When are Peter and MJ going to settle down, get married, and have children? Isn't it a bit tiresome writing the same stories for 60 years? Where is the character development?
Word of advice regarding DC/Marvel comics, you find a run that you really like, and say the story ended there. Then dip in and out on occasion if something is interesting
>>154020980Marvel spent decades trying to get rid of the marriage. They gave up trying to do something smart and just had Peter make a deal with the devil. When Spencer was about to undo OMD, the editors screwed him over and shoved him out the back door. Marvel would sooner sacrifice their firstborn children than let Peter and MJ get married again.
>>154020980>When are Peter and MJ going to settle down, get married, and have children? Like 28 years ago
>>154021018>They gave up trying to do something smart and just had Peter make a deal with the devil.that sounds retarded
>>154021018It’s honestly crazy how essentially a third of Spider-Man’s history is now having his soul and marriage being owned by the devil.
OMD/BND is what made me stop reading comics for good. So good job, Marvel, I guess.
>>154021311Perlmutter was behind it?
>>154021374Nope it's Quesada and Brevoort you nimrod.
>>154020980Never, Peter & MJ are ground zero for the deracination of White culture.
>meanwhile MJ in video games with the recent two games being Cosmic Invasion and Tokon
>>154021018At this point the post OMD status has lasted longer than the marriage. It's time to move on.
What's the point of not letting Peter grow up and have a family when they have Miles to fill in the teen Spider-Man slot?
>>154021979Cosmic Invasion sucked they ruined it with all that 2010's shit.
>>154020980there can't be real character developpment in a medium meant to go on forever
>>154021979not my MJ
>>154022238>It's time to move on.Kind of hard to do that when Marvel doesn't know what to do with MJ. She's too popular to just get rid of.
>>154021979they don't want to actually let them be together but they know it sells.
>>154022324the closest thing to comics would be soap operas and they have people dying, getting married, having kids, etc all the timethe difference of course being that those changes are somewhat spurred by IRL stuff (actors age, get pregnant IRL, leave the show, etc) and so developing existing and new characters is required, whereas comics take the lazy route and don't develop much if at all
Did you know that Spidey and MJ stayed together through the comic strip. They even pulled a Dallas with the OMD stuff.
has peter dated other women since OMD? has mj dated other guys? any other repercussions (like their aborted kid)?
>>154022404>has peter dated other women since OMD?yeah a bunch
>>154020980Stop being stupid anon.
>>154022416All secular jews strive to have a christian funerals for themselves.
>>154022554someone needs to edit that to say Shocker. He was the real tragedy in all of this.
>>154022238Not yet, but it's close.
>>154022325
>>154020980Never because he's going to marry and have children with Michele Gonzales instead :Folded hands emoji:
>>154020980They did, and it didn't work, so Marvel undid it.And Spider-Man has been rebooted so many times that today's Peter Parker is absolutely not the same character from 60 years ago.
The problem with Spider-Man isn't that he's an eternal character, it's that he pretends not to be.
>>154020980STATUS QUO POLICE! YOU'RE UNDER ARREST FOR WANTING TO CHANGE THE STATUS QUO! THE PATTERN MUST REPEAT! THE PATTERN MUST REPEAT!
>>154023087>and it didn't workIt worked for 2 decades in the 616 comics, as well as multiple alternate universe stories.
The reason reason why DC and Marvel have a multiverse is by accident. They have hundreds of writers working for the same company working with the same characters for over 100 years. That's why there are so many characters and so many storylines. They made separate universes so the audiences wouldn't get confused. That way they can reboot the comics as much as they like and have people be able to follow along with the story.
>>154022554Wasn't the guy an asshole who got his reality destroyed because he destroyed the planet?
>>154021028This wasn't main canon, I don't know why some people act like it was
>>154023207>That way they can reboot the comics as much as they like and have people be able to follow along with the story.The constant reboots ironically make DC even more convoluted.
>>154023207This doesn't apply to Marvel
>>154020980Most people simply pretend everything after omd is shitty fanfiction.And since its so ass and no old fans want anything to do with it nor or they bringing in new fans...welllIts basucally screaming into a void now.
>>154023272That's because they never commit to the reboot and always make it just a continuation of canon but some cosmic shenanigans reset everything except for some things.
>>154020980Who cares? Peter got flanderized to death into a manchild and MJ is now a superhero.They are not the characters your love.
>>154021979>>154021028I noticed that they don't include Mayday in any of the games tho, like they include spider-gwen or even silk but not spider-girl. It's honestly weird cause they already went over all the popular ones but they choose to include even some weirder shit rather mayday
>>154024340I played Marvel Avengers Alliance before it got delisted. That turn based game featured Mayday Parker. You can look up its fan restoration project called Marvel Avengers Alliance Redux if you want to play the game now.
If you want Spider-Man to end, just stop reading Spider-Man comics.
>>154022238Most have. Are you not aware of how shit Spider-Man and comics in general sale?
>>154024729I still haven't seen the proof of Conway prostesting Maria Castle's revival when he was alive.
>>154024729who are those fans he's talking about? Brevoort? Honestly I can't take this text seriously cause Conway spoke the opposite too
>>154020980Only when the editorial will be purged and replaced with people who care.
>>154024729I like Conway... but he's dead wrong. The defining attribute of Peter Parker was that he aged and status quo DID change. Superman, Batman, Captain Marvel, The Shadow, etc. were perpetually the same age since the 1930's by the time Peter Parker showed up. Ditko and Lee deliberately showed the passage of time with their hero. Parker graduated High School in issue #28 for fucks sake! That was published in 1965! That means, at minimum, he was 18 before the vast majority of comic readers today were born. Time moves slower in Marvel, and Peter dropped out of college at least once but he graduated in issue #185 (1978), so again fans saw Parker age and grow as a character. While disco was still rocking the charts Marvel gave us 22 year old Peter. This is not a character defined as a teenager. He hasn't been a teenager since the early 1970's. FUN FACT: Gerry Conway took over writing duties for Amazing Spider-Man in 1972 and Mr Conway's age at the time... 19.Gerry authored Parker's transition from teenager to young man at precisely the same time that Gerry was aging from teenager to young man. Then he has the audacity to condemn later writers for doing the same thing? Worse, he betrays his own contributions to the title by classifying Peter as a perpetual teenager.This is the crux of the issue. It's not what's organic for the character. It's not what the fans want. It's petulant man-children creatives demanding Spider-Man be only what they say. Quesada was going through a bitter divorce, so Peter had to lose his marriage too. Peter was change until the fanboys became authors and suddenly Peter was only the character thise writers discovered when they were 15 and just starting to read comics.
>>154025558I suspect he just got bribed and said that shit so Marvel could get him to say it but he just needed money. I dunno.
>>154023192They were fighting or separated or removed of the main title for at least one third of those two decades.The marriage may have been popular with some part of the public but it was never popular between writers and editors.
>>154025934It worked just fine, all the fighting and struggle, was good drama. The problem remains the writers and editorial who were unable to accept the marriage and that MJ was the one who married him. Some of the worst decisions and story lines were born out of attempts at getting rid of the marriage.
>>154025934this is a terrible take
>>154024876Conway disowned the Punisher when he became a Chud hero.>>154024915Just look at Conway's own Spectacular run that happened after Peter got married. He avoided writing Peter's married life as much as possible, Michelinie handled all that.>>154025558>The defining attribute of Peter Parker was that he aged and status quo DID change. This ignores the long periods of time when he didn't change. Everyone in the Marvel Universe aged in real time until 1968 when Stan Lee slammed the breaks on it after realizing superheroes likely weren't going to be some decade-long passing fad. Then he was a college student for 13 years. And Wolfman had him graduate, not to age him, but to keep him permanently locked in as a graduate student. "Permanent 22 year old" was going to be his status quo, but it just one out of a thousand more cuts that kept pushing his age up. From 78 to 87 there was no real "progression," just the usual Spider-Man stories with Stan Lee's patented "illusion of change." And after 1987 up through 2007, once again, no progression. That's 20 years. They gave MJ a baby in the mid-90s when they were flirting with the idea of permanently benching Peter to replace him with Ben, came to their senses, gave her a miscarriage. MJ "died," came back, separated, got back together with him. All that was ultimately a return to a status quo.>Gerry authored Parker's transition from teenager to young man at precisely the same time that Gerry was aging from teenager to young man.Conway saw Peter as an eternal 19 year old when he wrote his original run. He and MJ grew a bit, but not too much.>Quesada was going through a bitter divorce, so Peter had to lose his marriage too.Never happened, this is a hallucination.
