Sorry ketolards and gym bros, but another one of your myths got debunked by based chad Dr. Greger. Turns out you've been fed ketolard propaganda, yet again.>The common explanations for the cause of the obesity epidemic put forward by the food industry and policymakers, such as inactivity or a lack of willpower, are not only wrong, but actively harmful fallacies.>https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=vwqQQopDg-0
Veganism ruined me. Nutrition science is pure slop.The body doesn't burn "calories". It's not a fusion reactor. Even the most reducible mitochondrial respiration interaction cycle is merely a subset of the chemical processes distributing information. Plant-based makes people lose weight because the diet is so bad the liver gives up on storing excess toxins in fat.
>>77548123Sorry ketolard, your made up story is irrelevant. Try dealing with the real world aka science for once.
>>77548001>The common explanations for the cause of the obesity epidemic>inactivity>wrong>actively harmful fallaciesNah bruh, here is your mechanistic evidence right here:>Molecular Effects of Physical Activity and Body Composition: A Systematic Review and Meta-Analysis>https://www.mdpi.com/1660-4601/22/4/637t. exerkine user
Dude, get a life. You've been spamming this board since 2019.
>>77548001why dont you just tell me what teh video says
>>77548001What should I eat to look the opposite of what Michael Greger looks like?
>>77548242>If I have muscles I am healthy Idiot
>>77548274Gregor is a body composition literature denier, right?>Deep learning-based body composition analysis from whole-body magnetic resonance imaging to predict all-cause mortality in a large western population>https://www.thelancet.com/journals/ebiom/article/PIIS2352-3964(24)00503-6/fulltext>Cox regression revealed an independent association between VSM (adjusted hazard ratio [aHR]: 0.88, 95% confidence interval [CI] [0.81–0.91], p = 0.00023), VSMFF (aHR: 1.06, 95% CI [1.02–1.10], p = 0.0043), and VIMAT (aHR: 1.19, 95% CI [1.05–1.35], p = 0.0056) and mortality after adjustment for demographics (age, sex, BMI, race) and cardiometabolic risk factors (alcohol consumption, smoking status, hypertension, diabetes, history of cancer, blood serum markers).He's BTFO on that; yes having muscles generally makes you healthier until the high end of the overweight range when increasing cardiovascular mortality outweighs decreasing trauma mortality.
>>77548123>Nutrition science is pure slopYes instead we should go by our feelings and what the grifter of the week is saying.
>>77548242>MAHA shirtI don't know anything about this fag but that shirt cements him as a tard
>>77548378Biology is computationally intractable but there are better models. However, this is unreachable to mirror learning midwits.
>>77548001What is your simple prescription for weight loss then? The one I do is "eat less" and it works amazing.
>>77548123Did you run blood tests or keep a food diary? OP might not want to hear your anecdote, but I do!
>>77548427>Biology is computationally intractableIt's really not; lots of in silico studies these days are confirmed on in vitro AND in vivo models. The problem with new-tri-shun """/s0i/"""yance is population cohorts with questionnaires; shrimple as, read chemoproteomics studies instead and you'll figure out what foods ack-shilly do.
>>77548488Silence, ketolard. Shrimple as, intervention studies also exist, and furthermore>longest>life>expectancy>Adventist>vegans>in>californiaYou will NOT find ANY intervention OR observation WHERE meat IS healthy.
>>77548869I'm not a ketolard, and you're scientifically illiterate.>Study finds vegetarians over 80 less likely to reach 100>https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2026/02/260225081214.htmprotip: mechanistic studies say meat peptides inhibit sarcopenia-associated protein networks
>>77548152Increasing physical activity makes almost no difference for weight loss compared to what people think. The main lever of control we have over CICO is not eating calorically dense food like meat and chips and soda. It's false and misleading for people to say you can just work out more to burn meaningfully more calories. You'd have to walk an extra 1.5 miles to burn off the calories of a single oreo cookie, or a single pack of mayonnaise, or a single tablespoon of butter, or 2-3 miles for a 12 oz coke.>>77548396He doesnt endorse everything RFK Jr does such as muh seed oil hysteria. You however are a libtard ketolard.
