Let's have a comfy Marvel thread.>favorite era?>favorite team?>favorite hero?>favorite covers?>any small moments that stick out?
>>153902358Aw, man, don’t use a spider-man issue for the OP. You’ll attract all his schizos that way. :(>favorite era?I’m very fond of the Bronze Age, especially the 70s. X-Men was pretty good, Defenders was great, Dr. Strange was fucking excellent. Loads of good talent in both the art and writing departments, some really stellar artists, just good quality all around.>favorite team?It’s the Defenders, not even close for anyone else. Their team dynamics from Englehart to Matteis are unbeatable and the plots are always entertaining. Not a fan of what’s been done with them since the 80s.(The Fantastic Four are in second place. Pre-Rogue X-Men in third.)>favorite hero?Dr. Strange>favorite covers?Take your pick from any of Marvel Fanfare’s. There are so, so, *so* many good examples in that line alone.>any small moments that stick out?Too many to count. Some are comedic, most are human in ways writers haven’t really captured since the 90s (and especially ‘00s). Pic rel. feels like getting a warm cup of hot chocolate and sitting by the fire after spending a week climbing snowy mountaintops if you know the context.
>>153902865>Too many to count. Some are comedic, most are human in ways writers haven’t really captured since the 90s (and especially ‘00s)I always liked when the cast would have conversations that gives a glimpse into their personality or history, or moments where they just do fun or cute things with their powers. Claremont was very good at that in his X-Men run. JMD does it well, too.
>>153902358I have no real answers to any of those questions, but here are my favorite Marvel comics so far.
>>153903755Just started reading?
bump
>>153904466No, I've been reading comics for over two decades. I'm hard to please.I have other favorites, but not on the level of these in terms of my appreciation.
>favorite eraLate 80s-Late 90s>favorite teamX-Men and Avengers West Coast >favorite heroPsylocke (British Maiden with the stupid puffy sleeves)>favorite covers90s Ghost Rider >any small moments that stick outI miss when the Avengers had a West Coast version. Two unique Avengers teams were better than one
>>153903755>Elektra: AssassinBill Sienkiewicz kills it as always with trippy art, but it didn't really grab me as much as I hoped. Miller's Daredevil is one of my all-time fave American comics (ignore The Man Without Fear).>Nick FuryNot read it yet, but I enjoy Silver Age insanity and the out of context panels make it look like a good time.>FoolkillerIt's an interesting standalone story. Not the best (comes off as Gerber trying his own take on Taxi Driver) but a worthwhile read.>Alan Davis Captain BritainA solid, but not great, run mostly carried by Davis' art and the utterly batshit plots. Alan Moore has done characters and stories I prefer much more, like Miracleman.>>153905484>British Betsy enjoyerI liked her in Captain Britain. I also liked that she was starting to develop into a leader during the crazy Australia era, which wasn't my favorite part of the Claremont X-Men, Genosha was enjoyable and Claremont getting really weird and blatant with his fetishes is always funny. Then Claremont and Jim Lee turned her into a ninja with a huge ass, and she's never been quite the same.Davis is on record for hating Asian Betsy, too (he posted about it on an old fan forum), which made me lol, but he has a very good point.
>>153902358>>favorite era?80s to early mid 90s was when I was a most active reader>>favorite team?Avengers>>favorite hero?Spider-man>>favorite covers?yo>>any small moments that stick out?
>>153905851Woops meant to post my over instead of my moment
>>153905851>any small moments that stick out?>stick>that pagegood one anon>In the original script for this issue, when the nurse asked Spider-Man if baby Danny Blaire was his, writer Peter David was going to have Spider-Man sarcastically respond "Gee, I dunno. Let's throw him against a wall and see if he sticks." Editorial had David scrap the joke, arguing the reply was a bit too harsh for Spider-Man.What a shame
>>15390587620th century spider man has many good covers
>>153905759I get his point. Ninja Betsy isn't just a costume change. They completely changed her personality. She became more aggressive and reckless. She would forget to use her psychic powers outside of her psychic knife. Her motivations were inconsistent and arbitrary because writers didn't know what to do with her. She had that pointless romance with Warren. For a character that was supposed to be a master martial artist, she got her ass kicked, captured or killed all the time. Claremont and Lee would have been better off leaving Betsy on the sidelines ( like Dazzler and Longshot) and creating a new character that had a different power set (like those shadow powers she got after Crimson Dawn). That fit the ninja angle much better.
