Question for the diehard Linux users, which one of the proprietary operating systems do you consider the lesser evil?
>>109184861Apple. It's not even a contest.
>>109184875Is it just because of the Unix familiarity, or is there more to it?
>>109184861Apple.But I could be biased here since I have a Macbook as along year Arch user
>>109184886It is backed up by evidence. I hate ubuntu more than I hate apple.
>>109184861>>109184886Windows would be a pretty good desktop environment if they switched to Linux kernel (the WSL stuff is just embarrassing, it's like using band-aid to fix a severed head) and maybe for good measure stopped wasting everyone's time with DirectX and used a real graphics API like OpenGL or Vulkan.
>>109184861GEOS for the C64
>>109184861Is this even a question? It would have to be Microsoft; outside of the dirty shit they pulled under Bill Gates, Microsoft is highly invested in the health of Linux as it is essential for Azure. Modern Microsoft has just been inept.Apple is willing cut features and support in order to secure money from services: ending 32bit support has a happy coincidence of forcing Mac users to use the Apple software store. Some of it can be justified, but some of it is insane like not dabbling with making their GPUs Vulkan compliant.
>>109184861If I had to pick one I would choose Windows.I like Apple hardware, but their OS is dogass.
>>109184861windows is lesser evil obvs.mac is where software goes to die in a few years.win32 will live on outside windows.
>>109184861>Question for the diehard Linux users, which one of the proprietary operating systems do you consider the lesser evil?They're both equally evil so as far as I'm concerned.But as someone who recently was forced to choose one or the other for a corporate laptop, I am going with Mac. Windows is just more of a shit show. Mac at least has to satisfy its female normal users.
>>109184886windows has gone off the rails with the bullshit, it's really that simple.
>>109184861macOS, because:1. It has the UNIX terminal2. It also runs professional creative software (that I use, anyway)
>>109184973apple makes the only good laptops, shame they come with macos -t 2012 mbp with win10
>>109184886Windows tracks you, installs things without asking you and shows you ads.Apple just wants you to pay and then leaves you alone.
>>109184861Macos just because Microsoft is a pajeet controlled company. Also, I can run most terminal programs just fine in a Mac without weird hacks like wsl
>>109184933directx has always been the leading graphics interface, it's the one technology m$ does well
>>109184886Apple don't sell your IP to advertisers
>>109184861Most linuxfags when they get tired of tinkering become macfags.They justify it with "muh unix" and "muh good laptops" but deep down the reason is that they already committed to hating microshit and they can't go back. Also finally having a job and family means they don't have time for computers and want something simple.
>>109184861Apple is much better at brainwashing their users into being absolutely dependant on them. I think they're the most evil tech company in existence
>>109185578>Apple just wants you to pay and then leaves you alone.Yeah they leave you alone after you pay for iCloud. Until then you'll be regularly reminded that you're not using it yet.At least on Windows you can just uninstall OneDrive if you don't like it.
>>109184861nothing of value here
>>109184886This >>109185578Apple isn't great but at least they sell you a product the old fashioned way. Microsoft products are borderline malware by default.
>>109184861Windows, because it doesn't treat me like a total baby and require magic keyboard shortcuts to see the C: drive.
>>109185683Also, everyone I know that has a mac is happy with it from a performance perspective.>>109185629Has nothing to do with tinkering. Requires an actual use case. In my case it's security shit that requires a closed source kernel-level keystore that only works on Mac and Windows. In a different thread there was a guy having a schizo meltdown because he had problems with TradingView (an electron app) lagging on Linux.t. linux user who doesn't tinker
>>109185767There is no C: drive on MacOS
anyone who says Windows doesn't know shit about computers
>>109185845Yes, retard, any other valuable contributions to this discussion?https://www.insanelymac.com/blog/view-hidden-files-on-mac/>magic keyboard shortcuts or shell commands required just to see your filesIn Windows this is just a checkbox that anyone can find. CrapOS makes this impossible to discover on your own.>>109185847Incorrect. All iToddlers are retarded.
