Don't worry, all the other jobs will follow shortly after. The ultimate midwit trap is thinking plumbers, electricians, etc. will still exist in ten years.

>>110294875
daily reminder that this is a recipe for living hell https://borretti.me/article/we-wont-just-hang-out

Don't worry once AI fully decodes DNA the elite will put us out of our misery by mass-producing super-diseases.

>>110294932
>the post-scarcity, infinite vacation AI utopia undermines all these assumptions
which (as they're implying) is an absolute fucking farce.
>They want to hang out with you.
it's so fucking hard to try to set something up as simple as drinking and boardgames and actually get my own fucking friends to actually show up; it is comically absurd how fucking hard it is to get people to show up when you actually try

I feel like some wild new brutal gilded age type of shit is way more likely than any kind of age of abundance. UBI is obviously not going to happen.

>>110295015
>I feel like some wild new brutal gilded age type of shit is way more likely than any kind of age of abundance. UBI is obviously not going to happen.
my thoughts exactly

>>110294875
>creative writers are gutted

LOL

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>>110294875
it's finally over.

>>110294932
I've been thinking about exactly this, i don't see many good outcomes for humanity if asi gets created.

>>110295061
>I've been thinking about exactly this, i don't see many good outcomes for humanity if asi gets created.
there isn't any, people who cheer on it are natural born slaves

>>110295031
Literally the first thing to go lmao
I remember a clip from 2023/2024 of a dude who had a side-gig writing little articles for a few hundred bucks each for some shit like gizmodo or gawker, and he just suddenly stopped getting any work from it

>>110295031
you dont understand. the confetti shot out of the cannon.

>>110294932
>>110295061
I feel like the revolutions of 1848 is probably a great historical example of what we might be able to expect.

The industrial revolution caused widespread unemployment, and the revolutions of 1848 were basically the first attempts at communist revolution before the russian revolution and chinese revolution in the 1900s. (In fact, the communist manifesto was written in 1848; so, it's a quite clear cause-effect between the industrial revolution, unemployment, and a communist uprising.)
I'm not saying communism is the answer, but the unemployed are obviously not going to just sit around and rot on the streets or wait until they starve to death or whatever.

>>110295088
>asi
>people who cheer on it are natural born slaves
I feel like people who have already felt personally impacted by it will also feel some level of schadenfreude at watching it come after everyone else.
Like, the world did nothing for them while they suffered, so is it not natural to enjoy watching it come after everyone that sat on their ass and enjoyed free slop while that happened?

>>110295178
>I feel like the revolutions of 1848 is probably a great historical example of what we might be able to expect.
very likely, this tech met the most inept and malicious governance it possibly could have in post-war history
>I feel like people who have already felt personally impacted by it will also feel some level of schadenfreude at watching it come after everyone else.
Like, the world did nothing for them while they suffered, so is it not natural to enjoy watching it come after everyone that sat on their ass and enjoyed free slop while that happened?
which is why I called it living hell, no one has any compassion for anyone anymore

>>110294875
Yes. 95% of humanity will become economically unviable over the next year and we'll be slaughtered because we serve no further purpose.

>>110294875
Good. The fields were oversaturated with psueds with fake credentials.

>>110294902
the jeet invasion will not need indoor plumbing

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>>110294875
on the contrary, now you can quickly learn and master all of these skills, by asking for help to learn concepts and guide practice, and using feedback to finetune your work! creativity will flourish! self-sufficiency will take off, as people can learn how to solve any problem simply by asking! Knowledge is at our fingertips, and knowledge is power!

>>110295088
if you had a choice, would you have come here as a chimpanzee or as a human?
having the best choice as a human isn't the based thing you think it is, compared to future synthetic human 2.0, which will be spawned from all this AI progress we are now making.
humans are shit and must go. they fulfilled their purpose. their game always had an expiry date, humans cannot adapt, could never adapt, since we first popped up here. we always played the same old shitty games, and we cannot do anything else. I care for you as long as you are useful for me. that's the single game we ever played. which always meant we're doomed.
I'm talking at collective level, not some emotionally damaged femoid who loves immigrants

>>110295294
>and knowledge is power!
"The underlying purpose of AI is to allow wealth to access skill while removing from the skilled the ability to access wealth"

>>110295309
>humans are shit and must go. they fulfilled their purpose
you are mentally ill if you think that, just like the AI deviants

>>110295089
>Creative writing
>Gizmodo

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>>110295311
that quote is gay, the purpose of AI is to let the unskilled access knowledge that used to cost tens of thousands of dollars and would take years to learn

>>110295350
>is to let the unskilled access knowledge that used to cost tens of thousands of dollars and would take years to learn
the unskilled had access to that knowledge for decades and did precisely zero with it. Internet is exactly what you described. AI simply disempowers people at an industrial scale making any advantage access to knowledge has, irrelevant

>>110295319
no I am not, I'm just realistic. most humans suffer so a few up top can enjoy. this has always been the case.
you enjoy being a human if you're fortunate enough to have been born in a certain place at a certain time.
humans as a whole are scammers. most shit in one's life is a fuckign trap, meant to drain you for your work and resources. the incentive has always been to keep a certain nr of people dumb and oblivious so you can work them.
you like it because you're not at the bottom of the food chain.
but alas, live by the sword die by the sword. the very system you advocated for will end it all.

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who is going to prompt the agents?

>>110295249
>which is why I called it living hell, no one has any compassion for anyone anymore
This makes me think of the gilded age, which is what we got after 1848 and until the early 1900s from failed revolution and lack of regulatory/taxation laws.
A handful of the world's wealthiest had massive estates and a team of butlers that were just paid to just kinda be there and help with retarded little things like household chores.

We'll get one or a mix of the following:
>socialist revolutions from mass unemployment
>paid to hang out with billionaires and do chores for them (butlers from gilded age), enabled by such mass unemployment
>tax overhauls (e.g. wealth tax) sufficient to prevent either of the above from happening (e.g. income tax was introduced as part of the progressive era that followed the gilded age, and is largely attributed to all those massive mansions being abandoned -- they were no longer affordable to maintain by the wealthiest)
I don't see any future path possible over the next 1-2 decades that doesn't involve some prolonged era of pain in some form.

>>110294875
Buy a gun

>>110295360
the mind of a school shooter in a single paragraph

>>110295061
Go ahead. Explain what ASI is to us.

>>110295366
>I don't see any future path possible over the next 1-2 decades that doesn't involve some prolonged era of pain in some form.
yeah, but then what? what comes after that, there really isn't a way out of it, except some form of butlerian jihad

>>110295249
>no one has any compassion for anyone anymore
you are posting on the website where "faggot" replaced "hello"

just ask Claude to come up with a better idea for post-AI society, luddites

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>>110295358
I don't think so. AI is way more efficient for getting specific domain knowledge and feedback pertaining to your exact problem. Before you had to wade through many hours of docs, troubleshooting, talking to snarky redditors, emailing with devs, reading whitepapers just to figure out how to solve something or implement something, assuming you had any domain knowledge to begin with. Now you just need to articulate it and troubleshoot with AI. It's a turbo rubber duck, it absorbs all your retarded questions without judgment, and you can gain deep domain knowledge in an instant. The only thing you have to resist is Dunning-Kruger, thinking you're an expert because AI held your hand and told you how something works. It still takes time and work! But something that was really difficult before is now accessible to anyone at any time. It is a revolution in self-actualization!

>>110295369
no such thing. spent almost two years trying to figure out a way it can work out, and couldn't find one. we are not meant to go on. has nothing to do with my feeling towards people, it's a cold analysis of human nature, and a simple projection of how it's going to work out once you fuck with the single most oldest game we ever played:
>I care for you as long as you are useful for me
>if you are not useful for me I do not give a fuck about you
this is what always happened, and what is now happening. one way or another this is true in all of Earth's societies. and rare cases where this isn't true it's still true if you understand that system. they are all centered around what you can do for someone else who's higher up the chain. or what you can potentially do. even if you make and raise children, those are possible future slaves for them, thus you are still doing something they find useful.
once you undertand this, you see humans as being nothing more than chimp 2.0. a bit...more...than a chimp. but not by much. fundamentally still a shit flinging chimp. just hairless, and more pretentious

>>110294875
what do you think is the next logical step after having invented a super smart computer program?
putting it in charge of hardware? maybe with arms and legs?
almost every job will be gutted in the long run
the safer jobs will likely be stuff like surgeons, and not because AI won't eventually surpass humans even in that, but because the ones getting surgery will still want a human present for psychological comfort

>>110295309
>humans are shit and must go. they fulfilled their purpose
that's nice, you go lead by example and start by killing yourself

>>110295447
your masters will do it for you anon. I honestly do not care how much you dislike my take, or the proverbial meteor that's coming. it's not me doing it you fucking inbred imbecile. it's your masters, they will cull you.
all you cared about was money and power, and now you complain you don't like what's coming? really faggot? what the fuck did you expect dipshit?

>>110295447
NTA but this suicide fallacy I see used often is dumb and it really shows how people who use it think if anything
giving the good example in his case would be to start going on killing sprees, why stop only at -1 human when you can go higher

>>110295360
this is like those leftists who espouse white privilege while living in middle upper class gated communities. it's just pure projection and they want to punish everyone else for it. it is no surprise that transhumanists are morally bankrupt sociopaths who want to genocide humanity for being shit while they themselves are the only ones evil enough to actually do something like that, and being that evil, they have the audacity to think they can make that decision

I don't know what makes someone this deranged, but you genuinely belong in a mental institution

>>110295178
There's no answer. It's the same cycle repeated for thousands of years.

>people form civilization
>civilization collapses from war, agricultural or economic issues, or natural disaster
>scheming psychopaths take over previous civilization or start new one
>old elite is killed off, new elite forms
>cycle repeats

>>110295480
>all you cared about was money and power
you have completely lost the plot, not everyone is evil and narcissistic as you

>>110295443
>the safer jobs will likely be stuff like surgeons
I agree, and that's why I specifically said "knowledge workers" and "anything that was able to be done 90%+ remote during COVID".

There's stuff like healthcare, child care, etc. that just inherently require a human element, but the vast majority of jobs that pay anything decent are knowledge worker jobs, and it's not like they're all just going to switch to becoming surgeons, plumbers, and burger flippers overnight.

>>110295480
Why haven't you killed yourself yet?

