>>108990488
idc

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>wont waive rule for unprofitable ai firms
NO IPO FOR YOU

>>108990529
Someone is getting minecrafted for this.

NOOOOO YOUR 401k HAS TO PAY FOR OUR AI SLOP

>>108990645
Trump will force them to.

>>108990529
They can still have an IPO.
Their stock just won't get counted as one of the 500 stocks that make up the S&P 500 index, giving their spot to some other company instead.

This only matters because many investor funds automatically buy all the stocks included in the S&P 500 and Musk tried to use this fact as a quick money grab.

>>108990748
I'm selling my shit anyway. This will cause another economic crash.

>>108990756
what's the chink version of the S&P 500?
gonna invest everything there

>>108990488
>the requirements for MegaCap companies to demonstrate profitability in the latest quarter of the financial year along with the previous four quarters.
AI companies are FUCKED.

>>108990769
I'll invest in eastern Poland.

>Such rule changes would have accommodated SpaceX’s plan to only offer approximately 3 percent of its IPO shares to public investors, and the fact that SpaceX is currently unprofitable with a growing debt load that has reached $29 billion because of its spending spree on AI infrastructure.
Holy shit, I didn't know it was this bad.
With Starlink, even though they were building and launching themselves (perhaps partly because) I thought they would basically be printing money because of subscriptions and deals with companies and governments.
Even with Starship development, they should have been getting enough from it to be paying off the debt, but SOMEHOW they decided to take on more debt instead.

>>108990803
Its called fake news read through political spin. You're reading from a reddit owned propaganda platform.

Starlink generates ~$15-20B/y. The "debt" is just buying out xAI. xAI just signed deal with Google/Anthropic. Their revenue run rate is now ~$50 billion per year.

SpaceX paid off all their "debt" from buying a separate company. While tripling their annual revenue.

>>108990800
>eastern Poland
formally known as ukraine?

>>108990769
Problem with investing in Chinese stocks is the communist government doesn't allow foreigners to buy all types of stocks (many Chinese companies have both China only stocks and stocks that can be bought by foreigners) or gain a majority share in Chinese companies.

But easiest is to buy MSCI China Index ETF's.
And that's alright but I'm not 100% convinced the communist government will rugpull all foreign investors one day.

>>108990896
how often has the Chinese government fucked over small investors compared to how often the US government fucked them over?

>>108990859
>The "debt" is just buying out xAI
That's exactly what's so shady about this.
Musk is using one of his company's IPO to pay off the debt from one of his other company's.

If it was just SpaceX going public it would be fine, but it's SpaceX + all the debt from xAI knowing many funds will auto-buy if it gets included into indexes like S&P 500 and MSCI World.

>>108990859
>The "debt" is just buying out xAI.
Who did that money go to?
>xAI just signed deal with Google/Anthropic. Their revenue run rate is now ~$50 billion per year.
For capacity they will need to keep building out.
I don't think this is as rosy as you make out.

>>108990899
China has fucked over every single business when they came to power.
That's what communism means: government owns all the companies.
Until Trump the US government always put shareholders above everyone else.

Authoritarian regimes like China, Russia and now USA are never good for small investor.
But there are plenty of alternatives like MSCI World ex USA, which includes all the stocks in stable civilized countries (except for worst Korea which IMO should be included but you can buy them separately).

>>108990488
fast entry was gay and retarded, funny they spun that shite up for those three just to deny it to them

>>108991153
They will find a way to fuck you still.

>>108990923
>I don't think this is as rosy as you make out.
Doesn't matter what you think. The story is completely opposite of what the trannies want people to believe. Their fundamentals are Starlink and AI compute now. And Starlinks set to grow +100% this year. And the years after that, they will grow even more

My biggest question is whats further out than Starlink. Aka their now experimental chip fab which they will build out by going IPO and grabbing the free $70+ billion in cash for the investment. They've got Intel and ASML partnered together along with few others in talks.

>>108992985
>And the years after that, they will grow even more
This will be more true if Starlink V3 is even remotely as promised. Starlink goes from just being a rural provider to competing with anything south of FTTH

>>108992985
>And Starlinks set to grow +100% this year.
They are set to go under you retard. Musk is desperate.

