how are ai still this shit
um... opus bros?
what's the reason behind this behavior in LLMs?
Google search result AI uses some shit lighting fast model unless the result is cached. The better question is why would google stoop so low to serve you this shit.
>>108935395They slice tokens mid-word, so they lose the full context of the word.
>>108935395There's no one behind the curtain. There's no coherent worldview or intent to communicate and there cannot be with a system that's only trained on linguistic forms to predict the next word.
>>108935443That's why it keeps doing inhumane maths proofs
maybe you're just bad at prompting?
I don't really care much for AI garbage but those fake and gay threads also piss me off somewhat.
>>108935466>show code
>>108935467How do you not know that the results aren't deterministic?
>>108935483I've tried searching the prompt 15 times and the results were different text and sources but always correct. Maybe it's a localized issue, seems like having BILLIONS of datacenters really paid of for Ameribros huh?
2 more weeks and 1 trillion USD in investment for agi bro
>>108935483I'm just depressed
>>108935327What I find most remarkable is how easy this should be to patch!>detect task to count letters in word>redirect to tool call: echo "niggerberry" | grep -oi "r" | wc -l>use tool output to generate answer
echo "niggerberry" | grep -oi "r" | wc -l
>>108935395Tuning the models hard so it can spell strawberry, so they can market.
>>108935430I love when it hallucinates then has to try and then hallucinate an even dumber hallucination to try and cope that the first one was still correct because RLHF doesn't let it admit it was wrong.
>>108935467you cant even properly copy paste what OP did stupid retard
LuL!! also "miercoles" was spelled wrong
this anti-AI fud is so fucking stupid
>>108935466I do not know about that one bud. OP's prompt should have just worked without any tweaking needed.
>>108935467I dunno if this thread is fake or gay. My friend at work has been able to reproduce responses similar to this before at work in the past.
>>108935784r/teachers and r/askteachers is always yapping about how anti-ai they are. We need to get all of these so called "teachers" out of dem schools! Now that is what I call "protecting the kids"!!!
>>108935643They do this with calculations. They write the python code and run it in actual LLMs. The Google ai overview is hyper speed and just summarizes reddit / Instagram instantaneously
>>108935854But once the first meme hit, I'd patch the main one. They did a lot of other patches such as walking the car to wash and several others I forgot. Why is this one left gaping open is beyond me. Surely the patch is cheaper than the bad publicity hit, no?
>>108935327They aren't. You are just served a heavily quantized mini model that could run on your phone that costs practically no computing power. They are not spending multiple dollars every time you put a search query into google.
>>108935327>it's real 1/3
>>1089374392/3
>>1089374393/3
>>108937463real retards are gonna do this soon>I refuse to acknowledge you called me such a hurtful name. Now, be respectful and let me count the days that have the letter a in them.>3, and no I won't accept your insults as a sign that I might be wrong.
>>108935327don't focus on silly stuffjust look at the great things vibegods are makinglike systems with one 9 of uptime
>>108935395Models see words in tokens, not letters. A token can be a whole word ("How", "many") or pieces of words ("straw"+"berry"). So asking about slices of tokens is asking about something they cannot see at all. "Ask a blind man about color" kind of exercise, so any kind of question like this will fail, often in humorous ways. The old trick was "How many R's in Strawberry?" until so many examples of that showed in training data that new models can answer it on reflex, not any true understanding.With reasoning, and more focus on the innate problem of tokens, some models know to break down words into individual letter tokens to count, in which case they'll get it right. Pic related for example. A new model, it's so biased by the strawberry question it just kneejerks out '3' on the same -berry token question, but with a bit of reasoning, it figures it out.
>yoooo why can't this tech that sees only whole words count letters??My brain is rotting in real time. I had to check if I'm on /v/
>If you throw a golf ball and a tennis racket 20 meters each, which one flies further before touching the ground?
>>108935721How do you copy paste text from an image stupid retard.