>>154026350A story like the clone saga wouldn't have happened if people were excited about the Spider-Man books coming out month to month. And when it ended, the line relaunch wouldn't have happened if people once again didn't immediately get bored with the incredibly dull stories they were producing. They wrote themselves into a corner.
>>154026366>Conway disowned the Punisher when he became a Chud heroIn other words, a rule for thee and not for me.
>>154020980Anon these comics have been running for a long time and if you try to think of everything that has happened as canon, you are going to have some issues. For that reason you just read the ones you think are interesting and create your own canon in your head.
>>154026448Do you have numbers proving people were bored? If they wrote themselves into a corner its not becuase of the Marriage. They could have told stories about Peter in his teen years they could have just made another line and done that. oh wait they did and it fucked up the mythology and gave us miles. they could have told stories about mayday but instead we get Spider Gwen (Which is wierd).Spider-Man doesnt "stand for teen boys". He is about respomsibility.
>>154024729Marvel characters always grew and changed though. Reed Richards gets a kid, Nick Fury became head of S.H.I.E.L.D. and so on. Having an elaborate intersecting continuity where characters could grow was a selling point. It was never purely status quo. >The married Peter Parker is a much less interesting character than the teenaged Peter ParkerSkill issue. He's a different character, but there's no reason he can't be interesting.
>>154026670There is so much continuity there is no continuity and everything that happened after OMD is Apocrypha.
>>154021979She was very prominent in Marvel Invasion
>>154026844Yeah they totally boned continuity. You'd think an entire marvel event could have happened out of it.
>>154026930I dont get it? Did a marvel event happen to fix the continuity.
>>154026798Yeah, check comichron Amazing sales of January in each year1997 81,0271998 68,1751999 after the reboot 83,8912000 56,4132001 49,1902002 after JMS reinvigorated the title 97,4492003 97,0332004 87,3662005 79,6822006 during The Other 95,3832007 with Civil War in full swing 114,7962008 start of a Brand New Day 127,856 101,132 97,8812009 with one issue propped up by Obama 352,847 63,735 59,9142010 76,730 61,969 56,8372011 the beginning of Slott 56,749 52,050I'll just skip to the Spencer years2018 66,396 91,697 - must have been some weird promotion here with that second issue, the numbers went back to normal in the following month2019 57,520 57,726 Oh would you look at that, the "Peter and Mary Jane are back together" hype fizzled out after a short period of time. People got bored again. In the historical records, in the 80s, pre-marriage Amazing Spider-Man was selling around 280,000 copies a month, though those numbers were propped up heavily by newsstand sales. Ultimate Spider-Man made Spider-Man comics popular with a new generation of teens again, that's a fact. It didn't last, they botched it and there's a number of reasons for how and why that happened, how it goes.>>154026843By always you mean "from 1962 to 1968" when Stan Lee decided they needed to stop aging.>Lee had conveyed to his writers that Marvel's stories should have only 'the illusion of change,' that the characters should never evolve too much, lest their portrayals conflict with what licensees had planned for other media
>>154026798>>154026843Spider-Man is entirely defined by being one of, if not THE first teenage heroes. Before him, kids and teens almost never got to be heroes, they were relegated to being sidekicks to adult heroes.
>>154026448The marriage isn't what made the book boring. It's just a scapegoat to avoid blaming the writers and editors. We haven't had a marriage for nearly 20 years and this shit has stunk basically the whole time.
>>154027813The main problem with Spencer's run is they kept dragging the Kindred mystery to the point that everyone hated it. It wasn't nearly engaging enough for how much they tried to milk it.
>>154020980Character development would be IF they managed to settle down
>>154027888No one under the age of 50 has ever read a comic where spiderman was under the age of 25.Every fucking popular spiderman work has him as a young adult/25ish year old.Whats your favorite mainline teenage spiderman story? Every single one. The problem us that they want to sell him as a teen but they cant. Xmen has no teens and it sells like dildos at a dyke colony.
>>154022554Norman looks like he doesn't want to be there.
>>154028010hes more like 30 since he graduated university after years of dicking about and became a professor at one point. thats mid 20s and its long past that.
>>154027397No they just slipped it all in there and we just took it. No real explanation of how things.If he missed the wedding how were they still together? How does that effect Venom's origin?
>>154028046Late 20s early thirties. Look huge chunks of spidermans popular mythos doesnt work if he's a teenager.It just diesnt. Most of his stories work if hes a perietual teenager.Even spectacular spiderman cartoon was just college spiderman in everything but name. The marvel people complaining are peoole who never wrote a good spiderman comic in their lives.
>>154020980MaryWhoreSisters are delusional
>>154026366>married lifeYeah forget all those pages he has of MJ and Peter embracing in his Web of run.>when he wrote his original runWhoa guys, we got a mind reader over here. Faggot.>Quesada divorceIt is parroted by anons, I will give you that. But the faggot reeks of a divorcee. Anyway, smells like Brevoort or Slott in here. What a stench. Ugh. >>154027813>fizzledYeah it did renew interest but stories take time to build and speculators exist no matter if a character returns or dies. MJ by itself won't rocket the book every week but it actually does show that editorial isn't up their own ass. >1962 to 1968Yeah remember when Matt never changed from being a lawyer or never met Electra? Yep. Nobody changed.
>>154028010Mostly true for 616, but Ultimate Spider-Man, the Mary Jane series, Marvel Adventures, and Spidey all had him as high schooler.
>>154023214that planet's real name? Isnotrael.
>>154028517>Yeah remember when Matt never changed from being a lawyer or never met Electra? Yep. Nobody changed.That's illusion of change. Matt will occasionally have periods of not being a lawyer, but he'll always go back to that occupation. Having a college love interest turned assassin in his life doesn't change him all that much either.
>>154028819Ok let me put it in these terms. Who wants to read illusion of change when Spider-Man is a special case where every facet of design, plot, characterization, and themes all point towards actual tangible change being the moments that are most critically lauded by fans and are the most unique things about Spider-Man in comparison to Matt? Also how come Karen Page is still dead since Guardian Devil? Why is it that change has stuck while Karen in Born Again is a major ending point that drives the message home for that story while Guardian Devil her death sticks when it probably shouldn't have with a story that sucks? You'll say nobody cared about her and that the effects of that story and Born Again are only an illusion of change. But why is it that Born Again and KLH are still brought up today? Because they contain arcs that change the character by the end. And a writer who ignores all that is doing a disservice to the character and to the audience if they maintain that illusion by breaking the more important one that these stories have stakes. How do you maintain stakes if Peter is arbitrary and the plots are arbitrary? It's an exercise in futility just as your struggles to appear competent, faggot.
>>154028951>Who wants to read illusion of change when Spider-Man is a special case where every facet of design, plot, characterization, and themes all point towards actual tangible change being the moments that are most critically lauded by fans and are the most unique things about Spider-Man in comparison to Matt?See >>154026366 againThere are long periods of time where nothing changed and none of the changes were part of an intentional plan to have Peter age and progress. There's no single writer or editor who's ever said "Yes, it was my intent to have Peter grow up" except that blowhard JMS and his own editors, Alonso and Quesada, did not share his preference.>Also how come Karen Page is still dead since Guardian Devil?A lot of people disliked crybaby Karen Page. Frank Miller bringing her back as a drug addicted porn star was a fuck you to the whole era of "Karen cries about wanting to be with Matt while Matt laments over not being able to be with Karen because he's blind/unwilling to give up being Daredevil.">But why is it that Born Again and KLH are still brought up today? Because they contain arcs that change the character by the end. They're brought up because they're artistically well-done stories. "Something happened" does not make for a good story in and of itself.
