden from the main trail. your criticisms are mostly this same non-issue being rephrased and reiterated

>>58254073
>it was here again with a new full-color sprite and an upgraded level-up moveset and tm compatibilities. everything was new and exciting
And that's a good thing which falls under the good aesthetics. Again they nailed that part, but having a Pidgey be in the game again when it's infinitely superior to the new region bird Hoothoot sucks a lot of the fun and joy out of using new regional mons.
>not if you invest in a 'full party' of more than 6
Thing is, literally every other handheld game is balanced to match a team of 6, the worst being usually underleveled encounters when at the Elite Four, not to mention if you're frequently swapping out more than 6 mons at a time, the final Red encounter goes from possible to requiring a lot more grinding than necessary, that or a lot of cheesing with healing, x items etc. Again RBY has a curve that respects and expects the player to have a full party of 6, whereas GSC doesn't, and will actively punish the player when again they start hitting those few spikes.
>they're fine
Not when say Typhlosion's best move until late game (late 50s) is Fire Punch, or when exciting moves like Megahorn on Heracross are locked until end game anyway. Shares similar issues to BW in that regard.
>these are 'hard mode' options which is why they're a bit hidden from the main trail
There's nothing "hard" about grinding up a L5 Tyrogue to late 30s just so you can use it at the tail end of your run. In terms of collecting and filling the dex, I have no issue with it. But as far as gameplay is concerned, it should be obtainable a lot earlier, which is the issue with a lot of these rewardmons or low percent spawns that litter Johto, and only fuels posts like the other anon made where the dex was only made for marketability and not substance.

>>58254104
>but having a Pidgey be in the game again when it's infinitely superior to the new region bird Hoothoot sucks a lot of the fun and joy out of using new regional mons.
>only fuels posts like the other anon made where the dex was only made for marketability and not substance.
Once again a zoomer who doesn't understand that Gold and Silver were created as "Pokemon 2" rather than "the latest games in the Pokemon Franchise".

>>58254127
>noooo it's a sequel not a new generation in the franchise, that's why we made it so shitty!

>>58254127
Fyi that doesn't excuse its problems, and that only really paints gen 2 as a cheap cash in rather than a legitimate set of games. The excuse of a "sequel" does more harm than good to GSC as a whole.

>Oh boy, I sure hope Kanto can carry this shit game after how utterly boring and awful Johto was! Surely them stitching on the last region as a heckin postagme will make up for it
*takes 3 steps into Kanto*
>runs into level 3 Pidgey with my team of level 40s
I'm sorry, but everything about Johto, including its overrated slop remakes, is poorly designed.

>>58254104
>having a Pidgey be in the game again when it's infinitely superior to the new region bird Hoothoot sucks a lot of the fun and joy out of using new regional mons.
"i dont like the hard mode option" ok?
>literally every other handheld game is balanced to match a team of 6
yes, a lot of your criticism of this game seems to be being upset at it for not being like the other games
>Not when say Typhlosion's best move until late game (late 50s) is Fire Punch, or when exciting moves like Megahorn on Heracross are locked until end game anyway
that's by design. it's fine. i have no idea why you think this is a problem. do you want these pokemon to have these moves earlier? surely that would make the game too easy
>There's nothing "hard" about grinding up a L5 Tyrogue to late 30s just so you can use it at the tail end of your run
in the context of the game as it exists, yes, that is "hard". you and i might both agree that it's more tedious than it is necessarily difficult, but that would be me conceding too many things to you. if your current team isn't overlevelled (because you've been rotating monsters out as the game design implicitly nudges you to do) then it ends up tricky to incorporate a very underlevelled pokemon into your team

your criticisms probably wouldn't exist if NPCs existed in the game to tell you these things more explicitly, and maybe they should be there to suggest things like that ("I used to use a RATICATE in my team, but as a seasoned veteran, I became able to master the hard-to-use DUNSPARCE! If you need a challenge, look for rarer POKéMON!") but it's kind of obvious after the first time you beat the game what you should experiment with on the replay, and I'd rather they accidentally leave too much for the average player to intuit, than the excessive handholding every game afterwards normalized

>>58254138
>designed with a different mindset and purpose? no, it's just shitty because hoothoot doesn't have a signature move and ability!

>>58254145
>after how utterly boring and awful Johto was!
a truly bizarre take that no one born before 2005 ever had

>gen 2 mons were designed to be shitty as a "hard mode" for the next playthrough
Is this the new cope? 99% of kids aren't playing the same game a second time, especially if they have to reset their file.

>>58254157
ask me how i know you're a zoomer who never played these games as a kid

>>58254160
Zoomers are the ones saying this because they have emulators. I sure as hell wasn't resetting my 200 hour save on my cartridge.