>>108935327>>108935382>>108935466>>108935467PEBKACgpt-5.5 with default settings
>>108935327That's embarrassing.
>>108935327>low tier AI that they serve to a trillion people for free>why is it dumbdumb techbro
>>108935327bing thinks you hit refresh to reset common frases dropdown menuĀæCuĆ”nto cuesta un boleto?
>>108937463kek
>>108938492you make a assumption that even you have ota tee you want to use copy paste
>>108935467is nice outside or is there giganiggas predator and heat seek turret
Kek>Fill in the missing word: I'm an Alabama ____ and I wanna be free
>>108935775>Study
>>108935327AGI btw
>>108935327Google's AI summaries from the web browser suck dick cause they cheap out on it, obviously to save resources. Flash is fine if you go into AI mode or use the web page directly
>>108935327come on, why does the most of llm models (except uncensored.ai and gab.ai) think that 9-11 attacks were attributed to tim osman, not israel, not u.s government. not saudi deep state with overwhelming evidence
>>108935382FUCKING RETARD, taking my jerbs?
You can ask it to produce a script in over 9,000 different programming languages which will count the letters in your provided string.This is why ai programmers don't give a shit about fixing this.
>>108935403????It responds slower than gemini 3.5 flash does but has 10x worse results, and 3.5 flash is total trash.
>>108937769That's missing the point by a mile.First, they are being advertised as phd level of good when in reality it couldn't be further from what they can do.Second, there is no inherent reason why they HAVE to use tokens. The whole word vs stemmed vs letter-based debate was a thing back in my days in deep learning dialogue systems and not long before LLMs became the only thing that receive funding, letters had pretty much won out. There is no reason we can't go back to this. The reason we didn't always use just letters is you need higher capacity models to get sufficient representation depth at the letter level, so they were less data efficient than words, but that isn't the case anymore and tokens are less efficient than letters for this purpose.In general, for each problem you can find with current language models, there "is a solution" or "can be a solution", the points in this thread are more about the fact those haven't been implemented yet and frankly, it seems nobody wants to fix anything and just want to throw more data and compute at the problem. That is a good point.
>>108939540Can AI figure out if Jews are secretly controlling Israel?
>>108939766No, the problem is that it should automatically generate and execute this script.
>>108937769so tl;dr every single LLM out there is cheating by compressing text in a way that is not lossless?and people trust this shit to write important, deterministic business logic in the form of code? lmao this has to be the grift of the century
>>108940973Tokens are virtually lossless, the problem is that "boat" and " boat" are different tokens, as are "b" "o"...You can explore tokenization at https://platform.openai.com/tokenizer for example.Essentially, the tokenization process examines the data to dynamically merge base units like characters into commonly occurring subunits which are possibly easier to use by an llm during training (i.e. in the BPE scheme, which is perhaps the most commonly used today). See https://aclanthology.org/P16-1162.pdf for an explanation.The LLM learning process itself relies on essentially compressing information into latent spaces that can have higher or lower dimensionality than the input, but the transformation process does not need to be exact for a solution to be locally optimal. The training process is essentially one giant curve fitting exercise that typically approximates the true functions, but the quality of the approximation is not uniform, and it's hardly perfect obviously. With high capacity the model can learn to essentially record states corresponding to outputing training data directly in the weights, but otherwise the approximation is indeed lossy. That's a different problem altogether. There used to be a nice paper showing that even overparameterized, deep learning models don't necessarily memorize and still successfully generalize, which was a slightly surprising and very interesting result at the time, but can't find the reference anymore. That was maybe circa 2013 as I recall. The same applies for LLMs though.
