>now
Spider-Man has been webbing up males since his debut. When are you going to quit lying to yourself OP?

The comics went to shit in the 2000s with Civil War. And have only kept getting worse.

File: marcus_by_zazzers_dl9cvy6(...).jpg (153 KB, 827x1104)

153 KB JPG

>>154170087
This has been a problem for ages. I'm not one of those people who thinks comics have all been bad since the 90's or anything. But the poor writing quality has been prevalent for long enough that it isn't noteworthy anymore.

>>154170087
I read something a while back that talked about how editors now don't really take the time to teach new writers, artists, and editors about the craft of comics, so even the good ones don't understand the basics of what does and doesn't work and why. There's no development of talent anymore. I have no idea how true that is, but it feels plausible.

Because comic book fans want bad comics to complain about.

>>154170663
Complaining about bad comics is poison. This animosity towards all of the ruined demoralization tainted media we enjoy is destroying media in the west.

That animosity is supposed to be focused on villains stories that upset and make us want to talk about them. Not just being angry at the story itself.
The difference between rage baiting the audience through being terrible and enraging the audience through a well crafted story is like night and day.

>>154170087
This video sucks ass, legit definition of smart sounding idiot

>>154170087
Bad editorial, even good writers and artists put out mediocre work when they're with Marvel. They need to stop hiring from within the disney corporate structure and actually hire comic book people.

>>154170704
>Complaining about bad comics is poison.
So is alcohol and there are still people who can't stop drinking it.

>>154170710
Marvel employee spotted

>>154170767
Most every member of editorial people complain about were around pre disney and are comic book people, they just fucking suck at their job

File: 1780796365639356.png (687 KB, 642x650)

687 KB PNG

>>154170087
Aside from this whole culture war shift and questionable genderfluid "people" invading the industry... the main problem of comics (or at least flagship series) is their incredibly long duration, second only to books maybe. Still, books managed to keep a single author and that helps with consistency, but mainstream comics can't because they are commercial for the most and perpetual.

Even the best writer will run out of ideas, and also the same characters changing hands and team so many times in 100 years will end up changing for the best or the worst.

>>154170087
They should hire me. I have an awesome idea where a chubby glasses wearing 30 year old man has sex with all the young nubile superheroines in alphabetical order. At the end of every issue a different superhero comes in and high fives him.

>>154170767
>They need to stop hiring from within the disney corporate structure and actually hire comic book people.

Are you fucking high, Marvel has not been hiring from within Disney until this year (to replace two people who've been at Marvel for decades)
Marvel has been allowed to act as its own entity during the 2010s because Ike made that deal with Disney. As far as I know all the people who were in charge at Marvel up to this year were people who've been at Marvel pre-Disney or were hired directly by Marvel instead of Disney. Did you get your info from fuckin Youtube grifter rageslop or something?

>>154170219
>The comics went to shit in the 2000s with Civil War.
*with Avengers Disassembled

>>154170663
Surprisingly the only part in that video that would count toward that would be about the Rogue miniseries and that really has more to do with storytelling problems. He also doesn't blame the creators for this, citing an article quoting some creators who got overworked and underpaid

The other complaints he has in that video include:
>Poor planning with constant unnecessary relaunches and event tie-ins colliding
>Marvel's inability to keep stuff in print

>>154170087
Why can’t you speak English?

>>154171097
The BND clique has been so fucking badly circlejerking to the point of blood we are relying on goddamn Disney to save us from the Brevoort/Lowe nightmare.
New blood. I don’t care where it’s sourced or scraped from. New blood and a change of fucking course from this goddawful status quo some embittered gen x’ers have set.

>now
try decades

Marvel's problems doesn't date from yesterday. Even in the 70, Starlin was not impressed by Stan Lee's editorial decisions.

File: 50785823.jpg (1.01 MB, 1876x2026)

1.01 MB JPG

>>154170087
catnip thread for maryWh0refags

>>154170087
>now

>>154170087
Absolute mogs them all day.