>>58254143
What does "a legitimate set of games" even mean? How is it being a sequel bad?
>it's bad because.... it's different from games made a decade later! different = bad!

>>58254147
>"i dont like the hard mode option"
Making it intentionally shitty and deflecting it as "dynamic difficulty" isn't a good thing by the way. There's no reason so many Johto Pokemon have to be understatted and underwhelming as a whole, and presenting it as a "hard mode" while all the Kanto Pokemon don't have this issue isn't a good look.
>yes, a lot of your criticism of this game seems to be being upset at it for not being like the other games
I don't mind when a game does something different, but what exactly is exciting about having nearly every trainer share the same low leveled party compositions and then punishing you with a high leveled Lance and Red fight if you decide to invest in a dozen different party members? Even the Switch games don't become this comically unbalanced.
>that's by design. it's fine. i have no idea why you think this is a problem. do you want these pokemon to have these moves earlier? surely that would make the game too easy
I'd rather the Pokemon be fun and unique. A 2nd typing would had gone a long way, and it's Chikorita that has the most diverse moveset of the 3, not to mention giving you better moves earlier would actually benefit playstyles like you offered where you're raising a dozen Pokemon since that would greatly reduce unnecessary grinding.

A lot of my criticisms wouldn't exist if, at the bare minimum, NPCs were properly leveled and scaled accordingly. You could Exp Share a lot of new Pokemon during the last leg of Johto and in Kanto if all the trainers were pushing high 30s low 40s. And it doesn't help where every other gen gives me a healthy, diverse amount of options, while in GSC my best moves for most of a playthrough are Ice Punch, Surf and Strength. It's just boring.

>>58254167
you're a dumb nigger who wasnt even alive in 2000. people have an encylopedic knowledge of all the pokemon and characters in these games because they played them over and over. it wasn't that we'd have a single 200 hour save, rather, we'd have several 50-100 hour playthroughs

>the distribution is shit because...uh....the game is a sequel you chud?
>kanto sucking ass is ok because...uh...n-no one who played the game before 2005 would ever say this?!
>the gym leaders not using the new pokemon is ok because uh...uhmn...misdreavus was suposed to be hecking rare and worthless, so enjoy seeing the gastly line for the 1000th time!
>the level curve being dogshit is ok because uh....poketubers!
It's time to admit Johturd was always dogshit and every defense for it reads as satire from nostalgia millennibabies

>>58254176
>Making it intentionally shitty and deflecting it as "dynamic difficulty" isn't a good thing by the way
it's not 'intentionally shitty'. it's the only viable way to introduce a 'hard mode' into these games. and not only is it viable, it works. that it doesn't do a great job of explaining this is an admitted weakness of the game. that you don't get it even after it's explained to you is a problem on your part
>but what exactly is exciting about having nearly every trainer share the same low leveled party compositions and then punishing you with a high leveled Lance and Red fight if you decide to invest in a dozen different party members
you can beat lance and red with a decent team in the 50s-60s. you don't seem too familiar with these games you're pseuding as having thoughtful criticism of
>I'd rather the Pokemon be fun and unique
"I want all the pokemon to have signature moves and abilities and they all need to have both physical and STAB options of both typings"

lol

>>58254153
At the time, most of the outrage came at gen 3 which killed transfers and worked to hard monetize and penny pinch the act of getting old Pokemon back, where gen 2 ended up looking a lot better comparatively through rose-tinted glasses.
Fast forward now where you can play every game up to gen 7 on your phone, and things are a lot more accessible than they were before, and the problems really highlight themselves. A lot of the primary complaints targeting gen 3 are gone because a few emulators give you the full experience anyway, whereas GSC still has a myriad of its issues, many of which carried over into the remakes anyway for some retarded reason. There's no more grass is greener scenario defending gen 2 or any of its faults unless you really want to compare them to the Switch games, which saying "gen 2 is better than swsh" isn't really an accolade.

>>58254185
>low IQ babble
we need to stop letting niggers post on 4chan

>>58254178
>they played them over and over
Now this is a zoomer ass take. Kids played the same file for hours on end. What happened to your catch em all collection?

>>58254185
>all youtuber exclusive complaints

>start new game
>trade late game johto mons into the new save
here, i fixed gen 2. can't wait to explore johto with my houndour, sneasel and larvitar

>>58254200
it didnt take anyone 200 hours to finish the dex

>>58254185
>high IQ aryan TRVKES
you’re right, johtroon is slop.

>>58254209
>spic larping as aryan
get back to work, pablo, or im calling ice

>>58254176
>And it doesn't help where every other gen gives me a healthy, diverse amount of options, while in GSC my best moves for most of a playthrough are Ice Punch, Surf and Strength. It's just boring.
>complains about team diversity
>picks feraligatr every time
Also, this complaint is nonsensical. There are literally more Pokemon with more moves available before the elite 4 in gen 2 than gen 1.

