Does Rob still own the rights to Supreme? Why don't they collect the Moore-run already?
>>154989762I remember a fun visual gag where Supreme would be changing into his costume, which was hidden under his clothes, and he'd roll up his sleeves to reveal those enormous clunky bracers.
>>154989821>>154989762Did Moore wrote that joke?GO TO HELL MOORE, YOU SHOULD DO MORE COMICS FFS. GO TO MARVEL AND WRITE SOMETHING FOR SPIDER-MAN, MAYBE LIKE WHAT YOU DID IN 1963. OH YEAH AND FINISH 1963. OR DO WHATEVER YOU WANT, A SEXUAL-ABUSEMAN COMIC IDK
>>154989762Didn't the rights get tied up in some VC firm or something? That's why Youngblood was nowhere until recently.I own my story of the year trade, it's in my top three comics.
>>154990270Nah, he just wants to write weird books about London now. He's old, let him enjoy his 3rd act.
Andrew Rev swindled the rights out of Liefeld, he’s sort of notorious for these underhanded deals in the industry. Anything Liefeld makes with his characters has to be through him.
>>154990270>GO TO MARVELOh hell fucking no. Better retired than working for that trash company.
>>154990275>I own my story of the year tradeLucky devil. I've been hunting down the run issue by issue. It ain't cheap if you're not a burger.
>>154989762I have both of the TPB books, but of course they're missing the final issue because the series was cancelled on its penultimate release.
>>154989762It’s really crazy how much Morrison apes from this book for his titles like Multiversity and All-Star
>>154991254So is Moore's criticism against him justified
I was lucky enough to find the TPBs, but here's some Archive.org links for you to get Supreme as well.https://archive.org/details/supreme-comics-collectionhttps://archive.org/details/supreme-the-story-of-the-year
>>154990270He was actually willing to work for Marvel in the early 2000s, I figure since he was forced into working with DC again with the whole WildStorm/ABC line fiasco.He and Tom Brevoort were in talks. Brevoort wanted Moore to write Fantastic Four, but Moore wasn't interested, instead wanting to write Ant-Man. Brevoort thought it wouldn't sell and shot it down. For what it's worth, his brief Captain Britain run is one of my favorite Marvel comics of all time.
>>154993351That was so stupid>Hey everyone, Alan Moore is coming to Marvel with a new revolutionary runI guess this wasn't enough. Turns out that Swamp Thing was popular before Moore
>>154989762I wish. I think Rob said some encouraging words to the effect when he got YB back but i'm not sure. >>154992764Thanks anon. Besides Moore and imo Ellis' pretty interesting with lovely art Blue Rose - can anyone recommend which other runs or books are good?
>>154993351>Brevoort wanted Moore to write Fantastic Four, but Moore wasn't interested, instead wanting to write Ant-Man. Brevoort thought it wouldn't sell and shot it down. Criminal incompetence if true.Worst case scenario, you get a amazing Ant Man run. Best case scenario is that you now have a working relationship with Moore, which Marvel hasn't had EVER since the Marvelman debacle. That opens up the opportunity for Moore to work on the bigger properties later down the line.
>>154991254What Morrison used to do is constantly try to refute things Moore wrote in his comics. There are numerous direct references to Moore in Zenith, Flex Mentallo, Animal Man, Seven Soldiers, Final Crisis, and The Multiversity.
>>154994663Ironic that Morrison doesn’t really do this for his Batman run cause Moore doesn’t give a shit about Batman
>>154993351>>154993521>>154993942It's entirely possible that suggesting something uncommercial that Marvel wouldn't want to do was just a polite way for Moore to tell them "piss off and leave me alone", I tend to doubt he REALLY wanted to work for Marvel again by then, or work on corporate-owned superhero comics in general.
>>154993351>I did later make an attempt to convince Alan to write FANTASTIC FOUR, unsuccessfully—he did have an interest in doing ANT-MAN, though I was never quite certain whether we could sell it in sufficient quantities to make it worth pursuing, and it never came together in any event. But I bet his Ant-Man would have been mind-blowing.https://tombrevoort.substack.com/p/46-friendlessWhat was Moore's relationship with DC back in 2001? Was it at it's worse? Because Marvel could've gotten him to work on something as a jab at their distinguished competitor.