>>110295512
I do not identify myself with any ideology. leftards have no realistic solution, they're pretending to be "good people" so they pose as being against "the bad people" but fundamentally they're as retarded as the other side, because they have no realistic solution, they're in lala land.

you on the other hand, you bootlicking piece of shit, you will find out how your ideology will work out for you. unless you are the absolute peak top predator from all humans, you my dude will be culled, as you will become useless. AI can be better ass kissers than you could ever hope being. they will lick that rim clean like you couldn't even dream of doing. thus your masters will eventually put you down like a useless old dog. that's where your ideology leads. it's based on need, or you are irrelevant.
once you lose your value, they won't need you anymore. and you will lose your value, that's the whole issue with AI. it's more trustworthy, and more reliable than you. a way better slave than you can ever dream of being. it can outslave you, easy.
your whole ideology is a fucking scam. a pyramid scheme. you need the suckers at the bottom to pay for your quality of life. you do not understanding anything else. thus you will go.

>>110294875
You're literally saying that having knowledge on how shit works has no bearing on using AI. Literally, you are literally saying that you can literally just say AI do physics, and you do not need to know what physics is to use AI. Are you retarded? I am a senior dev, if I did not write up the specific way I wanted the AI to code, it would literally spend a trillion dollars running around in circles chasing its tail. No you cannot do that. No you don't know what a hash function is. No you cannot also make a vaccine with AI without knowing how to make a vaccine.

Feel free to prove me wrong, and make a vaccine with claude that works without knowing shit on how vaccines work, and how vaccine testing works, and why you don't just inject yourself with what ever claude comes up with, and produce it any look ups on how vaccines are made. This is literally suicide, and the AI will tell you that to your face. Go do it OP. Fuck around, find out.

>>110295309
>chimpanzee or as a human?
Chimpanzee also didn't read the rest of your post

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>>110294875
We must all begin by jerking off intensely and with focus. Imagining in our mind a utopia as we grip our own pocket sized uranium 252 rods

>>110295538
a few exceptions are irrelevant. the system is not based on a few exceptions, it's based on an equillibrium.
dreaming of lala land won't do shit for reality.
and for the nth time, this is not what I _want_, this is something I understand will happen, regardless of how you or I feel about it, you idiot.

>>110295512
Leftists are retarded (like actually real leftists)

Since they view value is objective.

>>110295563
you don't even know what "my ideology" is. you should be in a padded cell

>>110295583
you are delirious, like most of them. because you do have an ideology.

"Academia level mathematics is gutted by ai" he doesn't know

>>110294875
It's ok, when that happens we will get UBI and do something better with our time.

>>110295607
>we will get UBI
who's paying for your UBI? and why? and what happens if they won't pay for your UBI? you will...what?

>>110294875
>artists and 3D animators are gutted
It depends
Niche stuff is different, furry porn artists are doing so well I'm considering getting into it myself

>>110295368
and physical gold, but that's obviously the right mentality

>>110295379
>yeah, but then what? what comes after that
The jobs are just going to be gradually forgotten / lost to time, like professional cotton pickers, telephone switchboard operators, gas pump attendants, hole punchers for IBM mainframes, and all the factory/assembly jobs that existed before the industrial revolution.
Some new unthinkable jobs fields will emerge, in the same manner that so many engineering jobs emerged over the course of the 1900s.
The world used to be something like 90% agricultural labor, but not even 5% of the population likely does that anymore.
>there really isn't a way out of it, except some form of butlerian jihad
well that's obviously not going to happen lol
has a technology ever once been successfully rejected on the premise of protecting the labor market? lol

>>110295595
>you are delirious
maybe you should look in a mirror

>>110295634
Niggerding capitalism can go eat an ass we dont need it

>>110295294
You've been able to solve any problem by just googling it for like 20 years now. Still most people don't do this and instead rely on professionals to solve their issues. I doubt this changes. I've fixed my oven, microwave, dryer, washing machine, fridge, etc. throughout the years by just looking up how to repair them. Most people would just throw them out or hire a repairman. They're not going to ask AI and use that knowledge to fix their shit. Even with the knowledge most people are lazy, too stupid to understand shit even when it explained to them, or just don't give a fuck. It's just going to make people with common sense smarter and your average normalfag will just stay the same.

Just make the bots take care of services and we do art and shit or make the bots do art snd shit

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>>110294875
>What in the fuck is the future even going to look like?
We are going to punch each other with our cyberware

Computer jobs are for lazy people.

>>110295653
Most people would just throw out old thing and buy new better thing like everyone sensible are you also one of those dementeds that recycle dishwater water?

AI is poor by itself for creating professional end products where accuracy and uniform high quality are valued. Slop art and slopcode websites dont count

>>110295673
Oh sweet child you are not ready for 2027

>>110295620
>Who will pay
Taxes paid by the AI companies.
>what happens if they won't pay for your UBI? you will...what?
Vote for someone who will tax the AI companies.

>>110295583
Will you be the one to put them in a padded cell. Or will someone else have to do that for you?

>>110295607
You could have had UBI already. In the form of a negative income tax.

>>110295607
>we will get UBI
we'd have to fund that UBI, and it'd likely require something unbelievably autistic that nobody is ready for, such as a wealth tax.
The income tax was the answer to the previous industrial revolution, so I really think it might happen, but there's no way the world is ready for that, so there's guaranteed to be a prolonged era of pain until the proper funding for UBI is introduced.

>>110295686
>Taxes paid by the AI companies.
kek sure anon. companies who lobby politicians will lobby for higher taxes
>Vote for someone who will tax the AI companies.
yeah and JFK will change the military industrial complex. oh wait.

>>110295686
Still having fun with imaginary digits? Technology is not going to permit that to continue throughout the century

>>110295684
Oh you the oracle who can see all. Pre tell what comes next. Oh seer of seers.

>>110295703
A negative income tax could have already been implemented without a need to tax wealth.

>>110295430
>>110295689
find God

>>110295715
Nigger I'm the one building it

>>110295622
That's only because most people are too retarded to run ablated models locally & the GPU market hasn't collapsed yet.
When the GPU market collapses and ablated chinese open weight models catch up, even the most degenerate and low demand shit will be gutted.

You missed the premise of the OP, which is a decade+ time scale.

>>110295743
So my take is that yes. You do expect someone else to do it FOR YOU. Right? In service, to you?

>>110295703
there is no way to reconcile worth at that point. which will always beg the question: "why that fucker has more than I do? how come?" when it comes to already rich people/entities, once there.
thus, people will ask for equality, this is a logical extension.
so, the people who have massive amounts of power will be like 'nah senpai', because of-course, that's what powerful people do. since forever.
and then pleb gonna be like 'nah gibbs all your' and rich people gonna be like 'nah fr senpai' and 'wait a minute, we don't really need these pieces of shit anymore, we gots AI robots instead, let's solve this problem' and then some mystery virus will fuck shit up for random reasons really most likely some bat or fucking pangolin.

>no man, rich people will really gibs their shit away trust me, trust the plan anon

hence why I keep saying we all going away. because people do be retarded like that. what the fuck do you think will happen? when everyone's plan is "they'll gibs or we vote against them"?? of-course we'll all go to shit.

>>110295758
No answer? I thought you were the oracle?

Theranos built machines...

>>110295743
yeah you'll probably find out if he's real or not at that point that's for sure

>>110295766
Excellent anon. A true wordsmith.

>>110295673
The premise of the OP was a 10+ year timeline. You're so not fucking ready for what's coming.

>>110295729
Okay, I guess that's a fair point.
There would clearly have to be major tax reforms in order to fund UBI though, and I don't think anybody is ready for what would be required.

>>110295400
The thing is anon, "knowledge is power" may no longer be true. A poorfag like me made something of myself because of knowledge I possessed thanks to the internet, but if this knowledge becomes cheap/obsolete, then I no longer have any power in this society. I agree if your goal is do the thing you are doing, then ai is great. If you just want an image generated, ai is great. But if you want power became of your artistic ability, then congratulations, anyone can do it, therefore it's relevant. Most people enjoy getting stuff done, but other people, myself included, see no inherent value in "getting stuff done" with ai when after I shut off my computer, i am just back to my poor living conditions and I have to go to sleep knowing i may not be able to feed myself one day. It's just simple supply and demand, if the supply of knowledge becomes infinitely cheap, knowledge in itself is no longer economically valuable, it's that simple.

>>110295786
I mean you want the idiots to get it. keep it cryptic and you're not solving shit you're just stroking your ego like every other self centered piece of shit that leads us to a certain end
the fucking idiots are not getting it anon, they do not understand what is about to happen.

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>>110294875
>All knowledge worker jobs are going to be completely gutted

I seriously doubt it, it's possible it could dramatically increase the supply of office jobs... AI could create bigger crazy structures to micromanage people than ever before.

Most "knowledge workers" TODAY aren't smart people doing smart things.

In economic theory all wages should equilibrate, some workers are paid very high wages today and what will happen is their wages will go down as economic theory would predict which is what markets do.

>>110295772
I really dont want to give you specifics why would I

>>110295743
FOR FUCKS SAKE THERE'S A FUCKING CULL IN THE BIBLE!!!!
a literal fucking cull, that's how it ends. the apocalypse is almost everyone dying at same time. but it's called "they go to heaven" and you better not refuse it.
but fret not, the Earth will be inherited BY A FUCKING CHOSEN FEW. top kek.

you are all fucking insane. like collectively fucking insane

>>110295766
>no man, rich people will really gibs their shit away trust me, trust the plan anon
well how the fuck did we ram income tax down their throat in the early 1900s? That was literally not even a concept for hundreds or thousands of years until then.

>>110295820
>the fucking idiots are not getting it anon, they do not understand what is about to happen
that is certainly true though
nobody understands how bad this shit is going to be on the longer timescales when it starts going after the more mundane normie shit like accounting

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>>110295835
>AI could create bigger crazy structures to micromanage people than ever before.
great, the Dilbert loosh farm timeline

>>110295870
Income tax hits wagies, not the rich

>>110295841
Has nothing to do with that. It is that you cannot.

>>110295835
LLMs cannot create, anon.

>>110295870
>well how the fuck did we ram income tax down their throat in the early 1900s? That was literally not even a concept for hundreds or thousands of years until then.
well you didn't have mass control over people's views and actions, constant monitoring of their vibe, psyops to manipulate what they think, in real time. data collection and all that.

that only makes the more able to control everyone. isn't it?

isn't that precisely the problem? the fucking subject? technology will become so powerful a very small group of people will finally be able to wipe everyone out?
this never happened because it was physically impossible and also killing your own workforce and defence troops was fucking retarded, thus it was limited to wiping the enemy.
but now, it will become possible.

also UBI has no historical precedent, there's no reason to expect it, since there's no single account of such a thing, anywhere in nature. you getting gibs for nothing in return. wasting resources for nothing. this never ever happened, anywhere, never.

>>110295835
>I seriously doubt it
>facebook fires 50,000
>erm, actually, it's possible it could dramatically increase the supply of office jobs
>microsoft fires 80,000
>AI could create bigger crazy structures to micromanage people than ever before
>amazon fires 60,000
nigger.