I feel like the biggest problem with Gen II is that it isn't as FUN as the two Gens around it. Kanto flipped between "this game is kicking my ass" and "I'm beating everyone's faces in" on a dime and that created catharsis and Gen III messed with the formula in a lot of fun ways via natures, abilities and Doubles that made you want to explore and see everything. II was just kinda mundane in comparison, it lacked that WOW factor outside of aesthetics and just puttered around.

>>58254190
>it's not 'intentionally shitty'. it's the only viable way to introduce a 'hard mode' into these games
They already did that with bug types though. Just that now instead of the bad Pokemon being contained to a singular type in the early routes, it's now a majority of the new dex that's bad to ellicitate this supposed "hard mode" which is bad. Again, none of the other games had to do this, and making Pokemon purposely shitty isn't a good design choice, even under the guise of "it's different!"
>you can beat lance and red with a decent team in the 50s-60s
You aren't hitting 50s-60s if you're raising over a dozen different Pokemon. You're hitting mid 50s by the time you hit Red fighting every single trainer with a party of 6. You're shifting the argument for some reason since I never implied the fights were impossible at low level, but throwing away a LOT of experience for an excess amount of Pokemon you aren't even going to use for over half the runtime ends up drastically lowering your odds of beating Lance and Red at those breakpoints unless you set aside some time to grind, which is tedious.
>"I want all the pokemon to have signature moves and abilities and they all need to have both physical and STAB options of both typings"
I just want the Pokemon to be cool to use man, and a lot of the Johto Pokemon aren't. Why does Noctowl learn Confusion at 41 and never gets Psychic? Why does Yanma not get any good bug moves, or any good moves in general? Why is Lanturn's best electric move Spark for 90% of a playthrough? Why is Typhlosion just Charizard but strictly worse in nearly every way? It's boring.

>>58254207
Teambuilding? Battle Tower? Fuck you I'm not deleting all that shit.

>>58254231
>Again, none of the other games had to do this, and making Pokemon purposely shitty isn't a good design choice, even under the guise of "it's different!"
post your hand, i dont believe you're not a stupid nigger
>You aren't hitting 50s-60s if you're raising over a dozen different Pokemon.
post your hand, i dont believe you're not a stupid nigger
>I just want the Pokemon to be cool to use man, and a lot of the Johto Pokemon aren't.
post your hand, i dont believe you're not a stupid nigger

>>58254213
>>58254194
Sad. Can’t actually defend her abysmally designed childhood games, so she starts spouting racial epithets.

>>58254228
I almost always use Chikorita for the exact reason that the water slot will always be my most diverse option, but a bulk of new party inclusions are either complete dogshit compared to the already included Kanto Pokemon (ie Pidgey outclasses Hoothoot in every way) or are obtained so late in the game that you're wasting time grinding Pokemon that will maybe be present for like 10% of the content, especially when many Pokemon don't have their movepools shine until the 40s and at best you're using Strength on most of the shit you obtain.

>>58254251
there's no point arguing with niggers, they're too stupid to understand the conversation

>>58254244
>no argument
ywnbaw

>>58254239
Most people who were playing gen 2 when it first came out were children, anon. Children don't do teambuilding or the battle tower. The only way you were doing those things is if you played gen 2 for the first time when you were already an adult. Which means you're either a boomer who played children's games in the 00s or you're a zoomer who played gen 2 for the first time last year.

>>58254258
>no hand
i accept your concession, nigger

>>58254254
I agree, Johto is the worst region and its fans are low IQ nostalgia babies incapable of defending it

>>58254267
>can't defend their shitty gen
>resorts to calling everyone a nigger
Johtards everyone

>>58254271
only way you could get that from this conversation was if you were a mongoloid retard. thanks for proving my point, take care now

>>58254252
>i have to have an entire party of johto pokemon because... i just do okay
>none of the kanto pokemon available count as diversity because... they just don't okay

>>58254261
children grinded their pokemon to level 100 for hours retard

>>58254294
I've never understood this argument. If you're playing a game that advertises itself on all of the NEW things you can see, find and do why would it be the player's fault for expecting such?

>>58254294
>none of the kanto pokemon available count as diversity because... they just don't okay
At that point why don't I just replay RBY or play FRLG instead? GSC isn't doing anything special comparatively, especially since we've established it's a sequel and not a new generation, and outside of Red and a better Lance fight, I'm getting a strictly worse experience with less care put into 2 sepearte regions as opposed to the fully established Kanto from the previous entry.

>>58254127
when i buy a new game i want to see the new stuff it adds. i don't care about the old stuff because i already saw that in the last game.
you don't make any distinction between the new and old stuff because gen 2 was your first game and you were a dumb kid who hadn't seen any of the pokemon yet.

