I just want to know why? Why are Marvel like this? They can't honestly think this is a good idea for the big milestone. How can they look at how badly they're doing, how DC is wiping the floor with them and think THIS is the the way to go?
>>154102809Because Marvel doesn’t care because they know Disney will bail them out no matter what.
>>154102809... That doesn't make any fucking sense. Did May just FORGET that she gave birth?
>>154102809Soap opera-tier writing. That's what capeshit is, really.
>>154102809They'll do ANYTHING but let Peter and MJ be a couple again. Something that lasted for decades has no place in the House of Ideas where things are awkwardly retconned in.
It's just intentionally insane. What's next? Uncle Pen's secret pet Pomeranian?
>>154102809So who's the other guy?
>>154103367Are you retarded?>>154103375Always has been.
>>154102809>They can't honestly think this is a good idea for the big milestone.>Have no fear, we've got stories for years!
>>154103968I don't even recognize what comic you posted
Don't worry, he can still be a tulpa created by Mephisto.
>>154102809They have had the same writing team for decades, a writer team that believes that youth is more central to Spider-Man than responsibility, they fundamentally misunderstand this character and they cannot write the youth they claim is so crucial because they are aged Gen X'ers. They are unable to let go but unable to change or read the fucking room. Their ego is too enmeshed in the thing now, they won't admit the obvious fucking mistake for what it is, and so we just have to wait for them to retire or die until we get actual direction back in 616 again.Until then, telenovellas. Not even original plots, but aping Mayday Parkers origins and doing another secret relative plot. DC please please please brutally murder my favourite Superhero's mainline, I need you Prime.
>>154105469Or a robot created by Chameleon
>>154103966The black man is Aunt May’s current boyfriend who is living and fucking with.>May loves B. B. C.
>>154105678He also doesn't like Peter, will no doubt take to the NEW GUY like fly to honey and be a voice on Mays shoulder saying sure is better than that dead-beat gone away for months Peter!They are so predictable, just always bet on the stupidest and most aggravating thing and you're always right.I defy you to name a reason Peter hasn't just told Aunt May yet. This should be the real debate for Peter, to explain six months absence in space (our relatable street hero to the youth everyone) and not have that just swept under a rug by Kelly who should just be doing GOTG. We can't even cite her heart anymore because she's aging backwards to ensure OMD lasts forever, all she does is faint like a true telenovela grandma.
>>154105536>and they cannot write the youth they claim is so crucial because they are aged Gen X'ers.Don't drag me into this, I fucking hate OMD
>>154103968>Always has been.Maybe so, but there used to be high concepts and bombast to balance it out. Now it's unfiltered soap operas.
>>154105755You know the sad part is May has found out he was Spider-man numerous times and it was actually really good.
>>154105978Don't blame you aged brother, so long as you aren't trying to write hip dialogue for the kids by citing Bill and fucking Ted.Had the right editorial regime been in place, to just let him age naturally and let a clearly family orientated character and story grow properly, they ironically would have a far greater locus of reference to speak for Peter.As it is, just give Peter a skate-board and we have a full Buscemi.
>>154105536>a writer team that believes that youth is more central to Spider-Man than responsibilityDon't they already have that nigga Miles for that?
>>154106027And May has had a brilliant death that should have lasted, she had her time. She made her impact. Her best stories had been told. What has she been since then other than a writers tool from the anti-creatives who just want to write the thing they were reading in childhood? And rather than start their own ongoing which would have to depend on its own merits, just completely hijack the original run and nail it down to a dead and rotted status quo complete with Faustian bargains and wonder why ASM has such a dismal reputation to write for.We have the responsibility comic, where nobody takes responsibility or consequences seriously, nothing can't be undone except the most obvious thing near everyone has been asking for.>>154106130The superfluous inclusion of other Spiders to the point of oversaturation in 616 is only making the Youth argument look even more retarded. And it was always retarded. Goddamn Peter Pan over Peter Parker.
>>154106146At this rate I wouldn't be surprised if Miles gets married earlier than Peter
>>154106200If he does, he unironically will be the ascendant Superior Spider-Man and I will fucking kneel to your OC Bendis.
>>154106263fuck off
>>154106438I find Miles inoffensive at best and irritating most of the time, but if the editorial cabal for some reason lets at least one Spider get away from them to lead by example then so be it.That said Miles already did a Mephisto deal, so he's proven no better. God we need Mayday to kill old scratch already, Spider-Office can't be trusted with this diabolus ex machina enabling them.
>>154106494I haven't kept up with Miles' story (I haven't kept up with Peter's either to be fair, I only know that Paul's dead and Peter and MJ 'reconciled' recently), what was the deal about?
>>154106560>what was the deal about?Kamala Khan of course
>>154105376>i don't know it so it doesn't countYou're pathetic. I bet you won't know the panel this story was fleshing out either, fuckhead.>>154105984Nah, it was always this unfiltered. Peter's greatest enemy is his best friend's dad.
>>154106567Let me guess, he made a deal to bring her back?
>>154106578yep
>>154105469Paul should be revealed to be that too, once the editorial stops sucking him off.
>>154106560Ms Marvel died and got undied by letting someone else die. And no, there are no consequences beyond Miles 'quitting' which is a nothing to a Spider.What the fuck is Mephisto's powerlevel again and why does he need mortals permission to use such power over life and death? What are the rules for him, and who set them? The OAA?And that reconciliation was fireman grade washing apologetics. They can't address anything actually said or done in the Wells run so we just get an allusion to 'thrashing', sorry without specifics and moving on. It makes one wonder why even bother with comic books if this is the drama resolution they give?
>>154106657>once the editorial stops sucking him off.The editorial would rather sacrifice their own firstborn than make Paul out to be a villain
>>154106697Realistically how can this shit be fixed without a retcon
>>154106657I fully believe Paul will be given the Marcus treatment the moment those responsible for his creation and continued involvement leave office. Too infamous and too many young creative people out for his scalp, the moment Lowe and the like are gone the hatchet will fall. He'll be revealed if not as a Supernatural empowered agent, to just be a stereotypical incel type who emotionally manipulated an isolated soul in a abusive setting for years, and those kids worked as supernatural chains that made MJ live her worst nightmare.To become her mother and sister.
>>154106755At present? It won't be because >>154106731Too much ego and people responsible. They are STILL carrying water for this abortion of an arc, even though it's caused as much reputation damage if not moreso than the worst excesses of the Clone Saga. They did a Avengers #200 sequel, they realize how many elements are there and are desperately trying NOT to be the office that did a Avengers #200 sequel. Hence Paul glazing even in pointless death that THEY advertise.They want us to just move on and pretend Wells didn't happen. Which is a terrible thing to do in an ongoing, if you hit a shit run you should try use it as fertilizer for the next writer the fix, but they can't do that without addressing the raping element in the room.In short anon. We will get a resolution. It will be arriving sometime in the next decade when the old heads are finally beheaded.
>>154106758Yeah, but it'll take years (probably a decade) before anything like that happens.
>>154106828I see it as the canary in the coal mine, the moment Paul is finally properly addressed we know the old regime is dead. That or just OMD being retconned.616 is the most bizarre odd thing out in the whole franchise, it's solely because of the old boys club and self-selection it's lasted this long. Except now DC is proving you can with the right run hit lightning, and Marvel is still pounding sand.
>>154106755Make Paul an avatar of Mephisto and have the reason why MJ was such a bitch toward Peter at the beginning of Wells' run is because of a secret spell or miasma that makes most people see Paul in a better light than he actually is and Peter in a worse light than he actually is
>>154106923These panels are so fucking bizarre to me.And look at how the world once the 'kids' is all sunny and idyllic? This is a omnicide world where nothing lives, what the fuck are kids doing walking around? Why doesn't she question that? Why does MJ never question Paul openly weighing leaving them to die?There's a perfect story of manipulation, gaslighting, self-loathing and abuse here. It's not a nice one but it's compelling, but Spoffice won't do it because we like Paul.
>>154106982>we like PaulDidn't Brevoort or some other fuck claim that there was totally a large Paul fanbase out there and they were just being drowned out by the loud minority?
>>154107069Brevoort also said that MJ and Paul are the most sexually active marvel couple. He's a troll whose not actually in charge of Spider-Man anymore, but the self-selection of BND folk mean it doesn't matter.They know Paul was loathed, and they know the Paulheads was entirely ironic shitposting on par with Morbiusposting. They just didn't know what the fuck Dead Language was going to do because Lowe doesn't read or appreciate the impact of goddamn scripts.
>>154106050>as you aren't trying to write hip dialogue for the kids by citing Bill and fucking Ted.The entire point of B&T3 was that they're behind the times
>>154107163Well B&T3 has much greater self-awareness than Spoffice, which is either going to do a It's a Wonderful Life thing for 1000 or a secret relatives plot... AGAIN. It's like Sisyphus but it's a big dungball we're expected to crowdfund getting to the top.Nah, imma keep my money.
>>154106755>>154106923>Current MJ a clone while the real MJ's out there a la TAS>MJ was being manipulated by magic>Making MJ genuinely reflect (not the half-assed bullshit in Venom 258) on what she did; hell, if you want to keep the editorial happy (I wouldn't see why you would) make it where MJ starts thinking she doesn't deserve Peter and distances herself from him for like two runsIn all likelihood it'll be swept under the rug. They kind of already did that with Venom 258, to be honest.