>>77548880That only applies to underweight and frail seniors, not hulking ketolardasses like you. It's been debunked several times. Try again, ketolard.
>>77548881CICO doesn't account for foods that directly modify your metabolism, such as barberries through downstream mTOR axis modulation.
>>77548884Strictly speaking it should, but you've brought up a good point about how different foods affect calorie absorption, all to the benefit of vegans. "A calorie is a calorie" is a murdervore/diet soda shibboleth
>>77548242except hair and going to the gym they look about the samealso the comparison is unfair as one is posed and prepared
>>77548886Literally not just absorption; different bioactive foods affect calorie intake/usage, muscle catabolism/anabolism, fat whitening/browning, and many other aspects of metabolism.>>77548883How bout this one?>Comparing postprandial inflammatory responses to a plant-based meat alternative, grass-finished beef, and grain-finished beef in healthy middle-aged adults: a 3-group randomized crossover trial>https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0002916526000018>ResultsNo significant differences in postprandial inflammatory markers were observed across interventions (P = 0.64). CRP increased slightly (+0.05 to +0.38 mg/L), TNF-α decreased moderately (−0.75 to −1.08 pg/mL), and IL-6 increased slightly (+1.29 to +1.92 pg/mL) across interventions (all P > 0.05).Oops, looks like Dr. Gregor's favorite inflammatory boogeymen might be limited only to ketomudervores with the worst cooking skill issues.
>the brian schizo gets along with MoxyteTruly the worst timeline
>>77548001>faggot OP doesn't give us a simple quote explaining the myth and how it's wrongYeah, I'm not clicking that shit and giving some faggot views.
>>77548880>Calls him scientifically illiterate>posts an article instead of the study itself Selection bias and only applied to people who were frail. Obviously if old people don't eat enough calories they are going to die more. I don't think we have very many 80 year olds on a board about weight lifting. >>77548894Gregor advocates against saturated fat. The plant based meats in that study had just as much saturated fat as the meat it was trying to replace. And those aren't even long term results, when you look at actual health outcomes, plant based replacements do better https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32780794/FYI I fuckign hate Gregor and think he is a grifter and knowingly lies about certain things.
>>77548139I'm HCLF.>>77548463I was vegan for 6 years. I didn't keep food diary, but quickly noticed sensitivities to most compounds, including phytates, oxalates, salicylates, lectins, nickel, copper, and other phytochemical biowarfare. I was traumatized by the amount of suffering involved in industrial factory farms, thus never thought I'd be able to not be vegan again. Nonetheless, I think ethical questions are more nuanced. I'm >>77548416I've tried everything to make it work: systems designed around minimalism, maximalism, Bryan Johnson's Blueprint, semi elemental diet (supplements + refined grains + lab tested protein powders), etc. Nothing provide as much relief as reintroducing beef and dairy (especially with respect to chronic brainfog).My art skills got worse and worse on a vegan diet and I feel brain damaged.
>>77548944>FYI I fuckign hate Gregor and think he is a grifter and knowingly lies about certain things.Like what, ketolard? The vax?
>>77549384>phytates, oxalates, salicylates, lectins, nickel, copper, and other phytochemical>lectins>copper>nothing worked except beef and milkYeah right, retarded ketolard. I'll believe it when you publish the case study.
>>77548186Vegans live an average of 10 years longer, so I can afford to spend them educating and HUMILIATING ketolards on this board. See you in 2029.
>>77549455>Vegans live an average of 10 years longerNo, they don't.
>>77549435Nta but I don't think anyone cares if you believe it or not. It's not the point. You, on the other hand, seem to think it is the point which means you think you are able to change minds but you haven't. I can guarantee you haven't changed one single opinion or eating habit on this site. For all your time and seething you have achieved nothing. Is it true you've been queefing about since 2019? Lol. It's glorious that you will never breed.
>>77549629You're right. Compared to a ketolard we probably live 20 years longer.>>77549637>It's glorious that you will never breed.Tell me about your kids, ketochud. As if a foid wants a murdervore.
