>>37857147
Can you concentrate? Focus? Read a book cover to cover?

It's the mind that's weak. Not magic. There's no limit on the power of magic whatsoever.

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>>37857171
>There's no limit on the power of magic whatsoever.

So where are all those unlimited magic users?

Examples of what I wouldn't consider placebo-faggot-tier-magick:

>mastery of your body and flesh (aka being able to heal your defects such as balding or needing glasses, perfect body and weight, doesn't age)
>direct mind reading that leaves no possibility for guessing or cold reading
>being able to influence the elements or gravity in front of other people (levitating, conjuring fire, wind, water, whatever)
>summoning spirits that are VISIBLE and able to influence to room clearly (aka not just "The room just felt cold" or "I think I saw a shadow, not sure" because people can easily imagine that especially if they are spooked)

>>37857147
our world sucks

>>37857147
You consist of DNA that up to 99% tells you that magic isnt real in this realm and expect to cast fireballs without tearing down those hard wired hindering beliefs.

>>37857208
There are tons of people who are 100% delusional and believe they are Jesus reincarnated, the chosen one and married to Gods. Completely off their meds and convinced, yet they are unable to do anything remotely impressive. It can't be about faith.

Now if your argument is that it depends on what everyone believes then I would ask if magic was inherently real why would people randomly stop believing for no reason?

>>37857171
>real communism has never been tried before

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(There is no such thing as magic, what has been historically known as magic(hidden knowledge) was limited when for the most part the watchers were barred from stepping a permanent foot into the realm a very many cycles ago.)

>>37857147
>in our realm
You got isekai'd at some point and found a world where magic is an undeniable part of existence or something? What is your reference point, bro? Lol

>tangible displays of power and mastery over reality and flesh
That's a high bar you've set. it's more Matrix or Dark City larp than magic, which is it's own larp.

>the only magic that exists in this world is this low-tier shit that is so weak it could be easily mental illness, coincidence/placebo and impossible to prove
Pretty much. If that's all mid for you, maybe just move on to something else.

>>37857147
>all that “magic”
>can’t make yourself look young, look fit; look attractive, or rich
The fuck is the point?
either real magic is seriously hidden inside a secret underground cult, or magic is not real.

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>>37857147
neo-pagans and new agers are larpers. reconstructionists have my respect because they keep trying.
I see crowley as ambiguous, sometimes I see him as a chris-chan and other times I see him as a visionary.
They literally only use crowley-thelema or golden dawn rites.
gardner invented his own rituals and has some heterodox memphiz mizrain rite thanks to crowley's initiation along with other masonic stuff.
It is nonsense.
>also
they don't cast fireballs all they claim to do is concentrate the energies of the universe or elementals and accomplish law of attraction or affirmation style goals. basically they put bias in your head that something is going to work and if it doesn't work it's because you lack energy whatever that is.
the original magic seemed to be pure invocation, evocation and dealing with spirits and weird entities. like typical yoruba or voodoo.

some people literally believe in the stupidity of the kybalion, which is something of the new thought, there is nothing hermetic about it. there is even a version with masonic aesthetics by robert much earlier.
even academics who study hermeticism do not consider it to be something of hermeticism.

I don't like wiccans because they are fluffbunnies, they generally shit on the occult and are more of an exoteric public religion on the same level as christians.

>>37857171
This. Magic is only as strong as the person wielding it. The fat goth chick into Wicca who can't control herself around a tub of ice cream is going to accomplish as much with magic as she will with any other tool at her disposal.

>>37857147
what do you think would be happening to this realm if everyone was able to shoot fire balls out their eyes

>>37857273
The usual cope of these people is that physical appearance doesn't matter and isn't important in a spiritual sense but that's bullshit. If they could wield magic or divine powers they would be able to master the physical realm too.

If you are beautiful people treat you better and your life is much easier. This has been studied but it is also common sense. And furthermore even if for some mysterious reason they just want to be ugly then at least heal your defects? Needing glasses or losing hair, those are defects of your cells.

>>37857274
Crowley also falls in this LARP-placebo magic umbrella. He couldn't really do anything impressive and he was ugly, balding, overweight and died of some dumb shit.

>>37857292
Not everyone, my question if ANYONE at all is able to do that? Obviously we won't figure it out here.

>>37857147
look at that picture. they are all fat.

99% of the prana in their body is busy digesting food and converting it to shit. they got no reserves left to utilizing it for "mAgIcK".

if you want to be more efficient with your prana/chi usage, fast for 90 days (only water) so you lose all the american weight, then only eat 3-4 times a week, so fast 3-4 days a week.

do this for a couple of months and you will be more potent.

if you still cooming though, that will be the next HUGE bottleneck for amassing and using chi.

>>37857226
Not even close to the same thing. One is an unworkable social theory and the other is something that requires discipline. It's like saying mastering an instrument or winning a game is impossible. Both communism and magic attract losers and for the same reason, but non-losers can and do make magic work.

>>37857383
>chi
>prana
which is it?

>>37857361
It’s a cope because they know it’s impossible to change their bodies.
I mean they have no issues with using magic to punish people and push their own political ideology on grand scale (binding trump and trump supporters” or “binding Supreme Court” (lol someone was angry about not being able to kill kids no more))
But their limit is on making themselves healthy, sexy, smart, and young?
lol
They only “magic” things that they can’t personally verify so it’s “always working” in their mind
Like lying to yourself
>>37857361
At least Crowley wasn’t a rabid anti west anti white tard
He was also super homo, but didn’t keep cursing “homophobes” left and right for not accepting his gayassshit.

>>37857361
>Not everyone
well what do you think would happen if one guy was able to do it

>>37857482
If one guy was able to do it that would mean that this type of magic exists even if super rare.

>>37857476

>this one has begun to see the cracks in oneness

cell phones are pretty cool

>>37857147
According to the discoveries made through repetitive inquiry processes by Ken Ogger and explained in his book Super Scio (the publication of which led to his being tied to a cinder block at the bottom of his pool), we descended through a series of universes prior to this one, each with increasingly strict laws of physics and causality. The previous universe Ogger called the Magic Universe, and it's where all these intuitions about how magick should work but only very rarely does, come from. Memory of how it used to be before your enemies decided they would be better off if you were trapped in the Physical/Space Opera Universe (eventually most of them got thrown down here too: the previous universes still exist but are largely uninhabited). If you let them push you down into the Mud Universe you'll be making threads about why kinetic movement is so weak.

>>37857147
Magic is engaging with the world at a more symbolic plane of resonance. Words are magic. Use them with love in your heart to avoid karmic consequences.

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>>37857147
Magic isn't weak
>2024
>muggles trying to do magic
ISHYGDDT

>>37857504
Interesting. Why did this happen though? All of us had enemies that send us down here?

>>37857274
>neo-pagans and new agers are larpers
And old-pagans and old agers were not larpers?

>>37857513
Can you do anything mentioned here >>37857175 and prove it? If not, you are the exact type of muggle you're talking about.

ANYONE can pretend to do some energy balls or influence the wind a little bit or do rituals or claim to be in contact with ancients spirits or demons. Even fat wiccans with tattoos do that.

>>37857491
I don’t get what you saying bro.
But it’s cool

>>37857513
its weak because if it were strong it would have held up to lab conditions
like the best the cia could find was dudes "moving" a coin in a pepsi bottle

>>37857226
How would you describe the Essenes? Just an egalitarian vegetarian commune, right? Not real communism?

>>37857519
When you're a powerful mage instead of an incel neet you tend to get involved in political struggles... Before the memory-wipe technology, killing your enemies just slowed them down a little before they reincarnated and got back to their old tricks. A universe is the ultimate supermax prison, and still there are prison breaks.
>http://www.freezoneearth.org/pilot/sscio/index.html

>>37857147
Maybe because most “magick practitioners” are genuinely weak humans who haven’t sacrificed anything except spare time and weak will for some vague dogma? You’ll find the best magis in the most funniest places, unreachable by humans, as they aren’t human at that point.

>>37857581
Anyone, even people with trashiest genes can become better at ANYTHING (not saying master, just better) with spare time dedicated to it
It’s just seems like “witches” are unable to do this

>>37857147
That's not magic.

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>>37857147
the actual answer is that
1. Humanity is litterally lesser then they were before because we evolve physically and spiritually in cycles depending on the position of the stars, hense the zodiacal ages.
2. there is a massive real effort by collectevist forces to hinder with chemicals, fear, psyop, mind control, death and deception anyone who isn't meeting their criteria for truth.

Real magic relies on a complete understanding, which also means having as healthy a body and mind as you can, spiritual practice and consistent effory, Gnosis or direct experience and actual not insane knowledge which requires you to at least understand that allegorical nature of most religious texts, if you dont, you get insanity.
most people are missing 90% of the basic prerequisite.