>>154106577I dislike everything about this administration but if the draft is reinstated and this generation of solipsists is sent to fertilize another nation's soil maybe there will be some good to come of it
>>154107337>MJ starts thinking she doesn't deserve Peter and distances herself from him for like two runsYou could absolutely do that from page one of her return in Wells.One of the biggest fucking things missing (along with basic characterization) was her inner monologue. The entirety of the Wells run. it is left to the audiences interpretation, WHAT IS THIS WOMAN THINKING? it's part of the mystery box, and the mystery box is fucking empty because Wells was writing badly and rushed, and so you end up with Dead Language.Just have her in denial about how nothing about these unaging children whose names keep changing and refuse to be schooled or socialize are wrong, that her relationship with Paul is abusive and wrong, and that her decision to leave Peter under false pretenses that Paul knew about makes her think herself underserving and unloveable. Boom, character drama. Character if not saved then at least salvageable for a big airport departure reconciliation down the line straight from JMS.But they won't. Because Kelly and his ilk don't care for MJ, they don't want to treat the Wells arc for the immense cancer it was, they just want to throw it under a carpet and move on and expect the audience they teased and baited to move along happily with them.And DC will continue to eat their market share.
>>154106697>>154106755Peter has forgiven Doc Ock, Venom, and Norman Osborn, all of whom are much worse people than MJ. Why exactly does this need a retcon? Every time people elaborate it’s always “I personally would not tolerate this”. But you aren’t a superhero. No one cares.
>>154107337>In all likelihood it'll be swept under the rug.To be blunt I honestly think this is the best way to handle things. The more they try to "fix" things the more they just complicate and break shit. Just do what Spencer was doing and let them be a couple and we can all pretend this shit didn't happen.
>>154107447Spidey Office has been running on pure spite for decades now, and as long as sales are doing decent then they won't care>>154107477I think it's more for MJ's sake than Peter's, I personally don't have any issues with him being quick to forgive
>>154107477Forgiven but not dated, let alone have a ring ready for a proposal.Saint Peter shenanigans aside (he should never fucking trust nor goddamn hug Norman I don't care if you strap him to a gattling gun of sin eaters, and Ock got off way too scot free for his early rapey and memory shredding shenanigans in Superior), the relationship needs a lot of work to continue to work. Or just Spencer sweep it. It's lazy but so is much of comic book writing.
>>154103326Not buying this argument until they quit renting comics in digital spaces. No ordo ab chao shit.
>>154107376What does that have to do with anything I posted? Unless you thought you were talking about me? In which case, I'm too old for the draft kek.
>>154107551Decent but never growing. Possibly the most popular Superhero in the world and they can manage top ten sales reliably. Kept afloat by a speculators market and variety covers like we're in the goddamn 90's again. This is what they call an achievement. A managed decline just gradual enough to avoid getting smote by the mouse.Such ambition from Spoffice, bravo Lowe.
>>154107376>this generation of solipsists is sent to fertilize another nation's soil maybe there will be some good to come of itThe maximum age to get drafted has been raised so if the recrooters started with the oldest then maybe you'd have a point here.
>>154107645>>154107551Outsold by Ultimate.
>>154107594For her character's sake, I hope they'll actually explain it rather than sweep it.
>>154106130miles will always be a ripoff so it doesn't matter.
>>154107744Again, they don't care as long as sales for ASM are decent
>>154107745This shit is going to be an albatross around her neck until it's addressed, but Spoffice would rather her wear it than them and their beloved Paul.
>>154107744Half the fun of Ultimate was seeing BND creatives lose their fucking mind.You mean you can actually just turn this one spigot and print sales?
>>154107799That reminds me, did MJ even care that much about the kids disappearing?
MUH GWENMUH GWEEEEEEEEEEEN
>>154102809Who the fuck is this guy?
>>154107876They couldn't even keep the kids names straight and you wanted catharsis for fairy-dust children? Her world reeling as everything she thought was wrong, and possible self-examination about how else she might have been manipulated? Like waking up from a long half-remembered dream where you had a relationship and it's all over and never existed?She had that one sadgurl image in group therapy with Paul, then she put on the Jackpot outfit and started quipping because we are Spoffice and we don't know how to write a one to one origins anymore.Better question is why a supposedly atoning Paul would let his distraught girlfriend wear the RNG kill me device, as opposed to him? They never discuss that? He never say it's my burden to bear?
>>154107772>decentdecent is a relative term. It sells "decent" because most of their books sell like crap.
>>154107954How did Spider-Versity and the BND miniseries Slott wanted as a ongoing go?
>>154107895the villain of the upcoming ASM 1000. “You stole my life. I’m their real son” blah blah blah
>>154107968Spider-Versity is based and has hot babes.
>>154107968Slott's BND makes Mephisto more relevant to spider larpers than Peter Parker if anything.
>>154108000Norman step away from the children.
>>154108000they all need to be incinerated
>>154108000Norman is so fucking cool
>>154107954Which means they can still justify it. "See? All the other comics are selling like shit, but ASM's still doing fine, so we must be doing something right."
The Marvel strategy for Spiderman has appeared to be 'write absolutely retarded bullshit that will annoy people' for years now. There's no other explanation except that they believe that writing their series as ragebait will somehow result in more sales.I personally find it hard to believe anyone buys comics that are terrible. But you have to assume that they have numbers to back their strategy up and they aren't just throwing away hundreds of millions of dollars for no reason.
>>154102809TOTAL KKKUESADA DEATH!
>>154107942>They couldn't even keep the kids names straight Kek, I forgot about this, but I shouldn't be surprised considering they also 'forgot' the fact that Paul knew about the time difference between his universe and 616.
>>154108097The comics are an IP and idea farm for Disney, it's not exactly a loss leader but they aren't kept on for the profits expecting an Absolute series return.Problem is the House of Ideas has got fucking nothing, and has had nothing for a while now. Hence the telenovella shit that could never pass the sniff test to the MCU without a massive rewrite.
>>154108057He’s after Jessica Drew
>>154107119It's honestly kind of impressive that Lowe is running the Spider-Man office when he is the worst editor at Marvel. How did he pull it off?
>>154108097Marvel and Disney execs can be retards too, anon.
>>154108108>we forgot one of the key reasons fans have been seeing and treating Paul as some sort of rape by omission creep for years>cement this fact by having MJ's canon reason for leaving being she thought Peter was dead, never mind how even that doesn't explain how fucking zombified her behavior was on return to her family and friendsThey really are in some sort of bubble, the Marcus popping is going to be wild and is the only thing to look forward to, too bad it's at least a decade away.
>>154108021I don't get why THIS is the era they wanted to go back to when it's barely noticeably different from the current status quo. Like if they wanted to do PRE OMD as a way to shut people up it would make sense.
>>154108138Connections and sycophancy. It's what has ran the office for decades.Are you on board with BND and OMD? Believe Spider-Man is about Youth and not responsibility? Come on in.Want longevity? Cathartic drama? A story viewed as something more than a toybox to be reset? Keep away, boo and hiss.
>>154108158It's literally just title synergy for the new movie. There's no actual demand for it.
>>154102809please god please be another clone instead of whatever this looks like.
>>154108148Way I see it, the moment the editorial actually calls out Paul and addresses MJ's mischaracterization is the moment OMD genuinely begins to unravel
>>154108285Call out Norman too. He visited Paul's funeral.
>>154108285As the mischaracterization of MJ is a direct result of OMD's status quo needing to keep, to write her in character is the absolute route of the youth crowd.
Spider-Man #1050: Aunt May's older sister Annie actually faked her death, and she is the new old boss of New York crime. Also she's a hapkido expert and can suck the life out of others on contact.
>>154108373*rout
>>154108378We could have a gag where Peter picks out his old year book and realises just how many of his school chums have become Supers, Villains or killed off. I swear a third of his cohort have been swallowed into Capeshit because BND cannot for the life of them leave that era be.
>>154108378Spider-Man #1500: Uncle Ben is actually still alive but is now a genocidal maniac.
>>154108148Does anyone outside of the Spidey Office actually like Paul?
>>154108631Shitposters. He's a shitposters dream.Other than that, he has as many unironic fans as the Morbius movie did.
>>154108631Christians could have him since he had a christian funeral instead of a secular jew one.
>>154102809>I just want to know why? Why are Marvel like this?Yeah, it's crazy the editors let "generic matches" get past them.
>>154108726>>154108734I meant within Marvel Comics, sorry.
>>154108734He didn't even believe in god.He was a vegan who made chicken korma.To Paul, our most confusing rapist.
>>154108780DC rightfully treated him like a creep, DC generally has been on a upswing since DiDio fucked off forever. The Marvel artists I swear are in a group chat talking about how much they have wanted him dead, half the loathing comes from drawing the worlds most punchable numale face.It's just Lowe, Wells and the usual suspects being divorced from consequence.
>>154106438Miles has more than earned it
>>154108896And what? Have a baby with Tiana? A tarantula hawk is a kind of wasp, so it isn't suitable for a multi-level nepo baby's hero name.
>>154108819It's genuinely just pure spite and entitlement on the editorial's part that's keeping Paul from being ripped to shreds.