>ketojeet reduced to spamming porn because he can't make an argumentSad.
>>77548123interesting
>>77549994>made up bullshit by a ketolard>interesting
>>77549905>we probably live 20 years longer.Sure you do.
>>77550035Yep. And we look damn good while doing it.
>>77548396That shirt pic is almost a decade old at this point anon...
Vegans have- Twice the odds of depression (OR ~2.14) https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32483598/- Twice the odds of cognitive impairment (OR ~2.05) https://www.nature.com/articles/s41514-025-00213-4- Twice the risk of hip fracture (HR 2.31, CI 1.66–3.22) https://link.springer.com/article/10.1186/s12916-020-01815-3- Shorter life expectancy https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC8881926/ and lower odds of healthy aging https://www.nature.com/articles/s41514-025-00213-4- Higher risks of B12 deficiency despite supplementation https://vegsoc.org/blog/the-epic-oxford-study/- Higher incidence of menstrual irregularity https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/2008867/(c.f. https://katspartz.substack.com/p/why-you-should-eat-meat-even-if-you)
>>77550922Fake news, vegans live longer among adventists.
>>77548001Gregor isn't wrong. Exercise is for cardio, flexibility or strength. It burns shit for calories.
>>77551718He is wrong. Cardio increases total daily energy expenditure (post-exercise and resting metabolic rate) mainly responsible for fat loss benefits in this context, not to the same extent as high intensity exercise though.
>>77551727It also increases calories in by a nearly equal amount via hunger hormones. Retarded ketolard.
>>77548242you should eat a dick. I'll volunteer. hmu if you in TAMPA
>>77548123>storing excess toxinsI wonder when will this fucking bs die. The body doesn't produce, store, metabolize or deals with "toxins". If you had toxins in your body then you'd fucking sick.There aren't toxins in regular metabolism. >inb4 muh toxins in goyslopDrink water. That's all your body needs to get rid of whatever you eat and shouldn't be there.
>>77548274Unironically yes. If you're somehow sick then you wouldn't be able to gain an anesthetic body like that.
>>77548001exercise helps you build muscle but it doesn't do shit to help you lose weight because it burns very little caloriesyou just have stop eating or you have to eat low calorie foods
if exercise was useful at losing weight you wouldn't have bodybuilders with bloated bellies. you wouldn't have fat body builders.
>>77548242he doesn't work out clearlyi think that's his main problemv3gan gains eats a vegan diet and mogs that guy on the left
>>77551922Insulting others and spreading disinformation is against animal welfare and the values you pretend to have.https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/31834814/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/29897822/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/36868314/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/9778093/
>>77552071what if she was that skinny and then got belly fat? What is she doing differently? Her thighs finally touch together but I find it hard to believe oatmeal protein shakes alone would cause that
>>77548001veganism is a mental disorder inside an eating disorder
>>77548001>always do the opposite…
>>77552517Doing the opposite of what ketolards say is generally a good idea except when they accidentally agree with Dr. Greger
>>77550922>Twice the odds of depressionMakes sense considering they live in a world that drastically opposes their values. >Twice the odds of cognitive impairmentMight want to actually read it: "Additionally, the heath impact of vegetarian diets may vary depending on diet quality, as our results indicated that vegetarians with higher diet quality did not significantly differ in terms of healthy aging outcomes compared to omnivores" Yeah if you don't supplement B12 and eat like garbage you will have issues. >https://link.springer.com/article/10.1186/s12916-020-01815-3Been deboonked. Vegans tend to have lower BMI. When controlled for BMI and adequate calcium intake there is zero difference: https://hsph.harvard.edu/news/eating-a-plant-based-diet-over-time-appears-safe-regarding-risk-of-hip-fracture/>https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC8881926/People are still posting this. For the 10000th time this study does not control for socioeconomic status. Wealthy countries with better healthcare eat more meat. >https://www.nature.com/articles/s41514-025-00213-4You literally posted the same study twice. See: "Additionally, the heath impact of vegetarian diets may vary depending on diet quality, as our results indicated that vegetarians with higher diet quality did not significantly differ in terms of healthy aging outcomes compared to omnivores">https://vegsoc.org/blog/the-epic-oxford-study/Hilarious how most of this paper is just saying "vegans have lower BMI, blood pressure, serum cholesterol, heart disease, cancer diabetes, diverticular disease and cataracts" and you think it's making vegans look bad because some of them don't take a supplement lmao.Pathetic.