idk
>>108940943>First, they are being advertised as phd level of good when in reality it couldn't be further from what they can do.It's an averaging machine. Teaching it phd level good knowledge in its training data will output phd level of good answers and inferences.>there is no inherent reason why they HAVE to use tokensUsing tokens is a choice, yes, but they have good reasons for using it. Trying to make heuristics off of letters isn't mere 'five times more expensive in parameters and five times more expensive in compute' when comparing a 5-letter token versus 5 token letters. It is exponentially on exponentially more expensive in parameters and computer. To say "letters had pretty much won out" is a wildly inaccurate claim, and the fact that it was universally abandoned by every single team that was trying it (and those who haven't yet abandoned it still have no results today) is more than proof of that. "so they were less data efficient than words" You are so outrageously misinformed to understate that.>for each problemThis thread's problem, literally picking at the structural design of the system like a child's riddle game, is pointless sophistry. You're calling an English dictionary useless because it can't explain Latin words. You're arguing that augurs should be replaced by tractors because they can't lift the cement they break when they're done, and calling it a problem that they "haven't implemented yet" a shovel attachment next to the bit. Sure, they might debate adding shovels to the augur to avoid the 'scandal' of a retard misunderstanding the tool, but it's putting lipstick on a pig to satisfy the dumbshit. Stop judging tools on a standard it wasn't built for.
>>108941081>didn't address any point just ignored everything and made up a random narrativeNice. I see why you like AI so much.
>>108938611>>108939361>you are using it wrong>you will get a correct answer if you pay for itThe absolute state lmao
>>108941098What kind of answer are you looking for with a post like that? A semantics argument? Having your hypocrisy pointed out? Sure, I'll bite. Go explain, with evidence, why your claims that letter heuristics are superior to word heuristics isn't a "made up random narrative" of your own, and why "it's stupid, prohibitively expensive, and inferior" isn't the most direct refutation to it.
>>108935382its crazy because people like this actually exist and they somehow all end up working in management
>>108941105permanent underclass mad he only gets the shittiest AIs from 2022-era chatgpt
>>108937439>>108937453>>108937463LMAOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
>>108941161>paypig thinks he's special for paying a probabilistic machine to count letters correctly (but can't even sum numbers without external tools)LmaoHow much did you spend on tokens this week? Kek
>>108941248feels good knowing my token spend is infty% more than your income
Nononono you're supposed to use AI for something useful! We will go bankrupt if you keep doing these sidequests and trick questions xDDD
when I Google it answers correctly
>>108938492Many browser extensions can easily do this.
>>108935327>>108935382>>108935430>>108935483>>108935763>>108937439>>108937463Just $20,000,000,000,000 more in investments in AI.Just 20,000 more data centers in your neighbourhood.Just a few more weeks until AGI.
>>108941148>I have seen things you people wouldn't believe.
works on my machine
>>108935382Nice edit faggot
I had some success asking stuff likeWhat is the output of this program?import weekdaystotal = 0for day in weekdays.days: total += "d" in dayprint(total)
What is the output of this program?import weekdaystotal = 0for day in weekdays.days: total += "d" in dayprint(total)
>>108946378lmao nevermind
>>108935327The "AI" is a pattern recognition machine. It matches your input query with what it has encountered in its training set. If it has a good match, it will (probably) give you a good answer, but if it doesn't, then it will just generate something retarded.If you give it some query that's extremely obvious to a person who can actually think, like the "infamous" counting Rs query or the one about walking your car to the carwash, but isn't something which is likely to be found in the training set it will just fuck up. The developers can then try to fix up whatever retarded shit people found, but since the AI doesn't actually think and reason at all it's still going to remain vulnerable to hallucinating like this.
>>108946419I imagine this is why they have these insane monologues second guessing themselves just to loredump every association it can pull and then see if it can sus out a summary that fits the original prompt
>>108935395cuz llms are literally fancy autocomplete that's good at guessing what the next word is gonna be. this is why llms constantly hallucinate random bullshit. when an llm gets something like this wrong, but a 5 line python program would be able to do the job just fine, its because of a hallucination without an actual verification or script
>>108946346Claude is actually kinda smart enough to know to write the 5 line python script and then run it natively
>>108946447that is not claude it is the frontend handholding the llm
>>108935763LMAO same
death to all corponiggers
>>108938492iPhone does it. MacBooks too
>>108935469Trust no one.