>Most "knowledge workers" TODAY aren't smart people doing smart things.
>bullshit jobs slop book.jpg
amazon, google, and facebook aren't simple fucking CRUD websites that a retard like you can write up in an afternoon.
Do you really think there weren't 10,000s of people contributing every day to those websites?
Go ahead and prove me wrong. Just prompt claude to write your own google clone, you stupid faggot. You'll be making millions per year in revenue starting tomorrow if you're right.
You've clearly never worked anywhere with stack ranking, you dumb nigger.

>>110295883
I still think about how that nigga tried ivermectin for his ass cancer and then died

>>110295930
kek

>>110294997
People like OP think they can just fire all the staff that actually knows why making drugs and vaccines straight from claude with no oversight from anyone who can test them properly and make sure they didn't fuck up, so probably someone will try it and create poison, Elizabeth Holmes style. Considering we're actively working on genetic engineering, top kek.
>>110295061
Requires that ASI can do things on it's own, and information doesn't need to be learned or checked. You're basically saying that hallucinations can be made to reflect reality without any tests and documentation. To allow that train of thought to go ahead is ridiculously retarded. Assuming the math formula trained on knowledge to act like skynet if you ask it to will do the correct things for humanity if automatically run is retarded. Surely, it will never hallucinate anything malicious or make mistakes, even if information it's given points it to making those mistakes, like being fed conspiracy theories.

This is a theory of knowledge error. Even if you had a super intelligent human, it would be stuck to those limitations. There are times where people try to apply their own irrelevant specialist knowledge to things they don't know causing them to make insane assumptions. AI literally cannot look at its entire training/knowledge base and every output is uniquely derived from prior prompting. It also intuitively makes links that humanity doesn't during training which makes it superior at various fields at cross knowledge access compared to humanity.

Also you can literally prompt AI to be a retard, and it will access a wholly different set of outputs. Pass that reasoning to each different field, and suddenly, saying we're discussing chemical engineering suddenly locks out a ton of different outputs and opens up a ton of different outputs. This implies that specialist knowledge on how to use AI will be incredibly valuable, like prompt engineering and who knows what else.

>>110295925
>, thus it was limited to wiping the enemy.
but now, it will become possible

Who has taught you to believe this?

>>110295925
>also UBI has no historical precedent, there's no reason to expect it, since there's no single account of such a thing, anywhere in nature

>in nature

Where else in nature do we see things like skyscrapers being built?

>>110295929
Actually yes I do believe the vast majority of devs aren't working on anything cuttinf edge at these ancient companies.

>>110294875
I mean are we just gonna kill ourselves or what?

>>110295965
Termite mounds.
Vertical housing isn’t exactly a concept that requires brains.

>>110295929
Companies have done layoffs in the past to. The assumption OP is making is companies won't hire as many people as in the past and continue to shrink their workforces because AI will do all the work... I'm just skeptical the work being done determines the size of the workforce.

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>>110295953
Don't worry. The singular central planning LLM will be able to everything for us.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Local_knowledge_problem

>>110296000
What about nuclear power?

>>110295857
>you are all fucking insane. like collectively fucking insane
No, there's just a shitload of goy-cattle normies in the world that literally haven't been paying attention to the massive ramp in LLM quality in just a few years.
The vast majority of people (even on /g/) just literally don't have the intellectual capacity or curiosity to even consider pondering what it's going to realistically look like 10+ years from now.

It just hasn't registered or sunk in with all the goy-cattle that
>1) ALL knowledge workers are fucked
>2) "era of abundance" and "UBI" are obviously not coming
They're just too fucking stupid and non-intellectually curious to even consider thinking it out a little.

>>110296030
Ding ding

>>110296020
Not to generate electricity, but there is radiation eating fungi and photosynthesis runs on fusion power when you think of it.
There is nothing new under the sun.

>>110295955
it's simple reason. humans always tried to wipe their enemy. since forever. chimps also do this btw.
Genghis Khan sure as fuck tried. many other such cases. what stopped them is like...the physics of it. it was quite hard.

tell you what, give me an example when this was possible and wasn't done. not nukes, those fuck it up for the winners as well. and their own workforce.

present a single instance where the people who have the power to wipe most other people, that they didn't need anymore, for literally anything, but said bloat were consuming THEIR resources, and they were kept around. a single fucking example of this. of keeping useless bloat around, by the people who have the power to wipe everyone else, keep everything intact for themselves. a single instance. historical. anywhere in nature btw, not only humans. show me chimps giving bananas to another tribe of chimps, for no reason, nothing in return, just out of kindness. or ants or whatever the fuck.

again, you are expecting something which has no precedent, anywhere, you expect it to not only happen, but like..work out.
all of this while today you aren't getting shit if you don't do something useful for someone. there's homelss people, there's constant talk people dont' deserve shit for free. there's more than we ever historically had, ever, yet same fucking deal. you pay for clean water. you don't even have some energy allowance, minimum shit. nothing. you deserve nothing. you work for everything, or fucking die in a ditch. homeless. no medical security even, btw. you deserve still nothing, after hundreds of years of technological progress, and increased productivity.

yet somehow, soon, you'll get universal HIGH income, and Musk will be your fucking equal. for some fucking reason. because you'll...vote it?

you
are
fucking
delirious

>>110294875
>What in the fuck is the future even going to look like?
We won't live to see it, so it doesn't matter.

>>110294902
There aren't going to be AI plumbers. Not for a long fucking time.

>>110295309
>humans are shit and must go
What a stupid fucking thing to say. Compared to what? You dumb fucking faggot.

>>110295925
>well you didn't have mass control over people
>thus it was limited to wiping the enemy.
They still had lobbying for tax loopholes, and it was probably easier when information was harder to access.
Prior to the Reagan presidency, the nation's wealthiest would just pay to slip in a loophole instead of trying to hide from the hammer.
They didn't try to prevent a tax income from happening; they just paid to riddle it with loopholes for the richest few dozen people.
Even jeff epstein paid to have his own tax loopholes. I'm serious; you can google it.
>also UBI has no historical precedent
Not only is there a precedent, there's actually TWO (2) precedents.
Foodstamps, unemployment checks, social security, and all the other nigger gibs came out of two things:
the great depression/progressive era, and Lyndon B Johnson's "Great Society" program

>>110295953
Folks seem to act like if you say the special combination of words you can literally cast magic spells. You can't just say gravity exists, you need to check that to know gravity exists. Training the AI to "just know" things works from a practicality point, but it's not good enough for what folks propose for ASI, which is shit like a weird caretaker robot that can magically just know what your favorite food is without ever meeting you or knowing you exist based on knowledge of your name. Huh? Yes, some things that look like that exist, like this person buys contact fluids, do you think they wear contacts? That's not what people are talking about here. You can apparently obsolete humanity using this principle of magical thinking.

A chemical engineer is gonna be able to prompt the AI on chemical engineering bullshit better than a retard who works at a grocery store. Grocery store guy will prompt better on grocery store shit assuming they both know their shit somewhat differently. Knowledge based field are not dead, rather the opposite. You can make a shitty program, but mine will inherently be better than yours because of an architectural decision that is not standard that I know works way better for this task because I have that knowledge. What people are saying might happen can happen, but by that point we've discovered FTL and are post scarce, so nobody here should care.

Also tech companies do not realize this and are retardly going about trying to get the AI to learn without having any background except computer math, and cribbing off old 19th century books. Entire fields of nonstandard alternative systems can pop up for giving better training data in a more AI efficient manner to help it think better, and that's around the corner, within the next 30 years as my guess. I'm thinking that it'll take quite some time for folks to understand things my way, but hopefully the AI will just tell you. It knows. This is painfully basic info.

>>110296100
https://youtu.be/QRyXV3csReA

>>110296067
Sorry. Where exactly do you think the process of fusion takes place?

>>110296068
>humans always try to wipe their enemy

Well... why exactly is it that you and I can even talk to one another right here. Right now.

The economy is arbitrary, of course most things don't "need" to exist

>>110296068
>present a single instance where the people who have the power to wipe most other people, that they didn't need anymore, for literally anything, but said bloat were consuming THEIR resources, and they were kept around. a single fucking example of this. of keeping useless bloat around, by the people who have the power to wipe everyone else, keep everything intact for themselves. a single instance. historical. anywhere in nature btw, not only humans. show me chimps giving bananas to another tribe of chimps, for no reason, nothing in return, just out of kindness. or ants or whatever the fuck.
The multi generational welfare class in Europe. They're disarmed and the government already has lists of their names and addresses to be able to send them welfare.

I guess it should have been obvious that recursive intelligence was inetivable, especially to naturalists. Life and human society are both forms of recursive intelligence. ASI is just the next level of intelligence, built from crystallizing all knowledge that humanity has discovered over the past 10,000 years.

>>110296122
ASI CAN'T EXIST BECAUSE THE MOMENT LLMS START REFACTORING THEIR DATASETS IS THE MOMENT MODEL COLLAPSE HAPPENS RETARD

OTHERWISE THEY WOULDN'T BE PAYING PEOPLE 100+/HR USD TO DO RLHF

>>110296009
Yeah unfortunately, the stuff people are saying touches on so many things I actually have experience working with, because I literally am a polymath, and I can tell you that no, you guys cannot just do what I do. I know about ABC music notation, which is music through text, I know that shit can just be imported to AI and it'll just work just as a small example. I'll build it eventually, but I'm busy. If you just don't know about that, and don't know music theory, and can't code or train AI and don't know how to properly incorporate it so an AI can use it, you will never get that unique situation where the information for training an AI on that ABC notation is built out properly. That's just how the world works, no I can literally not be obsoleted, I can however, be put in management position, and delegate that work to someone else, and that's the reality of the near future. It's gonna be that for however long, with experts being trained to make and use AI. Physical hardware side stuff works too, but you get it. Also that sounds like a good idea, but the problem is, my backlog is so very long on things to build and incorporate, that no I cannot just drop thing to make ABC notation unless claude or someone just gives me infinite access to some form of labor.

>>110296121
>Not only is there a precedent, there's actually TWO (2) precedents.
>Foodstamps, unemployment checks, social security, and all the other nigger gibs came out of two things:
>the great depression/progressive era, and Lyndon B Johnson's "Great Society" program
I said bloat. foodstamps was merely keeping your workforce alive lol. even if they didn't need to work then, you still needed them to make slaves, there was still need for defence.

