The OT was written 250 bc, and not 3000 years before. The whole old testament is fraud. The first NT gospel was what we would call "Marcion's version of Luke's gospel." It was the first gospel and all other gospels were copied and made from it. The ortodoxy biblical history claims Marcus was the first, but we have enough evidence to prove otherwise. It's true that Marcus gospel is the earliest gospel we have archeologically found. Marcion's version was of Luke was the original and most likely the only true account of Jesus and his teachings. The Luke's gospel we know today is not the original. Even thou it's called Marcion's version of Luke its not made by marcio or Luke. Most likely it was passed down to Marcio by earlier christians. The Jews under pharasees tried to hijack christianity and rewrite the gospels. That op was in full swing when Marcion came along. One of the key figures for the op was Paul. Paul teached almost everything contradicting Jesus. Also the acts has multiple theological clues it was written by rabbidical jews, and not christians. For example Acts and later talmud has many stories and similarities in theology. For example Talmud and Acts tell the story that Jesus was not crusified, but hanged. That story from acts had passed down through rabbies all the way to talmud. This hangin story was rabbidical version of Jesus's death.Anyway the gospel of marcus, matthew and john are full of Jewish revionism and retellings injecting jewish and anti christian teachings. The jewish op won. That's why they were murdering christians while claiming being Jesus's deciples. Anyway debate me.
Jesus tried to do a moral revolution within Judaism. The pharesees rejected it, and eventually murdered him. We know Jesus rejected murder, ritual sacrifices and was all about doing others as you would have done to you. He also advocated forgiveness as a virtue. Jesus had insight on what schemes the pharesees were trying to pull, and even gave instruction on how to spot false teachers. Jesus also rejected yhwh and did not refer to yhwh as his father or god. This is what we know.
>>24620473Christianity is a living religion. Your old books mean nothing to my God.
>>24620473HOURLY REMINDER: there is no god, jesus never existed and when you die it will be nothingness for eternity!
>>24620475That was nonsensical statement. Why wont you engage in the argument?
>>24620477You're arguing about some ink on paper that has no relevance to modern christianity. nothing in the bible says to decorate eggs for easter or take your kids to see santa at christmas.Christianity is a living religion and you're dead inside.
>>24620473Poseidon raped a woman and turned her into a pooner as compensation. LOL.
>>24620478Now you are arguing that christianity is just a fluid identity, and the teachings of Jesus doesnt matter. How silly and stupid.
>>24620480The teaching works because it is optimal. You can argue for a better case, but at the end of the day, what is optimal will be chosen.
>>24620480>Now you are arguing that christianity is just a fluid identity, and the teachings of Jesus doesnt matterYes correct. But you should use "don't matter" if there are multiple teachings, not "doesn't matter" that would be for one teaching. English is really easy, you'll be fluent in no time. I believe in you anon :)
>>24620481shut the fuck up gook
>>24620483Optimization and efficiency. I consider it a power move that I can beat your entire nation with 2 sentences.
>>24620473Song of Deborah, retarded kike, look it up.
>>24620473>here's my retarded schizo ramblings with nothing to back them up>While I won't provide any sources for what I've said I will immediately claim any source you quote as fabricated>debate me
>>24620476>there is no god
>>24620476
>>24620476it's funny how atheists deny Jesus but don't deny any other ancient historical figures. The first history of Cleopatra came from Plutarch and was written more than one hundred years after her death. There is more written about Jesus in the one hundred years after his death than there is written about Julius Ceasar. Why don't atheists deny Cleopatra or Julius Ceasar existed?
>>24620473trinity in the Old Testament - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PvE5E9BImE4- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rp92-3aBL-A- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9CBh8lmgecs
>>24620474>Yah-in reference to YHWH>-shua from the root meaning "to save" / "deliver."Yeshua = "Yahweh is salvation" / "The Lord saves"
>>24620473Paleo-Hebrew exists. Try again Mohammad.
>>24620473You can believe what you want to believe. But if your inmost desire is for Truth and you don't waver from that through all sorts of trials and tribulations, there are benevolent spirits in another dimension that will guide you to it. I myself have found great and incontrovertible archaeological evidence just on youtube of the Old Testament being true. Jesus commanded His followers not to be deceived, and those who love Him obey Him. I would diagnose you with ulterior motives as to why you don't want to believe the Bible and say there's something you value more than the Truth. So, you kick against it like Saul did. But even he could have a change of heart and a revelation and become very very useful to God.
>>24620485What evidence do you have of the age of that poem? Just Linguistic Clues. Nothing substantial.
>>24620493you have a jewish mind virus. you're a very sick person
>>24620495Well, that's your opinion. With what can we weigh our opinions?