>>108990488
I suppose that this scam was so blatant that the S&P was afraid of social unrest if they let it happen
I didn't even know that pension funds are required to buy stocks that a consortium of private companies compiles by law. Isn't America about free market n shieet?

>index fund rejects volatile securities
no shit, great thread

>>108990488
Did they really transform the cybertruck in security buggies?

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>>108993112
>They are set to go under you retard

>>108990488
>literally trying to trigger a recession
lol trump will eviscerate those commie fucks

>>108990488
It's only for fast tracking and other ai companies are excluded too.
SpaceX is now getting 2 billion every month in revenue from Google + Anthropic, so that leads me to believe it will turn a profit this year on paper and be included in the main indexes by Christmas.

>>108993533
nice to see all these billion dollar global corporation coming to gather to fuck Americans out of their pension

>>108993533
Unless they go under before that.

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AI

>google sells compute to antrophic
>google buys compute from xai, uh, spacex
That seems totally reasonable and not at all a financial circlejerk

>>108993541
>>108993538
shorting the company is also a viable move if you are in this state of mind.

>>108993659
Nah, I'm buying gold and waiting Trump out. He will be gone soon.

>>108993422
the recession will come eventually, difference is the size, the later it comes the bigger it will be. recessions are good for the economy when they're controlled, and the bigger they are the harder they're to control

>>108990748
Yes, including it in the index would give SpaceX's current investors a way to liquidate at a high price, leaving retirement funds on the hook when the bubble pops. Yet another case of Risk Washing.

>>108990803
Starlink only makes sense in extremely rural areas and the third world. Most of its income right now comes from Starshield, which is the US government paying for coverage in Ukraine.

>>108993659
The market can stay irrational longer than you can stay liquid and if there's one thing that's in abundant supply right now, it's irrationality. Short selling irrational positions is itself irrational in the contemporary context.

>>108990488
Dont care my ira is in fxaix and im not touching it for another 20 years

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Remember that companies were forced to IPO very early under strict rules that existed for decades, until Obama got rid of them with the JOBS act.

That's why all these tech giants IPO'ed when they were still small and allowed normal people to become very wealthy. Now they just treat retail investors as bag holders and exit liquidity.
Thanks Obama.

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>>108990513
Nigger what you think been driving PC costs thru the roof? if these fuckers eat shit and die you are gonna see the biggest firesale of hardware since the dotcom bust, you could get enterprise GPU brand new for the price of a song, RAM would be basically worthless, like in 2001 you could buy a brand new sun server for nothing because all those dotcom companies went to shit, this is 100x bigger.

>>108992985
LOL, LMAO even, starlink's overhead costs are insane but its the only thing keeping spaceX in business, and now there are like 5 new constellations being built, competition gonna be insane and starlink will have to cut prices to the bone, probably wont even break even. That retard musk fucked himself up with his autistic bullshit, tesla was already getting raped by chink EVs in every market but murrica and then he goes and pisses off the basedjak class which were the only fuckers buying his overhyped cars, the redneck whitetrash he appeals to is too fucking broke to even buy a model3.

And space datacenters are fucking stupid, just the radiators needed to cool them down are gonna cost more to launch than those servers will ever bring in.

>>108990488
>create data center "boom" that requires specialized hardware that will become utterly useless to the resale market when the bubble you've created pops
They knew exactly what they were doing.

>>108995266
Russians are already buying used datacenter GPUs and using them for gaming and local AI shit, its perfectly usable and its gonna be fucking cheap.

>>108995227
Counterpoint: Valve

>>108995247
>nooo muh competition

>>108995295
Did Valve even reach 500 full-time employees?
And do they get shares as a part of their total compensation?
If no, they are not subject to forced IPO even under the old rules.

>>108995282
They don't have video out.

>>108995321
They use adapters, its all over yt check it out

>>108995321
They literally just pipe the 3d output over the PCIe bus to whatever GPU actually has a display.
It's the same way you can play a windowed game and move it to an entirely different display served by a different GPU. Or how Windows can arbitrarily choose what GPU to render 3D graphics no matter what output you are using.

