Do RPGs without numbers exist? does an RPG need numbers to be an RPG?
Can a retard make a thread? Does a retard need intelligence to make an interesting point?
Yes, there needs to be number and the numbers need to go up otherwise it's not an RPG.
>>3464979they could replace numbers with words likeSTR - weak, average, etc. instead of 1, 2, 3but it would only be an aesthetic change
>>3465035No, I was thinking an RPG that it works like one intrinsically, calculations from the engine's standpoint, but all is hidden to the player. The player would've to actually experiment and test different weapons to see what does what, how powerful they are, etc. It would be a game of guesses, I mean, from a certain viewpoint, the hero shouldn't immediately know that the sword in the chest causes triple damage to dragon type enemies, or that a foe is just one strike away from perishing. Hero gets stronger too but doesn't know the full extend of it, can't get too cocky by assigning his health to an abstract hit points count, etc
>>3465042character can't know, though in some cases he would know more than the player, but the player can. player not allowing mechanics to inform every decision=roleplaying. player understanding the function of things that he has no personal experience with=roleplaying game. obfuscation is dumb, though it's fine to require identification, through npc or spell, or experimentation to uncover those numbers.
>>3465042some older RPGs indeed hid gear stats (eg. Dungeon Master, Eye of Beholder) hiding player stats would be unusual, but not impossible
>>3465049>player not allowing mechanics to inform every decision=roleplaying/tg/, pls
>>3464979>does an RPG need numbers to be an RPGI don't think so necessarily. Numbers can also be detrimental to roleplaying, since minmaxing bullshit tends to get in the way.Stalker games would've been different if the game rewarded the player with experience points for engaging in combat. Without numbers going up, it's easier to see the world through character's eyes: combat is an unnecessary risk and a waste of bullets, NOT the last 50xp I need for a level up. Which is partly why the games are so immersive.
>>3464984>>3465008Niggercattle pleb.>>3465109Patrician.
>>3465109>muh immurshunonly people who don't like rpgs in the first place care about this. you are playing a character, not self-inserting.
>>3465148But I like RPGs, so suck my cock, faggot
>>3465174prove it.
>>3465178Are you waiting for some autistic "my fave rpgs" tier list? Don't.
>>3465182you could start by not praising non-rpgs as superior to rpgs
>>3465183Where did I say that?
>>3465109>Stalkeris FPS, not RPG
>>3465185So?
>>3465184by caring about immersion over mechanics. you don't like rpgs, you like rp, which you can achieve in any game at all. fags like you can't separate yourself from the experience of knowing that it's a game, you are no different than a minmaxer.
>>3465187Where did I say that? Are you sure you're not just imagining things, schizo anon?
>>3465189so you don't care about muh immurshun? why reply?
>>3465192Good talk, buddy.
>>3465197lol. it does indeed take two to tango. try saying something.
>>3464979All video games operate on numbers regardless if you can see them or not. Mario getting a mushroom is a +1 to his HP. Every time Mario gets hit he loses that and if he had no power up he is reduced to zero HP. This is how games work. They need something to keep track of so the computer knows what to do. It's all number based.
>>3464979nobody tell this dummy that the eggs used in cookies dont have potential for life anymore once shat out lol.
>>3464979On PC, no, since they are all computer programs that are made using numbers.On tabletop? Maybe, as there are a few diceless RPG's, but some may rely on resolution charts, which undoubtedly have numbers on them. Overall, you're asking a stupid and irrelevant time-wasting question. Why do you want an RPG without numbers? What would an RPG without numbers add to the genre? Closest I can think of is Zork, since it involves combat, it involves questing, but as far as I can tell, it has zero numbers, unless maybe for counting certain items.
What a terrible idea. What's the point?
>>3465466the point is subversion
>>3465494So no point
>>3464979All video games work with numbers you fucking retard
>>3464979i don't think an rpg needs numbers, they are just the easiest way to express vertical progression to a player, they are spawned, just like mathematics, to simplify the rules and metaphysics of a given universeso they might be hidden, they might be minimal but how would one do damage and combat in such an environment, one would need the numbers behind the scenes as for essentials like character progression and roleplaying; the industry is in a constant ebb and flow on the stat sheets, we see more devs go into the more hardcore direction of stat heavybut we also see the perk system and traits for example, or the whole of the immersive sim genre that allow you to build and customize your character using only specific modifiers and horizontal progression so if there is a way to do it it is the one with perks i suppose
>>3465148>your character knows what XP is
>>3465749who are you quoting?
>>3464979There's plenty of "narrative" game systems for tabletop RPGs, they don't translate well to video games since at best you'll get an adventure game with few predefined outcomes instead of the inherent liberty of real RPG. And, anyways, most cRPG players are autistic retards who only want a poorly designed "numbers go up" tactic games with shit encounter design.
>>3464979>without numbersYou mean like tiers instead?S, A, B, C, D, E, etc.
>>3465042I think this is a great idea for a game as long as you're creative enough to find various ways to signal things to the player
>>3464979Do Platformers without platforming exist? does an Platformer need platforming to be an Platformer?
>>3467465This is how the jews want you to think. Words mean nothing, there is no division between anything. Merge back into the creator god and end reality.
