The flame detector is doing its job by not letting the gas stay on when there’s no ignition. But you would test that by leaving the gas on and unplugging the igniter. If his test is ever repeated in a real scenario you’d just cycle your igniter indefinitely, who cares. He’s fishing for parts to get a commission on. With that symptom I wouldn’t worry about it. You’re also a cuck for paying another man to tell you about your equipment

>>2990685
I don't actually know if it tried to turn the gas off. Apparently it didn't if it just let the igniter glow forever trying to ignite the gas. I think the worry is if the coil stayed on for a long period of time with no gas it could burn out, then if then gas somehow came back it might just pump unignited gas into the space? I don't know why that woupd happen, but if it did that could be potentially dangerous?

I just don't know anything about this stuff, man, I never lived in a house with a boiler before. That's why I'm trying to figure out how to verify whatever this guy's problem is and rule out easier solutions or figure out if this is actually even a problem at all.

>>2990653
What this anon said

>>2990685

The dude was forcing that scenario to try to sell you shit. In a real scenario no gas means the thing starts, the pressure sensor sees nothing, then everything turns off and it tries again in a bit. The lockout is what some systems have when their is a failure X times then it locks things out for 10 minutes or whatever. The igniter lighting over and over isn't a concern, but it's also the cheapest part by a mile, so buy 3 of them if you want.

>>2990702
>In a real scenario no gas means the thing starts, the pressure sensor sees nothing, then everything turns off and it tries again in a bit.

That's exactly what it did not do though. That's the concern. What would cause that, and is it critically unsafe?

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I asked my gf for you. Don't thank me, thank Elong.

>>2990745
>>2990745
Marry that girl.

I know it's an issue, that's not really what I'm asking. I'm asking if there's maybe a way to handle it without condemning the entire valve. But it's not surprising, all this integrated electronic bullshit is retarded like that. You could have had the card with all that logic on it as a module that clicks in and when it's not behaving correctly you replace just the card, but no, it's all cased up inside the unit so even an electronic failure that doesn't even stop the boiler from functioning requires disconnecting the gas and taking the entire fuckin valve out of the line and replacing it.

>>2990748
Like the AI says, measure it with a multimeter. You can do it just as well with a slightly better multimeter. Youtube has tutorials. If it's the detector, it's a cheap and easy fix. You can also check the wiring for shorts yourself, after you establish that the sensor itself is fine.

>>2990745
This is kind of retarded because a flame sensor literally cannot be in a detecting flame state when there is no flame present.

The control applies AC to the electrode and the AC is rectified to DC current through the flame and flows to ground, the board is able to detect this. A grounded flame sensor will never allow gas to flow. You would need an intricate set up to be able to trick a flame sensor.

There is pretty much 0 chance that you have a dangerous situation. The AI is correct that the control will just stop working instead of failing in an “on” state, it’s very common.

>>2990748
Listen I hear what you’re saying but having it all integrated like that is not a big deal. It keeps it safe from dust and water and simplifies the burner circuit. It’s EXTREMELY simple to replace a residential boiler gas valve, you should honestly replace it yourself if you think it’s an issue. Some supply houses won’t want to sell any combustion related parts to someone without a license/not with a contractor but you can find one that does

>>2990748

the only danger of no flame is unburnt gas.
so yeah, he made your thing dance, but what exactly was the safety issue?
In no scenario created be your guy or normal operation will gas not be ignited immediately when available with the parts you have... i think he's adding unnecessary wear on your equipment, basically abusing your ignitor to try and take your money.

>>2990825
for the record i am not this anon, he's just spot on and im agreeing

>>2990838
>flame goes out
>gas keeps flowing
or
>ignition fails
>gas keeps flowing

>>2990864
That's part of what's so weird about it, it knows to turn off the igniter when flame is present so it is proving the flame. And it doesn't turn off the igniter when there is no flame, which is a different behavior and implies in some way it knows there is no flame.

>>2990826
If your boiler is submerged in water to the level it would have to be to reach the smartvalve you have bigger problems than what your smartvalve is doing.

>itt retards trying to reinvent basic controls
There is literally no problem and you are inviting yourself to be scammed. Just pay the guy if he was that convincing

I got a second opinion from a different heating and cooling guy today and he confirmed that the smart valve is behaving normally, but it "sounds funny" like it might go soon so it might still be a good idea to replace it anyway. So he wrote me a quote for that repair plus a number of other things he thinks will be a future problem that nobody else mentioned before, like the boiler isn't showing the right pressure on the gauge(it was off at the time, I'm not sure that matters?) and to replace the backflow valve, autofill valve and expansion tank to resolve that, and some other bits and bobs, and so it would be something like $5-6k to get everything in line. But, he says, most people wouldn't do that because a whole new boiler would be about $20k with all new controls and everything and I wouldn't have to worry about it going forward. Even though my current boiler is in relatively good condition for its age, it's 30 years old, so I have to keep in mind that its days are numbered. Now since he left his company's sales girls are blowing up my phone trying to get me to book an appointment for an in home assessment to figure out a quote for a new boiler. Every single time you talk to any one of these people in person or on the phone they try to sell you something. And a lot of their work even looks more expensive than the previous company.