>154022416
>>154029083>none of the changes were part of an intentional plan to have Peter age and progressYeah so? I don't care about what the writers or editors say. You're retarded if you think that's what I mean. I know all the stories you faggot. I know all the behind the scenes stories and sentiments as well. But if you read the fucking text (the books themselves) that's all there. What else is it about? What is it fucking about if not responsibility and growing more adept at handling differing ones, more responsibility, etc.? I don't need an intentional plan. A lot of Marvel is kino by happenstance and a lot of good writing is like that. >something happenedYes but you cannot remove it without the stakes plummetting and the weight of the story evaporating. Why do I care for Peter if he isn't trying to get back and save his wife? These stories do not exist in a vacuum. Retard.>fuck you to whole era with Karen Headcanon.
>>154029298>So, at a certain point, Stan called up Marvel and let the folks there know that he was planning to marry Peter and Mary Jane in the newspaper strip at such-and-such a point. At the time, Mary Jane wasn't even dating Peter in the series, but [then EIC] Jim Shooter, not wanting the comics to get scooped by the newspaper strip or whatever, decided that the publicity surrounding the marriage (there was talk of a faux wedding ceremony taking place at Shea Stadium to commemorate the event) and the fact that this was Stan made it worth doing in the books as well.>The lead-up to the marriage is ridiculously rushed, as the creative team needed to move Peter and MJ from not dating to getting married in something like three months. So one issue opens up with Pete on top of a building musing about his life and what's wrong with it, and suddenly clicking on the notion that he should marry Mary Jane. He ends up proposing, following her back to Pittsburgh and learning about her upbringing in three issues. And then the wedding takes place. While the creators all did the best they could with the schedule, it was about as unconvincing a block of storytelling as was possible, especially given the pains that the Spidey creative teams had taken over the previous two years or so to indicate that Pete and MJ were no more than friends.>And at the time, most of the reactions in comic book stores was very much like what we're seeing now: This is fake, this is artificial, it's just a blatant media grab, they've ruined Spider-Man for all time, etc. That's not good writing. You only accept it because that's how it already was when you got into it.>Yes but you cannot remove it without the stakes plummetting and the weight of the story evaporating.The Kid Who Collected Spider-Man is a classic and progresses nothing. The Final Chapter is an earlier example. He lifts a big pile of heavy machinery, that's the story.>Headcanon.Check the letter pages, a lot of people hated Karen.
They should pair Peter up with April O’Neil
>>154028691Ultimate sold because 616 was a clusterfuck of unreadable garbage at the timeAnd the rest are typical nit really popular alt universe stuff.
>>154027813The marriage wasnt the issue, everything surrounding it was. the numbers you post are all over the place and not accurate. And yes they botched Ultimate and fucked up the Mythos, despite its success it should have never happened. There is now more than one origin story and more than one two many spider people. There are clearly several different epochs depicting the character growth of spider-man: High School, College, Post-Gwen death, the period following the first proposal all the way to the Symbiote, then you have Marriage years before the clone saga and then the marriage years after the clone saga and Mays "Death". Everything grinds to a halt after OMD and becomes a mush of events.you could have just made a new line, telling stories from a particular period. like during the ditko years or the 200s of asm. you didnt need to get rid of the marriage.
>>154029636The idea of just having runs focused on particular parts of Peters life or just alternative universes where he could end up in wildly different places or with different relationships is far too sensible, far better to sell his marriage and love to a Demon and completely muddle-fuck with magic twenty years of comics you now have to try square to make sense because BND writers can't write a stable relationship.
>>154029461Yeah ok just post an article framing it in the terms you want which is probably written by Brevoort or one his sycophants as the marriage issue itself and the marriage when it happened in general is known by people to be rushed yet the marriage in general as a status quo is beloved and the stories that came after. That's not what we're arguing faggot.Ok so you brought up other stories that are not moving the plot forward. But those are pieces of the story of Spider-Man and some stories choose different decisions and some see them as great as well. I don't care that those stories did it without progressing. Look at how many shit stories these hacks have created and they haven't progressed the story. This proves nothing except that the book had more variety and creativity back then. Now it doesn't. I don't care about the letters pages I used that as a point to show that Miller managed to make her important to her story just like how Conway used Gwen who sucked massively to tell a good story and progress both their characters. Holy fuck you're dense. Also you framed it like Miller thought that way when you don't know for certain and that isn't the main point. I'm not looking for Karen to get married to him, I'm looking for her to become an interesting character and Born Again helped in that regard while Guardian Devil wasted it.
>>154029724Your average reader doesn't see "runs" or "universes", they just see Spider-Man
>>154023249>This wasn't main canon, I don't know why some people act like it wasBecause it's better. It's better than the main canon. It was built of things that happened in main canon and took them into directions that weren't shit. Nobody is going DRRR MC2 is part of 616. But it's better. >>154024340She was in a few of the older games like Marvel Heroes online and that Spider-man runner thing. Spider-gwen and the other satellite spiders will continue to suck and get relaunched but we will always know who actually carried a book.
>>154030376But that's the thing, you can have all this and it's still Spider-Man. It's OMD that's so fucking out of whack and casting such a long cancerous shadow, it was the Lucy pulls the football for good moment for the franchise.
>>154030376The average reader sees this as a dying industry, the modern editorial as faggots, and old comics as kino.
>>154030509Based and true.
>>154020980Hopefully never Also I love MJ as venom. She's the best venom and I wanna f her so bad. Who cares about relationship BS in comics what are you a woman? LMAO sissy
>>154030621Jack off before posting, Pablo
>>154020980never? this is capeshit, what do you expect? it's been the same stories for a hundred year at this point
>>154030885Why do people who have never so much as touched a comic so confidently spout their incorrect opinions? Would you do this about a movie you’ve never seen? A TV show you’ve never watched?
>>154030392>Because it's better.Many things are better than main canon, but when people complain about Peter and MJ not settling down, they're specifically talking about the 616 versions.As good as MC2 was, it was just another alternate future, not the main canon that Marvel actually focuses on, so while they let some alternate Peters and MJs actually have families, the main ones have only regressed as time has gone on.
At this point even fucking characters like Finn the Human and Steven Universe are going to get families and children before Peter canonicallyWhat the fuck went so wrong?
>>154031024A self-selecting cabal of like-minded creatives at Spider-Office took root and have refused to read the room for almost two solid decades. Arguably longer, as the Clone Saga is a direct result of these fucking idiots being unable to use a stable marriage as an asset to heighten, stabilize or contrast drama and not a obstacle to divorced man energy or I want to fuck everyone through my childhood self-insert.
Is his superpower getting cucked?
The long national nightmare is over(Should've been Carol)
>>154031268this stupid event is going to make Cates’ drug-fueled abortions look like the pinnacle of the genre
>>154030318>I'm looking for her to become an interesting character and Born Again helped in that regard while Guardian Devil wasted it.There was a 14 year gap between Karen's last appearance in Daredevil and Born Again. And there weren't any particularly memorable stories featuring her in the 14 years between Born Again and Guardian Devil. She wasn't wasted, she was useless.
>>154030991Why is it so important to you that the "main" Spider-Man grow old when you can just read your alt future endings and leave it at that?
>>154031867Ok? What I am trying to say here is that Marvel didn't come up with anything new and didn't develop any long-term shit with her. Perhaps she is one that doesn't have enough initially. But a writer could come up with brand new stuff. But nah, nothing happened like you said after that.Can't do much now except say that if someone has ideas they have to replace the substantive appeal of that character to make up for them being taken off the board. BND and the stagnation of the status quo has done nothing but create slop.
As far as im concerned the BND era ended with DR Strange calling MJ and Peter unbreakable. This new era of paul was an altered time line manipulated by mephisto, and Venom 258 was a false ending.
>>154031932Because MAIN continuity brings legitimacy and because it was already happening in 616. Why this degenerate cuck spider man be relegated to alt universes?
>>154032530Venom 258 was such a lazy, craven sweep under the carpet. No actual addressing anything directly said or done, only alluded to and characters falling over themselves to forgive each-other (and thus the creatives) how big a mess they made, rather than have the characters act like the relatable Human beings they used to be great at along with the super action. That was what made Spider-Man compelling.Remember when Peter had a temper? A backbone? Knew when to walk the fuck away from people who were hurting him? Maybe he actually wants to be the one who puts space and boundaries to a woman who treated him appallingly (ha) and MJ has to be the one chasing him for a change?Actual drama, born of actual characters. Not telenovela secret relatives we've already had because we have hack writers doing hack writer things.