>>24620473>debate my wild and inane schizo claims regarding JesusWhy is /pol/ like this every fucking day? You guys aren't even Christian, why are you so obsessed?
>>24620495nothing healthier than being a christian
>>24620486Ok, lets talk specifics. I could dump a huge list of sources, but you would just reject them. So let's argue spesifics. What exactly dont you agree, and let's go from there.
>>24620497but i am a christian
>>24620499First. Why do you group Esau and Jacob together and called them all Jews?
>>24620473Kill yourself. /Thread
>>24620502see >>24620489
>>24620487>>24620488>>24620489U r a bot
>>24620504but not the guy who spams "jesus never existed" all day long. got it.
>>24620491Yhwh was satanic human sacrifice god. There is enough contextual proof just within OT>29 “Do not hold back offerings from your granaries or your vats.[a] “You must give me the firstborn of your sons. 30 Do the same with your cattle and your sheep. Let them stay with their mothers for seven days, but give them to me on the eighth day. - Exodus 22:29-30For example "Baal" and "Malak" simply means "Lord." Christians too, speak of praising "the Lord" , even thou they dont think god is baal or malak. The distinction between the God of love and forgiveness—whom Jesus represents—and the "god" of vengeance and bloodlust found in the Old Testament has become blurred because the pharesees have written and compiled the OT, and made saying the god's name in vain. We tend to view the Old Testament as a single, coherent book, whereas in reality, it consists of multiple mutually contradictory texts; even the individual books themselves may be edited compilations of earlier works. Furthermore, the so-called Books of Moses were likely not written by Moses at all; they may well be separate texts from various Semitic tribes that were attributed to Moses at a later stage.This entire matter is further complicated by the Old Testament prohibition against Israel taking God's name in vain. Because God's name was left unspoken, ancient Jews referred to Him using circumlocutions—such as "the Lord," "the Almighty," or "Father in Heaven." This led to a situation where YHWH/Baal—that god of murder and vengeance—and his followers mingled with other tribes and lived among them, sharing in the same festivals; it was in this context that Pharisaic Judaism evolved.
>>24620493Ok, so why do you disagree? I cannot engage if you are vague. If you want to prove your faith and believes and you are sure of them, then you surely wont ve afraid to engage.
>>24620506By word alone. Judahism should only be about the bloodline of the 4th son of Jacob; Judah. Why should everyone be group together and called Jews?
>>24620501And where exactly have I done so? And what are the implications you are trying to insist.
>>24620509It's like saying King Herod has the same bloodline as Jesus Christ. They are not.
>>24620506>human sacrificeis an acknowledgement of god's authority since he is the creator of the world, he can even order abraham to take away the life of his firstborn son, isaacbut god instead uses that to point to the ultimate sacrifice, that of christ jesus>"Abraham looked around and saw a ram caught in a bush by its horns. He went and got it and offered it as a burnt offering instead of his son."- Genesis 22:13>"The promises were spoken to Abraham and to his seed. Scripture does not say “and to seeds,” meaning many people, but “and to your seed,” meaning one person, who is Christ."- Galatians 3:16
>>24620506>satanicgod rebukes satan in the book of job
>>24620473>Anyway debate me.Sure, throw away anything but the Word, the actual words of JC, and nothing about the nature of reality, the relationship between JC and the Father and the Holy Spirit, and everything in the mission to be accomplished will change. IF anything, you will get closer to the true vine than any other you know. When you discuss Saul, Marcion, or whomever who did not meet or hear JC, you then enter a reality where you were asked to make a choice to believe JC by JC, and now you are having to believe someone else. You know JC by his ideology and methods of teaching and knowledge of reality, there is no other out there and it is impossible back then to forgery because they did not understand what the Trinity meant. It unlocks all things...
>>24620506>god of vengeancegod is justat the second coming, god will toss the wicked into the lake of hellfire
>>24620508Ok, I understand you want to debate, but please answer to the correct reply. You shouting to every message I make with irrelevant comments regarding that post makes following the debate confusing to follow. I did answer with instruction to clarify to your post >>24620501 here >>24620509If you have something to engage with within the context of >>24620506 post then please do. But please try to keep the discussion followable.
>>24620510And what does that have to do what I am claiming? You are angry but something I havent said or claimed.
>>24620473>The whole old testament is fraud.you mean a snake didn't really talk, a woman didn't actually turn into a pillar of salt, and moshie didn't actually part an entire body of water for his yiddles to escape through?nah, you're just a LARPagtheist
>>24620515I don't care about your narrative and head canon. I do care about the bloodlines and Truth. You act like an Esau who gave no shit about his bloodline and heritage and sold it for cheap for a scrap of bread.>Jacob said, “Sell me your birthright now.” Esau said, “I am about to die; of what use is a birthright to me?” Jacob said, “Swear to me now.” So he swore to him and sold his birthright to Jacob. Then Jacob gave Esau bread and lentil stew, and he ate and drank and rose and went his way. Thus Esau despised his birthright.