All this to say, fuck, how did life come to this? I have a different set of skills I've built up for my own career and I'm still learning all the time and I can only learn so much, so I figure when I need help with something I don't know anything about I can get a professional that knows this stuff to help me out. But you can't really do that, you have to be your own hvac guy, your own plumber, your own electrician, your own auto mechanic, your own lawn and tree trimmer guy, your own insurance agent, your own financial planner, all because if you're not someone is definitely going to try to use what you don't know to screw you.

>>2991108
You have 3 choices - suck it up and do all of your own work yourself, deal with the cheap service company that employs retards that don't know what they're doing to screw you, or deal with the expensive company where every single representative including the technicians are salespeople pestering you and trying to gouge you.

>>2991108
HVAC is one of the specialty fields, especially in residential, where virtually not a single technician knows what they are talking about and all of them are bad at their job. They will know SOME things and be right about SOME things, but it's very unlikely that you will find a person that actually knows everything they should. You either learn everything about servicing gas boilers and do it yourself, or you accept that you will pay one guy for one repair, and probably later also have to pay other guy for other repair, and then in the end you will be scammed on a whole new boiler, and it might still very well not work properly. I personally learned the entirety of hydro HVAC for residential and heat pumps and now only deal with heat pumps (which are very easy to install /diy/, easier to service and haven't had to service them since they are new).
That aside, why does a new boiler cost $20k, do you live in Australia or something? Residential stuff is like $2k to buy in Europe, maybe another 2-3k for install when it's just a simple swap.

>>2991108
>gets second opinion
>tries selling him even more replacements just for the lols
>also suggests that at this point he might as well spend 3-4 times as much to replace the whole thing
sounds like you live in scam-central

>>2991138
I was kind of floored by that. He said they don't just do the boiler, they redo the plumbing around it and you get a new expansion tank and new thermostat controls and new zone valves and all that shit. I asked "are you repiping the system in the whole house?" he said no. I know a boiler itself is $2-3k and I figured it would be a few thousand for labor because it's a lot of work, but $20k sounds pretty crazy. Is $10k a more typical cost for that?

That's what I'm learning, if you could just pay a few thousand for a boiler and some copper pipe and solder and install it yourself you could save so much money and not have to deal with retards and their horse shit gouging and upselling. I could sweat pipes. But I don't have the experience or knowledge someone really should have to take on a big job like that.

Thinking on it more, I think the previous owner must have been doing a lot of this stuff himself, because there's some plumbing and mods and stuff around the house that are a little on the nasty side to say the least, but this boiler lasted 30 years and it's not even the original boiler in the house, there's a 30 year span before that in the life of the house where presumably he had another boiler going 30 years. So he was doing something right.

>>2991160
If it's a really old boiler then it might be worth replacing for a condensation one, you save a fair amount of money on lower gas use. You probably can just keep your whole house open as one zone if your zoning is fucky or the valves are on their last leg. Or if the zoning works, then just don't fuck with it, looks a lot like they were trying to upsell you on garbage for a $20k payday.
https://rentry.co/heatshit this is for heat pumps mainly, but system principles also apply to condensation boilers, and individual components in the system are also the same. Switch to PEXAL wherever you can, it's easy to work with and fairly cheap and durable enough, PEX/AL can even be used for the gas line. Copper with push fittings is also very good but considerably more expensive (but a fart in the wind compared to the money you were getting quoted anyway). Realistically a /diy/ boiler swap with some updated piping shouldn't be more than $3k provided you're in the usual 20-30kW range. Heat pump /diy/ would probably be twice that, depending on how good a deal you can score on the unit.

>>2990864

ok, i get that, you did say that. i was a lil drunk at the time.

So this is or was all in place, working, now? Was the maintenance just like filters, a check up, or something else?

It sounds to me like there are two people who said things that possibly could be true, but there is a conflict of interest because of the money on the line...