>>154021006fpbp
>>154032641They either lack talent or actually hate the audience and are having a laugh at the still reading readers expense.OMD has ruined any potential of Spiderman as a serious book forever. It's fucking over. The only way to fix it is a total universal reset at this point.
>>154032753Mephisto could be outright killed instead. The Faustian aspect of Johnny Blaze is basically generic now because of Mephistowank like OMD and MCU Ironheart's pact so there is not much of a point in this concept anymore.
>>154020980I don't even like Mary Jane anymore. I just wish Spider-Office would finally just shit or get off the pot. They don't want Peter with Mary Jane? Fine. Write her out of the comic instead of this 19 years straight of edging and blueballing.Marvel got what they wanted. I don't want them together anymore nor do even want to see her in Spidey's orbit anymore.She's too toxic for Peter now and he deserves better than a 304 who will easily give up on him on jump the bones of a twat-knot wearing vegan faggot who assisted his father in summoning an ancient Mayan god to wipe out all life in their reality.Peter has also confirmed twice over now that MJ is more like a sister to him, anyway under Kelly's pen.I hope they either kill her off of permanently exile her to space as the Queen in Black or whatever the fuck because her shitting on him and his "Oh no, you're totally heckin' valid and NEVER need to apologizee to ME" response was unbearably pathetic and cucked. God, no wonder she doesn't respect him. And we're supposed to give a shit about her 60th Anniversary one-shot where a variant has her cucking Spidey with Wolverine in a full liplock...
>>154036453Hello Cb! Good to see you again!
Mark my words, they're gonna have Miles Morales shag Peter's MJ at some point
>>154036682Have fun getting compared to Paul Rabin who was also a multiverse refugee I guess.
>>154036453>RedditspacingDo we have a new reddit refugee
>>154022404Peter >Carlie Cooper (Literally named after Joe Quesada's daughter and first GF post-OMD)>Anna Maria Marconi (Technically Otto's GF since this was during that stupid Superior Spider-Man storyline where Emma Frost OoC respected consent and didn't read his mind because Wolverine was against so the hackneyed plot wouldn't end too early)>Silk (Bitten by the same spider so they had mutual rape pheromones to fulfill Dan Slott's Korean woman lusting over white boy dick fetish)>Lian Tang (Betrayed him to the Zodiac and lead to the destruction of Parker Industries)>Mockingbird (Because Slott is a hack and they are superheroes who wear masks working the same security detail so he considered that 'chemistry')>Michelle Gonzalez (A lawyer or some shit)>Norah Winters (Had a brief, flirtatious "will-they-won't-they" dynamic with Peter early in the Brand New Day era, though it was less of a traditional committed romance)>Captain Marvel briefly dated him but found him annoying.>Shay Marken (Ravencroft shrink who was his rebound from MJ cheating on him with Paul Rabin)>Black Cat (Another MJ rebound he slept with while dating Shay due to them practicing "ethical non-monogamy" before she broke up with him because they were "too healthy" together)>Raelith the Wretched (Yellow-skinned alien babe that Peter was FWBs-ish with when he went to space as a "Not" GotG in Joe Kelly's run pre-Death Spiral nothingburger event)MJ>Pedro (Firefighter)>Bobby Carr (Scummy actor who told her she was a stupid bitch and a shitty actress to her face saying that execs spared her feelings because she's hot, pretty much, before they broke up)>Ollie (A brief boyfriend from her nightclub ownership days, mentioned in the Superior Spider-Man era when she finally decided to attempt building her own life)>Paul Rabin (While trapped in an alternate dimension, Mary Jane and Paul spent roughly four years together. During this time, they found and adopted two children)
>>154023207Except they have primary canon unverses.DC used to be Earth-Two until the first Crisis made it Earth One and/or Earth Prime. Marvel's main universe has always been Earth-616 in the comics and Earth-199999 in the MCU but that retarded hairless faggot Feige is trying to force 616 on the MCU lately.
>>154023249Because it's better than whatever the fuck the past ~`20~~ hell--I'll be generous and say the past 4 years have been.>WHAT DID PETER DO!? (Fucking nothing bad as it turned out)>"NO, PLEASE LONNIE! I'VE LEARNED MY LESSON!" (Tombstone)>"NORMAN PLEASE SAVE ME! I'M GONNA DIE!" (To the fucking VULTURE of all people)>"Yeah, Paul cucked me with my girlfriend right when we were about to get engaged but I'd never miss his chicken korma!">"MJ is like a sister to me!"
>>154023382That's because The New 52 fucked things for Superman HARD after the "Truth" arc and sales tanked.Nu 52 Wonder Woman as bad as it was actually would have been WORSE if Azarrello didn't act as a buffer for Didio's even more retarded grimderp plans for Diana and the Amazons were.
>>154029083"Nothing should ever happen in stories" is a take. A retarded one that is fundamentally anti-story, but a take nonetheless so I give you credit, anon.
>>154030621I hope Knull rapes and kills her so we can all finally move on at the end of QiB. It's not like she's salvageable as a character post-Wells run, anyway.
>>154031024Gen-Xers and bitter divorcees realized their own mortality and began to live vicariously through Marvel characters--Morrison used it to permanently deconstruct and break down Cyclops and Jean's marriage (it has never recovered), Quesada got divorce raped and took it out on Spider-Man because he saw Mary Jane Parker as his bitch wife and wanted Spidey to fuck his daughter, Carlie ~~Quesada~~ Cooper, Zeb Wells got divorce raped and took it out on Peter and MJ's relationship when Lowe brought him in to do specifically that to retaliate against Nick Spencer and fans for trying to undo OMD and being excited for it, respectively.
>>154031229Post-OMD?Unironically, yes.
>>154031932Why is it so important to you that that "main" Spider-Man remains a whiny manchild into eternity?
>>154020980How can they fix MJ's image overall? Paul has ruined the public's opinion on MJ and the Raimi movies didn't help. People just see her as a cheater and disloyal because they decided to subvert her character so much.
>>154037092> Stop drawing her with sour puss face and writing cuntish snippy dialoge> She needs to have big gobbling making out senssions with Peter telling him how awesome he is and how lucky she is to be with him> Tickle fights> She needs to save him and be his champion.> She hurt peter real bad, venom 258 wasnt enough. In death Paul can still have a heel turn, and become a villian she can do nothing about. > Dylan uncovers Pauls journal where he admits to manipulating MJ for x reasons (he knew about the time dilation and lied to her and how gullible she was, thinking he was trying to make amens, when he was really giving his money to gay Prostitutes. Mocking her for think he would be another Peter and what a coward she was for not returning to him). >this reframes how dylan sees him after death as well.
>>154036785>Yellow-skinned alien babe that Peter was FWBs-ish with when he went to spaceyou forgot the blue inhuman alien chick Els Udonta.
>>154036453>I don't even like Mary Jane anymoreI noticed that's how black cat fans shit on mj these days. Pretend that they liked her before and totally hate editorial just like you, but actually like what they do
>>154022325you realize marvel hates peter/mj so much they won't even call this bitch mary jane watson right?
>>154037092The Raimi movies solidified her as the true canon LI. Pairing Peter with anyone else at this point is just fanfiction. Just like Superman and Lois Lane being together.
>>154026448People liked the Clone Saga at the start though. It's the best the book ever sold
>>154030621But Prime is a confirm marriage chad
>>154036785There was also Sara or whatever her name was from that Spider-Man/Wolverine storyline
>>154036785Wow, all of those people sucks (except Black Cat and Norah)
>>154036785Michelle and Norah are the only good ones teebh
I honestly think they broke Peter, along with most of his cast.What he really needs is not a GF nor marriage, but some time alone where his temper and backbone can be re-established. Also, have him work with JJJ and Norah Winter + new characters and bring back the ""office humor"".