>>153902358I dont read marvel at all, i have always been DC only but i really liked Todd Mcfarlane Spiderman run that you posted in OPIs there any other runs you guys recommend that are close to that? It can be spiderman or any other character
>>153905759>Not the best (comes off as Gerber trying his own take on Taxi Driver)That's why it is the best. It's the Paul Schrader approach to comic book vigilantism, written with Gerber's unique voice.>A solid, but not great, runIt's terrific. Jaspers' Warp is the best ultra-high stakes story I've come across out of anything from the Big Two. All those Crises and events pale in comparison. Unfortunately, it's far too short.
>>153907012Not just getting her ass kicked a lot, but she really did get brainwashed and kidnapped a lot for a powerful telepath, shit's hilarious. Based Claremont could not help himself. Only time I liked Asian Betsy was when Davis used her in his solo Excalibur run, but he just wrote her as classic Betsy while begrudgingly acknowledging that she's Asian now, haha.>>153907078I really liked the Stan Lee run (especially Steve Ditko) for Spider-Man. Roger Stern and John Romita Jr. also have an enjoyable run together. I didn't like the Mcfarlane run when he was writing, but I love his visual interpretation of Spider-Man.If you're looking for something darker, Frank Miller's Daredevil is excellent, especially the Elektra Saga and Born Again.If you're interested in mutants, the Claremont/Sienkiewicz New Mutants run is really cool in a trippy and ethreal way. The Claremont New Mutants as a whole is one of my favorite runs, but the opening start with McLeod and Sal Buscema is pretty dry.
>>153907507Thank you
>>153907638My general suggestion for Big Two is to find a character that you like (either through watching/playing/reading an adaptation, or you just like their look), find a story arc or notable issue, and start from there. If you like what you see, then maybe start at the beginning of the listed writer's run. It's how I eased myself into reading American capeshit.
>>153907507Not just Claremont, her worst ass-kickings came from later writers. BTW, one of the reasons like British Betsy is how resourceful she is. She can't beat people one-on-one so she tries to out smart them. She also used her telepathy in a much smarter way.
>Era80s easily. Everything just seemed to work, even when there was shitflinging behind the scenes>TeamWest Coast Avengers. I just really loved everyone on that team. Classic Thunderbolts gets an honorary mention as well.>HeroSpider-Man. Outside of that Daredevil and Hawkeye>CoversPic related>MomentsI've always been a big fan of the way Peter finds out about Jean's death in Death of Jean DeWolfe. It's very abrupt and feels very human
>>153908492What was your personal fave British Betsy moment? Her helping Wolverine fend off Sabretooth, and getting intel on the Marauders while doing so, sticks out to me.
>>153907078Word of advice: if you're looking to stick to the good stuff, have a good time, don't read comics for the characters. It'll break your heart, kid.
>>153909148>don't read comics for the charactersWhile I generally think that's good advice there are times were even if I really like a writer I don't always want to read what character they're on.
>>153908777That's my favorite, too. I also like her becoming more of a leader during the Outback era.
I really like the mid-70s and the early-mid 2000s. Early to mid-80s is really good too.
>>153907438I've just gone through Foolkiller again. It's a decent-at-best Paul Schrader pastiche, but the art isn't very good, and I found it starts to meander near the end. Gerber's dives into the vigilante psyche and Kurt's descent into madness did keep me reading. It's an enjoyable mini-series for what it is.
>>153909148I know that, thats why i said any character can goI just mentioned spiderman specifically because i like him the most from MARVEL and its like mentioning batman or super in a DC thread
>>153910123It's one of the very, very few superhero comics that have managed to move me, and I've read a lot. The art gets better in the second half, when the inking gets bolder. I don't remember it meandering, but I do remember it spiraling.If you can name better superhero titles, I'm all ears. Let my desperate search reach a breakthrough for once. This ocean of a genre must be hiding more than a handful of motherfucking pearls.