>>154109015They don't want to have written Avengers #200, hence we're all apparently reading it wrong.Problem is.They absolute rewrote Avengers #200.
>>154108726I don't think even cuckfags or NTRfags like him that much, I've seen more art of Paul getting cucked than him doing the cucking
>>154109238Who would want to self-insert as him? A sex scene with him on panel would make chastity a solid choice.
>>154102809Why does this bother you? How is this offensive?
>>154108164I've been burnt out over Marvel comics (Spiderman especially) for a while now, what's the point in trying to follow the story if nothing's gonna change?
>>154109460Peter’s life is regularly changing though, are you stupid?
>>154109460It would be one thing to have an Evergreen defined Spider-Man where you play with the character in a locked era or setting. The problem is we have had the SAME fucking wheelhouse troupe of writers for two fucking decades. There is nothing left for them to say, and what they had needed to be adapted with a hell of a lot of repair to make it the big screen. Compare the differences of what made BND to the set-up to the coming movie.
>>154107119>the Paulheads was entirely ironic shitposting on par with MorbiuspostingI mean it's not like we ever attempted any subtlety or finesse
>>154107892Why couldn't Nancy Marchand have been May
>>154108819>DC rightfully treated him like a creepHe was THIS close to nailing Peeg
>>154109628Because she was a Saint.;-;
>>154109665One digit away Paul, alas Mephisto's bargain doesn't stretch to DC.
>>154109687>next collab with DC would feature Wally West cheering up Peter Parker after defeating Mephisto together
>>154109769Wally gives me hope, the DiDio situation is pretty close to what we have here, except the cancer has spread to multiple peoples shared philosophy.Good news is the BND mandate failed, ain't nobody young wanting to see more divorced man energy the run. Just going to be a long wait until they fuck off.
>>154109804What happened with DC under this DiDio guy?
>>154109665>Tried bagging one of the hottest chicks in DCMarvel needs to desecrate his legacy for this shit man
>>154110071Imagine every complaint we have about Spoffice, except they have the mandate apply to the entirety of DC IP. Eventually shit became so unpalatable he was not so secretly booted, and what's more things massively and quickly improved dramatically, it was like a big arbitrary blockage burst. Say what you will for DC but they are objectively having a better time of it and enjoying much more satisfied and delighted fan reception and interaction.Except with original WW, I haven't read it but I've heard it's rough.
>>154108000Why is Norman dressed like Joker?
>>154112094he lives in a society where honor is a distant memory
Another writer will come and say it was a clone made by Jackal.
>>154108789>He didn't even believe in god.Who can blame him? He was the last living person on an earth his dad destroyed. How would anyone believe in any deity that would permit that?
>>154112260I dunno. The god his dad summoned?>How would anyone believe in any deity that would permit that?Putting the problem of evil aside, Marvel has objective god/s. Paul is an idiot, and an idiot working on a sufficiently advanced technology aliums view of what killed his planet.Namely, his greed, blatant negligence, ego and selfishness making him poke his pecker into places he shouldn't for techbro money.
>>154112329Nah, what killed his planet is letting his dad in on the job, which unironically is the least techbro thing to do.
>>154106130Ideally yes, but they're closet bigots
>>154109420Spider-Simps wanted the 1000th issue to be about reversing One More Day and changing the sad current status quo.
>>154114567I'll settle for it just not being total dogshit. But it's looking pretty unlikely anyone will be happy.
>Spider-man is one of the most popular superhero ever but his comics are about him getting cucked and going through endless humiliation rituals that everyone hatesExplain this phenomena.
>>154115274The mainline ASM run has been coopted by a very select group of anti-creative types who believe Spider-Man is about youth and not responsibility, and so forever treat him as some chewtoy manchild.The comics make the least amount of money in the franchise, they have the least pull and social reach, it's a petty fiefdom under an aged and spiteful editorial trying to keep the flame of 'their' Spider-Man in the 70's alive, the one they grew up with.
>>154115274Projection, retardation and spite.
>>154115274"But the one thing they love more than a hero is to see a hero fail" - Green Goblin, 2002
>>154114567>They wanted the comic to be good. Yes. Yes we did. Not sure why you think this is some kind of big gotcha.
>>154115274Spider-Man was good before One More Day happened.
>>154116835Marvel employees think calling the fans simps to make wanting to reverse OMD sound like a bad thing, which shows how out of touch they've become
>>154115376>The mainline ASM run has been coopted by a very select group of anti-creative types who believe Spider-Man is about youthI would very much like to know how and where they even got this idea. And even if we were to accept that moronic take, being about youth and being pathetic are very separate things.
>>154115376The one that gave up being spiderman and spent most of his time fucking around with black cat?He doesn't act like that spiderman.He acts like a beta bitch "nu-male" wimp LARPing as that spiderman as written by losers who've never been cool or can't even remember being in their 20's-30's. I'm not really sure what their philosophy on spiderman even is or who it's for. >>154116868Spiderman acting like a 20 year old with tony stark as his mentor was the most ridiculous shit. The unmasking was hated by everyone and still is. Oh they got their rage bump in comic sales, but it burned a lot of fans who would leave the comic forever. The fantasy that comic stans would stick with the character no matter what is a horrifying belief that allows them to justify the dumbest shit to themselves.>>154116890I think it's time to admit that OMD permanently destroyed comic book spiderman and give up.Everything that's happened since then has been considered apocrypha due to the soul selling.Absolutely everyone (including the idiot stewards of the spiderman IP whether they consciously belive it or not) thinks none of this matters anymore because the elephant in the room of spiderman selling his marriage and soul of his unborn innocent daughter to satan should come with a major cost and is going to blow upin his face huge.Everyone else believes that the basic soul of spiderman has been betrayed by marvel and want nothing to do with it anymore and simply don't care about comic spiderman or worse were so disillusioned that they cut off the character entirely. It was an IP killing fuck up and Marvel comics is DAMNED lucky comics are nowhere near as popular as they used to be.However the faggotry and blackrock approved zeitgeist has deeply poisoned the games and other media so it's dying overall.
>>154102809Aunt May was a hoe?
>just give up on the spider-man thing!1!1!1!Tell that to Mileshills.
>>154117006Spider-Man is popular enough that I think you really could fix it with one truly great run. The people want it.
>>154103606It's too late for MJ + Peter. The character is too poisoned.
>>154118796The overwhelming public conscious and consensus is MJ + Peter, shit like OMD and everything afterwards is stuff every comic book reader knows but that's a niche within a niche.We're just waiting for the next generation of creatives, that's it. We've seen the works and fruits of the current one and it's rotten because their foundation for the character was bad and they have now spent far too long drawing from the same talent puddle because they happen to agree.>>154118789I have faith we'll get it, the advantage of decades of shit is fertile fields to win the audience back with easy wins. We just need the usual suspects to finally get their company watch and get out.
>>154118789He's on his way out, Ditko saw it 12 years ago.
>>154119151>the guy who never appeared as a cameo besides stan lee in spider-man related media calling anyone and anything declining before he left the world
>>154107337You say this but look at what Carol got away with in Civil War 2, which was at no point explained by a clone or hex. They just expect you to give her a pass because she cried about it. Or the shit that went down between Colossus and Magik being handwaved.There’s precedent for absolutely shitty people just being allowed to live and let live, you know.
>>154119343>the man who created the foundation for Spider-man making an observation about the decline of Spider-manThe audacity!
>>154119636Fraud.
>>154119764Stan Lee? Agreed.
>>154119782>needing to state which one is a true fraudYou glaze frauds in general.
Did Spider-Man ever pay reparations for the shitty treatment he had of various women, especially in the 70s and early 80s?
>>154119633There's dumb comic book conflict where BIG TIME EVENTS twist everyones characters as the monkeys room for the writing team give varying degrees of accountability and culpability for actions they do, and inter-personal relationships.Look at the amount of bullshit Emma, Norman or BC during her Queenpin schtich get away with. They get a pass because it's comic books and we are moving on (although Norman this should be the one fucking exception but anyway).Excuses for characters punching each-other is another Tuesday for capes. However characters cheating or giving the impression of being unfaithful absolutely torches an audiences impression more than a dozen no-name civilians getting killed, as bizarre as that is.MJ has been nothing short of character assassinated since Wells, Kelly has no interest in writing her and Venom team either willingly or ignorantly don't know why Wells run was such an Chernobyl elephants foot.
>>154119114>The overwhelming public conscious and consensus is MJ + PeterOr Peter + Felicia.
>>154119633Weren't Carol and Peter a relatively popular ship at one point?
>>154121531Nobody thinks about Felicia.
>>154119845>as bizarre as that is.Other way around. Suspension of disbelief isn't infinite, if we're expected to believe that human life is a numbers game AND that that death is a revolving door at the same time, we really can't put up with much more than that. Where's the investment in a story supposed to come from if even the writers don't give a shit?
>>154121731She's the second or third most popular romantic prospect for Peter, what do you mean? She's orders of magnitude more popular than Carlie, Cindy, Shay or whoever else Peter has been with over the years.
>>154121976Most adaptations pair him with Mary Jane. At best Felicia is someone he was with in the past and no longer or a flirtation that ultimately goes nowhere.
Assuming they actually pair Flash and MJ up, how long do you they're gonna last before they eventually break up? I doubt their relationship would last as long as MJ's relationship with Paul.