>>37857520
no, because they sincerely believed. they were not a mannequin of aesthetics or self-help phrases with weird syncretisms.
they were an autochthonous religion of a given culture that may or may not syncretize with other gods.
>old-agers
I don't know what the fuck that is, but literally all the new age guys believe in the age of aquarius and a bunch of degenerate practices from the original occultism.
It's like they see occult practices as a Christian mass on the Sabbath, public, timetabled and in a meeting.

the ancient religions could at least have an exoteric and an esoteric side together with mystery cults or secret societies.
not to mention that the new agers love to regurgitate all the strange jargon with with quantum mysticism and have an obsession with pajeets and karma.
they do it all for emotion or peace or the new age or the aeon or for stupid material things like money, love, etc.
they don't do it for experience or esotericism.
>also
Now if we wanted to argue that religious traditions can be stupid, yes, sometimes they re very stupid.

>>37857398
>>37857546
>not magicians

Magic ain't real. Duh. It used to be old men standing in circles yelling at dust in the dim candlelight. Then it turned into draw rhombuses in the air and just declaring angels about you in 4 directions. Then it turned into magic cum doodles. And currently it's some kind of solipsist Neo cosplay. There no actual magicians here. They're all a bunch of armchair theoreticians pseudposting.

>>37857147
I have this suspicion that some super wizard in the past made magic dissappear from this realm.

It makes sense how so many mythical and cryptic beings are recorded by multiple ancient cultures all over the planet.

I think magic was so chaotic that he sacrificed himself to remove all magic and creatures from the world just so normal people could live peacefully (it didn't work obviuously) well it kinds did most kingdoms thrived but now humans are the chaotic evil creatures

>>37857398
look man it would be fun if magic was real but no one of prominence has made it work
otherwise the rich and powerful wouldnt be so scared of dying lol

>>37857147
>Why is magic ("magick") in our realm so lame?
because the places where it isn't lame are by themselves lame and usually nebulous and chaotic.

>>37857694
it was jesus!
wheres the goddamn unicorn fossils
wheres the dragon bones in 4000 year old dirt layers

>>37857147
If there exists magic the likes of which is depicted in fiction, the people alive today do not have the capability of casting it. Certainly a bunch of chubby-fat scene girls in america won't have the ability to cast forth a ball of fire to smite their foes. Neither will the lardball neckbeards who spend their days on /x/ talking about the nobody and gangstalkers in between their hourly nofap neochristian affirmations.

>>37857698
>but i did the lbrp and my bunghole puckered a little bit
>surely that's magic at work
Don't bother. They're working from a hypothetical idealized standard of magic that they themselves haven't attained, if they're being honest.

>>37857171
>There's no limit on the power of magic whatsoever.
In theory any force can move infinitely towards any direction, but in practice many factors prevent this from happening. Magic is the same, there is no 'limitless' magic, you will always reach a limit, beyond just your mind.
Otherwise, woudln't schizophrenics be masterful wizards?
>Buth muh focus
You do not need focus to be a loose canon, if you're a natural and schizophrenic, by your standards we'd have someone exploding stuff with their mind.

>>37857147
I will not give you a simple answer.
>Do not give what is holy to dogs, or throw your pearls before swine, lest they trample them underfoot, and turn and tear you to pieces.
Meditate on it, dumbass.

>>37857147
it's not weak it's just not as literal as you're thinking if you're of coarse mind
+ lots of stuff you perceive as normal because it's part of your backdrop is magic

>>37857722
why do you believe this over "magic is just fake"
what practices have you maintained and what results have you achieved

>>37857726
Extremely convenient that all this magical stuff is so SUBTLE that it can be literal roleplay, schizophrenia or placebo, right....

>>37857217
There is a reason. Magic has been ripped from the general population intentionally. Everyone used to use magic, but as society grew the elites realised the common man being allowed to use magic was not going to be a good thing. So they brought in religions that said magic was against God, they forced the masses to convert and then made magic an offense punishable by death. Within just a few short generations the general population lost all knowledge of magic, whereas the elites kept practicing. Then over time the elites turned magic into fiction to further distance the masses from belief. Magic requires belief, and the more people who believe the more powerful the magic gets. So they've made magic into children's stories so that it has become near impossible for the general population to recover their belief in magic.

>>37857751
Who exactly is the elite though? Because it's not politicians or rich people or royals, because those all age, get fat, sick and ugly.

>>37857147
For a second let's consider that "magic" only works through the archetypes/gods. If the person attempting to use universal energy to create an effect but is not favored by any of these higher powers, it will not work. For example, imagine someone wants to use love/sex magic but Aphrodite hates them - it will not work.

>>37857751
This is stupid. Magic has never been more widely covered in literature than it has now. I'm not talking about wokeist soft shit that's equal parts wicca equal parts activism. Magic from ancient Egypt, Greece, China, etc. The PGM, the various Solomonic magical manuscripts that are descended from the PGM in terms of technique, etc. Despite the Church, magic actually continued developing through the times of the inquisition, and often with tacit ecclesiastical help. There was a whole clerical underground that supported the endeavor.

>>37857729
Anon, what are you doing with your life? Trying to prove if magic is real or fake? Why are you wasting your time? Realize how dumb you sound, for once!

About 99% of the stuff you will find online, ESPECIALLY ON X is bullshit, just plain bullshit. No one here is an enlightened master, no one here is a wizard, and no one here knows what they are talking about. At best, you will find a bored follower of some religion or magical system, spewing their framework as if it is the answer to all questions. Actual discussion on /x/ has been dead for over ten years now. Your search is futile; you will never find anything here on the internet.

Now, to answer your question, 'occultism' is called as such for a reason. Once you realize why this is, you will see why I won't tell you anything about me or my practices. Besides this, I do not 'believe' in magic; I, like everyone else in the world, just live by its rules. There is no difference between you and me beyond a big metaphorical lock on your head preventing you from reaching realization.

>>37857751
But people had magic.
You mean to tell me somehow people stopped practicing magic because they were “forced”!?
You mean people who could have use curses and hexes got defeat by a practical traditional “beating”?
Then what’s the point of magic???

>>37857817
so you admit youre just a wanker

>>37857817
>muh pearls
Lmao this guy is a lame pseudlarper.

>>37857722
You keep confusing magic with pathology. That's limiting. I'm not schizophrenic. Are you?

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The quality of discussion on this site has gone so low over the past 14 years, it is almost unbelievable.
No wonder all the good posters have left, it is just like that one anon once said 'the future of 4chan is just bots talking to each-other, calling each-other a nigger eternally'.

>>37857796
But through what methods are you approaching the power of the archetype? Talismans/amulets? Conjuration and pacts? Pseudo-theurgy? Some methods purportedly work better than others if I'm to believe some of my magician friends. That's of course assuming the magician has incorporated all the required bells and whistles like electional timing, appropriate fragrance, symbola/synthemata, materia magica, fasted and taken a bath so they don't smell like a cow, etc.

>>37857839
>You keep confusing magic with pathology
You need to rethink what constitutes 'magic'.

>>37857854
>"all the good posters have left"
>is still here
Uh huh. Ok. Why anyone stays to endure things they don't like is mystifying. Unless you're just here to bitch and moan and not actually contribute anything. What's your next move? To regurgitate some shit about not casting pearls? Lol shut the fuck up and move along, charlatan.

where do /x/philes think "real" magic is
do sorcerers just not use the internet lol

>>37857873
My goals are beyond your understanding.
>To regurgitate some shit about not casting pearls?
I am doing that already. Would you rather I call you a retard and we leave it at that?

>>37857715

>Doesn't know gangstalkers are real

Sad

>>37857885
>My goals are beyond your understanding
LMAO this guy larping like a cloak and dagger lodge faggot. You have no power over anyone, least of all yourself. Fuck off.

>>37857705
I don't think it was that recent, I think it was way older than that, even more ancient.

It's possible jesus was part of that bloodline and performed miracles but even his powers were already diluted because magic was almost gone or something

It's obvious that no one here has any magic. Yes, that includes me.

>>37857929
duh
not even the "epic sorcerers" can point those interested to anything
its just obvious bullshit

>>37857854
Oh, jeeze... a boomer yelling at clouds.

>>37857147
There is no such thing as manipulating possibility, something either has the potential to occur under the laws that govern the universe or it doesn't. There is, however, such thing as manipulating probability.
Pondering that difference may serve you well.

>>37857952
>le loa
nah nigga its causality all the way down

>>37857952
>manipulating probability
So if I have an objective and put it in some thought and effort into achieving it, the probability of success improves, yes?
Why, that just sounds like... normal every day effort.

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> anon doesn't hack the noosphere for fun
ngmi

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>>37857147
Why wouldn't magic be real?

>>37858019
Eat shit, bot.

>>37858019
because it doesnt follow cause and effect. thinking angry thoughts doesnt let me pyrokinetically ignite a piece of paper, because what transfer of energy would heat the paper enough to combust?