>>154994847It's possible.>>154994977There it is.In 2001, Moore was working on several ABC titles, and ABC was under DC, since Jim Lee sold WildStorm to DC in 1998. He resented working with them again, but went ahead anyway because he had already gotten all these artists underway on his projects. I think the final ABC book came out in 2007. From what I've seen, it got really bad when the Watchmen movie came out.
>>154994977>What was Moore's relationship with DC back in 2001? Was it at it's worse?Moore's refusal to work for DC after Watchmen is so famous that he refused to accept checks from Wildstorm after they got bought by DC unless the came from a separate bank(and ended up being paid by Jim Lee directly, allegedly), so he could at least say he wasn't working for DC. Jim Lee established a separate publisher for him through Wildstorm, America's Best Comics. Eventually Moore drifted and ended these comics as Wildstorm became more integrated into DC. He took his crator owned projects elsewhere with DC keeping what Wildstorm owned.
>>154993521>Turns out that Swamp Thing was popular before MooreIt was enough to sell a movie at least. Very little of Moore's contributions were ever used in Swamp Thing adaptations,and he's arguably more remembered as a D-list movie than a comic.
>>154994977>>154995490Moore already started to push away DC again in around 2000 because someone at DC, probably Paul Levitz, said that a Cobweb comic couldn't be published as is because it was taking a dig at Scientology and I believe at the time WB were trying to persuade Tom Cruise to work with them. Moore then pulled his endorsement of the 15th anniversary stuff for Watchmen (which would've had DC Direct figures and the like) and so DC canceled that stuffIt actually got worse around the time of the V For Vendetta movie, IIRC. By the time of Watchmen Moore had already completely cut ties with DC for some time yet still got more pissed because he got the impression they were trying to pressure him into supporting whatever Watchmen stuff they were doing with the implied threat of removing his friend Steve Moore from a Watchmen novelization.
>>154995571>he's arguably more remembered as a D-list movie than a comic.You could absolutely argue that point, but you would he wrong.
>>154995578You're also forgetting the LXG drama, which predates V, if I recall correctly.
>>154991254I mean in Multiversity there's an Earth in the guidebook that's basically the Supreme/Awesome Universe Earth>>154994686Technically, Morrison's Batman is basically Morrison applying part of what Moore did on Supreme, but on Batman instead. Basically folding in all the eras including the abandoned one (early Silver Age era) and taking the modernization into account, and sometimes homages, like how there was a text story because there was a text story by O'Neil and Marshall Rogers back in the 70s. If there is a "possible" criticism of Moore in Morrison's Batman, it might be about how Moore on Supreme threw away 90% of Supreme that came before to make an all-new Supreme that was based on Superman's Silver Age but modern (some people also look at Glory's dialogue about how Supreme didn't miss much in his amnesiac state in Supreme #49 as a dismissal of the 70s and 80s comics) while Morrison arguably still tries to fit everything in with the modern Batman. Naturally he doesn't fit literally everything (the confrontation with Joe Chill isn't anything like Pre-Crisis, and fans of O'Neil-edited era Batman have complained about the run), but I would expect that if Moore had done a Batman run instead of Morrison, in spite of Moore's ambivalence for Batman, he would've tried to find a way to jettison much of the 80s/90s/00s the same way he jettison Supreme's prior stuff. Moore said in an interview back in 2009 that if he were writing Batman again he'd prefer to write it during the era of Zebra Batman, Bat-Mite, Ace the Bat-Hound because he felt while it was sillier it was more imaginative.
>>154995791Yeah I forgot to add that, LXG incident was around early 00s, a few years after the Cobweb debacle
>>154995777There's more of a fandom for the comic, but comics are small time. More people have probably at least recognized the movie or TV show than the comic because those get in the millions of viewers regularly while comics get in the hundreds of thousands at best. More realistically, tens of thousands. More people saw a rerun of the Swamp Thing TV show in 1994 than read the comic that entire year.
>>154996121I guarantee more people know about the comic that was written by the guy who wrote the fucking Watchmen, the most normie comic ever to normie, than they do about a low budget horror movie and short lived USA TV show from almost 40 years ago. 100%, the comic is more well known. Comics have been mainstream for 20 years now, and Moore is the lead of the pack, perhaps only behind Gaiman.
