I need a new desktop environment for my Devuan install. I need something that doesn't rely on systemd for obvious reasons, and I would prefer a DE that doesn't use GTK because gnomeshit. That immediately rules out KDE, MATE, Cinnamon, XFCE, LXDE, (gnome obviously), and pretty much all the other popular ones that I can't think of. Basically the only ones that seem to fit my needs are Trinity and LXQt, but I would like to know what other options are out there.
It's autism. Just use any of the ones you mentioned and be ok with it. Or you can install FreeBSD and use any of the desktop envs available there, which are ported and don't use systemd because there's no systemd. Or you can use i3 and not care about desktop environments. But honestly, I tried all that and what I learned is that systemd isn't the fight I want to pick.
>>108959784It's the fight I need to pick.
KDE doesn't need systemd nor does it use GTK
>>108959811It doesn't use GTK, but it is increasing reliance on systemd, which is a bad sign.https://www.theregister.com/software/2026/01/26/kde-plasma-66-will-increase-reliance-on-systemd/4257163
>>108959764Only gnome and kde are relevant. Others are outdated memes, usually do not work out of the box.
I don't know dude, I use xfce and it does everything I need it to do and doesn't do anything I don't.
>>108959764use kde>but muh systemd age verificationpatch it out or, guess what, lie. crazy stuff i know
>>108959764>I need a new desktop environment for myWhy would you want a desktop environment? Just pick a good Window Manager and use that. Blackbox, FVWM, DWM, Fluxbox are just a few of the possibilities.
Wayland shells have deprecated DEs
>>108959764Because there's no reason to even have a desktop environment, something that's useless by definition isn't going to be good.
Not a huge fan of any of em. Not even Windows.The only one I like is MacOS. I almost like KDE Plasma.
>>108959764Notice how there are a ton of GNOME forks. That's because GNOME is objectively the best. Pretty sure it runs on non-systemd distros e.g. Chimera Linux. But if you really, really don't want GNOME, then yeah, you're going to make usability sacrifices. KDE 3 was pretty awesome, so maybe try Trinity. Not sure how well it holds up in 2026, though. Plasma is the only other sane choice, but that has way more usability issues than GNOME, IMO.
>>108959764I use Trinity, it's nice :DExcept there are quirks you will have to hack around.LXQt is like KDE-lite. There are a lot of things it's missing that you'd expect in other desktops. You will probably fallback on a lot of KDE services and apps.Trinity is like if people forked Windows 7 and hacked it into working for modern applications. I can write an entire article on various tricks you can use to make it work better.
>>108959764>>108960264pretty much this. the release of cosmic gave the ick. and people slurping that slop as viable was comical. if i need to use x11 again probably just copy a tint2 and openbox config
>>108959764>I would prefer a DE that doesn't use GTK KDE Plasma, Sway (window manager), COSMIC desktop, LXQt, Lomiri
>>108959764Because it's all gtk or qt under the mask.Linux is converging into few huge projects sponsored by ibm or Microsoft.>>108960270Keyring, inter app, etc.
>>108959764lxqt with the window manager of your choice. by default you'll get xfwm (I don't know why), but nothing is stopping you from installing openbox, awesomewm or even kwin (either x11 or gayland)
>>108961880lomiri hard depends on systemd and no one has bothered to patch it out so it's just blacklisted from the devuan repos
>>108959764KDE doesnt need systemd, just use SDDM instead of PlasmaDM or whatever its called
>>108962257I just hope SonicDE won't backport this kind of faggotry
>>108959764LXQt, Enlightenment, Lumina, Trinity, and KDE Lite (AKA Sonic DE) are the only choices that meet your criteria. KDE does not use GTK BTW, and it sounds like you're just overwhelmed by the flexibility all of these DEs offer.
>>108962282>KDE Lite (AKA Sonic DE)Sonic DE is just a preservative fork because the kfaggots dropped X11 support and have a hard stance against XLibre
I like default Cinnamon in Linux Mint.
>>108960403I only need two kde apps in lxqt: kmail and kwin_x11. Both have an extra big dependency: akonadi for the former and the whole fucking systemsettings app for the latter. I can't do much about the former (kmail is the best email client on linux that has all the features I need and isn't a fucking web browser), but in the case of the latter, I'm considering bugging the SonicDE guys to make all sonic_win settings also available in a separate application, so people who only use the compositor can configure it without bloat.
>>108959764You don't need a new desktop environment, you need no desktop environment. They all suck because the concept is flawed.
>>108962330On Debian/Devuan you can avoid installing systemsettings and a bunch of other crap by adding --no-install-recommends to the apt install. Or if you already have it installed you can safely purge it.If you use a Firefox based browser might aswell go all the way with Thunderbird (or Betterbird) for E-mail. claws-mail is another great option, though it uses gtk3 you can install a gtk2 version.Trinity also has it's version of kmail which works fine.
>>108959764Try Window Maker.
>>108962371Did you actually read what I wrote?>you can avoid installing systemsettingsNot if you want to actually configure kwin, which includes installing and configuring kwin scripts like kzones (I have an ultrawide monitor). I don't want to hunt down every single config file and do it by hand, so currently the only way is to install systemsettings.>apt install paramsI know how it works.>If you use a Firefox based browser I use Vivaldi, and it has a builtin email client, too, but I don't want to use any browser-based email clients, because at that point I could just log into webmail. That's also why I refuse to install the electron app for discord, I can just use it in browser WITH ad blocking, css tweaks through Stylus and its spying capacity greatly reduced.