>>3464979Yes. Real reason why we have numbers-based rulesets is because it's the easiest objective way to measure and compare things. Math is math.
>>3464979id make him milk and eggs if you know what i mean (no homo)
>>3465035That's still numbers, anon. An RPG without numbers would be more akin to a puzzle game.
>>3464979You can't make a program without numbers
>>3467499>NobilisYou sir are my nigga and can come over and fuck my sister anytime.
>>3464979I'm making a rpg where there are no numbers, just graphs aso. All numbers hidden. I find the concept of starting with 50 hp and ending the game with 7879 hp idiotic.
>>3464979Yeah, the gameplay would have to avoid combat at all times though. It is *technically* possible.
>>3464979No. Yes. There is no such thing as an rpg without numbers.
>>3464979I dunno, and no.I'd say, navigating a web of events, and minor events chain-reacting into new events, and even new webs could all be created "without numbers."It may not be that hard to do, now that I've a second to ponder it. Thanks:)
>>3465148A character which is part of a world, a degree of immersion is therefore required
>>3468931>>3470642Nice. Imagine if all the time and resources spent on numbers and balancing them would instead go to designing multifaceted quests and the world, where you can't overcome impactful choices and consequences by grinding numbers up.
the real definition of video game rpg is a game that satisfies both of the following>an overt focus on numbered statistics>a storythat's it. if it has those qualities it's either an rpg or a hybrid genre like action rpg. no one can refute this.
>>3470977Yeah, it'd be simple in concept: Imagine a huge array of nodes, each node is a choice, each choice has an event, or consequence. As the character/party navigates the array, the array changes the party and the party changes the array. It'd work like a 'Choose your own adventure'/'Solo RPG'(think Tunnels & Trolls.)Now, both of those ideas were on paper, immutable. Digitally, they can be morphed by the player's choices. Combat would be a little trickier - but it could work in a similar manner. Each fight could be a mini-web of tactical choices. Navigate the fight with correct choices, win the fight. I'm gonna have to prototype some of this Saturday.
>>3471179Awesome. I hope it goes well and maybe opens up even more ideas
>>3465789>/jp/ troon melty when faced with the folly of his own hubris
>>3464979Fuck off Cain
>>3465042I've been thinking of a system like this too, because i fucking hate metagaming mathfaggots. It would take mass/veolicty/material hardness etc into account and obfuscate the actual numbers involved. There would be plenty of in-game information from blacksmiths and books and the like to get an idea of the strengths and weaknesses of things.
>>3472422>There would be plenty of in-game information from blacksmiths and books and the like to get an idea of the strengths and weaknesses of things.I love it when information is delivered through the world (books, NPCs etc.) instead of menus, interface, numbers.
>>3472450These days you need to run a game on a potato for your loading screens to last long enough to read the tips.
Is a Mordhau RPG possible?Skill-based Combat + meaningful RPG stats and choices.
>>3465042It would be fucking pointless at the end of the day because the engine still needs to make those numbers, which means someone is going to crack the game open, grab all the numbers and put them up into a wiki somewhere for people to see. You're just putting a barrier of information for the casuals.
It's kinda funny how so many people want to play action games or simulators or something and don't like RPGs, yet they come to an RPG board and post on it. What makes a person do this?
>>3472779The whole playerbase isn't guide readers and dataminers. Secrets will be spoiled online too, but they're still worth adding to the game for those playing blind.Designing a game with the goal of having depth with less spreadsheets could turn into new and innovative ideas and features, if you possess imagination.
>>3472779It's fine as long as you need to 'cheat' to know.You can always cheat in a game.
You can always roleplay, even when there are numbers. Someone who can't stop themself from metagaming won't be stopped by numerical obfuscation. Instead, all you've done is added a filter of mud between the player and the game. Probably better to design a game around what you like and not to spite those you don't like.
>>3465353Mario getting a mushroom is a state change, they didn't track HP separately from the state. It's like spiny eggs being replaced with walking spinys, or ? Blocks being replaced with empty blocks, or MegaMan X going from "dashing" to "dashing and jumping" to "dashing and jumping and shooting" for animation and physics.It's not all D&D mechanics.But, you're right that it's all math, since all computer science is math.
>>3472779>You're just putting a barrier of information for the casualsThat's the whole point. And definite numbers can still be hidden from datamining faggots.
>>3473287Are you going to hide how much gold the player has? Like they'll have to toss their coin pouch and listen to the jingle it makes when it hits their palm to tell roughly how much they have. That would be super immersive and show those metagaming faggots what for.
>>3473287Short of making the game always online and invest in sufficient servers, there's no way for you to actually do it. If you then wanted to truly black box the game then you'd probably end up spending about as much time as you'd need to figure out all the cheese builds and fix them.
>>3473290Yes.>>3473334If someone is that hell bent to figure out the specific values it would still mean nothing when the idea is that everything would also be down to weapon material hardness/sharpness vs armor other materials hardness/density, and stamina or whatever use taken into account vs hit distance for balance so there is no one beats all solution.
>>346504290% of old RPGs did this type of shitAnother proof that most of the people on this board don't płay videogames