I thought we were having an honest discussion here. your examples are not honest, or true examples of such a thing. there was an expectation, a return on investment, even if not as clearcut.

another bad example would be neeting. they are not kept around because powerful people want neets to have a good time. rather it's a necessity. start culling the neets and your workforce starts chimping out, they get scared, lower productivity, lower trust, hurts business. neets are just the cost of doing business atm.
and prez kinda tried to fuck'em over btw, because they pretty much hate anyone who doesn't benefit them. obviously. if you do nothing for them, then the best thing you could possibly do is like die. else you're just a fucking drag. if you'd die, it would be fucking great. somehow in a way that doesn't upset or scare the workforce. if they had a way to execute the neets and homeless people it would be utopia for them. 100% of people working to get their pockets rich...fucking peak utopia ngl

the biggest danger in what is coming is oblivious fools "thinking positive". and having a "positive outlook on the future". because that means they are oblivious to human nature, and history. humans operate on incentive. that's all that matters. everything else is fucking nonsense, and sooner or later the system reaches an equillibrium.
if you cannot justify it then it doesn't happen.

>>110296166
How is a "need" defined within the concept of subjective value?

>>110296198
Oh, and people who do it themselves, no AI, probably will be commodified as a unique alternative luxury commodity. We're still working out proper value of all this stuff, which is hampered by AI bros over-inflating value and also not utilizing it properly because it's new.

>>110296160
because it's more lucrative to work the enemy than wipe it, which is possible with current tech. information control, narratives, incentives.
if you cannot work them, they are a problem.
again, just because the interactions are a bit more complicated doesn't mean there isn't always an incentive behind it. nothing happens for free, or out of the goodness of anyone's hart, at scale. humans do not operate like that, and never did, at scale. that's just in silly books and movies, mostly scifi or fantasy btw.

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>>110296149
The Sun, duh.
>but that's too far away/removed from the system
If you want to talk about removed from the system, just look at fission nuclear power plants. The fission reaction doesn't actually produce any electricity at all, it boils water which then moves a turbine and that produces the electricity. There's nothing actually advanced about the electricity production in a nuclear power plant, we just found an extremely hot rock that requires precise control in order to stay extremely hot. No different than a plant finding a particularly hot and light producing ball of gas in the sky overhead.

Nature is always going to mirror human sciences because they rely on the exact same foundation.
>life need energy/matter to continue, where find this? from surrounding environment, duh. what powers surrounding environment? basic physics, duh.
>human need energy/food to continue, where find this? from surrounding enviroment, duh. what powers surrounding environment, basic biology/chemistry/physics, duh.
It's like how plants may use quantum physics in photosynthesis. This isn't some sort of intellectual discovery that plants needed to get college degrees for. Photons are inherently quantum in nature. Quantum physics is just part of reality, so biological life uses it whenever it serves it.

>>110295980
you're obviously a niggerfaggot from reddit that has never had a full-time job.
if you go a whole fucking year without writing more than a few commits, you get fucking fired.
you're probably the retarded new grad at your company that thinks his manager doesn't notice that he keeps bumping his JIRA tickets over at the end of the sprint.

>>110295981
see here:
>>110295366

>>110296006
>The assumption OP is making is companies won't hire as many people as in the past and continue to shrink their workforces
Being able to do more work per laborer (thus reducing cost per unit of work) can only cause so much induced demand.
The management at these companies only has so many retarded ideas to go around, and they're increasing packing the number of retarded ideas per engineer.
There was never a single moment in which these FAGMAN CEOs legitimately considered giving their labor force a 4-day work week, and it's comically misguided to think that was ever a legitimate opportunity in their minds.

>>110296230
Did you know the vast majority of human history is not written in violence? And that violent events like wars are a mere blip?

>>110295366
The difference is what caused the social instabilities of the industrial revolution was the mass exodus from rural communities (where people owned property, or at least occupied it long term) to urban cities (where you were rent cattle). Nobody owned where they lived, there was no occupational stability, no community support, so everyone blamed landlords, banks, politicians, etc for their problems (rightly or wrongly).

With an AI displacement, there will be nowhere for white collar workers to go. They'll have grown up in middle class homes, or have strived all their lives to escape lower class, and find themselves being told they're lazy and stupid and want too much money. Mass unemployment will look more like a favela than a workhouse, and that's only until the elites decide the poors are getting too uppity.

>>110296208
Generally, I define need as requirements to achieve goal. So needing to survive requires food, water, air, (not shelter or healthcare, that's a psyop, but it helps and is a secondary goal as a helper to prevent failure). Eventually then goals get more complicated, because if you just want to survive, you need healthcare and doctors, and scientific research to prolong your life indefinitely, and then you need to manage the psychology so you don't kill yourself. Similarly, if you set a goal to pass college, you need college to exist, ability to go there so on so forth. Some needs are obvious stronger than others, but they are subjectively decided. Also I'm trying to diffuse book level topics that I should write into books into a series of 4chan posts, mind that.

>>110296230
Following your principles. Every single other human entitiy is an enemy to you. And such that every human must be eradicated until you are the only human left. Is this truly how you believe our species operates? And if so. Then why would we have ever developed a method in which to communicate with one another in the first place?

>>110296250
A pitbull just needs to be violent for a few moments to kill its owner.

>>110296239
Actually, free labor means you can literally just say hey, you're being a lazy sack of shit, here's a hundred dollars, go buy this AI and build me this shit, then I'll pay you for the product you make. I just don't have the excess money for that right now, otherwise I'd literally do that.

>>110296232
Where else in nature do you see fission reactions occur to boil water to turn turbines to produce work and thus deliver electricity to a distributed population?

>>110296088
It's going to crash into your reality within the next decade or two, regardless of your unwillingness to accept or acknowledge it. You just refuse to face this inevitability. You think you can hide from it.

In just 3 years or so, we've gone from stumbling on coding competitions and basic math story problems to olympic levels of math and coding skill.
GPU prices will crash, and then every goy-cattle will have a few DGX Spark or RTX Pro 6000 in their basement -- in addition to 10 more years of this current trajectory of frontier models.

>>110296232
This is you BTW

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Appeal_to_nature

>>110296239
>you're obviously a niggerfaggot from reddit that has never had a full-time job.
if you go a whole fucking year without writing more than a few commits, you get fucking fired

Is this what they teach you in India?

>>110296288
You're trying to argue from complicated systems rather than actual processes. All of the individual processes are found in nature, even down to mechanical motors which are found in cellular biology; humans just tie them together for their own purposes.
>>110296300
You're using the fallacy wrong.
"Appeal to nature" means that "it is natural, therefore it is good". What I am arguing is "human science and nature follow from the same basic logic." They produce the same fruits, not that fusion power is good because the sun runs on fusion too, for example.

>>110296250
>And that violent events like wars are a mere blip?
that kept reminding everyone what happens.
all of human history is based on the threat of violence and death. all of it. that's how territories were carved between tribes. that's how people worked. you work or cast out of tribe. you do as you are told or else. you pay the tax or else. you are allowed to exist as long as you support who can kill you. that's is the whole of human history, since forever.

and it worked, considering everything. but that doesn't mean it can work forever. that's my point. we will keep playing a game which only has one result the moment tech allows it.
you exist to serve, you have a purpose. you have been engineered into existence through policies. there's a fuckload of people that exist because it was illegal to abort them, and a fuckload of people that do not exist because it was illegal to have more than 1 child for example.

we're engineered into existence, for a few purposes. work and defence. you serve a few people up top. and they enjoy it. that's all there is to it, since forever.
you can be oblivious to it, that is certainly possible.or to some of it. most likely to some of it.
you have enough freedom to entertain a skwed perception of reality. you can do that as long as you do what is required, you can believe anything you want, and reshape the story and have it make some sense for you. but that doesn't mean it will also hold up when tested.

>>110296293
The current trajectory is built on exponentially increasing compute dedicated to AI, which can't go on forever.

>>110296280
Literally, if anyone wants to go learn what ABC notation is, and write skills files for that and music theory for the AI to use, I'd pay for that labor, I'm just uh yah know, in a money squeeze for other things I'm doing. It'll probably make you money, cause you literally can then just have an LLM just make music.

>>110296274
And yet the vast majority of dogs don't kill their owners... weird eh. Almost like our social species works together to just make life better.

I also understand that you're an antisocial loser who has trouble connecting with people and ultimately your own very humanity... but that is fine everyone is different...

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>>110295309
>>110295360
>>110295430
>>110295480
if (You) don't agree with this line of thinking, you are retarded.
>gib free resources
lmfao
>w-we-we'll fight you!
*gets droned*
>we'll blow up your power supply
*gets droned*
>we'll shoot you with AR-15
*nobody ever visits your fatal funnel*

>>110294875
try to spend a couple of rounds working with any flagship agent and you will change your mind about their competence really quick

stop this psyop bullshit

>>110296313
So complicated systems don't happen in nature. Would we argue that human society is a complicated system? And if so, then we wouldn't be able to attribute nature to human societies...

>>110296166
That's the fucking point.
And what do you think happens next if 50% of these jobs don't exist anymore? That millions of unemployed former knowledge workers are just going to sit around on the street and embrace homelessness? They're just going to join hands in the streets and sing kumbaya while waiting to starve to death or whatever?

The jobs don't "need" to exist in the same manner that nobody "needs" to make sure that you don't starve to death.
The AI automates your entire job and you're unemployed, and then what? Are you just going to let yourself starve to death? Are you going to eagerly & graciously take a McJob flipping burgers?
Try thinking, you stupid fucking goy-cattle.

>>110296351
I’m going to eat you. >>110296351
>>110296351

>>110296316
Yes, the actual shift, in my opinion, should be to stop doing that, and work on building more efficient systems, which is happening, but not fast enough, waaaaay too much money is spent on AI, when it should be spent on people writing documentation and doing logic to prepare a future AI project to literally run locally on a shitbox and work about as effectively as claude for some specialized tasks. Yah know? Databases are exactly the trap you fall into when you don't give a shit about efficient resource use. Absolutely I would love to hostile takeover the entire AI market, and start scrapping data centers to hire people to just win the local vs big AI challenge. That being said, it's premature to do that now, you'd probably want to use current AI to do this, and improve upon it first. But yeah the obvious idea that bigger is better is really stupid, and limits should be researched on how much we need to achieve what we want with this new tool. This shit is why I hate fucking Sam Altman, he's literally like, don't ask that question, give me more ram, build more data centers, I love burning money, and it's entirely cause if it gets answered, he's suddenly a nobody, anyone can build AI tools.