>>109184933and if they ditched their window manager for KDE (breeze litteraly looks like win 10/11)at which point any sane person would just run debian, for stability, or fedora for up to date shit.Though it would be awesome if some madman came out with a replacement/theme for dolphin that has only the best parts of the windows 10 explorer (recent file/folders view, details view.) and tags
>>109185839>everyone I know that has a mac is happy with it from a performance perspectiveI'd imagine so. I don't have a Mac but raw performance is less of an issue when the software is designed specifically for the hardware you're running.>>109185629You can make Linux work, most people just miss the point and get lost in technicals. FOSS lets you build your own ecosystem, it's like building a car. Apple is the easy way out if it doesn't click.And tbf the way Linux tends to be organized and branded doesn't make this clear. I only figured it out the second time I tried Linux.
>>109184875This but Windows
>>109184861I want to say Apple, but at least you can install Windows on most machines without a hassle. But yes, I'd take a MacBook over a Windows Laptop.>>109184886>Is it just because of the Unix familiarityYes, but the privacy ootb is also better, although that changed, I recommend any apple shill to read the defcon presentation on apple:>https://media.defcon.org/DEF%20CON%2033/DEF%20CON%2033%20presentations/Yoav%20Magid%20-%20AppleStorm%20-%20Unmasking%20the%20Privacy%20Risks%20of%20Apple%20Intelligence.pdfthe privacy went down to windows 11 levels, since they introduced apple intelligence on device spying.
Ehhhh, most of you faggots are fucking noobs @ the internets.I use linux not because I hate microsoft (believe me, I do, but that's not why), not because I want to be a geek (I am), but because it fits my style. It's so much easier to accomplish things when you have the power of *nix commandline goodies ala GNU tools, etc. As well, I don't have to spend time searching for cracks and shit because /everything/ I use is free and I can build it from source if I need to.Not only that, but anything I don't like, I can crack open and change, usually without too much difficulty. Linux: The OS is /yours/.Get the fuck out, all of you.
>>109184933>Windows would be a pretty good desktop environment if they switched to Linux kernelThis will happen in the long run, the creative people already switched to MacOS and many programmers prefer Mac, Windows has it's legacy, gaming(still) + work/office/enterprise.>Implemented coreutils (mac/linux compatible)>Winget (package manager)>WSL (straight up Linux)>Contributing heavily to the Linux kernel>Their cloud relies on it>https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-server/blog/2015/05/06/microsoft-loves-linux/Microsoft Windows will be a desktop environment with a subscription service (office365, azure, enterprise support) with Linux under the hood, NT virtualized kernel for legacy support + biggest WINE contributor with Valve.
apple and its not even closesnow leopard was unironically the best propriety software ever released, if I had to use one thats it
>>109184886Apple is more of a walled garden bullshit but it doesnt spy on you and sell off your data in the same way. Also the fact that it is unix does help a bit. Windows is like the worst kind of frakenstein creation under the hood and every piece of it is barely holding on together. There is no cohesion and I cant believe its still working after they just keep shoveling shit into it.
>>109187024>Apple is more of a walled garden bullshit but it doesnt spy on youhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A-a3d7Hb_6E
>>109184861Windows. MacOS is like the most useless thing on the planet. There is nothing that MacOS can do better than Windows or Linux, absolutely no reason to use it.
>>109187032can i get a summary? is apple now spying on people?
>>109187059>can i get a summary?Just watch from 00:53 to 02:40min. It's a 2min TLDR.>is apple now spying on people?yes
>>109187059This video literally says nothing.
>>109184861windows 10 ltsc iot edition, it's not even a contest.used modern itrash once, not again, UX is clearly done by a disabled retard, I'd take wangblows retardation over this shit any day, no wonder most macfags are actually disabled or mentally challenged, that's required to not go full insanne by using this shit, I'd stick to my arch/i3 setup though tyvm
>>109187059>oh no AI is a gaping pus wound.>what a surprise!Please ignore the shitposters.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BNmJ3qBP9GEHere's the actual defcon 33 presentation if you are interested.
>>109186999What a waste of digits.>Windows becoming based on LinuxThe truest mark of a midwit. They are too incompatibly different for a transition like that to ever succeed.
>>109184861both they were both psyops run by magic beans boomers that neither should have ever gotten off of the ground. name one good mac program. name one good windows program. you can't.
>>109187023That sounds like you've never used a Mac. Anyone I know who has to use one absolutely hates them with passion. Apples Software quality is among the worst I've seen (but it's pretty, yay!)
>>109184861Microsoft.They still inherit the last good will from IBM PC for allowing any OS to be installed.