>>77553428>live in a world that drastically opposes their values>if you don't supplement B12 and eat like garbage you will have issues.Made up hypothesis.>adequate calcium intakeImpossible in the context of a vegan diet without high intake of metals and phenolic toxins.>does not control for socioeconomic statusWealthy people are also selective for higher quality non-toxic ingredients. Nonetheless this cannot actually be adjusted for due to circular causal relations. Associative studies are generally weak, but this isn't a rebuttal.>depending on diet qualityHigher quality omnivorous diet exists. This isn't a counter-argument either.>oxford study"Omnivores" ate mostly plant-based in this cohort. Lower BMI and cholesterol are also negative signals.>you think>patheticThis is a copy-paste from a blog that I didn't read nor design. I've been vegan for a while and I'm aware of all associated science. Unfriendly tendencies suggests liver toxicity, and a cognitive framework that isn't truth-driven and will fail to assess the weight of evidences, causal deduction, "devil's in the details", and short-term / long-term inversion of effects.
>>77553473>made up hypothesisIt's literally a hypothesis in the paper you cited you dungball>Impossible in the context of a vegan diet without high intake of metals and phenolic toxins.Tofu is literally made from calcium and provides 50% the DV. Fortified soi milk as well is very calcium rich. Show me one person who has gotten "heavy metal poisoning" from tofu or soi milk.>Wealthy people are also selective for higher quality non-toxic ingredients. Nonetheless this cannot actually be adjusted for due to circular causal relations. Associative studies are generally weak, but this isn't a rebuttal.You can definitely adjust for socioeconomic status. It's one of the most impactful confounders and any epidemiology worth it's salt does adjust for it. You can even look at the data yourself all of the high mortality/low meat countries are third world shitholes, with the largest meat eating countries being first world places. You're delusional if you think the only thing separating us from fucking Haiti in life expectancy is meat consumption. >Lower BMI and cholesterol are also negative signals.Lower? No not at all. I mean yeah you can have extremes which are bad, but compared to the regular population, having a lower BMI and serum cholesterol is a good thing. Which is why the vegans had lower CVD, cancer, diabetes, etc.>I'm aware of all associated scienceYou're obviously not if you're posting that meat life expectancy paper while ignoring the mountains of evidence that show us the benefits of increased fruit/vegetable/whole grain consumption. Or not even reading the papers yourself considering they all explain themselves and just copy pasting them from a blog....which you also apparently didn't read?
>>77552071I'm 5'10 and 155lbs btw
>>77552085damn what the fuck, he turned into a normal black guy
>>77553473>>77553723One thing to consider is the diversity of what is a healthy vegan diet. There is probably a cohort of vegans who avoid seed oils, nuts, onions, and salt, and seek out a specifically low fat diet.
>>77553723>in the paperThey literally suggest a healthier diet is more important than food categories. It's made up regardless.>dungballWhy are you acting like a bitter toddler? I was vegan for the animals, unlike rapey narcissists like you.>TofuThis is effectively a calcium supplement, associated with CVD and calcification issues. It's not protein-bound nor present in a food matrix. Calcium in milk is casein-bound which lowers the absorption rate and it is present with adequate phosphorus. Tofu also contains metals and toxic flavones.>can definitely adjustNope. Statistical events do not exist in isolation when decisions are recursively iterated on priors. You cannot correct a statistical error with reference data that contains the errors iteslf. There is no pure notion of statistical ground for true causal deduction in population studies.>only thing separatingYou are making up interpretations of my statements.>mountains of evidenceWeak interpretation.>apparently didn't readI'm not trying to convince anyone from anything. The reaction image was cute.
>>77551957Liver and kidney bros in shambles
>>77551957Hence why reabsorbing your own pee and poo is optimal.