>>154989762The TPBs aren't that expensive anymore (at least they weren't last time I checked eBay)If they did a new collection Rob should hire Moore to write a final issue
>>154996121>More people saw a rerun of the Swamp Thing TV show in 1994 Swamp Thing was on cable and it wasn't exactly getting that much buzz, at that point it would be around the same level as the audience for the comic that year
>>154996317There's absolutely more people talking about the comic, sure, but again, there's a silent majority of people that consume media and barely talk about it. A lot of people who know of the movie, TV show, or cartoon, may be older people, but that's still more than would be familiar with the comic. The shortlived Swamp Thing toyline probably made more of a cultural blip than the comic. Swamp Thing is significantly less well known by people than Watchmen or V for Vendetta though. It's reprinted a lot, but not a bookstore staple like Watchmen or V or Killing Joke. I doubt there's many people under 35 who really know the Moore Swamp Thing run.
>>154996471"Not getting much buzz" or a failing box office is still tens of thousands or hundreds of thousands of viewers or millions of viewers when it comes to movies. It's obviously long after Moore's run, but look at Swamp Thing sales in 1995>https://www.comichron.com/monthlycomicssales/1995/1995-01Capital.html7,500 copies. There are absolutely failing cable shows that had more viewers.
>>154995907Interesting. Despite the feud between these two, I like that there was a rivalry, even if one-sided. It made Morrison a better writer, so we got more good comics out of the ordeal.We need more competition in comics.
>>154996641Swamp thing was absolutely a bookstore staple in the early 2000s. You're full of shit.
>>154996437He ain't coming back.
>>154989762They haven't even collected Story of the Year properly, right?
>>154990334Fucker.
>>154990334>>154999821This hasn't been the case for a while which is why Liefeld is doing Youngblood again. What happened was Scott Rosenberg got the rights to Youngblood, Supreme, and Glory (and probably some others), and somehow did a deal with Andrew Rev that ended up with Rev controlling the comic rights to Youngblood and so on, and why Liefeld didn't do any of those characters for a while. I guess at some point Rosenberg cut off the deal with Rev and decided to deal with Liefeld again.
>>154999306there was a shitty one
>>154999306hell if I know
>>154999306Yes they have. Pic related, it's all 12 issues. The second, unfinished run is also completely collected.
https://mega.nz/folder/y9ph3Q4J#RFY_UlyC1C8PwRKALZ8VsA
>>154996437Moore wouldn't be interested. He originally wrote an outline that would've ended his run on a cliffhanger so his friend Steve Moore could continue where he left offAs far as I'm concerned Supreme ends with that final Moore script that Erik Larsen drew, plus the fan-made ending on the Forgotten Awesome blog
>>155000822I guess the Erik Larsen-drawn issue is the only one not included, right?
>>155001119Correct.
>>155001127An omni with all the issues + Judgement Day + Moore's Youngblood and Glory issues would be so cool.
>>155001165Agreed, I wish Moore's image stuff was more readily available. I'd also really like to get my hands on his Wild CATS run.I recently read his violator mini which was not what I expected.
>>154989821Heheh, that DOES sound pretty funny..
>>154993351>>154994977Here’s my issue with Brevoort’s claim. Like a year later Marvel was all ready to publish an Ant Man comic by Daniel Way with, as Way put it, “copious butt fucking”. So Alan Moore goes “I’d be willing to write Ant Man” and Marvel goes “nah” but Daniel Way says “I want to write an Ant Man comic with butt fucking” and Marvel says “hell yes here’s your contract!”
>>155002525Could still be feasible even with the conflicting response.As I heard it after working on the 2016 Thanos: Infinity trilogy Starlin left Marvel in a huff because Brevoort let Cates' Thanos Wins story step on the toes of ideas Starlin setup, either by not doing his job as editor or from actually telling Cates about Starlin's ideas to put him over. So weird acts of favoritism wouldn't be surprising.
>>155002525I'm not saying this is what happened, but in between talking to Moore and the Daniel Way book gettig greenlit(if it made it that far? It seems like it was cancelled very early, from what little reading I did), Marvel Max was becoming a solid line for the publisher. There is a difference between "I want to write an Ant Man book for the main line," and "we need more books for MAX."In no way am I saying that this is definitely what happened, I'm just saying I see it as a possibility. Brevoort has also been shown to kind of be a cunt, as is Alan Moore, so who knows. I don't think Alan Moore would come up with a fake pitch to get them to leave him alone, he seems like he's just fine saying "No, fuck off."