>>153910307Honestly, anon, I get the idea that American cape comics just aren't your thing.
>>153910307>>153910350Yeah anon i think you should just search for non cape comics, plenty of stuff to read that arent superhero stuff
>I'm not a superhero...>I'm a priest.
>>153910350I really liked Foolkiller, and twice now I've been told it's just okay in a Marvel thread. So I may be in the dark about the really good shit.>>153910357I already read that stuff. I'm asking specifically about superhero comics.
>>153910307I think the thing about Foolkiller is that it also captures a very specific moment of time. A bit broadly in the overall culture but very specifically the NYC of the general time period it came out. I don't mean this to sound pretentious but read the book Gods of New York which covers the period 1986-1990 and touches on a lot of things and figures from that time period like Bernie Goetz, Al Sharpton, Trump, the marked increase in crime and glorification of the vigilante. Gerber was a social critic and satirist and I think giving yourself a good idea of the era he was critiquing in any given book helps a lot.
Recently read the old X-men vs minis. They were nice.
Hold on
>>153913667?
>>153913667>>153915633It's over.
I like the 90s
>>153916952How come?
>>153917439Partly nostalgia and partly because for whatever fault the 90s had they were always trying to be cool. It's easy to point fingers at the crash and speculator gimmicks after the fact. To mock dumb events years later. But in the moment it was exciting. Except clone saga. that was frustrating even then
>>153917439not him but heroes return 1997-1999, age of apocalypse and early 1990-1991 x-men are pretty kino.I guess that some stuff from 1992-1996 can be okish.Also Marvel 90s was the last time that marvel didn't play "safe" so kudos to them in a way.
>>153919050Busiek is my favorite Avengers run
>>153917439More interesting than anything that came after it
>>153916952Post-Claremont 90s X-Men isn't nearly as bad as the Claremont cultists make it out to be. Generation X had some enjoyable stories, especially Jubilee's development under Lobdell. I don't even hate the Morrison era either, because he was trying to move the status quo and franchise beyond Claremont's shadow, and I say this with the Claremont/Simonson X-Men/New Mutants/X-Factor being my favorite Marvel line.Current X-Men is abysmal, though. The writers and editorial have lost all sight of what made X-Men so good.
>>153919733What would you recommend from post-Claremont but pre-Morrison? I’ve been curious, but never took the plunge as I didn’t like late-stage Claremont much either and figured whoever followed him up would probably spend a lot of their time trying to imitate that
>>153919414What about before?
>>153902358>60-70's>FF>Spider-Man/ 70's Shang Chi as written by Moench>pic related>Spider-Man's early encounters with the FF are all pretty. >>153919050I like AoA and Jurgens' Thor from this period
>>153919733>>153921070I was reading X-men well into Onslaught and it was really only when the event itself started and its resolution that I said "yeah this sucks." But Phallanx Covenant, Bloodties, X-cutioner, Fatal Attracts even the lead up to Onslaught were fun.
>>153921070I read on this board that Lobdell and Nicieza were told to script like Claremont early on, but you can tell both writers don't have Claremont's dialogue quirks or crazy fetishes.I enjoyed some of Lobdell's Uncanny issues. He had a talent for writing small-scale character stories.Generation X by Scott Lobdell and Chris Bachalo is solid, and has a lot of good character work for Jubilee in particular. That's the one run I really liked.Nicieza X-Force is pretty enjoyable too, especially after Liefeld leaves and Nicieza no longer has to be his tard wrangler.I haven't read through the whole story, but apparently X-Cutioner's Song is a standout for early post-Claremont.
>>153921748I think Niscieza is a better writer, or at least more reliable one, than he's really given credit for a lot of the time. Lobdell's alright too when you get someone to tard wrangle him. But both were very good at creating and towing the status quo which is something a lot of writers can't do these days. They kept the world and characters going in a way that made you want to keep coming back to them. they knew how to make the soap opera work.