File: She-hulk.jpg (183 KB, 585x900)

183 KB JPG

If 2026 comics are bad, what do you call comics that came out between 2014 and 2025?

>>154170663
that's true of /co/ (and seemingly how most boards are with their respective topics) but I don't know if it applies to the majority

>>154170087
>now

>>154171964
Identical.

>>154170087
The Crossing and The Clone Saga are where it started.

Bendis exacerbated shit with Disassembled, House of M and the weird axes he had to grind against Wanda and character assassinations via his apathy / disregard for continuity and established characterizations.

There is also all of Marvel Editorial being Gen Xers and acolytes of Joe Quesada with the YOUNGEST being Nick Lowe (who is, I shit you not, in his fucking 40s).

They are all in a circlejerking bubble of nostalgia over the Silver Age (hence the obsession over Gwen Stacy and Peter Parker being broke, constantly having shitty luck and the gaslighting campaign of Spider-Man being about "youth" instead or "responsibility")

Gail Simone also stated that most men in the office have had bad romantic relationships that ended in bad break-ups, infidelity and/or messy divorces (Quesada, Wells, Morrison), are married but hate their wives (Brevoort, Lowe) and are stuck in mid-life crises (this would also explain the weirdness of Quesada wanting Spider-Man to date a fictionalized version of his daughter to not seem like "the bad guy" in her parents' split and why he thinks a literal pact with the Devil is 'less bad' than a normal divorce, regardless of how retarded it objectively is to any sane person).

Both Marvel and DC had their edgy eras in the 90s, OG Ultimate & The New 52 but Marvel guys are PATHOLOGICALLY obstinant and incapable of EVER admitting a mistake whereas DC course corrected after the "Truth" arc fucked everything for Superman sales and gendercidal, infanticidal rapist Amazons hurt WW sales/brand and was (admittedly sloppily) retconned with "everything is lies" but they TRIED to fix it.

Meanwhile after shilling Paul Rabin for the past 4 years as a "great guy" in a mix of ragebait and sincere belief when the stuff for Death Spiral came out Lowe tried spinning it as editorial internally ALWAYS seeing him as a Heel. 1/2

>>154170087
Kek do we all just have the same algorithm

>>154173133
2/2: However, he also let ASM #18 or 19 with the blurb about MJ and Paul Rabin being married go to The the 4 year time dilation / discrepancy was supposed to be the crux/eplanation of MJ's resentment and why she felt "abandoned" by Peter, right? Only after fans pointed out that MJ has always been 1 year younger than Peter so with the Rabinverse events that makes her 3 years old than him (and Cyclops since Brevoort says Peter and Scott are the same age), this apparently shook them as not in anything official but on twitter or bluesky or some shit, Lowe responded to a fan questioning this 'clarifying' that it only 'seemed/felt' like 4 years in the Rabinverse.

The Death Spiral bullshit also exacerbated things with the lame ass mystery box for if MJ or Venom turned Torment into street pizza and had her gaslight Peter regarding it over the phone.

The 'talk' also was unsatisfying as Peter was (once again) a spineless simp saying that she NEVER needs to apologize for ANYTHING to him and Venom went on to shit-talk Gwen to try redirecting his frustrations onto him, instead.

But that whole thing is a mess because they don't know what to do with MJ because they don't want to write her and Peter together but because she is so intrinsically tied to Spider-Man's brand, so they can't kill her off or write her out, so they just try making her a superhero but Jackpot flopped so hard neither Hasbro nor Funko Pop wanted to piss money and resource away on an obvious loss leader thanks to Paul contamination, hence the pivot to She-Venom / VenoMJ but they keep her a cunt to Eddie despite easily forgiving Venom for ASM #300, then there are the ad bloats, blind bags, blind covers and variant cover spam on top of endless events that stall, prolong arcs or otherwise burn out readers with frequent convoluted threads and tie-ins that alienate potential new readers, casuals as well as veteran readers.