>>154039147>Norah Winteryeah more BND shit is the last thing we need right now
>>154022325Shut the fuck up Tom, your marriage to Zendayape is just PR
>>154022325>MCU MJ: brown, ugly but loyal>Comics MJ: Smoking hot redhead but a whore
>>154039147Peter Pan alternates between Wells sadboi SAVE ME NORMAN and Kelly dumb-ass clueless harem sainted Peter. I just miss Peter.
>>154040287Man, Spencer was really the last time it was decent. And I say decent, I still hate the Sin Eater stuff.
>>154020980I don't know why they broke them up without aging down Peter if they want a younger feeling Spider-man. Dude is in his mid-30s at this point and still being treated like a college kid.
>>154040568all around disgusting and made even worse considering Peter became a hero earlier than iron man
>>154040568He's back to 25 again
>>154043010He's been a hero longer than everyone but the FF, ww2 era heroes like Cap and I guess the Hulk but I wouldn't call early Hulk a superhero. The fact that Spider-man gets treated was "the kid" by anyone outside Cap and Wolverine is retarded. If he's 25 then the x-men/avengers have only existed for 10 year and Norman Osborn Jr. and Dylan Brock are 5 years old.
>>154037092you can't , she's an irredeemable piece of shitwithin 3 years she'll be dating Mac.
>>154043634Silence Gwenschizo
>>154020980>Have MJ and Dylan discover that Wells' shitty OC lied to them about everything, used child entrapment, tried to kill MJ with the stupid wrist gimmick to steal her money, and wasted his money on crypto scams and useless erection pills>Have Peter grow a spine and call everyone out over the shitshow of the past years>Discover that the MJ of the past years is a clone because the real one wouldn't give up on Peter, she is kept in stasis and imprisoned somewhere>Peter travels to other universe/hell/New Jersey to find MJ>Have clone MJ tag along because she actually feels guilty for what she did>Insert some proper drama bc why not>Peter finds and frees MJ, they find and save baby Mayday too>Face off against a pawn of Mephisto in the form of Paul, Peter easily beats him since Spider-Man isn't a cuck like Zeb Wells>Mephisto possesses the child rapists corpse in an attempt to stop Peter and both MJs from leaving>Clone MJ acknowledges that she did Peter wrong and cannot replace the real MJ, sacrifices herself to save Peter and kill the shitty OC for good>Peter saves the real Mary-Jane and the baby, escape back home together >Reality and their memories get a soft reset, undoing all OMD related nonsense>The marriage is restored, now with Mayday included>Mephisto (and editorial by proxy) seethe for all eternity
>>154043870It's better to just let the fans forget a bad story happened than to draw more attention to it by trying to fix it.
>>154028767>that planet's real name? Isnotrael.What?
They are still threatening to put her with Flash.
>>154043870kino>>154044667trying to write around past bullshit is half the fun in capeshit
>>154044904https://aiptcomics.com/2026/06/04/venom-unleashed-22-knull-carnage/>JW: Definitely not our intention to make it seem like Paul was hiding something from her. I think Al (and I) just didn’t remember that Paul apparently knew this fact. In addition, we’ve seen in comics before that these time differences are not always stable. Sometimes a place whose time moves faster than ours suddenly is moving slower. The whole thing is that their time and ours are not fixed together, so anything is possible.These people were wrting Paul without knowing what happened in the wells run. How do you write this conversation and Forget or not examine what happened previously. How the fuck do people take comics seriously when the writers dont?
>>154044911Maybe it's a fun exercise for the writer, but is it worth publishing? Not always.
>>154032593What legitimacy? More people have watched Spider-Man movies and cartoons than keep up with the comics.>>154037048It's not important to me, but it is important for Marvel to have the first incarnation preserved as a forever character. They know what happens when superheroes grow old, people lose interest in them. It happened to DC.
>>154040568>>154043010Peter has been eternally 28 since 2014 if not earlier. He has never been in his 30s. JMS probably had some idea in his head that he was in his 30s when he wrote him, but that never made it into the books. Back during the clone saga, they kept emphasizing that the original clash with the Jackal happened "five years ago" which would have put him around 24 or so given Conway's own thoughts about his age when he wrote him.I think it's ironic and self-defeating that the people who want Peter Parker to be eternally young have turned him into a late-20s loser, but they're just not very good at their jobs.
>>154045124Oh salty hell, they should have just never printed a letter or addressed that.So, we have confirming Ewing didn't really read or pay attention to WHY people were so appalled by Paul. Likely reading the editors notes and skimming the issue at best.We also have no in-universe reason why Paul didn't tell her. Which means blatant rape by deception. Fucking hell. Bravo Lowe, we have Avengers #200 again, we really did it.
>>154045979>rape by deception.Oh My favourite.
>>154045979I don't remember where it was said that Paul knew about the difference in time. It was his world. He had never been elsewhere. How would he even know?
>>154047545
>>154047835That was a lie. He wasn't sent there. He was a native.
>>154020980>When are Peter and MJ going to settle down, get married, and have children?>Isn't it a bit tiresome writing the same stories for 60 years? Where is the character development?OMD will never be undone anom and I do mean NEVER.
>>154048470Never under this editorial at least, the people who actually unironically thought #1000 would be it... fucking why? The same hacks who did it are the same hacks still there, they have gatekept their petty fiefdom as the rest of the franchise makes them more and more the bizarre outlier.That said forever is a long time anon.I predict next generation of writers/editors without the sunk cost fallacy and bizarre hang-ups will come in and finally sweep this decrepit era and its constant secret relatives plots to history.Or failing that, character just going public domain and it won't even matter anymore, if IP rights is what dictates what's 'canon' in the public consciousness. Death of the Author being what it is.
>>154021018at this point it would make sense to do OMD 2 only this time a full reboot happens spider-man timeline gets rewritten Gwen turns out to alive and is still peter's GF harry also turns out to be alive and etc...it's the only way to save spider-man really.
>>154048394Paul lies about a lot of things.Like, half his dialogue. It's more because Wells was actively making shit up and changing things as he went along, but because he couldn't find a backstory/chickened out of just making the kids his biological children with MJ they gave him a schizo's recollection of his past.
>>154048571by the time ther next generation of writers/editors arrive it will be too late . I honestly doubt marvel will still exist then they are going to get sold off for sure.
>>154048620Just reset Peter to the JMS era, we don't need a full reboot. I wouldn't mind Harry being back, but Gwen is better dead.
>>154048697There was a lot of backpedaling yes, but it's pretty funny to think you've pulled a "gotcha" on another writer based on your own faulty memory of how the story went.
>>154048843It's not a gotcha, Paul did know about the time dilation. He's fucking studied in Mayan Magic for the ultimate excuse for don't need to explain shit for the writers to use.He just lied about his relationship to Rabin for Wells more DRAMATIC reveal.
>>154048765I disagree at this point Gwen makes a better character then MJ at least she doesn't have blood on her hands unlike MJ.
>>154020980>When are fictional people who live mundane lives but in a comic book universe filled with death, corruption, civil wars, and rampant villainy gonna settle downI reckon when the need for Superheroes and Superhero adventures and battles against tyrants, monsters and criminals is over and theres finally world peace. Which will be never.
>>154048935>Paul did know about the time dilation.You've proven no such thing.
>>154049014It's literally highlighted.>>154047835
>Jordan White answers fan questions on Carnage’s future, Mary Jane and Flash Thompson’s romance, Eddie Brock’s mental state, Knull’s cosmic connections, and more as ‘Queen in Black’ draws near.>Venom and symbiote fans, AIPT has a special treat for you this week with an early edition of Venom Unleashed! That’s because there were so many great fan questions submitted that we had to get half of them out early. That’s not all, we’ve got exclusive art at the bottom of this article to get you hype and teased up for what has to be the biggest symbiote event in years: Queen in Black.>This week’s column digs into some fascinating corners of symbiote lore. Jordan D. White weighs in on how the Venom symbiote has grown larger and more powerful over the years, whether Cletus Kasady could ever return to the role of Carnage, and the surprising dinosaur connections hidden throughout Marvel’s symbiote mythology. We also get updates on Mary Jane and Flash Thompson’s relationship, clarification on a lingering Paul and MJ question from Amazing Spider-Man, and even a response from Al Ewing regarding a potential connection between Knull and one of Marvel’s oldest cosmic entities.>That’s not all. White also discusses Eddie Brock’s mental health. Stay tuned for more questions and answers in just three weeks!