>>1541224472-3 years IRL at most, I doubt it's ever gonna happen since MJ's rejected him/the possibility of them being together a couple times already, and any teases pointing to that direction is just ragebait on the writers/editors' part
>>154109420Becuase they have done this 5 billion times and then say it was an actual a Robot/Illusion/Genetically modified actress.Why are they bringing in a new character when they have other characters that need resolution? And yes I want OMD undone and that fact that they are not is an insult. I intend to spit on Joe kelly and the rest if i ever see him in public
>>154122539What about the pheromone thing?
>>154108122He looks like he'll assault Bailey.
>>154123033Kelly being a rage baiting degenerate who apparently and hilariously didn’t learn anything from Slott.
>>154123033>>154123300Didn't Venom say it wasn't about Flash?
>>154119151>yours are already in decline.What he mean by this?
>>154107876I guess, apparently. >>154115274What I've experienced as someone who has been alive since the wedding issue is that the character's popularity is driven by stuff outside of the comics now. I was luckily out of buying floppies when OMD happened, but realistically, most of us thought it'd be one of those comic rugpulls that would turn around fast. Years go by surprisingly quickly.So, the hope was there for a few years. Even Slott gave the relationship a bit of hope, as much as I don't like that run. Spencer went hard into putting them back together, teasing them moving in together again, getting engaged, and then Nick Lowe brought in Wells to absolutely sink the fucking ship. We're now closing in on five years since the Paul reveal, and honestly, hope is basically gone.Nick Lowe is solely responsible for this dumb shit. Somehow the longest running Spider-Man editor of all time.
>>154123427>hope is basically goneNah, they'll get back together eventually. Their relationship's been stained by Wells' run, sure, but they'll get back together.
>>154123427>the character's popularity is driven by stuff outside of the comics nowFunny how Marvel keeps trying to capitalize on the movies/TV shows' popularity by copying them in the comics, yet Spidey's editorial keeps shitting on the one thing that's present in pretty much every Spider-Man adaptation
>>154123033>>154123321>Didn't Venom say it wasn't about Flash?I kinda feel like Kelly was trying to imply it wasn't about Flash, and maybe about her pheromones spiked because Peter seemed jealous, but it was so vague and poorly conveyed that it's hard for anyone to be sure.>>154122447>Assuming they actually pair Flash and MJ up, how long do you they're gonna last before they eventually break up?I don't really think they're going to date, but if they actually do, I'm assuming under the Nick Lowe leadership cabal, it'll be 4-5 years again, like Paul. Anything so whatever writer can make Peter talk about how much he loves whoever she's dating.>>154122539>MJ's rejected him/the possibility of them being together a couple times alreadyThey never actually commit to her saying no. They also never commit to Peter being unhappy with it, he has to be the supportive ex-boyfriend who is okay with her dating him, for whatever reason. My personal opinion is that Ewing & co. didn't realize that the problem wasn't just that people wasn't Paul alone, and the "cuck" feeling about Peter is what has people up in arms. I hate that term, but writing "I love this woman but will fight for her opportunity to fuck other guys" is about as bad as it gets. I think Ewing's walked it back, but the monkey's paw of it all is just that they're going to kill her or send her to space.Alternatively, they might just be setting up Flash as Pete's rival instead of friend again, which is an okay -ish thought process.
>>154107477Because it destroys their relashionship and makes her look fucking bad. Peter deserves better
>>154123530We'll have to wait at least a decade (unless it's discovered that Lowe or Quesada or any of the vehemently pro-OMD folks have terabytes of CP on their hard drives or something) before anything resembling a marriage between Peter and MJ is seriously considered.
>>154123530>Nah, they'll get back together eventually. I like to think this too, but realistically, I don't know if Lowe is ever going to leave the Spider-office, and he's made it pretty obvious to the audience that he hates her. He's the longest standing ASM editor ever, and as I read elsewhere, guys in comics are pretty spooked they can't find work elsewhere. He's only in his 40s, and so while I'd hope younger writers and editors that have enthusiasm for the 80s/90s would come in and fix it... I dunno.My hope has been that he'd move to another office/company, but I think he's going to sit in that seat terminally until Disney just decides to end comic production.
>>154102809I do not understand why you fucking care about this.Like, it's fucking pathetic to rage about the marriage for 18 years, but at least that makes sense- you identify as Pete, and the universe owes you a supermodel. I get it.This I don't get. His personal life has always been soap opera material. Aunt May inherited a Canadian nuclear reactor and Otto Octavius tried to marry her for it. He's got at least 4 clones, double agent spies for parents, lived two full separate alternate universe lives that he ostensibly fully remembers, a forgotten sidekick and a guy carrying on the legacy of his dead alternate universe self and a fresh new alternate version of his first love kicking around in the space the clones and sister of said first love don't actually fill. We're not even talking about his best friend's dad turning into his immortal frenemesis after being turned good by a magic evil sucking spear/shotgun situation as a fallout from the actions of a Christian serial killer.Like, a secret cousin is The Most Historically Average Spider-Man outcome. It's the most true to its roots move this book has made in decades.
>>154123801>Peter deserves betterToo bad because the editorial doesn't want that either
>>154123944I'm not OP or anything, but comics are a completely different medium than 40+ years ago, are written mostly for adults now, and while schlocky drama is mostly okay... the "we're running out of ideas" and "Peter is very sad and never wins anything" storyline has run out of steam.>you identify as Pete, and the universe owes you a supermodel.No doubt some people feel that way, but it's not really the case for most. Lots of us can consume all kinds of fiction without pretending we're them, or their girlfriend is ours.
>>154123944Sadsack Marvel employee spotted
>>154123944Not buying this "(You) identify as MC" argument until Disney gets rid of its OCs that a comic characters keep getting paired with in MCU.
>>154123944>you identify as Pete, and the universe owes you a supermodel. I get it.Most Spidey self-inserters I've seen dislike MJ and want him to bang pretty much every other female character other than MJ
>you are a self-inserter because you want this character to have something betterMight as well call you a cuck for defending this dragged ass relashionship that has him being the pathetic one
>>154124141This is why I think there's barely any reason to follow the comics as a coherent story anymore, and its only worth now is as an idea farm for film or show adaptations.
>>154122811>It’s bad because I still am not over a dumb storyline from twenty years ago and can’t move on
>>154125099>Marvel employee who couldn't get over the marriage accusing other people of not being over a storyline twenty years agooh the irony
>>154125099>i have made nothing but shitty spider-man books for over twenty years stemming from one terrible editorial decision, how dare you take offense to this
>>154123944It's mostly a sign of how hostile things are between fans and editorial. Like, you're right. Spider-man has always been a bit of a soap opera, and even a bad soap opera at times. But people just aren't in the mood for it right now. Like, if this had happened immediately after Spencer's run, people would have been confused but rolled with it. If it had been after Slott's run, people would have made fun of it, but maybe they'd let it play out. Wells' run, however, marks the point where you cannot have a Spider-Man issue without seething, sometimes merited, sometimes not. No one trusts Nick Lowe (rightly so), so no one is willing to give him the benefit of the doubt.
>>154118789You are trying to rebuild a home out of the ashes of one they burned down. There is no way to fix this.No story line they can pull to make him not ruined.Everyone in his cast of characters are ruined. Not complicated or interesting to read about just trash.
>>154125135Lowe's one of the only people I'd ever actually give shit to at a comic con or something, because he has open contempt for his own audience, and that's such a shitty and depressing business practice (I guess Brevoort counts here, but meh). Maybe Zeb Wells, for how bad his run was, but I kinda feel bad for the guy, he was obviously going through some shit, and he's already been run roughshod, so that stinks.I guess the only other person I'd actually be mad at is Ken Penders.Any writer or editor who destroys shit people love for their own narcissism sucks.
>>154125117You’re just an online nerd raging about a storyline for no reason two decades later and incapable of enjoying anything Spider-man related simply because it hurt your feelings to read a bad story so long ago that there has been an entire generation of people who have grown up since than can in just two years drink legally. This is like still crying about House of M or Avengers Disassembled. You’re fucking obsessed
>>154121976>She's the second or third most popular romantic prospect for Peter, what do you mean? She's orders of magnitude more popular than Carlie, Cindy, Shay or whoever else Peter has been with over the years.You're sort of missing the point here. Comic readers know Felicia. Comic readers like Felicia. But MJ is like the Lois Lane of Spider-man. She's the one casuals know. She's the one people who only know the basics of Spidey know. People who don't know who Jean DeWolfe is but know who MJ is.
>>154125240>raging about a storyline for no reason>for no reason
>>154125240The generation that grew up during that time don't read spiderman nor want too.The online nerds are the only ones who still give a fuck.And let me ask you something. Be serious.Which recent spiderman comic would you show to someone under the age of 18 to convince them to buy spiderman?
>>154125099>>154125240You're an nerdraging Marvel employee, I don't think you have the right to complain about nerds raging
>>154125253>The generation that grew up during that time don't read spiderman nor want too.And of the generation that grew up during that time, they're complaining as well. And the newest generation grew up with stuff like the Spider-Verse movies and the recent Ultimate Spider-Man, which had a married Peter.