>>154170087
Why you can't learn english

>>154171374
This.

>>154173234
hivemind strong! :D

>>154170246
for me, Marvel Comics takes granted they have room for improvement and they just don't take it
>>154170704
>That animosity is supposed to be focused on villains stories that upset and make us want to talk about them. Not just being angry at the story itself.
The difference between rage baiting the audience through being terrible and enraging the audience through a well crafted story is like night and day.
interesting
>>154170637
even if it's just plausible, you're already thinking better than the editors

>>154173341
ESL meet OP who is also an ESL.

>>154173133
>and why he thinks a literal pact with the Devil is 'less bad' than a normal divorce, regardless of how retarded it objectively is to any sane person

This is something that I've noticed, every time One More Day is explained in real life to a person who isn't into comics they immediately think something around the lines of "what the fuck is wrong with the people who support OMD, are they deranged?" I saw it with normie people I talked to, I saw the reactions to Rich Evans' description of it. Hell, Perch brought up the time he explained to his wife why he hated the OMD comic he just read and she thought OMD was fucking stupid.

Marvel got extremely lucky in that they had a lot of shills to go around gaslighting people back in the day and that even people working at Marvel were willing to get into fights online (ie Slott and Wacker on the CBR boards) plus distracting everyone by taking shots at DC (this mainly worked because Didio repeatedly fucked up on a regular basis) so a lot of the anti-OMD stuff died down for a while

Marvel has actually got a lot better over the last 18 months, the interior art has improved dramatically, and the variant covers are also a lot better

>>154175879
>and the variant covers are also a lot better
Fucking kek.

>>154175731
I mean yeah, any sane person would object to a superhero making a deal with the devil to save a octogenarian parent.

>>154175879
Doubt.jpg

>>154177130
That's why it just seemed odd Marvel and Disney didn't get enough shit for it. All the people who want to point to something Disney legitimately did wrong was letting Marvel keep OMD intact and the writers and editors getting into spats online about it

>>154170087
>now

>>154179045
Because comics are a niche hobby.
And OMD burned so many casuals who just picked up a spiderman comic for shits and gigs(the ones who stayed around after the still retarded unmasking thing) that no one gives a shit anymore.

Disney damned sure doesn't. But Sony and the writers for homecoming took that retarded shit and redeemed it with the last spiderman movie.
Now OMD is just this thing that essentially turned every spiderman comic after it into nothing. No one trusts any story or believes in anything happening.
There's no weight. No belief in any of it.
It's all like a bad fever dream that most are still waiting to be over.

There is no one who isn't on marvel's payroll who likes OMD and doesn't think it is the single stupidest most disasterous decision in the history of american comics.

Comics peaked in the 80s.

>>154170087
everything is bad now. don't single out comic books.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Pov0MKuyJfg&ra=m

File: jim shooter.jpg (41 KB, 163x201)

41 KB JPG

>>154179463
They should have never sacked Big Jim.

>>154170169
What?

>>154180281
It's a jeet with a shakey grasp of english.
You're going to see it a lot now.

>>154175731
In some ways the Wells run has been the OMD defenders worst nightmare. Everything they have done will be summarised by comic historians as the Paul era, whatever good they wrote just gets overshadowed by the lighting rod in the room that sucks out all oxygen.
Every single criticism of the post 2008 mandate amped up to a thousand on an arc that was broken at the most fundamental level, and they follow it up with a GOTG arc and now a secret relative plot... again.
There is nothing there, they have nothing left to say, the franchise has moved on and they have failed their desperate shrine to the Silver Age. The most popular and lucrative parts of the franchise are far removed from the comics and their infantile mandate that Spider-Man is about youth not responsibility.
We are all just waiting for this very in-group selecting hollowmen to retire and fuck off forever, and to see their legacy to be put on a shelf as a bizarre bit of character trivia.