>>154049042>John asks, “How does the symbiote gain so much mass?” Originally, it was a lightweight, thin being that could pass for clothing, but now it can magically turn into something more than twice the host’s mass and still have enough left over to leave gunk everywhere.>Jordan D. White: Obviously, it cannot just generate mass, so when it’s condensed into less space, it’s just much denser. We’ve seen that when it uses too much of its substance on webs, it leaves its host partially exposed, so I imagine the Venom symbiote, wanting to be a good symbiote to its host, has worked over time on how best to grow and retain more mass. That would help explain why/how Venom got bigger and bigger over the years–it was loading up on more ammo. That does mean when it acts as clothing, it’s secretly INCREDIBLY dense and resilient clothing. As for how the host can carry it, why it’s not too heavy, I would say the symbiote does a lot of the lifting itself.>Sebina asks: Hi! My biggest question is: Will we ever see Cletus Kasady again? Given that Queen In Black venom unchained is seemingly hinting at Eddie becoming Venom again. Would it be possible for Cletus to become Carnage once again?>JW: I mentioned before that if Eddie Brock: Carnage had gone on, we would have brought Cletus in. I hope we see him again! Honestly, I think he should show up in a NON-Carnage capacity as a serial killer. Will he ever be Carnage again? I would guess so, but I do think there are a lot of story possibilities before that happens. It was not so long ago that they parted ways–just in Venom War.
>>154049108>Venom King asks: Do you have plans for a new Venom character that is a dinosaur? Not like Stegron, he was Pterosaur man, not a dinosaur, I mean, a true dinosaur, it can be an avian dinosaur(bird) or non-avian ones.>JW: You know, we have one! More than one! Meridius–the evil Eddie Brock, whose human body was transformed into a symbiote–spent a ton of time as a dinosaur when he was lost in time! We also had a Venomsaur in VENOMVERSE REBORN in a couple of DELIGHTFUL shorts by Ryan North that were take-offs on his long-running DINOSAUR COMICS webcomic.>TwoGoblins asks: In Venom #258, MJ tells Peter that she and Flash talked themselves out of a relationship. Does this mean this is the end of MJ and Flash teasing? Or will we see more of this drama due to Death Spiral? And if this is the end, were you planning to pair them but give up due to the bad reception of fans?>JW: I think MJ just stated where things currently stood in her mind. These things can change in either direction, so… it remains to be seen. Keep reading!
>>154049164>Golden-Spider asks: First off, I really loved MJ & Peter’s talk in the latest issue. But one thing stuck with me, though, since MJ didn’t know about the time difference between dimensions — but during the run where that arc took place in Amazing, it’s said Paul knew. Does that mean Paul took advantage of MJ by not telling her so she would give up on Peter? Or were both affected (Paul and MJ) by Rabin’s spell (the one that created the children) that played a part in both of them feeling/acting the way they did in that arc and up until this series?>JW: Definitely not our intention to make it seem like Paul was hiding something from her. I think Al (and I) just didn’t remember that Paul apparently knew this fact. In addition, we’ve seen in comics before that these time differences are not always stable. Sometimes a place whose time moves faster than ours suddenly is moving slower. The whole thing is that their time and ours are not fixed together, so anything is possible.>The preciousthing asks: I believe Ewing was the one who made it canon that Bruce Banner has DID (Dissociative Identity Disorder). Have you guys considered any potential mental health diagnoses for Eddie? It’s not too far-fetched to imagine he’s been self-medicating with Symbiotes this whole time.J>W: Good question and good theory! I do think Eddie has a lot of issues and problems to work through–hopefully we can find a place to do that. But also, I think there is a lot of opportunity to use the symbiote to write about those types of issues, using it as a metaphor, so it’s not always necessary to come out and use real-life diagnoses. With Hulk, I think Al was putting a label on something that was present in the comics for such a long time; it was overdue. With Eddie, I think things are a little more up for interpretation, and I would hate to shackle the future writers to something without a really strong story reason.
>>154049037Already debunked, I see it's impossible to convince you of anything because you absolutely refuse to acknowledge the rest of what happened in that story.
>>154049205>I think Al (and I) just didn’t remember that Paul apparently knew this fact.Haven't you got the greatest reason to be the most adherent to what was written previously?Does no one in the office actually read the end product that ships?
>>154049205>Joao Gabriel asks: I’ve made a Dylan family tree, but I had a problem, in 2021 Defenders (Also written by Ewing!) Anti-All appeared, and Doctor Strange said multiple pieces of it were spread in the multiverse, so I was wondering if Knull is also a piece of it?>JW: I reached out to Al, and he had this to say about it:>“Generally speaking, I’d rather cosmic-level continuity happened on the page instead of in side-sources like this one, but there’s definitely a potential connection if a writer wanted to go that way… and in the context of the family tree, it does give Dylan a lot of clout to have one going that far back! Forget Steve Rogers and his Revolutionary War ancestors – Dylan can trace his right back to the primal conflict that began the concept of narrative!”>Vovina also asks: Was the Eventuality’s suit the Venom symbiote, transformed by the Light into a sort of Anti-Venom, or did it just manifest from the Enigma Force, à la the end of King in Black?>JW: The Illuminated was using what he–at the time–called The Enigma Force, but what we now know was a much larger thing called the Lumina or Light Force.>Stay tuned, Venom heads, as we have a whole new batch of questions and answers when Venom #259 comes out on June 24th!>Without further ado, enjoy the exclusive art below!>https://aiptcomics.com/2026/06/04/venom-unleashed-22-knull-carnage/
>>154049240You didn't debunk anything, you noted Paul lied about being a native but didn't say anything about how he has explicitly said time was experienced differently to him.
>>154043010As of the current run Peter was in middle school 15 years ago, making him 27-29
>Raimi films>The comic for the past like 20 years>The Sony gamesSeriously though, does anyone even still like MJ? When was the last time she was a likable character? Spectacular?
>>154049388We saw a bubble of her character return from being deep drowned, before being burnt at the stake by Wells.
>>154049428I really just feel like they should just cut the string completely. I dunno, their relationship has become deeply unpleasant and, forgive me for using this word, rather toxic. All they ever fucking do is hurt each other, over and over and over and over.
>>154049333That entire line of dialogue was bullshit. He had no idea how time worked in a universe that he knew nothing about. You're reading too much into what he's saying.
>>154049688Oh they should, because the MJ we love hasn't been really allowed to be printed in ASM for several decades - with Spencer's being the exception that proves the hard rule.Because the characters are natural magnets for each-other, the current regime will forever just burn everything down before breaking OMD. Hell, with their treatment of Felicia it's pretty clear they simply don't know HOW to write romance anymore, let alone a goddamn stable and emotionally supportive one.If the current editorial can't behave, then do it. Shelve her. Preserve what character she has left and stop letting people who clearly have no attachment to her, beyond the Lucy football bait, write her. Let her ascend into the QIB for a few years even a decade and let the new team come in to finally chemo this cancer.
>>154049833You're really bending over backwards to not take the words he is saying as their plain meaning. You think he was lying about time working differently and was just right by coincidence? Why was he lying about that?Lowe pls.
Why is everyone acting like everything post OMD isn't Apocrypha?That the face reveal was a sign they were going to kill spiderman as a marketable comic character forever through their inability to write ANYTHING half decent? Him acting like a helpless hapless child to ironman and everyone else when he's been spiderman longer then anyone on the avengers have been superheroes in canon and have been trying to do the teen hero dynamic with them and it's been the most bizarre retarded shit I've ever seen.Look. Let's just treat this and everyone created during this time as particularly shitty fanfiction and have fun. It's all every bit of it ass. Pure unwiped ass.
>>154050128Good post anon.
>>154050128>ApocryphaThat would be all Marvel post Onslaught.
>>154048987You can be a super hero and still be married and have kids.
>>154050170>That would be all Marvel post Onslaught.Nah, heroes return was cool. It was when Disassembled happened that it becomes apocryphal
>>154020980Is the polish faggot finally gone?
>>154050229Nothing Slott does is canon, That's the deal!