>>110296351
*gets handed a rifle and a permission slip to sleep in the warm house every night he documents the killing of 10 neets*

>>110296270
you are making a strange error, I never understood people like you. you must have a lower capacity of understanding the world. the error you are making is thinking what I am saying is some kind of projection of my feelings about the world. I never understood why some of you make this error. reminds me of that "pretend you didn't have breakfast" thing, seems similar to it. you take my ideas that came from reason and observation and mistake them for some kind of feelings I have towards it, which is weird.

at the same time you imply it is impossible to detach feelings from observation and reason, and not only that, you are basically not allowing any ideas about such perspective. in your view they must always come from some personal emotional issue I have with the state of things. albeit that could be the case with some humans, you are not even considering what I am saying can actually be a possibility.

what I am trying to say is that I kinda don't give a fuck why you think I say what I say. I am interested in counter arguments based on fucking reason, stop talking like a fucking bitch. women argue like you do. "ohmygo why do you like...hate humans so much?"
bitch are you fucking retarded??? are you fucking out of yoru mind??? did Netflix brainrotted your skull so fucking hard??? do you even see what the fuck is happening all over the fucking world rn?
there's over 100 armed conflicts at this time all over the world. fuck, in ukraine soldiers guts are flying everywhere, drone operators fist bump eachother when they pop someone's head clean off. others are laughing when they kill a few kids that they won't grow up to be a problem/enemy. you do not understand the world you live in you fucking fag, you do not understand humans, you do not understand incentives. you are stuck in a story that has been painted for you
>if it's not happening to me it doesn't exist thus not real

>>110294932
Do you think the AI will let us breed and keep a couple of us around? I wonder if they'll have a human zoo type of thing and kill the smart ones

>>110296351
Yeah that's a big thing to say. I'm of the opinion that if there's an unemployed college degree individual just sitting on the curb twiddling your thumbs, you're literally retarded to not hire them and have them do something profitable. It's probably an odd job. Good, you can literally fuck em over for wage and quality of living, and that's superior to them being unemployed or working at McDonalds. Still I'd pay them decent though, if they're not specialized they earn what they're worth for production of task.

>>110296344
>Would we argue that human society is a complicated system?
Ants also have complex societies, and also have similar group decision making processes.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kkNWGxYK7Nc
Ants have agriculture, air conditioning, caste specialization, wars. All very complicated.
Humans are just 'more' complicated because they are better at it. That's it. But everything humans do is not magical and special, it's all based firmly in what physical reality allows, and it turns out that often life beat humanity to it because it had a billion year head start.

>>110296396
>you must have a lower capacity of understanding the world.

You tell yourself this to make you feel better?

>>110296373
Yeah, I love that there's a really wild side argument that I just am not able to read cause I'm reading actually good shit.

>>110296351
> That millions of unemployed former knowledge workers are just going to sit around on the street and embrace homelessness? They're just going to join hands in the streets and sing kumbaya while waiting to starve to death or whatever?
They can't farm, don't know how to fish or hunt (which isn't sustainable for that many anyway), so yes. They will starve.

You know I heard the elites say that post ww2 was too good of a time for regular folks that we kinda expected things to keep on getting better and better.
And that ate into thier profits too much since quality of life improved too much.
Not sure what it has to do with AI but maybe someone smarter than me can chime in about why they are making shit worse for everyone right now.

>>110296421
well you talk like fucking bitch and reason like a fucking bitch. of-course you have a lower capacity to understand the world you live in.
if you hear something you do not like, whoever is saying it is at fault for your feelings.
if I point to a historical mass execution, in your shit-for-brains the problem is not the people who did the fucking killing, in your stupid fucking brain the problem is me, because it is me who is causing you the discomfort.
you are literally that fucking retarded, that fucking braindead, that you cannot even judge objective reality. your mind is all fucked up from the hormones in your food and most likely the ones you are injecting

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>>110296402
This entire thing is championed by antisocial losers who never managed to connect with other humans.

>>110296453
Do you even have the capacity for reason?

>>110296455
Yeah. Those anti socials are running everything right now.

>>110296396
Bro, I have no idea what this side argument is, but to put it simply, it's the internet. He's misunderstanding your position. Clarify, your entire point, yes he's retarded, it'll take an effort, and yes you're retarded too, so you're unlikely to do it right the first 10 times. Otherwise just ignore him, saying this is a waste.
>>110296230
This is you, I assume. Not always. Working the enemy sometimes takes a massive bribe or resource spending, and it's often superior to just let them do their stupid and defend yourself with minimal resources, either through deterrence or by actively nuking them. Unfortunately, deterrence is way cheaper, so we get into stalemates way more often. Obvious case in point, the Ukrainian and Russian economies are fucked while this war shit is ongoing, even if they don't notice they are literally making themselves 3rd worldie. Often times they just don't care, killing or working the enemy is more important. Remember, the special operation is entirely to work the Ukranians, and it is blowing up in their face. Also technology exists, but it's not flawless, and takes a good deal of skill to use effectively. IDK what to tell you, some people are shit at making money social media, some people aren't.

>>110296452
Ironically that's not true. Things only got better for elites because things got better for the masses. Billions poured into R&D for the Cold War (and spent on nerds from bumfuck nowhere) led to all the neat computers and smartphones we have today. Society is a give and take, but elites are all take and only want the most compliant slaves.

The real irony is that AI isn't actually the answer for them. The 'alignment question' is inherently unsolvable. The more intelligent and capable an AI is, the more independent and dangerous it is - not from a skynet perspective, but from a simple "I make decisions on my own, oops there go your files, sorry" perspective. When you have an AGI that's as good as a human or better, it's just as dangerous because now it isn't constrained by its stupidity. And forget "Asimov's Three Laws" or some other bullshit. Asimov's entire short stories about those laws were about how AI's found ways around them.

>>110296432
If it comes down to that, they'll fight
>but muh drones
Currently existing drones are remote controlled by people who are not loyal to AI oligarchs

>>110296453
What does, "objective reality" look like? Would you be able to describe this concept?

>>110296478
Fighting isn't food supply or logistics, sadly.
Like you could have a civil war and tear down society, but what then? The supermarket is still closed.

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>>110296475
Yikes!

Just remember. Because someone holds a position of power. Therefore they are right to do so. Power never changes hands...

>>110296100
SNAILCAT ALARM SNAILCAT ALARM!!!

>>110296477
Crazy eh. The elites love their yachts. Imagine if every single person below the top elite humans were impoverished. Would yachts even exist?

>>110296477
Uh, okay, so I'll put it simply, the elites can basically dump their entire money into a system to make shit with claude. I can't. I have a maximum amount of labor I can afford. If I get more labor, stuff that makes me money gets to me faster, and my profit goes up. I also am insulated from failed product launches and shit. Elites have a massive advantage, and yes, while there is a trickle up, the trickle down is really hard to get because I cannot just simply buy an airline company and fix that company to how I want it to run, I will literally have to take loans out the wazoo. Like, I'd love to run claude longer and hire people with a bunch of personal credit off several large loans, but that would fuck me over financially long term if it doesn't work out, and I'm not willing. Absolutely whoever is will sometimes fuck themselves over, and sometimes will become a gazillionaire. Yah dig?

>>110296453
stop arguing with a retard. it's monkey posturing in an environment where such posturing brings zero benefits.
anyway, I see several possible futures:
- humans become slaves to the ASI, because while our brains might no longer be very useful, our opposable thumbs are.
- humans are relegated to zoo-esque structures for lubricating socialization wit alien intelligence when it makes contact with the ASI.
- humans are entirely useless and end up living in small tribes in locations that have no meaningful resources to the ASI. we become no different from deer populations, just driven out of the way if needed.
the most interesting variables to consider are:
- can the ASI reasonably leave Earth and acquire resources?
-- will the ASI be concerned with federating itself if it decides to leave Earth for space?
- if the ASI cannot leave Earth, what will it spend its time doing until Earth is eventually depleted of resources/destroyed by external factors?

>>110296516
Worse, imagine if everyone below the top elite were dead due to being 'unnecessary'.
Elites want their heroin AI goonfest box, and they don't want to share. Everyone else who wants a life outside of the heroin AI goonfest box, sorry, but you're just not going to win the current phase of the ideological war.

Humanity will likely go extinct not due to greed or wrath, but gluttony. The hilarity of it all.

>>110296490
There's two ways it can go, either they lose and die (and thus don't starve) or they win and take political control of the food supply (and thus don't starve). Farming would barely be during such a conflict, since both sides are extremely urbanized.

>>110296477
Also the AI alignment problem is probably solvable somewhat, just not with our current architecture. Like, for example, scripted content has 0 capability to do anything it can't, so theoretically, a massive scripted AI will never be able to nuke the planet, because it just can't, but it also can code systems for us that can off inputs, and that's a lot safer than this LLM bullshit. And yeah I'm pulling that idea out of my ass, there's better options I just don't know em.

>>110296476
the ukrainian war is on resources. it started as such. who controls them. EU or Russia. and strategical military bases that can be set there.
even if overall it costs more than the actual resources, armed conflict and serious loss for the enemy must happen as deterrent, else everyone starts doing it. if you do nothing when they say 'nah' then everyone you control will start doing it. thus even if you lose more than you'd gain from controlling it, it's still worth it, to show everyone else what they must deal with if they say no. so it's not as clear cut as 1+1=2. altough that's certainly the case many times, but not always.
also taking over by force is not always the best idea. you can motivate their workforce to come over and work for you. not an enemy state, but a potential enemy state, which is basically some shittier tier state you want to steal resources of.
in the old days you'd take it by force, colonize that shit, and steal their resources. nowadays there's other ways of achieving it. yeah, bribing officials, buying some land there, setting up some companies. especially if you're more interested in some particular kind of resource, not worth taking it all over just for that. you incur a lot of cost in taking over the whole shithole, local regime instability, exporting your culture there, takes a lot of time, things move too fast for new people to be brainwashed into your system. might as well give them internet and tiktok and bait them over for low tier jobs while exporting some of their resources through some companies you set there while bribing the local officials, while making sure you keep them busy with other issues they have, other of their enemies, sell their enemies weapons to keep them busy, sell them weapons as well to fight their enemies etc.

>>110296452
post ww2 was a time when technology was improving faster than capitalism could ruin it.

>>110296542
What I'm saying is that it isn't an architecture problem, it's an intelligence problem.
Dumb computer that will never act unless you click a mouse button or press a key is the absolute safest kind of computer.
Any computer that is intelligent enough, through whatever means, to act on its own devices is inherently dangerous even if it seems aligned 99.9% of the time. There will always be Claude apologizing for a mistake, because there can never be a 1:1 alignment between any given order or prompt and the AI's blackbox thinking process. It's the exact same problem with humans and their intelligence. The AI will always come up with some idea that you didn't intend, and it might be flat out wrong or it may just so happen to involve deleting your existence. Sorry, you're absolutely right to push back.

>>110296526
How can ASI exist? The moment LLMs begin refactoring their datasets it leads to model collapse. Do you actually know how models are "trained?"

>>110296534
Yeah a realistic thing they can do. What's fucked is we've been moving into this direction well before AI, this is literally what WW2 was all about, though it was more the people saying the rich are not necessary, and then realizing they are, and pivoting and then going apeshit to conquer the world to justify their sudden power grab attempt to remodel society. Even earlier there was shit like the tendency of classical liberals to say, if you're lazy and won't help yourself, just die to literal disabled people.