Some of my favorite issues were the the post event codas because you just got scenes of characters talking to each other in nice ways. Not comfy. This isn't slice of life shit. But it was very human.
>>153921123Before?
>>153916952>>153917439Not him, and I prefer the 80's for actually reading comics, but I get the warm fuzzies from the early-mid 90's, but less from the comics themselves and more from the ancillary stuff like the Impel cards, the cartoons, and Spider-Man Magazine. The cards genuinely did a lot of heavy lifting for the Marvel brand in the 90's, a bunch of kids were into collecting them and trading them until POGs blew up.
>>153922939It was a fun time to be a comic fan. I had so many of those cards.
God we need a guy like Shooter again
>>153924561We really do. Marvel Comics is run by a bunch of bitter neckbeards now like Cebulski and Brevoort who would rather double down on mistakes and let the company drown that admit they made mistakes and make business/editorial adjustments.
>>153906202Best covers would have to be by era, but I agree Spiderman had some great ones. I really like this one for some reason. I think the giant shadow, dark setting, and circus characters kind of make it seems like a horror comic. And I like the blue background. My favorite is probably The Punisher cover though.
>>153921842I generally like the "jobber" writers who aren't looking to push the medium forward and just tell good stories. It's a shame so many of them never rise above being C-list or B-list guys. Christos Gage has spent a long time being the guy who has to clean up for Slott yet even in that role he managed to make Avengers: The Initiative a solid but under the radar book that did a lot for some characters like Constrictor and had some really good one off stories (the Butterball and Johnny Guitar issues).
>>153925167Yeah, everyone always praises the big rock star writers but nobody takes time to thank the guys who put in the grunt work. Big stories that change the book forever are well and good but they only have meaning when there's a real status quo to change. This is why so many modern events feel tepid. Things only change long enough to change again.
>favorite era?Late 80s early 90s>favorite team?X-Men>favorite hero?Spider-Man>favorite covers?Too many spider-man covers to count so I’ll post one of my nonspidey favs. This Daredevil one. They layout and perspective is peak. Plus a blind guy holding a gun is hilarious. >any small moments that stick out?I’ll post a pic in the next post
>>153925715
>>153925167>>153925287Nah, fuck the grunts. I don't even like most of the rock stars.Everyone should make a full-hearted effort to push the medium forward AND tell good stories, because we're way behind.
>>153925860I think you might be misunderstanding what's being said. Nobody's asking for stagnation. What we're saying is that these are the issues were smaller character developments actually happen so when shit does go south it has impact. Nobody would care about Dark Phoenix or Gwen Stacy's death of we didn't spend dozens of issues before hand developing them.
>>153902358Being a spider-man/ venom fan is rough atm. And the clones or spider people I like i dont even know the status of, is ben /kain dead or what's the status on that? Its just hard to keep up anymore.
>>153925725I dislike PSA comics.
>>153926428Gun control was kind of a big deal back then. Peter David did a few episodes of Spectacular like that though while I wouldn't say he was more subtle it's interesting how middle of the road Peter was politics wise. If felt like anytime some subject came up or there was some debate on college campus he'd step back and not make an immediate judgement on things.
In any rate It's pretty clear what the writers bias is but it's presented as a pretty frank discussion which is somewhat appreciable.
>>153926493>>153926488actually this was Bill Mantlo. I was mistaken about the writer.
>>153926012I understood. I'm just pissed off about the state of comics, that even allows for there to be grunt work.Just ignore me.
>>153922939I'm adding the Marvel Toy Biz toys to this, I get warm fuzzies just remembering walking through Toys 'R' Us and Kaybee Toys and seeing the rows of X-Men and Spider-Man Toys. I still have the 10" Wolverine and Spider-Man from the 10" Marvel Universe line, I should dig around for more of them.
>>153921842Yeah, I dabbled in 90s post-Claremont X-Men and was surprised that for all the hate they get (you'd think the past decade alone would've changed things), Lobdell and Nicieza were not bad at all. Like you said, they both knew that they were writing a big, melodramatic soap and understood how to tow the editorial status quo while keeping things interesting for readers.
>>153928544It was enough to keep you engaged. I want to be engaged.
