Do you have a certain point with your favorite character where you were just like, 'fuck this i'm out'?
>The last O'neil arc>Rucka and Devin came to the main team>The old gang of obsessed batfamily writer(Dixon, Moench) won Nightwing over Titans and soon will win more and more things.>Brubaker and Hama failed runs started soon over>The comics started to be "create a villain and try to made the definitive Joker story "Yeah, people shat on Snyder or Morrison but No man land was THE moment you got Batman you love was done .Also Bendis in Avengers for ne
>>155673143Looking back the more I think Cataclysm was probably the beginning of the end of the post-COIE Batman and No Man's Land was the nail in the coffinI never understood people who bitched about Morrison's or Snyder's runs but praise the post-NML era of Batman. Yeah, Gotham Central was great but that doesn't account for the main Batman stuff
>>155672786I just don't follow characters. I'm out by default unless a comic is really good.
All Marvel characters during Quesada's reign.
>>155672786Can uncs explain what's so bad about NML
>>155672786No Man's Land was fine
>>155672786I’m not a baby, so no
>>155673781can you do more baby talk so we can all jerk off together you fucking creep>>155672786this the one where he just jumps off the moon?
>>155672786Anything with a Batfamily is going in the garbage.
>>155672786Denny O’Neil stopped caring about the comic’s quality in 1993 when he let his precious Legends of the Dark Knight become tainted by Knightfall, and turned Shadow of the Bat, which was supposed to have been Alan Grant’s continuation of his Detective Comics run, into a yet another event slop vehicle.By the mid to late 90s thats when he handed reign over to his assistants who proceeded to fire everyone not Chuck Dixon. NML is a stupid premise and a stupid comic that only serves to swamp everything in event slop. Plus it gave us Poochie Cass.
>>155672786Really? This? This is what broke? Not fucking Knighfall? This was fine.
>>155675091If you don’t like the Batfam, you don’t like Batman.
>>155675440>>155675451Knightfall didn't really fuck things up that much>By the mid to late 90s thats when he handed reign over to his assistants who proceeded to fire everyone not Chuck Dixon. Mid-90s was still Moench/Dixon/Grant The firing happened around NML
>>155675451Knightfall was iconic and the story made thematic and logical sense, and it changed the Batman mythos forever. What lasting power did NML have?
>>155672786Black Panther>Hudlin turning Wakanda into a generic egalitarian pan-african black utopia, introducing all these massive retcons.>Doomwar>Shuri becomes the new Black PantherThey lost me for years. Thank god for Jonathan Hickman.
Nu52
>>155675587Introduced Cass Cain (this was a mistake) and made the overly disruptive "batfamily" events into a regular thing.
>>155675692Cass rules.
I found NML to be really underwhelming. There are a decent number of memorably stories during the Knightfall era (Ventriloquist, Zsaz, Scarecrow and of course Bane himself) and the Knightquest stuff with Jean Paul was kind of neat if sometimes feeling like a Spawn ripoff.Knightsend with Bruce and Shiva's training was also cool.By comparison, I remember a lot less from NML. There was the Clayface/Ivy story and there was the extremist cop. I'm pretty sure most of the stories I remember don't even feature Bruce. Azrael was a big part of things and I think the gang war stuff was mostly Huntress or Batgirl. I can't really pick out memorable 1-3 issue storylines with Bruce from that era.I think Batman was a pretty big downgrade from around that time through to the end of Morrison's run. Winnick, Brubaker, and whoever wrote War Games were all decidedly 'meh' to me. Meanwhile I thought that "Tec was pretty good from the early 800s to around 850 where Bruce's story 'ends' with Whatever Happened to the Caped Crusader.
>>155672786I barely stomached Snyder's Bats. King's run made me stop reading Batman entirely.>Bat>Cat>Bat>Cat>Bat>Cat>Bat>Cat>Bat>Cat
>>155672786I think NML is a fun idea but it can be kind of tedious to read just because of the sprawl and character bloat. I enjoyed it when I read it in full a few years ago but it's not something I see myself revisiting. I just don't care about the Batfamily as a whole and NML doesn't do much to elevate itself above a soap opera, even if specific issues or moments work well as vignettes.
>>155675540Knightfall absolutes did fuck things up because it went on for too long and introduced the idea of having ALL Batman comics be affected by the event.
>Lex Luthor rebuilds Gotham and makes it look modern and gayWorst thing that resulted from NML
>>155675452If you like the Batfamily, you don't like Batman and you don't like comics.
>>155676124It was about a year. That's way less than most events.
>>155677103A year across all the Batman books. If you didn’t vibe with Knightfall, you were shit out of luck.