>>108995227
This.

>>108990488
Can this finally mean cheaper RAM prices on the way?

so this friday the bubble either bursts or nothing ever happens?

>>108990488
So wait what does this actually mean?

>>108990912
he wants to put Xai in "space" since it has better sun light and there are no NIMBYs in space.

>>108995598
IPO goes forward, normies are not allowed to have their "fund manager" auto buy it once its public.

>>108995598
it means nothing in practical terms. spacex already has 2X the amount of buyer for their IPO, more than what they are selling. they were selling stocks to raise $70 billion for their chip factory build out. the stock is oversubscribed and has more buyers than sellers

>>108995539
No, they will destroy all the unuses RAM to spite you.

>>108990924
>south gookland is stable
yup, that's a soivestor alright

>>108990488
So SpaceX were trying to pull some shit where they bypassed a usual waiting period right? is the ai stuff rejected for the same reason?

>>108997969
It's about stealing money from pension funds who are forced to buy stock from S&P 500 because Americans are insane.

>>108997994
Don't people from other countries also invest in things?

>>108992985
Starlink is doing great but its profit isn't even a drop in the bucket compared to xAI's net loss. The rest of the rocket company isn't profitable either.
Ironically if Starlink did its own IPO without the rest of Musk's shitty companies dragging it down it would probably be extremely successful.

>>108998012
I don't get it. Pension funds in burgerland are forced to buy these shares and this will crash the economy. China is not retarded and they won't touch that shit.

>>108995969
so it was just a ploy to inflate the value even further even though they'd never be able to match the total demand?

>>108998034
Bro trust me, everyone wants this radioactive shit. Just trust Elon Musk.

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>SpaceX IPO will crash the economy
Is this the new panican narrative?
Even at 1.75 trillion they are a drop in the bucket

>>108997994
You wouldnt be complaining if Tesla was in your funds as of day one 16 years ago. Past performance does not guarantee future results etc....but its hard to ignore the potential of the situation happening again.

>>108998886
yes risky investments can give you rich rewards
but you're not investingin a conservative index fund if you want a risky bet

>>108998013
Starlink was never going to make a profit based on some private retards paying a few bucks subscription fee.

It is a military product that has the purpose to provide low latency communication deep inside enemy territory.
And that is where that supposed "profit" comes from as well, from government military deals.
But that money is drying out now, because Starlink pathetically failed during the attempted color revolution in Iran.
Remember when Elon Musk and the whole US government boasted about how the revolution will coordinate via Starlink and how Iran wont be able to cut them off? They smuggled tens of thousands of terminals into Iran. All officially admited.
And then Iran just jammed them. The Starlink receivers were dysfunctional with 90% packet loss and even worse: The Iranian government triangulated them and Iranian people reported it when they saw a Starlink at someones house.
40.000 CIA plants died.

If the military purpose for Starlink is gone, how are they going to finance it?
By providing internet to fucking ships? Is every ship going to pay $ 500k subscription fee per month to cover for the enormous costs of constantly having to launch satellites into LEO?

>>108998926
>Starlink was never going to make a profit based on some private retards paying a few bucks subscription fee.
This is the reason Starlink makes money because people underestimate just how bad the Internet situation is outside their city/costal bubble.

>>108998945
Thats true to a point. However, there has been a big push in the last decade for rural fiber etc. I live in a small town in the midwest, and I have 2 separate fiber lines run directly to my house. There are places where you can get gigbit or higher fiber in the literal middle of nowhere, but not in town.

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>>108998926
>retarded third worldist seething over people protesting corrupt muslim shithole governments

>>108992985
starlink is only doing good in shit like EBITDA which doesnt take into account the amortization of the satellites...
>>108998926
this fag is right in that is a military tech shit, the most basic proof is that the first test were done in military planes.
>>108998945
that is a problem that happens less and less everyday. my country has desployed last year fiber to all the rural.