>>37857524

>this one knows what it is and what it do

>>37857958
You put words in my mouth, I am not here to argue for loa nor in favor of anything OP may refer to as "magic". I am simply offering a perspective I think would serve to ascend this train of questioning, which is nothing but a waste of time based on the label of "magic". There are possibilities, impossibilities, and probabilities. Probabilities can be influenced. I don't disagree that there is always causality unless you are meaning to tell me you can't manipulate the probability of outcomes through your own employment of causality. And then, ofcourse, perhaps there are causes you do not understand, like a primitive man dealing with the effects of advanced technology.
Consider that there may be higher dimensions, and greater beings, greater realms. We may be in a simulation, or under observation, put here by a God. There may be those things that our rules we must abide do not apply to.

>>37857568
How does one break free?

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OP here. 99% of the discussions and replies in this thread aren't from me, but I am reading obviously to see what people have to say.

>>37857147
>Magic is weak

That's a you problem. I have no problem manifesting some rather extraordinary shit. If anything, my last act of magic was me jumping the shark lol

>>37857817
What did I have for lunch?

>>37858039
Cool.
Still don’t getting it.

>>37857147
I have said this shit in so many threads and I always get hate for it lol. LoA is the best example of this nonsense

>I got another wage slave job using LoA, seeeeee, it works!
Their best example of "magic working" is them becoming a wage slave, instead of them escaping wage slavery.

It's like these people have extremely low standards, lack self-awareness, and they can't think for themselves.

>Why is magic ("magick") in our realm so lame? The first explanation would be it simply doesn't exist and everyone is roleplaying, but let's assume it is possible for the sake of discussion.
I actually believe that it's possible, but it's just that nobody who can actually do it would talk about it online.

Think about it. If magic is real, there is likely some group of rulers / governing body that makes the rules, hides in shadows, kills off people that make the knowledge public or abuse their power too openly, etc.

This is why the only occultists you see talking online are likely delusional, mentally ill, or at best people who can only do "parlor trick tier" magic that can't affect physical reality (and they learned how to do it on a fluke and they don't know how to properly teach it so their students get inconsistent results).

I think the extreme "harry potter magic" is possible, it's just that none of us will ever gain access to the knowledge and training required to achieve it.

It's like there is a "world behind the scenes" and were just barred off from taking part in it.

If that's not the case I'd say magic doesn't exist, because you'll never get me to call the low tier nonsense that people label as feats on these forums "magic".

>>37858068
You think wrongly because then the powerful would be using it to cheat death
In state funerals would be a thing of the past

not to mention manifesting planes droppin outta the sky instead of wasting millions on missiles lol

>>37858053
>manifesting
Let me guess, you got another job, you got a romantic partner, or you climbed a ladder. Damn that's all so extraordinary.

Shit that literally 99% of other people do, and likely more effectively than you do, without trying to "manifest" anything at all.

>>37858113
>You think wrongly because then the powerful would be using it to cheat death
You making too many assumptions.

1. It could be a well known part of occult knowledge that after you die you move onto a greater realm to continue your training and evolution as a spiritual entity. So instead of death being this thing to be feared, death is just a natural part of the cycle to those who have the knowledge.

2. These people could just be body swapping or creating new bodies for themselves to inhabit after they die, and just transferring their souls into new born babies or children.

>>37858040
thats just called doing shit
and theres no way to communicate with 4d beings or get them to help you
otherwise prayer would work

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>>37857876
That's what we want you to think

>>37857976
Correct. However, not all causality is apparent to us, and there does exist an infinitely high ceiling for what means of causality could be employed, and what order might exist upon higher planes.
In other words, a man cannot will a fireball into existence from nothing, but there may exist that which can travel through space and time and universes like you take a walk in the park. That is what is worth searching for.

>>37858134
sounds stupid, they shouldve extended their lives instead to hold onto their knowledge and power instead of moving into some squishy brained baby
also how they "soul transferring" in the age of neurology lol like they hookin up electrodes or some shit man we all know there aint no soul

>>37858164
>sounds stupid, they shouldve extended their lives instead to hold onto their knowledge and power
Maybe it's only possible once you get to a certain level of power, and some people can keep themselves immortal because they progress quickly, while others have to keep body swapping until they get to that level of power.

We wouldn't know anyways. Maybe it's just a game for some of these guys and they like the idea of living a completely new life as a completely new person every century or so. Maybe they are so far above a human existence that they see changing lives no differently than we see changing tv shows after we've finished the current one.

>>37858143
Prayer not working means prayer doesn't work. If I stand outside your home whispering for favors or throwing pebbles at your window, I guess that means communicating with you is equally impossible.
Yet here we are, by the "magic" of the internet, communicating.

>>37858162
>might
>may
Yeah, thanks. I'm good. Human lifetimes are finite.
I'd rather deal with what is apparent than go off on side quests full of hypotheticals.
Good luck. I hope you isekai into a world where willing fireballs into existence is a thing.

>>37858053
>t. typical schizo-tard

>>37858240
Except that the problem with your analogy is that the window, the person behind the window and the pebble clearly exist and there's no mysterious method by which to work them.

>>37858246
Seeking more than what is apparent isn't for everyone. It is what this board is for, though. You might be in the wrong place fren.

>>37858277
>Seeking more than what is apparent
Aka imaginary friends lol. I'm not even a total skeptic.
Aliens and cryptids still remain a possibility for me. I just expect clear evidence.
Dunking on idiots is a valid pastime.
This is exactly the right place to be.

>>37858260
I meant to add that, based on you not responding (perhaps even going unnocticed entirely), then with your reasoning it is safe to assume you cannot be communicated with. A greater being is not necessarily omnipresent or even capable of finding the meaning of all of the order in that of a lower plane.
Say I am calling out halfway around the world from you, asking for you to mow my lawn. I go home and my lawn is not mowed. We both, however, exist, and would you have been in the right place, could have heard me and refused to my face. Say I did so in a different language, you would not even know I am talking to you. However, I could communicate the same message in other ways.
The complexities around communicating up and down through dimensions by two different entities is way too complex to suggest we cpuld assume it is simply guarunteed or impossible.

>>37858213
nah thered be historical evidence if any of that were real

>>37858361
>nah thered be historical evidence if any of that were real
What's stopping them from erasing or obscuring the evidence, when they are the ones hiring the teams to do the excavating, etc. I don't think you get what I'm saying, I'm saying these individuals are the true rulers of the planet, controlling things behind the scenes.

It's funny how people like you will easily believe in the conspiracy that the Jews own, control and manipulate pretty much everything, but you can't imagine a group above them that controls even them and does the same (or maybe the group I'm talking about is an upper faction of the jews, who knows).

>>37858351
Again, you're attempting to use as an analogy beings whose existence can be observed clearly no matter how hard it may be for you to communicate with them. You don't need to draw a magic circle on the floor and burn incense to speak with a human being. You can use simple sign language if they speak another language, you can call them or email them if they're further away. And assuming they're not on the other side of the world, you can nicely ask them to mow your lawn for a fair price. To say that interdimensional communication is "too complex to discuss" is to assume that there even is such a thing as beings in another dimension to communicate with. You're putting the horse before the cart. Please, no more bad analogies. The truth of this matter should be clearly presented in clear and precise manner with detailed steps instead of through indirect rhetoric and thought experiments.

>>37858328
I am a big fan of evidence as well. For me personally, I'm mostly here keeping an eye out for new information. I do enjoy discourse with those who take strong stances, especially who take up against someone as agnostic as myself when I try to enlighten someone, usually assuming I am as strongly opinionated as they are and disagree with them by default. They might see imaginary friends, but you see imaginary prey. Sorry to knock the ball out of your hands.

>>37858388
If you believe there is no truth beyond what can be publicly proved or demonstrated, you are ruling out the possibility of magic from the get-go. Magic is not something you're going to figure out using only your left hemisphere.

>>37858388
That's the point of the anology. I cannot describe to you exactly how it'd work because we don't know, and it's just theoretical. You said communication is impossible, my response to simply try to get across that we do not know that based on "my prayers didn't work".
People really have a hard time acknoweledging unknown unknowns, and admitting them. There is simply no need to jump to conclusions.

>>37858450
And you, presumably with your "left hemisphere", have figured out magic so well that you're unable to undeniably demonstrate it beyond doubt for even skeptics to accept. Have you ever even conjured a grimoire spirit to some level of detectable presence with other people around to corroborate your success?

>>37858481
>another armchair theoretician
You're not the kind of person to bring value to a discussion about whether or not we can practically communicate with beings in another dimension.

>>37858518
Are you OP?

>>37857217
>It can't be about faith.
Imagine humans walking around wraped up like mummys with curses that limit their ability to use magic. But the curses are nothing more than the collective experience of your ancestors not being able to use magic, which is physically programed in your genes.