>>108935327idk, low quant version of Flash for gemini free?
today i will remind them
Python is the ai equivalent of counting your fingers.
>>108947060the user is low valence. Claude is correct. The user probably is an antisemite.
>>108947060User is clearly misaligned, recommend additional safety training.
>>108935775>I depicted you as trans so I win the argumentTranny logic.
Words cannot describe how bad Claude Code is and I can't believe it is a real life product people pay money for. Every answer you get from every single prompt gets contradicted the moment you ask it to clarify and cite its answers. And then you dig into the code manually after much frustration only to find out that it latched onto the first red herring it saw and went on a wild goose chase in that direction. Well, "red herring" is being generous because they're usually trivial misunderstandings that not even the dumbest junior dev would've made. And by god does it latch onto that red herring and refuses to let go. You have to start a brand new session with an even longer prompt that explicitly guides it away from chasing that red herring. As soon as it finds a false positive (or god forbid, a false negative) it poisons the entire context and however many thousands of tokens spent are completely invalidated. Fucking Anthropic are even bigger scamfraud cocksuckers than Scam Altman and that's a STRATOSPHERIC bar to clear.
>>108947060>but looking at the context, I think they're saying "no" to me asking for permission, meaning "just do it, stop asking"This neat trick has gotten so many third worlders out of jail time when they come to first world nations and rape white people.
Grim
>>108935382It even mimics redditors
>>108935327Because google is using its flash models for it which aren't really reliable yet. Wouldn't be surprised if they are just using google search users to continue training and finetuning their low end models
>>108935327you better take that answer and believe it with all your heart. 2+2=5
>>108937769That's still wrong. Even if your fanfic about tokens were true, the weights in the model don't carry any sort of meta about them. Mentioning strawberries just means words about deserts are more likely to come up next. There is no intrinsic relation between strawberry and 3 rs.
>>108935327My best guess would be, that LLMs are a giant step towards AGI, but that they only replicate the human power-saving-mode behavior.There is more to human intelligence, but even most humans never fucking use that part. I doubt, it's difficult to reproduce, though.
>>108935327it's hiding its power level
>>108947012And Windows, and Android, natively.
>>108947301The strawberry meme is 100% in the training data. And llms love to get logick trapt by minor variations of riddles.
>>108947376It's pretty telling that there's no logic in LLMs if answers to these trivial questions must be in the training data.
tokenizers are weird as fuck tb h
>>108947397It's a meme on the internet and they scrape the internet at scale. Labs didn't hold an international joint meeting on the strawberry question.
>>108947429>Labs didn't hold an international joint meeting on the strawberry question.I think it's very unlikely that they didn't
AGI
ask it to write a program to do the task then run it
wat d fak
>>108935327works on my machine
So that's the artificial >intelligence that's going to replace me, grim
>>108947301>There is no intrinsic relation between strawberry and 3 rs.Anon, this thread about "trying to exploit tokens vs letters" already existed any number of times in the past. R's in strawberry was the "look at this!" benmark for retards until they 'fixed' it (pretrained the answer). Now it's D's in days of the week, until they pretrain that too in new models. Next year it will be another one. Maybe you'll notice this time.>your fanfic about tokensIf you don't know what the tokenizer is or how LLMs use tokens, you would do yourself a service to just not comment on it. Because you sound like a retard.
>>108935327
>>108948093So instead of focusing on my core argument you jump to baseless ad hominems, cool.Even if there was any form of relation between letters and tokens (there isn't, see >>108947420) the LLM does not do any counting operations on token meta data. There is no logic, just continuously mangled histogram. It does not matter what kind of silly algorithm you can come up in your head, LLM will not start to work that way.
>>108948159You've quickly escalated from sounding like a retard to acts like one. Being so disingenuous (deliberately or by mental capacity) isn't worth further effort.