>>109185683I love when macfags call windows malware ("ThErE aRe AdS iN yOuR oPeRaTiNg SyStEm") but they're totally cool with their OS actually rewriting ads in their emails and messagesSent from my Non-iPhone
>>109185651nah you can just turn off the notifications about iCloud and it stops permanently
>>109184861Apple:- ties you to a single hardware vendor- less available software- worse backwards compatibility+ pleasant user experienceMicrosoft:- worse user experience- forced online account+ not tied to a single hardware vendor+ more available software
>>109187207>They are too incompatibly different for a transition like that to ever succeed.Anon, It's not that hard, if Apple and MS managed to transition from x86 to ARM, then using WINE for legacy support sounds like a joke in comparison. And the virtualized NT kernel will help you!!!
>>109184947Geoworks for IBM compatibles
>>109184861Apple is one if not the biggest cancer in the tech world. I wish it had never existed.
>>109187490>if Apple and MS managed to transition from x86 to ARMMS hasn't managed that though, and Whine is pretty bad.
Mac OS because it makes me happy and doesn't bother me all the time to give them more money
apple is sadly the most polished nix experience and it isn't even closewindows is servicablelinux is raped by ebussi types at almost every level besides the kernel
I'm sure MacOS is 'better' but I would pick Windows over it for the software library. I'm 90 percent Linux at this point. Functionally Windows is fine I just don't like the spying thing because I do embarrassing shit like ERP
>>109187693>I do embarrassing shit like ERPbased
>>109184861>diehard Linux userstroonix wont exist by the end of this decade
>>109187303iTards are untermensch who take it up the ass 24/7 and call their javascriptOS reaming their gaping assholes a "feature"
I'd rather be a macfag before I willingly install windows 11 on my computer.
>>109185893>any other valuable contributions to this discussionYes. You're a moron.I've been listening to both sides of this stupid argument since 1990, having been using both DOS and Macintosh since the 80s, when the freedom and openness of PCs was far more relevant than it is today. People who argue for Windows in 2026 because "it's more customizable" are a joke. Especially with technically subliterate comments complaining about "magic keyboard shortcuts or shell commands required just to see your files"Your opinion on anything is less than worthless. Every modern operating system sucks in some major way. There are no good ones.
>>109187776>troonix wont exist by the end of this decadeLol what a joke, android relies on the Linux kernel, MacOS and Windows got easy access to Linux, even fucking Android 16 implemented a native gpu accel Debian VM via terminal. My fucking Homeserver runs Linux, the website we are on runs on Linux, all those AI clusters are running on Linux.But "troonix won't exist" lmfao. Sure, it's niche on the desktop, but it's probably the most valuable OS for humankind. Even Wintards, Applefags, Saarnix-users and BSDcucks can agree on that.
>>109187766scary
>>109187878
>>109184886For all the shortcomings, for all the retarded regressions under Ive and dye, Mac OS X is still the best
>>1091870232nd BestNeXTSTEP 4 was incredible, and is the reason Mac OS X was any good at all. There are still ux paradigms it had that have been lost to time
>>109184861Depends on usecase, but on average I'd say Windoze for desktop, BigMac for laptop
>>109184875>spies on you 10x harder than even ms>all hardware backdoored with T2>can't run any software without calling home to crapple servers first>if you lose internet your currybook is a brickit's not even a contest, you shit in the street
>>109184861windows, how fucked up that may be.apple lies about your privacy, which makes it worse.+ apple silicon can't even run linux normally. (asahi is still a joke)
MacOS is the lesser evil. And the reason why is more straightforward than you think.Microsoft and Apple are the two companies responsible for connecting the average person to the PC/Online world.But to buy Apple products you need to not be poor.
im going back to windows, fuck this
>>109187878The 4chan servers run on BSD
>>109184861They are both pure evilThe lesser evil are the BSDsAnd still for that they deserve to eliminated
>>109188413Don't trannytinker and this won't happen.Also, set up snaper and use a liveboot USB to roll it back in case of things like this. Your total downtime will be about four minutes.
>>109188400get a toilet street shitter
>>109187934
>>109184933>if they switched to Linux kernelWhy? Is the NT kernel bad or something?>>109186187How do you reccomend escaping the trap?
>>109189032do the needful iJeet >>109187766
>>109187776OH NO NO NO NO NOWE GOT TOO COCKY LINUXISTERSSSSSSSS
>>109187776This bait is so silly, it doubles as a dementia test. If you fall for it, you should probs apply for government assistance.