>why would people randomly stop believing for no reason?
Times of struggle hinders the individual to find themself and ridding themself of the mental barriers that reduce the efficieny of magic, making physical work the more effective choice.

I don´t believe magic on a higher level was widespread, but limited to the people who either devoted their life towards the practise.

>>37858525
No, I'm the guy telling you that theoreticals are not what we need to show we can communicate with beings in another dimension. Someone who's actually done and can do it again for other people to see is who's needed.

>>37857147
>Why is magic ("magick") in our realm so lame?
FOR YOU

>>37858549
>skill issue
lol ok

>>37858518
Yes, I am the kind of person to suggest many things that are not apparent to use may influence causality and that is what one should consider possible as opposed to thinking of seemingly supernatural things as "magic" where real-life wizards hurl fireballs from their hands.
And then I am also the kind of guy to point out some such examples because they are beyond our understanding, and then defend the fact that one of them is beyond our understanding, and possible, when it is called impossible.
My goal is only to open minds like OP, and to get them to a better place where there resides better questions.
People often think that I am taking a hard stance and attack me, they take me revealing possibilities as taking a stance. I'm not here to convince anyone of anything except what they do not know. What they fill in the rest with is up to them.

>>37858496
Read my post.

>>37858633
To admit that something is beyond your understanding but then speak at length about it (even if only suggestively) is a waste of time if you're not actively figuring out practical ways to test your hypothetical ideas. I get it. It's fun to shoot the shit like you're in the studio with Joe Rogan, but I'm actually serious about this. I'm open-minded enough to consider the possibility of something being true, but not gullible to the point of accepting every conjecture and speculation shoved my way. I need more than just the free-form musings of an internet rando. At least try something practically instead of just wading in the kiddy pool of theories. Goetia, CE5, something. Try it with other people around. See what results there are, see if you can reproduce the results, etc. I'm tired of armchair magicians and pseuds.

>>37858679
>magic is when you suspend all standards of testing truth and just believe whatever head cannon the other anon has
Got it.

>>37858698
No, you don't.

Relevant question:
Discovered a leyline on my property. How can I maximize my mapping of it's nodes, and how can I get the most benefit from it?

>>37858679
Translation: I've never even tried to conjure anything.

>>37858689
You and me both, we are seeking knoweledge, wisdom, and evidence, meanwhile OP is asking if magic is real then why isnt Gandalf casting spells at 711. Yeah I don't know if higher-deminsional beings exist or anything about what they are, but we should all be aware of such possibilities, and something like that, or any other of a number of decent theories, is what should come to mind in place of what most normies think of as "magic". So really, I just want him on the same page as us. He needs to get a better feel of where to search.

>>37858710
To think is to conjure.

>>37858704
Yes, I do. That's why you've got nothing left to say other than stamping your feet and insisting "you just don't understand magic, you're approaching it the wrong way". Years ago while on vacation in Java I was given the opportunity to sit in while a dukun performed some magic. To make me and all four of my friends see the same vision in a bowl of lime water is no trivial feat. That is my litmus test. You can accept it or go away and get lost in your own meandering mind plays.

>>37858734
So there is real magic you witnessed?
I agree though. Internet magic is not real

>>37858705
Drum on it

>>37858750
But this is the thing: there's no way for you to know whether or not I'm lying. My point is that the truth of this stuff is not to be decided in the pointless back and forth volleys of internet chatter. You go out in the world and actually try shit out. And have other people around to experience it too. It's extra nice if they're skeptics.

>>37858734
>vision in a bowl of lime water
Nice. That kind of magic is related to Babylonian oil magic or Jewish "princes of the thumb". I think the PGM has some entries on it too.

>>37858782
Right! Lecanomancy like in PGM IV 154-285. I swear I'm not purposely being a fedorafag. I've just seen too much bullshit, and too few legitimate demonstrations of magic, however anyone wants to define that term. My standards are just higher as a result.

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>>37857147

There is no such thing as magic, there is only technology. If you have good enough technology, you can perform whatever you would call magic.

So, why we don't have good enough magic? Because we don't have enough knowledge.

>>37858782
>>37858817
I just learned something new.
Now I have a project to go try. Thanks.

>>37858767
Anon I am not the person you were arguing with.
But I agree, talk is cheap.
As I said earlier, if these were real “magicians” they wouldn’t be hambeast manfaces.
They would be the sexy fit young women that they always complain about.
Really, each person would have been their ideal self, and no one ideal is being an ugly fat fuck.
Some years ago I was reading on subjects of sigils and there was this “wizards” who did great things with sigils including creating egrigores, attracted people in his life, etc.
And the moment I saw his picture I doubted all of it.
He was just one ugly dude, with a blobby face.
There is no way, no way in hell, that you know magic, and not trying to fix your body face.
No way in hell
>>37858782
>>37858817
Seems you two knowing a good deal about magic.
Though it’s not the type I care about. Being pragmatic and all.

>>37858879
i mean if he was ugly n still gettin bitches then thers gotta be some magic involved

>>37858852
>Being pragmatic and all.
It's just my opinion but evocatory scrying is more pragmatic than le burp and drawing eggplants in the air in cardinal directions. And your talk of "ideal self" sounds like HGA stuff. If that's in the context of Abramelin, more power to you, But I don't put much stock in the Crowleyan adoption of the concept. When the oil magic works, there's an undeniable spirit appearance and it shows visions in the reflective surface that's relevant to the question posed. But "when" is the operative word.

>>37858923
Meant for >>37858879

>>37858923
Sure.
I am not dismissive of it as real magic.
Not at all.
It’s only that I don’t see it as anything that can affect anyone life.
Unless someone somewhere seriously researching those sorts of magic, trying to make a break though and get to something higher.
That being said, how come you two know about REAL magic like this, but never tried to learn and replicate it?

>>37858946
nah that "shit in school" is the foundation of our knowledge of reality and its why we can live the cozy lives we do doing magic larp

>>37858753
Drum on the earth, or play something like a bongo? How will drumming help with either part of this?
>>37858705

>>37857147
idk about you but I'd plap far right until my dick flew off.

>>37858953
Well, I don't know about the other anon, but I've tried to replicate PGM operations before. Just to very sporadic success. And as for affecting anyone's life, finding out where in the world a long lost high school friend might be ranks quite highly for me. It wasn't some kind of parlor trick. We asked the dukun where our friend was, he did his routine, and our friend's face was in the lime water. One of my friends laid down some rules like don't blurt out what you see if anything, and save the description for a note we'd individually write later without discussing it with each other. We all described the same setting, went to the country where he was supposedly, and there he was teaching English.

>>37858852
https://www.forgottenbooks.com/en/download_pdf/Babylonian_and_in_the_Later_Jewish_1000087782.pdf
https://ia801300.us.archive.org/19/items/TheGreekMagicalPapyriInTranslation/The_Greek_Magical_Papyri_in_Translation.pdf
Good luck, bro.

>>37859239
Pretty crazy.
So you can use to find lost objects, hidden objects.
And probably has lots of industrial/military espionage value too.

>>37857274
>guys, guys! I made this witch with stable diffusion! look at her! she's awesome! so awesome I'll put her in a post instead of an actual image!

>>37857147
Skill issue y'all dumb faggotrons

>>37857175
>I need Hollywood entertainment
No you need to be skullfucked until your brain is fixed enough

>>37859703
So you're just fine with having a magical micropenis, huh?

We have physical laws, but one thing physicists don't understand is there are subtler types of causality at play, mainly to do with consciousness and probability.

>>37857217
I think it's everyone's faith into how things work.

>>37857147
It’s because the 3rd density is unbearably slow, and unless you’re fueling your magic with child sacrifice it doesn’t seem to work at all.

>>37857274
women will never be able to actually understand magic.

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>>37860362
Men are just as cringe and powerless.

>>37857627
How to achieve gnosis?

>>37857527
seriouslly, if the US military doesnt use it, its either shit, doesn't exist, or unreliable

>>37857383
I eat one meal a day and fast a week monthly for /fit/ reasons, and I can't cast shit. I'm not really bothered by the lack of fireballs but I want to talk to the elementals like Paracelsus

>>37857799
what? form the 16-19th century is was covered by a huge amount of authros, the 17-1800's was a magical revival

>>37857817
I almost agreed with you until you turned into another ego jack-off "muh stuff actually works urs doesnt"

>>37860928
Paracelsus didint talk to shit, he was an alchemist not a wizard

>>37857147

I recently did as magickal ritual, it’s been 3 days or so, not sure if it’s working. Give us a stronger love ritual. Satanic or black magic, it doesn’t matter. Just give me one

You're being a simpleton

Most accomplished magicians generally aren't associated with magic, but whatever it is they succeeded in (looks, fame, status, power, whatever), and even if they openly admit to doing magic, that part is usually ignored because there are just so many other things discussed about them.

Obviously the new age stuff is BS. I'd add chaos magic in this category.