>>58254296
Yeah, and then they reset their save. I know because I did it. And I wouldn't personally call it "teambuilding" when it's just a level 100 Blastoise with Surf/Hydro Pump/Strength/Skull Bash.

>>58254309
Transgendered hands posted this, I just can't prove it.

>>58254309
>sheeit muhfuggn poketuber be keep us johtimmies down n shieet bix nood muhfugga need dat KANTOOOOOO gibs

>>58254328
>cant say tranny
not suspicious at all

>>58254178
Now this is peak revisionism. Playing them over and over was only viable with ROMs, most kids redid the same shit on their save or leveled up mons.
>people have an encylopedic knowledge of all the pokemon
Don't kid yourself. Pokemanchildren today still forget the type chart and which Pokemon came from which gen (it's always gen 2 mons).

>>58254342
ywnbaw

>>58254339
You niggers are completely incomprehensible, nobody can understand what you're saying.

why is gen 2 the game that causes its fans to devolve into calling others niggers and trannies?

>>58254302
>less care put into KANTOOOO therefore it's bad
johto is full of love and care, with the time mechanics and pokegear

>>58254317
>just a level 100 Blastoise
sorry you were a boring kid. i would be devastated if i lost my box of level 100s.

>>58254358
Low quality games that can’t be defended on any of its merits

>>58254359
>barely any worthwhile timed events
>pokegear is an underdeveloped mess that only contributes to a broken rematch and swarm system
>they stopped giving a shit about the region after ekruteak anyway
Kanto in RBY has more thought and care put into it than both regions present in GSC.

>>58254380
>none of these new mechanics to engage with and new places to explore count as content
You've made your trolling too obvious.

File: 66e3f9a6e98d1a730d9ae55df(...).jpg (48 KB, 650x900)

48 KB JPG

>>58253979
>download crystal disassembly
>fix all of these minor issues with minimal effort
>tweak things to your exact desired specifications
>never need to buy another pokemon game ever again
it's just that easy

>>58254390
They don't because forcing spawns is dogshit and inconsistent, rematches give you trainer fights that will be severely under your level anyway, and timed events offer so little in terms of content it's like saying the shit and vomit weekly FOMO raids are valid additions to the game. It peaks at bug catching contests and everything else is just a 1 off event that lasts 30 seconds at most.

>>58254391
I agree to that, and a lot of my preferred playtime in the region has come from modded romhacks.

>>58254391
What your personal fixes?

>>58254358
the kids who played GSC on release are too old to be arguing about pokemon on the internet anymore. all that's left are the really autistic fans.

File: f0e55b607e4b76d37b360edf2(...).jpg (391 KB, 1423x1590)

391 KB JPG

>>58254409
I changed the distribution so that johto has much more johto pokemon avaliable and it's the kantomons that are rare until you get to kanto. Made the gym leaders and wild pokemon tougher so the level curve is a little better. Fiddled with base stats and movesets to make shitmons less shit. Swapped ghost and dark in the special/physical types. Gave Red a mewtwo and gave Lance 6 dragonites. Next I plan to take out some of the more pointless mons like stantler/igglybuff/cleffa and replace them with a few of my favorite newer ones.

>>58254409
Not him but
>houndoor available in dark cave at level 5
>your choice of charmander, squirtle or bulbasaud as your starters
>remixed more difficult trainers and gym leaders with better Johto mons like Claire with Kingdra and Morty with sneasel
>infinite rare candies available as an option so you don’t have to grind lower level captures to your current party level
>higher level wild pokemon and motto mons available in Johto
Now if only I could add in the safari zone to Kanto…

>>58254644
>>houndoor available in dark cave at level 5
too early
>>your choice of charmander, squirtle or bulbasaud as your starters
gay
>>remixed more difficult trainers and gym leaders with better Johto mons like Claire with Kingdra and Morty with sneasel
clair already has kingdra
>>infinite rare candies available as an option so you don’t have to grind lower level captures to your current party level
gay
>>higher level wild pokemon and motto mons available in Johto
what the hell is a motto mon

>>58253979
>living sprites
>playable female character
>battle tower
>multiple regions
>badass steel type introduced
>scissor
>tyranitar
>heracross
>secret endgame boss
>adorable house decorations
>the awesomeness that was pokemon stadium 2
Gen 2 was fucking awesome. Nobody thought it was bad until some popular retard started shoving their idiotic narrative down the community's throat.
If you said gold silver crystal were bad games back in 2001 you'd have been laughed out of the classroom and bullied relentlessly. Ironically it was gen 3 that people would have insulted you for admitting to liking back in the day, but everyone and their grandmother is obsessed with loving gen 3 today.