>>154125135It’s a sign of how toxic and bitchy the fandom is when it now treats any plot development as a personal slight. Seriously, so May and Ben have a biological son. So what? Nothing about this should that controversial yet multiple people ITT keep bringing up OMD and their baggage of petty grievances as a reason to be mad. WTF are you reading anything at this point if this is how you act like?
>>154125334>It’s a sign of how toxic and bitchy the fandom is when it now treats any plot development as a personal slight.Marvel has no one to blame but themselves for causing this.
>>154125253Basically any random Spider-man comic.
>>154125350Or maybe fanboys are immature manchildren who need to grow up and start acting like adults
>>154124141>>154124258>>154124452>Most of us don't self insertI just don't believe that's true. >>154124255There is nothing sadder than watching you people make fanfic about bad books and then accuse everyone who disagrees with you *even slightly* of being a marvel intern. It's so fundamentally illiterate about how the industry works, their incentives, how many people are actually here/how influential this site is. Nobody is paying someone with English this good to come argue with a hundred people who hate their product.
>>154102809Marvel editorial still believes that any publicity is good publicity and that outrage sells comics.Peter's story is just unsalvageable at this point. Killing him off permanently and letting Miles be the only Spider-Man around would be preferable to what they're doing with him. Either that or a complete reboot of the entire universe, erase everything since Civil War.
>>154125406Both can be true.
>>154124141I do agree with you the "Peter is a sad loser who can't win" era is very played out. Like, let a nyugga get some bass in his voice again, like when he used to talk real shit to people like the X-Men and then backed it up.
>>154125410Peter is just fine, you’re being a hyperbolic drama queen
>>154125429So we should do Superior Spider-Man again?
>>154125409It's even sadder to watch someone like you try in vain to prove you're not a Marvel employee that just happens to write in the same condescension and the same tired talking points Marvel has been using since the 2000s whenever they lose control of an argument
>>154125409>It's so fundamentally illiterate about how the industry works, their incentives, how many people are actually here/how influential this site is.Doesn't change how stupid almost everything about Spider-Man's mainline comics have been over the past 2 decades
>>154125441When everyone who doesn’t agree with your misery circlejerk is “a Marvel employee” it’s time to take a long and hard look at yourself in the mirror and ask yourself if it’s time you seek medical help
>>154125453Yawn, your aggressive gaslighting is getting limp, Marvel employee
>>154125453>>154125409>>154125334These posts were by Dan Slott, weren't they.
>>154125429Raimi's fault, unironically.
>>154125409>>Most of us don't self insert>>I just don't believe that's true.Mentally ill. You are defending usage of OCs right now.
>>154125432Every single piece of happiness getting undone, every victory invalidated by the next issue, every step forward denied is not "just fine".He keeps getting reset to a "broke, friendless loser who can't hold a job" after anything good happens to him, but why? What narrative purpose does that serve? Even if you tell me that that's just supposed to be his status quo, why build him up and then tear him apart later? Why is every supporting character being used for shock even when that runs against their characterization? It feels vindictive, it's offputting.
>>154125240>>154125334>>154125409Wow, Nick Lowe on 4chan at this hour!>>154125429Heroes need conflict, no doubt. "I always lose and I whimper under the fists of street-level Tombstone while my girlfriend fucks someone else, I support it, and everyone in my life hates me and I'm going to apologize to the villains and the fucking Green Goblin who murdered the other love of my life oh and also my 3rd romantic interest is hard gay" for 5+ years is absurd. Heroes need to actually win every once in a while. Stilt Man is more competent than Peter right now.
>>154125607Because don't ask questions, just consume ASM product and then get excited for next ASM products
>>154125493You can blame Raimi for Paul but not for Mephistowank.
>>154125607>He keeps getting reset to a "broke, friendless loser who can't hold a job" after anything good happens to him, but why? What narrative purpose does that serve? I'm pretty certain that the leadership or editorial who believes they know what Peter Parker should be have long lost their memory of the early days of Spider-Man, when the dude actually had agency, stood up for himself, and wasn't a limp-dicked loser. Literally every Spider-person has more confidence and agency than him right now. He's just sad. All the time. Lonely, broke, alone, loses every fight, doesn't get the girl, and some people just fall into the "you're a self-inserting incel" dialogue if we don't enjoy constantly reading that.There's no character in comics that I'm aware of who has been turned into such a complete loser over the past decade or two, and knowing that the writers and editorial lost their wives or relationships IRL makes the shitty writing even worse for everyone else.
>>154125607Hey remember when Peter was briefly rich CEO and all you fucks did was whine about it?
>>154125626I can’t believe people are still crying about this comic. It’s so sad that you think that is some unforgivable moment in a Spider-man comic
>>154125099If the past 20 years have amounted to anything this might not have been a problem. Instead they want us to get over MJ while they constantly tease MJ.
>>154125756The 60-80s Spider-men didn’t amount to anything. The 90-00s didn’t either. You’re spitting out nonsense after nonsense out of sheer butthurt
>>154125708I was here for that, and we barely complained. It didn't seem like it made a ton of sense, but... whatever. Peter spent a year or so completely dead, which sucked. Parker Industries is part of what you're whining you think fans presumably want, a powerwank self-insert fantasy. You're just as incapable of understanding what most Spider-fans want as editorial is. Spidey doesn't have to be Superman. Peter having a relatively reliable source of income from time to time, maybe the loves of his life not fucking other people on panel every time they show up, not making his new (and only) best friend the one person who killed the first of his life, and maybe occasionally winning a *significant* fight isn't too much to ask.
>>154125689Misery porn is only worth it if it leads to the character growing and overcoming those obstacles
>>154106755Literally just ignore it. Back in the day it'd just be relegated to some cracked.com article, trying to fix Goblin'd just shows how it does more harm than good.
>>154125775Now yer just full of shit
>>154125747No one would "cry" about it if Peter had literally ever come back and done anything significant, besides getting beaten up, given a metaphorical blowjob to MJ's new boyfriend at every fucking opportunity, and losing at every turn.We've had two years since Wells' run, and while I don't hate everything Kelly is doing, outside of a quick battle in space and maybe fucking a yellow space lady, Peter's lost everything in his life, feels powerless, has no money, and everyone hates him. Again.
>>154125777>Peter having a relatively reliable source of income from time to timeThat is currently happening >maybe the loves of his life not fucking other people on panel every time they show upYour cuck fantasies are twisting your entire reality I see. MJ isn’t your real life ex-girlfriend, get over it. They broke up.>not making his new (and only) best friend the one person who killed the first of his lifePeter’s relationship with Norman is one of the best things the book has done in years. >and maybe occasionally winning a *significant* fight isn't too much to ask.He does that constantly.You’re literally making shit up to be angry about.
>>154125858>and done anything significantWhat the fuck does this even mean
>>154125708Hey remember when it didn't feel earned because Ock mostly set much of Parker Industries himself, and Marvel told Slott to skip the development because they were gonna relaunch everything after Secret Wars and jump months ahead?
>>154125747I can't believe you're still crying over people complaining about the comic, Dan
>>154125856What did Peter amount to between the 60s and 80s? He graduated from high school? Dropped out of college? Accidentally got an alien symbiotic suit when he was kidnapped? Drive Debra almost insane? What about the next twenty years? Get replaced by a clone? Out of nowhere got married I guess but that was not organic or built up, they fucking rushed it because Stan Lee wanted to do it in the newspaper strip. He lost his baby. For a time thought MJ was dead. Worked as a bartender briefly. Tried to go back to college and onxe again fucked that up. Published a photo book and that didn’t lead to anything really outside of iirc short media tour and people critiquing that the photos were awkwardly composed due to how he basically takes them by jumping in front of the automatic camera as Spider-man. Got his parents back only to discover they weren’t real and got owned by Harry. Almost destroyed his marriage during the edgy 90s years. What amazing accomplishments.
>>154102809>>154106697>>154108789>>154124402Cap this. Before 2030 Maryjane wil be dating Mac.
>>154125924Which was a sign of how Peter consistently fucks up and can’t commit to anything. He didn’t even manage to get his degree without Otto! It’s odd you complain about Peter not earning it when his whole character is about not being able to do stuff because he’s too devoted devotes all his time being a hero. It literally defines the character.
>>154125889>That is currently happeningCool, another person on the internet who doesn't read the comics! I'm sure TikTok's treating you well, since you can't even fucking read a storytime here. His job is gone thanks to his clone (Ben Reilly) deciding to fuck his "old best friend" up and turning them into a complete villain. >our cuck fantasies are twisting your entire reality I see. MJ isn’t your real life ex-girlfriend, get over it. They broke up.If they broke up, why not just have her move to fucking LA, London, or some other shit to keep her out of Peter's orbit? Does Betty Brant, Liz Allan, or Carlie Cooper (and more) appear in multiple books every other week with their boyfriend/husband/whatever? Do we need them on multiple covers every month? Do they get a 60th anniversary issue? MJ could have been out of the book after OMD, but they keep pressing it.>Peter’s relationship with Norman is one of the best things the book has done in years.This is the dumbest shit I've maybe ever read. Peter should have a significant, permanent disdain for Norman.>He does that constantly.He hasn't and doesn't. Someone else has been winning fights for him for years now.>>154125897>What the fuck does this even meanBeat a real villain. Get a job. Fucking anything. Not get trashed by his lesbian ex who dropped him for another girl immediately after he lost the love of his life to the first guy with a penis she met. Complicated, I know.