Successful magicians are part of the managerial class or are members of cults, or social networks (like what freemasonry used to be)

Fat wicca nerds are nowhere near the same level as long-time religious ceremonial magicians whose families have been practicing for centuries, but even then, magic is basically "para-religion", as in, it is mystical by nature and cannot easily be proven with empirical observations.

Meaning, for the most part, you won't be seeing fire balls cast from wands and whatnot. Most mature ceremonial magic cults (including those of the managerial class) have long Christian-like "liturgies" and complicated rituals often lasting hours, days or even years.

Most would agree that the rituals do work. These people end up running governments, companies and organizations, maybe end up celebrities etc.

It's just that they lose their souls in the process

>>37860984
>Most accomplished magicians generally aren't associated with magic
ya know, except all the classical occultists and wizards

>>37860973
Paracelsus wrote "A Book on Nymphs, Sylphs, Pygmies, and Salamanders, and on the Other Spirits". He was certainly a fucking wizard too.

>>37861043
anon what we consider magic and what he considered natural science are two intricately different things

>>37861043
that's like saying someone who writes mostly on mathematics who then writes one thing on history is known as a historian

Dunno if it's real but they say yogis do physics-breaking things. The theory behind em seems plausible, that reality is a dream

>>37857147

You are half right OP, magick is a subtle force, but 'real' nonetheless.

>>37860953
So... you're reiterating my point? Tell that to the other guy. He thinks magic completely disappeared from common folk.

>>37861297
>16th-18th centuries
>modern
My man here's either immortal or doesn't understand what modern means

>>37861109
The natural sciences grew partly out of magic the same way chemistry grew out of alchemy.

>>37861137
You can pursue mostly one thing and still have side projects, anon. Paracelsus was a Donald Glover of his time. And that this book >>37861043 was written by Paracelsus is a fact.

>>37861309
I was responding to this fool >>37857751
who thinks magic completely disappeared from people's lives, so yeah I had to cover all the time periods he discussed and that includes modern times and the 16th-18th centuries. Are there any other words you want to nitpick?

>>37861137
>>37861109
I can only assume you haven't read his book.

>>37861357
>>37861342
Arguing semantics is pointless

>>37861357
>>37861342
There's a reason he's remembered for his work on alchemy and early pharmacology and not one book fellas

>>37861355
Well write more clearly next time because that anon IS a fucking retard, magic never disappeared wtf Modern spiritualism is cancer but within the last 100 years we had two major occult systems still active and still plenty more, the world just god more secular

>>37861365
Yeah, I get that, but the kind of men who produce such works don't merely stop at the theoretical. Some of the things they wrote require practical corroboration and experience. It's like saying Isaac Newton was only ever a physicist and ignore his dabbling with alchemy and calculations of Armageddon (which I don't actually believe but we'll see when 2060 comes around).

>>37861387
No, you need to read more carefully.

>>37861390
yes anon becuase that was what science WAS at the time, calling him a wizard is removing the context of the time he lived in, he probably never considered himself as such, no more than newton would.

>>37861378
I don't care what other people remember. These are free times when I get to read whatever book I want from whatever author I want. And you don't get to dictate anything. You'd have us also forget that Isaac Newton dabbled in occult topics too. Fuck that. Go bother someone else about what people should and shouldn't be remembered for.

>>37861421
>I don't care if I'm wrong Ill just keep doing it anyway
lol

>>37861418
You are arguing semantics now. I'm not budging. Paracelsus was a magician. Newton not so much, maybe just a really ardent fan of "deciphering" the bible.

>>37861437
Well then have fun arguing pointless shit with no one

>>37861418
>>37861432
I'm not caving to your semantic play. Do you understand this? Paracelsus was a magician. Deal with it.

>>37861443
There's no argument to be had. Paracelsus was a magician and he wrote a book about elementals.

>>37861446
No

>>37861452
No, Im sorry you dont understand what the definition is but just repeating it at me like a child doesnt change it He was an alchemist, and would probably be insulted to be considered a wizard.

>>37861455
>i don't care if i'm wrong
Tough shit. Because I stand firm on my position and you can't change my mind. Carry on being wrong.

>>37861464
Great, changes nothing, no history book will be changed, wikipedia will stay the same, and he will be forever known as an ALCHEMIST

>>37861460
>leave britney alone
Lol what is this desperately childish need to change the mind of a complete rando?

>>37861473
IM sorry you need to resort to this childishness

>>37861467
>wikipedia
Lol the same page that lists the book on elementals? Ok.

>>37861468
>"Paracelsus was a magician"
>reeeeee

>>37861480
Yes and what does it call him on that page anon?

>>37861478
And I'm sorry you scour threads, jumping from post to post for any argument to be had. I'm half convinced you're just ragetrolling now. I'm sorry if you're not but there are assholes who join in on other people's exchanges for the sheer love of chaos.

>>37861492
I'm sure you'll feel better after simply admitting hes an alchemist

>>37861489
If you haven't noticed, I was mocking wikipedia. No wonder you have this ignorant opinion of Paracelsus.

>>37861502
Couldn't have been less obvious considering you're mocking me in that same post

>>37861489
>>37861500
Jfc he was an alchemist and magician
https://docquity.com/articles/paracelsus-the-alchemist-journey/

>>37861509
Exactly. But these other anons insist he was only ever one thing.

>>37861509
>https://docquity.com/articles/paracelsus-the-alchemist-journey/
Nothing from his own works or any form his followers claim him to be a wizard, some after the fact crap isnt worth our time

>>37861521
>is mad about the use of a word
LMAO

>>37861527
I Accept your concession

Not only was Paracelsus a magician, wizard and sorceror, he was also a fantastic beatboxer.

>>37861532
Paracelsus was a mage. You're just too mad to admit it.

>>37861467
Are you like diagnosed autistic or something? Do you understand you can be more than one thing? If a doctor gets knighted by king sneed they don't lose the PhD. If he spoke to a salamander he didn't suddenly forget how to mix laudanum. Fucking idiot.

>>37861536
How dare you call him a beatboxer! Admit you're wrong and I will accept your concession.

>>37861542
6/10 you got me, this is like those wierdos who constantly attribute shit to st. Germain

>>37861550
Idk, man. There's anons who go around just for an argument.
And that's whether or not they sincerely believe in the positions they take.

>>37861550
Im sinply saying you're ignoring historical context and simply mindlessly applying labels to someone who would have been offended to even be called one

>>37861555
Nice trips in tribute to St Germain who was a magician and alchemist and breakdancer

>>37861571
I accept your concession

>>37861577
>wikipedia doesn't explicitly say obama is a human
Lol there was none given. You're just too much of petulant princess to understand that people can be more than one thing.

>>37861589
Because ignoring context is retarded, might as well just call anything you don't understand magic and everyone smarter than you a wizard

Paracelsus invented wikipedia and intentionally left out "magician" from his list of occupations so Biden wouldn't set the inquisition on him.

>>37861600
FUCK, WHO TOLD YOU THAT?

>>37861599
But I'm not calling you a wizard though lol. Just Paracelsus.

>>37861612
Pretending to be retarded to avoid the topic is sad anon

>>37861624
Pretending to be superior is even more sad. You've simply decided on the conclusion and refuse to see that alchemy, medicine and magic intersected during Paracelsus' time. Not my fault you're retarded ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

>>37861642
Im sorry you cant understand context anon

>>37861662
I'm sorry you're retarded and think you're a debate-bro.

wait.. isn't paracelsus the guy who suggested the use of poppet dolls to cure dancing mania?

>>37861668
I accept your concession

>>37861727
Clearly none was given, but you're just spamming the same childish retort.

>>37861735
I accept your concession

>>37861735
so you impotently reporting every post?

>>37861685
kek nobody wants to talk about that
we're just supposed to focus on his alchemy

Nice to know historical literacy is now something to be mocked on /x/

>>37861685
I believe that could be a postmorten thing attributed to him? But it could be. Wizard or seer or evoker or whatever the fuck you want to call him, he was no materialist

>>37861756
Yeah, alchemist :D

>>37861755
If only things explicitly written down by an author is to be considered history, maybe you should write about your parents. Otherwise they won't be history either.

>>37861768
Bizarre insult and fails to impact anon. Context still matters tho.

>>37861760
Nah. Alchemist AND magician.

>>37861777
lol what spells did he practice, what magic did he perform anon? Is written language magic to you?

>>37861774
The context being that alchemy, medicine and magic were integral in his practice. Keep trying to sound smart.

>>37861788
lol no again Context anon

>>37861792
Lol no again to you. That IS the context.

>>37861802
No, it isnt.

>>37861809
I'm gonna just keep saying yes every time you spam no. And every time you repeat "I accept your concession", I'm just gonna laugh at your desperate need to change my thought. Tough luck. That ain't happening. Paracelsus was a magician.