>>108998945
>muh rural people will HAVE to pay for Starlink
I am living in rural nowhere and until a few years ago, the best internet was provided by some private company that erracted some mid range directional antennas doing some radio stuff. Was four times faster than ADSL and cheap as well.
And now there is 5G as well.

If Starlink has to pay for its satellites via private subscriptions, without military gibs, nobody is going to buy that, it won't have a competitive price (it already doesnt now).
Ships are going to be the one market left.

>>108998964
40.000 dead protesters, who were completely cut off from the outside world, because tens of thousands of Starlink terminals got jammed.
>muh third world
if that third world was capable to jam the unjammable Starlink... imagine how it would perform against China.

Its a failed military tech.
Go ahead and shittalk the people who defeated you. I am sure that makes your product look great.

>>108990488
As someone who invests into the S&P 500, I'm glad because I want stable long-term growth, not pump and dump IPOs

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They dare doubt our lord and saviour Musk?

>>108998963
>However, there has been a big push in the last decade for rural fiber etc
It's been very spotty.
I have fiber but can drive 15 min away and find places where the only option is DSL
If it wasn't for an actually good local ISP There would have only been fiber after living at a property for 24 years and after it's value exceeded 350k. Apparently that's what it takes for Comcast to come around.

>>108999018
The DSL connection, that i had before fibre came here a year ago, was fast enough to stream a 4k video and had unlimited data.
It is still a better deal than paying USD 120 per month for a 50GB Starlink plan.
And now there is 5G and the average normie doesn't even have an ordinary internet connection anymore, they just tether with their phones.

Starlink will only ever become more expensive, except in the markets where they still have to enter.
Meanwhile your phone plan will get faster and cheaper in the foreseeable future.

>>108999099
Paying $150 for 15mbps is robbery. I've seen the ads.
Also IDK where your getting a 50GB limit, unless your comparing starlink roam.
Starlink home/fixed has only gotten cheaper.

>>108990488
SpaceX is gonna nuke the ozone layer. The cadence of launches and retirement reentry burnups is filling the atmosphere with alumina particles, which work as a catalyst to free chloride particles from atmospheric HCl. Single molecules of Cl or ClO will continue to react with ozone hundreds of time to break them down into regular oxygen.

>>108995247
>you are gonna see the biggest firesale of hardware since the dotcom bust
it didn't happen after crypto, and it won't happen after AI. keep dreaming, retard

>>108999099
>It is still a better deal than paying USD 120 per month for a 50GB Starlink plan.

Why would you lie on the internet? The 50GB was $50/m. And now its 100GB/m for $55. The $120 is their max 400+Mbps speed unlimited.

I dont understand how can brazenly lie so boldly

>>108999125
If you are in urban Europe, you can get Starlink for 50 bucks per month and it only ever got cheaper, because Starlink has no chance to enter that market.
If you are in the US, you pay more for Starlink now, for a worse service, than you got four years ago.

Starlink is just not competitive.
A few people in rural fly-over states in the US, who don't have any other choice, while still being wealthy enough to shit out money for three-digit monthly internet fee, aren't going to sustain the global service.
Especially because they are getting more and more fibre as well. It's a constantly shrinking customer base.

>>108999232
You fags don't have phones?
Just create a hotsppt for your laptop.

>>108999133
Guess we'll just stay on Earth then

>>108990859
revenue != profit

>>108999232
>Starlink is just not competitive
Keep telling that to yourself.

>>108999238
Thats why Starlink is so much cheaper inside a densly populated European area.. because nobody is going to pay for this shit.
If you could pay Starlinks European fees while you are in bumfuck nowhere Montana, you would have an amazing deal.

And now you know why Starlink subscriptions are geolocked.

>>108999261
sorry Elon, but Starlink won't survive the military bucks running out.
Should have not lost in Iran.

>>108999263
Is this why they shut down 3G? So that this fag can push more starlinks? Wew.

>>108999232
>If you are in the US, you pay more for Starlink now, for a worse service, than you got four years ago.
Uh I think it's like quadrupled in performance?