>>155002525Didn't Way pitch one for scumbag Steve Erin Grady Ant Man? Who existed because Edgar Wright had a hard on for Scott Lang and wanted to make a movie about his Ant Man but Bendis was throwing a huge temper tantrum demanding Scott stay dead because he hated him, forcing them to create Grady to try and bully Wright to use him instead?
>>155001175Moore's Wildcats was collected but it's complicated by the fact that the first half is connected to like two 20 part crisis crossovers where the individual parts make little sense out of context but can't be skipped because Moore's run is set up by them.
What's the big deal about Moore's Supreme? Isn't Supreme just Teamu Homelander?
>>155004375The short of it is that Moore was working on and off for Image in the 90's, Liefeld asked him to work on some of his books and he was initially cold but Liefeld managed to win him over by pitching Supreme to him as letting him do the Superman comics DC wouldn't let him do.
>>155004375Supreme started out as the prototype asshole Superman but around the time DC made Superman an electricity based being, Liefeld hired Akan Moore to write Supreme and gave him card blanche to do whatever he wanted, which led to Moore straight up rebooting Supreme into Teamu Silver Age Superman. Unfortunately Liefeld's comic company went out of business leaving Moore's run unfinished.Years later, Liefeld hired Erik Larsen to finish the Moore run but gave him free reign and Erik, hating Alan Moore, brought back classic Asshole Supreme via multiverse shenanigans depowered the Moore version (as Liefeld had to intervene when he realized Erik didn't intend to finish the Zmoore run). Larsen ended with another cliffhanger and an asshole Supreme/Omniman fight AND IIRC Warren Ellis ignore everything Larsen AND Moore wrote years later to create his own Supreme who at least paid lip service to the nicer Moore version
>>154990270Why does that particular joke make you so mad?
>>154994847But Moore has a history of taking on lesser-known characters/books. Gives him more freedom to experiment.
>>155003833There's a big difference in getting someone like way, who was an up and comer back then and never a big star, and Moore in writing an Ant-Man comic. Marvel probably just felt it'd be a waste to use Moore on a book that wasn't likely to sell and was probably just meant to be a proof of concept for a movie.
>>154995549You're getting the timeline mixed up. ABC was created as a Wildstorm imprint when it was still at Image just before the sale to DC. Lee apparently was unaware of the animosity Moore had with DC, and has said the first time he met Moore in person after the sale he thought Moore was going to beat him with the walking stick he carries.
>>155003833I think two issues of Way’s Ant Man were completely finished before Marvel pulped them thanks to George Clooney killing the MAX line
>>155004334No, Way’s Ant Man was Hank Pym and I think set in its own little corner. Scott Lang was still alive when Way was doing his book
>>155004470Actually I laughed when I read that post and I wanted to know if Moore wrote it
>>155004375>Isn't Supreme just Teamu Homelander?How can Character A created decades before Character B be a knockoff of B?
>>155004576>Marvel probably just felt it'd be a waste to use Moore on a book that wasn't likely to sell and was probably just meant to be a proof of concept for a movieI have no doubt, especially if Brevoort was involved, that this is likely what happened but it’s still fucking retarded to think Alan Moore writing anything for Marvel wouldn’t sell enough to make it worth it. But Marvel was doing a lot of experimental shit at that time, namely the entire fucking MAX line, so it’s just bizarre to me that they’d turn down anything Moore would be willing to do
>>155004364I know it was collected but it's incredibly out of print and, while I'm interested, I'm not so interested as to pay niche Alan moore oop book prices.
>>155004691Did Moore ever write a shrinky guy? That'd be interesting. I wonder how he would include rape
>>155004929Isn't Hank Pym infamous for beating his wife?
>>155004951It's a single panel shove/slap. He didn't rape anybody.
>>155004691>but it’s still fucking retarded to think Alan Moore writing anything for Marvel wouldn’t sell enough to make it worth it.Moore wasn't exactly guaranteed sales , I don't think his Supreme or his Image work in general was selling that well.
>>155005152>I don't think his Supreme or his Image work in general was selling that well.Maybe, but one of the big two publishing it would probably make the difference
>>155005199This. People are sheep about publishers.
>>155005199Even without a sales boost seems like it'd be a coup just getting Moore on a Marvel book.