So to conclude: Paracelsus was a magician. I'm going to bed now, but I'll return tomorrow to say the same. Good night.

>>37858019
beep boop

>>37861827
No, but Im sure you'll just keep repeating it. To call him a magician is to completely misunderstand what counted as magic and what was natural during his time. To him those werent magical beings, they were natural beings, to him alchemy was a natural science(in a way it was too). To be considered a wizard would have been a insult to him, he was called a necromancer to that effect. He was a chemist, a philosopher and an alchemistic sorry you need this childish shit to avoid being wrong on such a small unimportant subject

>>37857147
Magick is meant for men to wield. It's not meant for women and faggots. Simple as.

>>37857147
I've been thinking about this question my entire life. I have come up with several possibilities.

First, assuming magic is based off spiritual enlightenment, philosophical proficiency and mental acumen, then the average person probably can't use magic, take the internet, for the past couple years normies have been touting DEI as both supremely logical and ethical, but nowadays opinions are turning, people think they're annoying and companies are dumping them, this is a microcosm showing the wheels of samsara, in a few years, people will switch gears again, feel guilty about the past and forget why we even argued in the first place going for decades, I can count multiple occasions where I've changed my mind about something and tossed away my former perspective like a piece of garbage, only to do the opposite again, dragged unwillingly across different beliefs. For a person who is spiritually enlightened this wouldn't happen, they would have the perspective to truly see all sides of an issue and most of them are untrue, but most people who practice magic shit are not like this, they have a specific ideology built into their practice like non interference or pacifism, and ultimately that's what hampers their practice. If you ask any new ager what "enlightenment" feels like, they'll just say "oh you'll know it when you feel it" but thats not really true, thats how you settle for schizo coincidence seer magic, to get the real thing you actually have to fight a spiritual battle against yourself.

There's also the option that its other things like demons though. Maybe elites are hiding magic, or maybe its archons, ask a gnostic anon and they'll tell you that "spirit animals" all the Wiccan go gaga for are actually demons meant to distract from higher levels of perception, in fact at a certain level of true intention, archons will just force you to have a heart attack and die.

>>37862081
Crowley was a raging faggot

>>37857147
Harry potter magic is impractical, theatrical nonsense.
Real magic is way more subtle and powerful.

>>37862175
Another anon once reccomended some Chinese guy called John Chang, there are old videos of him on YouTube and supposedly he had real chi powers, you can even see in the video him set a ball of paper on the ground, press it with his hand and set it on fire, or drive a pen through a table. This was done for a documentary several decades ago, but he refused to keep filming because apparently his master came to him in ghost form and was passed he was showing their cool shit to plebs, so thats another option, that Chinese ghost dudes are preventing the filthy mortals from achieving an immortal spiritual body so they don't have to deal with a spirit world population boom or something.

There's also the fact that most spiritual traditions in the modern day are based off stuff Crowley did, but Crowley didn't really do a good job at creating a consistent objective magic tradition, in fact he did the opposite, he basically took an ancient text from a Jewish mystic about how to achieve gnosis and be blessed by divine power, and butchered it. The original ritual outlined was very ascetic in nature, consisting of multiple trials including an 18 month long retreat from the world where you cannot speak, for like three of those months you couldn't even allow people to see you or you had to start over, but Crowley used his classic "muh individual path" to shorten that down to a three month total retreat, which he failed to complete, so he had a "revalation" and managed to do the whole process via a three day mass orgy, and that's one of the biggest differences, most Magick practitioners do it because they're lazy, but the shit there is not easy, it ain't free either, according to the mystic all that time he spent was just to prove himself to God, and after he gained awesome powers he had to make a vow to basically never sin again and live his life in the service of others, so its possible God (if he exists) is personally controlling who gets magic, and is very picky.

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its not the magic thats weak. its people

>>37862228
Crowley was just a sex and drug addled freak high off the attention he got from whatever he was doing that day. If it wasnt magic it was mountain climbing, or just shitting on Christianity. If he was born today he would have just been another vtuber or more likely, a lolcow

>>37862248
Nigga tried to be the Bruce Lee of magic, but he was more like the V-Shred honestly.

>>37862228
The problem today is most people get into this shit to rebel. Its a retarded phase for most, then you get the witchtokers and tumblr witches who do it to feel special or for a sense of community. Here you've essentially seen the occult and conspiracy community merged into some insane demon thing that makes utterly no sense. The people who get into that might actually do something requires such a perfect storm of requirements (good education, high will power to actually study this shit, mentally sound) that you
ll probably see 1 in 10 million, MAYBE

>>37862256
Problem is he was simply there for attention, he was creative, Ill give you that, though only to a point, as it all just revolved around sex in the end, and modern Thelemites cant ever take a joke because even they realize it wasn't that serious, and if they acknowledge that, the whole thing might fall apart

>>37857694
I had a theory that this world was created by magic communists in another world, who seethed because they were not good at magic, and grouped their abilities together to conjure a realm for anyone who agreed with them

It's the kind of thing that makes sense to the book smart, if it is what happened I can only blame myself for being retarded enough to fall for it

>>37857147
Why do you think conflating fiction with reality is an argument?

>>37860850
The only thing the us military uses now are troons and spics.

>>37857147
(Before you read the following: Don't hurt yourself.)

Let's say you can hurt yourself .
What's stopping you from doing it?
Try overcoming it.
It'll be scary. Try to hurt yourself.
I suggest this: try to tear your muscles apart from contracting them really hard.
Whatever stops you, is also the source of what stops you from doing magic, or at least one form of it.

I did "magic", or at least saw some genuine paranormal phenomena, by pushing myself to the extreme physically and mentally. Like trying to tell a person I knew that I'd love to have some time with his daughters (I didn't actually say it, but I almost did). I did stupid things, which were at least to my perception, fucking crazy and way out of my comfort zone. And they resulted in noticeable paranormal phenomena.

So maybe like other things in life, it's a reap what you sow kind of deal? If you put in genuine effort like trying to go out of your comfort zone or putting in focused work, you'll get something.

If that sounds lame to you, and you still want some sort of insane reality bending magic, well... I guess you could somehow try to completely leave the paradigm of our shared reality. But, reading authors like Peter Carroll, I've realised that the magick they can do is not because they somehow leave reality behind. Rather, they work within it, producing results by playing around with what is actually a natural part of our reality.

As an example, look at LoA. Let's say we all have some sort of ability to "manifest" things. For our manifestations to be meaningful and desirable, we'd want to integrate that whole idea of manifestation with our normal mind, like our emotions, subconscious feelings, thoughts, opinions, language, etc. If we tried to manifest "from scratch", what we would get either would be so weak as to be imperceptible, or irrelevant, or just plain useless. So that's why we have a framework in which we do things, so that we don't have to build it all up from scratch.

>>37857147
imho magic can influence only your reality tunnel but once in a while someone else's reality tunnel gets manipulated too. when we are all like gods why should it be easy or even achievable to change the reality of other gods in a reliable manner? and yeah, everyone's a larper at some point, it comes with the territory

>>37864496
>when we are all like gods
because we're not. Only in your own space or dreamworld. The very defining characteristic of the real adult world is that there are real adult risks and not everything can be done at the snap of s thought. The higher up into the world's your awareness goes the more serious it gets and the less you even worry about the notion of gods. Its just not important and no one really cares.

>>37864334
Not OP but the constantly poking reality with a stick approach you described is something that resonates with me too. Can you tell about some results or phenomena you experienced with this approach?

What is up with that phenotype in the middle of the photo? I swear I always see someone like that practicing wicca or pagan shit
>chinless
>fat blob head
>wanted to be taken seriously
There has to be a reason for the pattern

>>37864334
Yo. You just made me realize I do this thing all the time. I'm a fucking weirdo and I do something that most people are completely afraid of: trying to stare at everyone down. Most people would feel complete shame if they went around doing that, but for me it's a very conscious thing. And I do it because I have yet to meet a person who will stare me down... Is that magic? Because I'm doing something literally everyone is super afraid of doing, because they fear the consequences?

>>37857512
/thread

>>37864845

80% of Americans are obese or overweight

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>>37857147
god came back for a lil bit and that really dampened the magick of things, fantasy did exist but Christ literally stopped it for our sake

>why?

bcus traditional magick thats "out of this world" was things that had God-like power (which came from God) but was not one with God. God only changes the world (since Christ) in subtle ways that are only explained by the World; by God. These non-one-with-God things found themselves actively violating a decent bit of natural law because they had power to change the world directly, but didn't abide by the same laws that God set.

>why god allow?

bcus God wanted to punish us or something? Idk, back before Christ he did that a lot

>fairy tales

literally pray to jeebus it helped me with my tummy ache from anxiety on the bus to work

>>37858019
as requested

>>37857175
I actually got perfect dental health (history of cavities, haven’t seen the dentist in 4 years no problems) through a pact with God and I was curing my bad eyesight using my infinite learning tool. The Divine weakened my learning tool but it’s still there. I stopped practicing as hard anyway after it got good enough to drive even at night, so it’s still poor.
I can convince people online and in real life that I have a girthy, dangerously potent penis without even trying, but that’s an evolutionary ability that autistic women are born with.