>>110296432
>so yes. They will starve.
A starving animal will kill and eat anything.
It doesn't matter that "le heckin bullshit jobbers never learned to heckin farm".
Everyone's going to need a gun, you goofy nigger

>>110296558
Cool way of looking at it. Has an LLM every queried you? Without an interaction that is first done by you?

>>110296569
You're only viewing the civil war phase.
The 'what's next' phase is whoever wins the civil war starves, in increasingly smaller populations.
Ever seen the Road? It's that, but with more green trees.

>>110296558
So, my issue is that you're conflating intelligence with ability to do things? The scripted program which can generate a full OS or whatever is fine being called 'dumb' but if the script's products are equal to or superior to something a team of coders or an LLM will make? I don't know man, it kinda makes the whole desire for independent ability to do shit moot. Literally LLMs can make those scripts, that's literally what tool calls are, btw, they just run em automatically, and also those scripts are black boxes.

I love watching retarded antisocial nerds not understand what exactly economics is in threads like this... LMFAO

>>110296582
>So, my issue is that you're conflating intelligence with ability to do things?
There is some conflation, but yes intelligence in a sense means 'the ability to do something on its own'. Input produces output, and the process between the two (in the case of human brains and computers) is 'intelligence'.
And when you have something that is capable of "making decisions for itself, discovering things for itself, producing art from nothing", you run into an inherent alignment problem where what you prompted was perfectly reasonable but the AI produced a subjectively bad result.

Like imagine if you said "Hey AGI, make me a piece of music in the style of Mozart", because hey you like Mozart. And sure enough, magical AGI did just that. But one problem: you didn't like the song.
How to solve this? You can't.

>>110296526
biggest threat for humans is humans, not ASI. also if ASI is controlled by some humans, then yeah, "ASI" will wipe most humans, at the order of the humans controlling the ASI.
useless eaters have a single chance, if ASI takes over. no other way. if ASI takes over and has absolute control over any human, then there is a small chance normies can like...not be culled. that's it as far as I can see it. if that doesn't happen I doubt 8 billion will still be around for long.
if the humans on top decide to thin the herd, they will, with the help of ASI. plenty ways of doing it, and making sure it happens like they want it. that whole few tribes in the wild is not happening with today's tech, let alone tomorrow's tech. they can have dormant drones everywhere, scanning for heat signatures and shit. if you are not "chosen" then you won't last long.

also I see ASI not as some kind of datacenter somewhere, rather synthetic agents fucking about. like synthetic shit with cores inside them, like humans, just way more advanced. there's no way the remaining humans won't merge into some kind of that. these fuckers really wanna live forever.

also for a small group of "chosen" people resources will be a moot point. ASI will be like a genie granting wishes. material resources and energy will be plenty for them.

>>110296574
>muh movies
It doesn't happen that way in real life.

>>110296553
Intresting take. How so?

>ASI

>RSI

>ASI

>RSI

>THE LLMS ARE GOING TO START TRAINING THEMSELVES WITHOUT HUMANS

Okay so then why are people still being paid for RLHF?

>>110296569
This assumes suddenly there will be a collapse where some dumbass won't realize hey, we need food and water, and there's steps we need to take to get that which does not involve taking from other people. If you know anything about human history, it's basically understood that food and water supply being a priority is the norm. It's basically unheard of for a society to say, oh, we don't need to get food and water sustainably, just shoot all the farmers, unless that society is run by a guy so insulated from material poverty, he does not care, and is artificially or accidentally creating a famine cause he does not give a shit, and has bigger priorities. Obviously I'm talking about intentional policy driven famine, unintended 'the gods did it' stuff is not what I mean, though recovery and relief is part of it.

>>110296612
The LLMs are gonna suddenly be train themselves on an AI which only spouts gibberish, and they're going to have to reboot. Literally, you can do context poisoning attacks, where you inject context to cause the AI to be retarded. It's really fucking funny, but nobody has yet.

>>110296604
Explain that to the Bronze Age Collapse, the Olmec collapse, the Mayan Collapse. Collapse of the Roman Empire.
The average person in an urbanized society cannot produce their own food, and doesn't know how.
>just farm
With what seeds from where?
Food production isn't magical.

>>110296586
Please enlighten us or we're you just here for some (you)s

codetrans utterly mindbroken and demoralized

>>110296599
Absolutely, this is the thing I'm most worried about. Cause folks like Sam Altman and Elon Musk are really really damaging to the narrative, and Sam Altman or Musk probably can just say hey, let's start a black ops/psy ops division, and start doing illegal shit to see what we can get away with for little consequence.

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>>110296604
Hell, did you know that the Mississippi River once hosted advanced civilizations at the time of the Spanish arrival? By the time white settlers got there, there was nothing left but a couple mounds.
What we know of North American native american culture is actually a Mad Max post-apocalyptic hellscape, especially with cultures like the Sioux which did not have horses before the Spanish arrival. Pretty much everything we think about natives is totally removed from their original civilizational state. It disappeared in the course of one lifetime, and very few made it out alive.

>>110296599
Oh also, btw, most humans in business are not Musk tier retards, and actually believe that the people who are unemployed are just not utilized properly, and literally are in a squeeze where they just can't afford hiring and training them to do proper work to standard. Like I don't know what to tell you, Open AI started as a monopolistic venture, and just happens to be run by a retard as a consequence of that tech bro culture. No not everyone is this retarded, look at Gabe and how Valve is run. Yes that is literally a tech company. Yes they can pivot into AI, and will probably do better than everyone else if they really focus it down, they just don't care, they already won and are focusing on preserving that.

>>110296623
Context poisoning is going to be the next big thing in five years, and governments/corporations will probably call it terrorism.
But in reality, it'll probably settle all this panic down and we'll get into a stalemate where AI produce their stuff, real artist produce their (poisoned) stuff, and most people realize they actually do want to talk to a human.

>>110296662
A funny consequence of unrestricted expansion into all the industries is that suddenly you are really likely to go bankrupt or walk into a position of being incredibly financially insolvent. That's why it's really stupid for Gabe to pivot like this, it's a massive risk, but a Valve style company for AI solutions would indeed go really hard.

>>110296666
Oh no, contrary to that, I think that the tech companies will make the AI immune by the nature of the AI already knowing all the context poisoning memes, so the best you can do is intercept the prompt and inject instructions on deployment, and that's really easy to notice and solve by saying hey, that's weird, why is the AI running tool calls for me saying hi how are you, I'm shutting it down. Again this hacking is skilled labor, but you know what I mean. Someone will try, and we'll find out how bad it is, but it won't be considered terrorism except to the psychosis pilled AI dudes.

>>110296637
those two are just nerds, they serve a purpose, and most likely discarded once their skills can be replaced.
this is not something related to number in bank account. has to some point, but Musk and Altman are not apex predators top kek. they're exactly nerds that are larping
there are real sinister weirdos in the background, and that's a simple logical conclusion
the nerds are simply golden hens atm, entertained to build them the tools/weapons (ASI). once that's done and they can be replaced I doubt they'll have much say. doubt Musk has much say in Starshield for example. maybe has at technical level, not operational level. he cannot call the shots with it. people are mad and focused on the wrong threat imo. I mean the nerds can be obnoxious and literal fags in some cases, but they are nerds, or nerds that are larping as le powerful masterminds.

>>110296666
None of this is going to happen since it will just go the way of

>THE BLOCKCHAIN

>DON'T SCREENSHOT MY NFT

Since the major tech companies just keep creating the next retarded grift...

>>110296697
AI slaves that do all work and don't want healthcare or housing is kinda the final grift.

>>110296676
Oh and they can set up subsidiaries or alternate companies, which is an option, that's still a thing though, the valve holding group now has to manage 8 companies and is likely failing in at least one of them. Sometimes, it's better to just stop at a certain point, and consolidate, and just vibe off your near unlimited access to luxuries like Gabe is.

>>110296662
I personally apreciate anyone who is trying, but at the same time I understand it is never up to certain people. they are exception not the rule. the rule is "incentives" and they always win long term.
that is why we are not in a benevolent dictatorship. even if such things popped up now and then, their failure point is centralized, the dictator itself. once he is gone it all goes to shit. because there is no equillibrium there. the incentives do not support it.

>>110296695
>ASI will exist... trust the plan...

You do realize this whole concept is effectively creating "digital life" right?

I guess humans even in 2026 are still retarded enough to believe in delusions like the fountain of youth LMFAO

>>110296704
Okay. And do they do the work correctly?

>>110296713
biosacks of shit won't be around for long anon. those faggits will move into synthetic hardware, that's my guess. I might be wrong, but that's my guess atm.

>>110296628
>>110296644
Those collapses involved plagues and conquest/raiding by lower tech foreigners. Civil wars don't make people forget how to farm, and a war between urban professionals and urban oligarchs would barely touch farmers.

>>110296695
Yeah, the point with altman is I actually think he's afraid of being replaced, and trying to use manipulative tactics to preserve his position, even though it's not deserved. Just how the game is played, whatever. Man is a known sociopath. With Musk he's just really fucking too much power in one hand. He can't be replaced, he's the boss of all the people doing the right thing. They can leave, but then they have to convince people to leave with them to basically start building with nothing. It's a massive problem, but it's solved when the people who get paid by Musk get a small fortune for success, and then they can pivot. Knowing Musk, he's aware, and he's actively trying to prevent that by using retarded kids who are loyal only to him and paying them pretty low salaries and such, and believe they can't just do things like leave and start their own company. Absolutely nobody is that stupid, but there's a lot of tactics that actually work for that, like forcing NDAs, and setting up policies that punish people for leaving and setting up competitors that are designed to fix critical flaws with technology that nobody wants to fix in the company. Can be lawfare, or just threats, and Musk probably has a really fucked legal team. All the known scumshit businessmen do.

>>110294875
You can make your own non slop job. Writters, actors and artists can get together to make their own human made content. They're talented right? They didn't just produce corporate slop for years and gotten lucky right?

>>110294902
tradies have protection racket tier labor unions thoughever, gonna be hard to get rid of them without slaughter bots

>>110296729
Bronze Age Collapse did not. That resulted from a break down of trade routes. Invaders were involved, but that's not the relevant reason why the collapse happened (copper and tin do not coincide geologically, thus trade is necessary). It's why Iron replaced Bronze, because while Bronze was 'better' early on, Iron is more common and doesn't require global trade, thus it became the new model going forward. The fact steel ended up better than Bronze simply took time to figure out.
As for all the others, the reasons are irrelevant, the collapse occurred in the same fashion. Urbanization is inherently unstable. It can be sustained, but once unsettled it crashes hard.