>>109189219tick tockthe great linjeet flushing is upon usimagine an internet without freejeets
>>109189250but why do you want that
>>109189250>imagine an internet without freejeets
>>109189250>>109189266ARM can't kill x86 and UEFI fast enough
>>109184861Impossible problem. They both are evil for different reasons.
>>109189250>the advice for asahi linux users is not to upgrade to macos 27 until the issue is resolvedDoesn't seem like a strong dementia test, but thanks for pointing it out it anyway
MacOS is pretty good. It's very similar to using a pre-riced Linux except you can't rice it yourself. Which isn't as much of a deal breaker for me now as it used to be. Everything else works exactly the same as I'd expect it to for my day-to-day tasks like compiling and debugging, among other things that all add up. Which is more than I can say for Windows. Way more. Side note... when I was in college a decade ago, all the students using Windows laptops were always sitting there with the spinning update circle "Getting things ready..." so they were just doing everything on their phones because the windows update process would keep getting in their way. I can't imagine it's changed for the better, nor with modern hiring trends and business trajectory at Microsoft.
>>109189394Windows updates happen once a month and the process takes about 10 minutes.And if you don't like that you can disable them and run them when you want.I hate Windows tbqh. But the whining about updates is so ridiculous. It reminds me of how retarded most people are.
>>109189442>It reminds me of how retarded most people are.this. so many of the people moving to linux are doing so over absolutely trivial bullshit that they could've figured out in ten minutes. like no shit if you're using stock Windows your experience will suck, all you have to do is download a few utilities, use startallback, and you're mostly fine from there. the only reason why i personally moved was because i kept having random problems that were truthfully probably my fault
>>109187934>t. Satya Nutella
>>109189442>run them when you wantsince when? last time i used it you could only postpone it for 2-4 hours max, and in certain scenarios it would say "fuck you, we'll do it now".
>>109189567nta but it depends a bit on which edition of Windows you have which update settings you can configure
>>109189567Non-Home editions let you disable updates since forever, officially.On Home edition (why would you use that?) you need to apply some registry hack.
>>109189605>On Home edition (why would you use that?because freetards are the same tech literacy level as boomersthey followed a basic ass 123 step guild to install their hobby OS and delude themselves into thinking they're masters of the tech universe when the reality is they're so fucking tech illiterate they can't figure out something as fucking basic as group policyfreetards are the same group of tech illiterates that cried about wannacry and "M$ BAD" when microsoft patched it and it became old news eons before it actually became hitauto security updates were made specifically for retards like theseauto feature updates are still shit though, but that's why different editions exist for different users
>>109184861They are equal and tied with Alphabet products. Only Nvidia and Oracle are more evil.
from what ive gathered mac users are homosexual and/or indian so Id say windows
>>109184875/thread
>>109189719>>109184875street shit harder pajeet
>>109188263Apple derangement syndrome: the post
>>109184861I literally got this 20 minutes ago booting my 2 years old win 10 VM which had been working fine. This has to be illegal. I couldn't get around this.
>>109190007perfect example of >>109189637
>>109184861Windows at least supports an open hardware ecosystem, Mac just runs on their own dogshit only.
>>109185578This is what I liked the best when I switched over to MacOS for my laptop usage. Windows today feels like being in a bazaar where merchants constantly pester you trying to sell something, MacOS feels more like a ”pay once and it’s done” experience, just like Windows was back in the day.
>>109190007just load an answers.xml in the base install.iso
>>109184861apple because it guarantees me posix environment and many shared expected behaviour to *nix stuff
>>109190019How can you be this retarded. People hate windows because it is literally begging you to "sign in" and has a button with "remind me later". I will never fucking deal with that shit, absolutely unusable. You actually fight your computer which is actively trying to spy on you and scam you, and then go online to defend it for absolutely no reason.People use macOS and Linux to avoid setting "group policies", they need to get work done instead of fighting their computer to stop spying on them and stop advertising and chosing the right browser and all that dumb shit. No MacOS or Linux user is ever thinking about running "debloating" scripts, but that's how bad it's gotten on windows.Windows is a tinkertranny operating system and you think you're cool when you spend time fucking around with group policies.Look at this shit, the right click menu is loading.
