I understand people being against eating dogs and stuff>nooooo my pet-inosssssbut this is going too far
>>5151869Huh? I've been selectively not eating sea food based on them being smart for years now, I don't care about whatever influencers are clowning around about it, never knew other people cared. But I do not believe they should suffer and I strongly think we've been underrating them severely for years. I only wished they lived longer to get smarter so we could study their growth further see if it caps at all, I think they got screwed over by nature. They're very neat sensible creatures. I don't eat horses, cats, dogs, monkeys+apes, octopi, crustaceans, frogs, snails and rabbits (all for different reasons, some are religious or family traditions, others personal). I just know nobody gives a fuck about sea creatures enough to be careful about it in any step of the process or put regulations in place beyond consummer protection so It's a full no for me, I'm happy to hear the project is failing then but sad for the local business prospects of course. Regulations are too slow for it to be a safe bet, just look at how shrimps are treated. I don't trust them. If they didn't botch every other animal industry so often I'd maybe care less but they're not trustworthy. Since cows and pigs are popular here they're treated better but it's an uphill battle to prevent corporations crushing local traditional farms since politicians never favor them.
>>5151869An octopus saved my life once, I feel like I owe them.
>>5151869Octopus intelligence is severely overrated
>>5151869Its empathy instincts not intelligenceDogs and cats and to a lesser extent horses were bred to trigger these in you. Octopi werent. Ergo dog eaters are typically brutal people who have an easier time with murder, rape, and cannibalism as well (see china, prewar europe)
>>5151934I only eat animals with cloven hooves that chew their cud, fish with scales, and kosher birds. Amazing how god invented a dietary category of only the most retarded and pitiable creatures, largely absent of will (except goats unlike cattle and sheep will attack you if you slaughter another goat, so i dont eat goat)No kosher slaughter tho. It was the best reliable humane option cavemen had but not anymore.
>>5151869Vegans are objectively superior humans
>>5151977Yeah aside from being weak soilets due to malnourishment.
>>5151977Vegans are superior slaves. Just look at india. They pursue veganism to enforce caste. Only wealthy people can attain even 90% of their genetic potential without meat, which keeps most people artificially stunted. A poorer or less educated vegan just gets sick and grows up small and retarded. At the end of it very few animals have real world moral value because our interactions with them ultimately affect other humans and both individual and group fitness. The assumed moral value of most animals only exists in hallucinated spiritual terms. And vegans simply lack any prophets and goss outside of south asian slave religions whose fruits are apparent
>>5151965A Judas goat will lead sheep to slaughter while its own life is spared. The term is a reference to Judas Iscariot, an apostle of Jesus Christ who betrayed Jesus as told in the New Testament of the Bible.
>>5151977>guaranteed seething replies
>>5152020Only Jains are vegan, the majority of Indians consume dairy
There's only superficial differences between dogs and octopus. Eat both or neither.
>>5152047I don’t see a valid moral difference. Milk and eggs are bodily waste. A vegan can, despite their identity politics, eat an egg and only lose virtue signaling points (normalizing or symbolically acting against le sentient beans dignity or whatever) without doing anything real>>5152230Superficial is what matters because it actually affects human reality and interacts with involuntary instinct. Without honest belief in a spiritual truth there is no such thing as valid non-anthropocentric ethics. Additionally, ethical consistency is itself pointless without a judgemental higher power that has set at least one standard we must be consistent with (see; YHWHs seven laws of noah) so we are not beholden to logical, legal conditions - courts of law. With no concrete base (“why be good?”) there is nothing to actually reason from and ethics are just whatever seems like a good idea at the time within the constraints of material reality. To say this, you must 1: accept legal tradition as a divine mandate 2: legally enshrine intelligence as a determinant of an organisms value.
>>5151965>Amazing how god invented a dietary category of only the most retarded and pitiable creatures, largely absent of will (except goats unlike cattle and sheep will attack you if you slaughter another goat, so i dont eat goat)And yet mussels, which don't even have a brain, are forbidden. Doesn't seem very consistent.
>>5151869The intelligence cope doesn't even follow logic considering how we treat pigs. This topic is entirely a product of carnism. Attempts to "rationalize" why certain intelligent animals are okay to eat while others aren't will always be contradictory. It'll have barely coherent reasoning like this >>5151963 which doesn't even realize that he's defending a lack of empathy, while accusing other nations of having none.It's always going to be illogical but people like their tasty meat so they will excuse the contradiction. The only "out" I see for animal cruelty is for there to be a cheap, tasty synthetic meat source while simultaneously pricing "organic" meat out of the hands of most people. It's never going to be through consumer action.
>>5151869Octopuses are clever, but are far too short-lived and too anti-social to make anything of their intelligence.
>>5151977Lol.Lmao even.
I would have absolutely no problem eating another human.