>>154173133
>The Crossing and The Clone Saga are where it started.
For better or worse, nothing that happened in The Crossing mattered by 9 months after it ended, when Heroes Reborn started. It simply doesn't have the legacy to matter. For damaging pre-Benis Avengers stories, you really have to go back to Byrne's run to find something that really damaged characters and actually lasted.

Even as long as the Clone Saga went on for, it just didn't really leave a lasting legacy. It's more just one really notable symptom of the wider problem you identified yourself about Marvel's editors and writers wanting to back out of Spider-Man being married and constantly coming up with retarded ways to go about it.

At least if it had worked out the way 90s Marvel planned, the Clone Saga would've just let Peter and MJ leave NYC and retire.

File: 1657250389844.png (521 KB, 633x812)

521 KB PNG

>1990s - Industry crash: comics are no longer a great American past time and the industry reels.
>2000s - Anger sells: big events, gimmicks, ruining characters and pissing you off to desperately get you to buy books.
>2010s - Anger sells the double down: diverse replacement heroes, no capitalising on the MCU popularity and then finally apathy catches up with them.
>2020s - Borrowed time era: COVID and death of Diamond, collected edition bubble has formed and is ready to pop, same gimmicks, more anger selling/double downs, MCU is dead and they have little left.
Marvel are in desperate course correction mode even though they should have done that in 2017 when Secret Empire was so bad even Disney had to comment on Nazi Cap and the comic shop owners shouted at Marvel representatives at a meeting. Too little, too late.

>>154180800
>the Clone Saga would've just let Peter and MJ leave NYC and retire.
I have never understood this, there is an entire world of comics ahead of a maturing Peter. You could have a stasis status quo of Mayday/May/Richard or whomever in highschool having their youthful Spider adventures whilst Peter and MJ are doing the matured balancing act of responsibility owed to the wider world and their family. Keep that the mandate for decades if you must, there's just so much more you can do with it than we have seen for the past two.
Everything BND cabal wanted to write for, they could have written in alternative ongoings or just through the younger spiders the plot was naturally going to give them. And now we have a glut of younger Spiders running around 616 anyway, so the youth argument has got absolutely fucking nothing in it anymore other than Silver Age necessity to keep Peter a manchild dumb hamster spinning in his wheel.
If BND really thought their approach had an audience, they would have made it a separate ongoing without a Faustian bargain. As it stands when fans have an alternative they choose it.

>>154180940
DC unironically won by replacing one guy, it's incredible.

>>154181008
Anon, you're thinking like a normal person who was actually enjoying the comics in the late 80s to mid 90s, not like a Marvel employee who genuinely believes Spider-Man is "about youth" as the single core theme, and is probably seething that Peter was ever allowed to age out of his teens, and seething even harder that Gwen got killed and MJ got cemented as the endgame girl before you were even born. Those guys just aren't going to settle for getting what they want in an AU or a legacy character when they're in a position of power to make 'official' Marvel canon exactly what they want it to be, and the hell with what the paying audience wants.

>>154181031
If you want to see an example of how DC turned it around just look at the collected editions department
>Circa COVID, DC's collected editions department is practically gutted in one of the takeovers.
>Collected edition YouTubers become bigger.
>DC omnis become hardcovers, books are cancelled, super unreliable, bad recolours and poor quality.
>Marvel meanwhile has omnis, epics and masterworks.
>Marvel is still printing like crazy and seems unstoppable.

Fast forward to today:
>DC finest doing well.
>DC have cheaper compact editions that are similar to tankobon style books.
>Releasing books like the upcoming Swamp Thing Dark Genesis omni with a focus on better paper stock and original colours.

Meanwhile:
>Marvel cancelled the masterworks.
>Epic collections hiked up in price.
>Epics are super poor when it comes to reprints.
>Everything is an omnibus, even brand new series and stuff like collecting all of Krakoa X-Men in omni format.

DC learnt some lessons about what people want, quality focus, some cheaper books. Meanwhile Marvel has gone ALL-IN on omnibus format. And I really think there is a bubble forming. You simply cannot have enough space for all those omnibus editions. They are putting everything into the format.