>>154126049> Beat a real villain. Does that constantly >Get a job. He has a jobZ>Fucking anything. No I will keep refusing to acknowledge facts‘Kay bye
Has Jameson ever been Spider-Man? They should have Jameson do a stint as Spider-Man.
>>154125970>>154125989>>154126190Hi Dan!
>>154126049>He got fired!He was suspended, not fired, so clearly you don’t read comics. He has a job and income. And currently he’s dealing with Ben fucking him over. Standard stuff.>Why doesn’t MJ move elsewhereShe did and then came back. There is no problem here.>He should hate NormanHe did hate him and has slowly and begrudgingly started to respect him now that he’s time and time again seen Norman try his damnest to redeem himself. Peters isn’t petty.>He doesn’t defeat villains in fights! He doesn’t!He does. All you’re proving here is that you’re so up your own ass and unhinged hate for Spider-man comics over one bad storyline that’s older than your car and you’re just lying and whining about nothing
I want my heroes to be heroes.Not punching bags and morally evil trash in brightly colored longjohns.You win.You have your demoralization tool to use on fucking losers who will never amount to anything anyway.Have fun with your dead character.
>>154126501If that guy is Dan Slott or someone from Marvel, then they still didn't really win given how much more complaining about Marvel has been popping up all over
>>154126501How is Spider-man not a hero?
>>154102809>Why are Marvel like this?
After looking at those posts by that guy defending ASM by attacking fans, I think I see why Marvel dropped the minimum issue guarantee down to 5
>>154126190>Does that constantlyCool, name the last time he meaningfully beat anyone without help then. I root for the guy and off the top of my head, all I can think of in the past two years are not-Ronin and showing up for a cool moment at the end of Miles' book.>>154126262>He was suspended, not fired, so clearly you don’t read comics.Clearly you've never had a job. Also, Peter doesn't think he has a job anymore. Unless our newest random employer chick accepts Pete has a clone that sabotaged an entire project while he's been Spider-Man in space... he doesn't have a job. Also, Ben left a tuna sandwich in his radiator in his shitty apartment, or whatever.>She did and then came back. There is no problem here.Amazing Mary Jane isn't the point, and you're being obtuse if you think it counts. They were back in a relationship in Spencer's run. Slott wrote her to be in love with him, still. If they wanted MJ gone, she should have completely left the book in 2007. No variant covers. No teasing their love, no "Jackpot," nothing. That was their chance to say adios and move on permanently. Instead, they didn't, and included MJ as his main love interest in... everything.>He did hate him and has slowly and begrudgingly started to respect him now that he’s time and time again seen Norman try his damnest to redeem himself. Peters isn’t petty.There shouldn't ever be anything Norman can do to redeem himself. Ever. He's the absolute worst person in Peter's life, and getting shot by a magic shotgun as a "redemption arc" is horrendously stupid. The best we can possibly do is having Peter stay out of whatever shit Norman's mixed himself up in, like Dark Reign. Being buddies that enjoy a coffee together is nonsense. Pete doesn't redeem people to that level, and is supposed to have a goddamned spine.>over one bad storyline that’s older than your carAt least this is tacitly untrue for one of my cars.>He does.Great use of examples.
>>154125987the best part is that it's so true
>>154126904>meaningfully beat What does meaningfully even mean? He beat Absorbing Man and Titania like two issues ago. Not “meaningful” enough for you because it didn’t take six issues? The made up standard for superhero not sucking is that he can’t ever have help from his supporting cast or do team-ups and has to spend twenty pages duking it out with a villain alone? You’re just making up reasons to complain and adding arbitrary rules to dismiss facts. Hell you yourself even admit there have been instances that you would consider acceptable, so what are you even doing here? Just nitpicking and whining for the sake of it because you still can’t accept a bad story took place 19 years ago? My God that’s sad.And yes, suspension is not the same as being fired or being unemployed. It is not bad that Peter’s secret identity causes trouble with his private life and job. We’re in the middle of a storyline about that, it can go either way but currently he has not been fired. It’s classic Spider-man storytelling. You are again wrong and just grasping at anything to complain.>I keep getting triggered because MJ and Peter aren’t together That’s your own personal problem. >There shouldn't ever be anything Norman can do to redeem himselfMaybe he can’t ever fully redeem himself. That doesn’t mean Peter can’t be supportive of Norman. You’re being petty and angry that Peter is a better person than you.
>>154127030>What does meaningfully even mean? He beat Absorbing Man and Titania like two issues ago. Not “meaningful” enough for you because it didn’t take six issues?Literally, no. That isn't meaningful enough. Just like Issue 13 where he beats someone from the Black Order in passing, there's absolutely no build up. No tension. Not only that, he only manages to do so thanks to a Technarch suit, then spends multiple issues lamenting how scared of Hellgate that he still is. Honestly, I don't hate Kelly's run, and for a moment he had me hopeful that Peter was going to look competent again... but then Death Spiral came around, the fallout from him being in space came around, and it feels like Pete regressed heavily. He's back to being an irresponsible manchild that MJ/Felicia/May is mad at. Soloing Titania and Absorbing Man with a couple of jokes was bad.Peter and MJ aren't together for reasons that make any kind of narrative sense. Norman isn't a good guy for any reason that makes narrative sense. The devil wanting someone's marriage for "reasons" and keeping an 80 year old woman alive is dumb. Letting the most evil person in your life become your best buddy because he got blasted by a magic shotgun but maybe that wasn't the source of his evil and it went into your heart once or twice and maybe the evil was some kind of demon but also isn't and now whatever, you're pals, is bad writing.
Slott pls
>>154125240>This is like still crying about House of M or Avengers DisassembledThese got undone thoughever
>>154127110>That isn't meaningful enough.According to you. Who just made up this bullshit rule you pulled out of your own ass. It’s laughable
>>154127162What's laughable is you thinking that he's the only one who thinks it isn't meaningful enough
So is it Slott or Lowe who's in the thread doing petty-ass bitch-mode arguments against fans?
>>154102809This isboring?This is boring.
>>154127192Lowe doesn't give a shit, he's completely tapped out and doesn't even proofread or check the hair-colours of characters for what makes print anymore.Slott however, he is still getting into shitfights on CBR. It's very possibly Slott, or just some bored anon doing a Slott for amusement. What else is there to discuss? We're strapped into a telenovela plot for #1000.
>>154102809When does he fight Doctor Octopus?
>>154127178We’ve gone from “Peter isn’t allowed to do anything significant” to “I meant he doesn’t beat any real villains” to “no I mean it’s not MEANINGFUL when he beats real villains!”The goal post keeps moving every post as som entirely inane new rule is invented to justify why the butthurt claims aren’t wrong. Quite amazing.
>>154127240>The goal post keeps moving every post as som entirely inane new rule is invented to justify why the butthurt claims aren’t wrong. But that's exactly what you've been doing this entire thread.
>>154127192I've felt like 4chan has been irrelevant since the hack, and no one of relevance would show up here again, but it legitimately feels like an actual writer or editor is in here complaining we don't like it. I'd love to know who. They seem coherent enough not to be a total shitposter, but defensive enough that their own work is under attack.
>>154127311That's why I didn't think it was a regular shitposter. It reads more like someone in the industry trying in vain to pretend to be a shitposter so he can attack without it getting back to him
>>154127311Or maybe you’re just really stupid to think that the only people who could disagree with your stupid complaints has to be the writer or editor
>>154127342Yeah, maybe I was giving you too much credit in the first place. Your desire to shovel more shit writing and plotlines into your mouth should have been a strong hint.>>154127328Maybe we were too optimistic.
>>154127380No, it's the same tactic that that one account believed to be Slott's sockpuppet account was doing on CBR. He's trying to gaslight his way out
>>154102809Very interesting how you have 250+ posts and not a single good argument explaining why this is supposed to be bad. Just endless repetition of the same old tiresome talking points by people who claim to love Spider-man but hate every single Spider-man comic published in the past 19 years because they never could get over One More Day.
Not even replying.Not buying.Chuddha just smirks at a sinking ship, and its deserving captain and crew.
>>154127393I really don't give a fuck about whether Winderbaum and Bendis sell Miles Morales to MCU Mephisto or not. Get this argument out of here.
>>154127423Yet you felt the urge to comment and boast.
>>154127393There are many good arguments but you keep ignoring them like the marvel employee that you are.
>post yfw saving your money for another decade
>>154126049Betty and Liz are going to be in a story that spoofs All-New Venom where there is an All-New Axe of Violence who is more violent vigilante and less reincarnation in service of Satannish and it is assumed the new host has Elizabeth as her name. Then it turns out to be a man with a middle name of Elijah or Elizandro who takes a woman's form when active.
>>154105537With input from Harry Osborn.
>>154106027>>154106146Mays death was one of the best spider-man stories I ever read.
Was there an instance of Aunt Maybelle being an alias for Aunt May earlier than Amazing Spider-Man #-1 (May, 1997)? Tom DeFalco's May Parker was established in Amazing Spider-Man #418(October, 1996). If there's none, then I'd just refer to the aunt as Aunt Maybelle.
Because its probably a ruse, they tease a new villain with history changing powers. It could be a big nothing.
>>154128258Don't worry Peter Palmer is on the case.