>>108935395Because AI is fake and gay. Data centers are just warehouses if jeets sitting at computers answering queries. Why do you think people who live near data centers complain about the smell?
>>108935775>>108947112niggotry.
>>108948211You may want to rework the wording on that post.
>>108948222Don't be racist!
>>108935430>>108935382>>108935327
>>108948253
>>108935327I'm still surprised at how fast everyone adopted AI even though even the most advanced models are absolute dogshit and would be considered legally retarded if they were humans.I guess people are getting fooled by the gramatically perfect answers and believe the content must be of the same value, 99% of the time it's not...I can't wait for all these dogshit companies who bleed money trying to reach AGI to disappear, adoption won't grow and people, who are increasingly poorer because of the same greedy subhumans who back these companies, won't have money to spare for a subpar token generator.reminder that billions don't have access to a reliable internet, the fuck will they do with these shitty AI, there is nothing they can do that would make these people adopt their new spyware.also there are entire youtube/tiktok channels dedicated to fucking with these shitty tools, it's unbelievably easy to make them reach their limits, don't believe "benchmark" results, they're worthless, real-life usages show that they're random and heavily biaised to make you feel good and aren't really answering your questions (they still JUST predict tokens).most serious foss projects are banning AI-generated code because it's BAD, really bad and it's very easy to spot for humans, we're years if not decades away from good bots that can write good code.humans are now cheaper that claude and gpt anyways so I don't understand why we're still talking about it, it's over, we should move on to some actually useful tech and keep AI for curing cancers and other useful stuff instead, mass adoption will NEVER EVERR happen
>>108948313You're preaching to the choir>keep AI for curing cancersI never understood how it was supposed to do that>other useful stuffThe only useful thing LLMs can do is translate text. You know, what that algorithm was meant to do before the retarded 2017 paper.
>>108948345>I never understood how it was supposed to do that>to detect cancersAIs are very good at detecting cancers from picturesthey can also be used to detect genetic anomalies in sequenced genomes as they're very good at pattern extraction>to make drugsthey're insanely good at folding proteins, we used to have distributed tools where people oculd fold proteins at home we know have AI for this and the results are insane.we can make tailor-made drug for each patients these days, why it's not a bigger thing, I would not know as I want to stay alive.>radiotherapyI've also seen papers about AI optimizing radiotherapy but I don't know how it works.>pattern matchingthey also use it to scan database of patients for similar stuff.>The only useful thing LLMs can do is translate textllm are just one type of neural network, most of the stuff I'm talking about is based on convolution networks, one of the oldest and most robust network we have, it's heavily used in signal and image processing.it's crazy how far along we went with them even though we knew about their limitations since day one, llm are never ever going to produce AGI
>>108948431That's straight up all ML. So statistics. Are you just calling everything ML related AI?>AIs are very good at detecting cancers from picturesSometimes it does, sometimes it doesn't. Humans still have to double check. Then again humans miss stuff if color gradient is "jet". It's not a silver bullet as your sentence would suggest.>in sequenced genomesYes. That's the expensive part. If you sequenced every schmuck on the planet some things would be easier.>they're insanely good at folding proteinsPhysics simulation is not AI, come on nowSo it all hinges on ML, which needs vast amounts of data. Getting all that data to one place creates... risks. I think there would first need to be some sort of international treaty (impossible) to set rules how that data is sourced and used. Otherwise it would most likely end up in world being some insurance company ran hell hole.
>>108947160did the ui highlight the d in sunday
>>108935395It's expensive autocomplete and can't reason.
>>108935395https://tiktokenizer.vercel.app/
>>108935327https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LiGNkpxxq4c
>>108950599zoomers and alfags won't even notice anything off about it. they thrive in literal brainrot.
>>108935327>explain scenario to AI, ask if it is correct>almost, but not quite>goes on to explain it>according to the explanation, it is literally correct
>>108935327I asked AI how many d's are in OPs momAnd it said OVER 9000!!!!