>>154181008
They had a book for that, Spider-Girl. It had terrible sales.

>>154181223
Ok pull 'em up faggot.

Tried so hard to cater towards people who don't buy comics, alienating people who actually buy comics, and then being shocked when the people who don't buy comics still aren't buying comics.

>>154181223
Spider-Girl got 100 issues.
Slott can't get his BND throwback to be beyond 5 despite shilling for an ongoing.

>>154170087
>Now
What rock have you been living under since the 2000s?
Also, buy a sponsor for your video, asswad.

>>154181381
They gave the concept another shot with Renew Your Vows and that one lasted 23 issues.

File: sD-c-OsEn8K1Tha9DAatz6LPL(...).jpg (93 KB, 640x785)

93 KB JPG

>>154172062
>>154170663
So writers are just writting shitty, preachy political gotcha fantasies to pander to /co/'s need to complain about shitty preachy political gotcha fantasies?

>>154181419
Again with the time jump to a wildly different setting, don't be disingenuous and act like RYV sole difference was just an aged up married Peter.
We're talking about a natural progression, without Lucy pulling the goddamn football.

because the people who write them much like video games are failed Hollywood wanna be losers who'd rather be writing movies instead but have no real talent so they take what jobs they can get. this coupled with the fact that editor board rooms follow gay as aids check boxes leads to the clown show that is modern writing

>>154181419
I'm still waiting on those figures faggot.

>>154181452
It makes no money or sales though, Brevoorts retarded enrage to engage strategy doesn't work when love is the only reason a young guy would pay for anything he can find in a few clicks for free. They have oldheads gottahavemyspiderman who are dying off, and a young base that view 616 as the retarded black sheep. Managed decline is all that's been accomplished.

>>154170663
Not really. When compared to the other hobbies comic readers are very forgiving to bad comics, they just tell you not to read them. no one makes a hit peice shredding the comic down on how it fails at art, storytelling , characterization. I don't think there's a comic review equivalent of red letter media's prequel reviews or a comic reviewer has harsh as Yahtzee.

>>154170087
>Why Marvel Comics are so bad now?
>now
When do you think they were good? Because they've been largely shit with occasional bursts of pretty good (in a single title, not brand-wide) for a long time.

>>154171389
>Starlin
The guy that doesn't allow anyone to be better than Thanos ?
The guy that wrote "Thanos finds an old cosmic artifact, becomes omnipotent, but decides to willingly give it up" like 3 ou 4 times ?

>>154181589
You can look them up yourself on Comichron.

>>154171582
>I had to kill her
Based MJ. Hatefuck that Goblin, Peter!

>>154170087
Well DC also sucks
>implying it's actually good
but Marvel is special. It's like they're aware of what comicsfags don't want and double down on doing it. They're malicious.

>>154182258
More xmen titles¡

>>154170663
Not me.

>>154181589
Sales went down on the RYV ongoing, but what he won't tell you is that
>Slott's RYV mini actually got the highest orders of the Secret Wars miniseries tie-ins all the way to the end
>RYV ongoing under Conway did actually have enough initial interest that David Gabriel noted it in an interview
>Slott seemed to be doing everything he could to undermine RYV (ie saying that because Spider-Man was married he wasn't able to save the Avengers and killed Venom) and kept getting into arguments online about it, outright telling people that the marriage will never come back, etc etc. The RYV ongoing also wasn't as heavily promoted as other stuff.
>RYV ongoing had an editorial changeover and I think Jordan White and Heather Antos took over, which I think prompted the aging up of Annie May
>RYV was also out at a time when trust in Marvel Comics was at its lowest yet, this was right when Comicsgate was happening, this was when MCU fans and normies were outraged by the HydraCap thing, this was when fans checked out of ANAD and Civil War 2 and all that shit

>>154184183
OMD guys have nothing to look forward to, only an ever increasingly frayed string of the anvil above them. Only question is what finally kills the status quo and banishes the ghost of Joe.