>>154127549I spend my money on Peter/Fel/MJ throuple comms or some combination of them together
>>154129103We’ve been saying that for the last 5 lives and it never happens. Spider-Man/Peter Parker is too mainstream for Marvel/Disney to ever let that happen.
>>154129132The X-Men are mainstream as fuck and they had a dozen couples becoming throuples including some of the O5
>>154129361They backpedaled hard on Logan/Scott/Jean. Tom Brevoort even said "If it didn't happen on panel then it didn't happen" even though it did happen on panel (in Wolverine). This was just something Hickman was allowed to do because he's the biggest name they have.
>>154125987>Before 2030 Maryjane wil be dating Mac.Mac Gargan? Why?
>>154128304Really? Ben and May having a kid that grew up evil because he didn't have May and Ben teaching him good morals while Peter did is absolutely something that comics would do. Superman minus kents and all that.
>>154129502>They backpedaled hard on Logan/Scott/Jean.Never miss the opportunity to remind an X-Men fan that Cyclops and Wolverine were having gay sex on the Moon.
>>154103966Oh knowing them them they wil make that peter's is norman's son and that may had a affair with him and she hid the fact the fact from peter.Alas Sins Past 2 the sins of peter's aunt.
>>154129536And Marvel is acting cowardly for not keeping it up
>>154129132^last 5 years
>>154105469>>154105537>>154127980Somehow Mysterio and the Jackal will have a say
>>154129741such as what?>Mysterio: Me and Jackal had sex with each other alas we are gay.>fans fown and do a facepalm and then dump their collection od spider-man comics in the trash.
>>154129866>Mysterio pays a struggling actor to play Aunt May's and Uncle Ben's secret son
>>154129531Peter grew up with Ben and Peter still chose the evil option, then his Uncle Ben paid the price. May and Ben were not magical sages dispersing esoteric wisdom of responsibility and goodness.Ben never told him "WITH GREAT POWER MUST ALSO COME GREAT RESPONSIBILTY." Peter had to learn the lesson on his own after his uncle paid the price. Like the rest of us, Peter Parker is a piece of shit who made selfish decisions, he is not the moral center of the Marvel, or any, universe. "Power and Responsibility" wasn't passed down through recitation; it was carved into Peters bones because of his own mistakes and failure.
>>154130320And still felt regret about his actions. If he was like half the people he fights, he would have found a way to profit off Uncle Ben's death financially, and failing that rob a bank.
>>154130596His regret and guilt was spawned out of the that infamous panel posted above.
>>154130954So you admit it that Peter Parker was shaped by his enviornment.
>>154129536>Cyclops and Wolverine were having gay sex on the Moon.What..i though they were sharing jean
>>154130985No.
>>154130996Wolverine as a lover boy was always weird. him being a gay lover boy is weird and stupid. Just another reason to hate the Xmen and Marvel
>>154102809Why is this in a superhero comic?
>>154131353Why isn't it? Marvel hit fame exactly because they were the first to throw soap opera into comics and people loved itMiscarried baby that's still alive is just that. Only reason people are upset is that it's for Aunt May and not baby May.
>>154131557There's drama, there's soap opera and then there is dumb telenovela that isn't even fucking original to Spider-Man because we already went through Theresa which is already being back-pedalled.This is the House of Lowe, nothing ever happens.
>>154130996Hickman couldn't be explicit about it but he hinted as loudly as he could that Wolverine was topping them both.
>>154131557>they were the first to throw soap opera into comics and people loved itThat didn't happen at all.
>>154131724And Hickman possibly got this notion in his head from that Youngblood comic Millar and Liefeld did over 20 years ago.
>>154131724This means Emma and Jean and Scott were fucking too
>>154131776Emma wasn't involved, at least as far as Duggan was concerned, who had her griping about being one of the few celibate people on the island.
>>154131865
>>154103926Vulture is bens pet parrot thats been evolved into a manIve heard they can live up to 70 years
>>154132346>It's a HE episode
Yeah, whatever
>>154129898>Quinton, it's been done..>Anything Norman can do, I can do better. >Quinton, you're not a director! >I am now~
So the movie guy was named Quentin before there was Quentin Tarantino?
>>154133182We are not meming Mysterio into being a footfag.
>>154133380He's a hypnofag.Exactly how many times did he have MJ on the therapy couch for that Sins Past retcon?
>>154102809The only time people pay attention to these shitty, unfun comics is when they fuck something up so bad that people post about it. Stop reading this trash, stop talking about this trash. I swear there are zero organic eyes on this garbage - even the complainers are sockpuppets trying to drum up scraps of attention in one of the few communities that still even bothers with western comics. Just let them die.
>>154133458It is pleasant, when the sea is high and the winds are dashing the waves about, to watch from the shores the struggles of a decrepit Spider-Office.They get no money from it, their engagement means nothing in a world where the entire floppy is a click away for free, the only reason to pay is love and they don't have that. All they have is the IP, aging speculators and spite - and it makes them really fun to laugh at. Stop being emotionally invested in this decades dreck and it becomes fun as well brother.
>>154102809Because you're still reading and caring about it.
>>154134615But I'm not buying it
>>154134659Doesn't matter. You're still engaging with it.
>>154134671Brevoort pls, that doesn't equal money or profits anymore.Otherwise Morbius would have been a cinematic juggernaut.
>>154134734I feel like the "Marvel is still winning because they still get engagement" is some kind of copium at this pointIt worked back in the 00s and early 10s when they could brag about their sales, but now everyone is aware that things are getting worse at Marvel and their shills and other employees are obviously having crashouts online
>>154134952Also, y'know, the Absolute line and DC eating their market share. Turns out the secret to getting new people into comics isn't gimmicks and ragebait.
>>154125708I remember how the same people attacking people for not liking Peter being a rich CEO were also the ones defending OMD status quos
>>154134734>>154134952Attention is advertising. If you abandon it entirely, don't follow along, don't talk about it at all, then Marvel loses.
>>154135298"All publicity is good publicity" is only good up to a point. As we've seen in the past decade it could eventually backfire badly, and affect future things. People have a tepid reaction to ASM #1000 because of all the "publicity" Zeb Wells' ASM (and subsequently Ewing Venom) got and how it allowed people outside of the usual sphere to get that the problem is editorial
>>154125775>>154125970Anyone else here ever notice this tactic Marvel likes to do?Fan: This current shit is badMarvel employee/shill: Oh yeah? Everything old is also as bad!It seems like a weak argument for modern comics to rely on cliche crutches
>>154134734>>154135298I'm starting to think "attention is advertising" was heavily pushed by people who want to pay employees in "exposure"
>>154136334Do you have reading comprehension problems?
>>154134671but I'm not buying it.
>>154139757Yes, I have a problem with comprehending your badly-written posts
>>154127226ableist scum
>>154126049Black Cat's got a nice pair~
>>154135381If 'bad publicity is still publicity' was right then Star Wars shouldn't have stinkers like Solo or Mandalorian and Grogu after all the publicity that the sequel trilogy stirred up
>>154139780That's besides the point. The fact that you're engaging and driving discussion about it on social media is what matters.
I am not going to make a storytime for this I will just do here it seems rather appropriate all things considered. Just to be clear you are going to hate OMD much MORE and especially MJ after readinng this book. from your good "friends" from marvel editoral hahaha
>>154144946don't know why anyone would be upset. is it the baby thing?
>>154145036f you knew anything about spider-man you would know this leads to aunt may getting shot later and then mephisto showing up offering to save he life in exchange for peter's and MJ marriage.
>>154103606So... MJ + Cormac?
>>154144962Isn't Ringer de...>>154144974I see. Carry on.
And this ends this great storytime see it REALLY is all MJ fault had it not been for her peter NEVER would Unmasked himself to the public and thus aunt may never would gotten shot. And thus he would never agreed to do the deal with mephisto and the marriage would still be there. Thus MJ is the one responsable and to blame for all that and that's why I hateher along with many other to the core. And that's why I wish peter would be with Gwen instead in the end it turns she really is the better girl for Peter.>>154145116>>154145097
>have a broken ass power>be a common flunkieHydro-Man is one of those good thing he's dumb characters.
>>154145452It's weird feeling like the only sane Spider-Man fan when most are retards like this
>>154137718I don't know if that's true or not, but you have to cut your losses regardless. Why continue to give them attention?>>154143168Those still made hundreds of millions. They should make nothing, but there will always be retards. Your best bet is to stop trying to make more retards aware of them. It's mostly inevitable, but you lose nothing in abandoning this sinking ship. >>154139780But you're advertising for them.
>>154145084>I've had an amazing life.>I'm thankful for it.>so, when my time comes, I'm at peace with it.Well, there you go Peter. You went over Mays explicit wishes at the expense of your soul and possibly the worlds fate.
>>154145864>Those still made hundreds of millions.Which doesn't mean much when they also spent hundreds of millions, part of which is on marketing. Seriously do you not understand how a lot of this works
>>154145042"Because criminals will go after my loved ones" seems to be the main reason for secret identities for heroes, but how often do villains get their loved ones targeted to strike at them?
>>154146853Peter has had several of his enemies go after his family even before the reveal
>>154146597You're right.But you're also forgetting the fact that it poisoned the IP and by extension the brand trust of Disney.It isn't just about making a few pennies at the box office. It's about the brand and merch sales.THEY FUCKED IT. It's less then worthless now.