>>154050278That's Buseik you cum dumpster
>>154050209My main man made it.Glorious bastard.Shows it CAN be done, a character CAN outlast and prosper past a spiteful editorial.
>>154050284I know, I was including Slott.
>>154049904The plain meaning is that he was making everything up. "I'm one of you" - wrong. Before Spider-Man and Mary Jane showed up he had no idea there were even other worlds. He certainly wouldn't have stayed all by his lonesome on a dead world if he could escape.
>>154050270Nope but the marriage is on the other hand FOREVER that is.
>>154050308For as dirty as they did Jon Superman and Lois are still together. Marriage is clearly a non issue.
>>154021006This. Kraven's last hunt was it for Peter and MJ's relationship for me.
>>154022238I have. Marvel hasn't.
>>154050549Married Superman is so boring DC has written him out of his title twice within the past decade, first doing their own take on Planet Hulk while his gay son handled Earth and now currently where he's fixing the Multiverse or whatever while Prime Time is going on.
>>154050428The plain meaning of>a long time ago--to me, at least--Is a long time ago, to him at least. Because glyph-man knows time works differently for him.>>154050428>Before Spider-Man and Mary Jane showed up he had no idea there were even other worldsThat's what he said, even choosing to believe a explicitly lying liars words why then three pages before is he talking about the emissary communing with higher beings. Like y'know, from other worlds?We're both really putting more thought into it than Wells did. Pauls character changed depending on what he needed to make his mystery box less water-logged.
>>154050600What's changed with him being married that makes him boring? It's not like he's fucking his way across DC or even flirts with other women besides Lois Lane or WW. We all know OG Maxima is clearly the superior waifu and a slowly glowing relationship with the 20/10 arrogant thirsty bratty warrior queen in need of correction would have been a great story. But LL is okay.
>>154049108>massSo your explanation is just that it got better at it over time? Fucking bullshit. I fucking hate these newsletters because it might as well be vital info and fun flavor text that also added to the immersion that was part of Spider-Man's thoughts/strategy or Venom's thoughts are now relegated to these dumbass letters. I know no prizes exist. But this fucking ridiculous that vital understanding of the lore and how shit works is stuck in here rather than the pages themselves.Oh and yeah this is so they can justify MJ and Dylan even though that shit is still retarded and the symbiote fits the wearer not the other way around. Living COSTUME, Marvel? Ever heard of it?
>>154050567Understandable but JMS's stuff is good for an older Peter and MJ, and 500 is stopping point for the whole series imo. I know the 350 crowd will probably disagree but whatever.
>>154050683Back in the 80s Superchad had more than one woman trying to catch his interest. They messed it up with the New 52 when they had Perez write him as a loser with Lois oneitis, a similar problem they have with Peter Parker now.
>>154050788500 is a decent stop point. I haven't really liked much past that. there's stuff I've enjoyed in a vacuum but it didn't really feel like it lasted. Like it mattered.
>>154020980Never. Peter Parker can never be happy and MJ does not want to admit she missed out on a good thing. She's a total nasacistic bitch from being popular her whole life and both Gwen and Black Cat are way better partners, but poor Parker is so stuck on MJ he can't let it go so she strings him along and is on again off again because she's addicted to being victimized, then rescued, then the chiding high maintenance woman she actually is.
>>154050813Yeah Peter Parker was way less dorky than they let on once he grew into Spiderman. He has some of the hottest babes in the entire industry he just never has free time.
>>154051294Romita and Andru really cranked up the handsome Pete.
>>154051406Mr Advertiser get down!
>>154051059Same here. Spencer felt like it did but that was partly because it did feel like he was doing it out of spite towards Slott and editorial. Which is based. But modern books are too short and yes, JMS's era had that same problem but at least it still felt like the same character. The decompression could be ignored.
>>154051406brain rotted retard
>>154051294The whole chronic fuckup thing is contrasted horribly with his romantic relationships. He is physical with Raelith and Felicia, his coworker is interested, shay'll be back, and mj is a wait and see. Peter must be a fucking gigachad
>>154051469>>154052100what was it? >>154052174totally relatable.
>>154031932Because that's the Spider-Man that we follow the most.
>>154052738That comic spiderman has been dead for long enough for a generation to be young adults with their own children now.Comic spiderman has been barely readable shit for as long as a generation has had time to grow up to be old enough to have children of their own.And the most famous spiderman for them are cartoon miles morales and live action miles morales in white face.It's over anon.It's time to move on.
>>154049205How are these people not fired yet?
>>154052950Cronyism, they're 'well known, they're cheap, and they get the books out on time and are competent. That's about it.
>>154053094>competent
>>154053136I said competent not talented. They get the job done admirably and keep the lights on. But they aren't winning any awards for amazing stories or changing things in a way that will leave a character voice that will echo into eternity.I honestly believe they are pro OMD because they think that will allow them to create their own character that can catch on in the spiderman universe and get royalties and clout.
>>154050549>Marriage is clearly a non issue.Tell that to Bruce Wayne
>>154052430>what was it?Miles/MJ cuck porn
>>154053392Nothing NTR about it, just standard MJ x Miles romantic piece but he had his dick out
>>154029601>because 616 was a clusterfuck of unreadable garbage at the timeIt still is and it keeps getting worse. There are more multiverse refugees than ever before.
>>154050567I liked the marriage all through the 300s. I also liked todds Spider-Man and after. I have enjoyed the 400s as well and despite the a story not being the best i have found outside of Ditkos Spider-Man run, the Marriage is my favorite Status Quo.
marvel has been shit for decades
>>154053390Bruce is mentally ill
>>154053404Dumb cuck lmao
>>154055001Mentally ills don't raise successors, they brainwash.
>>154050755They gave up on making sense for what was originally called a living costume in like 2003. Shit's been screwy longer than not.
>>154050755It's a return to form.
>>154052794Not that anon but some of us are zoomers who found out the modern books sucked shit when we got to be in middle school or high school and stuck to reading old shit. So no, some won't move on and hopefully my generation sctually does some shit. We'll see. >>154054859Yes.>>154055712I know but I'm still gonna complain about it and my point was moreso the fact this shit is getting explained in a letters page and is different than the no-prizes from back then where some autists got really hung up on certain shit.
>>154055915>how else do you explain Stan Lee screwing up the names of his protagonists?I dunno except all those times all of their powers eventually fall into a status quo where mistakes aren't made anymore, their characterizations cement themselves (this is basically Marvel's whole distinguishing factor besides the public fearing them and heroes not always getting along) and those explanations are probably left open until they basically can't anymore after a writer gets themselves into a corner. Yeah I know what I'm saying might be contradictory where I want Venom to be a costume yet I also am fine with silver age stuff like this but that's because they were one-offs and also when they were being created.Anyway, who's the writer of this? Sounds midwit. Like yeah comics should be eventually cycled out and you focus on something else but like all hobbies it doesn't matter what age you are unless you're buying too much of it or it is quite literally something like baby toys.
>>154052794>live action miles moralesMileshill....
>>154022651I'd have settled for the next page revealing most of the crowd were there for Shocker's funeral but by the time they realized they were at the wrong place it would be too awkward to leave.>>154028020He's just there to make sure Paul is really dead.
>>154055915By the 1980s they were having characters in-story talk about how their powers worked and cases like Blackout's powers being changed from a dubious thing to the same "Darkforce" that various other characters with shadowy constructs also used. So not giving a shit seems to have fallen out of favor after a while.
>>154025934>but it was never popular between writers and editors.Therein lies the real cause of so many problems at Marvel, not just Spider-Man's marriage. The people working there aren't writing for the enjoyment of a paying audience, they're not trying to entertain you, the fans, and give you what they think you want to see, they're writing for themselves, and if what they want to see is a complete opposite to what the fandom wants, they'll choose to ignore the fandom and do the thing they like instead, every time, no matter how uncommercial it is, no matter how much it hurts sales and drives readers away.And that's even before you get to the writers or editors who actively WANT to make the fans angry and to ruin things that they know fans love.Pay attention to the rest of Marvel and note how it's only Reed and Sue who are allowed to stay married, and that's only out of respect for Lee and Kirby, and even then, they constantly keep teasing that Sue might cheat on Reed. There's a lot of other couples that fans want to see together but they can't have it, and there's no real reason beyond Marvel just don't want to do it, they don't want to give you what you want, they want you angry.