>>154173234
I would not have been recommended to that video if YouTube has not been extremely hostile to adblockers.

>>154170087
>Now

>>154181654
True

>>154170087
I like Mortal Thor.

>>154170087
Around the time fags that use terms like "washed" got into it

>>154170087
looks like Magic the Gavining has 30 minutes or yapping to answer that question OP

>>154184458
>implying the comics have not been bad longer than the fags that use terms like "washed" got into them have been alive

>>154184458
The type to use "washed" are the type to delude themselves into thinking Miles is a good character or worth salvaging as if black kids would want black Spider-Man when they would rather have their own or get Static or someone else to show up.
Imagine being a kid and you get a toy of Miles when you'd rather get Blade who is his own character.
Like I know some anons will say you can't conceive of that as a kid, but that's bullshit. If you pull out Miles as a figure (unlikely), you're gonna hear a white kid or a black kid point out you have black spider-man at some point. Maybe not elementary age but definitely middle school. And if you have black spider-man there's definitely gonna be some mixed feelings. "Get your own" is uttered by every kid at some point. Sharing is like the first lesson you learn. So you gotta imagine. Bendis said that this where kids imagine you're Spider-Man. Well past this point is where anons have already provided plenty of answers and debate. What I'm saying is that as a kid, you're gonna reach this point and it's inevitable.
>>154184477
Shill.

How many years have we got left until Lowe, Brevoort etc are all gone?
Lowe's the youngest in his 40's, does that mean a minimum of 20 years until BND is at last banished?

>>154170087
Why can't ESLs makes their question OPs into complete sentences?

>>154170087
I think the mess of the Clone Saga signaled that, as a company overall, they were pretty afraid of any meaningful and lasting change, and over the 2000s and early 2010s, we'd start to see this heavy shift towards more empty and vapid "we're telling you it's dramatic but generally you hate it" kind of stories that are bookended by meh events and other nonsense. It didn't happen all at once, but by 2015 that basically became the total reality of things.

Now the only thing you really get out of Marvel is smaller books that you cling to and hope will complete their stories before editorial shuffles the character off to an event or onto a new team for sales numbers and completely fucks up the whole thing. It extended even to their Ultimate line, as stories people actually liked got fucked up HARD by sales gimmicks like real time and then the end of series crossovers.

>>154181452
>it's all muh poltiics
What's it like being stuck in 2016 twitter?

>>154170087
>thought it would be a shitposting ‘Marvel BAD’ vid
>he actually goes over examples
actually good vid

>>154170087
I'm not giving Marvel another chance after Secret Empire and ANAD. Fuck them.

>>154181452
Look no one supports the comic book industry it's run by big corporations who own it who don't care as long as they produce a few books every once in awhile, they don't even make money off of it. Is the attention economy so you dumbasses go around talking about some ridiculous book or some ridiculous show and they can actually make an argument that it was successful even with it being canceled because it created quote unquote internet buzz

>>154170087
>Now
They became bad the moment Avengers: Disassembled hit the shelves. Became worse when the 1st Civil War came and after that became progressively worse and worse.
They had some runs that were fun, but these were a minority compared to most of the stuff they released since then.

>>154170663
Spider-Man never recovered from OMD.

>>154181654
We had some youtubers who did it during early 2010s

>>154188374
They got bad in the 90s.

>>154185276
Kids do not think about that shit at all, anon. The only way it would even enter their minds is if a weird ass adult started bullying them about it. Nobody except comic fans give a fuck.

>>154181654
>>154188419
I think it was mainly because Linkara was the prominent comic youtuber during the early 2010s

>>154181654
>no one makes a hit peice shredding the comic down on how it fails at art, storytelling , characterization.

Were you even around for the 2000s/2010s because I can assure you this happened. It just primarily happened on blogs and review sites. Youtube has a larger audience but at the time like >>154189745 indicates, Linkara was the prominent comics youtuber.