>>154146950and in 50 days Disney is going to make a billion dollars from the latest movie
>>154147030k...
>>154145802Really anon use your head now anon. it's pretty clear things would have turned out quite differently for peter had Gwen lived and they remained with each other. Oh granted their is that issue that he hid the fact that he was spider-man from here and that she blamed spider-man for her father's death. But I am quite sure they would have resovled those issues between each other given the chance. The what if story made that quite. Yeah pretty sure they would have gotten a happy ending eventually
>>154146853Heroes don't do that because well, they're heroes. But yes, sometimes villains will go after each others' families.
>>154147376She'd believe that Peter Parker/Spider-Man is cruel and just treating her as a plaything when he comes out to her. Then she would get superpowers from Dr. Jonas Harrow try to avenge her father with Peter's blood.
>>154147485irrelevant and bullshit they would worked things out between each other had they gotten the chance and Gwen gaining superpowers was never the plan. And again MJ is the one to blame for the marriage being gone they make that quite clear here her tears say it all. She knew perfectly well what would happen if peter were to unmask himself to the public. People oftten see mephisto as the villian of OMD and blame him for the marriage being gone but this where they are wrong the real villian is none other then MJ herself.>>154145116
>>154147030Which latest movie?
>May dies, Ben Jr. hates Peter for letting it happen and pushes him away forever>Ben Jr. dies and May finds out that Peter's Spidey, pushing him away forever>They both they and Peter is now completely aloneWhatever makes Peter suffer the most, because that's all they know how to write for Spider-Man. I was supposed the warrior alien was alive and slumming it on Peter's couch, because I figured they kill her before he could fuck her.
>>154107503Every "fix" just makes shit worse because everyone involved on the creative side hates peter & is an idiot so yeah the best fix would be for everyone to ignore it & never mention it again
>>154147821I want MJ shelved after QIB for as long as it takes for a new regime to come in and basically summon an unPauled MJ from the ether. Just explain the weird homunculus MJ we've since since Superiors was unable to tell anything was wrong with Peter, and then left to work for Tony because superhero shenanigans were too much for her.She's a different character, look at how they massacred my girl.
>>154147930instead of rehashing Paul shit for another decade how about just not referencing it and sweeping it under the rug like a normal person it's a bad run. there's no reason to make it seminal in its influence
>>154146853Most criminals don't really do the family. I think it has happened to Fisk a couple of times. Hood was nervous about people finding out he had a wife, IIRC.
>>154107551>for decades nowHow many decades?
>>154147376Considering one of the reasons Conway killed Gwen was to avoid their relationship progressing and that the main issue Marvel writers and editors seem to have, even back in the 70s and 80s, is the idea of a marriage, no, I seriously doubt there was happy ending on the way.Instead, you would be shitposting about how Peter show have stayed with Betty because they've ruined Gwen or some dumb shit like that.
>>154147974Pretending the entire previous fucking run and its still ongoing consequences didn't happen is a lot different than Sins Past. A panel still haunts Hank Pym and you think an entire runs worth of character assassination won't be hanging over MJ?This was years. Years of baiting the audience, promising them dramatic catharsis or at least a return on the misery porn and now they are just trying to hide the rotted corpse under the drapes?
>>154102809Wiping the floor is subjective, Marvel is killing DC in ad revenue.
>>154107594Humillation ritualImagine reading thisYou people are sick
>>154148221It's just bile fascination, Marvel doesn't see a cent from me shitposting on storytimes. It only hurts if you actually expect anything, this has been funny for a long while.
>>154147376If you think a woman is going to be forgiving after finding out that her boyfriend was responsible for her father's death and then preceded to lie-through-omission about his involvement all the while being with her romantically and not once ever explaining his side of it, then you don't understand them. A lot of Peter/Gwenshipping comes with a massive dose of wishful thinking. That relationship was over, he just didn't know it yet.
>>154148162yeah and for years Peter and MJ were having a baby and now nothing
>>154148140That's where you are wrong Conway was the only one who wanterd Gwen to be kllled off stan lee was very much against it. Also marvel was a very different place back in 70s and 80s would Peter's and Gwen marriage managed to survive had it gotten the chance? you can bet your ass it would have the only thing would have changed were the settings od the stories would spider-man have ended much quicker therfore? yeah most likely it would have but I for one would have preferred it ended that way and more quicker as do many others.
>>154148384Stan Lee was against it because he was all-in on "illusion of change." Spider-Man was never going to be married because that would conflict with whatever cartoon or tv show was running at the time.
>>154146597It doesn't matter how much they spent when they should have made NO money.
>>154148256Yeah well guess what the what if story implied that's exactly what would happened had Gwen lived. So you can just shove your bullshit/retarrded ideas/ thories straight up your fucking ass. their is as reason those stories are called what if for a reason dumbass that being said i bid you good day.
>>154148427You are wrong Peter And Gwen woud have been married to each other sooner or later. I tell you right now peter's life would have better had he married her instead of MJ.
>>154148573Personally, I'm a Deb Whitman truther. She was the one for Pete, but editorial fucked her over.
>>154148659Peter was a jerk to her.
>>154123333Name two big heroic, inspiring American-made characters created specifically after 2000 that will stand the test of time as beloved iconic heroes that will be remembered and emulated for generations to come.
>>154148510That story glossed over the entire issue, it was poorly and unrealistically written. "Jenny Blake" Isabella was always a shit writer.
>>154148837bear in mind this saying >real life is stranger than fictionMy point is this who is stay something like that would not be made to 616 canon for real.
>>154148688It's called negging.
>>154148708None. Invincible will never last as long as Batman has. I wish Ditko gave his opinions on MJ and Peter.
>>154149562I doubt Ditko cared that much about what happened after he left. MJ wasn't even a character while he was on ASM.
>>154103326>Because Marvel doesn’t care because they know Disney will bail them out no matter what.Disney doesn't like a branch that bleeds money either. Right now, Disney is making moves to align Marvel Comics more closely with the rest of the company. That's why they recently assigned a new head to the entire branch. The folks currently running the comics should be afraid. They are replaceable.
>>154150548>The folks currently running the comics should be afraid. They are replaceable.and yet they did nothing to replace the problem makers that fans have been crying about for years only that one guy that kept trying to push for more collected editions and some redundancies
>>154106755complete universal reset in a big event
>>154150643>and yet they did nothing to replace the problem makers that fans have been crying about for yearsDisney doesn't care about that. They care about the numbers and DC is currently pummeling Marvel Comics in that aspect. That's why they put Brad Winderbaum in charge and there will be more changes later.
>>154151265>WinderbaumOy vey
I think I've figured out how to bring Mayday to 616 while keeping to Marvel's concept of Peter Parker as a pathetic loser that everyone hates. Peter gets MJ pregnant and then bails and refuses to acknowledge his daughter even after she gets her spider powers. He never pays child support and when baby May is at his aunt's house, he just turns around and leaves.
>>154108248Be ready for Slott to asspull another Spider-Verse event to coincide with the conclusion of Miles' movies.
>>154152404Miles is forever an industry plant with a forever asspull writer considering the discrepancies between his family background and the comics counterpart.
fuck marvel
>>154151265>Brad WinderbaumThat's not going to be anything but a disaster. Worst case scenario, you get Peter/MJ back, but it's Zendaya MJ.
>>154152404Be ready for Slott to pull his ass when he tries to stand up, leaving him incapacitated and bedridden due to how fat he is.
>>154148573Hey fags I got the Gwenschizo right here. Fuck this faggot. Bitch couldn't even keep her neck safe, how the fuck is she gonna give Pete some head?
>>154144946>implying you have the power to influence othersNgmi. First you gotta acknowledge that you're gay. Second you gotta learn English, and third, you gotta be able to lift 10 lbs. Otherwise you're not even a male much less someone to listen to.
B4 thread 404's I'd also like to say that there is irrefutable proof that Gwenschizo was raped and that proof is how this schizo behaves. Only the raped would stoop so low. Low enough to editorial's level.
>>154102809Mephisto on speedial...
>>154148659Deb? Really? All Peter did was drive her borderline mad by being such a shitty boyfriend
>>154155714I have a thing for women who are operating on the precipice of a mental breakdown.
>>154108000Who the fuck are half of these characters?
>>154156590It was kind of funny she was in the cartoon. I don't think she was even super relevant a character at the time
>>154102809I was hopeful for Kelly run but this shit has soured me completely. Spider-Office needs to go
>>154156733She wasn't at that time; her last appearance in the comics was like in the early 80s and she didn't appear again in the comics till Civil War. The 90s cartoon did way more with her
>>154109501Brevoort is that you?
>>154145097>My cloneThey won't even let him say Ben's name...
>>154156733She's a prominent-ish character from the post-grad college era. It's not completely unreasonable for her to be used considering that's the era they were adapting
>>154106577TBF, nobody read ASMF. It was a mid anthology during a shit time in the franchise. Nobody was lining up to read stories about Aunt May and Spider-Girl and... Jackpot or whoever.Other topic, has the Lubensky clone shown up since the Slott run ended?
>>154157519Cloning Nathan Lubensky is so stupid. Man, that story fucking sucked.
>>154157519I liked JMD's story about Harry coming back