>>108962408>Not if you want to actually configure kwin>I don't want to hunt down every single config file and do it by handFair, haven't used kwin in a while. Compiz also exists if you don't mind some gtk I remember getting a gtk2 version of Compiz working too.>I use Vivaldi, and it has a builtin email client, too, but I don't want to use any browser-based email clients, because at that point I could just log into webmailSo why install an internet suite if you're not going to use it?
>>108962457>compizI tried it out with lxqt on a temp devuan install recently, it wasn't quite stable, especially when configuring parts of it, and it's also slower than kwin_x11. Something like the compizconfig-settings-manager would benefit sonic_win in the future, even if it looks like a stripped down systemsettings.>So why install an internet suite if you're not going to use it?I have those features turned off because I don't need them. I use Vivaldi because>the UI is very customizable and supports further CSS hacks>it still supports manifest v2 extensions>they took a hard stance against AI (which is where brave lost me)
>>108962504Compiz might be finicky but mixing in kde too much is dangerous. It's really a trade off.I'm looking forward to Devuan's gtk2 revitalization project when they fork a desktop environment. It should make things much easier.
>>108959764What's wrong with LXDE? It's the best.
>>108962561I'd rather have some kde "extras" over gtk stuff, because gtk goes out of its way to be as hostile to user theming as possible. QT? You can easily make any user theme with Kvantum and it will look good on any scaling because it's SVG-based.
>>108959764>I would prefer a DE that doesn't use GTKsonicde
>>108959845What about LXDE?
>>108962860>>108964281OP doesn't want GTK
>>108959764>and I would prefer a DE that doesn't use GTK because gnomeshitI too hate gnomeshit but found all Qt based DEs to be lacking and KDE is bloated, Trinity is probably the closest thing to a perfect DE but it's too clunkyNowadays I just use MATE with heavy custom theming and library overrides to disable some annoying gnomeshit:https://codeberg.org/dsalt/gtk-nocsdIf you're interested then there's a guy that forked both GTK3 and MATE and is making DE called CAFE with his toolkit called CTK which he forked off GTK3, however that is literally just a one man project so don't expect much of it
>>108959764desu everything on Linux, but the kernel itself, sucks donkey ballsPerhaps some saint can vibecode an efficient slim DE
>>108964313Okay, but LXDE is a good desktop environment.
>>108959764LXQT is a set over openbox or some other window manager, so you could do it yourself and put whatever you want.icewm, is pretty friendly if you just want a light weight desktop
>Why does every DE suck?Because your autism is making things not feel right, which causes you to seek out things that feel right. It's an endless loop and you're stuck in it.
Time to slop your own DE!
>>108964329but why accept gtk when the devs have switched to qt already? lxqt is superior to lxde in literally every possible way
>>108964481LXDE uses less ram.
>>108964691how much less ram? does it depend on what wm you use for both? (implying the same wm for both in each test pair)
>>108964691unused ram is wasted ram
>>108959835>However, the Plasma Login Manager depends upon the systemd-logind service. It will only work on Linux distros that use systemd; indeed, the developers of the new project explicitly dropped FreeBSD support in December 2025. who cares, its a login managerjust dont use it
>>108964801Using more ram = High temperaturesUsing less ram = Low temperatures
>>108964323Strong disagree. The kernel is pretty shite and a lot of the software is top tier. Though it is more fair to say 'was' top tier given especially all the shit that's been happening as of late.
>>108964801so edging OOM is the way, huh?
>>108965046>edging OOM
>>108965194kek
As long as it runs emacs you’re good.
>>108962914gtk2 is the opposite actually, it has theme engines and user platform plugins just like Qt. In fact, Trinity has a gtk2 engine you can enable that integrates gtk2 apps with Trinity's theme engine (picrel shows gtk2, TQt and Qt6 uniformity)It's only in gtk3 that they deprecated the theme engine in favor of their CSS bullshit.The only apps you actually can't theme are the ones that use gtk3/4 or niche cases like whatever the fuck PopOS is doing.Just a fair warning, you might get more than "extras" when pulling in KDE. Qt frameworks work in mysterous ways.>>108964317>Trinity is probably the closest thing to a perfect DE Thank you.
>>108959764Explain in concrete technical terms what you don't like about GTK.
>>108966914Gnome Tool Kit
>>108962348>They all suck because the concept is flawed.How does this board continue to attract the dumbest posters imaginable?
>>108959764if ya cannot do lumina then consider "building your own DE" by putting together the individual compoentns, like a window manager (openbox), a panel (tint2), etc... in the same manner that bunsenlabs does.
>>108966531they ported qtcurve to qt6?
>>108968641No that's Trinity's version of qtcurve through qt6gtk2.
>>108968692goddammit. you got my hopes up.
>>108959764LXQt has been working fine for years on my machine
I understand nothing of what the fuck you are talking about, I just use plasma cause gpt told me
>>108959764trinity is comfy