>>5152047No you fucking retard. Janis consume dairy. It's necessary for religious stuff. >>5152020I'm 6'1My older brother is 5'2. Guess which one of us is vegan lol
>>5152230Nigga their meat is vastly different, are you retarded
>>5152314Abrahamic meat restrictions are because of the lack of sanitation and refrigeration at the time those religions were created, pigs were forbidden because people didn't know about germs and parasites and thought the disease they were getting from pigs was inherent to the meat and not a byproduct of poor handling and shellfish were forbidden because people didn't have the means to keep them fresh until consumption
Animals don't give a shit about how smart what they're eating is, why should we? Humans creating categories of what's okay and not okay to eat based on our own personal opinion morality is incredibly retarded.
>>5154439>animals dont give a shit about informed consent so why shou-Good idea! *unzips dick* bend over>>5154398Early heebs cooked the shit out of their meat and any uncooked meat can carry parasites. It was pigs specifically because they banned eating intelligent animals. Fish with scales bans whaling and dolphin hunts. Not a coincidence.
>>5153619That “barely coherent reasoning” is spot on. You just have a schizo definition of empathy as a vague virtue you feel for imagined minds and he had a materialist definition of empathy as a button that gets pushed in the more autonomous part of the human brain.Yes, dogs are not octopi. Humans are forced to feel empathy if they have it when around dogs. We bred them to do this.
We don’t judge food-animals by intelligence. We judge them by usefulness, edibility, and taste. Octopi are not useful to man for any other purpose than consumption, they are edible, and they can taste good, therefore they are food.
>>5151934>doesn't want to eat smart animals>still eats porkNice larp fag
>>5151869Honestly, I kind of agree with the sentiment behind the objection, but I think it's very reasonable, or could easily be made so, in practice. Octopuses honestly have pretty shit lives in the wild, and very few species live longer than one year, and only one lives longer than two years. Not as in, "Oh, they get preyed on, ocean's a rough neighborhood"; as in that is literally the upper limit of achievable lifetime for octopuses.Given their short life-spans, it doesn't seem remotely within the bounds of cruelty to have a farm that could give them less stressful and chaotic lives than they'd be likely to experience out at sea for the short time they get to exist in this world, then harvest them for food when they're about to croak anyway. Seems very win-win all around for the octopuses, humans who would enjoy studying and/or caring for them on the farms, humans who could earn a living preparing and selling octopus meat or octopus-based cooked dishes, and humans who enjoy eating octopus or are curious about trying it. This seems to be one of the least-morally objectionable forms of animal-consumption for humans imaginable. I'm open to reasons why it's not if someone thinks they're seeing something I don't here, but this just strikes me as knee-jerk emotional outrage by people who've heard "octopus a smartie :)" without really knowing much else about them.
I don't like eating things from the sea so I am all game on animal rights for the squids. Not land mammals though, doesn't matter how smart they are they will end up on my plate>nuh duh pigs an dogs!!1!Pigs are tasty, dogs are not.
>>5154559I did say the farming process was important in my decision, I'm against industrialized and large exploitations that put profit over suffering which is most global producers, I'm once again caring about regulations in my decision to eat or not something and locally we do have some standards where as intelligent sea animals do not, so I leave very little trust in the industry's ability to not make horrors. I'm still on the fence about pig, since, my religion doesn't forbid it outright and while I love them they do make most of the meat here, I do try to lower intake despite traditions and doesn't seek it out. Poverty still means, if it's given to me by someone, I can't really object.>>5151965Hm hm. That said impure animals tend to be for a variety of reasons, I can imagine seafood, frogs and pigs have very different reasons for being banned or primed as impure. But it was wisdom.
>>5154585Interesting view. I tend to view it this way for cows. But as we know. Things don't tend to be this ideal once you step out of traditional forms, I fear they will treat them like they did the shrimps and pigs because they'd want the best turnout and rate or use unethical methods to promote hormone and breeding or botch the slaughter.
>>5151869Don't octopi only live for eight months
>>5151934>how shrimps are treatedit looks like if they don't suffocate they die from hypothermic shock from the ice water slurry they are thrown in for transport. Freezing to death is one of the more peaceful ways to die for a human, and how is it worse for a shrimp than being eaten alive like happens in the wild?
>>5154372I'd feel better if they were a bad person, like I'd have a lot less problem eating a bad dog. I'd enjoy eating a bad dog, like I'd think 'yeah, fucker' with every bite.
>>5154777It's the keeping and breeding I hold issue with. I've seen them maim their female's eyes so they are hormonally more active while all held in the same area. Imagine someone gouging your aunt's eyes so she'd develop differently or be more active?
>>5154818if your aunt is a shrimp im gonna eat your whole family>nooooodats speciesismoh no! get in the pot
>>5154822Kek. Anon I'm not vegan, I still eat animal products even if I make exceptions and tweaks... But thank you for the chuckle.
That's why I only eat baby octopii -- they're not as smart as the mature ones
>>5151869>tfw to smart to eat