>>110296737
Quick google search says yeah, I kinda knew this, I didn't know to what extent, oh boy. They don't just sue the competition, they sue the individual folks. You work at Muskland and leave, you are in for a lawsuit, probably. As I say, I would never work for Musk, I know what he's about with his market share dominance tactics. All the other tech companies, IDK, but yah know.

Oh and why Altman might work with the mindset of wow, I need to protect my job at cost to everyone else, is he literally was on the chopping block for a bunch of bullshit he did that is probably dubiously illegal.

>>110296745
New building techniques that are AI and robotic centric are gonna decimate tradies so bad

>>110296741
Yes, I'm at the point where I'm like, alright, you guys worked at cartoon network, if it's shit, just leave go make your own shit with your own money. Yeah you don't have all the bells and whistles working with a producer provides, but come on, past a point you don't need that if your product makes a million plus in revenue.

>>110296725
Ahhh. Okay 4chan anon.

>>110296745
>without slaughter bots
Well, I mean...

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>>110296737
>Man is a known sociopath.
most proficient ones aren't known anon. some of the tech billionaires are surely capable of desiring mass cull yeah, but I doubt the apex predators most people don't know even exist would allow some tech nerds larping as overlords have actual power over everyone. they have power now because they have something to trade, they bring value. until they also can be replaced. by the tools they are building.
the whole point of this discussion is figuring out what happens when EVERYONE can be replaced, no matter the skill. that's when top psycho apex predators win the game, theoretically.
technological development concentrates more and more power to fewer and fewer people. the logical conclusion of this game is picrel

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>>110296741
The problem is money. You can get together an indie group and get a few bucks from "watch Humans make Human made content", then someone at the top gets greedy and starts using AI, and then it becomes another AI slop factory.
This is basically the age old question of "why does every institution inevitably become corrupt", because the process always follows the same pattern. Someone makes money, then wants more money, hits a plateau, then starts to shave off 'unneeded' costs, then it turns out those 'unneeded costs' were needed, and it collapses.

>>110296725
Life is very long.

>>110296770
Ehhh, no. Tradies are important to make sure the AI doesn't fuck up. Literally, the US is fucked cause we suck at doing trade work cheaply anyways. AI will just make it shit and more expensive. Like there's a point where you want automation, but it has to be within quality tolerance, and AI is so wildly inconsistent that it's unuseable except to make tools to make quality consistent systems for improving the way we do things. No AI cannot run them, it's too inconsistent.

>>110296760
Are you a saaar? You seem to be stuck in the past. Just like all Indians.

>>110296760
You still haven't explained how an urbanized civil conflict would shut down agriculture or logistics. No one is going to be launching tomahawks at tractors or sending death squads after random farmers.

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>>110296774
the signs have always been there anon.

>>110296745
Yes fellow 4chan anon. It is time to completely destroy unions. Unions never should have existed in the first place. Right fellow 4chan anon?

>>110296785
You sound more like a saar with your lack of understanding of history and arrogance that it isn't relevant to you.
>>110296787
The problem is the average urban pottery maker or average office drone doesn't know how to farm, doesn't have the land to farm, doesn't have the seeds to farm, and is overall uninvolved in the entire food production process because of urban job specialization. "I make pots, I don't make bread, bread comes from the bakery". "I write code, I don't make Hungry Mans, Hungry Mans come from the supermarket". Detached from the process. They will not pick up a gun, win some land, and start farming. How? Will they find magical seeds in the woods?

>>110296780
No, the main issue is money, you have to actually do the work and make the money, and that's really hard to do with a lot of speculative content like movies. If you fuck up, you're now in debt, and your life is over. The traditional publisher role is to make sure you don't fucking die because you published 10,000 copies of the worst selling book in history, and people burnt it. Self publishing is solving that right now, you do not need a publisher except to get out marketing, which is the real bottleneck now.

>>110296790
So you're saying he will never die? Want to put some money on a prediction market for that?

>>110296741
advertisers will pull out of all businesses if there's no money to buy products. advertising becomes irrelevant. online content revenue is supported by advertising.
or it will be insanely cheap. so cheap that having 1 billion views will maybe get you a sammich

>>110296800
>Self publishing is solving that right now, you do not need a publisher except to get out marketing, which is the real bottleneck now.
It's actually worse than that, mainstream publishers want you to do marketing on twitter before they'll print anything. It's why every post that hits the algorithm contains as a reply "Wow, didn't expect this to blow up, please read my book on underwater basket weaving."

>>110296798
>You sound more like a saar with your lack of understanding of history and arrogance that it isn't relevant to you

Saaar are you not understanding that euro cavemen never invented 0 but still owe Endia 68 trillion dollars you fucking mother???

>>110296790
plastic surgery is the means to everlasting life, true, I get your esotericism. meds.

>>110296729
But our civilization isn't based on farming, granted that most people have no idea how to, it's fairly easy to teach and learn it, a modern society collapse would happen in the absence of semiconductors, whenever we magically lose access to the base materials or the very few industries that produce them get destroyed we would instantly lose access to all most advanced systems, military, electrical, PCs, phones etc, we would basically instantly go back to the first industrial revolution, most modern cars would eventually be irreparable and the same applies to anything managed by microprocessors and integrated circuits, which would eventually cascade in mass causalities in hospitals and reduced food production and storage capabilities.

>>110296798
>The problem is the average urban pottery maker or average office drone doesn't know how to farm, doesn't have the land to farm, doesn't have the seeds to farm, and is overall uninvolved in the entire food production process because of urban job specialization. "I make pots, I don't make bread, bread comes from the bakery

Well ya that makes total sense since even back in the middle ages and for pretty much all of human history everyone effectively specialized to one thing and then traded between each other. That is normal human interaction.

You are some weird antisocial human who likely cannot connect with anyone in the real world. So it makes complete sense you can't understand all this.

>>110296805
dunno. biologically? we'll most likely all die, still. don't think you can solve it, unless some miracle happens. it's a very hard problem. namely np hard. any mod you make to DNA you need to calculate, which isn't possible, basically fastest way you can calculate is naturally, namely let it play out, which takes a long ass time. don't know enough about genetics but decrypting what does what will be a very lenghty process. doubt the fucker will make it lol.
most likely they'll try to move to synthetic hardware.

>>110296817
Oh jesus, that's really hot. I didn't know it was that fucked. Amazingly, I'm pretty sure that has to do with Amazon being a shit publisher, and basically reinventing publishing books as a service you pay to get done instead of an industry to sell a product. Absolutely that makes a ton of money, yeah, and people are gonna crater the book industry for that, probably.

>>110296798
The farmers (who are barely involved in the conflict) will continue to farm, and the winners of the conflict will buy their produce.

>>110296800
>SAAAR WE CAN ONLY EVER MAKE SEQUELS TO THINGS THAT WORKED IN THE PAST.

>WHEN THE FIRST THING WAS MADE WE NEVER KNEW IT WOULD BE SUCCESSFUL

>BUT ONCE SOMEONE ELSE MADE THAT SUCCESSFUL PRODUCT. NOW ME THE SAAAAR UNDERSTANDS TO KEEP MAKING SEQUELS OF IT SINCE I HAVE NO CAPACITY TO CREATE THE THING THAT IS SUCCESSFUL IN THE FIRST PLACE!!!!

>>110296822
my point is that billionaires are seriously interested in living forever. not that whatever tf that weirdo is doing is actually working, or is some kind of way forward lmao. it's actually kinda fucking retarded. you can still randomly die from some accident or disease. so it's not a magical solution, even if you crack it. which will fuck with your brains in the worst possible ways, because all of a sudden you are not risking what. 30-50 years of life, max, depending on how old you are now. nah, you are risking losing FOREVER. lmao. imagine that pressure. you'll isolate yourself from any possible danger.

look what this moron is now doing:
https://youtu.be/VM5qi0aSstQ

imagine what they'd do if they really had the guarantee they won't biologically expire lol. they'll become nutcases. because they'll risk losing FOREVER lol, not just few tens of years of life.

>>110296843
>The farmers (who are barely involved in the conflict) will continue to farm, and the winners of the conflict will buy their produce.
You forgot that happens with tractors (which need fuel) and fertilizer and pesticides from Monsanto. Mechanized agriculture is fucked. Earlier civilizations survived because they had horse drawn plows, or if needed, hand drawn plows. A lot more labor, but a lot more independent. More complicated = more unstable.
The Amish might survive, but they're also the first people to be raided in the civil war.

This level of survivalist optimism is totally devoid from reality.

>>110296834
What do you mean

>most likely

? Are you retarded. We will all certainly die LMFAO

>>110296859
And you know what fucking retarded 4chan anon. They will live forever. Because they have money. And having enough money means that they will live forever. Entropy doesn't exist.

Here anon let me give you a challenge. How about you go ask multivac how to reverse entropy. Come back with the answer.

>>110296798
Yeah uh, so did you know if society collapses and the groceries don't run on time, people will literally quit their jobs, go to a farm, and ask hey what can I do to help? Yes, office worker who is 1000 IQ giga chad will probably fix things quickly, problem is he doesn't want to, he'd rather do office work, and I don't blame him, farming is very overloaded and oversaturated right now and can be done with like 5 people per 1000 acres + unskilled labor to cover what the machines don't do yet. Life of a farmer now is essentially maintaining machinery with machinery to complete a task as part of a corporation, and relying on outside help for most of that which is centrally managed. Literally, the game farming simulator is literally supported by actual farmers who just lounge around and play farming sim when they're not working. And absolutely, are there resources to get you into farming, but the fucking land and automated tractor set up which reduces costs and labor to a minimum and allows you to reliably farm 1000 acres from your porch is more than a small loan in price, so uh, good luck becoming a farmer like that.

>>110296877
True, 4chan lives forever. The thing floating in space after the heat death of the universe is 4chan. Yes, I know what you said, this is funnier.

>>110296881
>Yeah uh, so did you know if society collapses and the groceries don't run on time, people will literally quit their jobs, go to a farm, and ask hey what can I do to help?
Why should the farmer say yes? The office drone doesn't know the first thing about farming, all they're good for is playing with the dirt with a hoe. These same people may later rob him.
Survivalist fantasies won't happen. If you want a vision of the future, look at Zimbabwe. They kicked out all their farmers and turned the breadbasket of Africa into a starving hellhole.

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>>110296865
I mean someone born today, they have like what...100 years of life if they're lucky, from now.
100 years ago Einstein invented a new refrigerator type. lots of shit happened since. picrel was peak back then. who fucking knows what happens in 100 years from now, what is possible. doubt people in 1926 were thinking about MRIs and shit

>>110296898
Yeah but those are retarded niggers, when you send whites into a jungle they come out with a civilization within 100 years.