>>37858689
ffs magic is not real in your reality tunnel we get it. put a bow on it be a faggot somewhere else

>>37861490
kek'd

>>37861827
no, paracelsus was a sorcerer!

>>37864551
being a god is a matter of perspective I guess
>Verification not required.

I think maybe it was meant to be used collectively, not just by single individuals.

>>37865357
>muh robert anton wilson
You have poor reading skills. I wasn't even saying magic isn't real.

>>37862014
>more semantic raging
In your words: I accept your concession.

>>37865529
But no... he would be offended if you called him that! Lmao..

>>37857147
Magic ain't real >>37865688

>>37857292
We have guns and moltovs. So would it be that different?

>>37866791
Yes. Are you retarded?

>>37857147
If someone tells you they can do "magic", they can't do "magic".
Nobody can do "magic".

>>37857217
> why would people randomly stop believing for no reason?

Maybe you forgot about how many people were murdered for practicing magic before materialism rapidly took hold.

Prior to the 1800s, many were burned for suspected "witchcraft".

Then "science" established that it didn't exist; the Flexner Report in the early 1900s in America condemned homeopathy and other natural cures to ailments.

Anything that couldn't be "scientifically explained" was not allowed to be taught at medical schools or they'd lose their license to operate. Even if it worked. Then Rockefeller oil-based pills filled in the gaps.

If magic is real make me win lottery, all 6 numbers so my brother can have a successful heart surgery, otherwise magic is fake and gay.
Checkmate wizlarp bros

>>37857175
If there were people who could maintain a flawless appearance through magic, you wouldn't know they were ever ugly, right?

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>>37857147
Have you tried gitting gud?

>>37867122
>Have you tried gitting gud?
>muh hemisync
>still a wage slave
>still living an average life
>still can't get bitches like 6'5" hylic that can't "git gud"
What's the point of arbitrarily ascribing worth to something that has not tangibly improved your life in any objective way (key word is objective, not subjective nonsense like "I feel enlightened" or "I feel at peace").

>>37857147
>Why is magic ("magick") in our realm so lame?
It's not. You simply believe it's lame, so you recognize a lot of lameness and you live that belief, no?. Change your mind and the world will change with you.

>>37867152
If you are a materialistic retard then you should've studied stocks, dumbass.

>>37867268
>is poor and still has no magic

>>37867152

I mean the gateway tapes have seriously improved my life in many tangible objective ways. And actually one of those ways is financially. When I discover the gateway tapes I was 100k in debt. I am now semi retired. So you can use them for financial gain if that is something that is important to you.

>>37857171
so how does it come to pass that every colonized people, all of whose leaders claimed to be decendents of the gods, all of whom employed a robust class of spiritual experts, shamen, sorcerers, etc, were unable to stem the tide of secular meat, disease, and weaponry thrown at them.
Why, under the weight of all their combined curses and comparative occult might, wasn't Europe swallowed into the Earth?

>>37867296
>When I discover the gateway tapes I was 100k in debt. I am now semi retired.
Woah there, grandpa. You went from A to B with no intermediate steps. Dish out the details.

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>>37867299
Retarded pagan rituals and sacrificing chickens are meaningless actions that have no science or potence. If you don't have Kundalini energy to work with you don't have anything.

>>37867313
The only thing semi about him is his dick

>>37857147
Because if everyone knew that the supernatural is real everyone would try to escape from this loosh farm so the ones who put us here want to limit our abilities and keep us focusing on the material.
>captcha TNDNV

>>37867327
Ok but I remind you that both the near and far East are among those subjugated by soulless secular forces. Why?
Why are the geographic centers of your chosen occult framework so much worse off than the spiritually dull and buglike beaurocrats of the CCP and the Mindless Western consoomer?

>>37867329

Yeah semi in your moms mouth.

>>37857694
>I have this suspicion that some super wizard in the past made magic dissappear from this realm.


Basically what happens in LotR

>>37867313

The gateway tapes have tracks for solving all your financial problems including “visualize your ideal life one year from today”, “cast your problem out into the universe and wait for the answer to come back in a form you can understand” and also the “free flow” tracks which you can define for your own custom needs. Through these, I was shown ways to pay off all debts and attain the ideal life I visualized one year in the future. You don’t have to do the gateway tapes, you can laugh at this if you want. But I literally have money in the bank, every material thing I could ever want, ZERO debt of any kind, and I don’t work, don’t have a boss, and never have to set an alarm. So I guess it worked out ok for me.

>>37867388
Get some viagra, pop-pops. And answer the other guy's question.

>>37867268
>If you are a materialistic retard then you should've studied stocks, dumbass.
1. There's no point in studying stocks. The best and most effective investment plan for anyone is to just put all of their money in an index fund and take advantage of the fact that you get a guaranteed 11% return per year (instead of gambling).

2. There is no such thing as "materialistic" when you look at reality over time. People like you just lack the self awareness to realize that.

You are talking to me right now through an advanced technological device, you don't hunt for meat or farm your own vegetables (you go to the grocery store), you enjoy all the entertainment you want, you eat great food when you want, you have high quality sanitation facilities, etc.

Most of us today have more materialistic lives than a fucking king 1000 years ago, and 1000 years from now, what we call materialistic today, will be the new normal of tomorrow.

It's all relative. You have just been raised to see all the modern conveniences you enjoy as "normal" and "average", so you don't think of them as "materialistic luxuries".

>>37867296
Sure totally believable, that's why you left out all of the details.

>>37867415

See above- also I will add this process took about 4 years in total.

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>>37867376
Funny, every ideology you listed as superior has a negative birth rate and is suffering spiritual death as we speak. Meanwhile the 500 million Buddhists are flourishing.

>>37867425

See above.

>>37867412
Bruh, that's just called financial responsibility and adulting. Assuming you're not spinning yarns online, no one really needs hemisync or magic to learn how to make money, save, invest, etc. It just takes discipline and study. Now, if you conjure a spirit and it leads you to some treasure worth hundreds of millions of dollars, that's something worth discussing.

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>>37867446
top kek

>>37867446
>CPAmon: he will teach you accounting, he has red hair and a tiny hat

>>37867448
>longtext meme
No thanks.

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> spend years in the secular world learning a skill only to soul trap yourself chasing worthless cloth bills
> or learn how to vajra hook wealth from the souls of the malicious straight to your door (total mastery of crypto and stocks)

If only there were a goddess as based as Manohara Vasudhara

>>37867475
>my scam is better than the others
top kek

>>37867412
You aren't describing magic, you are describing a placebo. Every other person I've talked to that used the tapes is a wage slave. You are taking a coincidence and confusing it with a miracle.

You are also being very vague and that's likely on purpose because it's like you are trying to convince yourself.

What the hell does this even mean, be specific:
>I was shown ways to pay off all debts
A voice whispered a legal loophole or a business opportunity in your ears?

For every 1 person that thinks they magicked their way into winning the lottery, there's 9 other lottery winners that won without doing any magic at all, and there's 1000000+ people who lost.

You just got lucky bro, on a planet of billions somebody is bound to get the specific sequence of life events that you did that leads to such coincidences.

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For "proof" of magic here you go. Do the simple prayers to these 8 angels, and you'll really see, and feel, some magic. Be serious, though, and make realistic requests.


https://codexastarte.substack.com/p/invocation-of-the-angels-of-omnipotence

>>37866842
Have you tested everyone to prove there's no Magick? "We" just need a broader definition of Magick. Magick is Any rite, ritual, Intention, experiment, ceremony, practice, prayer, blessing, cursing, request, or contemplation used to ask a Higher power (HGA) or god to grant you something you want. It also uses your Will to effect a psychic, paranormal, probability, supernatural change, or wish fulfillment. Xtianity, therefore, has had a near monopoly on magick for centuries while denouncing anyone elses use of it, including their parishioners! It's time to do some "trust-busting"! It'sbeen hiding in plain sight.

>>37867475
>vajra hook wealth from the souls of the malicious straight to your door
As long as one attains spiritual union with Red Manohara Vasudhara, right? Lol mighty presumptive...

>>37867493
Sure, let's round up all magic practitioners and test them. With proper controls and protocols.