>>108999232
>Especially because they are getting more and more fibre as well. It's a constantly shrinking customer base.
this, and it always needs more launches to replenish satellites...
if you see the full numbers are awful, that is why they show you their cherrypicked stats
>>108999273
technically 3g is redundant, low tech stuff should be in 2g, and good stuff should be at least in 3g. but that is if you still have 2g, if not is retarded

>>108999286
2G was sunset before 3G was

>>108999282
>performance
You watch 4K netflix on a satelite phone?

>>108999299
I use 2G in Europe because all medical/emergency equipment rely on it. Burgers are fucking retarded and like to pay.

>>108999255
No one cares about profit when you're in growth phase, dumbass. Everyone is in investment phase, dropping hundreds of billions. The expenses allow them to grow. The only valuable metric for a stock owner is ARR minus investment. If you're taking away their investment expenses, thats "profit" but its meaningless to investors. Investors dont want the current profit, the investment is ALWAYS for the future growth.

>>108999335
>when you're in growth phase
How many decades my african-american?

>>108999325
>2G phase out will be complete by 2030
tick tock

>>108999299
apparently they are starting to plan the shutdown in many places of europe
https://www.rosenberger-telematics.com/en/news/switching-off-the-2g-network/
this is retarded btw
>>108999325
that is what i am saying, many connected stuff doesnt need more

>>108999325
>>108999352
2G equipment is just old as opposed to some intrinsic reliability to 2G
Europeans again framing a purely economic decision as something rational.

>>108999349
We will leave the EU by then ;)

>>108999359
My black friend, if it works, why fucking break it?

>>108999360
No need for this, the EU will die before it happens.
Shutting down 2G is honestly such a retarded idea.

Americans are living a lie.They roleplay as if they are capitalists and as if unprofitable companies, that are prepped up by the government or military, are totally highly successful private businesses.

The only customers, that are profitable for Starlink, are rural Americans who otherwise only have overly-expensive DSL access.
The Musk-fanboys underestimate just how high the population density is in other rich parts of the world, and how low the percentage of rural people in America is.

The potential profitable market for Starlink is approximately 40 million people.
That's it. It's the population size of Poland.
And the few people out of those, who buy Starlink, are supposed to cover the costs of having to launch hundreds of Satellites each year, forever and ever, till infinity, because they are in such a low orbit that they crash down to earth naturally all few years?
It makes no sense!

Of course Starlink is a military project. Of course the taxpayer pays for it. Of course it would (will) be dead if its military purpose is not achieved (and currently it is failing on that front).

You could give me Starlink FOR FREE, and only make me pay for the 600 € dish, and it would still be a bead deal!
A phone contract with data is 15€ per month.
I would have to consume Starlink for over 3 years for free for it to be viable to buy the dish.

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>>108990756
I hope. All you stock market faggots are propping up this giga-jewery by tying your future on the scam market.
>you need the wars
>you need the jeets
>you need the debts
If they add AI to the 500 you'll need things like pic related or else you lose it all. Literal golems, all of you.

>>108999618
Wishful thinking, brown poster

>>108990488
thank fucking goodness.

>>108990488
Saw someone on HackerNews really seething about this, like this is not what should have happened. Very bizarre.

>>109001407
Someome is going to die over this.

>>109001055
anon is right that starlink by definition is a shrinking market. it has no advantage at all where there is fiber, and fiber wont stop expanding. like it only makes sense in middle of nofucking where, and by definition there is barely any population there, and places where the infrastructures are not developed, which ironically is mostly the usa, but still that is diminishing every day
no idea of his numbers

>>109001613
6 billion people dont have fiber.

>>108999618
It's still useful to the military in that it allows portable internet in places where there are no cell towers and it resists snooping in a way that cell towers don't.
I remember reading that Ukraine was given starlink access to help avoid Russian jamming and triangulation. As long as it's good for those purposes I think the military will keep it afloat.

>>109001762
Better stats yet, <20% of Americans have fiber

>>108990488
It's funny since SpaceX would have been find if Elon didn't shove his garbage AI company within it in order to hide its debt.

>>109001762
I don't want Africans to have fiber.

>>108995247
>And space datacenters are fucking stupid, just the radiators needed to cool them down are gonna cost more to launch than those servers will ever bring in.