>>24620473Herbs
>>24620517
>>24620516You want to get specific, yeah? I called you out on the foundation of the word Jews itself.Why do you group all the tribe together in this one specific words?
>>24620519jesus's Y chromosome comes from the fatherand he wasn't a talmudic kabbalist either (books which weren't written until 600 years after Christ)>"Jesus said to them, “Most assuredly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I AM.” Then [the jews] took up stones to [kill] Him [...]"- John 48-49he's not "a jew", he's god
>>24620473None of that matters All that matters is that Jesus died for our sins He resurrected And we will all resurrect after we die
>>24620507The truth was revealed to me, starting from the inside out. It's a spiritual thing. If you aren't baptized and filled with the Holy Spirit, you cannot understand a great deal of the Bible because much of it deals with a certain spiritual condition / experience. It's an esoteric book for the anointed. If we have opposing ideas, you could "win" an argument against me by simply being better at arguing. Lawyers even do that when just telling the truth could be much more compelling simply because they are entrenched in that style. I'm just giving my personal testimony. In a courtroom, the jury must choose who to believe, which requires discernment. If they value justice, they will seek very carefully in order to uncover the truth.
>>24620522That's not what he meant in fact the Jews interpreted what he said the same way that you are. He was not saying that he is God. He was saying that God was before Abraham. And he is one with God so he knows Abraham because of his connection with God. He never once claimed to be God.
>>24620525
>>24620511>>24620512>>24620512You are now spamming incoherent responses, and not engageing in what is been written. For example in OT there are two different passages of the same story, but with huge difference. >Again the anger of the Lord burned against Israel, and he incited David against them, saying, “Go and take a census of Israel and Judah.”>2 Samuel 24>Satan rose up against Israel and incited David to take a census of Israel. 2 So David said to Joab and the commanders of the troops, “Go and count the Israelites from Beersheba to Dan. Then report back to me so that I may know how many there are.”>1 Chronicles 21Yes, in one the entity commanding to count the israelise was god and in the other story is satan. So which one is it? Who is commanding israel? Again in the second book of Moses, God commands the firstborn to be sacrificed to Him. And to make it clear what God means by giving such orders, he instructs to give as is done with the firstborn of cattle, namely by slaughter sacrificing.>29 “Do not hold back offerings from your granaries or your vats.[a] “You must give me the firstborn of your sons. 30 Do the same with your cattle and your sheep. Let them stay with their mothers for seven days, but give them to me on the eighth day. - Exodus 22:29-30However, in the fifth book of Moses, God forbids the murder of children, as if He had never commanded it. This contradiction suggests that these "God" stories are probably not the same series of books or are talking about the same God, but rather that the stories have been combined, and that is why the contradictions of God are so glaring.
>>24620532It's basically like a mirror. Jesus was a perfect reflection of the father but he was not the father. Like if you had a mirror out in the desert and you can see the sun in the mirror. You could ask the mirror if it is as great as the sun and it will say no The sun is far greater. But you can ask the mirror what am I looking at and it would tell you that you are looking at the Sun. The same as when Jesus said those who have seen me have seen the father. He was in perfect alignment perfect reflection of the will of the Father. But he also admitted that the father is greater than him.
>>24620571>how is the trinity one god and not threebecause that's what makes sense when you read the bible. that there is only one god, and that he appears as three persons. here are some examples to help you wrap your head around it.>modalisma computer programmer (the father) makes a game via code (the spirit), and selects an avatar to play as (the son).you can see how he can die, while still being alive.>partialismstarfish and octopuses have neural networks in their limbs, essentially giving them independent brains.you can see how even though it's one organism, the three can hold a conversation with themselves.both modalism and partialism are considered heresies, because they do not fully represent the greatness of god.all analogies break down eventually, as god is like nothing else in creation>"To whom will you liken Me, and make Me equal and compare Me, that we should be alike"- Isaiah 46:5there are writers like Augustine of Hippo and Thomas Aquinas that you can look into the work of, for a non-heretical understanding of the trinity.but the best that i can describe it is something like this:there are things that are essential / the essence of being god- uncreated creator, all powerful, perfect, etc.before anything was created / time even existed, the son and the spirit proceed from the father.even though they are distinct persons, they each fully possess the essence of being god.trinity in the old testament:- https://youtu.be/odNoExd8a5U- https://youtu.be/rp92-3aBL-A- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9CBh8lmgecs