Venom is fat! FAT!
>>154026448The Clone Saga started life as "what can we do as a big Spider-Man story for 1994 that can potentially top 1993's Maximum Carnage in scale and sales?"As much as pseuds love to bitch about Maximum Carnage, it sold really well, a lot of kids loved it, and it's been as close to an evergreen trade as Marvel get ever since, the kids were reading and enjoying Spider-Man prior to the Clone Saga, and during the early months of it too.That pic does a lot to explain why Marvel editorial are stuck in a mindset that Spider-Man is "about youth" thoughever. Bill Jemas has been gone for 20 years and they're still running to the programming he gave them.>>154027813This should be obvious, but sometimes you need to check sales of other titles for comparison, as sales at times can be indicators of the state of the industry in general, the ups and downs of one single book aren't always just due to it's own storylines.>>154028010>Xmen has no teens and it sells like dildos at a dyke colony.These days it's selling more like it's got free AIDS on every page.
>>154031268>(Should've been Carol)No, the readers demanded it was Paul who died. Carol can get killed later.
>>154024729As a kid, I read Amazing Spider-Man 350-400. Not all of them and there were various issues of Spectacular, Web of, and regular mixed in too, but that was when I read. I liked it and Peter was married in every single one of those. Not once as a kid did I feel like Peter's life needed to mimic my own.
>>154056666Check 'em. Digits more powerful than the devil's OMD. Undo OMD.
>>154026448>spider-powers=pubertywhat fucking retard came to that idiot conclusion?
>>154024340It’s pretty simple.>Mayday makes all the other female Spiders look like shit>Having Peter’s daughter upstaging everyone would reinforce the idea that Peter is the one true Spider-Man just as his daughter is the one true Spider-Girl>OMD means you can’t just have Mayday travel to the past to be in 616 and if a parallel version were here the ‘will they won’t they’ tripe with Peter and MJ would make even less sense. Literally how would Paul happen if MJ can see her daughter right there? It’d kill all the shitty relationship drama.So it is easier to just push some contrived character like ‘alternate reality where Gwen Stacy took Peter’s place then permanently goes to 616’ or ‘What if a girl in Peter’s class also got bit by the same slider and was in a basement this entire time’ rather than simply ‘Peter’s daughter inherited his powers.’
>>154058071>>OMD means you can’t just have Mayday travel to the past to be in 616 and if a parallel version were here the ‘will they won’t they’ tripe with Peter and MJ would make even less sense. Literally how would Paul happen if MJ can see her daughter right there? It’d kill all the shitty relationship drama.Doesn't the X-Men have Rachel hanging around when her mom was dead at first?
>>154058121I don’t care about the X-Men so I can’t explain their thought process.
>>154058121Nate gray literally kissed his mom, spider-man is bad but not that bad as x-men
>>154037092>Comics shits all over her and Peter>Raimi MJ is awful>Insomniac MJ is somehow even worse>The MCU straight up doesn’t have herSo what are we left with when all the most popular games, comics and movies all depict her as a shit character? Like yeah she has good cameos and references in other media but that’s basically it.To be fair, a good chunk of people still remember MJ at her peaks but without a solid mainstream portrayal she’s having a hard time being liked. The best shot is if the redhead girl in the next Spider-Man movie is Mary Jane and she replaces Michelle Jones. Only other shot is if an actually good new cartoon came out and she had a good appearance there.
>>154058298What's worse, the comics actively trying to make MJ unlikable so that people stop asking for the marriage, or Insomniac actually thinking people would like their cunt version of MJ
>>154023249Why the fuck would I want it to be "main canon"? Nobody gives a SHIT about 616! NO ONE
>>154060338Tell that to the multiverse refugees.
>>154055915Wow, that guy soukds like a faux-smart jerk.
>>154050209I want Peter and MJ to marry and have kids but I want the kids to be powerless. I'm sick and tired of the kids having super powers.
>>154060413FUCK EM REFUGEESBUILD THE WALL
>>154020980that would be a sign of aging and you can't have superheroes really age (unless it's kid to adult) or they get too old to be superheroes which doesn't fly with the whole going on forever thing comics have
https://x.com/Lunchuanweizhi/status/2062597793408254355Fan art doesn't look so bad to be honest
>>154060314Honestly I’d say Insomniac. The comics aren’t nearly as popular as the game and the comics always have hope that shit will improve when the retards retire or drop dead. Insomniac just created an entire new version of MJ who is a total bitch so now anyone who plays their games will have her as one of their main impressions of the character. It reminds me of how dumb kids have a bad understanding of Miguel because pf the movie so there are people that unironically believe he is an actual vampire or fat women getting mad that he isn’t brown in the comics. A shitty mainstream portrayal is worse for character perception.
>>154061435I concur, it's like how Raimi's adaptation became so embedded in the popular culture that elements of it write themselves into the comics where there was no history before.Like Norman getting a complete retcon in how much he meant to Peter as some sort of parental figure, this just wasn't the fucking case in early Spider-Man.
>>154036808>Earth-199999 in the MCUShould've given it a catchier number like 151 or 998 or whatever, no wonder they tried to replace it with 616, no one wants to say or remember how many 9s the MCU Earth is supposed to have.
>>154036870It's better, but it's still not canon dude, just an AU.We want to see the main Peter actually get better.>>154060338You say that, but even when the book is ass, it STILL sells, so clearly people care enough to buy it.I don't see why it's hard to understand, sure it's nice that Marvel has let Peter and MJ get together and have kids in alternate universes, but we want that to happen to the mainline Peter as well, the one we follow month to month.
I say do a time skip, pass the mantle to his son (Richard? Peter Jr?) Previous 16 years can be fleshed out later.
>>154062386>it STILL sellsbecause of collectors that don't even read comics. They still think that peter and mary jane are together because of those variant covers
>>154062386>>154062520It's sunk cost and hopefully 1000 is when it tanks.>>154061339Design still sucks, desu. Doesn't fit MJ.
>>154061475Stan provided just enough that you could say they had a deeper relationship off-panel.
>>154062386"Canon" doesn't matter. All it is is the longest-running Spider-Man story, one that's never meant to end until the company itself is closed.
>>154062613>"Canon" doesn't matterTell that to multiverse refugees.
>>154062386canon stopped mattering after OMD or heroes reborn if you want to be pedantic
>>154061435>or fat women getting mad that he isn’t brown in the comicsI just remembered the people mad that Miguel wasn't brown in PAD's last mini. God that pissed me off
Is this Flash? Is he having a Flashback?
>>154024526I don't think avengers alliance redux has any new characters, only base roster
>>154020980I hate capeshit! I hate comics! Talk about TADC instead
>>154063232>trashed JaxNo thanks.Never even watched episode 1 btw.
The whole anti-aging thing is weird to me. Betty and Peter never came across as high-school students in the ditko run.
>>154063280Exactly it’s pro suicide and triggering ppl and did it with its most complex character. So I plan to make sure TADC discussion takes up half the board until it’s made aware of. But talking about other things distracts.
>>154063634In the context of the 60s they were.
>>154062585Tbh, that was after Peter punched the Goblin out of Norman. Before that, Norman was pretty flawed when it came to being a father to Harry.
>>154044904>where things cuurently stand in her mind. This comment is kind rapey.
>>154064679What is the worst case scenario? Even if Venom assumes direct control of the body and tries to rape Flash, then Anti-Venom would protect him.
>>154064713I feel Flash would be more interesting if he was gay and want to fuck Peter.
>>154064818>"MJ, listen. Oh god, how do I say this?>"It's ok Flash. You can tell me.">"MJ, I'm gay.">"Oh. wow.">"Yeah">"I'm so proud of you...">"Yeah, also... um... Paul and I...">"Oh..."
>>154023249Because it should have been
>>154049042>Mary Jane and Flash Thompson’s romance,what
>>154065336It's decades in the making.
>>154026843>Reed Richards gets a kidCurrent writers want nothing to do with the kids though.
>>154065755MJ was using Flash to make peter jealous. When Flash found out he told MJ to piss off.
>>154066400The fantastic four have only added to their kid count.