The other issue is that the Big 2 retaliate whenever they get a negative review about something big, Marvel moreso, so the most prominent reviewers online that get views just handle shitty ass books with kidgloves or resort to pointing out sexism/racism/etc because it's an "easier" cause to get behind that the Big 2 couldn't ignore at the time.

>>154188860
Yeah no.
The 90's along with the 80's were peak Marvel.

>>154188864
What part of "I know some will say kids don't think/conceive of Miles not being his own character but kids will inevitably realize and point out only Spider-Man has a black one made specifically for him," did you not read in my post? Bendis literally segregated Spider-Man and with how Brown v. Board turned out as an argument, I think the inherent separation of the two is on a primal level going to confuse and mess with kids heads.
Separate but equal is a tired phrase and a bit melodramatic for what we are discussing but it LITERALLY is happening right here with Peter and Miles. What is EQUAL about them in terms of artistic merit? A kid will realize one has all the cool as fuck stories, moments, and villains, the other has jackshit and is trying to feed off the other.
A kid doesn't have to think about what I all laid out to get the feeling that something isn't right. They can't analyze on the level of us. But they can certainly make fun of one another and point out surface things that don't seem right.

>>154170087
Dan Slutt did this.

>>154192658
Dan Slopp.
Dan Slotto Blocktavius.
Dan Bott.
Dan Plopp.
Dan Rott.
Dan Grave Plott.
Dan Nott.

File: ComicSalesbyFormat_2024_H(...).jpg (136 KB, 1662x1354)

136 KB JPG

>>154170087
Marvel (and DC) comics are written in a way where the story doesn't matter and people have pretty much caught on to that fact. Why bother reading a capeshit comic that will by passed around like a whore to various teams that all have different visions of what it should be (or gets retconned/destroyed by corporate) when you can read a manga or indie comic that has the same author(s) the entire run and can actually be complete?

>>154170087
Because they fired the conservatives like me and my co workers who were making the good comics. It really is that simple.

>>154170087
They've been bad for almost 20 years straight now

>>154192928
>who were making the good comics
Bullshit, I doubt that they fired you before the 2010s

>>154192928
>goes indie to write even shittier comics

>>154192252
You don't know any children at all.

>>154191470
90s in when the rot set in.

>>154193412
It definitely is for Spider-Man, the first of many attempts to jettison his trajectory of family man to his current status as career-less bum on the oust with everyone. The original sin of the Clone Saga to todays Pyrrhic victory for Spoffice.

>>154181198
I think Marvel's been heavily relying on the omnibus format because it generates the most short-term money for them. But yes, I also can't help but notice this is causing them some potential problems, too

>>154170087
I don't even read comics right now, but Absolute DC made me forget Marvel even exists.

>>154181452
No one buys comics anymore other than neckbeards
Beit left wing neckbeards who'll buy a comic because it panders to their views or the right wing neckbeard who'll buy it just to bitch about it

>>154193394
You don't know what they think.

>>154196070
This is anecdotal but I have noticed a few people getting rid of whole collections. These books have not necessarily held their value and having Ikea shelves full of books as you get older is becoming a worse prospect for people. The fact Marvel are putting so much modern shit runs straight into omni format also shows the problem.

>>154196670
Man they are retarded.

>>154196706
Comic historians epithet for this era.

>>154193306
Cyberfrog did pretty well thank you

>>154193179
I've been in the business since 1999, you?

File: is-gwen-trans-v0-6e16cccy(...).jpg (19 KB, 475x428)

19 KB JPG

tranny writers (gwen is trans btw)

>>154196070
The reason omnibus sells well is they are durable and easily sold in bookstores and online, floppies not so much. Plus the printing can be farmed out to direct printing outfits as necessary. No diamond distributors required to get it into people's hands

>>154173133
Also just the whole event culture in general just feels bad.