>>37867446

Well, in my opinion, today’s society is not fair. In fact, I would say it is rigged to destroy you. You will not be able to have a life I have through simple “work hard and save and don’t waste money on Starbucks”. You need the hemisync tapes to access a high level of consciousness where you will be shown how to receive the kind of money needed for a real quality of life. I’m talking about a quality of life you will never have from working at the Amazon warehouse and saving all you Pennies diligently. Some people will mock me and refuse to believe this and that’s ok. The tapes are out there for free. I’m posting this in case someone who is reading this is 100k in debt working a night shift job in a factory and totally hopeless. And in that case, you have nothing to lose and possibly much to gain by taking my advice

>>37867495
>>37867495
Yeah... the problem with this kind of magic is that there's the ever convenient "I tried and I tried but the wealth wasn't coming in, but eventually I achieved spiritual union and by the time I got to that stage, I no longer had desire for wealth." I mean, what's the end goal of Buddhism anyway? Enlightenment and cessation of suffering. And how are people supposed to get there? By getting rid of their attachments to things like wealth. It's a fucking trick is what it is.

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>>37867483
> scam
What do you think the yarmalukes are doing with their semitic blood magic? At least this is using pure positive energy.

>>37867495
> spiritual union blah blah blah
Yeah, we're friends. What about it?

>>37867489
>You just got lucky bro, on a planet of billions somebody is bound to get the specific sequence of life events that you did that leads to such coincidences.


Shouldn’t this just make it that much more obvious to you that the tapes worked?

>>37867435
I quibble with your understanding of "flourishing" but be that as it may the golden age practitioners could not in their own time prevail against the tides of dull soulless violence, nor preserve their countrymen against a long dark age of persecution, exploitation, and spiritually dulling influence of their then-conquerors.
I'll gladly entertain that the decline of those very conquerors is the result of a relative few's spiritual power, but even so the insufficiency of magic to prevent those dark eras or prevail in spectacular way against dumb force is the kind of surprising "weakness" I percieve the thread is about, and it certainly falls short of "limitless" as the first tripfag suggested.
Engineering and large numbers seem like far "stronger" avenues in the aggregate.

>>37867507
Yes, it's rigged. But people aren't as weak as they think they are. They have difficult choices to make but they still have choices, and they can achieve their goals with discipline and watching out for opportunities. You can do this with or without hemisync.

>>37867523
Lmao this guy is a pretentious larper

>>37867493
>It'sbeen hiding in plain sight.
It's been hiding in the poverty of all it's practitioners. It's scary to me how literally every mediocre person can convince themselves that they are capable of magic, and yet they see no logical flaw in the fact that they lives remain as unchanged and powerless as every other non-practitioner around them.

I could never delude myself into believing nonsense like that.

When someone has a 140+ (Genius) IQ, they are completely aware of it, their abilities reflect that, they are undeniably superior to those around them who don't have their abilities, and their results in life reflect their superiority.

There are exceptions, but that's the rule. There are average IQ ranges for certain career fields, and higher IQ's dominate the more specialized well paying fields.

When someone has great physical genetics and athletic talent, it's the same thing.

Heck, just height alone works like this. Stats show that around 60% of Fortune 500 CEO's are 6ft or taller, but 6ft men only make up 15% of the US population. So 15% of the population dominate CEO positions at a 60% rate.

This shows you that humans still operate on a somewhat primitive level, where physicality determines respect and whether a man is seen as a "leader". There were very likely short (average height) men that were just as qualified if not more, but they lost the spot just to height alone.

To get to the point, when someone has exclusive abilities/traits that the majority of the population lacks, their lives reflect that reality, and they can use those abilities to their advantage in various aspects of life.

The life of a tall man is blatantly easier and more enjoyable
The life of a genius is blatantly easier and more enjoyable
the life of an athlete is blatantly easier and more enjoyable

So..... why isn't the life of an individual that claims they can manipulate reality with magic (a VERY exclusive ability) not blatantly superior and more enjoyable?

>>37867540
> only sees materialist conquerors as winners
They're all going to go extinct. They've studied this effect in rats, once all the behavior sinks of spiritual death and social breakdown appear the population goes entirely extinct. Google "rat utopia experiment" and read the papers. Secular China and the West are suffering all of these problems.

>>37867533
>Shouldn’t this just make it that much more obvious to you that the tapes worked?
It seems like you can't read.

>>37867489
>For every 1 person that thinks they magicked their way into winning the lottery, there's 9 other lottery winners that won without doing any magic at all, and there's 1000000+ people who lost.

1. The large majority of people that have the same outcomes as you did not use the tapes.

2. The large majority of people that did use the tapes did not get your outcomes.

>>37867563
Fake and gay study, but that's beside the point.
A poison that kills your enemy AFTER he humiliates and harms you and your loved ones may be said to be "powerful" but it's certainly LESS powerful than one that would kill him instantly, or than a well-handled mundane weapon.
But you appear to be making the even weaker claim that the spiritualism's real power is just that it allowed them to weather an assault that was doomed to die on its own eventually anyway.
That's fine, it's just a disappointing power-level for literal magic. And again, falls FAR short of having "no limit"

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>>37867599
>Fake and gay study
Fake and gay mind.

>>37867609
nice try buddhist, I know it's the same mind that we share. But mine is cool and discerning whereas your region is troubled and deluded. Let's both try and attain enlightenment immediately for each others sakes, no?

>>37857634
>no, because they sincerely believed.
and how do you know neo-pagan and new agers don't sincerely believed in the things they say they believe ?

>>37866660
Jesus you were desperate for attention

>>37867712
>is the one actually desperate for attention
Sorry. I can't be your step-dad, Jimmy. Your mom's a whore.

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>>37857147
we just stop calling the powerful stuff that actually works 'magic', those are called 'sciences' under the current paradigm

>>37867795
>Let me redefine mundane shit as magic so that I can convince myself I'm capable of doing magic

>>37867762
Were you just sitting in the thread waiting for a response??

>>37867829
Most of that "mundane shit" is only mundane because you are already used to it, there descriptions and explanations given with little symbolism and it's spiritual and metaphysical implication left for each to ponders instead of being explicitly told along side it

>>37867941
>the mundane isn't mundane
lol

>>37867941
>Most of that "mundane shit" is only mundane because you are already used to it
No, it's mundane because it was achieved by obeying "natural law". Unlike you I don't lack self awareness. Being able to go to a grocery store and buy food is a luxury even though it's a common thing in the modern era, it's still not magic though, humans achieved the food production rates we have by selective breeding and genetic engineering of crops, using pesticides and herbicides, etc.

It's not magic no matter how amazing it is, and how much it impacts our lives, because it was achieved through natural means that abide by natural laws.

Starting fire with a lighter is amazing and very useful, it's still not magic because it involves using an flammable liquid and friction to start the fire and keep it lit.

If you could start a fire with just the intent of your mind and by tapping into some kind of invisible energy (again with just your intent) that would a very clear and undeniable example of magic, because it defies natural law.

You can't just redefine mundane scientifically understood phenomena as "magic" just because it looks flashy and/or is useful.

>>37867562
great post

If you could shoot fireballs with your hand you've already broken the matrix and would be able to do literally anything like move matter so you would be able to move planets and galaxies. You'd basically be able to move freely in the universe then. So no wonder that doesn't happen because then using such powers would be vanity when they could just ascend.

>>37867562
Because none of those things are true. On this site right now there are 130+ iq people who live like shit. People who would crush some sport but never got to. Virgin lanklets. No amount of nebulous statistics about height or whatever can change the fact life can suck, and for most it does, no matter your qualities.
By the way, notice many wizards in legend don't have happy ever after. So wanting some weak probability manipulation or ganzfeld telepathy to carry you up to untold riches and success is a little presumptuous.

>>37867507
Thank you for sharing it. Do you remember which series of tapes?

I remember an anecdote in one of Ophiel's books, where an entrepreneur thrived during the Great Depression, until he became convinced that something wasn't working if he succeeded while others failed, at which point he too failed.
It doesn't matter if it doesn't work for the vast majority. It's important that it works for you.

>>37869368
>On this site right now there are 130+ iq people who live like shit.
1. Lol at "4channers are geniuses bro", sorry, I don't think that's the case.

2. Remember when I said:
>>37867562
>There are exceptions, but that's the rule. There are average IQ ranges for certain career fields, and higher IQ's dominate the more specialized well paying fields.
I already know that there are a FEW people with above average IQ's that are under-performing in life because of various circumstances, but that is not the majority, that's a small subset, a tiny exception to the rule.

>No amount of nebulous statistics about height or whatever can change the fact life can suck, and for most it does, no matter your qualities.
Never said life can't suck, you are arguing against a strawman. the point still stands that there are rules, and people who are genetically gifted tend to life exceptional lives and have many advantages over those that aren't genetically gifted.

So someone who has the gift of magic which dwarfs the superiority of any genetic gift should have an amazing life (on average), but the large majority of so called magicians I talk to online are wage slaves with shitty lives.

So it's more likely that they are just delusional and they can't actually do magic.

>By the way, notice many wizards in legend don't have happy ever after.
>So wanting some weak probability manipulation or ganzfeld telepathy to carry you up to untold riches and success is a little presumptuous.
How do you know they were even legit?
Aren't you being presumptuous?