The guy artificially shutting off the gas on a system thats 30 years old to try and convince you something needs to be replaced? Possibly true, possibly fishing for a sale. I think you are very correct to get a second opinion.

the second guy may have told you true things, but if he works for a large enough outfit to have sales people, beware. They ALWAYS try and get you to replace everything, then its so complicated and fancy you basically have to call them when it fucks up, and they do. Too much wind in the exhaust pressure be too high will cut the whole thing out because a sensor trips. (you just reset in this scenario but my point is theyre very expensive option is NOT trouble free forever for you, just gets them lots of money)

The only voice without a conflict of interest right now is yours. Id get down and dirty trying to find a book for the service tech for your boiler and try and verify the guage pressure.

I was a maintenance tech for a property management company for a while maintaining roughly 100 shitty old new england houses and being on call for their fuckups. Calls in the middle of the night were for new shit more often than the old.

pointed out a bunch of other stuff for down the road---> salesperson giving a call... this sounds highly suspicious of being your most knowledgable, leanest, least preditory contractor.

you own it, actually own it is my suggestion. I heat with a direct vent propane stove. Expensive, but no power required. One little thermopile

>>2991171
Yes, the second guy at least made mechanical and logical sense. At the end of the day he ultimately said it would be a good idea to replace the valve in question, but because it is very old and making whiny creaky noises and not because it's going to burn my house down. So at least he got us down from a critical threat of danger to a preventative maintenance advisory.

I'm not sure what happened to this new company, though. Years ago they were one of the companies I consulted for installing a generator for the house and I didn't choose them for the work but they gave us the cheapest quote. I also don't remember dealing with a fleet of sales girls. But now every phone call they go for an upsell and the prices they're quoting for boiler/plumbing stuff is making me cross eyed. When this tech was talking sense and said their on call maintenance package was cheaper than the previous company in my head I thought I was definitely going to move my business over to them, but then he showed me their quotes for work and I started changing my mind. They want a lot of money for their work and they are DEFINITELY the kind of company that WILL find some work that needs to be done if you let them.

>>2991142
I think so, but I don't think my area is unique. Everyone knows the poor old lady that gets swindled by the mechanics and plumbers and roofers and shit. Even if she knew a single thing about this stuff she's too old to do anything about it herself now, she needs help and some guy tells her she needs this and this and this and that to turn her heat back on in the middle of winter and she just has to say "oh, alright......" It's sickening.

>>2991179

Given how the world turns, sounds like the company could have got bought out by a national corporate chain... maybe they just had a shift.

I would point to my experience watching these guys- not my actual knowledge about them, to try and do surgical and logical maintenance on what you have till problems large enough force your investment. You ask very good questions- if you do the whole 9 yards in in the basement, is there going to be anything done to increase or ensure the lifetime of the rest of the system?

If it's creaky and cranky, and the mouthfeel is yeah, working for now, with the emphasis on for now, I'd lose a little bit of faith in humanity, search for a small hvac company, ideally a one person show, (not sure if those exist where you are) and try and be firm about you are looking to have that valve replaced, and you wouldn't be opposed to an assessment of the unit in question but that's the scope of the work for now.

You kind of worked your way to it but once you weather the storm of how an entirely new setup or thing would be better, often the issue in question is much more limited, like one valve or switch or motor.

Everything has a service life, and if it's not new, yes, it could be. Now, do they know how to fix what's in front of them was kind of the energy I found with hvac guys. I was the one opening the door so they could give the management company a quote to give the owner of the house.

a bunch of guys are just ninnies and totally can keep the old ubits going, but dont want to if they can get away with installing new. (and leaving all the old stuff lying on its side on the floor)

Sucks you have to deal wjth contractors as a single woman. There's a lot of bs in the priviledge, social justice, this that and the other thing about this world if the parts of our cars are still called master and slave cylinders, but one thing that is for sure true is you have it about as hard as you can in this regard.

Wield your power about never calling people again if they overquote you, thats the only reason you got the call is the only tool that comes to mind

>>2991184
As an elderly unwed black woman with 7 children and grandchildren to care for, I've faced jim crow, I've faced segregation, I've faced gerrymandering, I've faced firehoses at protests, I've faced police violence, but by far the greatest adversity I've ever faced in my long life is white contractors that gouge the elderly.

>>2990685
>cuck
It takes time to learn things. Don't be a dick to someone who is still working on it.

Gas valve cutoff is working but igniter still sparking sounds like a short/bad electrics.

>>2990745
i like that your ai thinks you are a gay nigger and called you dumb

>>2990653
Clean the flame sensor rod with a magic eraser or fine grit sandpaper.

You hired a professional
You don't like what he told you
so you ask randoms online to tell you everything is fine

But you are too cheap to buy a fucking gas detector on amazon

>>2990653
that's what you get for buying "smart" appliances, dumbfuck