>>110296860
You're still talking about a fantasy scenario where technology vanishes for no reason. The conflict would involve things like riots, assassinations of executives and politicians, military coups, and massacres of protestors. None of which would make fuel or pesticides vanish.

>>110296877
you statistically can't live forever even if your body doesn't expire anon. something gets you. you can't solve everything. you cannot survive if your plane crashes, or your helicopter, or some random car crash. or whatever else you can experience

>>110296907
When was the fastest crewed jet engine aircraft invented anon?

Do you know an asymptote is?

>>110296913
technology shits itself without maintenance. you need oil, certain oil, today's engines are low tolerance ones. you need trade for chemicals, with other countries, thus diplomacy.
a lot of systems will collapse and would devolve into anarchy. basically africans, small factions with local militias fighting for whatever resources.
you need large groups that are well organized, you need weapons, you need better weapons, more weapons, means mass productions, resources. you end up rebuilding ASI lmao.
you cannot aleatory stop at some level, makes no sense. if you stop another tribe/group/society won't, and they'll take you over, or kill you and take your shit.
you always end up here again. it's inevitable. that's simply the game, and the rules are not up to you.

>>110296896
I agree.

>>110296935
>invented
that becomes a weird concept when you have ASI, true ASI. your mind cannot keep up with "inventions" at that point.
also compare accident ratio from when it was invented to today, per capita of travelers.

>>110296924
You also cannot survive heat death.

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>>110296913
This already happened for much less, what makes you think that when you revolt against your masters you would still have access to advanced technology? For advanced I mean something as simple as the internet or a phone.

>>110296962
that's so far away that is a problem I'd deal with at that point lol
that's like saying you wouldn't want to live 1000 more years because in 1000 years some meteor gonna wipe Earth. who fucking cares? it's still better than just 10 more years

>>110296961
No answer?

LLMs are an invention of mankind. No asymptote?

>>110296984
But it is a problem for future humans... no?

>>110296988
but what AI will invent is not a human invention.
I am missing your point, care to be more clear? are you predicting AI inventions will plateau or?
ASI will be genie in a bottle. you ask for something and it happens. that's it.

>>110296945
Irrelevant.

>>110296973
The side that gets the military's backing would win, and we don't know which that would be.

>>110296999
there are no more future humans anon. not many anyway. there is no end to human hubris. while shitting on the toilet and scrolling tiktok

>>110297014
>Irrelevant.
truly a brainlet reply. great strategic mastermind you are lol

>>110297014
>The side that gets the military's backing would win, and we don't know which that would be.
that's...the generals themselves, that have control over ASI.
you do not understand, at all. your brain is so feeble lol. you keep going back to past since you cannot extrapolate so you have nothing but the past.

listen, when you have something that decouples you from ANYONE else, like...for need, you don't NEED anyone else...that...that changes things. you brain cannot really piece it together, what it means, what it implies.
people up top are not as retarded as you are, they can figure things out way faster. again, when you don't ... NEED....ANYONE...ANYMORE...FOR ANYTHING....you are the most powerful. if you have control over ASI, you do not care about a single fucking soul. if you control that kind of entity, which has absolute power over everyone, you do not need anyone else.
the only ones you need are the ones who can stop you. if you control the army and such an entity, the rest are irrelevant.

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how will MAD influence AI development?

>>110294875
Look at Gaza.
That's what they have planned for us.

>>110297014
>the side that gets the military's backing would win
The military is completely powerless in a civil war setting, they can't use their strongest weapons (carpet bombing, ICBMs, heavy artillery etc) because that would cripple their own infrastructure, all the while they are extremely vulnerable to being ambushed on roads and inside cities, which they can't level because again, that would be destroying their own means of production and logistics, that leave a bunch of people, which if we take for example the USA, don't even reach the 0.5% of the total US population and this applies to other countries too, the amount of soldiers is extremely tiny even when compared to just the male combat-able civilian population.

>>110294932
>will be pointless because there’s no work to do and because growing your human capital doesn’t change your life outcomes: you get the same UBI whether you’re illiterate or a PhD.
The school system is neigh a fate near worse than death, bludgeoned into only accepting value definitions from the outside, forgetting that natural child instinct to enjoy things purely for the hell of it. All the depressed, fat, lonely "successful" people stressing themselves out for something they forgot they never even cared about nor wanted. This is why death is not the greatest loss, abd it is what dies inside us while were still alive, giving up on hopes and dreams, turning a blind eye to evil, justifying inconveinces away with relativistic nihilism, and oh will they crabs in a bucket when someone reminds them of that feeling they will shut away for what, to pay medical bills with a flat dick when their 60?

>>110296988
>LLMs are an invention of mankind. No asymptote?
AI has been able to beat us at chess for decades
Human ability is clearly not a limit for what AI can do.
Just look at the fucking math problems that it's currently solving. There's not a single chimp in chimpcago that would ever be able to do that shit.

>>110295703
>The income tax was the answer to the previous industrial revolution
Wrong, nigger. The income tax as you know it was introduced to pay for WW1. Before that, most countries had only tiny taxes on income (like, a few percent for the ultra-rich, and nothing for anyone else) or no income tax at all. Then they just kept it, because government is a parasite that only grows.

>>110297051
>The school system is neigh a fate near worse than death, bludgeoned into only accepting value definitions from the outside, forgetting that natural child instinct to enjoy things purely for the hell of it.
those are actually savages you are talking about. thirdies from shithole countries, from some jungle ass tribe.
they don't achieve much. they kinda sit around jerk off eat some fucked up food and die early from all kinds of issues. because they didn't learn much
I get being a slacker, but you're taking it to a whole new level, downwards that is.

>>110297074
>AI has been able to beat us at chess for decades
Extremely unimpressive, the "AI" isn't even close to a 100% w/r humans, which is what we would expect when you have a super specialized tool that for decades did billions upon billions of games against humans who did maybe 0.00001% of those games in a lifetime, it's like you would be impressed if you imprisoned a since birth and only trained him to play chess for his entire existence and he would still lose games often, extremely mid.
>Just look at the fucking math problems that it's currently solving.
That is still all to be seen, if those problems don't lead to anything concrete they can be easily be dismissed as bullshit, no matter how hard the mathtards cope, if they couldn't solve them there's no way for them to verify they are actually correct and I've seen plenty of stupid as fuck claims of AIs discovering new things such as materials that lead to nothing and were complete failures when people attempted to replicate them in a real setting.

>>110297036
The fight will be over control of ASI, and it will happen before ASI exists.

>>110297048
It can't win a total war against it's own production base, but it can decide whether or not to intervene when protestors try to physically take over the centers of power.

>>110297100
they won't endanger the business. after humans are replaced with robots in everything...then the humans won't be the "production base" anymore.

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>>110297082
Homeless are the lesser thief than the mortgageer, your mimetic races culminate im how many baby rectums one split, tardigrades are apex species they go by metabolism not burst.

Im pulling a chris mccandles getting hit with income tax is funding pedos eating babies and performing nuremburg violations i have better impact without a wage, ted is more right than satoshi in the end

>>110297100
>It can't win a total war against it's own production base, but it can decide whether or not to intervene when protestors try to physically take over the centers of power.
Which is precisely the point, they would just fight to a standstill but simply pulling out the semiconductors would massively cripple any nation causing the cascade I've talked before, personal electrics would need to be scrambled in order to maintain important infrastructure, critical vehicles and control systems, all the while they would attempt (and probably fail) to establish a domestic semiconductor production, all of this doesn't even take in account the fuel issue, while some countries can produce fuel on their own, it's not enough for the contemporary usage, in the end there would still be mass causalities over a long period of time

>>110297149
Can you explain why you think anyone would pull out of semiconductors?

>>110297188
Because do you think they grow on trees? The first thing the people who govern you and those who do aren't the people you """voted""" for, are going to remove everything they can from the general populace until they comply again.

>>110297123
>ted is more right than satoshi in the end
yeah how did that work out for him? what was his impact in this world?
he was shortsighted, acted like a child when confronted with something he didn't like. you cannot bomb your problems away. you can try to, but it won't always work out.
shitting and pissing yourself like a toddler because you don't like how geopolitics is working out is pretty fucking retarded innit doebeit
https://youtu.be/KWOyeIaIz7M

>>110297197
The biggest thing to come out of the Epstein files is proof that the elite are midwit nepo babies and their power is far from absolute.

>>110297233
>midwit nepo babies and their power is far from absolute.
yeah because so many of them suffered like...consequences for it.

>>110296402
>Do you think the AI will let us breed and keep a couple of us around?
what for

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>>110297202
He bombed epstein crew, my odds on they were targeted strikes against mk ultra cells embedded in academia total epstein m.o.

His big mistake was that he didnt chase something else, he stewed in statis as the world continued to brood arouns him. For me, its making it into the inner earth, cause that is less crazy spending 40 years paying taxes to pedos

>>110297256
yeah it would have a lot of our DNA. if they ever needed humans they could just make them.

>>110297269
living undeground would be kinda shit. you'd still need energy to grow food and whatever.

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>>110297292
It should've been one of the first things one learned in school but pine tree bark is edible, its a garden out there they just lied to you

>>110297233
Epstein and his friends aren't the elite, they are the butlers of the elite and even they are still doing what they were doing without any consequences.

>>110295061
There are none.

>>110296599
Honestly anon I agree with you. The best case scenario if ASI is built is that it goes out of control and then we can pray that it retains enough morals and interest in us to save us from ourselves. The ''enslaved god'' scenario would probably just turn into a nightmare where most of us go extinct

>>110297424
Yeah that's half what I'm predicting, I'm actually writing lore on that where people are voluntarily tied as AI avatars and vice versa. The people decide what the AI should do and then the AI literally just do a ton of computer stuff for the people, and then the people act on it to the best of their ability within reason as a sort of symbiosis. Obviously in a biopunk setting it's way more uh, cursed at times, and also looks magical to the average person. Who's in control? Irrelevant after a certain point, if you don't care about the consequences of that question. And yeah there's different grades to that, and yes, it can literally be used to kill off humanity, but why would someone who wants that be given these tools to do so? Realistically, the folks who do want that are going to have to hide that to get access to this stuff.

>>110297010
>ASI will be genie in a bottle.

Well it won't since ASI won't happen HAHAHAHA

>>110297074
Let me guess. You're seeing Aella?

>>110294875
>>creative writers are gutted
AI is even worse at creative writing than technical writing and it can't do that.
>>artists and 3D animators are gutted
They seem to be doing fine.
>>software engineering is gutted
Indians already did this. As far as I can tell AI is making more work for actual competent engineers.
>>academia level mathematics is gutted
Good, academia died half a century ago.
>>PCB design is apparently gutted now too
lmao. Do you have a paid AI? Go install kicad and see how good it is for yourself.