Radiators don't even work that well in a vaccum

The heat has to be vented as infrared radiation, there's no atmosphere to physically conduct the heat away

Data centers in space connected by an optical data transfer laser grid are even more implausible than his old Mars colony scam

>>108999250
and die from leathal amounts of UV!
we'd either have to move underground at that point or die. global agriculture and oceanic life will collapse if musk is allowed to destroy the ozone layer.

>>109001965
Isn't China building their datacenters on/in the Ocean to get unlimited supply of cold water?

>>109001992
>if musk is allowed
When USA go, Musk goes with it.

>>109001772
Russia can jam it though. They just do not want to get in trouble for jamming civilian networks (while they jam GPS b
with their missile
warning satellites).

>>109002007
The US decline will take a hundred years. Nothing is changing overnight, and they'll just slowly become less relevant like the UK and Russia.

>>109002033
Huh? Trump and Musk will be both gone before 2030.

>>109001965
While I agree orbital data centers is stupid, there's still atmosphere in LEO. Obviously far less of it than at sea level, so radiators have to be larger if relying on that type of cooling. Also note that the Sun is able to transfer heat the Earth through the vacuum of space.

>>109002081
Excess skin pigmentation will remain and continue to grow.

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Amazing how the Jeet mods will warn you for the most superfluous shit on this board yet this retarded /pol/ tourist thread is allowed to exist

>>108999335
>No one cares about profit when you're in growth phase, dumbass.
S&P Dow Jones Indices, which manages and curates stock indices such as the S&P 500, requires that MegaCap companies show profitability - i.e. actual profit; not revenue - over the latest fiscal quarter and the preceeding four.

>>109002033
The US decline over the past 6 years or so has been parabolic, man. It's speeding up, too, thanks to the kleptocrats we have in charge. Trump may personally end US hegemony in the next couple of years with his ridiculous foreign policy, historic deficit spending, and his completely unprovoked melty with Iran.

>>109002274
There's always an excuse to delay companies

>>109002033
Commies wish for decline of America. The death cult is their propaganda calling.

>>109002322
Trump is obsessed with outdoing Obama, so he needed to do something with Iran that was better than Obama's Iran deal.

All the shit we're currently living is literally because of that one moment Obama roasted and humiliated Trump over his birther stuff.
Fucking clown world.

>>109002354
>Trump is obsessed with outdoing Obama, so he needed to do something with Iran that was better than Obama's Iran deal.
Kamala called Iran America's Greatest Adversary and voiced her intention to conduct military action back in 2024. You're inventing some weird partisan headcanon just doesn't align with reality.

>>109002395
yeah yeah tell me more about Democrats warmongers
glad we voted Trump to keep out of war

>>109002354
>All the shit we're currently living
Is a paradise compared to what's to come when there are not enough young people left to hold up the economy in a few generations. And the source of that is 200 years old, and beyond any president's ability to affect.

>>109002395
Kamala being shit doesn't excuse Trump being shit. This kind of direction brained thinking is the exact reason the US is in the dumpster. Useful idiots like you are the reason the uniparty hasn't had to represent a single person in the past 30 years.
I wish I could crawl through my screen and kick you in the nuts.

>>108993156
>I suppose that this scam was so blatant that the S&P was afraid of social unrest if they let it happen
The big funds told the S&P to enforce the existing rules strictly or face them all pulling out of the whole market. The problem with this batch of IPOs is they leave the current majority shareholder effectively holding such a large stake that the funds would be at severe risk of market manipulation due to lack of liquidity. Absolutely awful position for them to be in, so they pushed back HARD and locked the AI corps out of the key index.
If Musk wants to get his money out that way, he has to give up more control and start running the business much more conventionally, with actual proper accounting and profit/loss reporting and consensus decisions at board level. (Same applies to Anthropic and OpenAI too. No dodgy deals.) He can refuse that, but then he won't get major investor buy-in except from players who have a very high appetite for risk.

>>109002481
>If Musk wants to get his money out that way, he has to give up more control and start running the business much more conventionally
SpaceX just dies if that happens.