I wish there was a better lolita snark site/secrets spot than 4chan now that BTB has been gone for three years. I want places to be mean about itas and share secrets without threads constantly falling apart into trans discourse.
>>10947046are crystal cafe and lolcow not any good
Most lolitas aged out of caring about drama/gossip and a lot of the newer generation grew up finding bullying lame and something you just see in older movies and shows because things like abuse and mental health are common knowledge now.
>>10947047both are still full of people screaming about the trans menace lol. just make fun of people for how they can't wear lolita right, not because of whatever gender they think they are
>>10947050just ignore those posts and post more of what you want to see?
>>10947069Hard to ignore when it's the majority of the website in general
>>10947048Honestly this, and it’s a relief. Most drama-posting and shittalking appears to happen in smaller private groups, most Discord servers seem to have some kind of drama channel. 10 years ago it was more normal for women in this community to shitstir into their mid twenties and thirties, but I think more people are ‘touching grass.’I can get into clowning on brands for designs or decisions, and I can get into discussing what I think is ‘ita’, or the types of behavior I find annoying—I can’t even get into name dropping if someone has genuinely scammed or, idk, did something bonkers like steal at a swapmeet or whatever. But I can’t get into targeted public shaming of random people online, which is what secrets usually become. If you have a problem with someone or something, why not just talk about it with your friends in the community, you know?
>>10947275Typo, I meant *I CAN get into name dropping if someone scammed etc
>>10947275I don't know why people think it's strange for women to gossip past 20-30. Older women are the world's biggest gossips and always have been.
>>10947278Additionally, gossip serves an important social function: enforcing social norms. It was decided in the 90s and 00s that gossip is bad. Immediately we have a generation of miserable women whoring themselves on the internet, claiming to be men, and suicide rates have gone up instead of down. Gossip is good, actually.
>>10947279dumb take
>>10947285Sort of accurate.Gossip was a product of a sexist society where women were scrambling to find some sense of autonomy, and power in their lives. For a long time, common women didn't have the same access to education and hobbies outside of ones that lent themselves to homemaking (like sewing and embroidery), and upper class women just having finishing school (learning etiquette and manners and how to be a wife etc) and other socially acceptable interests. Women of all classes basically didn't have anything better to talk about because they didn't get to experience much outside of their sphere of other women. Gossip was naturally the most interesting and universally informed thing out of the limited options, especially when it provided a sense of control and having an effect on lives that they otherwise were powerless about.We're now in an age where women can lead more interesting lives, learn and discuss anything they like, not bound by limited social circles or traditional gender roles. Gossip becomes trivial compared to everything else out there. Sure you could read anonymously about how Shelly's socks she was selling at the swap meet were stinky and stained, or you could watch a true crime documentary. You can talk about whose husband is cheating on whom, or you can play some videogames. You can speculate on some girl's family financial situation, or you can take a class on something handy. The world is your oyster.
>>10947278it's childish
>>10947278I am a hater at heart and I feel very blessed to still have a group of friends from LJ who are with me in this well into our 30s lol
>>10947302The thing is, I can play video games, watch a true crime documentary, take a class on something handy, and also gossip. Gossip is normal. It's just looked down upon because people think primarily women do it and anything women do = bad.
>>10947047crystal cafe is femcel central. Not sure about lolcow.
>>10947362Idk, I don’t enjoy gossip that targets others because I’d rather focus on my own life. Other people being poorly dressed or being awkward online/at events has nothing to do with me. If there’s a scammer or something, that’s different—but at that point, I only care about the action the scammer took, not the details of their personal lives.Boiling down the critique of gossip in this thread to ‘they think gossip bad because they think women bad’ lacks nuance imo.
>>10947366You seem really autistic desu, are you a man? This holier than thou attitude about not caring about others' going-ons comes off as very male
>>10947279It only took 5 posts from >>10947050 for someone to bring up trans people, again>just make fun of people for how they can't wear lolita right, not because of whatever gender they think they are
>>10947370No, I’m just an adult woman in her mid-twenties. I’m not meaning to be holier-than-thou, but it’s curious why my personal opinions on gossip are bothersome enough for you to call me a male? You might want to introspect a little tbqh
>>10947366I think there's a difference between gossip and bullying, and these days a lot of lolitas call the latter the former. Gossip in the sense of discussing scammers, or who has beef with who, or if a convention or brand or "influencer" did something wild, or what trends are and if they suck, that's fun in a tabloid rag kind of way. But these days most people's idea of "gossip" is talking about how fat/ugly/annoying the vendetta target of the month is, transvestigating random women Anyone I Dislike Is A Man style, and infighting about every topic under the sun. There's also "cow" culture where instead of keeping up with news with the community as a whole, you pick one "cow" to fixate on and try to make everything they do into a gossip topic. I've noticed whenever someone brings up a new topic or event that doesn't involve an established "cow", it gets derailed or buried in favor of whatever some "cow" had for lunch. For gossip, anyone should be fair game. If you're limited to a small pool of established people to talk about, it's just targeted harassment. This definition of gossip is very juvenile, Burn Book type nonsense, and I don't think it can be compared to the gossip habits of 20th century adult women.