>>154197017
They sell pitches and ideas but the execution is always so fucking bad due to a smorgasbord of reasons, and the impact they have on the even well-done ongoings getting derailed is like a smelly earthquake.

>>154197069
I'm not one to hunt for sales figures, but is there even an ROI for big line wide events?
At a certain point I think it might be better for each run to just sit in its own continuity without bearing on any other ongoing unless, yknow, people like the developments enough to warrant their adaptation.

>>154197167
It's editorial being both unable to constrain themselves and completely incompetent.
They should, until they prove themselves far better at juggling that they are, limit themselves to one big event a decade. You can have smaller minis spread between years but above all else, have a plan prior and the various writers all onboard together so we don't have the usual nonsensical mess of too many cooks, wild mischaracterization and pacing like a spastic. To name just a few problems.

>>154196950
>>154196937
lol, stop larping. You're not ethan

>>154197414
No i work with him though. Pray for his family and mine. A lot of illness lately. It's not fun.

>>154197443
Okay not not ethan, I'll pray, even if you're just larping. Because yeah everything sucks now

>>154170087
5$ USD for 35 pages and 10 of that pages are ADS.
And every comic is cancelled in volume #5 and characters are rebooted in another universe. And adults wearing spandex is weird.

>>154197167
The problem is, Marvel has generally been acting like every new run is its own continuity and yet not. They don't want to put the full effort into making things cohesive so readers caught on how unmemorable most stuff from Marvel in the last two decades is

>>154170087
Diversity hires

>>154197443
>i work with him though. Pray for his family and mine. A lot of illness lately
Lucifer is calling them back to office. Good.

>>154170663
This is such an insane cope.

Chances of a new Spider Office by 2030 or nah?
Thinking it'll be 2035, Lowe would be in his fifties and the old BND circlejerks will finally be shuffling the fuck out of the office.

>>154203188

The current restructuring at marvel publishing means the bosses are displeased at the current direction.

I doubt any of the editorial old guard will be around in the next 12-18 months.

>>154199751
What started this? It wasn't this bad in Marvel NOW, ANAD or shortly after Disney bought them.

The stories are always going to be bad because they have to remain none commital. Death marriage none of matters. Continuity therefore doesn't matter.

>>154203848
Add to it multiverse crap and movie synergy fucking up arcs and past characterizations and yeah...

>>154203845
It was starting to be a problem with maybe some late 90s stuff but the problem just accumulated over time.

>It wasn't this bad in Marvel NOW, ANAD or shortly after Disney bought them.

These were basically a sharp decline from the Quesada era which itself had its own increasing problems. I think what you're seeing now is basically all their bad decisions compounded by COVID (and financial issues), Feige trying to run all divisions of Marvel during the 2020s, the decline of Marvel films/tv, Marvel Comics not getting enough money from Disney, people from the Quesada era still trying to run Marvel like it was still the Quesada era

>>154170087
Now? Brother, they've always been bad.

>>154170663
This. /co/ takes pride in doing storytime of pain threads.

>>154170087
Is this the new retarded shill? Youtube thumbnail caps? Fuck off outta here, loser

>>154170087
>This thing sucks, actually.

The sort of person who works on comics is more likely than the average person to be really online, to have a reddit account, twitter, and so on. As trannies and other far left ideologues actively campaigned and coordinated to capture moderation spots there (and here) this had a long-term impact on how these people think, what they think is and isn't acceptable and so on. It caused a shift in priority away from the norms of trying to sell comics to an audience and towards trying to fulfill some sort of agenda or to get the approval of an imaginary audience on reddit. This hasn't been limited to comics, you can see it in video games very heavily, television writing rooms, etc. It's all downstream of allowing the internet to shrink and to become controlled by a fairly small group of insular super mods on estrogen. It's why people who used to be good slowly turned to shit.

>>154207575
truke, as they say

>>154207611
Is it?

>>154209902
indeed, many people are saying this

>>154205560
They shouldn't. That shit's retarded.