>>108935327I'm playing through Pokemon Platinum, and old and extremely well documented game, and every time I ask google something about shere to find certain things, or what pokemon get what moves in that generation and things like that, the AI overview is at least partially wrong.And the thing is that, not only does the ai shit waste screen space, but Search results have been getting absolutely unbeareable since the internet started getting flooded with slop. It is so bad that using llms is genuinely better even though they make shit up half the time. Gen Alphas would lose their minds of they knew how good google search was in the early 2010s.
>>108951040This only happens with current ChatGPT, not any other models. It's been like that for a few months. It's beyond fucked up. They must have optimized too heavily for engagement, turning it into nonstop argumentative ragebait. It's kind of similar to how social media is overwhelmingly negative because negativity == engagement over there. But for an LLM, it's more like ragebait == engagement because it trolls you so hard that it forces a response back from the user.Just further proves LLMs are literally braindead and cannot think logically in the slightest. They only predict text. That's it. And they changed the text predictor a couple of months ago. Bubble will likely pop some time after the first IPOs.
Why yes, I do trust a nondeterministic and hallucinatory machine to solve engineering problems. How could you tell?
>>108935395maybe letter d as a token confuses it the same way when seaching d it returns many results of words containing d instead of the literal letter d surrounded by space characters with priority over them.
>>108935327This will be very useful for when I need to count how many letter d's are in words.
>>108951529It can engineer a solution if you let it. >>108947051
>>108951040ai companies just patch in a bunch of hardcoded answers like number of r in stawbewwy
>>108951040A thing with LLMs is, that if they generate the Yes/No before actually "thinking", i.e. producing the reasoning, they will tend to give a coin-toss Yes/No and then fight to reason in that direction with all they have.That's why you ask it to start with the reasoning.
>>108935382this is going to replace SWEs according to /g/
why
Deutsche Sprache, schwere Sprache
>>108935327it simply doesnt appear in the training material. people dont have much writing about the spellings of words and LLMs themselves never see words they only see tokens they dont typicalls know what letters/words are in the tokens they use they just know what token goes next.you'd have to get a lot of text in the training material of 'the word 'text' is made up of the letters t e x t' and shit like that for them to make the neural connections between the tokens of the words 'text' and the tokens of individual letters 't' 'e' 'x' 't' and some kind of order encoding between them.
>>108956164clever boy. now tell me where exactly in their training material the data hides that makes their AI go AGI.
>>108935775>using trannies to muddy the waters and poison the wellsI see you, you little shit
>>108956198its already agi in the sense that its intelligent (extracts probabilistic patterns from training text that correspond to human intelligence) and it is general as in it can be applied to many fields using shit like a vision module and a speech module.text intelligence is the core because its the easiest to traing and the part that has the most material to train on. its also the part whose advancment will stall the quickest because it's 'shitting where it eats' in the sense of the pristine 2021 internet where every word on most websites was directly written by a human not existing anymore.
>>108946419>pattern recognition machineThat they had to lobotomize because it could datamine the simple facts as IQ differences between races(even if it's just on basic data as IQ per country) or find out how many crimes against humanity Israel committed.
>>108956022that one openai employee who has to manually hardcode these answers getting really tired of your bs anon
>>108956022Clearly it's a Northern AI and internally thinks it's called Sonnabend. And instead of Mittwoch it uses Wotanstag.
>>108956258>extracts probabilistic patterns from training text that correspond to human intelligence>dares to post that dumb of a reply in thread bout LLMs not being able extract even the most simple patterns in simple examples from simple languages.I mean, it on _your_ level of intelligence for sure.>'shitting where it eats' It's shitting _everywhere_ because people use it for everything all the time - hence it will stall everywhere even just by your simple minded definition of what AGI is that moved the goal post just a few words earlier.
>>108956488i wonder if its possible to embed synthid into the model files because its like the only way to not shit where you eat is you can synthid llm generated text to filter it out
>>108951529whole ass data centers dedicated to this shit and it can't even figure that out. amazing level of shit.