I can't even go into the ita thread anymore. It's like actively subjecting myself to gore, and it was starting to ruin the fashion for me. Nowadays I try to only look at well-dressed non uggo fatty coord pics and just mute the bads its like why subject myself. Also, giving randos attention for looking bad isn't a solution because none of them take advice.
>>10947390Great points, nonna! I don’t have an issue with fun or informative gossip, but when it slides into bullying, it becomes a problem.I also don’t trust that anyone moderating a gossip platform would fairly enforce the difference. Running a site like that for free (or at all) requires an excess of free time, an excess of online engagement, and an excess of interest in gossip—none of which inspire confidence in fair moderation.Maybe my stance comes off self-righteous, but it’s not about policing behavior. I’ve just seen too many people—both those targeted and those doing the targeting—get stuck in these cycles, and they never seem to come out better for it. Some people have been hyper-reactive ‘lulitas dnt need 2 b luvlies’ types for years and are still right where they were. If these spaces actually made people sharper, happier, or more socially competent, that’d be one thing. But they don’t.
>>10947419AYRT, I completely agree. It's just not realistic to expect a gossip site to stick to the spirit of gossip, particularly in this day and age-- anyone invested enough to keep the website running would probably be insane, and we've already seen countless gossip sites, blogs, etc be shut down due to devolving into targeted harassment and bullying.
>>10947411this, kek. i used to browse the ita thread daily when i was a lonelita, but after participating in irl lolita spaces for a few years now i've completely lost interest. i see enough ita coords at meets and conventions. atp in the western community there's more bad than good anyways. ruminating on bad coords just isn't fun anymore, and it certainly isn't productive in improving my own.
what happned to PULL?
>>10948368This got axed couple years ago as far as I know. Sad, loved lurking there.
>>10947046bump
>>10947047lolcow is hilariously bad, so much so that it is good, it's like witnessing a social experiment, it's like some kind of old 4chan but if they were hyper focused on trolling people, as if they were in a perpetual hunt to find all the chrischans and ruin them, gotta love browsing it without even posting, they're prertty fucked in the head
>>10950478so its like a female kiwifarms
I don't care to moralize about it, some people in this fashion are rude, standoffish, annoying and/or creepy and need to know it. I miss having BTB to yell out YOUR COORDS ARE UGLY AND YOU'RE FUCKING WEIRD and have the person see it. It's a harsh world out there and one gets tired of lying.
>>10950482KF at least asks people to back up their claims with a source, lolcow is literally "trust me please" on every post
>>10947370You think not wanting to stick your nose into other people's bizzy is male behavior? Weirdest genre of misogyny I've seen in a while.
>>10947048 >a lot of the newer generation grew up finding bullying lamelaughing in jirai comm>>10950478>hyper focused on trolling peopledoubt.jpg because cowtipping is prohibited
>>10950478oh was reding with my ass, fair
>>10947362>can play video games, watch a true crime documentary, take a class on something handy, and also gossip.only one of those things could be a good use of free will
>>10950624those are just the examples from the post it was in a reply to, not what I would do myself personally
Snarky
>>10947046The Internet is dying
>>10947356lol
>>10947048>>10947275I would say yes to the fact that the ita shit aged out, most drama circles aged out or went to sites that basically if you get name dropped on; you then have a shield of "evil nazi racist homophobes who harass and kill people". This goes for cosplay and anime cons as well I feel. At the current time shit is almost completely forgotten or kept in such a small gossip circle it's impossible to follow like akin to being discussed on bluesky or something irrelevant. Like this isn't the 2010's where everything festered about as cons roared into the mainstage.>>10950596>doubt.jpg because cowtipping is prohibitedYou KNOW that shit happens, come on anon you're telling me a bunch of at(or near)40 year old women don't have a dozen alts to do stupid shit on? That's a doubt.jpg
>>10947046Me too
>>10947046women under 40 are just way, WAY more woke than they were even 10 years ago, and part of that is deciding that bullying and gossip is bad, and usually if your coords suck and don't improve people will silently ostracize you even if you refuse to take concrit (and also everyone's standards dropped bc everyone realized they don't have to aim for AP/BTSSB level looks, which require you to at least be an in shape 5/10, and let's be real, pre 2010 street snaps are straight up ita compared to modern coords; the only difference is that they were in brand)also there's no real way to avoid vendetta posting, and half the time it degenerates into "eww trannies" and the kind of person who gets into lolita is much more likely than the average woman under 40 to find that distasteful (and is disproportionately queer or genderfucky themselves) which is why cglers don't stick in comms despite the average person here being able to dress better than the average comm member (i would be surprised if there were more than 50 Trump voters in *every* regional comm, combined, in America)
>>10961056Agree with most of this, but don't conflate gender-critical with Trump voters/conservatives. Most gendercrit women are liberals and true radical feminism (the RF in TERF) is descended from Marxism.If the Western comm has let's say 3,000 active members, there are probably dozens of gendercrit liberals and 5 Trump voters.