>>155004375>>155004466>Teamu
>>155004929Maybe in Swamp Thing or Top 10? He was gonna write Doll Man in Twilight of the Superheroes where it'd be revealed that Doll Man was drastically physically altered over timeIf you read that part of the pitch it's funnier when you reread Supreme, cause Moore cites the square cube law affecting Doll Man (which I believe he might've gotten from Philip Jose Farmer who brought up the square cube law in his King Kong story), while in Supreme, Billy Friday (the Jimmy Olsen analogue/British writer stand-in who is obviously Moore and maybe also Morrison) is talking about how Stupendo the Ape Supreme couldn't be real because of the square-cube law, and Supreme brushes it off. It was like Moore just telling his 80s self to go fuck off
>>155004623>George Clooney killing the MAX lineHe absolutley did not kill the MAX imprint. Punsiher MAX wasn't even out by that point.
>>155005152His Violator and Spawn stuff sold well during the mid-90s but that could just have to do with the popularity of Spawn at the time. You could argue about 1963 sliding down the charts, but it was published in 1993, at the peak of the speculator boom and a glut of stuff coming from multiple companies. That it even still managed to chart in the top 100 five issues in is pretty good, especially since the audience for 1963 is not the same audience as the one reading Spawn and the like at the time.Supreme was published while the comics industry was still reeling from the Heroes World debacle and Diamond getting control of everything, and Liefeld left Image (which led to other problems that weren't helped by the comic industry shakeups), so its sales were way lower than a lot of stuff Moore was doing up to that point, yet at the same time it was getting praised a lot. The ABC line's sales seemed more stable by comparison and I think that had to do with DC/Wildstorm being in a more stable position than Liefeld's Awesome was at the time.I think a Moore Ant-Man series would've done well because by the time Quesada took over Marvel there was a gradual reassessment of Moore's comics. Watchmen was about to be placed on a higher pedestal than before, people were talking about Miracleman as a lost classic that influenced modern comics, and so on. I even remembered seeing more people talk about V For Vendetta than I did in the 90s, and this was way before the movie. Plus you know Quesada would gladly brag about getting Moore to write for them after Moore cut ties with DC.
>>155007923Moore was arguably more of a household name in the early 2000s than he is now. Swamp Thing, Watchmen and V for Vendetta were all in barns and noble, he had series coming out at the time, and Wizard sucked his dick pretty hard.It's funny that you talk about Miracle Man that way, when I was reading those comics you still couldn't get any of those, the eclipse reprints were long out of print and eBay wasn't what it is now. My friend who really turned me on to comics again was an avid torrenter and got me Miracle Man, among numerous other things. Reading those low quality scans was a real piece of exotica at the time, something that I'd been hearing about for YEARS but never had any way of reading.
>>155008004That was a part of the reason why Miracleman got talked up a lot back then, because it was almost inobtainable. Issue #15 was charting in Wizard's Top 10. It was also a time when Millar's Authority was getting popular and Paul Jenkins and Jae Lee were doing Sentry and in those discussions about those books back then I would often see Miracleman get brought up, to compare to them.It also helped that around 2001 TwoMorrows published the Kimota book by George Khoury that had interviews with a lot of the people involved, even showing how Alan Moore and Steve Moore wrote a timeline that showed V For Vendetta was to take place in a world where Mike Moran never remembered his "magic" word, and that Gargunza was the one who built the Fate computer. So there was this whole legend being built up around Miracleman for a while.
>>155008141I miss that time when you actually had to go look for things, it made finding cool shit feel like actual discoveries.
>>154989762I don't like the art.
>>155007881There was like eight MAX books a month before Clooney got his hands on Fury Max. The Shanna the She Devil Frank Cho mini was supposed to be MAX. The Daniel Way Ant Man MAX mini. That weird Phoenix mini. All cancelled/repurposed because of the suits making Marvel cull the MAX line. By the time Punisher started the only other MAX book was Supreme Power and I don’t think they even did another mini outside those two till the late 2000s
>>155008141nice
>>155009383Marvel is spineless.
>>154998168Moore cares about moneyif there was enough money involved he would do it but really there isn't enough hype around the book to justify a new collection and paying an artist to draw a final issue.
>>155009383Did you look at those other MAX titles? Most of the line was probably selling like shit. Plus, a lot of that stuff was specifically intended to be miniseries. "George Clooney didn't want to be in our movie because of a comic that's finished from several years ago, so we have to kill this line, except we didn't actually kill it and titles keep coming out for it for the next decade," that doesn't make any fucking sense.
>>155011669Ennis did the best MAX titles. That's nuts.