>>109190474also adding, i can use brew or macports and ignore about nearly all the apple side bullshitunironically works better than linux if i want to go zero brain usage comfy mode
>>109190505Recently I tried (and failed) finding a single use for my $3000 macbook, it can't even cronMacs literally get mogged by raspberry pisFuck off with your lies
>>109190707it is literally there?
>>109190717And it literally doesn't work
>>109190731yeah it is kinda borked
>>109190775Like literally every single thing on a Mac. Absolutely unusable for anything other than impressing low IQ girls>but they're so pretty
Android
>>109184861Honestly I have no idea windows is the worse OS right now but mac is gayI just want something nice like 7 was and KDE gets damn close.>>109189746Jfc roflmao. I have no words.
>>109189458>just a few simple third party hacks, ranjeet's debloat scripts, russian malwares and it's as good as arch+kdeno fucking thanks kek, that's all of the tinkering and breakage risk(actually multiplied by ten, at a minimum) of using arch without any of the reward
>>109187844G is full of technically illiterate morons, which is why you see the "it didn't work the way the other one worked therefore it's bad" arguments about keyboard shortcuts Funny is when that type runs out of arguments they just call you names
>>109184861muh tracking and spyware aside.Windows 11 is actually so fucking shit it's ridiculous.I left troonix for a couple of months, really gave Windows a chance, the performance was horrible, all their WinUI apps are absolute trash, their store is laggy, everything is fucking laggy and I have a monster PC, WSL has a massive performance tax even for basic node baseddev shit.Don't get me started about all the useless XBOX bloat, the copilot bloat, the double and slow af context menu, explorer is ridiculously bad, virtual desktops are slow af, you can't even move apps from expose mode from one screen to another.BRUH
>>109191269I forgot the gem that is setting up SSH when you are logged in with the mandatory MS account
>>109191269>>109191282It's not a mystery why all the AI shit is coming to macOS first, and actually Linux too now.
>>109191269True, W11 is embarrassingly bad.But you can just use W10 for a couple more years.>>109191282The MS acc isn't mandatory. Are you retarded?
>>109189059>How do you reccomend escaping the trap?It's hard to be more specific without knowing your exact usecases so I can only give advice. But stick with software that works well together and try to avoid software made for a specific desktop in mind.For example if you use KDE and like KDE, go all in on KDE. Otherwise try to avoid KDE software. Like if you're on XFCE you should be careful installing Kate because it might pull in a different icon theme and Konsole as a dependency. Also use the same distro for everything. Look to see if your package manager has an option to block packages from being installed, this can save you a lot of headache. If you want something more advanced look into the basic protocols like sftp or imap and how they integrate with your desktop. I have a seedbox I connect to through ftp on the file manager and can transfer files and stream movies from.
>>109184861windows, but only for secondary reasons. i don't want windows to die, because it's keeping pc's alive.as for macs, they're too insignificant to be a threat
>>109191288The reason is that most ai users are dumb and in the US, and because they're dumb and in the US, they use Macs
>>109191747Why block packages?
>>109190435It happened 2 (4) years after the install (I got the ISO 4 years ago). This screen probably wasn't even a thing back then.The solution is not to modify a fucking iso. The solution is to never use this piece of garbage for any use case.
>>109194303So you don't accidentally install them. Like on debian based distros it installs a lot of extra packages as "recommended" dependencies by default from a package. They're not actually hard dependencies and often makes the experience better, but sometimes it also fucks with your system config or is just bloat.For example I prefer doas because it's simpler than sudo. As a desktop user I don't need any advanced features to elevate privileges. But pretty much every desktop authentication package has sudo as a recommended dependency. They work fine without sudo, but installs it as a recommended dependency default.
>>109184861steamos
>>109184933such a revolutionary idea. gonna elaborate on why this works?
>>109191057>using arch without any of the rewardsure, but the point is people wanting a "windows" experience on linux are going to be dissapointed. if you're just driving it the same way, you might as well have just stayed on windows
Aluminum OS, because they provide a working distro of Linux.
Apple was okay when OS X was a thing and they owned Shake, but after Jobs kicked the bucket it went downhill from there. Talking about corporations is like talking about how your shit smells after a certain meal. It's different but not that much different.
>>109184861Windows because any benefit that macOS provides is immediately offset by vendor lock-in.
>>109184861Windows because at least it's usable and not designed by and for cuck guzzling faggots.
